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I thought I’d have accomplished a lot more today and also before I was 35 (2020)
- holtkam2 5y agoThe ironic thing about this post is that the author sounds like an awesome dude. Heck, I just read his work in the New Yorker. I wish he could realize he was killing it! And same goes for you, dear reader :)
- orionblastar 5y agoMe too. I got mentally ill in 2001 and got burned out. I found out the hard way when you are the best most efficient worker they assign you tasks that other people can't or won't do. The stress builds up from the extra work and burnout happens. I am 53, I should be a manager or CEO by now, but I am disabled and out of work instead. Learning all over at home with new technologies and languages like Python and Dart/Flutter.
- cbg0 5y ago> I am 53, I should be a manager or CEO by now Some people your age are managers or CEOs but most people are not, and there's nothing wrong with that. If that is your goal, keep pushing towards it in spite of your issues, but you should also consider focusing less on career and more on just enjoying life.
- rkagerer 5y agoSorry to hear that! Folks like you who are passionate and have an innate strong work ethic are worth their weight in gold, and need to be nurtured and protected from burnout by their managers and peers. I've been on both sides of this equation. As a consultant with my own business I've done stints of 80+ hour work weeks, wrestled RSI and flirted with the edge of burnout. I've also managed teams with superstars sprinkled in who take on visceral ownership of a project, working to the goal not the clock and doing whatever needs to be done to achieve success. Some here will criticize that as an artifact of poor management / corporate culture, but in my experience different people have different priorities in life and some come with a very strong professional drive and crave the opportunity to outperform. There's an incredible multiplier effect that can raise the productivity of the whole team. But if they're underappreciated, taken for granted, or blindly loaded up with ever-increasing responsibilities as you described it's disastrous. I liken it to using a rare, hand-crafted sports car to haul manure then leaving it out in the rain to rust. I've learned how crucial it is to stay keyed in to the pulse of your team. Communication is key (simple questions like "How's your workload?", and paying attention if someone who's usually cheerful seems agitated or irritable). At times I've had to force reports to take a few days off in between cycles to regenerate and make sure they stay fresh. Have also spent some years volunteering in emergency services, and watching ordinary humans placed in high-pressure situations you gain an appreciation for mental health and not being cavalier about it. I hope your activities playing with those new technologies you mentioned rekindles that spark of wonder which first led you into tech, and you land a career with an employer who knows how to take care of their people. Look forward not back, you've still got years of professional opportunity ahead of you if that's where your desires lay.
- withinboredom 5y agoI think that pretty much everyone feels this when they reach a certain age and it doesn't really matter what you've accomplished. I think humans just have an innate desire to have more.
- warner25 5y agoYeah, I think it's just "moving the goalposts" or the "hedonistic treadmill" or "comparison is the thief of joy." When I turned 34, I made a list of (fairly attainable but significant) things that I wanted to accomplish before turning 35 last year. I mostly did those things, and I know that I objectively have more to my name than most of humanity at this age, and I'm in a better place than I imagined being at 20, 25, or 30... college degrees, seniority in my career, married, kids, 7-figure net worth, still healthy and fit... but it just doesn't feel like it. I mostly just notice the people who have accomplished more, or have a nicer house, or have more time to do what they want, or have a better family situation in some way.
- moonchrome 5y agoSo either the author has a midlife crisis or they genuinely hate where they are in life. TBH, since they have no family/commitment and sound like they dislike where they got in life - I'd say discard the image of yourself and start doing radical things moving forward, sounds like a no lose situation to me, worst case scenario you die doing something risky - but that always sounded better to me than surviving in a hole.
- bmitc 5y agoJust to note, this piece is in the humor section. Like most humor, it’s likely a constructed story based on real events or feelings. And also like most humor, it’s relatable. I think your advice to move forward is still relevant though.
- bryanrasmussen 5y agoThe title is also obviously supposed to be funny.
- bmitc 5y agoI actually thought it was a serious article at first, as it resonated pretty strongly with me. Haha. But then I definitely got a satire feel from reading it.
- giantg2 5y agoI didn't find it funny nor was it that relatable. I'm actually wondering why it's even on HN in the first place and not flagged.
- medymed 5y agoIt’s maybe not uncommon to have dissonance between enjoying an accomplishment versus enjoying or finding meaning doing the tasks that lead to the result/accomplishment. This is one very scatterbrained outlier of that dissonance.
- AussieWog93 5y agoPoor bastard. I think a lot of older people really don't understand this, but our generation (late millennials, or at least middle-class late millennials) were genuinely fed the lie our whole life that we were special and could do anything. At some point, you have to admit to yourself that you're just an ordinary human being and Elon Musk has something special that you don't have. Only when you're in this mindset can you reason about your own limits, what you can achieve and discover that you're actually a pretty decent dishwasher technician.
- kochikame 5y agoElon Musk was born privileged and is probably wrong about a whole bunch of things. I don't think it's an appropriate or useful point of comaprison.
- dagw 5y agoElon Musk was born privileged Only relatively speaking. There are a whole lot of people grew up with a hell of a lot more "privilege" than Musk and who have accomplished far far less.
- supermatt 5y agoAnd theres even more less privileged who cant take a risk because they dont have anything to catch them when they fail.
- dagw 5y agoOf course. As someone who ticks most boxes on the privilege checklist I can witness first hand how much easier that has made my life compared to several of my friends and colleagues who ticked far fewer boxes. At the same time I've known people from even more privileged backgrounds than me completely fuck their lives. So while coming from a 'privileged' background is important, and perhaps even necessary, in becoming the next Elon Musk, it is far from the determining factor.
- asplake 5y agoPersonally, I’ve done some of my best work in my 40’s and 50’s. And so different to anything I was capable of doing in my 20’s and 30’s. The funniest thing is that I chose not only my university degree but also my optional modules based on a career choice that I moved on from well before I was 30. I don’t generally do regrets, but older me would tell younger me to relax a bit. There’s plenty of time and lots of things to try. Be prepared to be surprised!
- a1445c8b 5y ago> Personally, I’ve done some of my best work in my 40’s and 50’s. Reading this makes me feel better about my current trajectory. Mid 40s male.
- antupis 5y agoI think career peak comes somewhere between 45-60 especially when domain is something which needs multiple skills like founding company or writing book. https://www.inc.com/jeff-haden/a-study-of-27-million-startups-found-ideal-age-to-start-a-business-and-its-much-older-than-you-think.html https://www.inc.com/jeff-haden/a-study-of-27-million-startup...
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- martin_a 5y ago> I don’t generally do regrets, but older me would tell younger me to relax a bit. Me now (35) would love to tell that to me (15), too. All the grey hairs for nothing.
- dagw 5y agoYes. I'm 43 and I'm feeling that I'm only now just hitting my stride, career wise, with good idea what I'm actually good at, want to do and can contribute. 20-40 was basically floundering around, trying things, learning things and working out what I wanted to do when I 'grew up'. And looking back, I wouldn't want to have had it any other way.
- jotm 5y agoOh hey, it's ADD/ADHD/laziness/whatever the fuck you want to call it. Goes great with (or causes) anxiety and depression. "Daily humor", yeah very funny, haha. Except when you live it. If you're thinking "well, that's normal for a lot of people", yeah so was unable to see without glasses or dying from a burst appendix, lack of insulin or just bad food. Some people have it mild and get by, but for some, it's hell on Earth. More healthcare pros need to recognize it's a problem, recognize it's fixable and fix it.
- posix86 5y agoSounds a lot like ADHD to me tbh.
- aaaaaaaaata 5y agoNew puppy's behavior is easily confused as such. It's closer to the truth that we're probably just not supposed to live this way.
- bayesian_horse 5y agoADHD goes without recognition and diagnoses way more often than it is being identified wrongly. It is a valid condition, with serious and quite predictable consequences, only partly fixable by medication and therapy.
- xvector 5y agoAs someone with ADHD - our society places a high value on being a “focused worker bee.” Individuals with ADHD do not fit this mold, even if they bring value with increased curiosity, inquisitiveness, and creativity. I think ADHD is a genetic trait that was evolutionarily selected for, and individuals with it made effective explorers, inventors, and creators, providing substantial benefit to humanity. It is an explorer's gene, though society today finds little value in that. It's so frustrating and incredibly heartbreaking because I think people with ADHD are 100% totally valid in their own right, as it is likely an adaptive trait [1, 2], and yet our society has abandoned them as disabled. [1]: "ADHD as a disorder of adaptation" - https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9401328/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9401328/ [2]: "ADHD sucks, but not really | Salif Mahamane | TEDxUSU" - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWCocjh5aK0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWCocjh5aK0
- aaaaaaaaata 5y agoYou can't judge a fish on its ability to climb a tree, but all we pay for is tree-climbing!, between the hours of 8 and 5.
- JetAlone 5y agoWhen I was a teenager, I saw the stories of exceptionally strange internet personalities like Chris Chan and Ulillillia, and felt a paranoia that I'd spend my life in my overprotective parents' basement. When I look at my life, I've accomplished so many things I never would have expected I could have. I'm still missing a handful of things my community members remind me they expect me to have, the biggest one being marriage. In spite of needing to slog through tiredness and bouts of ressentiment, I can see I've beaten the average trajectory, and I've beaten the trajectories some people have put me down by saying I'll end up on. I actually have a slight chance of doing one or two more things in life that mean a lot to me. I am grateful I've been lead out of the basement, spared from literal prison; not hospitalized nor shut into an asylum (though some dear readers may think I belong there ;P). The world's a disturbing place, but I'm on a road to freedom and joy. https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2F66.media.tumblr.com%2F5b37902f2f2ea8dbbfbf3d947f899629%2F495416d2db2091ff-b4%2Fs640x960%2F0234477190a5661297947ab624a999c34ab92416.gif&f=1&nofb=1 https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2F...
- eixiepia 5y agoThe problem with many people today, is that their only measure of success is whether they are a success in the eyes of others, often strangers or people they don't even care about. Find out what you really want, don't care what others think. This way it's much more realistic to have success, and you will probably also be much happier. I don't think many would want to be a CEO if they didn't care what others think.
- bigpeopleareold 5y agoThis plagued me for a long time. It felt like the only way to validate my value is based on what someone else said about it. However, what really happened was that relationships are fleeting, attention from others tends to be weak and a lot of the time, no one really does care. Also, I overemphasized process, that certain things must be done in a certain way for them to have a certain truth to it. It is and was crippling. One thing that changed for me last year was that I finally got the passion to get through that list of random topics I wanted to get through without the pretense of trying to prove anything to anyone. It really did work, even though the feeling towards those pretenses still linger a bit. Here on HN, there was once something that stuck along with me, on an article about how people found success in one-person companies. One said that he did what he needed to do and then just find what could be sold from that. It's a simple statement, but what it says lacks that pretense of finding the truth in something, like finding success in other people or even unattainable quality of work.
- tonyedgecombe 5y ago>The problem with many people today, is that their only measure of success is whether they are a success in the eyes of others, often strangers or people they don't even care about. I think the real problem is the pool of people they can compare themselves to is so much larger. No matter what your interests, vocation or career it's easy to find someone on social media who appears to be an order of magnitude better than you are.
- cmollis 5y agoI really only stopped caring what people thought after I got divorced (I was 43 at the time). Before that, it was 'the big house', 'the bmw', 'running the cool business'.. ostensibly, showing off to everyone else how impressive I could be (I wasn't). I felt like a fraud because I hated what I was doing. Others still had more money, a bigger house, and a cooler car. It was an arms race and I was losing. But when all of that was stripped away after the divorce, it was again, just me.. along with my three young kids in my two bedroom apartment. I realized that all of that was stupid, and really didn't contribute anything to who I really was. I was forced to do only what was absolutely necessary.. to stop being selfish and focus on my kids and rebuilding my life. Although I was struggling, it was liberating. Now I could regain what I lost: money, sure..I was always pretty good at my job, but mostly my humility. I didn't come from much, which I used to wear as a badge of honor when I was younger. Losing a lot of 'stuff' made stop caring about where I lived, or what I drove. I could just simply 'focus' on what I personally felt was important, not someone else's arbitrary standard. Now I drive around my neighborhood (in my 12 year old honda) looking at all the late 30-40 year olds racing inexorably towards their collective mid-life crises, doing their home improvements, driving their Teslas that they can't afford, berating their kids because they're not impeccably perfect in every way and I think to myself : 'yeah, I know.. it's coming for you too'..
- onion2k 5y agoI had six voice mails This is what I would consider a significant measure of success - people wanting to talk to you (assuming they're actual messages, and not robocall spam). Whether they're from friends who want to chat, contacts who want to work with you, or just random updates about interesting things that for some reason someone thinks you should know about, having people out there think about you enough to fire up the dialler on their phone and try to reach you is pretty cool. There are so many other things they could be thinking about.
- OgAstorga 5y agoPlot twist. Those are from debt collectors
- rkagerer 5y agoThe beginning of the article mentions a few examples of distractions. So much of the modern web is developed by people who've made a scientific study out of gaming your emotions and vying for your attention. Focus is a priceless resource. When I need to put my head down and concentrate, I try to shut off distractions. Like many developers I know, sometimes it means I gravitate to working late at night when the rest of the world leaves me alone.
- JKCalhoun 5y ago> So much of the modern web is developed by people who've made a scientific study out of gaming your emotions and vying for your attention. I just figured it was an evolutionary (sort of Darwinian) march to where we are now. Throw enough stuff at the wall and you'll quickly find what sticks. But to be sure, when I saw I was wasting away flipping through the 100 or so cable TV channels (around about the year 1999 or so) I cut the cord. Of course, the web was not nearly as intoxicating then. I have the new cord around my neck now.
- cik 5y agoThere's something cross cultural here that just doesn't cross. I can't relate. I'm responsible for me - my success, my failures. I also sure as hell better check on my neighbour and lend a hand. Fulfilment comes from within, not externally. Results driven fulfilment comes from the gradual achievement of small goals, slowly combining into larger goals. They can be as small, as simple as reading a book. The best advice I was ever given was 'finish what you start'. Rather than skim articles in newspapers, I forced myself to read (awful) articles from the beginning to end. Eventually that morphed, and I now make choices on when to skim, what to leave behind - what's a sunk cost fallacy and what isn't. But the point was to break the pattern, to achieve small things, and build on them. I take the same approach with my kids. Get a win, then get another win.
- xvector 5y ago> Fulfilment comes from within, not externally. I am 26 and this is has been the hardest thing for me to come to terms with over the past few years. I thought I'd be happier with a high paying job. So I got a job that pays at the 99.9th percentile for my age. Didn't really make me happier. Then I thought my unhappiness was because of my weight. So I lost 90lbs. Hardest thing I've ever done. But it didn't make me happy. Today a voice in my head is telling me "you'll be happier if you get muscular," "you'll be happier if you get in a relationship." I plan to do all of those things, but I realize they probably won't make me happy. What has helped somewhat with fulfillment was placing a fundamentally greater value on myself. Reflecting on my accomplishments has made this a bit easier. And I do value myself a lot more today than I did two years ago - my confidence is higher, even if not as high I hoped it would be... I can't help but feel a bit lost. My accomplishments did not provide me the concrete, grounding, pervading feeling of achievement I hoped they would find. I wasn't happy after them. Instead, there was... nothing, and now I feel like I'm kind of just floating without direction when it comes to "finding happiness."
- fxtentacle 5y agoI believe you mistook the path for the goal, or the future for the now, if you want. Exercise will make you happy, but only while you're doing it. Getting a raise will make you happy, but only for a short time period after that raise. "Having" a relationship won't make you that happy, but the process of building the relationship is highly enjoyable. The key to happiness is to do those things that make you happy while you do them. Sacrificing your personal now for a better future is one of those church ideals that always struck me as weird. That said, if you work on making the planet better, that work will probably also make you happy as long as you keep doing it. But the "better planet" itself is too abstract to make you happy long-term.
- powersnail 5y agoMy disillusionment is not on a personal level, but rather, on a societal level. I thought that I would become successful enough to, well, make a lot of differences in how the society works. Now being an actual part of the society, I don't see how I could accomplish any of my childhood ambitions. Even if I'm 20x richer, with a much higher social status, they are beyond me. I suppose that the younger version of me have gone too far in pride, and too little in understanding. Which I've made peace with. But a lingering consequence is that I really don't know what to aim for anymore, not inspired by any visions, not particularly excitable. From a day-to-day point of view, I settle for being helpful to my fellow human beings. On a grand scale, though, I'm quite lost.
- qsdf38100 5y agoYeah, not much you can do on a grand scale unless you devote you career/life to it I guess. Due to recent events/war I wanted to do something, not sure what, as I realized I’ve been focused on my own little life for too long. Except I see there’s not much I can do, as you said, except talking with family and friends. It feels like the boat is slowly sinking, nobody really cares, and there’s nothing I can do about it.
- DoingSomeThings 5y agoA small note - This podcast with Amanda Litman of "Run For Something" was inspiring for me. I know you aspired to make big change. But I wonder if running for a local political office would help scratch that itch? Those roles have direct impact on the lives of your neighbors, and don't have to be full-time gigs. There's whole orgs that provide resources to help make it happen. https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/01/opinion/ezra-klein-podcast-amanda-litman.html https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/01/opinion/ezra-klein-podcas... https://runforsomething.net/ https://runforsomething.net/
- powersnail 5y agoActually, I really do plan on running for something once I'm eligible! (Currently on a visa, though)
- kochikame 5y agoI think a lot of people on this thread are missing that this is a humor piece
- supermatt 5y agoI think a lot of people are relating and finding it anything but funny.
- tonyedgecombe 5y agoIt's only funny because it is so close to the truth.
- djaychela 5y agoI was expecting to resonate more with this article, but found that the writer really hadn't been doing much. I often complain to my girlfriend that I've got nothing done, and then she asks what I've done... and it turns out I've actually done a lot. I'm currently splitting my days between regular contract work producing videos (first two hours of the day, 7am-9am), and then after a short break I spend the rest of the day (until 6pm, with an hour for lunch) working on my house extension. Today I'll be doing more of the roof (weather permitting), or putting in central heating pipes. Then, after dinner, I'll be working on YouTube content. But still, I've done nothing, in my mind... because I expected to have the extension finished by now (I'm 9 months in, and about 6 months behind, mostly due to external delays). I'm 50. I did expect to be much more successful than I am - I'm not in the slightest, financially. I never expected to be a millionaire, but I'm below average earnings in the UK. But I'm (mostly) happy, and I think that's what matters. I hope so, anyway!
- jakupovic 5y agoKeep on trucking and like someone else said find pleasure in the process. Deadlines are arbitrary and most of the time meaningless.
- idontwantthis 5y agoBelow average while working only 2 hours per day or below average per hour?
- robertlagrant 5y agoIf you can DIY things that would cost someone else tens of thousands of £s/$s then imagine how much you'd need to earn to get that money after tax, and then add that total amount to your salary. That's the equivalent of what you're earning. One reason why I don't like using salary as a comparison is it doesn't reflect people's life circumstances, except at the extremes. It's just easy to measure. And good luck with the roof!
- fxtentacle 5y agoTo me, it sounds like the author tried to be everything to everyone. That's a recipe for disaster. If I had to give advice to my younger self now, I'd probably go with: 1. Celebrate your science reading habit, instead of awkwardly apologizing that you like mathematics. 1 paper a week might seem like it'll get you nowhere, but in 20 years, that compounds to in-depth knowledge of the field. It'll pay off, but on a time scale you and your peers don't understand yet. 2. Don't compare to Gates, Zuckerberg, or Elon. The 1st had resources you'll never have because of his rich parents. The 2nd is now universally hated as a sicko psychopath whose products drive teens into suicide. The 3rd can't seem to keep a stable enough relationship to have a family. You'd hate being in their shoes. 3. Get more comfortable saying no. People are going to ask you for favors all the time, but your time is very limited. Only help friends or those where you predict they'll reciprocate. Make people get their own hands dirty first, it'll help them learn. Stay away from "energy vampires" who ask for your help for everything but won't help you back.
- jl6 5y agoOur amazing global technology allows us to compare ourselves with almost every other human being. We spot someone who’s a better programmer, another who’s a better athlete, another with a bigger family… and soon we start to feel inadequate across a multitude of dimensions which all start to flatten into a single dimension of worthiness. We have invented the total perspective vortex.
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- 5350-uiop-1130 5y agomy idea of success, in order: 1. financial independence (enough passive income not to work if i prefer) 2. own my own home (large enough to grow a family) 3. have a family In my mid 30s, pretty much given up on 3 and 2, as 3 depends on 2. So I am just left with 1 to aim for.
- hef19898 5y agoNo. 1 can be solved by adopting a conservative life style, ideally two "steps" below what your current income would permit you. 2. and 3. are totally independent from each other, both are made easier by No. 1 so. Just a general advice, if I may dare, stop putting those things in order, relax and let some things in live just happen. And enjoy the journey as much as possible. Obviously, that advice only works if you are living in a stable environment. If you don't priorities are going to be topped by, worst case, living to see the next day.
- 2000UltraDeluxe 5y agoThat's unreasonable expectations for most, to be honest. I don't know if it's just because it's the HN bubble where everyone seems to be a USD millionaire and run their own successful startups, or if it's a general thing enabled by modern media trends (or something else entirely). Regardless, it's perfectly possible to succeed at having a happy and fulfilling life without being financially independent. #2 can be achieved if one moves out of the more attractive areas where housing is often far cheaper than in the more hip areas. It may have consequences like an increased commute, or a lower salary, but again, having enough money to never having work isn't going to happen for most of us.
- Volrath89 5y agoI don't know where do you live but it's definitely not necessary to own a home for having a family. Assuming you are a male, just having a stable job and actually wanting to have a family gives you a great chance of success with many, many women. Also mid 30s is so young, you still have at least a decade to find a significant other and build a family if that's what you want.
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- k__ 5y agoI can relate a bit. I'm 36 and often ask myself, what did I do? My parents had kids with 20. My father and grandfather were managers with 25. I met a bunch of people who founded a company before they were 20. Friends of mine traveled from Europe to East Asia as hitchhikers in their 20s. Many of my fellow students work for FAANG. Two are CTOs at middle sized companies and one is even a professor at university. In contrast to that I always feel like a slacker.
- bigpeopleareold 5y agoI had a conversation with co-workers once. The question is: Do we really want to do what our engineering manager does? I thought maybe I would want to, but as an engineering manager, he has the gravitas and attitude to do that work. I would think that I would have to do that and have been slowly gravitating towards that, but that was never my original motivation into getting into software development. Though, I think the fact that I don't have that position right now is a testament of how rather successful I am of what I originally wanted. When I was in my 30s, I felt like some colleagues had a bit more luck even for what they wanted to do: joining the right company, getting to work on the right projects. Maybe they slid into them or maybe they struggled to get the best projects. The fact is that I don't know. I never asked but it doesn't matter because I think that very few things from people are insightful enough anyway. Let's say we're successful slackers inst
- JKCalhoun 5y agoLet's talk about your other friends from high school though.
- k__ 5y agoYes, most of my high school friends have basic 9-5 jobs and even many of my fellow students dropped out without any degree.
- anyfactor 5y agoI found my zen when I was told that, "always know you are the best". No matter what, you are better than everyone by some metric. I also figured out quite recently that, never compare yourself to anyone because there is always going to be someone far better than you. Far luckier than you. I was binge watching a YouTube channel called "Geoguesser". Self explanatory. I was mesmerized by how skilled he was. Even if he was thrown into a literal no where, he was fairly accurate in his guess. Then I watched him compete with other people. He is good but he was no where as good as the other competitors. My reality was shattered. He is not a miracle but he was just skilled at a niche, that's all. There are better guessers but they were not miracles either they were more skilled AND more lucky. So the pursuit of skills and ambition never stops. It is not a thirst, it is greed. So stop comparing, embrace the mediocrity and convince yourself you are better. Start by finding the small things that makes you better than most.
- globular-toast 5y agoI don't have this problem. I feel like I've achieved loads. I just don't see the point of any of it and it doesn't make me happy. I've spent my life working hard and now I can look forward to my body and mind deteriorating in a world with not a soul who cares about me.
- imtringued 5y agoIt could be worse, for example, you could be thinking those very same thoughts at an even younger age, before you even accomplished the things you set out to do.
- caffeine 5y agoI managed to read the first two paragraphs before being quite certain the rest would be a waste of time. As far as I can tell (not a psychiatrist), this individual is suffering from mental illness and could benefit greatly from cognitive behavioural therapy. I hope he gets better soon.
- Tade0 5y agoI dropped such worries when I was 25 and started working for a startup, the founders of which were roughly my age for the most part(only the CEO was 34, which happens to be approximately my age at the moment). Eventually they built a successful company employing hundreds of people. Since then I started measuring my success by comparing to my past self - I think it's healthier that way. I've also found that it's a lot like breathing - you need to, ahem, "exhale" from time to time - take up a less ambitious role just so that you can focus on other aspects of life.
- Cthulhu_ 5y agoI've done that; after the first year, I had to go from 36 to 40 hours because cost of living was increasing while wages stagnated (due to covid). This year I've decided to move on, because the company itself is stagnant and yes, cost of living is increasing. That said, with the latter point, me and my girlfriend have long-term goals of moving someplace bigger and more out of the way, which is a nice goal to have. Staying at my current employer would have been stable, but ultimately stagnant and ungratifying.
- giantg2 5y ago"Since then I started measuring my success by comparing to my past self - I think it's healthier that way." That's certainly better than the one the author is using. Current day me would still fail though - I've made no progress and my opportunities/abilities are slipping away.
- kinnth 5y agoWell that was quite apt. I just turned 36 today and a lot of it resonates. Perhaps the more you learn, the more pressure you put on yourself to perform. Most of those people who he quotes probably thought a lot less but ended up doing a lot more. Say yes to more things, don't conform and never regret.
- alkonaut 5y agoIsn't life merely thinking you'll accomplish something big in the future when you are young (from by a bias that shows people accomplishing grand things more than others), and then basiclaly being too busy just living for a couple of decades, and finally accepting that merely living is accomplishment enough? This panic over accomplishment must be a cultural phenomenon. I can't relate. Is there a wide group of people who are in panic over that their life might end up being merely "lived" without companies founded, books published, mountains climbed?
- hans1729 5y ago>This panic over accomplishment must be a cultural phenomenon. Economic pressure. Look at the housing market and the dystopian reality of our political processes, social divide, etc. -- TONS of people feel like they need to become free by means of economic accomplishments. This is even more so the case in countries without universal healthcare etc. It's coming down to Maslow. If you work in tech, chances are you're smart enough to have and smell opportunities. People who don't have that opportunity because they are occupied with family or day-to-day-jobs can be content with less, just because there is no material dream to pursuit, or because they have other intrinsic goals (art, social connections [...]). The rat race we're forced into drives people mad, and we can't really blame the people. It takes a lot of mental progress to dig yourself out of that. Highly (!) intelligent people, think the top 1% of the chart, may be otherwise occupied, for example by the drive to contribute to scientific progress, but the top ~10-2% (I'm just throwing numbers here) feel trapped in material pressure and forced to "make it", where "it" isn't an actual target other than economic freedom.
- alkonaut 5y agoI think that's probably the cultural difference. When I think "accomplishment" coming from a country with a large social safety net, I'm thinking self-realization (writing a book, climbing everest, reaching the olympics, founding a company, making a scientific discovery) - but accomplishments in this case are independent from economic security. In fact, in order to accomplish I'd probably have to give up some of my economic security. Meanwhile in my case, sending my kids to college or paying for day care is a non issue, even on a low paying job. Getting a nice degree, even a PhD isn't an issue (because higher education is paid for and PhDs are paid positions - but not one you take for future economic gain). So if I want to maximize my economic security and worry about house prices, then I have to accept that I probably need to give up the thought of personal "accomplishment" of the Everest kind, and Instead I'll just work 40h a week and raise a family.
- sussexby 5y agoThis resonates somewhat as I turned 35… today. I thought I would have accomplished a lot more but I also: - fail to recognise my accomplishments to-date - cross-compare with others around me (even if they’re not in the same situation) - have to recognise the variability created by choosing to have others in my life (spouse, children) I reel when I think about some of my decisions - e.g. not buying a home for my family and continuing to rent but I have to accept that some of that is not all my fault - housing is increasingly expensive and I’ve not been blessed with the same 5-figure deposit contribution from family that my friends have had. I also need to recognise the concept of home ownership is an ideal informed from the previous generation and may or may not be as relevant today. I do resent the increasing encroachment of work into the home. The delineation between home and work today is tiny and it becomes very difficult to maintain separation between personal / family / work. This becomes especially hard when work expectations ramp up and how we’re all international now. At times I’ve felt like a vessel for family and work duties with no time left in the calendar for personal pursuit. When it’s difficult to nurture your personal self and develop that internal satisfaction and success, I feel we try to seek that same satisfaction/success in the other domains of family and work which monopolise our calendar and as such look at the measures of success there (a nice car, a decent career, a lofty job title, great family holidays, etc…).
- swayvil 5y agoImagine that you're trapped in the matrix. A dream where all projects, even the most impressive, are just videogames and dust. The only worthwhile achievements would be to become aware of your predicament and to escape the matrix. And any worthwhile pursuit other than that is just a deeper kind of trap. Distracting you while the clock ticks away.
- circlefavshape 5y agotl;dr I imagined a story with myself as the main character, and now I'm disappointed because the story is not real
- mjg59 5y agoGrowing up, the idea of a career in computing was implausible. The only computing course my school offered was scheduled against doing a full science course, and they had nothing for the 16-18 range. The local night school programming class I signed up for was cancelled because I was the only person who signed up for it. My parents made it extremely clear that the idea that I could ever make money writing software was unrealistic, which meant I was 27 with a PhD in genetics before I jumped ship into software full time. And maybe because of that, I'm pretty ok with things? Every day I'm aware that I could do more. I know people who could take over my job right now who are 15 years younger than me. And that's ok, because I have achieved so much more than ever seemed possible to me as a teenager, and every time I stare out the window and realise I'm in San Francisco and part of the industry that was so far away when I was growing up I have to take a moment to come to terms with the fact that this is actually reality. I know this article is satire, but I also know that many people hold themselves against standards that are not realistic. Almost none of us have achieved everything that we could be, and that's just fine. If you're spending a lot of time troubled by the fact that you feel like you're falling short of your potential then this is a great time to find a therapist who can help you work through that. It's ok to want more than you have, but if you're objectively in a basically good place then you really shouldn't be constantly aware of that in a negative way. I'm at peace with the fact that I'm never going to found the next unicorn company or be CEO of Google or even write some software that a lot of people care about. Let's be kind to each other and ourselves about what we've achieved, rather than holding ourselves to a model of what we could theoretically be if literally everything had gone our way.
- justsomebody1 5y agoThis is an exceptionally kind take. Thank you!
- mjg59 5y agoThat means a lot, thank you!
- jll29 5y agoWhat you say is true, yet we should aspire high standards, so that we can find out what we are able to achieve. If you set your bar too low, you will never surprise yourself with doing what your previous self deemed impossible, but what your current self managed to do. Most people I meet can do a lot more, by my assessment, than they think they are capable of. Their own thinking then hinders them from trying, and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy. The trick is to keep a positive-curious attitude about it "let's see if I can" rather than obsessing about others and comparing. Comparing is superficial (people who want to boast do it a lot), and never apples-to-apples, as no-one has the same starting point (parent connections, wealth, genetic disposition/talent etc.).
- pizzaknife 5y agorang a classic age milestone bell this year (within last 12mo) and the internal dialogue has given much cpu cycles to "personal fulfillment" and what that means. The author of the article spends the majority of their time comparing themselves to others(a very narrow band of humanity at that) and as such derives guilt shame and regret. Ive found that comparing oneself to another is a core behavior of fostering personal discontent. Its a behavior weve trained for since we began being social beings so its a very hard thing to conciously negotiate. I try my best to be reasonable about when and how i need to "compete" and when i do not. Getting over my ego (work in progress) has lead me to discover very much of my waking awareness does not need to approached as competition (either directly or as a general underpinning). this realize, each and everytime, is freeing and, as the bumpersticker admonishes: bark less and wag more. Note - spelling and grammar in loose internet bb post sqaurely does not meet "competitive" litmus (my performance certainly wouldnt win any medals had it qualified anyway)
- codr7 5y agoIf you want to hear God laugh, tell him about your plans...
- ArcMex 5y agoI focus on the time required to accomplish something and it dictates where I want to be at a certain age, as opposed to picking an age and arbitrarily setting goals to hit by then.
- coldtea 5y ago>My artistic motto is “Always write five hundred words before noon.” Maybe if the author haven't started with such hand-me-down, derivative, cliche, "artistic motto" he'd have done better...
- thenerdhead 5y agoI just wrote a whole book on this topic coming out soon. I had a similar crisis at 29 last year going into 30. As a former overachiever and perfectionist, I gave myself till 30 when I was 18 writing down goals for some life accomplishments like: - Get a Master's degree by 30 - Build a successful company by 30 - Be financially independent by 30 - Get married and have kids by 30 Needless to say, I accomplished only one of these things. I have a beautiful family I wouldn't trade the world for. But the others? Failure. I lived my life with the social conditioning of the modern world that I lost my sense of happiness. I looked to others to define my path of value and purpose. I kept losing myself to shoulds. What I didn't realize was that I was on my own path of fully expressing myself. I had to turn my attention back inward. I was the only person on this hero's journey to find happiness. Now I’m content with what I’ve done by 30.
- IMTDb 5y agoI am always quite surprised to see these as being labeled "overachiever" goals (they are pretty commonly expressed similarly). Being an "overachiever" means : benefiting from the work of others (food, clothes, transports, ...) for roughly 23 years (time it takes to complete a master degree), then contributing to society for roughly 7 years (until the "successful company is built) by working extremely and then benefiting from the work of other for 60 more years (assuming death at 90) once financial independence is reached. This is absolutely not sustainable for society as a whole, if more people managed to do that, mankind would not be better off. The fact that you have been able to complete your last goal, and that you are still contributing to society in a meaningful way, hopefully for many years to come is a much better outcome for everyone than if these self imposed goals had been reached. And the fact that you are content with your achievements so far a reflection of that. You are absolutely succeeding at life, and you actually have overachieved those goals.
- psychoslave 5y agoToday I woke up, took paper-and-pencil, and wrote a poem about taking time for oneself, as some kind of gratefulness for being able to enjoy self-awareness. A bit later I red it to my daughter, and she replied with a poetry learned at preschool (she’s 5). Now, what I didn’t make was to work on some of these digital projects I have, or looking for some new career opportunities. And part of me was a bit upset for this, to be transparent. Reading this article though, sent me back to the words of my little derisory poem, and recalled me how the most rewarding things can come from the tiniest endeavours.
- marinappi 5y agoIt's not just that I thought of accomplishing more, but I also believed the world would be stable and things wouldnt change too much. How foolish that was. A stable world is a dream and at any moment something somewhere might impact us so hard that it changes everything. My parents lived through that, had their jobs replaced with automated systems halting most of their dreams. And now we went through a pandemic and are going through a possible world war....
- JKCalhoun 5y agoIt's true that the pace of change appears to have accelerated. I grew up under the threat that the USSR would nuke the U.S. and 70's culture was beginning to wake up to problems of oil shortages (embargoes), over-population, pollution. I am not sure I perceived the world as a stable, predictable thing even then. But the Boomers had the rug pulled out from under them when the Summer of Love rolled in and suddenly the gender roles and marriage contracts of their parents generation "Ozzie and Harriet" lifestyle were shattered. Women entered the workplace, the decline of the blue-collar living wage, automation... And I suppose the generation before began with the Great Depression followed up by the rise of fascism and WWII...
- Derelicts 5y agoI agree with all this. Times are changing and its happening so fast that not everyone can catch up. All the problems we had in the 70's did not get fully resolved, but seem to be getting worse, just look at global warming or oil and gas prices jumping sky high. Not to mention housing prices. Will see where the world goes in the next decade.. I sure hope it gets better.
- Draiken 5y agoThis is always a tough subject for me because everyone seems to have at least an idea of what they want to achieve. When I was younger I had these silly dreams of moving to another country, getting married, becoming a programmer to make games, have my own company and get rich (haha). I did become a programmer and got married, but never left the country or became rich. Now on my 30s I know how limited my options are. I could focus on my craft. But I don't have the same drive as before. I could try to progress my career, but I'm already earning good money and I know to earn more I'd have to either start job hopping or study some leetcode to get into a FAANG. I could try to focus on my hobbies, but you realize very quickly that to get good at anything, you need hundreds/thousands of hours. I could try to start a company, but I know that's extremely hard to do and also requires a shit-ton of luck to work out. After all that, I realize that I have no real objectives to strive for. Some of the dreams I realized and they weren't that satisfying. Some I discovered were not worth pursuing. And now what? In the end, I'm just a blip in the universe and when I'm gone it will be unchanged, the same as if I had never existed. Yet we focus on these artificial goals set by childish dreams, society or life events. What's the point of it?
- jchanimal 5y agoIf you aren't feeling motivated to add structure to plans, this helped me https://waitbutwhy.com/2014/05/life-weeks.html https://waitbutwhy.com/2014/05/life-weeks.html
- alexonaci 5y agoAgree, and this is definetly not a popular opinion nowadays. But you could try having kids. You’ll find the meaning like a fire under the arse
- black_13 5y ago
- SMAAART 5y agoIf most people feel this way, does it mean that it's "normal" to feel this way? I torment myself with similar thinking. 1. Objectively speaking I have achieved a lot in my life, from where I started to where I am now, I am living the American dream, and then some. 2. I KNOW that I have a lot of unfulfilled potential. No, it's not the sugar-coated way to say that I am a loser, my "problem" is non-crippling anxiety: while I seem to be perfectly functioning on society, I procrastinate A LOT, and I suffer fro "failure-to-launch" syndrome. I am getting better but not better enough. Case in point this morning I was thinking about starting my own "100 days of rejection therapy" in order to improve. The kicker? When Jia Jang's TED talk came out in 2017 I told myself I was gong to do it. Today, 5 yers later, I am still thinking about it, and NOT doing it. FML. Steven Pressfield calls it "Resistance", I call it Anxiety. Regardless, I can't help but wonder if: 1. The economy must lose trillions of dollars in loss productivity and loss opportunity due to resistance/anxiety 2. Is there a business to be made addressing this problem. It is a problem, but how to address it and monetize it?
- cheeko1234 5y agoI think people that were told that they were special and that they'd amount to something great as children are the ones that suffer most from this mentality. The expectation of performance was artificially inflated which leads to difficulty dealing with failure and constant feelings of dissatisfaction.
- SMAAART 5y agoMaybe. I have mixed feelings about your statement. Growing up the messages to me were quite the opposite (without going into details), and now here I am, fully grown adult, full of doubt, uncertainties, fears, full of Anxieties that prevent me from achieving my full potential. I guess your overall principal is correct, we all know people that fit your statement; at the same time individual experiences and reactions to those experience are also big contributors to outcomes.
- andrewallbright 5y agoThis hits too close for comfort. I'm 31 now (oh my god). If I want to do the things I want to do, I just need to start doing them.
- p0d 5y agoI read a two thousand year old book this morning that said we shouldn't measure our life by our wealth. I just watched the news article about the dinosaur, extinction event, find. And still, many will make wealth their goal and waste their time pursuing success. I wasted enough headspace on it myself. Work hard, be grateful for what you have, enjoy what you have while you have the health.
- Anthony-G 5y agoMark Kozelek beautifully expressed a more melancholic version of this sentiment in 24, the first track of Red House Painters’ first album: https://invidious.snopyta.org/watch?v=i0-FA_svTKg https://invidious.snopyta.org/watch?v=i0-FA_svTKg In the song, he acknowledges his lack of accomplishments as he gets older. There’s ambiguity as to whether he’s more regretful that he never achieved the heights that his younger self envisioned – or if he’s coming to accept this. While he wrote the song in his early twenties, I guess this is a sentiment we can all relate to: there’s always some age-related milestone looming ahead of us.
- Tr3nton 5y agoAwesome, more navel-gazing demoralization from corporate communists in New York City.
- perlgeek 5y agoI can't help but add my favorite Tom Lehrer quote: "It is a sobering thought that when Mozart was my age, he had been dead for two years."
- crispyambulance 5y agoWhat! Did you fail to set "S.M.A.R.T. goals" for yourself in your personal life? :-) If it _really_ mattered to you, you would have done it no matter what, but you got distracted by other things in life. That's OK. There is no HR department for your job as a human being. You don't have to rate yourself on a scale of 1 to whatever. If someone assigns their worth in life by material things or external measures, they will NEVER have enough. There will always be "unchecked boxes" that will override any satisfaction for the "checked boxes".
- ChildOfChaos 5y agoReading through this thread makes me wonder, what are achievements really? If it's not something that brings something to your life and helps you or others grow, then I don't think it's that much. Sometimes those things can even be things where the outright goal failed, because what really matters is something else, excellence of character, enjoying your life and helping bring that out in others as well. I think of someone like Steve Jobs, I remember when he was alive how much he was idolised and how everyone wanted to be the "Next Steve Jobs" now it has been some years that has passed, I feel like that light is a little less and people have moved onto the next thing they want to be, the next Elon musk, mark Zuckerberg or just some level of crazy achievement. But I wonder what it is worth really? Even those people that have achieved so much more than I ever have, did it really matter so much anyway? If those people were not around, everyone would find someone else to idolise, if those people were not around, the problems they solved in the world would likely just be solved by someone else or perhaps they would be solved in a different way at some point in a future and who is to say that that other future is not somehow better than what we have now? Due to the butterfly effect, we just cannot know what crazy alternative realities would happen if the people that we assume have added to humanity and given so much did not exist, somehow life would have continued and the fields in which they came would be just fine or perhaps even better as something else would have come along at some point, something that doesn't have to happen now because of the work they did, you cannot know that life itself is actually better because of them. You could cure cancer, but then the next evil dictator survives cancer due to the treatment and then nukes the entire planet into oblivion. When you think of it like this and see that 1) It is very unlikely that you would be able to achieve at that level and 2) It doesn't really matter anyway, your perspective is forced to change on these things, you start to look at just enjoying your life, doing things in a more localised way than trying to change the entire world.
- meatsauce 5y agoI said I was going to be a millionaire by the time I hit 30. Turns out, you have to work for it.
- layer8 5y agoHigh inflation also helps.
- motohagiography 5y agoRelated to his conclusion: in one of the areas I train in, there is a famous saying where celebrating achievements is just admitting and accepting your level of mediocrity. Somewhere along the way I acquired a voice that asks, "Was that your level? Was that your price?" It's kind, but knows there's more. I do a lot of things, but have learned to achieve nothing. The high points I had where I got some fame and recognition are mostly embarassing now, because they remind me of my conceits that get in the way of ideals I intend to spend a lifetime pursuing. Looking back on the thing you were famous for, was it your best? Does it define you today? Have you left your peak behind and you are less now than you were then? Probably not. To me achievements mean nothing unless they were humbling and converted ignorance into appreciation and humility. It's a tough way to be, but it yields a pretty interesting journey. Sure, I have breakthrough moments. Getting code to work, getting a new piece of music under my fingers, winning a contract or solving a problem, forgiving the person I was who believed things I don't anymore, etc. But I've found expereriences are meaningless unless there is a way to share them to improve the lives of others, even if it's just to make them laugh, or perhaps to serve as a warning, often at the same time. Life isn't in your future and the reflected glory of your achievements, it's now, and you need to breathe it all in and exhale it, over and over again until you can't. I hope the author gets the opportunity to laugh at himself for thinking that his achievement of writing this for New Yorker was the best he could do. I'm pretty sure he's got so much more:)
- stevenhubertron 5y agoI turn 40 tomorrow and can’t help but think how I got my dad over the hill gifts when he turned 40 and thought he was so old. While I have accomplished most I have wanted to do 2 things have still alluded me.
- dcist 5y agoWhat are the 2 things?
- cl42 5y agoThe young man, who does not know the future, sees life as a kind of epic adventure, an Odyssey through strange seas and unknown islands, where he will test and prove his powers, and thereby discover his immortality. The man of middle years, who has lived the future that he once dreamed, sees life as a tragedy; for he has learned that his power, however great, will not prevail against those forces of accident and nature to which he gives the names of gods, and has learned that he is mortal. But the man of age, if he plays his assigned role properly, must see life as a comedy. For his triumphs and his failures merge, and one is no more the occasion for pride or shame than the other; and he is neither the hero who proves himself against those forces, nor the protagonist who is destroyed by them. - John Williams in Augustus
- teamtestbot 5y agoMan, I feel like I skipped those Middle Years and went straight to living my life one meme at a time after college.
- sillysaurusx 5y agoAll of 4chan did. It seems optimal for most people.
- sjg007 5y agoThis is basically what Fox News does. Meme of the week or month.
- gunfighthacksaw 5y agoReality does surprise me now and then by reifying a meme I laughed at a few years ago. Usually the physical manifestation is less funny than the original meme though. I think it was all related to the 2016 US election which is when those 4chan chaos magicians joined forces to elect ‘orange Pepe bad’ to troll normies.
- Forgeties79 5y ago
- nkotov 5y agoI know it's cliche to say but for me, I was always driven by personal fulfillment. My definition of personal fulfillment changed almost every year since I was 20. At 20, I wanted to be a VP at a company by 25. At 21, I wanted and then bought a motorcycle and then later crashed on it. At 22, I wanted to and got to work for a startup. At 23, I got married and got to six figure salary and was hoping to buy a house. At 24, I bought a house, got a dog, and wanted to start a company. At 25, we had a kid and I started a company. At 26, I wanted and got into YC. At 27, I pivoted the company and we ran out of runway. I'm turning 28 in a couple of weeks and decided to slow things down for a couple of months but ended up accepting a cofounding offer to build something else. Every year brought many sad and happy days. There were slow days where I felt I was wasting my life away and there were many fulfilling days where I felt like I accomplished a lot. I really believe that life is what you make it. Having dreams is fine but unless you're working towards them every single day, they will remain as dreams.
- dhairya 5y agoI like to joke I have type B personality with type A ambitions which is the recipe for perpetual unhappiness. When the switch is on, things move quickly, but its been getting harder and harder to find the switch. I'm in early soon to be mid-30s and I've been trying to figure out if having grand ambitions is still necessary to overcome inertia or is it something else.
- alkaloid 5y agoThis is why my wife and I had eight children. We realized early that there is no other meaning of life, and no other more important legacy, than being surrounded by family when we die. Thankfully, we're in good company now that Elon Musk has gone public with a similar idea in perpetuation of the species.
- lost_soul 5y agoBeing a COBOL programmer is starting to look pretty good.
- markus_zhang 5y agoI'm close to 40 and has never been more confused than before.
- sharadov 5y agoWhat a dreary, depressing article. Sorry dude, life happened while you were waiting..
- pkaye 5y agoTurns out we are a NPC, not the main character.
- Decabytes 5y agoI’m currently in a transitory period between moving from a rental into a house. I just want the next 3 months to fly by. But I have to keep telling myself that if I don’t focus on my life in the present, then I will effectively just have lost 3 months of my life because I’ve been so focused on what’s at the end of it, and not what happens in between.
- worik 5y agoThat was humour?
- _hcuq 5y agoFor those who believe in God, most of the big questions are answered. But for those of us who can't readily accept the God formula, the big answers don't remain stonewritten. We adjust to new conditions and discoveries. We are pliable. Love need not be a command or faith a dictum. I am my own God. We are here to unlearn the teachings of the church, state and our educational system. We are here to drink beer. We are here to kill war. We are here to laugh at the odds and live our lives so well that Death will tremble to take us. Source: https://quotepark.com/quotes/1336674-charles-bukowski-we-are-here-to-drink-beer-we-are-here-to-kill-war/ https://quotepark.com/quotes/1336674-charles-bukowski-we-are...
- pochekailov 5y agoPeople often ask me: why am I always preaching life extension and immortality research? Here is why: so you can be 41, 441, 1041 and still have millions years ahead. Once 41 years old no longer means you wasted your youth away, you will be able to concentrate on one thing per day and don't feel tragic if this thing fails.
- maerF0x0 5y agounfortunately the life expectancy once we remove aging is only about 1000 due to eventual death from trauma . Once we remove death due to aging, nearly every death will be relatively sudden and unexpected.
- DoingSomeThings 5y agoThis resonates. It feels like a cliche, but I genuinely feel like I've peaked in life. I excelled in HS. Top of class. Award winning marching band. Full ride to a decent state school. Helped run some student organizations, did great in classes. I took a total detour post-undergrad for a few years to do service work. But now I'm in my 30's and 5 years into a "real career". I work long days in Operations at a tech marketplace. It's fun problems and I like working with data/product, but it hardly feels like I've living up to the potential I had thrown on me earlier in life. I'm far from the top 1% performer I was in High School / College. I play a lot of video games and read a never-ending stream of miscellaneous articles. I go to the gym a few days a week and . Maybe once a month I pull out my guitar. I checked off my "adult" milestones -- Married and have a house. But seems like lots of days I just wake up, work, then stare at a TV. It's not all bad -- But reading this list and the failure to start, so many possibilities but I never do anything idea just rings true to me.
- pipeline_peak 5y agoHorse indie movie, circus of Pépin, chuck taylors? lololol you’re so quirky!