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A little exercise each day improves muscles more than one big weekly workout

• theclansman 4y ago
  I really like the thought of doing 6 curls a day. Yet I go into the comments and people here are talking of doing 5 minutes of curls every 30 minutes, which sounds insane.
  • tarentel 4y ago
    I started having back issues during covid probably because I didn't have a proper place to work. I now lift or do some cardio for 10 minutes a day 4-5 days a week and have seen pretty drastic improvements. Much more than I thought I would experience given that 10 minutes feels like nothing and is the opposite of what I've been told by my more fit friends. I just bought a cheapish weight set and haven't gone above 15lbs on each dumbbell but my arms and shoulders have gotten noticeably bigger and my legs slimmed down quite a bit. Of course my back is much better and my posture as well. I was not big to begin with 5'11" 170lbs and I am not into fitness. I really don't enjoy doing it but 10 minutes usually will fly by and I can get on with doing things I enjoy more.
  • tsol 4y ago
    It's different for everyone based on how fit you currently are. 6 curls a day wouldn't do much for me, for example-- I would hardly notice. But even 20-30 would give them a nice workout. I assume some of the people talking about more rigorous schedules are people that are already pretty fit and therefor need more intense workouts
• tiku 4y ago
  And if you do both?
• ramblerman 4y ago
  I'd be more interested to know where this isn't true. - exercise - study - practice All work better in steady increments. Are there any human endeavors where all-out wins the race?
  • ajuc 4y ago
    Programming is better if you do 3.5 hours once a week than 30 minutes every day.
    • ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
      This is not the case for me. I program several hours; every single day. The results speak for themselves. I also walk 3 miles, every morning. It helps the old ticker to keep ticking. I used to run, but kept injuring myself, resulting in long breaks.
      • exmadscientist 4y ago
        Walking is underrated. I've intentionally walked at least 3 miles every day (not without fail!), at top speed, in addition to whatever else is part of daily life. I don't intentionally do any other exercise (though apparently I'm strong enough to get asked to move things). My resting heart rate (in my 30s) is 48 bpm. Forty-eight! (As measured on multiple occasions by genuine hospital equipment that I happened to be using in the course of testing/working on it.) For someone who used to be a fat guy, that seems incredible. And yet there it is.
      • weberer 4y ago
        >This is not the case for me. I program several hours; every single day Read the parent comment again.
        • ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
          I know. But read what I wrote: “This is not the case for me.” I won’t speak to programming only 30 minutes a day, or only three and a half hours a week. I don’t do it, and don’t know anyone that does. It’s a strawman argument that doesn’t really apply to any real-world scenario. I simply used it as a fulcrum to make a comment, based on my own, real-world experience. I also used it to mention something that has a bit more relevance to the article, itself.
• standardUser 4y ago
  A think a lot of the reigning wisdom in the fitness world is created by serious strength trainers, for serious strength trainers. They aren't wrong, and their advice will become useful to you if you also get seriously into strength training. But for people starting from neutral, the advice in this article is better than anything your most enthusiastic gym friends will tell you about protein intake or leg day or training to failure. Just workout specific muscles several times a week and you will get stronger and bigger muscles over a few months, regardless of diet.
  • jmole 4y ago
    This. Take shoulder press as an example Most people would be better off lifting a 10 lb weight 50 times instead of lifting a 50 lb weight 10 times. High weight, low reps is a great way to injure yourself if you're like 99% of people out there.
    • jiggywiggy 4y ago
      Yeah i moved back my weights to 50/60% of max rep. No more back issues or injuries. Also train less. Yet strength and mass have gone up.
    • dsego 4y ago
      I always had problems doing full pushups. Now I'm starting slow, doing upright pushups against the wall. Have to thank this youtuber for the motivation: https://youtu.be/zkU6Ok44_CI https://youtu.be/zkU6Ok44_CI
      • SenHeng 4y ago
        Somehow I just knew it would be Hampton’s video. Yes, this guy and his channel, hybridcalisthenics, is amazing at breaking workouts down into progressive sets for beginners .
    • andreareina 4y ago
      Source for 10-rep sets being particularly injurious please. And 10 lbs x 50 is much less stimulative than 50 lbs x 10, bordering on being not particularly effective.
• flobosg 4y ago
  This reminded me of a submission from last week: “Working Out Only on Weekends Is Equal as Daily Exercise” – https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32390947 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32390947
  • russellbeattie 4y ago
    LOL, I was just going to link to that. Studies about exercise and weight loss are like the ones about red wine and chocolate. There's a contradictory article every other week. These sorts of things are accepted or rejected totally based on subjective opinion. If you're a type A person, you're thinking, "This sounds right, I guess I better find a 15 minute slot in my daily schedule." and if you're type B like myself, who shudders at the thought of the monotony of another daily task, you immediately think, "Hey, waitasecond! I thought we could just leave it to the weekend??" To each their own.
    • jdkoeck 4y ago
      I agree that these things are subjectively accepted/rejected, but you should know that there is no such thing as « type a » and « type b » person. Type a/b is a primitive typology based on old research funded by the tobacco industry.
    • hackernewds 4y ago
      I can see how weekend = daily workout could be a perfunctory interpretation of the same results as in the title post.
      • symlinkk 4y ago
        Huh?
    • brushfoot 4y ago
      Not that there aren't contradictory studies, but I don't see that here - this study focuses on muscles while the weekend study focused on all-cause mortality. I.e., just exercising on the weekends may be enough to live longer, but spreading weight training out throughout the week is more effective for muscle growth than the equivalent sum of the training on the weekend only.
• brabel 4y ago
  As someone who goes to gym at least 3 times a week (I find that the bare minimum to feel good), I think going only once a week must be actually damaging to the body... even when I miss one day and go only twice in a week, I can feel that the body has had enough time to "lose" much of the power it gained from the previous visit several days before, so it just kind of tries to regain that power back... it's like your energy levels going up and down from basically sedentary to just barely active, then back down... I imagine going only once a week would be like that, but with larger swings up and down, which surely can't be good for you. About 3 times a week, to me, is the sweet spot where I don't feel constantly tired, but also feel like my energy levels remain more or less stable.
  • atwood22 4y ago
    Everybody is different. I've come back from a week's rest a felt way stronger. I justified this as the rest letting my body fully recuperate, but who knows why this happens.
    • hombre_fatal 4y ago
      Yeah, same. Maybe it's all mental, but it doesn't feel like it. That said, I imagine you also aren't making a habit of it. Maybe training every day and then accidentally taking a week off give you some recuperation you didn't realize you needed.
  • kiba 4y ago
    I am incorporating some daily exercise to avoid the nasty side effects of DOMS, although that may be unnecessary past some amount of weeks. For example, squatting gives the worst DOMS. The solution is to just squat more frequently. I still have push, pull, and leg days. They just emphasize different muscles.
    • heurisko 4y ago
      > The solution is to just squat more frequently. I've found stretching also is important prior to exercise.
• Gatsky 4y ago
  Note that the study participants were healthy young individuals who were untrained ie. didn't do any regular resistance training prior to the study. Untrained people, particularly if they are young and healthy, often show large effects with exercise. The big difference between the training schedules cannot be extrapolated to well trained individuals.
• raverbashing 4y ago
  Humm this sounds too much like "one weird trick" and I would not be surprised if the researchers fumbled this a bit For one, doing 30 reps in the same day (with no details about if/how this was split into sets) is different than 6 reps in the same day (in terms of weight/intensity) This is TFA https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/sms.14220 https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/sms.14220
  • CannisterFlux 4y ago
    Yeah, it seems fishy. If 6 reps of something is difficult enough to do such that it has in impact on muscle growth, I can't see how they could manage 30 reps of the same thing. I wonder if the 6 reps 5 days people were untrained, while the 1 set of 30 people could manage it because they were trained enough so that it was possible (and therefore too easy)? Or maybe the 1 set of 30 was with a lighter weight to make it possible?
  • davisoneee 4y ago
    You can follow the link to the actual journal article to get details, and then criticise based on information. The protocol was 1 session of 5x6 reps (1d5s6r), versus 5 sessions of 1x6 (5d1s6r), with control 1d1s6r.
  • thinkcontext 4y ago
    Plenty of workout routines have days per week devoted to focusing on particular muscle groups ("leg day" etc), the study seems aimed at looking at their effectiveness. Its a study where they controlled variables to learn how the body responds to different types of stimulus, not a workout plan. It can inform the design of a workout plan but someone just naievely adopting this study design is
    • raverbashing 4y ago
      Yes, it is possible that the study helps in that sense (and yes, I'm skeptical of "leg day" workouts), I feel it is more productive to work out a muscle at least 2x week
• zaplin 4y ago
  Incidentally I've been doing this the past three months. I have an athletic background and I tend to go full-on workouts etc. But I decided to take it easy this summer, stopped training in general but I would set an alarm every 30 minutes and take short brakes (2-5mins) from work. In that time I do a few pushups and a couple exercises with the kettlebell. Nothing fancy or tiring, I stop just before I feel any type of resistance or "burn". This happens 5-8 times a day. On weekends I do none of that. Of course It's anecdotal but my body has FOR SURE changed. It's like when I did two times a day workouts. Of course I'll go back doing full workouts because I enjoy them. But anybody who dislikes devoting big chunks of time just for workouts should definitely experiment with micro workouts.
  • rollulus 4y ago
    What you describe here is also known as “Greasing the Groove”.
  • Thlom 4y ago
    I will try this starting now.
  • evv555 4y ago
    Depending on how hard you're pushing yourself this is commonly known as "greasing the groove" and is often used to get passed performance plateaus. The key is to never train to failure, increase the total volume of fresh/quality reps(spread through the day), and switch up the routine after x weeks to avoid overuse injuries.
  • NetOpWibby 4y ago
    Two weeks ago I decided to try reps of 20 push-ups whenever I thought about them. I haven’t thought of doing so more than twice a day BUT I’ve noticed an increase in my chest mass. I want to get back into exercising regularly but that large chunk of time isn’t conducive to my personal projects…I just don’t want to dedicate so much time to exercise. I’m relatively healthy so it’s not a big deal but you know how it is. Your biggest bully is yourself.
    • 4y ago
• simonswords82 4y ago
  I can't remember what episode it was but there was a really interesting chat between Joe Rogan and David Goggins on the Rogan podcast where David said in his view it's better to work out every day and ensure that you don't wake up the next day sore. His logic was that daily 80% threshold workouts are better than 2-3 times a week at 110%. Consistency is key - and that stuck with me. There's something nice about having muscle ache but it's counter productive to wanting to get back in the gym for most people!
  • thefz 4y ago
    Using DOMS as a metric is quite wrong. They are very subjective and most importantly they do not occur proportionally to exertion.
  • jack_pp 4y ago
    Firas Zahabi says the same thing too : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_fbCcWyYthQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_fbCcWyYthQ 0:13 : I'm a big believer in never being sore. You should train and the next day you should wake up feeling good
    • hackernewds 4y ago
      One of the best sensible videos I've watched on the topic. Firas might not look it, but he's trained a lot of authoritative athletes
      • dizhn 4y ago
        His view on other things though. Damn. I don't know the guy. I searched his name on youtube to see if he'd go into more detail in another interview. I won't say it takes something away from what he says about training but damn I kind of feel like it does anyway. :)
  • captainmuon 4y ago
    What I've heard is the exact opposite, you should wait until the muscle soreness is on the way out (2-3 days if you are a beginner) until training that muscle again, to give it time to build new muscle. I've also found that I only get bad DOMS when I haven't trained a muscle in a while. If it happens every time, I am training slightly different spots every time because my execution is not clean. (Side note, I find the highly technical term DOMS funny, as if that is some syndrom that has just recently been discovered. It's just plain old muscle soreness, the German term translates even roughly to "muscle hangover").
• haroldship 4y ago
  Does this justify Pavel Tsatsouline's Grease the Groove?
  • fredrikholm 4y ago
    Every elite athlete trains several times a day, most days of the week. GTG maintains volume via high frequency and intensity via very low intensiveness (eg. any one set is never difficult). This is great for people who have access to equipment yet don't have the time for one longer session. Otherwise there's nothing special with it.
• isitmadeofglass 4y ago
  Just like everything else today, the “consensus” fitness advice is shaped to optimize profit, since it’s made up and distributed by the sales reps(personal trainer) it’s pretty much all bullshit. Like you’ll see a bodybuilder proclaiming that this new exercise is the best ever for training abs, and the “proof” is “look at my abs” but obviously the exercise didn’t get the person to that point and it wasn’t made up until the person starter as a personal trainer and needed to sell people on “one secret the establishment hates”. In a 4-week training the trainer would rather have you come in every other day or once a week because it’s easier to schedule more clients. Makes you feel like your getting more for your money, And the trainer is going to make sure you’re sore because that makes you “feel Like it’s working” which is easier to pitch to people than to find an objective measure you can change enough in 4 weeks that the client is certain it works and feels the cost is justified.
  • elcomet 4y ago
    You seem to know something about this, so could you tell what's the best routine?
    • Sakos 4y ago
      If you want to avoid the bullshit and the broscience, strongerbyscience.com. Ignore the paid products, all you need are the articles and the strength training guide.
    • barry-cotter 4y ago
      Well, what is your goal? The best bang for your buck in terms of time spent is weight training, just do Starting Strength, Mark Rippetoe, and once you’ve maxed that out, go for maintenance. Three hours a week. But cardio exercise is probably near as good and might be just as good for most purposes except maintaining muscle mass as you age. For that just do a Couch to 5K programme and then run regularly. If you feel like running more than three times a week do it. If you feel like running longer distances, do it. Or don’t. By far the biggest difference is between the unfit and the moderately fit. Just start slow, take it easy and do something. Doing yoga four hours a week beats no exercise by a lot.
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• bodge5000 4y ago
  Does anyone have any idea how to retain muscle mass for longer? I was previously strength training daily, but took a week off (a dangerous combination of a tooth extraction and internet fearmongering) and my arms are already looking noticably slimmer. As soon as I can I'll get back to my daily routine, but I can't imagine this will be the last week I have to avoid it, these things happen, so I'd like to keep more of what I've got if/when that happens again.
  • presentation 4y ago
    I'm pretty sure that it takes significantly longer than a week to start losing muscle mass, so it might be in your mind.
    • bodge5000 4y ago
      Yeh that seems likely, though I swear to my eyes it does look different
      • weberer 4y ago
        Have you been taking creatine, but stopped in the past week? It could just be water weight lost.
      • leksak 4y ago
        It could be that they previously were inflame from training and thus held more water. Or, if you've been eating less (seems likely) your body might have had to take some glycogen from the muscles which also binds water. Lastly, sure, you may have atrophied some but probably not a substantial amount. Do something, if you can, that exerts the muscle (heavy being preferable over 15+ reps) to retain muscle tissue.
    • barry-cotter 4y ago
      People vary a lot. One of my friends lost 10kg of muscle mass in less than a month without being sick. He just stopped going to the gym every day and went on holiday. If your natural build is skinny as a rail and you’re buff and you stop some people just deflate like a balloon.
• helge9210 4y ago
  There is a factor usually left out: tendons and ligaments. Lacking blood vessels they can't improve as fast as muscles (tendon/ligament improvement/repair is happening thanks to electric potential gradient generated by piezoelectric effect of stretching/compression), but are part of muscle control system. If a tendon signals overload the attached muscle won't be able to generate full power.
• radu_floricica 4y ago
  Probably relevant for the HN crowd: there's a bunch of very geeky next gen fitness guys that keep up with the cutting edge of fitness research, and occasionally expand it themselves. If you're reading them, this kind of thing is being discussed for years, with new studies just moving the odds a bit in favor of the current hypothesis. Yes, they're very Bayesian, explicitly so. A few names/links, pick and mix as you will - they're all good: https://mennohenselmans.com/high-resistance-training-frequency-enhances-muscle-thickness-resistance-trained-men/ https://mennohenselmans.com/high-resistance-training-frequen... http://www.lookgreatnaked.com/fitness_articles_by_brad_schoenfeld.php http://www.lookgreatnaked.com/fitness_articles_by_brad_schoe... https://macrofactorapp.com/articles/ https://macrofactorapp.com/articles/ https://rpstrength.com/team-member/mike-israetel-phd https://rpstrength.com/team-member/mike-israetel-phd Probably not the best links for each, but it's morning and I got work to do. Should be enough to get you started tho.
  • cyri 4y ago
    And if you do functional bodybuilding aka CrossFit have a follow here from the guys of ETH Zurich: https://www.instagram.com/wod_science/ https://www.instagram.com/wod_science/
    • audiometry 4y ago
      “Functional bodybuilding” what? Bodybuilding is explicitly not functional. It maximizes for appearance/size.
      • ImPostingOnHN 4y ago
        it maximizes building the body, which comes with it's own appearance, sure, but the functionality of a muscle (what you can do with it) is in large part a function of the size just remember to stretch too :)
  • OrderlyTiamat 4y ago
    Thank you, this stuff is great!
• davisoneee 4y ago
  Just to clarify, for those without access to the full document: Participants: 24 males, 12 females. 'Healthy'. No regular resistance training of the arms in the previous 6 months. 1 day, 1 set, 6 reps (8male, 4female) 1 day, 5 sets, 6 reps (9m, 3f) 5 days, 1 set, 6 reps (7m, 5f) duration: 4 weeks, then 3-7 day 'rest', then test edit: formatting
  • mkl 4y ago
    That seems like a pretty small sample.
    • audiometry 4y ago
      Small sample of weak (untrained) people moreover.
      • davisoneee 4y ago
        That itself is a _good_ thing. The people who most need exercise are the people who don't currently exercise. If showing a small amount of regular effort is effective, compared to a single big effort, then that helps people get healthier.
        • TheCoelacanth 4y ago
          But they are the people who least need to optimize their routines towards muscle gains. Any remotely sensible routine will get them huge gains if they stick to it. Beginners need to optimize for a routine that they can consistently follow, not for the most effective exercises.
          • davisoneee 4y ago
            That's my entire point. if beginners think they need to do huge sessions, that can be intimidating for some. This research is confirming "just put _some_ effort in consistently", which is basically what you said.
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• senectus1 4y ago
  how do you guys keep it up through the colder winter months? I always fall off the cart in that period.. its too dark, cold and wet and all i want to do is eat food that i really shouldn't :-(
  • pengaru 4y ago
    Relocate somewhere with better year-round climate, it can't be overstated how much easier it makes staying fit and active.
  • FartyMcFarter 4y ago
    You could set easier goals for the winter - a slightly higher calorie intake, a bit less exercise, give yourself an extra cheat day, whatever works.
  • papandada 4y ago
    Same here (Canadian prairies). Everything seems possible in the summer. The autumnal equinox hits hard. The only thing that ever worked for me was getting out to the pool regularly in the morning. Getting to the pool was much less effort than exercising, and once I was there, I was more awake, more pressured for sure to put in a decent effort. Early morning cardio and some cold exposure was invigorating (I know it's ironic to suggest this to a comment that mentions being too wet and cold, but it is different) and kept binge/emotional eating in check.
  • tallanvor 4y ago
    If you go to the gym, you pretty much have to get into the habit of going every day, and around the same time every day. Eventually you get to the point where missing a day (on purpose or otherwise) gives you the feeling that you've forgotten to do something. That doesn't mean you have to have a significant workout each time you go - 30 minutes on an exercise bike with low resistance won't significantly impact recovery times if you're focusing on strength training, but it'll still get you to the gym and help reinforce the practice that it's a normal part of your day.
  • seper8 4y ago
    D3 supps Likely your testosterone is suffering. And testosterone makes hard work feel good.
• atemerev 4y ago
  Sure, but ADHD prevents me doing anything regularly :(
  • scajanus 4y ago
    I find it easier to go to the gym 7 days a week than 2-3 times a week -- there is no decision involved, and no chance to "oh I'll just do it tomorrow". When I fall off the wagon I can skip a few weeks or months easily though.
    • atemerev 4y ago
      That’s an interesting idea, thank you.
    • ImPostingOnHN 4y ago
      Same here, it's just part of my morning routine at this point, rise and grind. It's enough of a workout that it makes a difference in the day, and that difference is enough to convince me to keep going (even though I'm always panting and occasionally feeling nauseous during the workout) that, and I'm really impatient, and the 30-minute workout 6-7 times a week gets me results faster than the same workout less frequently would
  • duckmysick 4y ago
    What's your goal? Any exercise at all or something more specific?
• dave7 4y ago
  I may be reading it incorrectly, but it seems rather strange they are counting the eccentric (decline / negative) portion of the Bicep curl as the only stimulus. It begs the question, how did the trainees get the weight back up to the top to do the next rep? Lab assistants? It is also interesting because negatives are super-effective when you are too weak to manage a whole rep, this is often the case with pull-ups and the trainee can easily jump up to the bar, lowering themselves slowly as the stimulus, and soon enough will become strong enough to perform a complete rep. But after that point, the eccentric portion alone will not be enough to improve further.
  • brigandish 4y ago
    My guess is they use both arms to lift. Perhaps that doesn’t count as enough stimulus to be recorded?
  • scajanus 4y ago
    Couldn't access the original paper easily, but in studies like this they might use specialized lab equipment -- that allows 'maximal voluntary eccentric contraction' more safely and easily than traditional dumbbell/barbell lifts. Basically it would complete the rep in, say, 1 second, while measuring the force you put out, but the machine is powerful enough to resist whatever force you put against it. They probably used the same machine to measure the results, that is, 'MVC-ECC, isometric (MVC-ISO), and concentric contraction (MVC-CON) torque of the elbow flexors' -- which would also be harder to do in a traditional gym setup.
• ZeroGravitas 4y ago
  This is talking about muscle building, but this is basically the same reasoning that is used to explain why gardening and a cycling are really good at extending longevity and increasing health (including mental health), it's something you can do fairly consistently year round and through the week. So it might not help you have bulging biceps, but any kind of physical movement you can integrate into your daily life is valuable.
• quickthrower2 4y ago
  I am doing some body weight exercises like this daily. It is to combat chronic fatigue so I need to be very careful not to over do it. I am using a daily tick list and to get a tick for exercise I need to do 10 reps of something. If I am very ill it could be ten shrugs. If I feel super it might be 10 pushups, 20 squats and a pull up. Following this Laissez faire system has increased my strength. Carrying a 10kg item in the shop feels quite light, and picking up my kid about 40kg is possible now. It is those things I am super happy about. I am using TRX (aka some rope hanging from the ceiling) and the earths gravity, I don’t need any weights yet. But I have some dogs and kids if I need them :-).
  • gigaflop 4y ago
    While I don't like TRX, it was originally designed by a Navy Seal to provide a full-body workout. So long as it helps you achieve your goals, it may be all you need.
    • quickthrower2 4y ago
      I am interested, why don't you like TRX? (I didn't know TRX is a brand name too - but I mean the suspension training in general...)
      • gigaflop 4y ago
        I like big, chunky weights, and want big muscles. I enjoy having a bit of bulk, and that doesn't mix the best with bodyweight exercise. In my head, bodyweight exercise is best for maintaining a more lean physique.
• zeruch 4y ago
  This seems to align a lot with the grease the groove concept (I heard it mentioned earliest by the kettlebell dude, Pavel Tsatsouline, but not sure if he's coined that phrase or not).
• captainmuon 4y ago
  From what I've heard (and my own very little experience) the ideal is somewhere in the middle. You need to allow 1-2 days after excercise for muscle growth. So doing the same excercise every day might actually inhibit growth a bit, and once a week is too infrequent. You also don't need to do crazy long workouts. It is possible to set the muscle stimulus pretty quickly. The idea is that you train right up till muscle failure (which sounds scarier than it is). What's I've seen recommended is about three sets of each 8-12 repetitions per exercise. You choose the weight so that you cannot do more than 12. Splitting it up in sets helps you edge closer to the point of exhaustion. It is important that you don't overdo it of course. In the end though, any exercise is better than no exercise, and as long as you have something you can stick to and works for you, it's fine.
• dirtyid 4y ago
  IMO a lot of these studies on untrained are fairly pointless, this one on extra strength particularly so. Reality is basically anything works for novice lifters and unless you're genetically blessed in hypertrophy department, moving bluntly bitch weights and slight more bitch weights doesn't meaningfuly impact end results for gen pop. I've forgot the exact numbers but I recall metastudy of strength to muscle mass to longevity/health ratio, i.e. entire strong people live longer narrative pointed that the baseline of strength and muscle mass one needs to benefit from meaningful health affects is greater than (from what I've observed after years in the gym and especially those who don't progress/quit before reaching ) novice tier fuckarounditis workouts. Granted ultimately it's about finding routines one can consistently stick to but also one that builds up the base of strength and hypertrophy for health effects. And that's totally possible doing a little exercise once a day, if little = enough. However if exercising lackadaisical a little everyday and after a year you're stalled doing a dozen pushups and a couple pullups then maybe try something else that raises your baseline so that you can now trivially perform 50 push ups and 5 pullups everyday. Sometimes it's even better spend a little time doing methods you don't enjoy because with respect to strength and muscle mass, they can typically be maintained by methods you do enjoy, i.e. I trained myself to bench/deadlift 2/3x bodyweight, but I can take a long barbell break doing not much sets of max pullups and dips and squats to maintain most of my muscle mass, which is more than most people need for optimal health and probably detrimental. Point is, spend a few months to do basic barbell novice progression, maybe put in effort to milk some intermediate gains, the entire 80/20 rule and find yourself suddenly able to perform better in other domains and maintain performance through methods more amenable to your life style. For gen pop, probably good to set goals to weight + bf% and some minimum level of strength according to age and weight, especially lowerbody/hip strength if we're worried about old folks dying from falls. Surprised there aren't recommended fitness standard like military fitness minimums.
• amelius 4y ago
  You need resting days.
• jdthedisciple 4y ago
  I'm somewhat critical: > One group did this six times a day for five days a week (6×5). The other group completed all 30 contractions in a single day once a week (30×1) While this may appear effective for complete noobies, I suspect that the hailed effect will quickly go to 0 when you get even just a little more advanced. To make progress then you can't avoid longer "Time under Tension" sets for your muscles. Which also becomes increasingly impractical to spread 5 times over a day as you first need to properly warm up each time.
• piskov 4y ago
  These — every day vs once a week — are both extremes. Muscles need around 24 hours to restore but already start to “cool” after around 2 days. Problem is that nervous system needs at least 2 days to recuperate (if we’re talking about any meaningful workout with free weights for lifting, bench pressing, squalts, etc). So one should balance these two recoveries: too long — muscles will cool back down, too short — nervous system is not restored which quickly leads to squeezing yourself out and easy illness due to weakened immune system. So 72 hours are the golden interval both in terms of recovery and practicality so one doesn’t live in the gym.
  • ImPostingOnHN 4y ago
    what is the physiological mechanism you're describing with the slang, "muscle cooling down"?
    • someguydave 4y ago
      One could ask a similar question to nearly every poster on this thread. Excercise and nutrition are very bikeshedy topics.
      • ImPostingOnHN 4y ago
        I suppose its true, indeed one could ask any number of questions about any number of things in the world mine was about 1 specific thing though
    • piskov 4y ago
      I’m by no means an expert in the field, so short answer is I don’t know. It’s probably connected with muscle protein synthesis which in trained people peak in 24 hours and basically goes back to basal level after 72 hours [1] After that, without exercise, all gained muscle growth starts to negate. [1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1474228/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1474228/
• throwaway22032 4y ago
  Most fitness advice is "how to not get fit, for people who don't want to get fit". It's honestly not that hard once you treat physical health as being an _essential_ part of the human experience. It's not a chore, it's not a task, it's fundamentally important, it's what you are on this planet to do. You "don't like it"? I'm sure you do loads of other things that you like even less (8 hour work day?) - society just supports those things more. If someone told you that you could become a great chess player by playing 30 seconds a day would you buy it or would you think they were completely full of it?
  • jraph 4y ago
    > I'm sure you do loads of other things that you like even less (8 hour work day?) - society just supports those things more Well, it does not merely supports those things. It almost coerces you into them. There are few ways to get enough money so you can live. I would not work the same 8h/days if I could. > it's what you are on this planet to do Not at all. I'm here for no reason. Now that I'm here, I'll optimize happiness while creating as little harm as possible to others. Doing sports would at best be a means to this happiness if it helps me feel better, longer. Even knowing it is not quite enough to like it and be motivated to do it enough. I say this as someone who likes hiking, does most of their trips by bike, and runs regularly, as long as I'm not too tired and it's not extremely hot or cold outside. I don't like practicing, and I won't lie to myself about it. I only do it because I believe it makes the rest of my life better. I guess considering it as essential helps indeed, but that's a very abstract idea, to be honest.
    • throwaway22032 4y ago
      Physical reality is far more coercive. You can earn money without a 9-5. Hell, a person can just have money and not need to earn it. You can't get fit or maintain fitness without putting in the work. That's part of the reason it's so valued, there is no cheat code.
      • mritchie712 4y ago
        well, there's steroids.
• scajanus 4y ago
  Dan John's Easy Strength, that he originally developed with Pavel Tsatsouline whose Greasing the Groove was also mentioned in the comments, follows a similar idea. It consists of workouts done 5 times a week, and lasting no longer than 15 minutes (for me, in practice, ~20 minutes was closer to the truth). The basic idea is to do 2 sets of 5 in push/pull/hinge/squat followed by a loaded carry at loads that feel almost too easy, 5 times a week, for 40 total workouts. There is some detail/progression added in his texts, but the basic idea is short, frequent, repeatable workouts that seem to lead to pretty good strength gains when run once or twice. He does say that you might want to do more volume-intensive program before/after, as everything tends to work for some time but not forever.
• DIARRHEA_xd 4y ago
  As with all regimen-based health/nutrition studies, the results can be ignored. Instead, use these studies for ideas, and experiment yourself to find out what works for you.
• jollyllama 4y ago
  The other huge benefit is you're keeping your metabolism up with more frequent workouts and less sedentary days/time.
• lr4444lr 4y ago
  I don't know what to think of this. One wonders whether the load and rate of exertion are controlled for. If I know I am going to have to work out 5x/week, I sure as he'll don't go as hard on day 1 as I would if I had a whole week to recover on a 1x/week regimen. Maybe 5x/week is still overall more load, and that's why it works, but taking the time to do this week after week is also tricky. Not to mention, there's periodization to control for too. If all of the participants had been doing something closer to 1x/week per body part before the study, the 5x/week regimen had an unfair advantage purely due to novel metabolic and neuromuscular challenge.
• throwaway787544 4y ago
  We all know Pavel's "Grease the Groove" works from experience; this is just scientific back-up. If you want to be in marginally better shape, set between 4 and 10 timers every day, and do one set of push-ups, or squat jumps, or both, when the timer goes off. If you're not used to this, do half push-ups or lower-down push-ups. For the squat jumps add some weight (i.e. dumbbells) over time. You can play around a lot with push-ups and squat jumps, both to make them more interesting and work different muscle groups.
  • flycaliguy 4y ago
    That explains my muscle development after having kids. Basically just doing squats and lifts throughout the day. Lots of tag based cardio to round it out and those multiple peanut butter and jelly sandwiches every day probably helps as well.
    • throwaway787544 4y ago
      Not a bad idea... Round it out with some leap-frog for plyo, animal crawls. You could turn burpees into a fun game. (Where is the parent-kid playtime-workout video that we all need? Tire the kids out and give the parents a couple sets)
      • Balgair 4y ago
        I'm not saying 'Baby Shark' with burpees wouldn't not get me in the best shape of my life. But I am saying that I'd rather jump off a bridge than combine two of the most hated things in existence.
    • hombre_fatal 4y ago
      One of the best things my dad taught me was to have fun doing push-ups and squats randomly throughout the day like any time there's downtime. I hope you pass it on to your kids. It's like teaching your kids to enjoy a raw carrot when they feel for a snack (something I also thank my parents for).
• cosmiccatnap 4y ago
  I'm not sure why this needed to be studied... If you work out only one day you can work out for maybe two hours. You can easily workout an hour a day or even 30m which is still 5 hours a week... Like, this study is kind of coming to the conclusion that working out more is more progress and we'll...yea duh
• curiousllama 4y ago
  A bit ago, there was another study stating the exact opposite of this: that weekend-only workouts showed better results than daily workouts. I think the real TLDR here is "the workout you do is better than the workout you don't." Just do something consistently, and there's a good chance you'll get some sort of results. There are some universal principles - but not many - and there are many paths to realizing them.
• deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
• pibechorro 4y ago
  Work out every day. 2x a week do high intensity cardio to your limits. The days after, do revovery like yoga, light swimming, walking, stetching, and build up to the next hight intensity day. Do heavy weights once a week for bone density. Sleep. Listen to your body, if you need a week off, do it. get sunshine,go ouside. Eat whole foods.
• nyjah 4y ago
  I found this site in an hn comment and its been my goto for training for 5+ years now. gmb.io if you are out of shape, elements is gold. I've been through elements countless times. Its body weight training that focuses on movements and is very beginner friendly, but can also be scaled up. I own multiples of their programs, all pretty great. You can also get a lot of value out of their free stuff on YouTube.
  • zuzuleinen 4y ago
    Thanks for this! I just bought it yesterday and I really like it!
• jriot 4y ago
  The body can handle any exercise regime you desire, given the time the feature most people lack. Either being afforded the time to exercise, will power to exercise or interest to exercise. Then there are those who see strength training or long-distance running as being detrimental to long-term health. Where I believe most people fail is not setting an objective goal; to get fit is vague. You need a goal that is measurable, preferably not body weight as your body will structure itself properly for your goal. I suppose your goal could not be ambitious enough but I assume people seek to push themselves. At the beginning of Covid I was a 235 lbs powerlifter, then I started boxing (gyms opens 6-weeks in Covid) training to compete, dropped to 185 last November with a 10k run at 53:23. Now I am working towards my own goal the 15-50 project; to be able to have powerlifting total of 1500 lbs and run a 50 miler within a weekend. Current lifts are squat - 555, bench - 405, deadlift 605, with my one mile run at 8:43. I have to build my run slow (running at 220 lbs) while I maintain my lifts. I have planned for this take 3 years. It won't always be pleasant but given time the body will adjust and you will have a much healthier life!
  • anon23anon 4y ago
    I feel like Powerlifting has become such a crap shoot. You have ppl doing ultra wide sumo on DL, crazy back arch on bench, squat suits, wrapped knees, ultra wide foot placement low bar squat blah blah. To me these lifts no longer even remotely resemble what I do in the gym. That being said I love John Haack - conventional DL, relatively narrow/normal grip on bench, doesn't the dude even high bar? Wish that shit was just the standard.
    • lee 4y ago
      Why do you care how others powerlift? If someone wants to do an ultra wide sumo DL or quarter squat 500 pounds how does that effect you?
    • jriot 4y ago
      I have started this year using knee sleeves once I go above 400 lbs on squats. At 37 it keeps warm and secured, better for longevity. If there are any real complaints for strength sports (I've done strongman as well) are the high usages of PEDs. Not that I am against people using them but it makes it difficult to have apples to apples comparison, particularly when competing.
• brodouevencode 4y ago
  It is nice to see some data behind this. Intuitively it makes sense and you can prove it out with a simple question - have you ever met a carpenter that didn't have an iron handshake?
  • symlinkk 4y ago
    Which is part of why we (programmers) get paid so much, we are doing work that is objectively unnatural and unhealthy (hunching over a desk in a sedentary position for the majority of the day).
• screye 4y ago
  I've found that the easiest way to work out is to make it entirely incidental to your everyday life in a manner that exploits your weaknesses. My distracted mind loves fidgeting with a doorway pullup bar or living room dumbbells as I go about my daily life moving between rooms, having conversations with roommates or waiting for my coffee to pour. Biking and brisk-walking everywhere is great for getting that cardio in. Hobbies are the most obvious example where health is a secondary benefit. Climbing and hiking do that for me. That way, working out never feels like a chore.
• darthrupert 4y ago
  I won't doubt that muscle mass can be increased this easily, but to get the mental benefits of exercise does require a longer medium or high intensive practice.
• turkeygizzard 4y ago
  I got very interested in this kind of stuff a few months ago in an effort to get better at climbing. I can't access the full paper but going from the abstract, this result isn't super surprising for two major reasons: mainly that once a week isn't often enough, and the once-a-week workout group might also be doing unnecessary muscle damage with such a heavy workout. It would be interesting if they had included more groups that did more reasonable workout schedules like twice or three times a week with three sets a day. I imagine those groups would see better results than the 5-days-a-week group. A further caveat is that the abstract doesn't mention if the individuals are untrained. Assuming they're untrained, that often explains a lot of the gains you see in these papers. That's not to say this is unimpressive. For sedentary people, it means that just a small amount of non-exhausting exercise can make significant changes to the body. These researchers actually have another paper from earlier this year that shows that just squeezing your muscles can result in 10% strength gains (https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/sms.14138?af=R https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/sms.14138?af=R)
• wooque 4y ago
  Once a week was never enough, they should have compared group that exercises 3x a week compared to little exercise every day. I would guess 3x a week will be much better.
• AlwaysRock 4y ago
  For the last few years I've been moving most months to a new area and have limited access to gyms, or at least affordable access. I've been doing pushups, split squats, and pull ups. 6 sets of 10 during the day. I alternate between each exercise. One per day. It's an incredible way to have a baseline of fitness and make sure I'm getting up from my chair during the day. I typically find I'm more likely to do some cardio later in the day as well because I've already done some exercise.
  • flanbiscuit 4y ago
    I'm in a similar situation How do you do pull-ups when you don't have gym access and there's no home equipment? Do you travel with one of those door frame pull-up bars? Do you search for local parks with pull-up bars?
    • AlwaysRock 4y ago
      Travel with a door frame pull up bar. I've bought a half dozen over the last two years. If I cant bring it somewhere for some reason they are like $20 on Amazon.
• brisky 4y ago
  I have a daily routine: 3x5 second horizontal handstands, 10 pull-ups and balance on one leg with eyes closed. It takes less than 5 mins, easy to make a habit of and really makes you feel and look better. Sometimes I throw in some stretches too.
• ffggvv 4y ago
  Sure once a week vs once a day. but what about twice a week? 3 times a week? Youre telling me every bodybuilder ever is wrong?
• kevinpet 4y ago
  I'm less convinced by studies that use an unconventional control group. What I mean by unconventional is primarily the single set of 30 reps once a week, which is not representative of conventional wisdom in weight training (conventional wisdom would be 3-5 sets of 5-8 reps, with a rest of at least a minute between). Another factor is that they are doing maximal eccentric movements. This means lowering a weight slightly heavier than the subject is able to lift slowly. Does this make the study invalid? Not clear, but it makes it less clearly applicable.
• carom 4y ago
  >One group did this six times a day for five days a week (6×5). The other group completed all 30 contractions in a single day once a week (30×1). Researchers also had a third group do six contractions once a week as a control. >Results show the 30×1 group did not see any increase in their muscle strength over the four weeks. However, they did see their muscle thickness (an indicator of muscle size) grow by 5.8 percent. The control group doing six contractions a week did not see any change in muscle strength or muscle thickness. This is already known. High reps will build muscle size. Low reps near max will build strength. These researchers need to lurk more. Power lifting routines will gradually increase weight during a training cycle, with the goal of hitting a new 1 rep max (1RM) toward the end of 6 weeks or so. In weeks 4 and 5 you'll be doing sets of 2 or 3. Body builders will normally do lower weight for sets of 12 or more, targeting specific muscles.
• lowbloodsugar 4y ago
  In untrained young people.