10 ms·

> We demonstrate a range of pre-existing memory CD4+ T cells that are cross-reactive with comparable affinity to SARS-CoV-2 and the common cold coronaviruses HC

> We demonstrate a range of pre-existing memory CD4+ T cells that are cross-reactive with comparable affinity to SARS-CoV-2 and the common cold coronaviruses HCoV-OC43, HCoV-229E, HCoV-NL63, or HCoV-HKU1. Thus, variegated T cell memory to coronaviruses that cause the common cold may underlie at least some of the extensive heterogeneity observed in COVID-19 disease. Could we just start deliberately spreading these weaker cold viruses then?

el_benhameen 6y ago
My kids are ahead of the curve. They've been doing that for years.
- RhysU 6y ago
  It's like (cue Jurassic Park music) life finds a way.
- greesil 6y ago
  I really would like to see some data if parents of younger children fare better than others in the same age range.
- snowwrestler 6y ago
  Good joke, but since we're talking about kids... there is obviously more to Covid-19 heterogeneity than previous exposure to coronaviruses, since very young children are least likely to experience serious illness, but are also least likely to have a lot of exposure to other coronaviruses.
  - w0utert 6y ago
    One of the theories is that the density of the ACE2 receptor the virus binds to, is somehow correlated with testosterone levels, which is very low for young children, and low for women compared to men. This would provide an explanation why severe cases are extremely rare in young children, and comparatively high for men vs. women.
CyanLite4 6y ago
Many of those like OC43 and NL63 are extremely deadly to the elderly and have been known to have around 5-8% mortality in nursing homes. For everyone else, we should have a vaccine in the next 2-3 months.
- epmaybe 6y ago
  I really doubt that we will have a vaccine for the general population in 2-3mo. No vaccine manufacturer that I know of is even expecting phase 3 results until the end of this year at the earliest. And then you have to start using supply for first responders, healthcare workers, etc. and then move to gen. pop.
  - SpicyLemonZest 6y ago
    We won't have enough supply for the general population, but ramping up the supply of a cold virus inoculation would run into mostly the same challenges.
    - __blockcipher__ 6y ago
      It should theoretically be a lot more scalable to just culture en masse. Since you’re not doing any modifications. Altho if they required testing of the culture to ensure no mutation that would slow things down
      - vibrio 6y ago
        Growing wild-type coronavirus is easier than making the current vaccine approaches? How/Why? As someone familiar with virology and cGMPs, I don’t see how that is the case.
        __blockcipher__ 6y ago
        My thinking is that culturing massive amounts is incredibly scalable since there's no need to inactivate or perform other steps to render the virus safe. You're just culturing a fuckton of virus in a medium like agar.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
sjg007 6y ago
We already are.
vikramkr 6y ago
Maybe, but thats basically developing a new vaccine, and in the time it takes to test that out and make sure it's safe and effective, we'd already have other vaccines on the market that might be more likely to be effective. Theres also the risk of antibody dependent enhancement where a competing immune effect makes the disease worse if previously infected with a different strain as seen in the dengue family
- djsumdog 6y ago
  It's silly to think we're going to have a safe vaccine on the market any time soon. It'd probably be safer to give everyone coronavirus common cold viruses if it can build an immunity. ..and Immune Enhancement Syndrome one of the serious consequences of the SARS1 and MERS vaccines that never made it past their trials. There are a lot of factors to immunity beyond antibodies. Traditional vaccines are either close viruses in the animal world (horsepox for smallpox) or heat treated inactivated virus (flu). We know they produce anitbodies, but there are hundreds of other parts of our immune system (complement system, inane, etc.) that might interact and form memory as well. Vaccines come out of bad places; from eras where hundreds if not thousands of people were going blind, dying or getting paralyzed by disease. It was easier to just test things on people back then too, and a lot of them died (Chinese were inoculating people with actual smallpox 300 years before Jenner discovered making a vaccine from Cowpox/horsepox). In the 1970s, the Swing Flu vaccine was a disaster. Sure millions of people got the vaccine and were fine, but 3,000 people developed Guillain-Barre syndrome. Some still have trouble walking or smiling (see the 60 Minutes documentary from that era) Vaccines need a lot of testing. I do not understand why we're trusting the man who gave us Windows 95 to lead the Gates/Gavi alliance responsible for giving us a "safe" vaccine in less than a year. That's insane.
  - SpicyLemonZest 6y ago
    The problem is that, at least in some populations, these viruses are only moderately less dangerous than COVID-19. There are recorded nursing home outbreaks (e.g. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2095096/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2095096/) where a common cold coronavirus killed 5-8% of residents.
blargmaster33 6y ago
GOD NO! The Covid vaccine market will be a bananza! Billions will be made!!
mke 6y ago
Why not just test everyone for t-cell reactivity to SARS-CoV-2? The general population already has broad coronavirus exposure. If your test reveals no immune reaction, you are clearly a candidate for extended quarantine. If you have an immune reaction, now what? More study needed. Can you be safely exposed? Something must explain the rampant asymptomatic carrier rate.
m3kw9 6y ago
We don’t know which viruses can also enhance the virus severity.
andrewseanryan 6y ago
As a simple problem solving thought experiment, I’ve been saying the same thing (purposeful infection with a cold virus). It’s not likely to be an outcome that we would want to use, but from my laymen perspective it sounds much easier than creating a vaccine (the cold virus already exists). But of course testing would have to take place and it could actually make things worse. While the solution has not yet been identified 100%, we should be looking at everything. That is just good problem solving.

el_benhameen 6y ago

My kids are ahead of the curve. They've been doing that for years.

RhysU 6y ago
It's like (cue Jurassic Park music) life finds a way.
greesil 6y ago
I really would like to see some data if parents of younger children fare better than others in the same age range.
snowwrestler 6y ago
Good joke, but since we're talking about kids... there is obviously more to Covid-19 heterogeneity than previous exposure to coronaviruses, since very young children are least likely to experience serious illness, but are also least likely to have a lot of exposure to other coronaviruses.
- w0utert 6y ago
  One of the theories is that the density of the ACE2 receptor the virus binds to, is somehow correlated with testosterone levels, which is very low for young children, and low for women compared to men. This would provide an explanation why severe cases are extremely rare in young children, and comparatively high for men vs. women.

CyanLite4 6y ago

Many of those like OC43 and NL63 are extremely deadly to the elderly and have been known to have around 5-8% mortality in nursing homes. For everyone else, we should have a vaccine in the next 2-3 months.

epmaybe 6y ago
I really doubt that we will have a vaccine for the general population in 2-3mo. No vaccine manufacturer that I know of is even expecting phase 3 results until the end of this year at the earliest. And then you have to start using supply for first responders, healthcare workers, etc. and then move to gen. pop.
- SpicyLemonZest 6y ago
  We won't have enough supply for the general population, but ramping up the supply of a cold virus inoculation would run into mostly the same challenges.
  - __blockcipher__ 6y ago
    It should theoretically be a lot more scalable to just culture en masse. Since you’re not doing any modifications. Altho if they required testing of the culture to ensure no mutation that would slow things down
    - vibrio 6y ago
      Growing wild-type coronavirus is easier than making the current vaccine approaches? How/Why? As someone familiar with virology and cGMPs, I don’t see how that is the case.
      - __blockcipher__ 6y ago
        My thinking is that culturing massive amounts is incredibly scalable since there's no need to inactivate or perform other steps to render the virus safe. You're just culturing a fuckton of virus in a medium like agar.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

sjg007 6y ago

We already are.

vikramkr 6y ago

Maybe, but thats basically developing a new vaccine, and in the time it takes to test that out and make sure it's safe and effective, we'd already have other vaccines on the market that might be more likely to be effective. Theres also the risk of antibody dependent enhancement where a competing immune effect makes the disease worse if previously infected with a different strain as seen in the dengue family

djsumdog 6y ago
It's silly to think we're going to have a safe vaccine on the market any time soon. It'd probably be safer to give everyone coronavirus common cold viruses if it can build an immunity. ..and Immune Enhancement Syndrome one of the serious consequences of the SARS1 and MERS vaccines that never made it past their trials. There are a lot of factors to immunity beyond antibodies. Traditional vaccines are either close viruses in the animal world (horsepox for smallpox) or heat treated inactivated virus (flu). We know they produce anitbodies, but there are hundreds of other parts of our immune system (complement system, inane, etc.) that might interact and form memory as well. Vaccines come out of bad places; from eras where hundreds if not thousands of people were going blind, dying or getting paralyzed by disease. It was easier to just test things on people back then too, and a lot of them died (Chinese were inoculating people with actual smallpox 300 years before Jenner discovered making a vaccine from Cowpox/horsepox). In the 1970s, the Swing Flu vaccine was a disaster. Sure millions of people got the vaccine and were fine, but 3,000 people developed Guillain-Barre syndrome. Some still have trouble walking or smiling (see the 60 Minutes documentary from that era) Vaccines need a lot of testing. I do not understand why we're trusting the man who gave us Windows 95 to lead the Gates/Gavi alliance responsible for giving us a "safe" vaccine in less than a year. That's insane.
- SpicyLemonZest 6y ago
  The problem is that, at least in some populations, these viruses are only moderately less dangerous than COVID-19. There are recorded nursing home outbreaks (e.g. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2095096/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2095096/) where a common cold coronavirus killed 5-8% of residents.

blargmaster33 6y ago

GOD NO! The Covid vaccine market will be a bananza! Billions will be made!!

mke 6y ago

Why not just test everyone for t-cell reactivity to SARS-CoV-2? The general population already has broad coronavirus exposure. If your test reveals no immune reaction, you are clearly a candidate for extended quarantine. If you have an immune reaction, now what? More study needed. Can you be safely exposed? Something must explain the rampant asymptomatic carrier rate.

m3kw9 6y ago

We don’t know which viruses can also enhance the virus severity.

andrewseanryan 6y ago

As a simple problem solving thought experiment, I’ve been saying the same thing (purposeful infection with a cold virus). It’s not likely to be an outcome that we would want to use, but from my laymen perspective it sounds much easier than creating a vaccine (the cold virus already exists). But of course testing would have to take place and it could actually make things worse. While the solution has not yet been identified 100%, we should be looking at everything. That is just good problem solving.