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Texas recently passed bill(House Bill 4110) making this crime a felony, I wonder if this will make it easier for owners to be covered under Sec. 9.42 code which

Texas recently passed bill(House Bill 4110) making this crime a felony, I wonder if this will make it easier for owners to be covered under Sec. 9.42 code which will let owners use deadly force against anybody who is under your car or running away with your converter during night time. Texas is 2nd highest in US for this crime, somebody is gonna pay with their life for this crime. https://legiscan.com/TX/text/HB4110/id/2408113 https://legiscan.com/TX/text/HB4110/id/2408113 https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/SOTWDocs/PE/htm/PE.9.htm https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/SOTWDocs/PE/htm/PE.9.htm

mint2 5y ago
By that somebody do you mean someone that random vigilantes assume stole a cat in the past with little proof? And then grab shotguns and pick up trucks to chase the somebody if they ever see that somebody again and proceed to execute the person?
Someone1234 5y ago
Catalytic converter theft is obnoxious, and I'm fine with it being a felony (in particular as the cost of repairs is substantial higher than the "raw cost" of the stolen converter itself). That being said: It isn't a capital crime and shouldn't be. If people can legally justify deadly force without self-defense (e.g. finding someone under their vehicle and shooting them) then the law itself is a problem. If the state wants to make things a capital crime they should just do so directly, because at least then you get your day in court, a jury who could nullify, and lawmakers have to suffer the political ramifications of killing a bunch of petty thieves.
- dylan604 5y ago
  >If the state wants to make things a capital crime they should just do so directly, whoa, easy there fella! Don't go giving this guy any more zanny ideas. He'll call another special session just for it (no governor has called this many). The wackier the idea, the better he'll like it.
- xenocyon 5y ago
  Considering that lawmakers in Texas and other places have recently been trying to make it legal for car drivers to mow down pedestrian protesters, I don't think they are worried about the political ramifications of people killing petty thieves, or rather they believe such ramifications will play to their advantage rather than disadvantage.
  - djanogo 5y ago
    You should provide proof of actual law/bill, penal code and case law where what you claim was applied before posting bigoted comments on entire state. Edit: Did you even bother to read the law before you commented?, the first fkin line, and (b), Line (1) burden of proof is on the defendant, not the prosecution, it will be judged by his peers. The (2) will fail if protestors are on allowed/blocked road ways and will only apply if protestors are illegally on non-permitted road ways. (1) the person operating the motor vehicle was exercising due care; and (2) the person injured was blocking traffic in a public right-of-way while participating in a protest or demonstration. (b) This section does not affect a person's liability for an injury caused by grossly negligent conduct.
    - dylan604 5y ago
      https://capitol.texas.gov/tlodocs/851/billtext/html/HB00250I.htm https://capitol.texas.gov/tlodocs/851/billtext/html/HB00250I... what else can I google for you? While I agree the "whole state" is a really big brush to be painting with, it's not an inaccurate description of what the state legislature is doing.
      - barbacoa 5y ago
        >what else can I google for you? I don't think asking for clarification was an unreasonable ask. Too many people today use emotional charged rewordings to describe things. It's honestly hard at times to know what people are referring to anymore.
        dylan604 5y ago
- tessierashpool 5y ago
  Texans are like this about everything. Bloodthirsty and armed to the teeth, even when they're going to a flower garden to drink herbal tea. I live in a neighboring state and we get a lot of Texan tourists. You can't get them to honor a stop sign or even drive on the right side of the road with anything less than the threat of deadly force. It's utterly exhausting. edit: in the interest of a having worthwhile discussion, let me acknowledge that there's an over-generalization here. Sorry about that. But, in the interest of valuing expertise, let's also keep in mind that Texas has to be experienced to be understood.
  - dminvs 5y ago
    We also are all given horses and a Stetson by the state government at birth! /s
  - dang 5y ago
    Flamewar comments in general, and regional flamewar in particular, are not allowed here. If you'd please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and not post like this again, we'd appreciate it.
- HelixEndeavor 5y ago
  Or, alternatively, thieves could decide to not try and steal catalytic converters knowing they could get shot for it at no legal repercussion for the owner. If you gamble with your life, you're bound to lose eventually, and I just struggle to feel sympathy for those who knowingly ruin their own lives with full conscience of the consequences. I have the right to defend my property.
  - arcticbull 5y ago
    Another vote for failed state anarchy. Where all did you grow up and go to school if you don’t mind, I’m building a list of no-go zones.
    - 0x0nyandesu 5y ago
      Oy vey go away. Move to Europe if you don't like it. Your anarchy is my justice
      - arcticbull 5y ago
        Ah yes Europe famously the only place on earth you can’t unload a clip and murder someone for stealing the catalytic converter out of your Ford truck lol. Absolutely embarrassing. Think of all the failure that went into someone making this statement with a straight face. Federal, state, local, moral. Just wow. “Your anarchy is my justice” is the rallying cry of every criminal out there. The state losing its monopoly on violence is the definition of a failed state. Other places you’re welcome to murder people for stealing from you are likely Somalia, parts of El Salvador, the Sudan, Western Sahara and uh, I want to say cartel controlled states in Mexico. Not exactly sterling examples of well run areas. Even there it’s due to absence of state control, not outright abdication.
  - capableweb 5y ago
    It doesn't worry you that people could misuse the law? For example, shooting someone to death first, then placing them under their car, and that way get away with murder?
- mgraczyk 5y ago
  I also agree that it shouldn't be a capital crime, but I don't think that automatically implies that deadly force cannot be allowed to prevent the theft in the first place. The distinction really comes down to your belief on public vs private use of force. On one extreme, you could believe that only the state should be allowed to use deadly force to enforce, on the other extreme you could believe the state should never use deadly force. I would guess that many Texans who support the use of deadly force in this situation accept this difference. Personally I feel there should be no death penalty, but also believe individuals should generally be allowed to use deadly force to protect themselves and their property. I'm worried about cases or mistaken identity or collateral damage, but that should be an empirical question rather than one of justice.
thatfrenchguy 5y ago
Yes, because, the right answer to someone stealing your catalytic converter is to shoot them and get the lifelong trauma from it. Such a great idea.
- dylan604 5y ago
  Some people are not affected by the taking of someone else's life. Not everyone will be affected the way you might be, and hell, you might not be affected the way you think you might. It could be worse, it could be less. Hopefully, you never have to know, but to assume everyone does is not realistic
  - mint2 5y ago
    Ahmaud Arbery’s case is a reminder that a significant number of people dream of carrying out vigilante retribution/enforcements without cause and shoot people.
  - tessierashpool 5y ago
    What you said is true of psychopaths and sociopaths, but rarer in the general population. Generally speaking, PTSD is an extremely well-documented consequence of killing. "killing or seriously injuring someone in the line of duty was significantly associated with PTSD symptoms (p< .01) and marginally associated with depression symptoms (p < .06). These results highlight the potential mental health impact of killing or seriously injuring someone in the line of duty." https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3974970/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3974970/ "Killing in War Leaves Veterans with Lasting Psychological Scars, Study Finds" https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2016/12/405231/killing-war-leaves-veterans-lasting-psychological-scars-study-finds https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2016/12/405231/killing-war-leaves-... lots more evidence out there.
    - mint2 5y ago
      If it caused 10% of individuals to have symptoms then they’d detect a p value like those, the other 90% could be pleased as pudding for all the p value would care. I doubt it’s that high, my comment is just that the quoted p value and association does not actually provide any support for the statement And the first of your sources does say that 7-19% of officers get ptsd but also that 25% kill or seriously injured someone, which is a larger number than get ptsd. so that suggests 6-18% officers kill or seriously injure someone and don’t get ptsd. Assuming the ones that get ptsd are the same as the ones doing bodily harm, unrealistic but conservative, that means half of officers who do that could easily be just dandy.
jccooper 5y ago
That section makes no mention of classification of the crime. It would be the same scenario felony or misdemeanor.
tasty_freeze 5y ago
In Texas, one is allowed to use deadly force against the perpetrator of theft, even if one is not threatened (say the perp is running away) with the proviso, for some reason, that this crime happens at night. In 2013, a man hired an escort off of craigslist. She took $150 payment, then refused to have sex with him and left. She made it to her car, but he grabbed a gun, ran to her car, and shot her in the neck. A jury acquitted him. https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2013/06/ezekiel-gilbert-texas-man-acquited-of-murdering-craigslist-escort-who-wouldn-t-have-sex-with-him.html https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2013/06/ezekiel-gilbert-...
- consp 5y ago
  Apparently I'm not sane enough to see how committing a murder is being law abiding. Texas is definitely now on my do-never-go list.
  - go_blue_13 5y ago
    And you're clearly not sane enough to understand what 'murder' means either
  - perth 5y ago
    DW, if you're a tech worker pretty much every silicon valley company is finding out they won't find talent in Texas, so I think you'll never have to go there as they pull out.
- alliao 5y ago
  and no one's made a mod yet for GTA:Texas Edition talk about missed opportunities..
- hippich 5y ago
  The reason why at night, because it is not about killing/executing/etc, but about not letting the perpetrator to run away without consequences, which is very likely at night - hence the night provision.
markdown 5y ago
> let owners use deadly force against anybody who is under your car or running away with your converter during night time. WTF? Why don't you think that should result in a murder charge?
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
arcticbull 5y ago
I cannot even begin to understand the rationale for executing someone stealing your private property. That’s some failed state shit.
- throwawaysea 5y ago
  I personally view it as the exact opposite. I feel that defense of- and autonomy over- my person and property are the most fundamental tiers of liberty. A society that does not uphold defense of property is effectively arguing for a lack of private property (a certain ideology starting with ‘C’ also has this trait). If we had enough surveillance, police officers, and so forth to catch criminals, hold them to consequences, and deter others, I would support avoiding a stricter law like this. But the reality is cities simply cannot afford the amount of staffing needed to stop these crimes from happening, and I don’t think hardworking taxpayers should have to shoulder that burden. These criminals are also not helpless victims - they are most typically lazy bandits who are breaking down society when they could very easily go get one of the millions of jobs available today and make an honest living through hard work - like the rest of us. If these people want to operate outside what a just society requires, then we need real, harsh consequences so that we have an effective deterrent that will put an end to this. Citizens being able to defend their property without expensive or time-consuming legal complications seems like a great way to have a distributed policing force at no cost, to uphold the very laws that our society has already put on the books.
  - plantain 5y ago
    >If we had enough surveillance, police officers, and so forth to catch criminals, hold them to consequences, and deter others, I would support avoiding a stricter law like this. The fact that you don't, and that you think street executions are a substitute, is what makes it a failed state.
    - plantain 5y ago
      https://twitter.com/JodiHernandezTV/status/1462284757434175488 https://twitter.com/JodiHernandezTV/status/14622847574341754... Honestly, what is going on in the US?
seer 5y ago
Huh only in America it might be considered OK to execute a person for a theft of an automative part. Its like - there is someone committing a nonviolent felony of stealing a minor part from your car, and now you are deputized to be judge jury and executioner and can perform a quick public execution, for your convenience… I mean I get it sucks very hard to have something being stolen from you _in front of your eyes_ but does this justify an execution? Isn’t that why we have monopoly on violence and for that matter insurance? I’ve had stuff like that stolen from me, by a member of my country’s repressed minority, and it was in front of my eyes, I was sleeping when the act was committed, right next to me, so I guess my life was also in danger. I woke up just as they were making their escape. I did have the urge to chase them down true, but never in my dreams have I thought these lives were beyond redemption and I have the right to execute them then and there, and I would live happy afterwards… How does the moral calculous work for Americans? Genuinely curious. Is it “something bad is being done to me, I am therefore justified to use any means necessary” kind of thing, or there is something else/more?
- treeman79 5y ago
  San Francisco is becoming the poster child for what happens when you decriminalize / remove consequences for theft.
  - SyzygistSix 5y ago
    I think the lawlessness in San Francisco is more the poster child for what happens when we treat people as disposable.
    - treeman79 5y ago
      https://www.hoover.org/research/only-san-francisco-61000-tents-and-350000-public-toilets https://www.hoover.org/research/only-san-francisco-61000-ten... SF is spending 100k per homeless person. It’s not going well. What’s the correct amount of caring?
      - 5y ago
throwawaysea 5y ago
Great! This is exactly the kind of action we need up and down the West Coast, in LA, SF, Portland, and Seattle. In all these cities “restorative justice” policies have essentially legalized crime, while still subjecting law abiding taxpayers to every statute. As an example: if a vagrant using up public parking spaces as a home dumps sewage from their RV into the street, they’ll face no penalties. If a homeowner drops a thimble of anything into a drain, they’ll face significant fines. Without real consequences and deterrents, criminals and low lives will victimize others with impunity. The catch-and-release policies used by activist DAs like Chesa Boudin have massively backfired and turned livable, attractive cities into dangerous slums. It needs to be fixed now.
- bruceb 5y ago
  There might actually be things you have posted in this thread I agree with but why then do make other dumb wild claims. "If a homeowner drops a thimble of anything into a drain, they’ll face significant fines." Nobody knows what you dump down the drain. "turned livable, attractive cities into dangerous slums." Weird as I have not seen housing prices slump in value, they just keeping getting more costly.
  - qweqwweqwe-90i 5y ago
    They probably weren't being literal.
userbinator 5y ago
Ironically, Texas would probably also have one of the highest percentage of vehicle owners who have removed and replaced their catalytic converters with a straight pipe. It's called a "cat delete" and common in the performance community, probably because there is no emissions testing.
datavirtue 5y ago
Wouldn't the dollar amount of the theft had made it a felony?
devwastaken 5y ago
There is no law for shooting people with property. Self defense, even in Texas, requires an imminent threat of grevious bodily harm. Texas DA's on the other hand do not follow the law, and generally will not prosecute unless you're not the right kind of person. Content warning. 1. https://youtube.com/watch?v=Xo4H5ijVPEE https://youtube.com/watch?v=Xo4H5ijVPEE
- sokoloff 5y ago
  > There is no law for shooting people with property. See 9.42: https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/PE/htm/PE.9.htm#9.42 https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/PE/htm/PE.9.htm#9.42
mnemotronic 5y ago
What goes around comes around. Or if you prefer: For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged, and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. Matthew 7:2
perth 5y ago
Just make sure you shoot 'em in the back several times https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VU7ol1_pw6U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VU7ol1_pw6U (/s)

mint2 5y ago

By that somebody do you mean someone that random vigilantes assume stole a cat in the past with little proof? And then grab shotguns and pick up trucks to chase the somebody if they ever see that somebody again and proceed to execute the person?

Someone1234 5y ago

Catalytic converter theft is obnoxious, and I'm fine with it being a felony (in particular as the cost of repairs is substantial higher than the "raw cost" of the stolen converter itself). That being said: It isn't a capital crime and shouldn't be. If people can legally justify deadly force without self-defense (e.g. finding someone under their vehicle and shooting them) then the law itself is a problem. If the state wants to make things a capital crime they should just do so directly, because at least then you get your day in court, a jury who could nullify, and lawmakers have to suffer the political ramifications of killing a bunch of petty thieves.

dylan604 5y ago
>If the state wants to make things a capital crime they should just do so directly, whoa, easy there fella! Don't go giving this guy any more zanny ideas. He'll call another special session just for it (no governor has called this many). The wackier the idea, the better he'll like it.
xenocyon 5y ago
Considering that lawmakers in Texas and other places have recently been trying to make it legal for car drivers to mow down pedestrian protesters, I don't think they are worried about the political ramifications of people killing petty thieves, or rather they believe such ramifications will play to their advantage rather than disadvantage.
- djanogo 5y ago
  You should provide proof of actual law/bill, penal code and case law where what you claim was applied before posting bigoted comments on entire state. Edit: Did you even bother to read the law before you commented?, the first fkin line, and (b), Line (1) burden of proof is on the defendant, not the prosecution, it will be judged by his peers. The (2) will fail if protestors are on allowed/blocked road ways and will only apply if protestors are illegally on non-permitted road ways. (1) the person operating the motor vehicle was exercising due care; and (2) the person injured was blocking traffic in a public right-of-way while participating in a protest or demonstration. (b) This section does not affect a person's liability for an injury caused by grossly negligent conduct.
  - dylan604 5y ago
    https://capitol.texas.gov/tlodocs/851/billtext/html/HB00250I.htm https://capitol.texas.gov/tlodocs/851/billtext/html/HB00250I... what else can I google for you? While I agree the "whole state" is a really big brush to be painting with, it's not an inaccurate description of what the state legislature is doing.
    - barbacoa 5y ago
      >what else can I google for you? I don't think asking for clarification was an unreasonable ask. Too many people today use emotional charged rewordings to describe things. It's honestly hard at times to know what people are referring to anymore.
      - dylan604 5y ago
tessierashpool 5y ago
Texans are like this about everything. Bloodthirsty and armed to the teeth, even when they're going to a flower garden to drink herbal tea. I live in a neighboring state and we get a lot of Texan tourists. You can't get them to honor a stop sign or even drive on the right side of the road with anything less than the threat of deadly force. It's utterly exhausting. edit: in the interest of a having worthwhile discussion, let me acknowledge that there's an over-generalization here. Sorry about that. But, in the interest of valuing expertise, let's also keep in mind that Texas has to be experienced to be understood.
- dminvs 5y ago
  We also are all given horses and a Stetson by the state government at birth! /s
- dang 5y ago
  Flamewar comments in general, and regional flamewar in particular, are not allowed here. If you'd please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and not post like this again, we'd appreciate it.
HelixEndeavor 5y ago
Or, alternatively, thieves could decide to not try and steal catalytic converters knowing they could get shot for it at no legal repercussion for the owner. If you gamble with your life, you're bound to lose eventually, and I just struggle to feel sympathy for those who knowingly ruin their own lives with full conscience of the consequences. I have the right to defend my property.
- arcticbull 5y ago
  Another vote for failed state anarchy. Where all did you grow up and go to school if you don’t mind, I’m building a list of no-go zones.
  - 0x0nyandesu 5y ago
    Oy vey go away. Move to Europe if you don't like it. Your anarchy is my justice
    - arcticbull 5y ago
      Ah yes Europe famously the only place on earth you can’t unload a clip and murder someone for stealing the catalytic converter out of your Ford truck lol. Absolutely embarrassing. Think of all the failure that went into someone making this statement with a straight face. Federal, state, local, moral. Just wow. “Your anarchy is my justice” is the rallying cry of every criminal out there. The state losing its monopoly on violence is the definition of a failed state. Other places you’re welcome to murder people for stealing from you are likely Somalia, parts of El Salvador, the Sudan, Western Sahara and uh, I want to say cartel controlled states in Mexico. Not exactly sterling examples of well run areas. Even there it’s due to absence of state control, not outright abdication.
- capableweb 5y ago
  It doesn't worry you that people could misuse the law? For example, shooting someone to death first, then placing them under their car, and that way get away with murder?
mgraczyk 5y ago
I also agree that it shouldn't be a capital crime, but I don't think that automatically implies that deadly force cannot be allowed to prevent the theft in the first place. The distinction really comes down to your belief on public vs private use of force. On one extreme, you could believe that only the state should be allowed to use deadly force to enforce, on the other extreme you could believe the state should never use deadly force. I would guess that many Texans who support the use of deadly force in this situation accept this difference. Personally I feel there should be no death penalty, but also believe individuals should generally be allowed to use deadly force to protect themselves and their property. I'm worried about cases or mistaken identity or collateral damage, but that should be an empirical question rather than one of justice.

thatfrenchguy 5y ago

Yes, because, the right answer to someone stealing your catalytic converter is to shoot them and get the lifelong trauma from it. Such a great idea.

dylan604 5y ago
Some people are not affected by the taking of someone else's life. Not everyone will be affected the way you might be, and hell, you might not be affected the way you think you might. It could be worse, it could be less. Hopefully, you never have to know, but to assume everyone does is not realistic
- mint2 5y ago
  Ahmaud Arbery’s case is a reminder that a significant number of people dream of carrying out vigilante retribution/enforcements without cause and shoot people.
- tessierashpool 5y ago
  What you said is true of psychopaths and sociopaths, but rarer in the general population. Generally speaking, PTSD is an extremely well-documented consequence of killing. "killing or seriously injuring someone in the line of duty was significantly associated with PTSD symptoms (p< .01) and marginally associated with depression symptoms (p < .06). These results highlight the potential mental health impact of killing or seriously injuring someone in the line of duty." https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3974970/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3974970/ "Killing in War Leaves Veterans with Lasting Psychological Scars, Study Finds" https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2016/12/405231/killing-war-leaves-veterans-lasting-psychological-scars-study-finds https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2016/12/405231/killing-war-leaves-... lots more evidence out there.
  - mint2 5y ago
    If it caused 10% of individuals to have symptoms then they’d detect a p value like those, the other 90% could be pleased as pudding for all the p value would care. I doubt it’s that high, my comment is just that the quoted p value and association does not actually provide any support for the statement And the first of your sources does say that 7-19% of officers get ptsd but also that 25% kill or seriously injured someone, which is a larger number than get ptsd. so that suggests 6-18% officers kill or seriously injure someone and don’t get ptsd. Assuming the ones that get ptsd are the same as the ones doing bodily harm, unrealistic but conservative, that means half of officers who do that could easily be just dandy.

jccooper 5y ago

That section makes no mention of classification of the crime. It would be the same scenario felony or misdemeanor.

tasty_freeze 5y ago

In Texas, one is allowed to use deadly force against the perpetrator of theft, even if one is not threatened (say the perp is running away) with the proviso, for some reason, that this crime happens at night. In 2013, a man hired an escort off of craigslist. She took $150 payment, then refused to have sex with him and left. She made it to her car, but he grabbed a gun, ran to her car, and shot her in the neck. A jury acquitted him. https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2013/06/ezekiel-gilbert-texas-man-acquited-of-murdering-craigslist-escort-who-wouldn-t-have-sex-with-him.html https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2013/06/ezekiel-gilbert-...

consp 5y ago
Apparently I'm not sane enough to see how committing a murder is being law abiding. Texas is definitely now on my do-never-go list.
- go_blue_13 5y ago
  And you're clearly not sane enough to understand what 'murder' means either
- perth 5y ago
  DW, if you're a tech worker pretty much every silicon valley company is finding out they won't find talent in Texas, so I think you'll never have to go there as they pull out.
alliao 5y ago
and no one's made a mod yet for GTA:Texas Edition talk about missed opportunities..
hippich 5y ago
The reason why at night, because it is not about killing/executing/etc, but about not letting the perpetrator to run away without consequences, which is very likely at night - hence the night provision.

markdown 5y ago

> let owners use deadly force against anybody who is under your car or running away with your converter during night time. WTF? Why don't you think that should result in a murder charge?

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

arcticbull 5y ago

I cannot even begin to understand the rationale for executing someone stealing your private property. That’s some failed state shit.

throwawaysea 5y ago
I personally view it as the exact opposite. I feel that defense of- and autonomy over- my person and property are the most fundamental tiers of liberty. A society that does not uphold defense of property is effectively arguing for a lack of private property (a certain ideology starting with ‘C’ also has this trait). If we had enough surveillance, police officers, and so forth to catch criminals, hold them to consequences, and deter others, I would support avoiding a stricter law like this. But the reality is cities simply cannot afford the amount of staffing needed to stop these crimes from happening, and I don’t think hardworking taxpayers should have to shoulder that burden. These criminals are also not helpless victims - they are most typically lazy bandits who are breaking down society when they could very easily go get one of the millions of jobs available today and make an honest living through hard work - like the rest of us. If these people want to operate outside what a just society requires, then we need real, harsh consequences so that we have an effective deterrent that will put an end to this. Citizens being able to defend their property without expensive or time-consuming legal complications seems like a great way to have a distributed policing force at no cost, to uphold the very laws that our society has already put on the books.
- plantain 5y ago
  >If we had enough surveillance, police officers, and so forth to catch criminals, hold them to consequences, and deter others, I would support avoiding a stricter law like this. The fact that you don't, and that you think street executions are a substitute, is what makes it a failed state.
  - plantain 5y ago
    https://twitter.com/JodiHernandezTV/status/1462284757434175488 https://twitter.com/JodiHernandezTV/status/14622847574341754... Honestly, what is going on in the US?

seer 5y ago

Huh only in America it might be considered OK to execute a person for a theft of an automative part. Its like - there is someone committing a nonviolent felony of stealing a minor part from your car, and now you are deputized to be judge jury and executioner and can perform a quick public execution, for your convenience… I mean I get it sucks very hard to have something being stolen from you _in front of your eyes_ but does this justify an execution? Isn’t that why we have monopoly on violence and for that matter insurance? I’ve had stuff like that stolen from me, by a member of my country’s repressed minority, and it was in front of my eyes, I was sleeping when the act was committed, right next to me, so I guess my life was also in danger. I woke up just as they were making their escape. I did have the urge to chase them down true, but never in my dreams have I thought these lives were beyond redemption and I have the right to execute them then and there, and I would live happy afterwards… How does the moral calculous work for Americans? Genuinely curious. Is it “something bad is being done to me, I am therefore justified to use any means necessary” kind of thing, or there is something else/more?

treeman79 5y ago
San Francisco is becoming the poster child for what happens when you decriminalize / remove consequences for theft.
- SyzygistSix 5y ago
  I think the lawlessness in San Francisco is more the poster child for what happens when we treat people as disposable.
  - treeman79 5y ago
    https://www.hoover.org/research/only-san-francisco-61000-tents-and-350000-public-toilets https://www.hoover.org/research/only-san-francisco-61000-ten... SF is spending 100k per homeless person. It’s not going well. What’s the correct amount of caring?
    - 5y ago

throwawaysea 5y ago

Great! This is exactly the kind of action we need up and down the West Coast, in LA, SF, Portland, and Seattle. In all these cities “restorative justice” policies have essentially legalized crime, while still subjecting law abiding taxpayers to every statute. As an example: if a vagrant using up public parking spaces as a home dumps sewage from their RV into the street, they’ll face no penalties. If a homeowner drops a thimble of anything into a drain, they’ll face significant fines. Without real consequences and deterrents, criminals and low lives will victimize others with impunity. The catch-and-release policies used by activist DAs like Chesa Boudin have massively backfired and turned livable, attractive cities into dangerous slums. It needs to be fixed now.

bruceb 5y ago
There might actually be things you have posted in this thread I agree with but why then do make other dumb wild claims. "If a homeowner drops a thimble of anything into a drain, they’ll face significant fines." Nobody knows what you dump down the drain. "turned livable, attractive cities into dangerous slums." Weird as I have not seen housing prices slump in value, they just keeping getting more costly.
- qweqwweqwe-90i 5y ago
  They probably weren't being literal.

userbinator 5y ago

Ironically, Texas would probably also have one of the highest percentage of vehicle owners who have removed and replaced their catalytic converters with a straight pipe. It's called a "cat delete" and common in the performance community, probably because there is no emissions testing.

datavirtue 5y ago

Wouldn't the dollar amount of the theft had made it a felony?

devwastaken 5y ago

There is no law for shooting people with property. Self defense, even in Texas, requires an imminent threat of grevious bodily harm. Texas DA's on the other hand do not follow the law, and generally will not prosecute unless you're not the right kind of person. Content warning. 1. https://youtube.com/watch?v=Xo4H5ijVPEE https://youtube.com/watch?v=Xo4H5ijVPEE

sokoloff 5y ago
> There is no law for shooting people with property. See 9.42: https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/PE/htm/PE.9.htm#9.42 https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/PE/htm/PE.9.htm#9.42

mnemotronic 5y ago

What goes around comes around. Or if you prefer: For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged, and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. Matthew 7:2

perth 5y ago

Just make sure you shoot 'em in the back several times https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VU7ol1_pw6U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VU7ol1_pw6U (/s)