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Apple blocks game streaming services unless individual games are approved
- gameswithgo 6y agoapple no longer makes computers for people who actually like tech, they make easy mode devices for normals
- reaperducer 6y agoapple no longer makes computers for people who actually like tech, they make easy mode devices for normals Since 1984. That was the whole point of the Macintosh.
- mattkevan 6y agoWhat’s so bad about that?
- skunkworker 6y agoTheir processor technology is ahead of every android phone on the market, and they put their high end cpu into their low end device (iPhone SE).
- immigrantsheep 6y agoI really don't notice Instagram or Twitter or my mail client running any faster on my iPhone than on my Android device.
- ljm 6y agoWasn't even a year ago that I was singing Apple's praises for focussing on privacy. I don't feel the same way any more, and I've been happier with an Android device since.
- madjam002 6y agoI’m on iPhone thinking of making the switch too. Any privacy tips you recommend for Android?
- canofbars 6y agoThe only thing you can do to retain some level of privacy is find a phone with great lineageOS support, install with no gapps, install fdroid as a system app so it can manage updates. You still won't get kernel updates when security issues come around because not even the OEM can update that without convincing all the vendors to update their blobs.
- monetus 6y agoI'm not who you replied to but using privacy focused apps from the F-droid store when you can rather than the play store is a good start.
- 29083011397778 6y agoIt really depends where you fall between John Doe and Richard Stallman. In no particular order: - Disable GApps. Note that this can absolutely be done without root [1], as I've done so on my BlackBerry KeyOne and a previous LG G6. This has the additional benefit of a dramatically faster UI on nearly any device. - Use F-Droid instead of the Google Play Store when possible. If you've disabled GApps like I have, the Aurora Store can be used to fill in the few apps your employer may require. - Use web versions of apps when possible. mbasic.facebook.com or simply facebook.com is a reasonable alternative to the app, and won't steal you contacts. The former even allows messages to be sent without the app :) - Use a custom ROM. Note that this will require an unlocked bootloader and either a maintainer for your phone, or to build LineageOS for yourself. - Minimize permissions you give apps. Don't get thrown when some apps request Location when you don't think they need though: Google has tied Location to Network Access, meaning you must grant Location Access for most apps to see Bluetooth & WiFi networks (which could reasonably be used as a proxy for your location). - Unless you need it, don't leave Bluetooth on all the time. Retail locations use Bluetooth beacons to ping devices and follow consumers through the store. Bluetooth is reasonably localized, and gives the retailer fascinating data relating to where you went, how long (or if) you lingered in front of junk food, if you had to search for something, where you went first, and possibly payment card information (waiting in line vs walking away after a payment is made at a certain terminal). [1] https://www.xda-developers.com/disable-system-app-bloatware-android/ https://www.xda-developers.com/disable-system-app-bloatware-...
- pumanoir 6y agoI've used iphones from the 6s till 11 and this week I switched to an android. I hadn't realized how limiting iOS is.
- sharken 6y agoFor me it’s the anti-gaming sentiment that Apple promotes which is at fault. Not going back to Apple until they change their ways. So hello Sony Xperia 5 II and goodbye IPhone 11.
- reader_mode 6y agoI doubt they are anti gaming - they spotlighted League of Legends mobile in the iPhone 12 launch. They just want to milk everything on the app store. I'm so torn on Apple - on the one hand their ecosystem is the most complete and works the best, but on the other hand they try to take a cut from every revenue stream on their platforms, keep a walled garden and often lock out things that are useful to me. For example iPad pro is an amazing tablet - hardware wise - I would use it as a on the go dev machine - but iOS is so pointlessly locked down I couldn't use it for anything non-trivial. Compare that to an Android device where I can get Linux userland running or Windows tablets. But then Apple couldn't monetise all my apps on the device. Samsung is the closest you can get to Apple ecosystem but they suck badly - their hardware is acceptable but software is nowhere near close - apps are bad, bixby is horrible, tizen OS is missing basic stuff. Microsoft could be a player here but they just started experimenting with mobile after a long time, they have no wearable, and the surface line seems promising but always has that one or two flaws that makes it unsatisfying. I'm hoping they can create something in the future, I have no expectations from Samsung - they seem both incompetent and insistent on doing their own thing when it comes to software.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- gpanders 6y agoTheir App Store team is completely shooting the rest of Apple in the foot, and I’m amazed that no one there seems to realize this. They are burning good will faster than they can create it.
- FloatArtifact 6y agoThis includes platforms to stream games from users local PC to clients. As an example RainWay https://rainway.com/ https://rainway.com/ So this ban is broader than the article suggest.
- nitrogen 6y agoI don't use an iPhone/etc so I'm curious, do they block remote desktop applications?
- saagarjha 6y agoNo.
- AsyncAwait 6y agoNo they don't. They don't have a competing service there yet.
- threeseed 6y agoApple Remote Desktop has been around for nearly 20 years.
- AsyncAwait 6y agoThat's not a 'service', which is the key part. There's no 'services revenue' to be had there.
- nikitaga 6y agoThey don't make billions of dollars from it like they do from app store.
- cma 6y agoThey did block steam link remote desktop for a while
- zepto 6y ago
- friedman23 6y agoThis is a losing proposition for apple.
- dathinab 6y agoWhats next iphones only opening approved websites? EDIT: While that seems super sarcastic. Consider this: Game streaming services are in the end just a gateway app to games, in the same way the browser is a gateway to the internet. Furthermore apple already did hinder "browserish" gateways, like apps which are a gateway to more ergonomically reading word-press blogs or message apps which where gateways to a federated "internet of messaging".
- A4ET8a8uTh0 6y agoIt honestly does not seem very far fetched especially given recent fortnite news ( https://www.slashgear.com/fortnite-iphone-workaround-may-bypass-apple-thanks-to-nvidia-05645906/ https://www.slashgear.com/fortnite-iphone-workaround-may-byp... ).
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- selsta 6y agoApple encourages streaming services to use Safari: https://www.engadget.com/luna-amazon-cloud-gaming-interview-pwa-apple-173948922.html https://www.engadget.com/luna-amazon-cloud-gaming-interview-...
- pjc50 6y agoThey'd try that if they thought they could get away with it.
- threeseed 6y agoApp Store has been around for over a decade with largely the same rules. It is their platform and ultimately they have a right to determine what apps they do or do not approve. Whether it's streaming or not is completely irrelevant.
- hu3 6y agoAnd we have the right to criticise rules.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- 627467 6y agoSeems odd (to be charitable and say the least)... Do they vet music/movie streaming services content too?
- threeseed 6y agoApple has always distinguished between interactive apps and read/view-only content. Music/Movies are in all countries regulated by well established rules which govern what level of objectionable content is permitted i.e. you will never find porn on Netflix. Apps/Games have similar regulations in some countries but definitely not all. So Apple has opted to "fill in the blanks".
- lern_too_spel 6y agoNetflix has interactive movies that are like games.
- threeseed 6y agoIt is still a movie and so would be regulated under existing movie classification systems. And since movies are over a century old every country has a similar regulatory framework. Most countries do not have an equivalent for apps/games and so it is ultimately left to Apple to regulate.
- sushid 6y ago> Most countries do not have an equivalent for apps/games and so it is ultimately left to Apple to regulate. We literally have ESRB that's a whole lot less arbitrary than Apple's review system.
- threeseed 6y agoESRB isn't for apps and is US only. Hence my point that there isn't a global regulatory framework for apps/games like there is for music/movies.
- cblconfederate 6y agoMaybe they are seeking "special arrangements" from major providers, like their very lucrative search agreement with google. Maybe that's Apple's model going forward.
- flak48 6y agoSo what Apple is saying is basically "Nice app you've got there, shame if anything happened to it"
- akmarinov 6y ago7 of August? I believe that was discussed back then.
- falcolas 6y agoIt was. And Microsoft said they're moving to a web app, like Luna is currently doing.
- sillysaurusx 6y agoApple has always wanted to block "browser" type apps. If it can be used to install or view hundreds of other apps, then it's probably not a good fit for the iOS garden. We willingly give Apple money under this premise. I'm not sure why this is surprising.
- _hao 6y agoHow do apps like WeChat are allowed then? There are entire platforms and mini-programs inside.
- kinkrtyavimoodh 6y agoSection 5.1.2(iii) of the App Store Review Guidelines has a special exception for Apps with a 1 billion install base from a country where the government doesn't give two hoots about your App Store Review Guidelines.
- andreasley 6y agoThat's simply not true. To the people saying it's obviously a joke: The App Store Review Guidelines have become huge and I wouldn't have been surprised to find something like this in there, although not in these exact words. Actually, I wish the App Store Review Guidelines WOULD state exceptions like the one mentioned. At least that would be transparent.
- manigandham 6y agoIt's not a real guideline, they were making a joke. But it's true that Apple risks alienating their iOS user base there if they try to ban WeChat now.
- chottocharaii 6y agoSeems obvious that was a joke
- saagarjha 6y ago
- gman83 6y agoIt's weird that they specifically worked with Amazon to make their Luna game streaming service work as a PWA on iOS: “We worked with the Safari team to ensure that some of the things that weren't there are there, and that allowed us to kind of get to where we are today,” Luna head of engineering and technology George Tsipolitis said. https://www.engadget.com/luna-amazon-cloud-gaming-interview-pwa-apple-173948922.html https://www.engadget.com/luna-amazon-cloud-gaming-interview-...
- als0 6y agoI don't think it's weird that the Safari team work with big developers. They want to make their mobile browser competitive with other browsers, particularly ones that support advanced features that enable cloud gaming.
- jagged-chisel 6y ago"Safari team" doesn't necessarily have the same motivations as "App Store review team." Apple, as a company, needs to play nice with the web.
- gfxgirl 6y agolol. There's a reason Safari is called the new IE. So many features missing or buggy, not following standards.
- zinekeller 6y agoActually, most developers with an opinion on "new IE" says that Google Chrome is the new IE. There are cases of Firefox and Safari implementing features and Chrome-specific behavior that they won't endorse but are used by webistes (notably, unsurprisingly, Google's sites) [1, 2, 3]. Additionally, there are features that most have requested but are effectively being blocked by Google [3]. 1: https://hacks.mozilla.org/2020/04/twitter-direct-message-caching-and-firefox/ https://hacks.mozilla.org/2020/04/twitter-direct-message-cac... 2: If you have Firefox, browse about:compat to see Firefox's workarounds to websites which relies on Chrome-specific behavior. 3: Firefox implementing a wholesale change that maps "-webkit"-prefixed CSS properties (usually implemented by Chrome even, so Google should used "-blink" (the name of their HTML/CSS engine) since "-webkit" is for Safari's changes) to the standard and/or "-moz" equivalents for websites who are using it. 4: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24959588 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24959588
- baud147258 6y agointeresting how the title here omit that it's about Microsoft's game streaming services. Because in that case it could be that Apple is specially going after a concurrent rather than just being annoying
- PaulHoule 6y agoThis is such genius. Somebody had to throw cold water on the bubble idea of game streaming.
- m463 6y agoI can't imagine this isn't epic/fortnite specific
- strictnein 6y agoIt's not, at all. They're also blocking Microsoft's Xbox game streaming.
- vaccinator 6y agoIts not at all because there is one more target...
- sidpatil 6y agoIt doesn't seem like a coincidence, since this showed up recently: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25003441 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25003441
- Aeolun 6y agoThis is silly. They’re not seperately approving every app on my VNC server either.
- bluedino 6y agoYou’re not VNC’ing into a game machine, though.
- ineedasername 6y agoHow do you know? I've done it before.
- soulofmischief 6y agoI remote into gaming machines on my phone. What is the difference between a game and an app with respect to personal liberties?
- bluedino 6y agoahem a game machine you’re playing rented games on VNC is used for machine you already own, so that’s why it’s allowed.
- bigmattystyles 6y agoThe machine is rented, in many cases, you already own the game.
- Rebelgecko 6y agoYes I am
- jonny_eh 6y agoshadow.tech is available via the App Store ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
- nvrspyx 6y agoAfter fighting takedowns from Apple for years.
- CountHackulus 6y agoRemember when Apple only allowed web apps through pinned links on the home screen? How things have changed since the 3G.
- throwawaysea 6y agoIf this is their policy, how can we trust that Apple won't then move to censoring websites in the browser? Or even taking control of DNS?
- Barrin92 6y agoJust more evidence that large platform and device owners will try to gate-keep and landgrab as much as they can and try to destroy the open web and force competitors into financial agreements to collect economic rent. There finally needs to be regulation on this. No banning of end user services as long as they're legal, I don't want a phone maker controlling what I do on the internet. It's ridiculous. Microsoft in the 90s doesn't even compare to this, it's on an entirely different level. If competition regulation would actually still exist we'd tear apple a new one.
- jMyles 6y ago> There finally needs to be regulation on this. No banning of end user services as long as they're legal I was with you up until this moment. Doesn't this just shift the power to a less accountable authority in the state? What about content that isn't legal but which is, you know, not child abuse or similar? Does that deserve a platform also? I think that being able to view content on a phone regardless of its approval by the state is essential to a free society. And, as always, the question is: legal where? Healthier is for people to find and enact workarounds to this censorship, and to cause Apple to be unable to profitably proceed.
- danielheath 6y agoThe state already bans illegal content. The question is whether we also want a second party banning it.
- jMyles 6y agoIt seems to me that society desperately needs parties working to subvert such bans. Requiring that private companies instead actively participate in it seems like exactly the opposite.
- HashThis 6y agoApple is a crony capitalist company looking to collect rents from other people's work. We need to aggressively call out Apple for being a crony capitalist company rigging the economy. Crony capitalist companies break competition to rig the economy. That is what Apple is doing by working to collect rents from other people's work.
- shmerl 6y agoGood reason for users to ditch Apple.
- __m 6y agoNot really. Stadia wasn’t exactly a big success either
- shmerl 6y agoI don't think this should be even the main reason. But it's as good as many others, it just extends the list.
- Apocryphon 6y agoGeForce Now is quite good.
- shmerl 6y agoI think it started OK, just as a VM renting service where you could run games you already bought in any store. But it went sideways when they started restricting what kind of games you can run. At least Google Stadia makes developers port games to Linux. Geforce Now isn't doing anything like that.
- p0nce 6y agoDevice makers should stay in their device-making roles.
- factotvm 6y agoApple is, and has been for a very long time, both a hardware and software company. They sell this as an advantage. Since long before the iPhone was a thing. “More and more, software is getting integrated into the hardware… Yesterday’s software is today’s hardware. Those two things are merging. And the line between hardware and software is going to get finer and finer and finer. And one of the ways that we’re approaching the problem of trying to remove the barrier is to try to look ahead a few years and try to make some predictions at how the technologies are merging, and at the same time very carefully looking at the kinds of high level tools our customers are going to need and trying to make those two points the same target.“ —Steve Jobs, 1980
- nitwit005 6y agoFeels like an opportunity for malicious compliance by requesting approval of a massive set of games. I'm sure Microsoft can produce a list of a few thousand given their acquisitions and licensing deals.
- stjohnswarts 6y agoThis is just petty on their part.
- tomasreimers 6y ago"If people had understood how patents would be granted when most of today's ideas were invented and had taken out patents, the industry would be at a complete standstill today"; "The solution is patenting as much as we can... a future startup with no patents of its own will be forced to pay whatever price the giants impose. That price might be high: Established companies have an interest in excluding future competitors" - Bill Gates, cited in https://youtu.be/uH4RskpUFiA?t=1069 https://youtu.be/uH4RskpUFiA?t=1069 I believe what formerly happened with Software patents is currently happening with platforms. Lawrence Lessig (if you haven't read his works, highly recommend) talks a lot about how copyright is used to restrict creativity / culture / innovation. In this talk [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uH4RskpUFiA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uH4RskpUFiA] he makes the case that: 1. Creativity and innovation always builds on the past 2. The past always tries to control the creativity that builds on it 3. Free societies enable the future by limiting the past 4. Ours is less, and less, a free society What's fascinating is Apple has gone a step above and beyond here to use their control over a platform to control the innovations built upon it. The end-state is that no one can do to Apple what Apple did to other players (leveraging free software--Unix--and open hardware Schemas to kick off their computing platform). This pattern is one we've seen with other players, and will result in more and more people "defensively" building out platforms (what I suspect Google is doing with Android and FB with Oculus; if Apple's monopoly is allowed to stand it's only reasonable that other companies will need competing personal-computing platforms as a bargaining chip).
- mlindner 6y agoGood, Apple shouldn't let random people run whatever virus infected nonsense they want on phones.
- swiley 6y agoThe only reason to have a native app for this is marketing. Really this goes for the majority of iOS apps since native apps can't do a whole lot anyway. This doesn't even need push notifications though, I don't know why anyone would bother putting up with all the crap native apps take just to have to deal with all the crap apple gives you.
- blntechie 6y agoApple is going to get lot of flak for this and rightfully so. Do they really watch all the videos YouTube or Netflix has to offer to review and approve?
- fakedang 6y agoToo bad no one will take Apple to court after all these shenanigans. It's quite funny actually, I was planning to join the Apple ecosystem with a new iPhone this year, and then they pull all of these shenanigans.
- woah 6y agoApple has always individually approved apps on iPhone. Is that news to anyone here? Why would they change that policy just because of some low-level implementation detail around whether the interface is rendered on the server or the client?
- umvi 6y agoApple doesn't have to approve every video streamed from the YouTube app. Apple doesn't have to approve every website accessed from a browser app. So why does apple have to approve every video game accessible though a video game streaming app?
- freakynit 6y agoI say all companies should boycott Apple until it learns to play fairly. Apple is nothing if majority of bigger services and apps are not available on it's app store while available elsewhere. People should realize this is similar to uniting and revolting against dictatorships. The premise of the situation is same. Apple should realize it's 1 trillion+ valuation is nothing if no one buys or sells anything to/from it.
- raghavtoshniwal 6y agoJust trying to think functionally here: Netflix now has “interactive” video content (see: Bandersnatch). Isn’t a streaming video game service same as “interactive” video. If so, isn’t Apple almost saying they’d also have to approve every video on the Netflix platform? Or am I missing something?
- dang 6y agoLooks like this had several threads over the summer: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24084373 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24084373 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24444987 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24444987 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24077615 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24077615
- charliebrownau 6y agoStop using Corporations Stop using cloud Stop using closed source Let the corrupt diversity infected corporations die under its own stupidy and greed and malpractice
- charliebrownau 6y agoStreaming options - Dlive + Entropy - JoshwhoTV + Entropy - Self hosted solutions