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Hacker News in the Style of Teletext

283 points by codetrotter 5y ago

_Nat_ 5y ago
Sounds like Teletext was basically a digital-magazine protocol. This is, a TV-station would continuously broadcast the latest Teletext-magazine for Teletext-clients to cache. Then users could view articles from their local cache. Reference: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teletext https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teletext EDIT: Apparently most implementations wouldn't cache something until the user requested it, then the user would wait until the next send.
- syntaxfree 5y ago
  https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Publish%E2%80%93subscribe_pattern https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Publish%E2%80%93subscribe_pa...
  - anthk 5y ago
    Not the same. Teletext' content was on the signal and it changed daily. That's it, a continous stream. There was no stored data.
- anthk 5y ago
  Teletext was like a newspaper sent on vblank cycles. You also had a reveal button in order to show some puzzle games'/riddles' solution.
- qsi 5y ago
  IIRC the more "modern" TVs did have some sort of cache for Teletext pages, but my memory is definitely hazy...
  - timthorn 5y ago
    Yes, it tended to be branded FastText
- rahoulb 5y ago
  Some TVs would show you which page was currently being sent in addition to the page number you were currently viewing. It went up sequentially, starting at 100 (which was the "home page"). That way you could time typing in the number (I remember on Ceefax 601 was the TV listings for BBC1) - say when it was at around 540 - and then you wouldn't have to wait so long for the page to "load". Most pages had multiple "sub-pages" - so the BBC TV listing would start in the morning, as 1/5 - then on each refresh, it would show 2/5, 3/5 etc. If you really wanted to study a particular page before it would reload, there was often a "Hold" button that paused the refreshes. Then, when you "un-held" it would jump to whichever page was sent on the next update. Watching the scores on a Saturday afternoon, updating across the various leagues, was a ritual for every football fan. (Maybe page 302 for football scores?) Bamboozle was page 451 on Channel 4 - everyone loved that.
  - davepm 5y ago
    holy crap, thanks for the memories! I remember bamboozle, and also, I think on Channel 4, the "Tea Time Quiz", where you had to answer a question and be the first to phone in the correct answer, I remember winning on a couple of occasions!
codetrotter 5y ago
Was browsing the #hackernews tag on GitHub and came across this.
- mindcrime 5y ago
  Next up, #teletext! https://github.com/topics/teletext https://github.com/topics/teletext
felixrieseberg 5y ago
It's cute. Well done!
dorkwood 5y ago
Discovering that my TV had teletext as a kid was definitely one of my first "hacker" moments. I can remember enjoying the fact that I, a small child, knew all of the day's news events before my parents did.
peanut_worm 5y ago
I am too young to have lived while teletext was a thing. I had no idea there was something like the internet before the internet.
- TrackerFF 5y ago
  Not sure how old you are, but at least here in Norway, people still use it. Though I myself haven't used it in probably 15 years. Pr. Wikipedia, in 2015 9% of the Norwegian population used teletext. In 2017, that number had reduced to 7.5% - I suspect those are mostly old folks. But to be fair, it was incredibly handy to look up specific things fast. If you wanted sports / betting results, TV-program, currencies, or whatever, you probably had memorized the page number. (The Norwegian Teletext, or "Text TV" as it's called here: https://www.nrk.no/tekst-tv/100/ https://www.nrk.no/tekst-tv/100/)
- wrs 5y ago
  There were lots of things like the Internet (in this sense) before the Internet. Go look at Genie, Prodigy, America Online, the Well, BBS systems, and many more. All centralized systems that were displaced by the decentralized Internet, which has since become much more centralized.
  - qsi 5y ago
    Obligatory mention of [1] Minitel. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minitel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minitel
    - anthk 5y ago
      People have been repurposing Minitels with some resistors and a wire to create "cheap" vt100 compatible terminals. https://spectrum.ieee.org/geek-life/hands-on/from-trash-to-treasure-how-to-resurrect-a-minitel-terminal https://spectrum.ieee.org/geek-life/hands-on/from-trash-to-t...
  - Someone 5y ago
    1967: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypertext_Editing_System https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypertext_Editing_System was internet in some sense, too, even though it was centralized and, one might say, not even ‘net’, let alone internet. A year later, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File_Retrieval_and_Editing_System https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File_Retrieval_and_Editing_Sys... got a bit more ‘net’ (https://www.brown.edu/news/2016-05-23/hypertext https://www.brown.edu/news/2016-05-23/hypertext has a movie about it that is worth watching but unfortunately doesn’t show how it worked). At least, it supported multiple terminal types. That page also claims “FRESS still runs on the current Brown mainframe.” Iet would be amazing if that were true. Software that’s over 50 years old.
mastazi 5y ago
Edit: I just figured it out, you have to use the numbers in the main area of the keyboard, not the ones in the numeric keypad. Does it work for you? I type numbers but nothing happens
- moonbug 5y ago
  press NumLock.
  - djmips 5y ago
    No that very obvious advice does not work.
  - mastazi 5y ago
    Obviously I did.
smoe 5y ago
I recently discovered, that my parents still use teletext today. Because it is a quick, no nonsense, easily readable way to check some high level news or weather forecasts. And since it hasn't really changed in decades, they can just pull up the right pages from memory. Whereas I wasn't even aware it still existed. Certainly brings back childhood memories. You can even use it in the browser: https://www.teletext.ch https://www.teletext.ch
- AnssiH 5y ago
  Still active in Finland as well: YLE: https://yle.fi/aihe/tekstitv https://yle.fi/aihe/tekstitv MTV (not the American one): https://www.mtvtekstikanava.fi/ https://www.mtvtekstikanava.fi/ Some people use them via phone apps as they tend to be faster and cleaner than webpages to check e.g. sports results. E.g. aText-TV (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.harjuconsulting.texttv https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.harjuconsu...) has many channels from a dozen countries.
  - lmas 5y ago
    Huh had to check and realized Sweden is still running it too: SVT https://www.svt.se/text-tv/100 https://www.svt.se/text-tv/100 What's the more common name of it? Most of europe seems to call it Text TV instead of Teletext?
    - ochrist 5y ago
      Same in Denmark: https://www.dr.dk/cgi-bin/fttx1.exe/100 https://www.dr.dk/cgi-bin/fttx1.exe/100
- ragebol 5y ago
  The Dutch Teletekst has a Twitter account where it posts images: https://twitter.com/Teletekst/ https://twitter.com/Teletekst/ Indeed great for no-nonsense news.
- mro_name 5y ago
  > quick, no nonsense, easily readable so that's what follows website obesity crisis.
mikeodds 5y ago
There used to be a game on Teletext in the UK called Bamboozle. Turns out someone has recreated it in browser. http://www.digitextsim.com/452/ http://www.digitextsim.com/452/
- sedatk 5y ago
  I used to do the same in my brother's house in the 80's where there was no computer, so I'd just pretend that the TV was a computer, and the screens were programs. Spent hours on it.
- jl6 5y ago
  Zombie Dave says thrrrrrrrs ssssssss brlllllllll, hvvvvvv rrrrrrn rrrrrrrpvrrrrrrt.
sen 5y ago
Great nostalgia hit, I used to spend so much time exploring teletext as a kid, and playing the text games. It was such a great system.
RedShift1 5y ago
Teletext helped learn me English, I always turned on subtitles whenever I was watching BBC.
ssimpson 5y ago
Thank you! I lived in the Netherlands for a short time ('92-93) as a kid and I always thought teletext was so cool!
aazaa 5y ago
Ah, this explains why don't remember seeing Teletext: > Adoption in the United States was hampered due to a lack of a single Teletext standard and consumer resistance to the high initial price of Teletext decoders. Throughout the period of analog broadcasting, Teletext or other similar technologies in the US were practically non-existent, with the only technologies resembling such existing in the country being closed captioning, TV Guide On Screen, and Extended Data Services (XDS). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teletext https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teletext
- joezydeco 5y ago
  In the 1980s the company that owned the Chicago Sun-Times, Field Communications, tried to bootstrap Teletext (the BBC's "CeeFax" branded as "KeyFax") in the USA. Their plan involved broadcasting read-only teletext on their company-owned UHF station after normal broadcasting hours. Take a loving gander: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVpUSaUMgbY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVpUSaUMgbY
  - _Nat_ 5y ago
    Just skimming the Wikipedia page, it sounds like almost all Teletext was read-only, which the entire protocol was designed around. But since you stressed their plans being "read-only", was there something else to it?
    - zapzupnz 5y ago
      Read-only as in KeyFax was literally a broadcast image of Teletext, rather than actual Teletext. That way, people without a compatible set or decoder (everybody) could watch it. That had the knock-on effect of users not being able to call up a page at will; they had to wait until it was broadcast.
    - iso1631 5y ago
      Normal teletext you select a page (typically a 3 digit number from 100 to 999, although hexadecimal pages also existed) Your decoder would then look at the vertical blanking lines with the data on, and wait for the page to match the one you selected. This could be fast (typically pages like 100 would be broadcast every second or so), or slow (page 693 might be sent once every 15 seconds) The decoder would then show it. The decoder would only need a 1 page memory. "Read only" teletext didn't include a decoder at all, it was the output of a decoder at the TV station which was sent via normal UHF means, typically with background music. As memory got cheaper, "Fast Text" was introduced, each page would have shortcuts to 4 more pages (red, green, yellow, blue). These would then be stored in the background when they were broadcast, so the decoder needed 5 pages of memory, but the experience of the user was much better as there was less waiting for the next page they'd usually want. This also allowed "hidden" pages like "35F" to be used. Towards the end of analog programming, teletext brought in on a PC capture card was stored and decoded by your media player. Computers obviously had enough memory to store every page so response was instant.
ElCapitanMarkla 5y ago
This is great. Brings back memories of when I used to go to grandads house in the early-mid 90s and play with his teletext tv.
disabled 5y ago
This is great! Just FYI I use Teletext daily! It's great and is still used here in Croatia (we even have a Croatian Radio Television teletext app for iOS and Android!). If you want to check out the service here it is: https://teletekst.hrt.hr/100-01.HTML https://teletekst.hrt.hr/100-01.HTML Also, just FYI, browsing the internet using a text browser is awesome! Try Lynx or something similar. Also get such an app for iOS|Android to read stuff! It changes the whole internet experience for the better!
- Scoundreller 5y ago
  Any iOS recommendations? Still know how to use lynx (great for getting around paywalls and getting rid of all the junk).
  - disabled 5y ago
    Violoncello for iOS: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/violoncello/id1568931107 https://apps.apple.com/us/app/violoncello/id1568931107 Violoncello for Android: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.tectrasystems.violoncello&hl=en_US&gl=US https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.tectrasyst...
    - MrJagil 5y ago
      Just tested HN, and it doesn’t look good, sadly
- anthk 5y ago
  >Try Lynx or something similar. - Links (faster), lynx (delays), retawq (needs a little patch, but it flies on a toaster), w3m, elinks. Also, Gopher, gopher revival is the "new" teletext :D. EDIT: in a similar vein: gopher://magical.fish gopher://mozz.us gopher://hngopher.com https://lite.cnn.io https://lite.cnn.io https://text.npr.org https://text.npr.org These will show up better in a text browser than in a graphical one. I tried them under retawq/links/lynx and everything it's crystal clear-readable and usable.
  - 5y ago
hackmiester 5y ago
If it doesn't work, you may have to open it without using a Private Browsing window.
albertkoz 5y ago
Teletext is still popular in the some European countries. e.g. in prisons to send one way messages from families. For small amount of money you can buy an ad in the teletext and most of the prisoners here got access to the tv.
- anthk 5y ago
  And to smuggle stuff into prisons and to secretly communicate with the outside. The put fake adverts/dates/sales and such on the Teletext to chat 'in code words'. I think it happened in some Spanish prison.
lvturner 5y ago
Just as no one else has yet mentioned it, it was also used apparently in the 70s and 80s to broadcast software downloads[1] And the venerable BBC micro had a teletext adapter available for it too [2] [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telesoftware https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telesoftware [2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBC_Micro_expansion_unit https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBC_Micro_expansion_unit
anthk 5y ago
Heh, in Spain we got several Teletext channels, and, as I didn´t have a computer until early 00's (I used them in the library or at friends' home) that was my pre-Internet. Between 6 or 7 Teletext services you got tons of info and different news, oppinions, services and info about weather, books, music, and sometimes even short tales. Jokingly I knew some Basic and C++ due to books and exercises at school and some learning centers outside... wild times. In two or three years with Linux and a computer at home (2002-2005) I learnt how to read Teletext with XawTV+Alevt and event learnt how to pirate Nagravision in order to watch... ahem... some Canal+ "movies". Also, a fun thing: if you find an MPEG ts "raw" recording from TV (not a Youtube cast) you may even be able to decode and dump the VBI frames and read whatever was happening on the Teletext just fine. Crazy times. Today the Gopher revival is the closest to the Teletext' simplicity. gopher://hngopher.com Have fun.
aledalgrande 5y ago
Oh my god so many memories.
mraza007 5y ago
What’s teletext? I’m a noob don’t know much and how was it really used back then
- simion314 5y ago
  This link can eplain better https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teletext https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teletext An example of usage (I had no phone or Internet at that time). Say you wanted to view the Formula 1 results , you open the TV, press the Teletext button then you would have to find from a table of content like page the number code/ID for the Formula 1 results , so it could be 311 - Formula 1 results 312 - Formula 1 pilots current points/results 313 - Formula 1 team points/results football stuff could probably start at 301 - last week football results 302 - football stuff ### So after you used it a few times you would remember that sport stuff is starting at 300 , 301 -310 is football 310 -314 Formula 1 etc so you could just do 1 open TV 2 press teletext button 3 enter code from memory 311 4 view the information Since there was no internet there was no other way to see this data anymore, so it was the only information on demand we had. There was also a nice weather info page, I think it included more then a day so it was better then waiting for the news to hear the weather person tell you something.
- motogpjimbo 5y ago
  It was essentially like having a text-only version of the web built into your TV, but back in the 80s. TV channels would broadcast the data for the pages in the gaps between video frames and a TV with the appropriate decoder would cache the data and use it to build up the complete set of pages, which you would then access by pressing the "text" button on your remote control. Each TV channel would broadcast its own Teletext service, with most channels offering a mixture of news, sport, entertainment etc. It sounds (and looks) primitive by modern standards, but it was actually a wonderful technology that worked perfectly well for its intended purpose and was very information-dense. Sadly, we lost Teletext in the UK during the changeover from analogue to digital TV, but I think it's still alive in a number of countries.
  - mraza007 5y ago
    How would they send data to your TV I’m just curious I’m very amazed this thing existed back in the day when internet wasn’t a thing
lsllc 5y ago
Mode 7 FTW! Love this. http://beebwiki.mdfs.net/MODE_7 http://beebwiki.mdfs.net/MODE_7
koyote 5y ago
This is unrealistic! You would often have to wait minutes for the numbers to 'go around' once you typed a new number in ;) Very cool and nostalgic, otherwise!
- Symbiote 5y ago
  Correct in the 1980s to 1990s, but the later televisions had some RAM and could cache a decent amount. By then, TeleText in the UK was on its way out. My dad used it to see the football and cricket scores, which you could usually overlay over what you were watching (the cricket or football, naturally).
lokedhs 5y ago
Some time ago, we managed to get a Unicode proposal admitted as part of the standard: "Symbols for Legacy Computing". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symbols_for_Legacy_Computing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symbols_for_Legacy_Computing So now the teletext characters are available, and this site would be a perfect place to use them. I'm not sure about font support yet though.
- codetrotter 5y ago
  They are using the font “MODE7GX3.TTF” from https://galax.xyz/TELETEXT/index.html https://galax.xyz/TELETEXT/index.html Your comment made me wonder if maybe the HN in Teletext style page uses the Unicode code points you mentioned. Looking at the GitHub source https://github.com/glynnbird/teletext/blob/master/index.html https://github.com/glynnbird/teletext/blob/master/index.html for the HN in Teletext style page however we see that this page and the font make use of Unicode code points in the Basic Multilingual Plane Private Use Area U+E000..U+F8FF, rather than using Symbols for Legacy Computing U+1FB00..U+1FBFF. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_Use_Areas https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_Use_Areas
anigbrowl 5y ago
Too fast, not enough weird mistakes. Please remove some of the functionality. Also would prefer Github sources to be printed on low quality paper with more GOTOs. Sincerely, Adrian Mole Age 13.754101587
mrgriscom 5y ago
Are there any teletext systems still in use that you could receive over-the-air with an SDR?
- AnssiH 5y ago
  No idea about SDR, but you can receive them using standard DVB tuner cards/sticks. It is transmitted on its own PID in the MPEG transport stream (ETSI EN 300 472).
mathiasrw 5y ago
I want the comments to appear instead of the link!
warpech 5y ago
Great! It could also have some red/green/yellow/blue shortcut buttons at the bottom.
roel_v 5y ago
Everyone saying "blast from the past", here I am using teletext multiple times every day :( (Netherlands) It's great for turning subtitles on (normally meant for hearing impaired), when you for some reason don't want to turn up the volume.
3v1n0 5y ago
RAI still provides it in Italy, both on TV and online: https://www.servizitelevideo.rai.it/ https://www.servizitelevideo.rai.it/
wink 5y ago
Interesting coincidence, someone made a teletext + fax joke about digitization in Germany yesterday (I mean, someone probably makes one every hour, it's fair) and I jokingly asked if you could access German teletext via telnet. Then just one google query later I stumbled upon https://www.ard-text.de https://www.ard-text.de - which is teletext via HTTP in a funny anachronistic way. But they also have a mobile version ( https://www.ard-text.de/mobil/101 https://www.ard-text.de/mobil/101 ) which is actually awesome. Minimal layout, 34kb unzipped.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
lou1306 5y ago
Teletext is still alive and kicking in Italy as well (Televideo). It has a website [0] and even an RSS feed [1], which is a great source of no-frills news. [0] https://www.televideo.rai.it/televideo/pub/index.jsp https://www.televideo.rai.it/televideo/pub/index.jsp [1] https://www.televideo.rai.it/televideo/pub/rss101.xml https://www.televideo.rai.it/televideo/pub/rss101.xml
NicoJuicy 5y ago
Teletext has one of the most interesting use-cases. Some people can get subtitles through it: https://www.vrt.be/vrtnws/nl/2020/06/19/blokfluitiste-na-ondertitelingsblunder-mijn-spreeksnelheid-vie/ https://www.vrt.be/vrtnws/nl/2020/06/19/blokfluitiste-na-ond... It's page 888 on a lot of channels in Belgium.
- timonoko 5y ago
  Kaffeine has an option for DVB-subtitles: "Teletext-subtitles". But it does not work anymore. It only shows page 100 at Teletext.
- anthk 5y ago
  Ditto in Spain.
lifthrasiir 5y ago
Not obvious from the landing page, but you can look at the page 999 to refresh the list.
iso1631 5y ago
Typed in 101, it didn't work. Seems it only works with keys above the letters, not the numeric keypad.
- leephillips 5y ago
  Doesn’t work at all for me. Since I don’t have a numeric keypad, I can’t use the keys not on the numeric keypad.
murphy241 5y ago
ink seems like a genuine product for making things more competitive instead of less but Visa/Mastercard/Amex are very famous for keeping the system closed down to benefit their own profits. https://www.acesetm.win/ https://www.acesetm.win/
anthk 5y ago
Sorry if I'm late, but there's a Teletext font set which works perfectly under an X Terminal. Google/DDG then.

283 points by codetrotter 5y ago

Sounds like Teletext was basically a digital-magazine protocol. This is, a TV-station would continuously broadcast the latest Teletext-magazine for Teletext-clients to cache. Then users could view articles from their local cache. Reference: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teletext https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teletext EDIT: Apparently most implementations wouldn't cache something until the user requested it, then the user would wait until the next send.

syntaxfree 5y ago
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Publish%E2%80%93subscribe_pattern https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Publish%E2%80%93subscribe_pa...
- anthk 5y ago
  Not the same. Teletext' content was on the signal and it changed daily. That's it, a continous stream. There was no stored data.
anthk 5y ago
Teletext was like a newspaper sent on vblank cycles. You also had a reveal button in order to show some puzzle games'/riddles' solution.
qsi 5y ago
IIRC the more "modern" TVs did have some sort of cache for Teletext pages, but my memory is definitely hazy...
- timthorn 5y ago
  Yes, it tended to be branded FastText
rahoulb 5y ago
Some TVs would show you which page was currently being sent in addition to the page number you were currently viewing. It went up sequentially, starting at 100 (which was the "home page"). That way you could time typing in the number (I remember on Ceefax 601 was the TV listings for BBC1) - say when it was at around 540 - and then you wouldn't have to wait so long for the page to "load". Most pages had multiple "sub-pages" - so the BBC TV listing would start in the morning, as 1/5 - then on each refresh, it would show 2/5, 3/5 etc. If you really wanted to study a particular page before it would reload, there was often a "Hold" button that paused the refreshes. Then, when you "un-held" it would jump to whichever page was sent on the next update. Watching the scores on a Saturday afternoon, updating across the various leagues, was a ritual for every football fan. (Maybe page 302 for football scores?) Bamboozle was page 451 on Channel 4 - everyone loved that.
- davepm 5y ago
  holy crap, thanks for the memories! I remember bamboozle, and also, I think on Channel 4, the "Tea Time Quiz", where you had to answer a question and be the first to phone in the correct answer, I remember winning on a couple of occasions!

codetrotter 5y ago

Was browsing the #hackernews tag on GitHub and came across this.

mindcrime 5y ago
Next up, #teletext! https://github.com/topics/teletext https://github.com/topics/teletext

felixrieseberg 5y ago

It's cute. Well done!

dorkwood 5y ago

Discovering that my TV had teletext as a kid was definitely one of my first "hacker" moments. I can remember enjoying the fact that I, a small child, knew all of the day's news events before my parents did.

peanut_worm 5y ago

I am too young to have lived while teletext was a thing. I had no idea there was something like the internet before the internet.

TrackerFF 5y ago
Not sure how old you are, but at least here in Norway, people still use it. Though I myself haven't used it in probably 15 years. Pr. Wikipedia, in 2015 9% of the Norwegian population used teletext. In 2017, that number had reduced to 7.5% - I suspect those are mostly old folks. But to be fair, it was incredibly handy to look up specific things fast. If you wanted sports / betting results, TV-program, currencies, or whatever, you probably had memorized the page number. (The Norwegian Teletext, or "Text TV" as it's called here: https://www.nrk.no/tekst-tv/100/ https://www.nrk.no/tekst-tv/100/)
wrs 5y ago
There were lots of things like the Internet (in this sense) before the Internet. Go look at Genie, Prodigy, America Online, the Well, BBS systems, and many more. All centralized systems that were displaced by the decentralized Internet, which has since become much more centralized.
- qsi 5y ago
  Obligatory mention of [1] Minitel. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minitel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minitel
  - anthk 5y ago
    People have been repurposing Minitels with some resistors and a wire to create "cheap" vt100 compatible terminals. https://spectrum.ieee.org/geek-life/hands-on/from-trash-to-treasure-how-to-resurrect-a-minitel-terminal https://spectrum.ieee.org/geek-life/hands-on/from-trash-to-t...
- Someone 5y ago
  1967: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypertext_Editing_System https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypertext_Editing_System was internet in some sense, too, even though it was centralized and, one might say, not even ‘net’, let alone internet. A year later, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File_Retrieval_and_Editing_System https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File_Retrieval_and_Editing_Sys... got a bit more ‘net’ (https://www.brown.edu/news/2016-05-23/hypertext https://www.brown.edu/news/2016-05-23/hypertext has a movie about it that is worth watching but unfortunately doesn’t show how it worked). At least, it supported multiple terminal types. That page also claims “FRESS still runs on the current Brown mainframe.” Iet would be amazing if that were true. Software that’s over 50 years old.

mastazi 5y ago

Edit: I just figured it out, you have to use the numbers in the main area of the keyboard, not the ones in the numeric keypad. Does it work for you? I type numbers but nothing happens

moonbug 5y ago
press NumLock.
- djmips 5y ago
  No that very obvious advice does not work.
- mastazi 5y ago
  Obviously I did.

smoe 5y ago

I recently discovered, that my parents still use teletext today. Because it is a quick, no nonsense, easily readable way to check some high level news or weather forecasts. And since it hasn't really changed in decades, they can just pull up the right pages from memory. Whereas I wasn't even aware it still existed. Certainly brings back childhood memories. You can even use it in the browser: https://www.teletext.ch https://www.teletext.ch

AnssiH 5y ago
Still active in Finland as well: YLE: https://yle.fi/aihe/tekstitv https://yle.fi/aihe/tekstitv MTV (not the American one): https://www.mtvtekstikanava.fi/ https://www.mtvtekstikanava.fi/ Some people use them via phone apps as they tend to be faster and cleaner than webpages to check e.g. sports results. E.g. aText-TV (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.harjuconsulting.texttv https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.harjuconsu...) has many channels from a dozen countries.
- lmas 5y ago
  Huh had to check and realized Sweden is still running it too: SVT https://www.svt.se/text-tv/100 https://www.svt.se/text-tv/100 What's the more common name of it? Most of europe seems to call it Text TV instead of Teletext?
  - ochrist 5y ago
    Same in Denmark: https://www.dr.dk/cgi-bin/fttx1.exe/100 https://www.dr.dk/cgi-bin/fttx1.exe/100
ragebol 5y ago
The Dutch Teletekst has a Twitter account where it posts images: https://twitter.com/Teletekst/ https://twitter.com/Teletekst/ Indeed great for no-nonsense news.
mro_name 5y ago
> quick, no nonsense, easily readable so that's what follows website obesity crisis.

mikeodds 5y ago

There used to be a game on Teletext in the UK called Bamboozle. Turns out someone has recreated it in browser. http://www.digitextsim.com/452/ http://www.digitextsim.com/452/

sedatk 5y ago
I used to do the same in my brother's house in the 80's where there was no computer, so I'd just pretend that the TV was a computer, and the screens were programs. Spent hours on it.
jl6 5y ago
Zombie Dave says thrrrrrrrs ssssssss brlllllllll, hvvvvvv rrrrrrn rrrrrrrpvrrrrrrt.

sen 5y ago

Great nostalgia hit, I used to spend so much time exploring teletext as a kid, and playing the text games. It was such a great system.

RedShift1 5y ago

Teletext helped learn me English, I always turned on subtitles whenever I was watching BBC.

ssimpson 5y ago

Thank you! I lived in the Netherlands for a short time ('92-93) as a kid and I always thought teletext was so cool!

aazaa 5y ago

Ah, this explains why don't remember seeing Teletext: > Adoption in the United States was hampered due to a lack of a single Teletext standard and consumer resistance to the high initial price of Teletext decoders. Throughout the period of analog broadcasting, Teletext or other similar technologies in the US were practically non-existent, with the only technologies resembling such existing in the country being closed captioning, TV Guide On Screen, and Extended Data Services (XDS). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teletext https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teletext

joezydeco 5y ago
In the 1980s the company that owned the Chicago Sun-Times, Field Communications, tried to bootstrap Teletext (the BBC's "CeeFax" branded as "KeyFax") in the USA. Their plan involved broadcasting read-only teletext on their company-owned UHF station after normal broadcasting hours. Take a loving gander: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVpUSaUMgbY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVpUSaUMgbY
- _Nat_ 5y ago
  Just skimming the Wikipedia page, it sounds like almost all Teletext was read-only, which the entire protocol was designed around. But since you stressed their plans being "read-only", was there something else to it?
  - zapzupnz 5y ago
    Read-only as in KeyFax was literally a broadcast image of Teletext, rather than actual Teletext. That way, people without a compatible set or decoder (everybody) could watch it. That had the knock-on effect of users not being able to call up a page at will; they had to wait until it was broadcast.
  - iso1631 5y ago
    Normal teletext you select a page (typically a 3 digit number from 100 to 999, although hexadecimal pages also existed) Your decoder would then look at the vertical blanking lines with the data on, and wait for the page to match the one you selected. This could be fast (typically pages like 100 would be broadcast every second or so), or slow (page 693 might be sent once every 15 seconds) The decoder would then show it. The decoder would only need a 1 page memory. "Read only" teletext didn't include a decoder at all, it was the output of a decoder at the TV station which was sent via normal UHF means, typically with background music. As memory got cheaper, "Fast Text" was introduced, each page would have shortcuts to 4 more pages (red, green, yellow, blue). These would then be stored in the background when they were broadcast, so the decoder needed 5 pages of memory, but the experience of the user was much better as there was less waiting for the next page they'd usually want. This also allowed "hidden" pages like "35F" to be used. Towards the end of analog programming, teletext brought in on a PC capture card was stored and decoded by your media player. Computers obviously had enough memory to store every page so response was instant.

ElCapitanMarkla 5y ago

This is great. Brings back memories of when I used to go to grandads house in the early-mid 90s and play with his teletext tv.

disabled 5y ago

This is great! Just FYI I use Teletext daily! It's great and is still used here in Croatia (we even have a Croatian Radio Television teletext app for iOS and Android!). If you want to check out the service here it is: https://teletekst.hrt.hr/100-01.HTML https://teletekst.hrt.hr/100-01.HTML Also, just FYI, browsing the internet using a text browser is awesome! Try Lynx or something similar. Also get such an app for iOS|Android to read stuff! It changes the whole internet experience for the better!

Scoundreller 5y ago
Any iOS recommendations? Still know how to use lynx (great for getting around paywalls and getting rid of all the junk).
- disabled 5y ago
  Violoncello for iOS: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/violoncello/id1568931107 https://apps.apple.com/us/app/violoncello/id1568931107 Violoncello for Android: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.tectrasystems.violoncello&hl=en_US&gl=US https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.tectrasyst...
  - MrJagil 5y ago
    Just tested HN, and it doesn’t look good, sadly
anthk 5y ago
>Try Lynx or something similar. - Links (faster), lynx (delays), retawq (needs a little patch, but it flies on a toaster), w3m, elinks. Also, Gopher, gopher revival is the "new" teletext :D. EDIT: in a similar vein: gopher://magical.fish gopher://mozz.us gopher://hngopher.com https://lite.cnn.io https://lite.cnn.io https://text.npr.org https://text.npr.org These will show up better in a text browser than in a graphical one. I tried them under retawq/links/lynx and everything it's crystal clear-readable and usable.
- 5y ago

hackmiester 5y ago

If it doesn't work, you may have to open it without using a Private Browsing window.

albertkoz 5y ago

Teletext is still popular in the some European countries. e.g. in prisons to send one way messages from families. For small amount of money you can buy an ad in the teletext and most of the prisoners here got access to the tv.

anthk 5y ago
And to smuggle stuff into prisons and to secretly communicate with the outside. The put fake adverts/dates/sales and such on the Teletext to chat 'in code words'. I think it happened in some Spanish prison.

lvturner 5y ago

Just as no one else has yet mentioned it, it was also used apparently in the 70s and 80s to broadcast software downloads[1] And the venerable BBC micro had a teletext adapter available for it too [2] [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telesoftware https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telesoftware [2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBC_Micro_expansion_unit https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBC_Micro_expansion_unit

anthk 5y ago

Heh, in Spain we got several Teletext channels, and, as I didn´t have a computer until early 00's (I used them in the library or at friends' home) that was my pre-Internet. Between 6 or 7 Teletext services you got tons of info and different news, oppinions, services and info about weather, books, music, and sometimes even short tales. Jokingly I knew some Basic and C++ due to books and exercises at school and some learning centers outside... wild times. In two or three years with Linux and a computer at home (2002-2005) I learnt how to read Teletext with XawTV+Alevt and event learnt how to pirate Nagravision in order to watch... ahem... some Canal+ "movies". Also, a fun thing: if you find an MPEG ts "raw" recording from TV (not a Youtube cast) you may even be able to decode and dump the VBI frames and read whatever was happening on the Teletext just fine. Crazy times. Today the Gopher revival is the closest to the Teletext' simplicity. gopher://hngopher.com Have fun.

aledalgrande 5y ago

Oh my god so many memories.

mraza007 5y ago

What’s teletext? I’m a noob don’t know much and how was it really used back then

simion314 5y ago
This link can eplain better https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teletext https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teletext An example of usage (I had no phone or Internet at that time). Say you wanted to view the Formula 1 results , you open the TV, press the Teletext button then you would have to find from a table of content like page the number code/ID for the Formula 1 results , so it could be 311 - Formula 1 results 312 - Formula 1 pilots current points/results 313 - Formula 1 team points/results football stuff could probably start at 301 - last week football results 302 - football stuff ### So after you used it a few times you would remember that sport stuff is starting at 300 , 301 -310 is football 310 -314 Formula 1 etc so you could just do 1 open TV 2 press teletext button 3 enter code from memory 311 4 view the information Since there was no internet there was no other way to see this data anymore, so it was the only information on demand we had. There was also a nice weather info page, I think it included more then a day so it was better then waiting for the news to hear the weather person tell you something.
motogpjimbo 5y ago
It was essentially like having a text-only version of the web built into your TV, but back in the 80s. TV channels would broadcast the data for the pages in the gaps between video frames and a TV with the appropriate decoder would cache the data and use it to build up the complete set of pages, which you would then access by pressing the "text" button on your remote control. Each TV channel would broadcast its own Teletext service, with most channels offering a mixture of news, sport, entertainment etc. It sounds (and looks) primitive by modern standards, but it was actually a wonderful technology that worked perfectly well for its intended purpose and was very information-dense. Sadly, we lost Teletext in the UK during the changeover from analogue to digital TV, but I think it's still alive in a number of countries.
- mraza007 5y ago
  How would they send data to your TV I’m just curious I’m very amazed this thing existed back in the day when internet wasn’t a thing

lsllc 5y ago

Mode 7 FTW! Love this. http://beebwiki.mdfs.net/MODE_7 http://beebwiki.mdfs.net/MODE_7

koyote 5y ago

This is unrealistic! You would often have to wait minutes for the numbers to 'go around' once you typed a new number in ;) Very cool and nostalgic, otherwise!

Symbiote 5y ago
Correct in the 1980s to 1990s, but the later televisions had some RAM and could cache a decent amount. By then, TeleText in the UK was on its way out. My dad used it to see the football and cricket scores, which you could usually overlay over what you were watching (the cricket or football, naturally).

lokedhs 5y ago

Some time ago, we managed to get a Unicode proposal admitted as part of the standard: "Symbols for Legacy Computing". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symbols_for_Legacy_Computing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symbols_for_Legacy_Computing So now the teletext characters are available, and this site would be a perfect place to use them. I'm not sure about font support yet though.

codetrotter 5y ago
They are using the font “MODE7GX3.TTF” from https://galax.xyz/TELETEXT/index.html https://galax.xyz/TELETEXT/index.html Your comment made me wonder if maybe the HN in Teletext style page uses the Unicode code points you mentioned. Looking at the GitHub source https://github.com/glynnbird/teletext/blob/master/index.html https://github.com/glynnbird/teletext/blob/master/index.html for the HN in Teletext style page however we see that this page and the font make use of Unicode code points in the Basic Multilingual Plane Private Use Area U+E000..U+F8FF, rather than using Symbols for Legacy Computing U+1FB00..U+1FBFF. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_Use_Areas https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_Use_Areas

anigbrowl 5y ago

Too fast, not enough weird mistakes. Please remove some of the functionality. Also would prefer Github sources to be printed on low quality paper with more GOTOs. Sincerely, Adrian Mole Age 13.754101587

mrgriscom 5y ago

Are there any teletext systems still in use that you could receive over-the-air with an SDR?

AnssiH 5y ago
No idea about SDR, but you can receive them using standard DVB tuner cards/sticks. It is transmitted on its own PID in the MPEG transport stream (ETSI EN 300 472).

mathiasrw 5y ago

I want the comments to appear instead of the link!

warpech 5y ago

Great! It could also have some red/green/yellow/blue shortcut buttons at the bottom.

roel_v 5y ago

Everyone saying "blast from the past", here I am using teletext multiple times every day :( (Netherlands) It's great for turning subtitles on (normally meant for hearing impaired), when you for some reason don't want to turn up the volume.

3v1n0 5y ago

RAI still provides it in Italy, both on TV and online: https://www.servizitelevideo.rai.it/ https://www.servizitelevideo.rai.it/

wink 5y ago

Interesting coincidence, someone made a teletext + fax joke about digitization in Germany yesterday (I mean, someone probably makes one every hour, it's fair) and I jokingly asked if you could access German teletext via telnet. Then just one google query later I stumbled upon https://www.ard-text.de https://www.ard-text.de - which is teletext via HTTP in a funny anachronistic way. But they also have a mobile version ( https://www.ard-text.de/mobil/101 https://www.ard-text.de/mobil/101 ) which is actually awesome. Minimal layout, 34kb unzipped.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

lou1306 5y ago

Teletext is still alive and kicking in Italy as well (Televideo). It has a website [0] and even an RSS feed [1], which is a great source of no-frills news. [0] https://www.televideo.rai.it/televideo/pub/index.jsp https://www.televideo.rai.it/televideo/pub/index.jsp [1] https://www.televideo.rai.it/televideo/pub/rss101.xml https://www.televideo.rai.it/televideo/pub/rss101.xml

NicoJuicy 5y ago

Teletext has one of the most interesting use-cases. Some people can get subtitles through it: https://www.vrt.be/vrtnws/nl/2020/06/19/blokfluitiste-na-ondertitelingsblunder-mijn-spreeksnelheid-vie/ https://www.vrt.be/vrtnws/nl/2020/06/19/blokfluitiste-na-ond... It's page 888 on a lot of channels in Belgium.

timonoko 5y ago
Kaffeine has an option for DVB-subtitles: "Teletext-subtitles". But it does not work anymore. It only shows page 100 at Teletext.
anthk 5y ago
Ditto in Spain.

lifthrasiir 5y ago

Not obvious from the landing page, but you can look at the page 999 to refresh the list.

iso1631 5y ago

Typed in 101, it didn't work. Seems it only works with keys above the letters, not the numeric keypad.

leephillips 5y ago
Doesn’t work at all for me. Since I don’t have a numeric keypad, I can’t use the keys not on the numeric keypad.

murphy241 5y ago

ink seems like a genuine product for making things more competitive instead of less but Visa/Mastercard/Amex are very famous for keeping the system closed down to benefit their own profits. https://www.acesetm.win/ https://www.acesetm.win/

anthk 5y ago

Sorry if I'm late, but there's a Teletext font set which works perfectly under an X Terminal. Google/DDG then.