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> Basically this means that in modern dating, if you are short, you are very likely to die alone and this trend will only get worse in the future. I'm 5'6, and
by throwaway515 4y ago
> Basically this means that in modern dating, if you are short, you are very likely to die alone and this trend will only get worse in the future.
I'm 5'6, and after almost 15 years of dating sites to modern dating apps, I have indeed accepted that yes, I will very likely die alone. My therapist has even half-seriously suggested I try lying about my height, and qualms aside, from the studies I've read, any plausible-in-person exaggeration would gain me a couple of percentile points at most.
- abledon 4y agogoogle: "filipino average height" You might have some luck over there :)
- aortega 4y agoMy theory is that if you stay in a city, you are very likely correct. In a city you have to compete with men much taller and attractive. And women have access to hundreds of those men 24/7 through their cell phones constantly hitting on them. You won't win, but in a smaller city/rural town, you have much more chances.
- handmodel 4y agoI am a 5'6 man. I still think a city is much better as I assume the 5'6 man has standards, too. It's not like finding a partner who is willing to settle with you is difficult at all - it is finding one that you feel meets your level of fitness, intelligence, and social status which is considered high (other than your height). In a rural setting you are going to be very limited but a city definitely has options. I would say be patient. I think as you grow older it becomes less important. And even if 80% of women have fairly strong height preferences I think a solid 20% have close to no preference or would care but are very short themselves.
- rayiner 4y ago
- kube-system 4y agoThere are certainly liberal women in rural areas.
- rayiner 4y agoIf your goal is to settle down—as seems to be a commonly expressed desire in this thread—you might find that conservative women are more like minded, for obvious reasons.
- kingkawn 4y agoWhat are those reasons?
- rayiner 4y agoConservative women are more likely to value traditional family structures and gender roles, and thus place a higher priority on getting married and having kids. Even controlling for age, etc., conservatives are 25% more likely to be married than liberals.
- kingkawn 4y agoYeah but then you have to live with a conservative.
- rayiner 4y agoI think lots of “liberal” guys would be happier in a conservative environment,[1] with the greater social structure and narrower horizons of conservative society. If what you really want is to settle down, have kids, and live a normal life, you might be making yourself unhappy trying to hack it in the NYC or SF's dating market--which is full of ambitious, individualistic people who aren't placing a high priority on those things. Consider that you might be happier moving to a red county and finding a conservative woman whose life priorities may be more aligned with your's--even if you may have abstract disagreements on immigration policy or the long-term effect of the welfare state. [1] Of course the opposite is true--but liberally minded people who can't wait to leave Iowa is a well-known trope. We don't talk so much about the folks who went to the big city for education or career opportunities, but would actually be happier in Iowa.
- wombatpm 4y agoDepends on the city. In Minneapolis being 6’3” was not big deal. In Chicago I’m a giant
- ambicapter 4y agoRural people tend to be taller on average than city folks. That combined with the sheer numbers difference, you're still better off in the city.
- ummonk 4y agoRural America is probably a few inches taller on average than the cities. Also the gender ratios there for young singles tend to be as bad as Silicon Valley.
- Shugarl 4y agoIn rural town, there's less competition.... But there's also less women.
- chrischen 4y agoLying about your height is actually an acceptable thing to do if it is to get over people's prejudices. In all honesty a good chunk of the people you encountered probably wrote you off prematurely anyways. But online dating and Tinder isn't great when you're trying to look past superficial qualities (your face, your height, your basic physical characteristics) so it's setting you up for failure, not to mention the way these apps are setup makes it really low effort for men to and woman to each have unrealistic expectations, and setup the vast majority for failure. But if you're still looking for things to try, I would recommend you get some activities (sports, hobbies) and meet people outside of a purely dating context. People's guards will be down and they'll be evaluating you on your other qualities rather than height in these contexts, and the extra time you spend with them is exactly what you need for them to overcome their prejudices.
- Rebelgecko 4y agoThought experiment: Can you apply the same process to other characteristics? For example, is it ok to lie about your race to improve your chances with racists? Even if that works, should you?
- chrischen 4y agoYea, if you think they'll forgive you for lying. If you're asking if it's worthwhile to court a racist then that depends on the other person. Obviously if you can turn them from a racist to not a racist then it's a worthwhile endeavor.
- ajwfew 4y ago
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- nradov 4y agoWell since race is an arbitrary social construct with no consistent, objective definition then anyone can choose any racial identity they like without it being a lie. But when I was in the dating market I wouldn't have been willing to date a racist anyway, so the question is moot.
- throw__away7391 4y agoI'm a tad over 6' but girls are so used to guys lying about their hight that they usually say I'm 6'2". On multiple occasions I've had my date insist over my objection that I must be taller than that. It's not a stretch for me to imagine that widespread lying by men about their hight has actually collectively made the problem worse for men, e.g. women insisting on 6 feet because they've dating 5'10" guys claiming to be 6" and decided that was the minimum.
- darkmarmot 4y agoSo awkward. I'm just over 6'2" -- and at a recent family reunion had to deal with everyone saying I must be at _least_ 6'4". Because I was much taller than the other 6' guys there... and if I dispute it too vociferously, it's almost an attack on all the guys around me who are lying about their height. It seems there's a 2 or 3 inch bump across the board.
- junofan 4y agoYeah the bump breaks down around 6’3”.
- aortega 4y agoThat's what you get for using inexact imperial units.
- skeptikal 4y agoYa, that happened to me once (Im almost 6’2’’). A guy who couldn't have been 5 10 was insisting he was 6 and that I was taller than stated. What was weird was that we were alone. He was only lying to himself. And you know what, he was a bit weird looking. He had bad posture. But he was a good guy. A smart, hard working guy with a big heart. This height thing is annoying. Id gladly trade inches of height in exchange for other inner character traits (courage, perseverance, conscientiousness). Intelligence I have to spare, but what good is it without character?
- 4y ago
- miramardesign 4y agoBrother do what I did move to south America, the dollar goes a long way and the ladies love their short kings. I'm amazed walking around here in Argentina how many couples where the woman is a head taller than the guy. Spoiled american women won't go for a guy a head taller than her.
- ummonk 4y agoI don't understand how some men will adopt the belief that they're doomed to die alone and would rather accept this fate than simply move to a better dating scene, or just get a mail order marriage.
- R0b0t1 4y agoThey adopt this belief based on repeated experience. You're going to take their entire life of observations and tell them to just try harder? What do you think they're doing?
- FooBarWidget 4y agoI've seen lots of people (in other contexts) keep failing and give up simply because they are too rigid in their thinking and refuse to try other ways.
- ummonk 4y agoNo, I'm telling them to do something drastically different, like leveraging that western citizenship / green card or that sweet tech salary into finding a wife. It's unromantic but better than dying alone.
- jseban 4y agoIt really makes a lot of sense, especially for tech cities where there's literally too few women, and the men have good jobs and incomes, why not match them with some of all the women around the world who would love to have the opportunity to start a family there. But that means the local western women would get increased competition, so that will of course needs to be shamed and frowned upon, I don't understand how it's any less romantic than the shallow greedy american women and their 6 foot 6 figures standard.
- Darmody 4y agoPlenty of women don't care about that. Just stop using apps like Tinder, they attract the worst of the worst, by what I see, especially in the US. Even if you were above 6', you wouldn't want to date a woman obsessed with height. In my group of friends, the shorter ones (around 1,73m) are the most successful ones.
- lupire 4y ago1,73m is oddly specific.
- throwanem 4y agoIt's five foot nine in metric.
- scotty79 4y agoNope. 173cm is less than 5'7
- doubleunplussed 4y agoIt's 5 foot 8.1 inches.
- AussieWog93 4y agoAlso my exact height (and have no idea what all these people are talking about)! Spooky, GP!
- LAC-Tech 4y agoIME Dating apps are a terrible way to meet women. All they have to go off are a few pictures and some numerical stats - and it's a sausage fest, the odds are stacked way against you. Hang out with people IRL.
- aortega 4y agoDating apps are a way to gain insight into psychology. If you don't use dating apps, the preferences remain.
- LAC-Tech 4y agoI'm not denying there's a preference. I'm saying dating apps amplify them by putting them front in centre. Where as you meet and have a good rapport with someone IRL you're not probably not sitting there thinking "Wait is he an inch shorter than my minimum height on tinder?"
- kjeetgill 4y ago[citation needed] My additional accecdata: it's really, really not. Even for an individual, stated preferences are often not that true in practice.
- Nav_Panel 4y agoDating apps are a way to gain insight into how UX manipulates desire + how applications produce behavioral statistics which we then clumsily project into iron laws of psychology.
- ambicapter 4y agoDatings apps change the way the game is played. Meeting people in real life is not like "meeting" someone via pictures and a bio.
- switchbak 4y agoI was never as appalled as I was when watching very successful, intelligent female friends of mine use Tinder. The shallowness of it is unparalleled. The quickness with which they'd reject perfectly good looking people was hard to believe. There's a lot to say about how the structure and dynamics. of a tool guide how we use it, and that's very much at play here. These same people acted FAR different in the outside world. I think the notion of a complete lack of scarcity leads our brains in this unachievable quest for perfection (based on nothing but a picture). I'd say get off the platform, but you also have to go where the people are! I'm just glad I'm not dating anymore.
- lupire 4y agoI'm curious which sites and apps you use, and if maybe part of the problem is that you are only using those.
- astrange 4y agoJust date taller women. The fixation on this is a cope mainly found in middle-height American white women, nobody else cares.
- w0mbat 4y agoTall women are easy to get dates with, well unless they are the fashion model types who are hot enough to get the in-demand tall guys. There are lots of cute tall women who are unfairly neglected. I'm average height and was married to a 5' 11" woman for a while. It always felt weird. It's much more comfortable for me to be with a woman who is a similar height, or a touch smaller, just for ergonomic reasons like how it feels when you hold hands or put your arms around each other. I don't understand hot short women demanding tall guys as a kind of trophy. I know they can get them, because they are hot, but they'd be more comfortable with someone closer to their height.
- astrange 4y agoMy girlfriend is 5'11" (and taller than me, and a model, dancer, etc etc) and yes it is a bit hard to reach standing, but I figure that's a common human experience. Sitting down and such you don't even notice. I haven't asked if the concept of needing an even taller guy has ever occurred to her, but the even stranger one of either of us caring if she's wearing heels sure hasn't come up.
- rayiner 4y agoMove to India! You’ll be average height and being white will be a big plus. Also, I'll observe that the median Hispanic man in America is a hair under 5' 7" (66.7"), yet Hispanic couples account for almost a quarter of births in America. Just a data point!
- fny 4y agoI'm 5'4" my fiance is 5'6". Stop thinking about it and grow a pair. It pays off. I had a lot of anxiety too when I started dating. Just act like its not a issue and the right girl will too.
- skeptikal 4y agoIts not the height, its the strut. Online women cant see you strut so heights the proxy. My wife's cousin’s 5’6’’ but Ive seen women go up to him and strike a conversation by the way he walks. Ive been in parties where he’s nailed every girl (including sisters and wives) in the room. Me? Nothing much, and Im 6’2’’
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- tomcam 4y agoWell that's horrible. Sorry, my dude. Weird thing is that tons of actors are that height.
- anoy8888 4y agoI know many people shorter than you and are quite popular with girls. Look outside your own countries , for example , someone average could become very popular in some Asian counties if you are white. ( not that I agree with it but it is the reality) . Ps I am from south East Asian country
- spoonjim 4y agoI have a friend who is not more than 5’4” and is incredibly popular with women. He works out a lot and has studied the art and science of getting women interested in having sex with him the way I studied electrical engineering.
- screye 4y agoTrying to play a broken game honestly, is a losing proposition. Social taboos get established to keep the winners winning. Go find yourself a gold digger. It is fine. Maybe go date women in cultures where 5.6 is not too short. Hell, I'd say that a mail order bride (more likely an economic refugee who appreciates your wealth) is still better than dying alone. It is a brutally objectifying system and you have to play to your strengths. Sure, there are social taboos around this. But when the system fails you, you have to look at alternatives outside. If you are too insecure about being THAT guy, then lie about till you start believing the lie. Every non-abusive individual deserves an honest chance at pursuing a relationship. If the thought of dying alone is painful, then cheat the system. All is fair in love and war. Haters be damned. P.S: get out of the bay area / seattle. These places are dating deserts. P.P.S: it is obviously advice for the the edge case. Only refer use it within the context of traditional options having died out.
- chevill 4y agoI'm a short guy (5'6") married for nearly 2 decades to an even shorter woman (4'11"). Perhaps its easy for me to say it because I've beaten the odds, but it seems to me it would be better to die alone than to be in a shitty relationship or to be in a relationship with someone that thinks they are making a concession by dating a shorter person. People cannot help what they are/are not attracted to so I have no animosity towards women that like tall guys, but even if that shrinks the dating pool 200x that's a better situation than wasting time with a person that isn't really into you. Also, gold diggers are shitty people. You can't have a real relationship with one. I can't blame the desperate people that volunteer to become mail order brides for thinking that screwing over some poor sap from a 1st world country is a lesser evil than them having to remain in poverty, but you'd have to be insane to marry one. There's no way to cheat the system, if a person isn't genuinely attracted to you, whether its physically or otherwise, you have no chance of building a life with them that's going to make the two of you happy.
- zarzavat 4y agoIt’s not beating the odds though. There’s countless millions of women around the world who would be thrilled to be dating a 5’6” American/imperial unit user. The problem only exists if you limit yourself arbitrarily to a very small pool of women having a particular nationality and skin color. 95% of women are not American. And only a very small percentage of those are gold diggers or mail order brides. The vast majority are just normal people with normal dreams of having a modest family. If someone is 5’6 and having trouble meeting someone, they should consider if their own criteria are irrational.
- aeze 4y agoI'm 5'5, pretty average (ie. not rich or particularly physically attractive), and I've consistently had attractive romantic partners my entire life. US-based, metropolitan area if that matters. I don't really have any advice, but I really don't think your height is limiting you. Don't get me wrong, it's definitely harder than if you were six inches taller, but it's not that bad. It's one factor of many that affects your overall attractiveness and many people don't care about it at all.
- beowulfey 4y agoYes at the very least it’s important not to hide it because it acts as a great filter for those who do care about it (which I’ve never been bitter about either—we all have preferences in attractiveness)
- iamacyborg 4y agoI’m also 5’5 and don’t really have this problem. I was upfront about my height on dating sites back when I used them and a few women mentioned it was a dealbreaker but that also never stopped me from getting plenty of matches and going on a lot of dates.
- gnulinux 4y agoThese anecdote-based "it's not that bad" comments are very misguided. Even the OP article clearly points out statistically even small differences like 5'7 vs 5'8 make huge differences and something like 5'6 to 6'0 can have 200x difference. This is by no means "fine" seeing (1) finding a romantic partner is one of the most important determiners of mental health (2) youth today is going through a huge social isolation crisis. If you're short you're seen (not explicitly, but through statistical regression to the mean) as a lesser person. I think it's absolutely crucial to understand this is not "fine" and compansate accordingly. This seems like the responsible truth to me.
- hackerfromthefu 4y agoI think also a lot of woman feel more comfortable or safer with a man around that height.
- FooBarWidget 4y agoI am the same height as you and now married. 10-15 years ago I came to the conclusion that dating sites and apps are the last places I should try. They encourage people to pre-judge you based on superficial characteristics that you can never win. It's simply not a fair fight. I've found that I stood a better chance in face to face situation: at least then I can display unique characteristics rather than just be a sheet of specs. My wife also happens to be shorter than me and she has never been on any dating site.
- scotty79 4y agoMove to a country where they don't count height in feet. Suddenly magic number 6 disappears and everything gets way fuzzier.
- kolinko 4y agoHow about trying a different city/country? In Warsaw, Poland, the gender inbalance is like 2 to 1 single women to men around the age of 35. This makes women drop certain criteria, and height may be one of the first to go. I heard that in NYC in US it’s similar.
- mjan22640 4y agoWomen look for the ability to climb the social hierarchy in men: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7pyPl-q_-0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7pyPl-q_-0 Height is a predictor of success, and women correctly pick that up: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2709415/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2709415/ When lacking height, you need to compensate by boosting other markers, that women latch on. Things like managerial position, luxurious housing, car, dressing etc.
- throwaway64554 4y agoThrowaway for obvious reasons, but for me the compensation was (and still is to some extent) having a very large penis.
- 4ad 4y agoHow do women know beforehand you have a very large penis?
- throwaway64554 4y agoThey don't, and after nearly 14 years of relationship & marriage & kids, I don't think women really care. But it gives confidence, and confidence makes you attractive.
- flyandscan88 4y agomove to an east coast city, wait a few years (older women care less about this stuff), get in good shape, start drinking and going to bars/meetups/events, especially related to your hobbies
- jseban 4y agoYou can also take pictures that make you look taller, with certain angles, poses etc (hint, women know and use all of these tricks).