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Newark cops, with reform, didn't fire a single shot in 2020
- tyingq 6y agoSome time ago, I watched Frontline's "Policing the Police" episode that featured Newark and Baraka's efforts. The episode was fairly early in their process (2016), and does a nice job of framing up both the problem, and how they intended to solve it. Jelani Cobb hosts it. He does a ride-along, and somewhat incredibly, sees the problems first hand...despite the cops he's riding with knowing full well he's filming everything. https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/film/policing-the-police/ https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/film/policing-the-police/ Edit: Apparently this link works outside the US: https://player.pbs.org/widget/partnerplayer/2365792793/ https://player.pbs.org/widget/partnerplayer/2365792793/
- throwaway1090 6y agoIt's on youtube [1]. They released another documentary with the same name and the same Newark subject with 2020 updates [2]. They both have the same duration but are different. [1] Policing the Police (2016) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_8vTl6D940 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_8vTl6D940 [2] Policing the Police (2020) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=taNwWilMVLg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=taNwWilMVLg Both come with optional English subtitles.
- gadrev 6y agoI guess it's US only? Can't access from EU.
- bmn__ 6y agoWorks for me, also EU. Use torsocks and youtube-dl to circumvent your region blocking.
- imagineerschool 6y agoConfirmed, can't access it from Canada, but with a VPN to the US, it's available. Who makes these choices?
- jmartrican 6y agoI didn't even know YouTube did this.
- oivey 6y agoIt’s similar to the BBC blocking non-UK streamers.
- WandOfALeftFoot 6y agoThe BBC is not free though.
- no_wizard 6y agoNeither is PBS. It’s funded through grants, donations and government funding via the Corporation for Public Broadcasting[0] [0]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporation_for_Public_Broadcasting https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporation_for_Public_Broad...
- tyingq 6y agoOn the off chance PBS allows access outside the US: https://player.pbs.org/widget/partnerplayer/2365792793/ https://player.pbs.org/widget/partnerplayer/2365792793/
- piva00 6y agoSurprisingly it worked here in Sweden, thank you!
- throwaway1090 6y agoWorks in India.
- imagineerschool 6y agoExtra confusing that they share a lot of footage. The 2020 release is an update more than a new work.
- throwaway1090 6y agoCan't edit above comment. Invidious to the rescue [1]. Just enable 'proxy videos' in settings (circle icon). https://vid.puffyan.us/watch?v=2_8vTl6D940 https://vid.puffyan.us/watch?v=2_8vTl6D940 and https://vid.puffyan.us/watch?v=taNwWilMVLg https://vid.puffyan.us/watch?v=taNwWilMVLg Notes: https://github.com/iv-org/invidious https://github.com/iv-org/invidious
- cdot2 6y agoWhile the crime rate has been going down since 2013, Newark still has a murder rate of 57 per 100,000 while the US average is 5 per 100,000. Perhaps their policing model should not be copied. http://www.city-data.com/crime/crime-Newark-New-Jersey.html# http://www.city-data.com/crime/crime-Newark-New-Jersey.html#
- tootie 6y agoDo police actually affect the murder rate?
- atonse 6y agoProbably but for an extreme example, look at what’s happened in Portland.
- tootie 6y agoProbably not causation. Crime rates are up nationwide. NYC is seeing a spike too and we've got the most expensive police force in the world. More likely the pandemic is to blame.
- umanwizard 6y ago> More likely the pandemic is to blame. You mean the response to the pandemic, not the pandemic itself.
- JamisonM 6y agoI don't know what the OP meant but I certainly would mean specifically "the pandemic is to blame". If there were no discernable response to the pandemic from any organized institution in society there is a pretty good chance the pandemic itself could be blamed for a /lot/ of terrible things.
- wizzwizz4 6y ago
- elil17 6y agoI think this only addresses half of what's wrong with Newark PD. Newark still spends about a third of it's city budget on police, at the expense of essential services like infrastructure and education. Newark PD still arrests Black people at a much much higher rate than white people. The disparity of arrest rates is even greater when it comes to drug possession.
- bananabiscuit 6y agoCheck the demographics, white people make up only about one third of the population in Newark.
- elil17 6y agoArresting at a hire rate means in comparison to the demographics of the city. In 2020, 50% of Newark residents were Black but 80% of arrests were of Black people. 80% of victims of police use of force were Black. A third of the city is white but only 4% of police use of force victims are white. [1] [1]: https://www.nj.com/opinion/2020/07/newark-must-do-more-to-stop-racial-disparities-in-policing-opinion.html https://www.nj.com/opinion/2020/07/newark-must-do-more-to-st...
- param 6y agoAnd do we know why this disparity exists?
- bananabiscuit 6y agoI’d assume it’s some combination of the cops being racist, or actual differences in crime rates among demographics. I see no reason to conclude it has to be one or the other, not sure if there’s any actual way to determine how much each cause contributes though.
- erikerikson 6y agoOne might add inherited circumstances that are predictive of outcomes.
- AtNightWeCode 6y agoGood for Newark! But, from what I understand, they gave the cops better training and got better result. That is how education works.
- tomerico 6y agoI disagree. The largest factors are likely to be culture (coming from leadership) and higher scrutiny (mentioned in the article as a requirement to report and investigate any use of force).
- yaml-ops-guy 6y agoCouldn’t possibly be a confluence of all the above? Not even in the tiniest degree?
- bluecatswim 6y ago"Largest factor" implies there are others as well.
- yaml-ops-guy 6y agoAh ok, perhaps I fixated on the curt "I disagree", for a moment too long.
- zero_deg_kevin 6y agoThey’re now proof points that governments can reduce police fatalities by training their police to use more than guns. This hopefully makes it a little easier to sue a city into the ground for failure to adequately train its police force.
- weswpg 6y agoImportantly, such training requires more funding, not "defunding the police" as some propose.
- 6y ago
- lostlogin 6y agoThe story describes positive change and this is good. However the detail is rather dark. “On Jan. 1, a Newark officer fatally shot Carl Dorsey III, of South Orange, during a confrontation in the South Ward, a case that’s being investigated by Attorney General” The link there says that officers arrived on Jan 1 2021 at 12:03am. So 3 minutes after 2020 they shot someone dead. https://www.nj.com/essex/2021/01/nj-protesters-rally-demand-justice-for-man-fatally-shot-by-newark-police.html https://www.nj.com/essex/2021/01/nj-protesters-rally-demand-...
- bonestamp2 6y agoFair enough, so let's say it was 1 shooting. Based on that incident, it sounds like that's still 1 too many, but is it an improvement over previous years? I can't find any stats on that, here's the department's site for this year though: https://npd.newarkpublicsafety.org/statistics/transparency https://npd.newarkpublicsafety.org/statistics/transparency
- jchook 6y agoSignificant to note that Newark Police officers did not wear body cameras until early 2020. It seems like part of the same “decree” but I didn’t see the article mention it. I recall a similar stat from CA where body cameras reduced complaints by 80%. Also it looks like Merrick Garland reversed Jeff Sessions’ limitations on consent decree.
- 0xbadcafebee 6y agoAnecdotal counter-argument: police have been filmed planting evidence, assaulting suspects, on their own body cameras. It may be useful at catching them, but not necessarily a deterrent
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- karaterobot 6y agoLooking at the 28-day periods, aggravated assault is up a lot, robbery is down by a lot, and most of the rest are within what I imagine are the yearly fluctuations. Is there more convincing support for the claim that crime is down in Newark?
- AbrahamParangi 6y agoViolent crime has been on a decade-long decline in Newark[1] so wouldn't at all be surprising if crime as a whole declined in 2020. [1] https://www.city-data.com/city/Newark-New-Jersey.html https://www.city-data.com/city/Newark-New-Jersey.html
- jghn 6y agoEven if it stays stable, isn't that enough evidence that we don't need the Warrior Cop model? Being able to demonstrate an improvement in crime by toning down the violence is just gravy on top.
- throwawayboise 6y agoPolice rarely stop crimes in progress. As the saying goes, "when seconds count, the police are minutes away." A strategy of high visibility, or "omnipresence" may have more of a deterrent effect than anything else.
- stjohnswarts 6y agoWhat it does confirm is that you don't need "warriored" up cops. Regular protect and serve types will work.
- mbg721 6y ago2020 had so many confounding factors, I don't know that there's convincing evidence of any trend.
- sanguy 6y agoWe need Robocop more than ever in this country. Or Judge's like Dredd. No judgement for color, gender, age, or appearance. Just policing based on the facts of the situation and the criminal record of those being policed.
- stadium 6y ago> criminal record of those being policed What if there is bias in the criminal record? This ignores the idea of rehabilitation and assumes that one crime, one bad decision, makes someone a criminal for life.
- brigandish 6y ago> We need Robocop more than ever in this country. Or Judge's like Dredd. Both were a satire on fascism, I'm not sure they're the best examples you could find.
- zo1 6y agoAnd yet here we are, in just the last few days: 1. Making organ "donation" default and you have to "opt out". 2. Talking about a 100% inheritance "tax" so parents can't leave their possessions to children. Talk about fascism, most people can't even see it coming.
- wizzwizz4 6y agoOnce you're dead, what's wrong with being used for parts? It's like the “would you kill 1 person to save 10 people” thought experiment except the 1 person is already dead. If you object, object. It's not like that's being taken away from you. There's a change in policy that will save hundreds of lives, at the cost of… no problem for anyone who cares enough to fill in a form.
- randomopining 6y agoYeah so “defund the police!” Should actually be “fund better police training!” Of course the AOC-type libs are utterly wrong. Biden is right.
- dragonwriter 6y ago> Yeah so “defund the police!” Should actually be “fund better police training!” Most people saying the former would support it being accompanied by the latter, however, they will note that that the past several decades have involved several police reform movements that have driven additional net funding to police at the expense of other local services, contributing to the expansion of police roles. “Defund the police” is about driving down the proportion of local funding consumed by paramilitary law enforcement and, along with it, the scope of responsibility. Increasing the share of those remaining resoueces devoted to training, and even moreso the quality of that training in respect to the remaining role of the paramilitary law enforcement services, is not something “defund" activists oppose, just something that they see as inadequate and not the first priority.
- failwhaleshark 6y agoWhy is this such a rarity these days? My grandfather was an AP (MP) for decades and never shot at anyone, despite handling uncountable hairy/critical situations with individuals trained in killing. Shoot first and ask questions never? Deescalation and self-control should be job #1 along with verbal/social skills to solve problems before jumping to the nuclear option out of fear.
- logicslave 6y agoBecause criminals have alot of guns
- failwhaleshark 6y agoThat seems oversimplified. Do you have any data about the trends of gun possession by criminals or gun crime related to attacks on police? There are also a lot of innocent people being shot too, or the visibility of it has increased. Edit: also, could it be police are less trained or more fearful than in the past?
- logicslave 6y agoI'm a highly educated individual, commonly read dense scientific works, philosophy, political science etc. Its my opinion that violent crime, and especially brazen violent crime is just flat out more common. Police are more frequently in life threatening situations. The demands on them to act perfectly are enormous. And so we see mistakes, broadly painted as racism. Its a cancerous thought framework, and it threatens the law and order of a civilized nation. But the video that is coming out is making it clear to the common people, that despite what the media says, you can see for yourself what occurs. The narrative can only be held for so long before too much video evidence to the contrary piles up. George Floyd robbed a women by holding his gun to her pregnant stomach. Duante Wright robbed a girl by choking her, holding her at gun point, for 800$ Adam Toledo was known in his neighborhood as "Lil Homicide" The 16 year old girl shot recently was running at people swinging a knife.
- 6y ago
- logicslave 6y agoI'm a highly educated individual, commonly read dense scientific works, philosophy, political science etc. Its my opinion that violent crime, and especially brazen violent crime is just flat out more common. Police are more frequently in life threatening situations. The demands on them to act perfectly are enormous. And so we see mistakes, broadly painted as racism. Its a cancerous thought framework, and it threatens the law and order of a civilized nation. But the video that is coming out is making it clear to the common people, that despite what the media says, you can see for yourself what occurs. The narrative can only be held for so long before too much video evidence to the contrary piles up. George Floyd robbed a women by holding his gun to her pregnant stomach. Duante Wright robbed a girl by choking her, holding her at gun point, for 800$ Adam Toledo was known in his neighborhood as "Lil Homicide" The 16 year old girl shot recently was running at people swinging a knife.
- wizzwizz4 6y agoDon't repost this all through the thread, please. It was bad enough the first time.
- craftinator 6y agoIt really doesn't help support their position of being "highly educated", does it?
- colinmhayes 6y agoImagine thinking anyone would believe someone with such an idiotic opening sentence is actually "highly educated,"
- samatman 6y agoThere were 287 homicides in Newark in 2020, up from 234 in 2019. That's 53 more lives lost, a shocking 23% increase. How related are these two facts? I don't know, but if you're going to come at this with "completely unrelated" I question your honesty. Source: https://www.nj.com/crime/2020/12/homicides-in-nj-soared-22-in-2020-what-caused-the-spike.html https://www.nj.com/crime/2020/12/homicides-in-nj-soared-22-i... Edit: apologies for not reading the source carefully, I was mislead by the search I used to retrieve it. That was for all of New Jersey, not Newark, where homicides have been flat (and that is unusual for the United States in general). I'm pretty distracted today. Sorry about that.
- darkerside 6y agohttps://www.statista.com/chart/23905/change-in-homicides-in-us-cities/ https://www.statista.com/chart/23905/change-in-homicides-in-...
- 5vforest 6y agoYour cited source literally says the opposite: > While Trenton and Paterson saw spikes this year, other cities like Newark and Jersey City haven’t seen much of a change.
- vanviegen 6y ago2020 was by no means a typical year. A rise in domestic violence, perhaps? Still seems weird though.
- tyingq 6y agoYou're quoting stats for all of New Jersey, not just Newark. This sentence is in your linked source: "In Newark, the state’s most populous city, 51 homicides occurred in 2020 as of Dec. 30 — the same number the city had in 2019, officials said." Which seems pretty notable. The most populous city is flat, while the state itself is up 23%.
- koolba 6y agoGiven the lack of commuters and total cancellation of sporting events limiting tourism, I’d expect a drop in overall crime of all kinds in Newark. A flat number with the lower flow of people isn’t necessarily a drop.
- enaaem 6y agoI wonder why cops in the West don't use man catchers? It's a great tool to subdue any non-gun wielding person. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-2SpSMZtyU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-2SpSMZtyU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4z-gzkb6s4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4z-gzkb6s4 Pepper spray and stick don't work against someone who is strong and aggressive.
- virtuous_signal 6y agoI had never even considered the possibility of something like this. I wonder what effective interventions we might be missing simply due to lack of creativity. I imagine a version of these wide enough for a person’s waist and with a locking mechanism could be used for knife/fistfights and be much more humane than shooting. Perhaps they could be stored in squad cars the way shotguns are.
- craftinator 6y ago"I thought I had grabbed the mancatcher, not the shotgun! It was an accident!"
- gudanggaram 6y agoEven if it stays stable, isn't that enough evidence that we don't need the Warrior Cop model? Being able to demonstrate an improvement in crime by toning down to play poker online https://easyeda.com/backlinkterbaik/idn-poker88-indonesia https://easyeda.com/backlinkterbaik/idn-poker88-indonesia the violence is just gravy on top.
- fridif 6y agoAnd still, Newark is not a very nice place to live.