22 ms·

Oculus Quest is removing the Facebook account requirement

384 points by simonjgreen 5y ago

beezischillin 5y ago
Can I migrate my purchases over and get rid of my extra Faceborg account, then? I don’t like the threat of getting banned and losing all my purchases hovering over my head constantly
bastardoperator 5y ago
Wake me up when the resolution isn't garbage. I have two Oculus kits collecting dust due to facebook and the fact that looking at my monitor is still a more pleasurable experience.
- Cromation 5y ago
  Isnt there a hack out there that removes the facebook account requirement?
morjom 5y ago
Any idea if this applies to other sets like the CV1 or Rift S?
2pEXgD0fZ5cF 5y ago
Oculus won't require an account? Where have I heard that one before... This is just another attempt at being clever (and dishonest), isn't it? "Sure we said it won't require a FACEBOOK account, but Meta is something totally different and <insert more marketing sentences>. And because of that, a Meta account is required."
mupuff1234 5y ago
Only to add it later on once they capture enough additional users.
- deltron3030 5y ago
  The sunken cost strategy.
mawise 5y ago
Owner of a Quest 1, so I've never linked to FB, but that's also locked me.out of Venues (which was how they broadcast Connect in VR). Any speculation on whether Venues will still require a FB account?
zzzeek 5y ago
im sure the ongoing FTC investigations have nothing to do with this
gregjw 5y ago
Shouldn't have been implemented in the first place.
KingOfCoders 5y ago
I will be a Meta account in the future.
ldehaan 5y ago
Ohsnap am I gonna get my kids one now? No. Hell no. Facebook Is Trash, I'll never give a cent to them on purpose and do my damndest to bring it down, put it down, throw Facebook away whenever I get a chance to educate someone. Im getting the G2 headset baby! If you want to Easily make the world a better place, never give Facebook your money. You don't need to join Greenpeace or sort recycling, just Get Rid Of Facebook.
- smoldesu 5y ago
  Yeah, all those poor people who can't afford ethical headsets can go fuck themselves! I'm getting a fully loaded headset with all my money, I simply can't imagine being unfortunate enough to get locked out of the Metaverse!
pitched 5y ago
I have an old grandfathered Oculus account and haven’t upgraded to Quest 2 because I don’t want to link my Facebook. If this ends up being true, they’ve made at least one extra sale.
- senectus1 5y ago
  if its true i'll buy them for my kids xmas pressies.
spywaregorilla 5y ago
Meta's pulling out for a bit while it finds a bigger strap on.
sowbug 5y ago
Glad to hear about this. I sued Facebook in a California small-claims court to rescind my purchase of the Quest 1 (and all accessories and game purchases) after I declined the change in ToS adding the FB account requirement. It took a while (negotiated with their customer support, then sued, then finally months later got an intelligent response), but we settled for what I asked for. I can't be the only one who got my money back. I liked the product except for the added account requirement, and I would now consider buying again.
- schaefer 5y ago
  You are my hero.
- djbusby 5y ago
  Curious how much time you spent and total time to resolve. Can you share?
  - sowbug 5y ago
    I used to practice law, so the process is a little more natural for me. Summary: 1. I read the terms of service that I originally agreed to. Found a requirement to first negotiate any dispute with their general counsel in good faith. So I wrote to them explaining that I declined the change in ToS terms, and asked for a refund of everything I'd purchased in connection with the headset, plus the dollar amount that it added up to. Sent by registered mail. Waited a few months, got no response. This was summer 2020. 2. Filed a support ticket basically saying the same thing. I got very prompt responses but of course they were templates -- sorry, 30-day return window has expired, please create FB account, etc. 3. Drafted up the small-claims complaint. This is actually a very easy and short form in California. 4. Sent a courtesy copy of the complaint to Oculus general counsel. This can sometimes get their attention and resolve things right away without involving the courts. No response. 5. Filed the complaint, then served Oculus/FB at their Sacramento address for their registered agent for service of process. This cost something like $100 (filing + service). 6. Got a summer 2021 court date. 7. Sent them another courtesy reminder that the court date was approaching and asked to resolve before trial. 8. In the late spring of 2021 got some activity on the support ticket saying sorry for the delay, please dismiss the case, we'll send you the $$$ plus a box to ship back the goggles. 9. I accepted their offer, shipped the stuff back, got the $$$, and filed a dismissal of the case. Total wall clock time > 1 year. Actual human time on the case probably 5 hours. Out of pocket expenses about $100, which I added to the settlement demand, and which they paid. So I ended up back where I started before the Oculus Quest purchase, except for the time I lost writing the court papers and support/legal communications. Which is what I wanted and expected. As I hope you can tell, I wasn't angry or out for revenge. I just didn't want the FB account requirement, and I especially didn't like that they tried to change the contract terms after we had a deal. It was just a business deal to me, and that takes pretty much all the emotion out of it, which can make many legal cases easier to resolve.
vegetish 5y ago
"Here, have a sense of freedom. Something Apple will never give you."
Cromation 5y ago
Wouldnt trust them. I'd follow the hack recently put out that gave you access without needing an account. Only thing you lose is access to their social media related functions if I remember correctly
coding123 5y ago
I prefer no account at all. If you still have an account you don't really own the device outright. You had to agree to some level of things by buying it at a store. Then you have to continually agree to a barrage of ever changing legal requirements. I honestly don't know if I can ever buy a new car, I might have to stick with ICE. At some point even your car might show a screen that says, hey before driving to work, do you agree to the following terms? NO? Then you don't get to go to work. I think we have too many "agreements" and a lot of it is parasitic because they want to sell data about you.
moron4hire 5y ago
The biggest questions (and anxiety) that I have right now is regarding the Oculus for Business (OfB) program. I develop a social VR experience for students of foreign languages. It's an activity we provide in addition to our traditional classroom based instruction. Our students are primarily government employees, in diplomatic, defense, or intelligence roles. When the pandemic hit, we had a huge problem. We needed to pivot our experience away from in-person and figure out a solution to continue development and testing with remote learning. So we built a new teleconferencing feature into the app and started shipping headsets directly to the student. They use them a couple of times for their classes and then ship it back. This pivot also came at the exact same time that we had the first kerfuffle over the Quest 2 requiring a Facebook login, which made it a complete non-starter for organizations like US intelligence agencies. Our product is a WebXR experience, which can technically run on any headset on the market. Any sort of PC tethered devices would mean we would have to also ship a gaming laptop to the students, because we can't count on their PC being powerful enough to run a VR headset at all. That would be significantly more expensive and would overcomplicate the setup for students. We can't ship Pico Neo headsets because their employers are fearful of the Chinese ownership of the company. We can't ship Vive Focus devices because, well, the lenses suck and have made even me, a hardened VR user, sick. The OfB Quest 2s that we have are really the best user experience we can provide right now. With Oculus for Business, the users of the headsets did not need any sort of login whatsoever. It was the best case scenario for us. WebXR nominally keeps us from being platform-locked-in, and the enterprise licensing terms keep our customers happy. I say "nominally", because the only other, realistic option for it right now is PC tethered devices. All of the non-Quest standalones only have an ancient version of Firefox available as a browser. Mozilla laid off all of their VR developers and has not had anyone releasing updates to Firefox Reality in over a year. There are spec changes and defects that they've not kept up with that are significant impediments to continued development. On the other hand, Facebook builds a version of Chromium as the browser on the Quest, that they keep very up to date and have some excellent performance optimizations built in. But Meta is ending new OfB purchases at the end of this year [0]. There is a Quest for Business (QfB) program that they have announced, but it won't be generally available until at least 2023. In an FAQ [1], they talk about options for migration. Migrate the existing OfB headsets to use the consumer Quest 2 software, migrate to QfB "when it becomes available" (starting a closed beta later this year, going to open beta "sometime in 2022"), or continue using OfB (which means no system updates in the near future [2]). What is not clear is what that means regarding headset users being required to have some sort of device login. They say QfB will have "Work accounts" to log in instead of a personal Facebook account. But what, exactly, does that mean? Are these accounts that we can provision per headset, so users can check headsets out of a locker or we can ship to the students and they can just use them? Or will they have to be per-user accounts? I can abide per-headset accounts. Our clients are not going to abide per-actual-user accounts. This has been a frustrating experience, to say the least. I keep hoping Microsoft will wake up one day and realize that waveguide displays are stupid, rip them out of the HoloLens, put in some opaque displays, and give us a standalone VR headset, with a decent browser, that my USG customers can abide. But they aren't listening to me. [0] https://developer.oculus.com/blog/evolving-from-oculus-for-business-to-quest-for-business/ https://developer.oculus.com/blog/evolving-from-oculus-for-b... [1] https://business.oculus.com/faq/ https://business.oculus.com/faq/ [2] OfB devices are currently on v28 of the system software, whereas the consumer SKUs are on v33, which has significant defect fixes and performance improvements. They've stated that v29 will be the last version deployed for OfB, so that's pretty annoying.
AstroDogCatcher 5y ago
Too little, too late.
deleted 5y ago
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kgc 5y ago
To be replaced with Meta account?
74d-fe6-2c6 5y ago
I'm confused. Is this valid as of now? As in ... I can buy an OQ2 and use it without an FB accunt?
spurgu 5y ago
Has anything actually happened since the FB meta promotion/announcement, or is this just speculation about what Mark said?
square_usual 5y ago
That's great, but I've already signed into (and made purchases!) on mine with Facebook, so I think I'll have to stay signed in for the near future :(
- rtcoms 5y ago
  What if you hard reset it ?
  - Shish2k 5y ago
    Hard reset would log you out, but the more significant question is “are my existing purchases tied to my FB account?”
emreb 5y ago
Is sounds like now you will need an Oculus account that is linked to your Meta account which is then linked to your Facebook and Instagram.
- spurgu 5y ago
  I challenge them to link my accounts where I'm not using any real details for the Oculus one (aside from IP address). They're gonna accept the challenge though and I'd be safest not using any FB products at all aside from Oculus. I check FB on average every 2-3 weeks so they could probably make the connection. Loose one, but still.
- zorr 5y ago
  At least now it will become possible to use Oculus without being forced to have a Facebook social media account. Just like it is possible to use Whatsapp without a Facebook identity.
  - GuardianCaveman 5y ago
    This is the big point even if we have to have a meta account we are not at the whim of being suspended from using our headset because of something we said on a separate social media platform
    - ImPostingOnHN 5y ago
      The bigger point is how much of your personal info and psychographic profiling will, one way or another, still make its way to The Company Formerly Known As Facebook, which remains to be seen Do you think they will just ignore those micro-head-movements when they start A/B testing different stuff on screen to figure out the algorithm that is _you_? Who needs a real, physical Westworld? I hear the next version might even track retinal movement. So many useful audience-segmenting and personalized targeting capabilities!
ENOTTY 5y ago
Facebook could just as easily change the policy again. Meh
- chaostheory 5y ago
  I believe EU laws are the main driver for this change. As an aside, the Quest 2 would have been a break away hit, if they didn’t make the FB login a requirement last year though
  - shafyy 5y ago
    It's crazy that they still sold that many, considering that it's not sold in Germany, one of the biggest markets in the world for them.
  - vineyardmike 5y ago
    > I believe EU laws are the main driver for this change. Why?
  - jensensbutton 5y ago
    Was still a breakaway hit.
    - jcpham2 5y ago
      Absolutely a favorite in our household. Regrettable that it requires a Facebook account.
    - chaostheory 5y ago
      By break away hit, I meant more in line with Nintendo Switch sales. I doubt it's even close due to the login requirement. They lost a lot of word of mouth marketing from would-be evangelists. It's near impossible to defend Facebook / Meta. The Facebook login was unnecessary friction since they didn't even take advantage of it from the start. It wasn't until a few months ago when I could even find my friends from Facebook. I do love my Quest 2 though.
peter-m80 5y ago
It now requires a Meta account (jk)
- micromacrofoot 5y ago
  That's exactly what this is. They killed off the Oculus brand and now it's Meta. You will need a Meta account. I'd be surprised if it doesn't use the Facebook auth system with a different skin.
- Uberphallus 5y ago
  You joke but that's literally what I expect.
ta988 5y ago
For me it sounds like they are still requiring a form of login so some sort of oauth. And they probably track you with that anyway.
MrPatan 5y ago
Interesting, I didn't expect mine to unbrick itself.
christophergs 5y ago
I'll pay the extra money and get the valve index just to avoid doing business with FB
- Someone1234 5y ago
  Not wireless, don't care. Glib but true. Wireless Vs. non-wireless is apples vs. oranges, now that I've experienced apples I want apples and Valve is only currently selling oranges. Plus you're comparing a "good enough" $300 device to a superior but cost prohibitive $1K device. I feel like people who compare a Valve Index to a Quest really don't get what makes Quest uniquely good to its audience currently. Nobody is denying that the Index is technologically superior across the board, what I am saying is that the measures we're using are completely different. I consider the Steam Deck a closer comparison than the Index for example.
  - kapp_in_life 5y ago
    Also outside in vs. inside out tracking. Being able to take the Quest from living room to rec room without setting up cameras is a game changer. And if you care about the higher performance you can still tether yourself to a gaming pc.
  - ldehaan 5y ago
    Well let's get some edumacation goin here, you can be wireless. Tracking is night and day on a vive vs. fb trash device. Are you really running around with a vr headset on? No, you mostly stay in one area and usually the same one. My vive pro not only has insanely good tracking. The video is amazing and the tracking, you can't say enough good things about it. Vive costs more because it's that much better. So while I'd buy the facebook trash costs less, that's the only reason to get one. Not even imo, fact.
    - Someone1234 5y ago
      You replied to the wrong post. My post was a response to one comparing the Quest to the Valve Index, whereas your post is seemingly something about Quest Vs. Vive Pro. Although regardless of who you were trying to respond to, comes across likely ruder than you intended just fyi.
supermatt 5y ago
Facebook account will become meta account. Oculus will transition to meta account. There will be no difference.
- YetAnotherNick 5y ago
  Umm, what again is the criticism for crating meta account vs creating oculus account(without fb)? I think at this point whatever fb does it will be criticised?
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- ldehaan 5y ago
  [flagged]
  - lexpar 5y ago
    This is really not a high quality comment.
- loeg 5y ago
  No, this would be an Oculus-specific account. There are enough legitimate criticisms of Facebook that we don't have to go around inventing false ones. Edited to cite the announcement transcript[1]: > And as we’ve focused more on work, and frankly, as we’ve heard your feedback more broadly, we’re on making it so you can log into Quest with an account other than your personal Facebook account. > ... I know this is a big deal for a lot of people. Not everyone wants their social media profile linked to all these other experiences. [1]: https://www.rev.com/blog/transcripts/meta-facebook-connect-2021-metaverse-event-transcript https://www.rev.com/blog/transcripts/meta-facebook-connect-2...
planb 5y ago
> During the recent Facebook outage, certain Oculus devices were effectively rendered useless due to their inability to connect to the larger Facebook platform. It’s unclear if that specific incident is partially to blame for this change. No, it's absolutely clear that this has nothing to do with the outage. WhatsApp and Instagram were down too. Their infrastructure does not care if the parent corp is called Facebook or Meta.
stevespang 5y ago
Zuck going "all in" with VR headsets and FacePlant.
someperson 5y ago
Great news! Mandatory Facebook account was a massive "own goal". I can't believe it took this long for the policy to be reversed. The damage to Oculus among enthusiasts was huge. But I guess the Oculus brand is going away anyway leaving just 'Meta' and 'Quest'.
throwaway123x2 5y ago
Would anyone recommend the Oculus Quest for getting exercise? This might be what pushed me to get it.
- GuardianCaveman 5y ago
  I haven’t used it for that purpose but I follow Alanah Pearce and she swears by it for helping her drop weight after she gained a bunch because of an injury. I’ve heard a few other anecdotes about the app she used helping others too called supernatural. Also the boxing ones too.
- mrfinn 5y ago
  Quest 2 owner here, "The thrill of the fight" has been my most amazing related discovery. Just 20 minutes playing before shower and you'll be sweating like there's no tomorrow. First days, if not already in gym, you are gonna feel for sure the aches.
- shafyy 5y ago
  Yes, for sure. Much more fun than going to the gym or doing boring exercises at home. Main use would be cardio and stuff like squats etc, not weight lifting. Although Carmack said (in his FB Connect keynote yesterday) that they will soon be fitness apps that incorporate weights as well.
  - randoglando 5y ago
    Carmack said (although he wouldn't recommend it due to safety concerns etc.) that he ties arm weights while playing Beat Saber!
- ilarum 5y ago
  Yes, I recommend it. Beat Saber and Thrill of the Fight are great.
- crakhamster01 5y ago
  Supernatural is a blast - if I had more space in my cramped apartment I'd be playing it daily.
fartcannon 5y ago
How many frogs will fall for the scorpions plan?
- tempodox 5y ago
  We know the answer to that: Billions.
willis936 5y ago
It begs the question: if they host the social media account and VR account and can reliably identify / link them on their end, and the laws and terms allow them to do so, does it really matter if they’re different accounts? It's still a win if you don't have a facebook account. For everyone else: I would assume that they will identify your accounts reliably.
- Mindwipe 5y ago
  It seems like it is better in that the arbitrary suspension of your Facebook account for moderation purposes (which is, due to how moderation at scale with machine learning just doesn't work, inherently random) won't cause you to lose access to your Oculus content and paid media. It's not a total win, probably, but part of the issue is that it's very unclear if you can have multiple redundant Meta accounts, what the ID requirements are for Meta accounts, what the process for appealing against moderation decisions for Meta accounts are, and what the terms of use for Meta accounts are.
- KaiserPro 5y ago
  They are explicitly banned from "soft matching" account now, by germany of all places. I suspect that what they are planning to do is to allow thirdparty authentication for "professional" VR devices.
- chaostheory 5y ago
  If they would have just stuck to this strategy, there would have been a lot less drama around the Quest 2 and more sales.
- GuardianCaveman 5y ago
  I guess it depends on what you’re worried about so if it’s identification and targeted ads you’re probably right but I was just worried about losing access if I close or get banned or something from my Facebook account for whatever reason.
- ComodoHacker 5y ago
  > does it really matter if they’re different accounts? Yes. If you lose access to one, you can keep the other.
chadlavi 5y ago
In the future: "good news! Your oculus, Instagram, WhatsApp and Facebook accounts are all merging into a single Meta account later this month"
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melvinmt 5y ago
Oculus will also no longer be known as Oculus: https://techcrunch.com/2021/10/28/facebook-errr-meta-unceremoniously-kills-off-oculus-brand/ https://techcrunch.com/2021/10/28/facebook-errr-meta-uncerem...
- micromacrofoot 5y ago
  So it sounds like they did some focus groups and figured out that no one wanted a "Facebook Quest"
- mrfinn 5y ago
  Terrible decision, Oculus is a well known brand, the name is catchy, it has good reputation. So, Facebook decides, let's kill off the brand and replace it with. something completely unknown!
nixpulvis 5y ago
I haven't been following this closely, but what's the state of this ridiculous requirement on the Rift S?
newhouseb 5y ago
Mark's statement was worded carefully in that he stated access would not longer require your _personal_ Facebook account. I interpreted this to mean you'll still need a Facebook account, but it would be through a Facebook for Work account (although I'm not sure if today these are distinct entities).
- snarf21 5y ago
  I assumed that you would be able to have a new Oculus only account. However, all you really have is an Oculus (by Hatebook) account. They promised to keep IG and WA separate too, so this is a bit of "Hey regulator, no it is a different account" non-sense signaling.
- hellweaver666 5y ago
  nah, they'll create a new single sign on service for Meta and you'll be required to have a Meta account (and Facebook and Instagram and WhatsApp will all also require a Meta account).
  - whywhywhywhy 5y ago
    This is the real answer, your shadow profile will become your public profile. No more pretending your IG and WhatsApp are siloed. More just instead of a star with each on a spoke and FB in the middle, Meta will be in the middle and FB just another spoke.
- AlexandrB 5y ago
  Yeah. This article seems to be jumping to conclusions based on a vague statement sandwiched between a bunch of PR claptrap about "hearing feedback". The actual statement could mean anything from the return of standalone Oculus accounts to just unifying SSO under a "Meta" account instead of a "Facebook" one. The only concrete detail was support for Facebook "work" accounts for logging into Oculus. > and frankly, as we've heard your feedback more broadly, we're working on making it so you can log into Quest with an account other than your personal Facebook account. We're starting to test support for work accounts soon, and we're working on making a broader shift here within the next year. I know this is a big deal for a lot of people. Not everyone wants their social media profile linked to all these other experiences and I get that, especially as the metaverse expands.

384 points by simonjgreen 5y ago

Can I migrate my purchases over and get rid of my extra Faceborg account, then? I don’t like the threat of getting banned and losing all my purchases hovering over my head constantly

bastardoperator 5y ago

Wake me up when the resolution isn't garbage. I have two Oculus kits collecting dust due to facebook and the fact that looking at my monitor is still a more pleasurable experience.

Cromation 5y ago
Isnt there a hack out there that removes the facebook account requirement?

morjom 5y ago

Any idea if this applies to other sets like the CV1 or Rift S?

2pEXgD0fZ5cF 5y ago

Oculus won't require an account? Where have I heard that one before... This is just another attempt at being clever (and dishonest), isn't it? "Sure we said it won't require a FACEBOOK account, but Meta is something totally different and <insert more marketing sentences>. And because of that, a Meta account is required."

mupuff1234 5y ago

Only to add it later on once they capture enough additional users.

deltron3030 5y ago
The sunken cost strategy.

mawise 5y ago

Owner of a Quest 1, so I've never linked to FB, but that's also locked me.out of Venues (which was how they broadcast Connect in VR). Any speculation on whether Venues will still require a FB account?

zzzeek 5y ago

im sure the ongoing FTC investigations have nothing to do with this

gregjw 5y ago

Shouldn't have been implemented in the first place.

KingOfCoders 5y ago

I will be a Meta account in the future.

ldehaan 5y ago

Ohsnap am I gonna get my kids one now? No. Hell no. Facebook Is Trash, I'll never give a cent to them on purpose and do my damndest to bring it down, put it down, throw Facebook away whenever I get a chance to educate someone. Im getting the G2 headset baby! If you want to Easily make the world a better place, never give Facebook your money. You don't need to join Greenpeace or sort recycling, just Get Rid Of Facebook.

smoldesu 5y ago
Yeah, all those poor people who can't afford ethical headsets can go fuck themselves! I'm getting a fully loaded headset with all my money, I simply can't imagine being unfortunate enough to get locked out of the Metaverse!

pitched 5y ago

I have an old grandfathered Oculus account and haven’t upgraded to Quest 2 because I don’t want to link my Facebook. If this ends up being true, they’ve made at least one extra sale.

senectus1 5y ago
if its true i'll buy them for my kids xmas pressies.

spywaregorilla 5y ago

Meta's pulling out for a bit while it finds a bigger strap on.

sowbug 5y ago

Glad to hear about this. I sued Facebook in a California small-claims court to rescind my purchase of the Quest 1 (and all accessories and game purchases) after I declined the change in ToS adding the FB account requirement. It took a while (negotiated with their customer support, then sued, then finally months later got an intelligent response), but we settled for what I asked for. I can't be the only one who got my money back. I liked the product except for the added account requirement, and I would now consider buying again.

schaefer 5y ago
You are my hero.
djbusby 5y ago
Curious how much time you spent and total time to resolve. Can you share?
- sowbug 5y ago
  I used to practice law, so the process is a little more natural for me. Summary: 1. I read the terms of service that I originally agreed to. Found a requirement to first negotiate any dispute with their general counsel in good faith. So I wrote to them explaining that I declined the change in ToS terms, and asked for a refund of everything I'd purchased in connection with the headset, plus the dollar amount that it added up to. Sent by registered mail. Waited a few months, got no response. This was summer 2020. 2. Filed a support ticket basically saying the same thing. I got very prompt responses but of course they were templates -- sorry, 30-day return window has expired, please create FB account, etc. 3. Drafted up the small-claims complaint. This is actually a very easy and short form in California. 4. Sent a courtesy copy of the complaint to Oculus general counsel. This can sometimes get their attention and resolve things right away without involving the courts. No response. 5. Filed the complaint, then served Oculus/FB at their Sacramento address for their registered agent for service of process. This cost something like $100 (filing + service). 6. Got a summer 2021 court date. 7. Sent them another courtesy reminder that the court date was approaching and asked to resolve before trial. 8. In the late spring of 2021 got some activity on the support ticket saying sorry for the delay, please dismiss the case, we'll send you the $$$ plus a box to ship back the goggles. 9. I accepted their offer, shipped the stuff back, got the $$$, and filed a dismissal of the case. Total wall clock time > 1 year. Actual human time on the case probably 5 hours. Out of pocket expenses about $100, which I added to the settlement demand, and which they paid. So I ended up back where I started before the Oculus Quest purchase, except for the time I lost writing the court papers and support/legal communications. Which is what I wanted and expected. As I hope you can tell, I wasn't angry or out for revenge. I just didn't want the FB account requirement, and I especially didn't like that they tried to change the contract terms after we had a deal. It was just a business deal to me, and that takes pretty much all the emotion out of it, which can make many legal cases easier to resolve.

vegetish 5y ago

"Here, have a sense of freedom. Something Apple will never give you."

Cromation 5y ago

Wouldnt trust them. I'd follow the hack recently put out that gave you access without needing an account. Only thing you lose is access to their social media related functions if I remember correctly

coding123 5y ago

I prefer no account at all. If you still have an account you don't really own the device outright. You had to agree to some level of things by buying it at a store. Then you have to continually agree to a barrage of ever changing legal requirements. I honestly don't know if I can ever buy a new car, I might have to stick with ICE. At some point even your car might show a screen that says, hey before driving to work, do you agree to the following terms? NO? Then you don't get to go to work. I think we have too many "agreements" and a lot of it is parasitic because they want to sell data about you.

moron4hire 5y ago

The biggest questions (and anxiety) that I have right now is regarding the Oculus for Business (OfB) program. I develop a social VR experience for students of foreign languages. It's an activity we provide in addition to our traditional classroom based instruction. Our students are primarily government employees, in diplomatic, defense, or intelligence roles. When the pandemic hit, we had a huge problem. We needed to pivot our experience away from in-person and figure out a solution to continue development and testing with remote learning. So we built a new teleconferencing feature into the app and started shipping headsets directly to the student. They use them a couple of times for their classes and then ship it back. This pivot also came at the exact same time that we had the first kerfuffle over the Quest 2 requiring a Facebook login, which made it a complete non-starter for organizations like US intelligence agencies. Our product is a WebXR experience, which can technically run on any headset on the market. Any sort of PC tethered devices would mean we would have to also ship a gaming laptop to the students, because we can't count on their PC being powerful enough to run a VR headset at all. That would be significantly more expensive and would overcomplicate the setup for students. We can't ship Pico Neo headsets because their employers are fearful of the Chinese ownership of the company. We can't ship Vive Focus devices because, well, the lenses suck and have made even me, a hardened VR user, sick. The OfB Quest 2s that we have are really the best user experience we can provide right now. With Oculus for Business, the users of the headsets did not need any sort of login whatsoever. It was the best case scenario for us. WebXR nominally keeps us from being platform-locked-in, and the enterprise licensing terms keep our customers happy. I say "nominally", because the only other, realistic option for it right now is PC tethered devices. All of the non-Quest standalones only have an ancient version of Firefox available as a browser. Mozilla laid off all of their VR developers and has not had anyone releasing updates to Firefox Reality in over a year. There are spec changes and defects that they've not kept up with that are significant impediments to continued development. On the other hand, Facebook builds a version of Chromium as the browser on the Quest, that they keep very up to date and have some excellent performance optimizations built in. But Meta is ending new OfB purchases at the end of this year [0]. There is a Quest for Business (QfB) program that they have announced, but it won't be generally available until at least 2023. In an FAQ [1], they talk about options for migration. Migrate the existing OfB headsets to use the consumer Quest 2 software, migrate to QfB "when it becomes available" (starting a closed beta later this year, going to open beta "sometime in 2022"), or continue using OfB (which means no system updates in the near future [2]). What is not clear is what that means regarding headset users being required to have some sort of device login. They say QfB will have "Work accounts" to log in instead of a personal Facebook account. But what, exactly, does that mean? Are these accounts that we can provision per headset, so users can check headsets out of a locker or we can ship to the students and they can just use them? Or will they have to be per-user accounts? I can abide per-headset accounts. Our clients are not going to abide per-actual-user accounts. This has been a frustrating experience, to say the least. I keep hoping Microsoft will wake up one day and realize that waveguide displays are stupid, rip them out of the HoloLens, put in some opaque displays, and give us a standalone VR headset, with a decent browser, that my USG customers can abide. But they aren't listening to me. [0] https://developer.oculus.com/blog/evolving-from-oculus-for-business-to-quest-for-business/ https://developer.oculus.com/blog/evolving-from-oculus-for-b... [1] https://business.oculus.com/faq/ https://business.oculus.com/faq/ [2] OfB devices are currently on v28 of the system software, whereas the consumer SKUs are on v33, which has significant defect fixes and performance improvements. They've stated that v29 will be the last version deployed for OfB, so that's pretty annoying.

AstroDogCatcher 5y ago

Too little, too late.

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kgc 5y ago

To be replaced with Meta account?

74d-fe6-2c6 5y ago

I'm confused. Is this valid as of now? As in ... I can buy an OQ2 and use it without an FB accunt?

spurgu 5y ago

Has anything actually happened since the FB meta promotion/announcement, or is this just speculation about what Mark said?

square_usual 5y ago

That's great, but I've already signed into (and made purchases!) on mine with Facebook, so I think I'll have to stay signed in for the near future :(

rtcoms 5y ago
What if you hard reset it ?
- Shish2k 5y ago
  Hard reset would log you out, but the more significant question is “are my existing purchases tied to my FB account?”

emreb 5y ago

Is sounds like now you will need an Oculus account that is linked to your Meta account which is then linked to your Facebook and Instagram.

spurgu 5y ago
I challenge them to link my accounts where I'm not using any real details for the Oculus one (aside from IP address). They're gonna accept the challenge though and I'd be safest not using any FB products at all aside from Oculus. I check FB on average every 2-3 weeks so they could probably make the connection. Loose one, but still.
zorr 5y ago
At least now it will become possible to use Oculus without being forced to have a Facebook social media account. Just like it is possible to use Whatsapp without a Facebook identity.
- GuardianCaveman 5y ago
  This is the big point even if we have to have a meta account we are not at the whim of being suspended from using our headset because of something we said on a separate social media platform
  - ImPostingOnHN 5y ago
    The bigger point is how much of your personal info and psychographic profiling will, one way or another, still make its way to The Company Formerly Known As Facebook, which remains to be seen Do you think they will just ignore those micro-head-movements when they start A/B testing different stuff on screen to figure out the algorithm that is _you_? Who needs a real, physical Westworld? I hear the next version might even track retinal movement. So many useful audience-segmenting and personalized targeting capabilities!

ENOTTY 5y ago

Facebook could just as easily change the policy again. Meh

chaostheory 5y ago
I believe EU laws are the main driver for this change. As an aside, the Quest 2 would have been a break away hit, if they didn’t make the FB login a requirement last year though
- shafyy 5y ago
  It's crazy that they still sold that many, considering that it's not sold in Germany, one of the biggest markets in the world for them.
- vineyardmike 5y ago
  > I believe EU laws are the main driver for this change. Why?
- jensensbutton 5y ago
  Was still a breakaway hit.
  - jcpham2 5y ago
    Absolutely a favorite in our household. Regrettable that it requires a Facebook account.
  - chaostheory 5y ago
    By break away hit, I meant more in line with Nintendo Switch sales. I doubt it's even close due to the login requirement. They lost a lot of word of mouth marketing from would-be evangelists. It's near impossible to defend Facebook / Meta. The Facebook login was unnecessary friction since they didn't even take advantage of it from the start. It wasn't until a few months ago when I could even find my friends from Facebook. I do love my Quest 2 though.

peter-m80 5y ago

It now requires a Meta account (jk)

micromacrofoot 5y ago
That's exactly what this is. They killed off the Oculus brand and now it's Meta. You will need a Meta account. I'd be surprised if it doesn't use the Facebook auth system with a different skin.
Uberphallus 5y ago
You joke but that's literally what I expect.

ta988 5y ago

For me it sounds like they are still requiring a form of login so some sort of oauth. And they probably track you with that anyway.

MrPatan 5y ago

Interesting, I didn't expect mine to unbrick itself.

christophergs 5y ago

I'll pay the extra money and get the valve index just to avoid doing business with FB

Someone1234 5y ago
Not wireless, don't care. Glib but true. Wireless Vs. non-wireless is apples vs. oranges, now that I've experienced apples I want apples and Valve is only currently selling oranges. Plus you're comparing a "good enough" $300 device to a superior but cost prohibitive $1K device. I feel like people who compare a Valve Index to a Quest really don't get what makes Quest uniquely good to its audience currently. Nobody is denying that the Index is technologically superior across the board, what I am saying is that the measures we're using are completely different. I consider the Steam Deck a closer comparison than the Index for example.
- kapp_in_life 5y ago
  Also outside in vs. inside out tracking. Being able to take the Quest from living room to rec room without setting up cameras is a game changer. And if you care about the higher performance you can still tether yourself to a gaming pc.
- ldehaan 5y ago
  Well let's get some edumacation goin here, you can be wireless. Tracking is night and day on a vive vs. fb trash device. Are you really running around with a vr headset on? No, you mostly stay in one area and usually the same one. My vive pro not only has insanely good tracking. The video is amazing and the tracking, you can't say enough good things about it. Vive costs more because it's that much better. So while I'd buy the facebook trash costs less, that's the only reason to get one. Not even imo, fact.
  - Someone1234 5y ago
    You replied to the wrong post. My post was a response to one comparing the Quest to the Valve Index, whereas your post is seemingly something about Quest Vs. Vive Pro. Although regardless of who you were trying to respond to, comes across likely ruder than you intended just fyi.

supermatt 5y ago

Facebook account will become meta account. Oculus will transition to meta account. There will be no difference.

YetAnotherNick 5y ago
Umm, what again is the criticism for crating meta account vs creating oculus account(without fb)? I think at this point whatever fb does it will be criticised?
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- lexpar 5y ago
  This is really not a high quality comment.
loeg 5y ago
No, this would be an Oculus-specific account. There are enough legitimate criticisms of Facebook that we don't have to go around inventing false ones. Edited to cite the announcement transcript[1]: > And as we’ve focused more on work, and frankly, as we’ve heard your feedback more broadly, we’re on making it so you can log into Quest with an account other than your personal Facebook account. > ... I know this is a big deal for a lot of people. Not everyone wants their social media profile linked to all these other experiences. [1]: https://www.rev.com/blog/transcripts/meta-facebook-connect-2021-metaverse-event-transcript https://www.rev.com/blog/transcripts/meta-facebook-connect-2...

planb 5y ago

> During the recent Facebook outage, certain Oculus devices were effectively rendered useless due to their inability to connect to the larger Facebook platform. It’s unclear if that specific incident is partially to blame for this change. No, it's absolutely clear that this has nothing to do with the outage. WhatsApp and Instagram were down too. Their infrastructure does not care if the parent corp is called Facebook or Meta.

stevespang 5y ago

Zuck going "all in" with VR headsets and FacePlant.

someperson 5y ago

Great news! Mandatory Facebook account was a massive "own goal". I can't believe it took this long for the policy to be reversed. The damage to Oculus among enthusiasts was huge. But I guess the Oculus brand is going away anyway leaving just 'Meta' and 'Quest'.

throwaway123x2 5y ago

Would anyone recommend the Oculus Quest for getting exercise? This might be what pushed me to get it.

GuardianCaveman 5y ago
I haven’t used it for that purpose but I follow Alanah Pearce and she swears by it for helping her drop weight after she gained a bunch because of an injury. I’ve heard a few other anecdotes about the app she used helping others too called supernatural. Also the boxing ones too.
mrfinn 5y ago
Quest 2 owner here, "The thrill of the fight" has been my most amazing related discovery. Just 20 minutes playing before shower and you'll be sweating like there's no tomorrow. First days, if not already in gym, you are gonna feel for sure the aches.
shafyy 5y ago
Yes, for sure. Much more fun than going to the gym or doing boring exercises at home. Main use would be cardio and stuff like squats etc, not weight lifting. Although Carmack said (in his FB Connect keynote yesterday) that they will soon be fitness apps that incorporate weights as well.
- randoglando 5y ago
  Carmack said (although he wouldn't recommend it due to safety concerns etc.) that he ties arm weights while playing Beat Saber!
ilarum 5y ago
Yes, I recommend it. Beat Saber and Thrill of the Fight are great.
crakhamster01 5y ago
Supernatural is a blast - if I had more space in my cramped apartment I'd be playing it daily.

fartcannon 5y ago

How many frogs will fall for the scorpions plan?

tempodox 5y ago
We know the answer to that: Billions.

willis936 5y ago

It begs the question: if they host the social media account and VR account and can reliably identify / link them on their end, and the laws and terms allow them to do so, does it really matter if they’re different accounts? It's still a win if you don't have a facebook account. For everyone else: I would assume that they will identify your accounts reliably.

Mindwipe 5y ago
It seems like it is better in that the arbitrary suspension of your Facebook account for moderation purposes (which is, due to how moderation at scale with machine learning just doesn't work, inherently random) won't cause you to lose access to your Oculus content and paid media. It's not a total win, probably, but part of the issue is that it's very unclear if you can have multiple redundant Meta accounts, what the ID requirements are for Meta accounts, what the process for appealing against moderation decisions for Meta accounts are, and what the terms of use for Meta accounts are.
KaiserPro 5y ago
They are explicitly banned from "soft matching" account now, by germany of all places. I suspect that what they are planning to do is to allow thirdparty authentication for "professional" VR devices.
chaostheory 5y ago
If they would have just stuck to this strategy, there would have been a lot less drama around the Quest 2 and more sales.
GuardianCaveman 5y ago
I guess it depends on what you’re worried about so if it’s identification and targeted ads you’re probably right but I was just worried about losing access if I close or get banned or something from my Facebook account for whatever reason.
ComodoHacker 5y ago
> does it really matter if they’re different accounts? Yes. If you lose access to one, you can keep the other.

chadlavi 5y ago

In the future: "good news! Your oculus, Instagram, WhatsApp and Facebook accounts are all merging into a single Meta account later this month"

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melvinmt 5y ago

Oculus will also no longer be known as Oculus: https://techcrunch.com/2021/10/28/facebook-errr-meta-unceremoniously-kills-off-oculus-brand/ https://techcrunch.com/2021/10/28/facebook-errr-meta-uncerem...

micromacrofoot 5y ago
So it sounds like they did some focus groups and figured out that no one wanted a "Facebook Quest"
mrfinn 5y ago
Terrible decision, Oculus is a well known brand, the name is catchy, it has good reputation. So, Facebook decides, let's kill off the brand and replace it with. something completely unknown!

nixpulvis 5y ago

I haven't been following this closely, but what's the state of this ridiculous requirement on the Rift S?

newhouseb 5y ago

Mark's statement was worded carefully in that he stated access would not longer require your _personal_ Facebook account. I interpreted this to mean you'll still need a Facebook account, but it would be through a Facebook for Work account (although I'm not sure if today these are distinct entities).

snarf21 5y ago
I assumed that you would be able to have a new Oculus only account. However, all you really have is an Oculus (by Hatebook) account. They promised to keep IG and WA separate too, so this is a bit of "Hey regulator, no it is a different account" non-sense signaling.
hellweaver666 5y ago
nah, they'll create a new single sign on service for Meta and you'll be required to have a Meta account (and Facebook and Instagram and WhatsApp will all also require a Meta account).
- whywhywhywhy 5y ago
  This is the real answer, your shadow profile will become your public profile. No more pretending your IG and WhatsApp are siloed. More just instead of a star with each on a spoke and FB in the middle, Meta will be in the middle and FB just another spoke.
AlexandrB 5y ago
Yeah. This article seems to be jumping to conclusions based on a vague statement sandwiched between a bunch of PR claptrap about "hearing feedback". The actual statement could mean anything from the return of standalone Oculus accounts to just unifying SSO under a "Meta" account instead of a "Facebook" one. The only concrete detail was support for Facebook "work" accounts for logging into Oculus. > and frankly, as we've heard your feedback more broadly, we're working on making it so you can log into Quest with an account other than your personal Facebook account. We're starting to test support for work accounts soon, and we're working on making a broader shift here within the next year. I know this is a big deal for a lot of people. Not everyone wants their social media profile linked to all these other experiences and I get that, especially as the metaverse expands.