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I am shocked and horrified that it is taking so long to clear those who have breached the Capitol. There is more police efficiency and aggression in a run of th
by voisin 6y ago
I am shocked and horrified that it is taking so long to clear those who have breached the Capitol. There is more police efficiency and aggression in a run of the mill BLM protest.
Edit: for example: https://twitter.com/RedR1dngHood/status/1346908557560537091 https://twitter.com/RedR1dngHood/status/1346908557560537091
- czhiddy 6y agoThe stark difference in the response to these "protests" vs the DC BLM protests: https://twitter.com/RedR1dngHood/status/1346908557560537091 https://twitter.com/RedR1dngHood/status/1346908557560537091
- ngngngng 6y ago"Some of those that work forces are the same that burn crosses"
- bilbo0s 6y agoIf this is true, America is a circus. How can you govern a nation under these conditions?
- awnird 6y agoIt turns out you can't, which is why the republic is currently being toppled by fascist dictatorship.
- moosey 6y agoHaven't you noticed? We can't!
- ngngngng 6y agoOur founders thought about that quite a bit, the answer they came up with? You can't. "Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious People. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." - James Madison As those were spoken over 200 years ago I think we can forgive the phrasing and understand the meaning of "moral and religious." And though at the time I'm sure these intelligent people thought that morality and religiosity were positively correlated, today I'm almost tempted to say that in my own relationships I see an inverse correlation, and I say that as a deeply religious person.
- 8note 6y agoIt doesn't even follow from what's written in the constitution. Religious freedom is not compatible with only certain religious folks being able to use it properly.
- watwut 6y agoTo be fair, to some extend it is like that everywhere. Armed services are generally attractive to people with authoritarian mindset - exactly like those movements. Plus, police can be more or less corrupt, but you never get 0 corrupt cops. You have always proportion of those who are work with criminals - helping or being direct members. You occasionally even have gangs composed of cops only.
- adsche 6y agoI agree in principle. Especially that that response towards BLM was completely unjustified and plain wrong. However, after watching the streams for a while now, I feel, the current response might have been the best to avoid shootings/deaths. Evacuation seems to have worked (so far, fingers are crossed). And I can definitely see right-wing terrorists shooting armed guards to get into the building and the chambers. The events are an absolute disgrace, but any stronger response might have triggered the terrorists even more. EDIT: Sorry, is this really such a stupid argument? Does the symbolism of entering the building trump that of a bloodbath? For context, right-wing groups 'stormed' German parliament a couple of months ago and nobody is talking about it anymore since nothing really happened.
- staplers 6y ago"America doesn't negotiate with terrorists"
- adsche 6y agoI was not sure if this needed a response but here it goes: I don't think this is a negotiation but rather a tactical withdrawal.
- jandrese 6y agoShots have been fired in the capitol building.
- adsche 6y agoYes, one intruder has been shot. No injured guards/ officers/ staff/ journalists reported (afaik). I cannot help but think that this is a comparatively! good outcome when dealing with armed right-wingers. EDIT: Heard on C-SPAN now: 5 reported injured now, 1 law enforcement. At least some of them gas related. I still stand by my opinion but I don't know for how long.
- watwut 6y agoI have seen video of cops with hurt faces. Someone hit them.
- sergiotapia 6y agohttps://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=black%20lives%20matter https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=b...
- inscionent 6y agoSo you think they will be cleared?
- LudwigNagasena 6y agoWhat police efficiency during BLM protests? I have seen so many videos of looting and disorder that’s enough for a couple of years for Russia and China to use in propaganda to justify their police state.
- TeaDrunk 6y agoThey fenced off the entire white house property and brutalized anyone who tried to cross the fence during BLM. These people apparently can just walk right in without even a bit of tear gas.
- mhh__ 6y agoWell they tear gassed some protestors - not looters, basically just people milling around compared to this - so Donnie could hold a Bible upside down outside a church.
- LudwigNagasena 6y agoThey also let protestors take over a part of Seattle and declare an autonomous zone without police for a few weeks until two kids were shot.
- 8note 6y agoAnd also put up tall barriers so people inside the chop couldnt see when someone was gonna do a Dover by shooting
- input_sh 6y agoHere's police in front of US capitol during a BLM protest: https://twitter.com/Vanessid/status/1346906560769839107 https://twitter.com/Vanessid/status/1346906560769839107 Compare it to what you see today.
- LudwigNagasena 6y agoThis is a photo of the DC National Guard at the Lincoln memorial. This is not the front of the US capitol. They couldn’t prevent Gucci stores from being vandalized but they have preserved one of the iconic buildings of the US. At least they have their priorities straight.
- burnthrow 6y agoadios
- TeaDrunk 6y agoThey broke the windows of the capitol to enter it, and still made it all the way inside and are still roving.
- danbolt 6y agoI think the people there are looking for a grand narrative with the feeling of a struggle between two sides. My guess is that Washington is attempting to avoid creating that environment to minimize conflict. That's why we see the burglars strolling like tourists guided by red velvet. [1] As a disclaimer, I'm not American, so take my feelings with a grain of salt. [1] https://twitter.com/JenniferJJacobs/status/1346902358006104064 https://twitter.com/JenniferJJacobs/status/13469023580061040...
- SkyMarshal 6y agoI’m American and that possibility has occurred to me too. The police are trying to manage the situation without inflaming it, and especially without creating some Tienenmann-lite incident of violence.
- danbolt 6y agoI think there's a bit of honesty to it as well. I bet the burglars need to see themselves as breaking into Mordor and challenging Sauron to save Middle-Earth. As much as Congress houses difficult things like partisan deadlock and lobbying, it's not a villain's lair in an action movie. I think it was smart of the capitol organizers to ensure Congress was secure, and then stay away from posturing like a James Bond villain.
- csomar 6y agoThey are armed. You can't use tear gas against weapons but guns. Using guns will lead to deaths either way, so I think they are taking the correct stance.
- hertzrat 6y agoSeveral people have claimed this, but none of the news sources mention it
- InitialLastName 6y agoCSPAN reporting at least one law enforcement officer transferred to the hospital with a gunshot wound.
- hertzrat 6y agoThat sucks. I hope they are okay
- 13415 6y agoI haven't found a picture of a protester carrying a gun, but there are certainly vandals with clubs and bulletproof vests inside the Capitol, and some of them have broken into offices: https://www.nytimes.com/live/2021/01/06/us/washington-dc-protests#in-photos-chaos-inside-the-chambers-of-congress https://www.nytimes.com/live/2021/01/06/us/washington-dc-pro...
- 8note 6y agoYou can still use tear gas. If countries weren't afraid of other gasses being used in war, they'd use tear gas on the battlefield
- kortilla 6y agoBLM took over an entire section of Seattle for weeks.
- delecti 6y agoThe cops pulled out before that happened, and it was quite peaceful there while that was going on. It's really not the same situation.
- viridian 6y agoI'm not defending what's going on here, but CHAZ/CHOP had a higher murder rate than Somalia because of unelected volunteer "private security". Not sure how you see that as peaceful.
- ubercore 6y agoSource, please. For both parts of that claim.
- themaninthedark 6y agoI'm sure that was hyperbole, CHAZ/CHOP has 2 deaths and 4 wounded in a 24 day period. So the murder rate is 2/24=0.0833_ Somalia had a murder rate of 599 deaths in 2015. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate#By_country,_region,_or_dependent_territory https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intention... 599/365=1.641 That being said, at least 1 of the killings at the CHAZ/CHOP was by the self proclaimed security forces. As far as I know no one has ever been identified or held accountable. If the idea is that you do not need police/ want to hold them to greater accountability because they are violent and kill innocent people but your replacement does the same thing...then what is the point?
- bumby 6y agoMurder rates are typically reported on a per capita basis, not per day rate. Siri is reporting CHAZ had a population of 80(??) and Somolia a population of 15MM. The respective per capita rates would be 0.025 and ~3.99e-5
- awnird 6y agoThe police and the fascists are on the same side.
- hertzrat 6y ago“The Police” is an over generalization. We shouldn’t ask the police to both intervene while also calling all of them fascists.
- bilbo0s 6y agoWhat we probably shouldn't have done was to hire the people we hired to be police in the first place. That was the mistake from which all others followed. If the people you hire to police your laws will only police the laws they want to police, or even worse, will only police the laws against a certain demographic of people, then you don't have a police force. And acting like these people are police inevitably leads to scenes like the one we see today.
- eyelidlessness 6y agoWe can’t identify a problem and demand a solution?
- hertzrat 6y agoThere are police officers who mean well and also officers who abuse their power; and police forces in different places have different institutional cultures and leadership, some of which are odious and some of which are good. "The Police" is a very broad term
- eyelidlessness 6y agoLook, it’s not like the bad apples theory hasn’t been debated to death. If you’re uncomfortable with the “good apples” being tarnished by the “bad apples”, you’ll have a better impact by working to change the pervasive culture of: - those “bad apples” being almost universally exempt from meaningful accountability proportional to their power and actions - those “good apples” being unwilling to lead those accountability efforts, or even to just distance themselves from the “bad apples” to set a better example - the clear and consistent bias overall in favor of these far right/fascist actors, including numerous times being caught on camera actively coordinating and ample video evidence of such bias in plain view If “the police” don’t want to be viewed as a homogeneous pro-fascist force, they need to not act like one.
- user982 6y agoPolice are standing back and standing by. https://twitter.com/jazmineulloa/status/1346898566703435779 https://twitter.com/jazmineulloa/status/1346898566703435779 https://twitter.com/igorbobic/status/1346902299466203145 https://twitter.com/igorbobic/status/1346902299466203145 https://twitter.com/bubbaprog/status/1346920198461419520 https://twitter.com/bubbaprog/status/1346920198461419520
- MivLives 6y agoIt's being live streamed on Twitch by people inside too. They locked them inside.
- hertzrat 6y agoThere is nothing those protestors would like more than a violent response. Imagine the social media response. The leadership is scared of sparking a bigger fire
- Ancapistani 6y ago> Imagine the social media response No, this is a key difference between the sides of this issue. The people in DC aren’t looking for a response on social media - they’re looking for a response in real life, with arms if necessary. I think they may well get it this time, too. The Left doesn’t seem to realize the table stakes are different with this.
- 8note 6y agoThey aren't really though. There's nothing particularly special about DC. The same sentators and congress can meet anywhere to do their job, and just ignore these folks
- SpicyLemonZest 6y agoWhat'll really spark a bigger fire is if the protesters are given time to do what they say they want, and recruit some congressmembers to declare Trump the election winner.
- hertzrat 6y agoThey lose if they do something as distasteful as blackmail congressmembers to take a vote. They would lose support from everybody
- cmurf 6y agoThis is nonsense, it's not how it works, Congress cannot choose the president unless no candidate gets a majority of Electoral College votes. Trump unquestionably lacks a majority of state certified Electoral College votes. And Biden unquestionably has a majority of state certified Electoral College votes - and per the Electoral Counts Act those certifications made by the safe harbor date, which was December 8, cannot be disputed by Congress. Everything else going on is a show. And it is working insofar as Trump's sore loser supporters have sent him more money after the election than before the election. They love the lies. They hate the truth. They lack the coping skill to deal with truth, so they sign up for the lies. They purchase lies as a product, that is what Trump sells. It's who he has always been and always will be. Trump right now: we had an election, that was stolen from us, it was a landslide election, and everyone knows it, especially the other side...but you have to go home now, we have to have peace. they took it away from me, from you, from our country this was a fraudulent election...so many are treated with evil...go home in peace Translation: We won, but you gotta go home. They stole from me, from you, from the country, but you gotta go home. They are evil, but you gotta go home. He is unfit for office. He's ill. The proper thing to do is wrap up the counting of ascertained Electoral College votes, declare Biden the winner. And then the House should immediately impeach Trump. And then the Senators can choose to remove him from office and ban him from ever holding public office again. That is the proper way to end this.