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I find it strange that there is so little innovation in the field of everyday tooth care. Particularly the inefficiency of brushing one tooth at a time. I like

I find it strange that there is so little innovation in the field of everyday tooth care. Particularly the inefficiency of brushing one tooth at a time. I like the idea of https://blizzbrush.com/ https://blizzbrush.com/, has anyone tried it? It's a bit suspicious that the single-pack is "sold out", but the 5 and 10-packs are not.

whoomp12342 4y ago
idk, I think the 1 pack means that people are wiling to try it but have not decided as a mass if they want to continue use. It doesnt mean its a bad product
unsupp0rted 4y ago
Totally agree there's too little innovation in this field. I hadn't heard of the Buzz Brush and it's fascinating to me, although it does look half-baked and too indie at the moment for me to trust it with my dental health. Also it's too expensive to try as a throwaway test. Any other cool innovative products that replace standard brushing?
- dmcgee 4y ago
  Not that replace standard brushing, but I worked with a company in Denmark called Novozymes. They produce enzymes for a variety of applications including dental care. They have a set of enzymes that they license to Unilever for a toothpaste called Zendium, which has some market share in Northern Europe. The enzymes break down microfilm that develops on teeth, making brushing more effective. There was RCT done on it I believe, I read the paper years ago, can't seem to find it now though.
  - unsupp0rted 4y ago
    Any concern those enzymes would get swallowed and break down membranes in the digestive tract?
    - krageon 4y ago
      Seeing as they pass through the acid in your stomach (and will denature there, which is the point of your stomach) you must be primarily worried about any of the bits before that. These enzymes are made to go in your mouth. If they dissolved the tissues in there they wouldn't be appropriate for that, so this is not a concern.
texaslonghorn5 4y ago
Based on the video, I wouldn't implicitly trust the brush to have enough precision to hit the small chunks of food at the gumline.
hanniabu 4y ago
Not buying it. That would only work if it were firmer because as it is now I'm extremely doubtful your teeth will magically fall into those grooves when the sponge has so little structure. On top of that it seems hard to clean, A toothbrush is open and has short bristles and often after rinsing it I'll look and still find debris where I need to clean again and deliberately get pieces out.
macinjosh 4y ago
If you are in the US, like me, you might not be aware of Novamin toothpastes. They are available in other countries. It is my understanding that it can enclose dentin tubules exposed by enamel loss. This article provides some background: https://medium.com/@ravenstine/the-curious-history-of-novamin-toothpaste-620c6bef8881 https://medium.com/@ravenstine/the-curious-history-of-novami...
- nso 4y ago
  I've had bad teeth since adulthood, partly due to a medication changing the pH of my saliva, and partly due to a Pepsi addiction. I swear by the Novamin tooth paste, my life has gone from always having small aches and icing in my teeth to my teeth hardly being a factor anymore.
- safeimp 4y ago
  I was considering this recently based on a thread from last week: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31954800 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31954800 Do you have a reliable source to purchase? I've no interest in purchasing via Amazon, wouldn't feel comfortable trusting the content.
- 2Gkashmiri 4y ago
  I have, after years of deliberatng, decided to use an electric toothbrush. Its been 2 years and I want to know what I should be expecting. Maybe I am sleepy when I a brushing so I don't notice but asking still. Novamin sounds interesting. Its available here on amazon so I might splurge on it but again, what I am to expect out of it as opposed to regular Colgate ?
  - nso 4y ago
    For me it removed that icy feeling.
- stjohnswarts 4y ago
  been doing nano-hydroxyapatite for the same reason. I use stannous fluoride based toothpaste in the morning and nhdpa at night before bed.
Silica6149 4y ago
This sponge you put in your mouth made me think for the first time about how much bacteria is potentially on a normal toothbrush. I'm betting this product is even less hygienic since it's a sponge instead of only bristles.
- bamboozled 4y ago
  Why not leave your toothbrush in hydrogen peroxide overnight?
  - Silica6149 4y ago
    Good idea, it's just I never thought twice about the cleanliness of a toothbrush. I guess it's been ingrained in me to think it's normal to run a toothbrush under water to "clean" it.
    - rusticpenn 4y ago
      You are supposed to change the brush every few months precisely for this reason.
      - DoingIsLearning 4y ago
        I thought it was because the hairs on the brush get 'blunt' from erosion on your teeth. The 'applied science' guy had an electron microscope capture of new and old toothbrushes and it was the differences between needle sharp edges and worn out clubs.
    - DoingIsLearning 4y ago
      I remember a myth busters episode where they demonstrated that toothbrushes left in open air will easily get fecal matter on the brush hairs due to aerosolized poop from when you flush an open lid toilet. Definitely a great conversation ice-breaker.
      - liotier 4y ago
dubswithus 4y ago
I remember some articles about good bacteria outcompeting bad bacteria in the mouth and preventing cavities. Seems like it probably didn't pan out.
- moffkalast 4y ago
  Nah it did, the problem is you have to take a pill every day and they cost way too much for that sort of frequent usage. Like $60 per 20 pills kind of price, which is hard to justify without hard proven evidence of actual benefit.
  - krageon 4y ago
    How did you get this price? Can I get them somewhere? $3 per day to never have teeth issues again is an absolute bargain.
    - moffkalast 4y ago
      I think I saw it on amazon a few years back? It's possible there wasn't enough demand to keep selling it, but I've also no idea what it was called anymore.
f6v 4y ago
Have you seen how much it costs to get crowns or implants? There’s zero incentive for innovation, people keep bringing their money.
- Forgeties79 4y ago
  I would like to think that most dentists like their patients to have healthy, cared for teeth and that they play in important role in it. I would not like to think that most of them actually work to our detriment so that they can do more expensive, painful procedures on our mouths and teeth. That’s a pretty cynical outlook I’d need to see evidence for.
  - prepend 4y ago
    I’d like to think that, but my dentist makes about $170/year from me having healthy teeth. They make $1500/crown (in addition to the $170 for cleaning). I’ve been to three dentists this year. I find it interesting that one said I had an emergency and needed a crown right away (a year ago), one said they’d watch the tooth, and one said nothing. Cynically, I don’t like agency issues where experts make lots of money off their advice and it’s difficult to double check.
    - stjohnswarts 4y ago
      I had a dentist for several years and everything was normal just clean and go. A new hygenist shows up and suddently "You have severe plaque below the gum line we need to do a deep cleaning (root scaling/planing)" so they do that and it's almost $500, next time rolls around and she says it again and dentist concurs. I had been brushing and flossing diligently (probably too much) since the last time and just looking at my teeth saw nearly no plaque. I left and said I'd call them back to schedule. I go to a new dentist the following week and they say I have lovely teeth and it looks like I've been taking great care of them, then I tell the dentist what the previous one had said and he's like "listen, I'm not going to bad mouth anyone, but your teeth look great, they just need a typical cleaning that you came in for". That's when I knew something was really wrong with the other place, so it happens. I know my story is anecdotal. Personally I think my old dentist got rid of her previous hygenist that wouldn't agree to hornswoggle patients and they tried to get me to do expensive treatments.
sAbakumoff 4y ago
My daily tooth care consists of 3 steps: 1. Clean between teeth by using an interdental brush 2. Clean between teeth by using a water flosser 3. Clean teeth surface by using an electric brush. I am not sure how would the sponge replace these 3 steps.
LeonM 4y ago
There is quite some innovation, but consumers are slow to adopt IMO. Last year, my dentist warned me I have quite severe receded gums. This was due to me pushing my toothbrush too hard. So, after doing some research I bought an ultrasonic toothbrush. These have a static head (it does not oscillate/rotate) which emits ultrasonic waves to clean your teeth. Same principle of an ultrasonic parts cleaner. The head is still a traditional brush, though very soft. The brush is used to transfer the sound waves, you do not use it to 'scrub' your teeth. There is not friction involved. From my experience, I can highly recommend an ultrasonic toothbrush. It takes some time to get used to, but personally, I will never go back to a traditional 'friction' type brush (manual or electric). The model I have is the Silkin' ToothWave. Prices have come down significantly since I bought mine (I paid >€200 IIRC, now they are ~€90). Note that some vendors sell traditional 'friction type' oscillating electronic toothbrushes with ultrasonic as a feature. In my opinion, these do not offer much benefit, it is better to go for a fully ultrasonic model.
- afterburner 4y ago
  Interesting. I've also had success using a Sonicare but always moving from the gums to the tooth (instead of along the gumline as the manual suggests).
- d1sxeyes 4y ago
  Looks like 250 EUR on their website?
  - LeonM 4y ago
    Looks like that pricing has not been updated for a while. I paid something like 200 euros, that was about a year ago. Most online retailers in my country now list them for less than 100 euros.
    - jachee 4y ago
      Weird. In Dutch (https://silkn.nl/toothwave-black https://silkn.nl/toothwave-black) it’s €119. In English (both EU and GB), French, Spanish, and German ( e.g. https://silkn.eu/toothwave-black https://silkn.eu/toothwave-black) it’s €249.
amelius 4y ago
I want something that I can use in the office (i.e., without easy access to a sink).
david_l_lin 4y ago
I think it's because incumbents in the space have played a huge role in preventing adoption of new technologies that actually prevent disease. Dentists make money not from preventing disease, but from performing procedures when disease has already progressed to the point of no return. Cavities and gum disease are bacterial infections that are completely preventable. I feel the need to plug what we've been building at https://www.bristlehealth.com/ https://www.bristlehealth.com/. We've built an at-home test that leverages the microbes in the mouth to detect disease, and provide actionable and personalized recommendations that can reduce your risk of gum disease, cavities and persistent bad breath.
- barbazoo 4y ago
  > Dentists make money not from preventing disease, but from performing procedures when disease has already progressed to the point of no return. I find that hard to believe as dentists wouldn't be the group of people I'd imagine developing those new ideas and products. How would that work?
  - yunohn 4y ago
    Nobody wants to go to the dentist until it’s too late, because it’s so expensive nor covered by health insurance. Even if it’s not intentional, dentists aren’t R&D specialists. They’re a service, at a premium price, whose livelihood depends on people going for treatments.
    - barbazoo 4y ago
      What lever do they have to prevent new products from being developed that help people take care of their teeth?
      - yunohn 4y ago
        The lever is the lack of funding and motivation brought about by the previous factors. It’s not an individual choice, rather a medical industry wide systemic issue. A popular example: https://finance.yahoo.com/news/goldman-sachs-asks-biotech-research-191500553.html https://finance.yahoo.com/news/goldman-sachs-asks-biotech-re...
runnerup 4y ago
For me the "unbreakable" floss string combined with a floss pick in this particular product: https://www.amazon.com/DenTek-Triple-Clean-Floss-Picks/dp/B003K01BMI https://www.amazon.com/DenTek-Triple-Clean-Floss-Picks/dp/B0... was a massive innovation that finally allowed me to regularly floss easily at the age of ~30. Prior to that I couldn't handle the floss string well, and all other floss picks (even nearly identical ones from the exact same brand) just snap apart between my very closely-spaced teeth.
Komodai 4y ago
This looks like a really bad dropshipping site... Especially considering the fact they've imported reviews from elsewhere, like AliExpress (even has the same name format, C**e).
bilsbie 4y ago
It’s just an over regulated industry where it’s too expensive to try new things.
- diob 4y ago
  Dentistry exists all over the world...
bsenftner 4y ago
In grad school, one of my friends worked for a US medical device manufacturer. They had several dental innovations that they did not bother to market in the US because the regulation to get approval out weighed what they felt the market offered. They made their profits in other countries and were happy with that.
jklinger410 4y ago
Capitalism only creates innovations where there is potential for expanding profits. Permanently fixing teeth is infinitely less profitable than keeping them in a constant state of disrepair.

whoomp12342 4y ago

idk, I think the 1 pack means that people are wiling to try it but have not decided as a mass if they want to continue use. It doesnt mean its a bad product

unsupp0rted 4y ago

Totally agree there's too little innovation in this field. I hadn't heard of the Buzz Brush and it's fascinating to me, although it does look half-baked and too indie at the moment for me to trust it with my dental health. Also it's too expensive to try as a throwaway test. Any other cool innovative products that replace standard brushing?

dmcgee 4y ago
Not that replace standard brushing, but I worked with a company in Denmark called Novozymes. They produce enzymes for a variety of applications including dental care. They have a set of enzymes that they license to Unilever for a toothpaste called Zendium, which has some market share in Northern Europe. The enzymes break down microfilm that develops on teeth, making brushing more effective. There was RCT done on it I believe, I read the paper years ago, can't seem to find it now though.
- unsupp0rted 4y ago
  Any concern those enzymes would get swallowed and break down membranes in the digestive tract?
  - krageon 4y ago
    Seeing as they pass through the acid in your stomach (and will denature there, which is the point of your stomach) you must be primarily worried about any of the bits before that. These enzymes are made to go in your mouth. If they dissolved the tissues in there they wouldn't be appropriate for that, so this is not a concern.

texaslonghorn5 4y ago

Based on the video, I wouldn't implicitly trust the brush to have enough precision to hit the small chunks of food at the gumline.

hanniabu 4y ago

Not buying it. That would only work if it were firmer because as it is now I'm extremely doubtful your teeth will magically fall into those grooves when the sponge has so little structure. On top of that it seems hard to clean, A toothbrush is open and has short bristles and often after rinsing it I'll look and still find debris where I need to clean again and deliberately get pieces out.

macinjosh 4y ago

If you are in the US, like me, you might not be aware of Novamin toothpastes. They are available in other countries. It is my understanding that it can enclose dentin tubules exposed by enamel loss. This article provides some background: https://medium.com/@ravenstine/the-curious-history-of-novamin-toothpaste-620c6bef8881 https://medium.com/@ravenstine/the-curious-history-of-novami...

nso 4y ago
I've had bad teeth since adulthood, partly due to a medication changing the pH of my saliva, and partly due to a Pepsi addiction. I swear by the Novamin tooth paste, my life has gone from always having small aches and icing in my teeth to my teeth hardly being a factor anymore.
safeimp 4y ago
I was considering this recently based on a thread from last week: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31954800 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31954800 Do you have a reliable source to purchase? I've no interest in purchasing via Amazon, wouldn't feel comfortable trusting the content.
2Gkashmiri 4y ago
I have, after years of deliberatng, decided to use an electric toothbrush. Its been 2 years and I want to know what I should be expecting. Maybe I am sleepy when I a brushing so I don't notice but asking still. Novamin sounds interesting. Its available here on amazon so I might splurge on it but again, what I am to expect out of it as opposed to regular Colgate ?
- nso 4y ago
  For me it removed that icy feeling.
stjohnswarts 4y ago
been doing nano-hydroxyapatite for the same reason. I use stannous fluoride based toothpaste in the morning and nhdpa at night before bed.

Silica6149 4y ago

This sponge you put in your mouth made me think for the first time about how much bacteria is potentially on a normal toothbrush. I'm betting this product is even less hygienic since it's a sponge instead of only bristles.

bamboozled 4y ago
Why not leave your toothbrush in hydrogen peroxide overnight?
- Silica6149 4y ago
  Good idea, it's just I never thought twice about the cleanliness of a toothbrush. I guess it's been ingrained in me to think it's normal to run a toothbrush under water to "clean" it.
  - rusticpenn 4y ago
    You are supposed to change the brush every few months precisely for this reason.
    - DoingIsLearning 4y ago
      I thought it was because the hairs on the brush get 'blunt' from erosion on your teeth. The 'applied science' guy had an electron microscope capture of new and old toothbrushes and it was the differences between needle sharp edges and worn out clubs.
  - DoingIsLearning 4y ago
    I remember a myth busters episode where they demonstrated that toothbrushes left in open air will easily get fecal matter on the brush hairs due to aerosolized poop from when you flush an open lid toilet. Definitely a great conversation ice-breaker.
    - liotier 4y ago

dubswithus 4y ago

I remember some articles about good bacteria outcompeting bad bacteria in the mouth and preventing cavities. Seems like it probably didn't pan out.

moffkalast 4y ago
Nah it did, the problem is you have to take a pill every day and they cost way too much for that sort of frequent usage. Like $60 per 20 pills kind of price, which is hard to justify without hard proven evidence of actual benefit.
- krageon 4y ago
  How did you get this price? Can I get them somewhere? $3 per day to never have teeth issues again is an absolute bargain.
  - moffkalast 4y ago
    I think I saw it on amazon a few years back? It's possible there wasn't enough demand to keep selling it, but I've also no idea what it was called anymore.

f6v 4y ago

Have you seen how much it costs to get crowns or implants? There’s zero incentive for innovation, people keep bringing their money.

Forgeties79 4y ago
I would like to think that most dentists like their patients to have healthy, cared for teeth and that they play in important role in it. I would not like to think that most of them actually work to our detriment so that they can do more expensive, painful procedures on our mouths and teeth. That’s a pretty cynical outlook I’d need to see evidence for.
- prepend 4y ago
  I’d like to think that, but my dentist makes about $170/year from me having healthy teeth. They make $1500/crown (in addition to the $170 for cleaning). I’ve been to three dentists this year. I find it interesting that one said I had an emergency and needed a crown right away (a year ago), one said they’d watch the tooth, and one said nothing. Cynically, I don’t like agency issues where experts make lots of money off their advice and it’s difficult to double check.
  - stjohnswarts 4y ago
    I had a dentist for several years and everything was normal just clean and go. A new hygenist shows up and suddently "You have severe plaque below the gum line we need to do a deep cleaning (root scaling/planing)" so they do that and it's almost $500, next time rolls around and she says it again and dentist concurs. I had been brushing and flossing diligently (probably too much) since the last time and just looking at my teeth saw nearly no plaque. I left and said I'd call them back to schedule. I go to a new dentist the following week and they say I have lovely teeth and it looks like I've been taking great care of them, then I tell the dentist what the previous one had said and he's like "listen, I'm not going to bad mouth anyone, but your teeth look great, they just need a typical cleaning that you came in for". That's when I knew something was really wrong with the other place, so it happens. I know my story is anecdotal. Personally I think my old dentist got rid of her previous hygenist that wouldn't agree to hornswoggle patients and they tried to get me to do expensive treatments.

sAbakumoff 4y ago

My daily tooth care consists of 3 steps: 1. Clean between teeth by using an interdental brush 2. Clean between teeth by using a water flosser 3. Clean teeth surface by using an electric brush. I am not sure how would the sponge replace these 3 steps.

LeonM 4y ago

There is quite some innovation, but consumers are slow to adopt IMO. Last year, my dentist warned me I have quite severe receded gums. This was due to me pushing my toothbrush too hard. So, after doing some research I bought an ultrasonic toothbrush. These have a static head (it does not oscillate/rotate) which emits ultrasonic waves to clean your teeth. Same principle of an ultrasonic parts cleaner. The head is still a traditional brush, though very soft. The brush is used to transfer the sound waves, you do not use it to 'scrub' your teeth. There is not friction involved. From my experience, I can highly recommend an ultrasonic toothbrush. It takes some time to get used to, but personally, I will never go back to a traditional 'friction' type brush (manual or electric). The model I have is the Silkin' ToothWave. Prices have come down significantly since I bought mine (I paid >€200 IIRC, now they are ~€90). Note that some vendors sell traditional 'friction type' oscillating electronic toothbrushes with ultrasonic as a feature. In my opinion, these do not offer much benefit, it is better to go for a fully ultrasonic model.

afterburner 4y ago
Interesting. I've also had success using a Sonicare but always moving from the gums to the tooth (instead of along the gumline as the manual suggests).
d1sxeyes 4y ago
Looks like 250 EUR on their website?
- LeonM 4y ago
  Looks like that pricing has not been updated for a while. I paid something like 200 euros, that was about a year ago. Most online retailers in my country now list them for less than 100 euros.
  - jachee 4y ago
    Weird. In Dutch (https://silkn.nl/toothwave-black https://silkn.nl/toothwave-black) it’s €119. In English (both EU and GB), French, Spanish, and German ( e.g. https://silkn.eu/toothwave-black https://silkn.eu/toothwave-black) it’s €249.

amelius 4y ago

I want something that I can use in the office (i.e., without easy access to a sink).

david_l_lin 4y ago

I think it's because incumbents in the space have played a huge role in preventing adoption of new technologies that actually prevent disease. Dentists make money not from preventing disease, but from performing procedures when disease has already progressed to the point of no return. Cavities and gum disease are bacterial infections that are completely preventable. I feel the need to plug what we've been building at https://www.bristlehealth.com/ https://www.bristlehealth.com/. We've built an at-home test that leverages the microbes in the mouth to detect disease, and provide actionable and personalized recommendations that can reduce your risk of gum disease, cavities and persistent bad breath.

barbazoo 4y ago
> Dentists make money not from preventing disease, but from performing procedures when disease has already progressed to the point of no return. I find that hard to believe as dentists wouldn't be the group of people I'd imagine developing those new ideas and products. How would that work?
- yunohn 4y ago
  Nobody wants to go to the dentist until it’s too late, because it’s so expensive nor covered by health insurance. Even if it’s not intentional, dentists aren’t R&D specialists. They’re a service, at a premium price, whose livelihood depends on people going for treatments.
  - barbazoo 4y ago
    What lever do they have to prevent new products from being developed that help people take care of their teeth?
    - yunohn 4y ago
      The lever is the lack of funding and motivation brought about by the previous factors. It’s not an individual choice, rather a medical industry wide systemic issue. A popular example: https://finance.yahoo.com/news/goldman-sachs-asks-biotech-research-191500553.html https://finance.yahoo.com/news/goldman-sachs-asks-biotech-re...

runnerup 4y ago

For me the "unbreakable" floss string combined with a floss pick in this particular product: https://www.amazon.com/DenTek-Triple-Clean-Floss-Picks/dp/B003K01BMI https://www.amazon.com/DenTek-Triple-Clean-Floss-Picks/dp/B0... was a massive innovation that finally allowed me to regularly floss easily at the age of ~30. Prior to that I couldn't handle the floss string well, and all other floss picks (even nearly identical ones from the exact same brand) just snap apart between my very closely-spaced teeth.

Komodai 4y ago

This looks like a really bad dropshipping site... Especially considering the fact they've imported reviews from elsewhere, like AliExpress (even has the same name format, C**e).

bilsbie 4y ago

It’s just an over regulated industry where it’s too expensive to try new things.

diob 4y ago
Dentistry exists all over the world...

bsenftner 4y ago

In grad school, one of my friends worked for a US medical device manufacturer. They had several dental innovations that they did not bother to market in the US because the regulation to get approval out weighed what they felt the market offered. They made their profits in other countries and were happy with that.

jklinger410 4y ago

Capitalism only creates innovations where there is potential for expanding profits. Permanently fixing teeth is infinitely less profitable than keeping them in a constant state of disrepair.