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Why is America stuck with bad headlights?

• oblib 6y ago
  I was not aware there were headlights that had a light pattern like that. Looks pretty cool. Years ago (`70s-90`s) when I built custom cars it was a pretty huge deal when the rectangular headlamps were approved. It created new ways to style the front end of a car, but we all were jealous of what they were doing in Europe with headlamp designs. The new LED headlamps offer way more styling opportunities and better lighting, but it's not surprising to learn we're still behind Europeans in regards to this.
• Reason077 6y ago
  Lack of matrix headlights is a glaring omission on Teslas sold in Europe, too. Pretty much any other high-end car in Europe has them, at least as an option.
  • TheSpiceIsLife 6y ago
    What are matrix headlights?
    • ebg13 6y ago
      It's described in the article.
    • deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
    • Kiro 6y ago
      You're commenting on an article that is basically just a short description of matrix headlights asking what matrix headlights are.
    • rogem002 6y ago
      High beam lights which turn off in sections to not blind other drivers. They're pretty neat! You can drive on a highway, have high beams lighting up signs but not dazzling other drivers.
    • squidlogic 6y ago
      Sometimes known as pixel lighting, matrix systems are based around a high-beam unit consisting of a cluster of LEDs (the Audi matrix system consists of up to 25 LEDs per high-beam unit), rather than a single high-beam bulb that you might find in a conventional headlight. This allows you to block out certain portions of the beam so you don't blind other drivers as they approach.
      • vidanay 6y ago
        On this type of lighting, what is the purpose of having high and low beams? It seems like you should be able to leave it on high all the time.
        • wil421 6y ago
          Most nicer headlights are shaped[1] in a way that the drivers side beam is shorter than the passenger side beam. You don’t want to blind drivers and it gives the passenger side more visibility. They also adapt to turns. Matrix headlights do the same and much more. High beams illuminate the whole road and not just the ground in the same lane as the car. [1] https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1827/4457/products/3_03867ad6-ac45-4c0f-9846-3733b2a5f35f_800x.jpg?v=1594359799 https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1827/4457/products/3_03867...
        • pandaman 6y ago
          You will blind yourself with your own high beams in heavy rain/snow/fog.
          • luma 6y ago
            Interestingly, a similar version of these systems was demonstrated back in 2012 which could track individual snow flakes or rain drops. They would avoid illuminating the drops so they wouldn’t reflect back at you, thus reducing glare and allowing you to see much further. https://youtu.be/4jwhQM6aDS8 https://youtu.be/4jwhQM6aDS8
            • 6y ago
    • stygiansonic 6y ago
      From the article: “Each of the 911's lighting units includes 84 individually controlled LEDs that allow the car to continuously morph the pattern of its beams. When a car approaches in the oncoming lane, the 911's headlights dim around it while leaving the rest of the pattern bright. The other driver doesn't get blinded, but you still have blazing lights on your side.”
  • justapassenger 6y ago
    Tesla’s lack tons of stuff that’s standard or an option on other high end cars. They need to catch up on things like ventilated and massage seats, HUD, CarPlay, bird view cameras and many many more. They’re effectively simple cars, with powerful computer and drivetrain. Adding localized and very complex feature is likely very low on their to do list, especially as their RD spending is ridiculously low, and trending downward for last few years.
    • TwoBit 6y ago
      I read that Tesla does have ventilated seats. That Tesla isn't a fan of HUDs (I think they are OK but not important at all). That bird view cameras aren't possible unless Tesla moves their existing cameras or adds yet more. It's silly to call them simple because they lack some esoteric features while ignoring useful features they have that other cars don't, such as dynamic software updates (and many others such as their piloting).
      • justapassenger 6y ago
        > I read that Tesla does have ventilated seats. It was very short lived option. > It's silly to call them simple because they lack some esoteric features Esoteric to people buying used 10 Toyota’s (there nothing wrong with that btw). But standard in high end cars. I’ve listed only few that come to top of my head, but it’s very long list, from features, through tiny gadgets in interior, sound insulation, and many others > while ignoring useful features they have that other cars don't, such as dynamic software updates Exactly as I said, powerful computer. Tesla is really good at computer stuff and drivetrain stuff. But they are very poor at rest of the car stuff. There’s nothing wrong with that - different people have different priorities for what they want from their cars. But let’s not dismiss validity of the features, just because someone’s favorite toy doesn’t have them.
    • brianwawok 6y ago
      CarPlay is silly. CarPlay was made for legacy manufacturers who can’t make a decent UI. The UI on Tesla is generally ahead of CarPlay. Not even sure how you would do CarPlay.. a small pop-up window? It couldn’t take over the whole nav or you lose Energy display and a host of other good stuff.
• boring_twenties 6y ago
  I installed the (OEM) European headlights on my car. It's, well, a night and day difference. It's been 8 years and no one has noticed.
  • ars 6y ago
    Do you have inspections in your state?
    • boring_twenties 6y ago
      Yes. Both when I lived in NY, and when I first moved to UT (since then, it's become emissions-only). edit: Err, so I guess no, actually? But I think I answered what you mean, not what you said :)
    • u801e 6y ago
      I've had E-code headlamp assemblies in my car for nearly 20 years. The car has been registered in two states where both do yearly vehicle inspections. No inspector ever failed the vehicle because of the E-code headlamps.
  • anchpop 6y ago
    I didn't know this was possible! Something to keep in mind if I ever buy a nice car.
    • bri3d 6y ago
      depending on the vehicle model, the differences may only be in coding / software, as well, so research that as well before investing money in expensive headlight units. one disadvantage of all of this cool headlight technology is that the modules often cost over $1000 each - painful repair cost for even minor accidents!
    • vuln 6y ago
      I did this on my 2003 Volkswagen GTi. I swapped the Jetta front end onto it and found a set on a vw forum. They were not cheap but it was amazing to have euro stock OEM HIDs while most everyone else I knew were running junk Chinese kits.
• coding123 6y ago
  Even more idiotic is my truck. I put a camper on it. I can't drive it at night because the weight of the camper tilts the entire truck back just a bit so that the head lights are aimed right at driver's eyes even on the lowbeams. Everyone flashes me and gets pissed off. Hopefully Adaptive headlights account for things like this.
  • bri3d 6y ago
    self-leveling is required on bi-xenon headlights even in the US, so this is quite strange. if you have older-style headlights, there should be manual adjustment screws on the lamp housing you can fix this with in a matter of minutes.
    • alistairSH 6y ago
      Bi-xenon lights are mostly reserved for luxury cars in the US. And despite the MSRP, many trucks don't have them (not without buying the fanciest trim level).
  • drewg123 6y ago
    In my state, you would not pass the yearly safety inspection. Can't you just adjust the headlights?
    • stingrae 6y ago
      Of course you would do the safety inspection without the trailer?
      • drewg123 6y ago
        I assumed the OP meant "camper" as a mostly-permanent thing mounted in a pickup truck bed, not a detachable trailer.
        • frosted-flakes 6y ago
          Those are in no way permanent. Many of them even have built-in stands that can lift and support the camper, allowing you to simply drive the truck out from under it.
• pkaye 6y ago
  Is this a standard feature in all European cars? It seems like a premium feature that might eventually trickle down to the average cars.
  • rwmj 6y ago
    It's certainly not a standard feature, at least for normal cars. They're available as an option or as an aftermarket upgrade.
  • formerly_proven 6y ago
    It's an option in pretty much all middle-class cars (e.g. Golf).
  • trzeci 6y ago
    This is not a standard feature of new cars, but it's pretty affordable addition for middle segment cars (In my MPV it was an extra 700$). Premium cars getting this more and more frequently, not LED, but lasers in case of Audi (and VAG).
• serf 6y ago
  groups like Audi/Porsche/BMW have trouble bringing their fancy LED setups to America due to laws pertaining to high / low beams -- meanwhile every Jack and Jill on the road has glaringly illegal aftermarket Xenon bulb setups in refractor headlight housings rather than proper projectors, blinding the hell out of everyone on the road, and the police seem to do nothing about it. I mean, hey -- i'm usually happy about automotive modifications that the police leave me alone about, but this aftermarket headlight trend is many times worse than a nuisance loud exhaust -- it can literally blind you for seconds during night driving.
  • decafninja 6y ago
    re: "aftermarket xenon bulb setups" Is this still a big problem? While I would have agreed with you, say, back in the 2000s when the whole "import tuner" craze was in full swing, I don't think this is popular anymore. The car mod scene seems to be close to extinct now, with whats left being a lot less crazy than those in the past.
    • tw04 6y ago
      IMO it’s WORSE. The new craze are the LED light bars. I had one on my old truck for off-road use, but there are idiots that drive with them turned on driving down public roads. They’re so bright it can take 10+ seconds to see normally again.
      • lotsofpulp 6y ago
        LED light bars should immediately result in an attempted murder conviction.
    • TedDoesntTalk 6y ago
      We also missed out on the yellow sodium headlight craze in Europe during the 80s or 90s. Headlights in the USA must be whitish in color. Anyone know why?
      • bonzini 6y ago
• cbg0 6y ago
  A friend of mine has this type of headlights on his BMW, and while they are very cool at night with the adaptive beams that light the road without blinding other drivers, I can't say that I find them to be a must-have, and I'd be hard-pressed to pay the premium to get them on my car compared to my current xenon lights that can only corner as I turn the wheel. Unless you're frequently driving at night, you'll be just fine with halogen or xenon lights.
  • 01100011 6y ago
    I think if you asked the other drivers they might say that you having adaptive lights is a must have.
    • alkonaut 6y ago
      Is blinding that big a problem? Assuming the lowbeams are well adjusted, they should never blind anyone. The number of times each winter that I forget to switch off my high beams for an oncoming driver and blind him is between zero and one.
      • 01100011 6y ago
        It is to me, but my vision at night isn't the greatest. I see quite a few people with HID/LED lights now and the blue shifted spectrum and poor aiming have caused me problems.
  • boring_twenties 6y ago
    So I paid around $2k for mine. Most people thought I was crazy. But, living at the time in an area with a lot of dark, wooded roads as well as what seemed to me to be an extreme deer overpopulation, I don't regret it one bit.
• ejz 6y ago
  Ah, it's our good old friend, regulation!
  • syshum 6y ago
    It is amazing how libertarian HN is all of a sudden.... Sadly it does not appear they believe the government is source of all this problem, instead they think "just need better regulation" Some people will never learn
  • acdha 6y ago
    This is a great example of what Tyler Cowen referred to as the Libertarian Vice: https://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2006/08/the_libertarian.html https://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2006/08/th... Regulation is not intrinsically good or bad any more than, say, law or any other social convention. If you want to contribute to the conversation you need to discuss the different factors which make a particular example better or worse than alternatives — for example, you could start by asking whether the reason why this innovation from Europe is not available in the U.S. is because Europe does not have regulation or because the quality of that regulation is different.
• projektfu 6y ago
  How well do they work for pedestrians and cyclists?
  • thrill 6y ago
    In the video at TFA the lights appear to self adjust for pedestrians on the right side of the road.
• dominotw 6y ago
  I really hate led headlights here in USA, They are too bright and need to be banned. People using these should be jailed for endangering lives. I don't know why but This seems to be particularly common here on big pickup trucks, which is even worse because they hit you right in your eyes if you are driving a regular car due to height difference. Also, I've had adaptive headlights on my subaru forever.
  • aaomidi 6y ago
    what is with Americans and jumping up at just jailing people? jesus christ you don't need to jail people because they used bright lights.
    • dominotw 6y ago
      shows basic lack of concern for other people's lives on the road, same as drunk driving. > because they used bright lights. Why are people doing this in the first place. I don't understand.
      • aaomidi 6y ago
        what does jailing someone achieve here? what is with this gross authoritarianism? most of these people using these bright LEDs dont realize how bright it is for the other drivers - it's probably just to make the roads brighter because driving in America is extremely different than the rest of the world (very very rural highways - with essentially no extra lighting)
        • giancarlostoro 6y ago
          When you are literally blinded by somebody's headlights making you momentarily blind, you are a danger to yourself and others and could kill yourself and / or others which is not even your fault to begin with! Jail time doesn't sound too insane then. I've literally had to close my eyes whilst driving due to someone's ridiculous headlights being super bright on the opposite side of the road.
• heipei 6y ago
  Even more importantly: Why is America still stuck with cars that honk when they're locked and that have indicator lights flashing in the same color as the tail-lights? One is a nuisance, the other one a straight-up safety issue.
  • bstar77 6y ago
    When I lived in Canada we had to turn on the honk mode because there were too many people using devices that block remote vehicle locking. The honk is an obvious indicator that the car did, indeed, lock.
    • crooked-v 6y ago
      > there were too many people using devices that block remote vehicle locking I'd be interested in more context on that.
      • mudita 6y ago
        Here's for example an article in the Guardian from 2015: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/may/26/high-tech-thieves-jamming-technology-steal-car https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/may/26/high-tech...
      • bstar77 6y ago
        http://vehiclesecurity.co.nz/blog/keyless-block/ http://vehiclesecurity.co.nz/blog/keyless-block/
    • detaro 6y ago
      Too annoying to look at the car for the 2 seconds it takes to see the indicators flash, which seems to be the common alternative?
      • ceejayoz 6y ago
        I like to use the honk to locate my car when I've forgotten where I parked it. Unfortunately, my 2016 Corolla makes a beep inaudible from more than a spot or two away. :-(
• sedatk 6y ago
  more importantly, why is America stuck with narrow angle side mirrors?
• csours 6y ago
  FMVSS (Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards) are prescriptive, not descriptive; they're also really really slow to update them. The difference between between FMVSS and UN/EU regulations could also be considered a regulatory moat. In today's globalized world, I can't imagine that the moat is worth it anymore. (Disclaimer, I work for General Motors, this is strictly my own opinion)
• hirundo 6y ago
  If it can detect cars and de-illuminate, it shouldn't be too hard to detect and spot-light other things for safety, like people, animals, debris.
  • infogulch 6y ago
    Current resolution generally seems to be less than 100 headlight 'pixels' so we may need more resolution before we can dim someone's face specifically. But that could get especially interesting when you connect it to a self driving system. The car's AI could become a more active participant in 'looking' at things.
  • drglitch 6y ago
    Mercedes has a good demo video about current state of this tech (EU only) - when you drive a car with it, it’s literally magical. Alternative tech uses a projector-like screen with 4K resolution, allowing for very precise light control. Here is a demo: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0OJjvYPV3oc https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0OJjvYPV3oc
    • dx034 6y ago
      Are they actually developed by Mercedes? Or do they have exclusive contracts with a supplier like Bosch?
  • glxxyz 6y ago
    With RGB LEDs it could highlight them in a different color; the Fox Puck of driving? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grOttsHuuzE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grOttsHuuzE
• justin66 6y ago
  I am grimly curious how many Americans would view a primitive combination of high beam/low beam/fog lamps/accent lights as being preferable to a sophisticated headlight that can do it all, simply because they get off on dazzling people with their absurd headlights.
  • ReptileMan 6y ago
    I am european and still prefer the simple system. As a software developer - knowing what kind of bunch we are - the less software for critical systems the better. Clicking a button or switching a lever with tactile feedback, immediate response that does exactly what is expected is vastly preferable to any smart system.
    • nwah1 6y ago
      But it is a gradient. There are simple "adaptive headlights" that try not to do anything too fancy. Just aim at the road, adjust for elevation, and the direction you are turning. Could imagine a hinge and a gyroscope controlling that, in theory. These matrix ones that add in adjustments for other cars and for signs are maybe a little too far on the curve for me as well. Anything using computer vision is not something I'd be excited about.
      • ReptileMan 6y ago
        I am all for innovation. But having some behavior of the car being a black box to the driver is recipe for trouble. And of course there are always edge cases that the developers didn't forsee. The more complicated a car is - the more training will the driver need. So standard drivers license at some point may not be enough.
• acd 6y ago
  Some European cars are sold with laser head lights as an optional extra. As a driver meeting usch a vehicle I ponder if that is safe for my eyesight? After recent scandals I don’t fully trust the car industry to self regulate as they have mislead consumers before for example Dieselgate. Thus I think it’s good that there is car safety regulations but that led lights probably should be allowed. I think too many consumer decisions are made on the basis of ego what is good for me/self as a consumer and not necessarily what is good for others.
  • adammunich 6y ago
    Can you provide an example? Last I checked white light lasers were $16,000
    • rootusrootus 6y ago
      They don't use white lasers. They use blue lasers, which are focused by mirrors on a yellow phosphor lens to make white light.
  • drglitch 6y ago
    The laserlights, like ones marketed by BMW, are not shining the laser outward into the world - they use them to warm up phosphor which in turn produces “regular” light. In a sense, it’s somewhat akin to an old school incandescent bulb, but using much less energy. In US, laserlights are reduced power due to regulations
    • kube-system 6y ago
      I think you mean fluorescent, not incandescent.
• kevin_thibedeau 6y ago
  I wish someone would do something about the excessively bright LED taillights people are installing. I can't stand having my eyes burned out behind these fools.
• mcv 6y ago
  I know very little about headlights, but I do know that too many cars have a certain kind of extra bright, blue-white headlights which hurt my eyes. I don't know why they are allowed, but I'd love to see them banned. They may be great for the driver, but getting blinded isn't much fun for oncoming traffic. > "When a car approaches in the oncoming lane, the 911's headlights dim around it while leaving the rest of the pattern bright." And what if it's a bike in the incoming lane? Or on the separate bike path on either side of the road? Will it detect that? Because too often, clever car technologies don't properly account for other traffic than cars.
  • PhantomGremlin 6y ago
    And what if it's a bike in the incoming lane? Or on the separate bike path on either side of the road? Will it detect that? Does the oncoming bike have a headlight? My car doesn't have matrix headlights (since I'm in USA) but it does have a necessary tool. It has a camera which detects oncoming vehicles. In my experience the camera works quite well. It dims my headlights more quickly than I can react manually. It also dims them when there's a lot of overall lighting (such as street lights). I can't attest to the specific situation of a bicycle. Around here, riding a bicycle after dark is a dangerous thing to do.
    • mcv 6y ago
      > "Around here, riding a bicycle after dark is a dangerous thing to do." And that's the exact thing that needs to change.
      • 082349872349872 6y ago
        The dutch often separate vehicle and bicycle traffic (physically, not just with paint).
        • mcv 6y ago
          But not everywhere. There are still plenty of places, especially on smaller, sometimes less-well-lit roads, where bikes share the road with cars.
• Simulacra 6y ago
  I wish we had the lights they turned with the steering wheel as a standard option. Is there any reasonably priced car with this feature, or is it only in Europe?
  • spdustin 6y ago
    That exists now with a number of models here in the U.S., and is sometimes called "cornering lights." The original article refers to what this Motor Trend article [0] calls, "Adaptive Driving Beams." [0]: https://www.motortrend.com/news/get-lit-adaptive-headlights-tech-work/ https://www.motortrend.com/news/get-lit-adaptive-headlights-...
    • Simulacra 6y ago
      Have a look at this advertisement for the Citroen from the 60s. Why did it take so long to get "adaptive" headlights? https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2&v=rRHogyYXFiQ&feature=emb_logo https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2&v=rRHogyYXFiQ&...
      • kube-system 6y ago
        Cornering lights were a thing on US cars in the 60's too. https://jalopnik.com/a-tribute-to-the-most-un-appreciated-light-the-corneri-1625241633 https://jalopnik.com/a-tribute-to-the-most-un-appreciated-li...
  • rimliu 6y ago
    My Honda Accord (~2013) had "cornering lights". And they do not sell Accords in Europe any more, though they are available in the USA.
  • mrep 6y ago
    What is reasonable for you? I'm in the US and my 2018 subaru crosstrek limited does that and the current 2020 limited version has LED Steering Responsive Headlights and starts at 27,395.
• vidanay 6y ago
  This thread just made me realize that it's probably been almost six months since I have driven at night.
  • dencodev 6y ago
    I also just avoid driving at night these days. Even on road trips I deliberately start at sunrise and end at sunset. Among the reasons is awful headlights. I don't drive at night unless I have to.
• ttsda 6y ago
  A lot of those "adaptive" LED light suck! Loads of times I'm stuck with some guy behind me with flickery, colour-changing lights pointing right at my face through the mirrors.
  • dx034 6y ago
    Are you sure those are matrix LED? They might just be standard LED on an uneven road.
• partiallypro 6y ago
  I get the criticism, want, and need...but comparing a $120K+ Porsche to a $20K average car isn't exactly a fair comparison, even when it comes to headlights. The replacement cost on that headlight is probably astronomical, where I can replace a bulb for $40. I don't even know if the Boxster which is around ~$60K comes with these headlights. A quick lookup and those Porsche headlights cost ~$2K EACH.
  • wil421 6y ago
    The ones on this website say they are £3,800 each for a 2019+ 911 Turbo (992). https://www.design911.com/Porsche/Porsche-992--911--2019--/992-Turbo-S-38L/Headlamps-RHD/pt70_187_-cma81-cmo2840-ct2955/ https://www.design911.com/Porsche/Porsche-992--911--2019--/9...
    • partiallypro 6y ago
      Yeah, I was looking at used prices, but I can't tell if your link is for the pair, or just for one.
  • bArray 6y ago
    As with all automotive parts, eventually the price will come down. Currently they are luxury, in some years they will be commodity.
    • taneq 6y ago
      They're also from a luxury brand that commands a premium price above and beyond its actual cost of supply. Give it five years and an entry level Hyundai will come with equivalent headlights and they'll only cost $100 to replace.
      • BoorishBears 6y ago
        Brands like Hyundai and Toyota have been coming out with sealed LED units for years, and they cost thousands to replace The headlights are not that cheap. Expensive optics, expensive LEDs with carefully selected emission spectrums, cooling solutions.
• peterwwillis 6y ago
  The American market has had "adaptive headlights" for nearly 20 years. They tilt up and down, side to side, depending on the orientation of the car. My 2004 Lexus IS300 had them. And they were HIDs, so they were plenty bright. (My base model 2012 Toyota's headlights completely suck in comparison...) But our headlight market and rules are pretty ridiculous. Most "fancy" non-HID bulbs are a ripoff and actually make visibility worse, and it's also illegal to convert a halogen setup to HID. Combine this with the fact that some designs are just crap no matter what the bulb type, and we have a general market failure to understand the real performance of headlights. People think they can generalize headlight types, but it doesn't bear out in practice. https://www.consumerreports.org/headlights/are-hid-and-led-headlights-worth-buying/ https://www.consumerreports.org/headlights/are-hid-and-led-h...
• causality0 6y ago
  Are LED matrix headlights something Europeans can get in a 20,000 Euro car or is this limit something that's only significant for luxury cars?
  • AnssiH 6y ago
    I don't think they are too common in 20000 EUR cars yet, but they are continuously trickling down. A quick look shows that they are an option in Opel Astras that start at 21390€ (inc. 24% VAT plus 2000€ car tax) in Finland and under 20000€ in e.g. Germany, though. The median price of new cars is around 30000€ here. The most common models are Skoda Octavia, Toyota Corolla, Nissan Qashqai (all three start at around 24000€), of which Skoda Octavia is available with matrix headlights and the two others are not, if I looked correctly. Most people buy used, though - ~85% of car purchases are used cars. A quick look through used cars market at nettiauto.com seems to show that there are many Opel Astras with matrix headlights for sale starting at around 14000€, but not many others at those prices.
    • randunel 6y ago
      Seat Leon with matrix led sells at €20.470,59 in Germany.
• CivBase 6y ago
  > Each of the 911's lighting units includes 84 individually controlled LEDs that allow the car to continuously morph the pattern of its beams. When a car approaches in the oncoming lane, the 911's headlights dim around it while leaving the rest of the pattern bright. [...] Porsche would also dim the right side if road signs on the shoulder were overly reflective. The article never mentions, but how does the Porsche detect oncoming cars and overly reflective signs? If it involves a computer doing real-time image processing, I can certainly see why the US government might be cautious considering headlights are an important safety feature for a car. I also assume a system like that would probably be very expensive. Is this just a luxury feature or are matrix lights actually common in European cars?
  • dave_aiello 6y ago
    > I also assume a system like that would probably be very expensive.... Couldn't that also have been said about anti-lock braking systems (ABS), if you go far enough back in automotive history?
    • CivBase 6y ago
      Yes. I just wanted to know if this was a ubiquitous feature in Europe or just a new tech that hasn't yet left the luxury market. The article title implies that the US is significantly behind the times here and I wanted more info to gauge how true that is.
      • dave_aiello 6y ago
        Yea, sorry. I was trying to highlight that automotive tech arrives on expensive models and is driven down to the entry level vehicles as the component manufactures are able to ramp up production volumes.
  • efficax 6y ago
    my 2020 honda civic has lane detection and cruise control that keeps pace with the car in front of you... this isn't much different
• WWLink 6y ago
  I would ask why America is stuck with bad tail lights.
• mdoms 6y ago
  I'd give those 911 lights about 7 or 8 years before they become a $6,000 problem.
• deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
• tannhaeuser 6y ago
  It's not just a problem in US. Ever since Xenon headlights became the norm in upper mid-class cars and up (2003?), I'm having trouble driving at night (here in Germany). I have no data to back this up, but I'd say subjectively glaring is much less of an issue since LED became standard (2010?).
• meddlepal 6y ago
  I just leased a car after a decade of car-free living (not doing crowded public transport again until we have a vaccine) ... the headlight situation is 10x worse than I remember. Driving at night is a brutal.
• gautamcgoel 6y ago
  So, basically the same reason we have bad everything. Our institutions and regulations are outdated relative to the rest of the world, so we get stuck with shitty stuff.
  • bsimpson 6y ago
    For instance: payments. Europe and Asia got chip cards and tap-to-pay decades before we did, even though Mastercard and Visa took part in their invention. America had credit card infrastructure first, so our payment networks were stuck with it, while other countries could start off with better stuff. Without the consumer demand that Google/Apple Pay (and later coronavirus) created, we still probably wouldn't have widespread tap-to-pay.
    • kolinko 6y ago
      And also instant free wire transfers. Paypal would probably never happened if US had a banking system like the one in some European countries.
      • Slartie 6y ago
        For fairness one must say that our free run-of-the-mill wire transfers being instant is a relatively recent development. They used to take multiple days in pre-SEPA-days, and international payments were a hassle (and also usually not free). And even today not all transfers are instant, as both banks must support this feature. But the processing time for the non-instant ones is down to one day across the board at least, so that improved.
        • mschuster91 6y ago
          It was never a technical reason to begin with that transfers took so long (i.e. multiple days), rather that banks made some side money by treating the transferred money as free loan. Similar to stuff like the common free international roaming, SEPA is something that the EU massively fought for the consumers against the entrenched players.
• deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
• DubiousPusher 6y ago
  I tend away from nationalistic exceptionalism and inferiorism. I tend to find one nation that seems very well together in one area is often all fouled up somewhere else. But I've just seen so many examples of America's inability to build working beaurocracy lately that I begin to wonder. This of course is a fairly trivial example but others are not. I'm sure I'm consuming cherry-picked media and if I went looking I could find the U.K. government with its pants down over here or Japan up to something silly but I have been wondering of late.
  • Symbiote 6y ago
    The UK seems to have made a mess of their Coronavirus response (fewer cases but even more deaths than the USA). That accounts for most of the current news. Johnson has recently continued the trend of nominating far too many people to the House of Lords (the unelected upper chamber of Parliament), which is a severe weakness in British democracy, second only to the terrible voting system for the Commons (lower house) in my opinion. "Boring" bureaucracy like the headlights is rarely a significant problem. The idea that the government is fundamentally incompetent and shouldn't be trusted even to tie its own shoelaces seems uniquely American -- in Britain, if part of the government isn't working the people look for a politician to blame, usually either for interfering or cutting the budget. https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news (centre-left, free to read) https://www.telegraph.co.uk/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/ (centre-right, parts behind a paywall)
• cbsmith 6y ago
  Wow, not one reference to Preston Tucker in this whole article. I searched for "Tucker" and the only match was C. Delores Tucker. Not what I expected.
• mzs 6y ago
  It's because the autronic eye in the '50s was so bad that regulations were created that prevent automatic dipping of the headlights. https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/great-info-on-the-autronic-eye-guide-matic-lots-of-pics.580437/ https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/great-info-on-th...
  • nhooyr 6y ago
    What does autronic mean?
    • kolinko 6y ago
      Click on the link that parent gave
• PinguTS 6y ago
  Here is the paper by a Porsche engineer from 2015 on how this headlights work: https://can-cia.org/s/eH8uD https://can-cia.org/s/eH8uD
• stormdennis 6y ago
  Do these clever headlights also take care not to dazzle approaching pedestrians?
• vkn255 6y ago
  LED headlights are not good for eyes, probably will result in long term damage. Is there a study that they are safe ?
• mschuster91 6y ago
  So, uh, you can get entirely self-built cars onto US roads, cars with fully autonomous experimental AIs, but not with intelligent headlights? WTF?
• Havoc 6y ago
  I recall arguing about European specs vs American specs a couple years back on reddit. Very strong insistence that the American route is superior. Don't think that legislation is getting updated any time soon.
• kvgr 6y ago
  I have a 4 years old Passat that has them, the visibility is incredible. Especially on the sides of the road, where normal lights go kind of dim. This kind of bureaucracy is very funny in US, cause I thought that one think US is build on is progress.
  • oblio 6y ago
    > This kind of bureaucracy is very funny in US, cause I thought that one think US is build on is progress. No, it's built on money. Sometimes that leads to progress, sometimes it doesn't.
• knorker 6y ago
  Also terrible blinkers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1lZ9n2bxWA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1lZ9n2bxWA
• yk 6y ago
  Porsche should publish an api for the blinkenlights, so that we can play pong while driving.
• mirimir 6y ago
  > Each of the 911's lighting units includes 84 individually controlled LEDs that allow the car to continuously morph the pattern of its beams. When a car approaches in the oncoming lane, the 911's headlights dim around it while leaving the rest of the pattern bright. The other driver doesn't get blinded, but you still have blazing lights on your side. That is amazing. And I suspect that one could incorporate more autopilot technology. Perhaps to better illuminate pedestrians, bicyclists, motorcyclists, and wildlife. Also perhaps police vehicles, identified through markings and/or tag number.
• fomine3 6y ago
  Upper middle class cars in Japan like Mazda3, Harrier also supports adaptive headlights. Possibly Koito is the supplier of LED systems. https://www.mazda.com/en/innovation/technology/safety/active_safety/alh/ https://www.mazda.com/en/innovation/technology/safety/active... https://www.koito.co.jp/technology/koito/system.html https://www.koito.co.jp/technology/koito/system.html
• ggm 6y ago
  I complained to my state authority about halogen and xenon. The glare aggressive bad. Seriously bad. It should be in the roadworthy testing: does this blind oncoming drivers. Blue led are equally vile. Really destructive of my night vision
• yason 6y ago
  This is a classical case of regulating at the completely wrong level. Forget low beams and high beams. All that needs to be regulated is that the headlights can't point to other drivers, cyclists and pedestrians at a too great intensity above N inches/centimeters from ground. Set those intensity limits to safe levels, make NIST (or some equivalent organisation) come up with a national standard test to enforce them, and let car makers use whatever technology to make headlights as long as they pass that test.
• farseer 6y ago
  I feel that night driving has become more tedious since the advent of LED lights and moronic drivers wielding them in high beam mode. Reading this thread, it seems this is a world wide problem.
• rawland 6y ago
  So, I'm riding to work by bike and in winter times I came to hate these lights. They destroy any natural darkness adaptation, which takes some time to set in again and then already comes the next car. These super fancy lights don't give a shit about the sidewalk or wild life. To me they increase no security whatsoever and contribute mainly to the ongoing light pollution. Probably they even decrease safety overall by randomly blinding humans/animals. Studies/Exp needed.
• throwaway0a5e 6y ago
  All these people stroking it to fancy new LED or projector lights clearly have never had to service (pro-tip: you usually can't) or replace them. The projectors in particular have a bunch of asinine failure modes as they age. Good luck finding a complete assembly for less than half a grand. Screw that. Give me sealed beam lights that cost $20 and if they're not bright enough then give me more of them (e.g. 2013 Ford E-series).
• OliverJones 6y ago
  Yeah. In 1964 my family returned to the US from the middle east where my dad worked. We brought the family Peugeot car with us. It had yellow antifog headlights, then popular in Europe. Dad couldn't register it in the US until he changed the headlights. This stuff isn't new.
• doitLP 6y ago
  Not only that, but the extreme brightness and blue spectrum cause macular degeneration. Especially in children https://health.clevelandclinic.org/are-led-lights-damaging-your-retina/ https://health.clevelandclinic.org/are-led-lights-damaging-y...
• VLM 6y ago
  I'm glad we don't have these because the mfgrs and dealers would just use it to screw over the buyers. It would be full of ongoing software bugs that can only be fixed if you pay for a $75 oil change at the dealership. Sometimes the headlight firmware will crash while you're driving down the road and somehow the owner will be 100% liable not the mfgr kinda like self driving car crashes. The module will be designed to crack the first time a piece of road gravel touches it and the module will cost at least $1000 and require disassembling the entire front end of the car to replace. I'm just not looking forward to it.
  • organsnyder 6y ago
    Defects like those would be subject to mandatory recalls. New vehicles are already full of software-controlled features. My 2017 vehicle has had three recalls that were purely software patches.
• thrownaway954 6y ago
  ok... i'll admit, that was awesome!!! i think everyone on the planet has wanted something like this for awhile now. when driving at night, i'm constantly blinded by people who keep their high beams on. it's gotten even worst over the years with leds and raised trucks and cars where the beams are at eye level. this could really help make night driving safe all around.
• j_m_b 6y ago
  Not sure how truly effective the Porsche solution really is. I have a hard time believing that computer controlled sensors can effectively direct beams of light. What about conditions which scatter light? None of the interesting problems are addressed in this article, instead we are left with a clickbait title.
• peatmoss 6y ago
  Reminds me of motorcycle helmet standards in the United States, where “DOT” is the minimum legal requirement. For people who want to live, ECE, Snell, or the new FIM standards are a must.
  • u801e 6y ago
    What's even worse are the standards for bicycle helmets which are governed by the CPSC (Consumer Products Safety Commission). At least there are better standards out there like Snell.
• throwaway29102 6y ago
  Because we elect garbage politicians who engage in wholesale bribery and are more interested in maintaining power than doing the job they were elected to do. We're getting exactly what we deserve, and honestly, I think that's too much.
  • lmilcin 6y ago
    We all know that. It was always true. The point of real democracy (versus what I call model/book democracy) is to extract useful value from fallible individuals while preventing them to do too much harm (like seizing too much power). The better questions are then: * Is it getting worse? * Are politicians more preoccupied with their interests than in the past? * Is it because it is easier now to manufacture misinformation? * Is it because people vote for parties and not for individual politicians? * Is having less focus on individual character an inevitable result of polarization of society? * Would more truthful and unbiased news coverage help? * Would more education on the principles of civic life help people make better voting decisions? * Is technology causing general disease of attention deficit and focus problem on the scale of entire society causing it to make worse decisions overall?
• Shorel 6y ago
  Also: awfully designed signal lights. They should be yellow, not red. And work independently of the brake lights.
  • u801e 6y ago
    The reason that they're permitted in FMVSS 108 was to allow automakers to save money. Hence the reason luxury brand cars with LED tail lamp have them in the USA.
• silexia 6y ago
  The biggest problem with government regulations is that they are often written in a reactionary or temporary way, but then become enshrined either by bureaucracy or entrenched interests.