12 ms·

Dwarf Fortress: An actual look at graphical improvements

303 points by skibz 7y ago

tveita 7y ago
I didn't know they were doing a graphics update, this looks great! It will be interesting to see what they do with the interface. I've thought before that a complete mapping and redesign of all Dwarf Fortress screens and actions would be material enough for an entire thesis on UX.
d4mi3n 7y ago
Nice to see the classic getting some modern graphics. I love text based games, but something as complex as DF really benefits from graphics that can make it easier to determine what is going on on the screen.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- nomel 7y ago
  My main DF consumption is through Kruggsmash playthroughs/stories on Youtube [1], so I don't live it, but I know I would would enjoy watching the game more if I knew which of the more than 30 creatures the "C" that I'm looking at represents [2]. [1] Kruggsmash: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCaifrB5IrvGNPJmPeVOcqBA https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCaifrB5IrvGNPJmPeVOcqBA [2] Creature characters: https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Creature https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Creature
- edem 7y ago
  It might feel like that but you have to learn how to see the matrix. You have 256 characters and 256 colors to encode each and every entity in DF using only CP437 characters. That's more than enough to be able to tell all the things apart with a single glance.
bootlooped 7y ago
Seems like simply upgrading some of the characters to equivalent emoji would have been a big improvement. I know many people don't like emoji, but for the most part they are pretty universal and easy to understand.
- gbrown 7y ago
  This has been essentially the tileset approach for a long time.
- Phrodo_00 7y ago
  This is not really needed. The game doesn't actually use ascii output, it renders the text (windows terminals would probably be too slow), and it supports graphic packs than can show the dwarves as actual pictures of dwarves. The biggest problem is when a glyph is reused for multiple things, as in that case the graphic has to pick one of them or stay generic.
  - bmn__ 7y ago
    > The biggest problem is when a glyph is reused for multiple things, as in that case the graphic has to pick one of them or stay generic. Solution: https://github.com/mifki/df-twbt https://github.com/mifki/df-twbt This is included in various content packs, so setting this up manually is optional. > The game doesn't actually use ascii output, it renders the text (windows terminals would probably be too slow) Linux and OS X terminals are fast enough. The init.txt setting [PRINT_MODE:TEXT] switches the renderer to ncurses.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
AdmiralAsshat 7y ago
Eagerly awaiting the graphical version to finally be available on Steam so that I can buy it and throw some money their way. I know the regular version has been available for free forever, but the ASCII graphics have always been a turn-off. I'm not opposed to MUD-style graphics in general, Dwarf Fortress is just so dense with stuff that I found I spent most of my time just trying to figure out what was going on.
- lawlessone 7y ago
  Same, i would have given them money years ago but always had issues with Paypal
  - bbeekley 7y ago
    They have a Patreon now. I recently started supporting them there.
- stevens32 7y ago
  If it's encouraging at all - after some hours into the game the ASCII actually starts looking like what they represent, enough that even when you see a new character given its context you can figure out what it's meant to represent without really thinking about it.
  - alpaca128 7y ago
    It's a bit like the Matrix. At first it's an overwhelming amount of mostly tiny green symbols and after a while things make more sense. I'm definitely looking forward to this graphical version, though. And hoping that one day the game will even support multiple threads, but that's probably wishful thinking.
- silveroriole 7y ago
  Why didn’t you install a tileset? Most people don’t play with ASCII nowadays.
  - 7y ago
golergka 7y ago
I spent significant time in DF in the early part of 2010s, but in the end found that it's just too much to micromanage - the game (at the time, at least) didn't offer much help with it, and after awhile, all the clutter really got in the way. If you like this kind of game, but would want something not as demanding, try Rimworld. Out of all dwarffortresslikes (I don't think that calling them Dward Fortress clones is fair), it's got a good amount of polish, reasonable 2d graphics (nothing too fancy, but looks nice) and most importantly, you don't feel as if you have to manually tweak every little thing. You still can, you just don't have to.
- bbrazil 7y ago
  Seconding this. Out of all games in that general category Rimworld is scratching my DF itch, without me having to dig all the way back into full DF complexity.
- bllguo 7y ago
  the key thing about rimworld for me is the multiplayer mod. there are many things i am willing to sacrifice for that experience.
  - LilBytes 7y ago
    Unsure if RimWorld is getting multiplayer or if they're planning on developing a new multi-player game, but they're advertising for a role that inc's multi-player experience at the moment. https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/fpe522/tynan_is_looking_for_multiplayerfocused_developers/ https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/fpe522/tynan_is_l...
- hu3 7y ago
  Rimworld is easily moddable with C#. And there's a vibrant mod community: https://discordapp.com/invite/rimworld https://discordapp.com/invite/rimworld I've created a few simple mods and it was a pleasant experience.
- jredwards 7y ago
  I've spent more time with Rimworld than any other game I've ever played. Between the vibrant mod community and the recent re-engagement of the original developers, it continues to grow and change, offering new experiences alongside the classic ones. Every colony I build is different. I will forever treasure this game.
jtolmar 7y ago
I never thought the ASCII graphics were a big problem in Dwarf Fortress; once you get used to it using a bunch of symbols as decoration, almost all the weird stuff ends up being things you placed yourself. On the other hand, the complete lack of UX consistency - whether a given submenu will use primary/secondary cursor keys, nested menus, or a pile of hotkeys - is a lot harder to deal with.
- TylerE 7y ago
  The complete refusal to integrate any sort of meaningful mouse support is mind boggling.
  - Lockyy 7y ago
    The graphical version will have mouse support.
  - danso 7y ago
    Yeah that's the issue for me. I don't mind interpreting ASCII characters, but the UI/menu navigation feels intimidating. Rimworld will (I assume) never be the type of indepth simulation that DF is, but it spoiled me with its point-and-click GUI
    - rstupek 7y ago
      I don't know if a point and click GUI precludes the depth of DF. If anything some things should be much easier to do with point and click. Factorio combines keyboard with point and click navigation and it has some depth to it.
      - munk-a 7y ago
        I think good mouse support wouldn't remove the ability to navigate menus using keystrokes - but for tasks like drawing out farms, the dig squares for a residential block or dragging and dropping workshops into the right place... that's where I think it'll shine. I don't dislike the keyboard approach used right now but DF hack and it's digging templates has clearly demonstrated that folks feel the lack of good dig designation sorely.
jshaqaw 7y ago
One day when I am retired and my kids are grown up I will have the proper bandwidth for DF and play it. Until them I am an admiring fanboy from afar.
- gorogue 7y ago
  Ditto. I would love to give it the attention it deserves, but unfortunately...life.
- xtracto 7y ago
  That's my thought but for Eve Online. I've read and heard about it, and the idea of it fascinates me. However I just dont have the time required to dedicate to it.
  - edem 7y ago
    Same for DF and EVE. :D
koverda 7y ago
One thing worth checking out if you're looking for DF-Lite with nice graphics: Odd Realm.
starpilot 7y ago
Next step: going 3d http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=167533.0 http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=167533.0 A raytraced DF front end would be breathtaking.
- zimpenfish 7y ago
  Get someone to write a DF to Minecraft map converter and then use Mineways to export to Blender? (Admittedly, this won't be a real-time affair...)
  - bmn__ 7y ago
    only works on old versions https://github.com/TroZ/DF2MC https://github.com/TroZ/DF2MC https://github.com/Thutmose/dorfgen https://github.com/Thutmose/dorfgen
xyzal 7y ago
In case you dislike Steam, take note Dwarf Fortress Premium is also available at Itch: https://kitfoxgames.itch.io/dwarf-fortress https://kitfoxgames.itch.io/dwarf-fortress
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
rstupek 7y ago
The biggest single thing DF can do after graphical improvements is fixing the performance, perhaps make it not single threaded. I've been able to get past the graphics, and work through using the keyboard menus, but having the fortress come to a screeching crawl when there's a ton of things going on is when I stopped playing.
- HumanReadable 7y ago
  I picked up dwarf fortress 7-8 years ago when I was in eighth grade, and have been playing it on and off since. Performance is always what kills the game for me. The game is supposed to be hard, but if you at all know what you're doing it's very easy to keep your fort well, and the only real risk of losing your fort is from you intentionally doing stuff that puts your fort at risk. You literally can defeat entire enemy armies by capturing them all with cage traps, for example. This I can forgive. Dwarf fortress is all about the crazy stupid ideas you can come up with after all. Want to build any interesting structures? Prepare for your dwarfs to get stuck every conceivable way one could possibly get stuck trying to build a simple wall. It can be incredibly tedious to accomplish something that ideally shouldn't take more than a few simple commands. All of this I could live with. The performance without fail is what eventually kills my will to play. Want to do cool stuff with magma? Watch the game slow to a crawl. Want to run a big society? Watch the game slow to a crawl. Want to do anything remotely interesting? Watch the game slow to a crawl. People go to obscene lengths to keep their performance, such as generating atom smashers that will 'delete' unwanted stuff from their fort completely, so the game stops wasting energy rendering 5000 rocks and how each dwarf is reminded about their childhood traumas as every rock reminds them of how their father died from a falling rock. This game is so close to being great but falls short at the very last mile because the basic gameplay is fundamentally flawed. This is a simulator first, game second and it shows :(
  - rstupek 7y ago
    Yeah trying to build structures where the dwarf decides he can't build it because a rock is in the spot he's supposed to build on and that rock is assigned to be used on another section of wall is very frustrating. Having to continually revisit builds was laborious.
archgoon 7y ago
Dwarf Fortress strikes me as a game that would benefit from a strong engine / UI split, with an API for querying the world state. That said, DFHack is probably sufficient for this purpose. https://docs.dfhack.org/en/stable/ https://docs.dfhack.org/en/stable/
- Octopodes 7y ago
  I haven't used it, but Dwarf Fortress Remote for iOS seems to accomplish this somehow; the whole UI is iOS native. Obviously there's no official API, but the developer has somehow managed to achieve something similar. https://apps.apple.com/us/app/dwarf-fortress-remote/id1003660287 https://apps.apple.com/us/app/dwarf-fortress-remote/id100366...
  - rashkov 7y ago
    I just got this, thanks to you. Appreciate it!
empo_simo 7y ago
fortnite is better
Der_Einzige 7y ago
There is already a pretty excellent 3D isometric front end for Dwarf Fortress. The name eludes me but it's well known within the community. However - I found that many parts of Dwarf Fortress disappointed me (and I was hyped as heck to play it - given that I'm a fan of Nethack, DCSS, Cataclysm, and basically any rougelike or rougelite). The game just feels extremely unfinished. Adventure mode is a total joke. Performance is totally garbage. The creator refuses to open source his game (no one will laugh at you man!). The documentation is horrific (no one quite knows how some of the BASIC SKILLS work or what they do) It's got the potential to be a true gem, but right now, it's like an uncut diamond in the rough. Might as well just play Rimworld. Rimworld solved every single problem that Dwarf Fortress had and its world is more compelling to me.
- jointpdf 7y ago
  > ...3D isometric front end for Dwarf Fortress There is more than one mod in this category, but you may be thinking of Stonesense: https://dfhack.readthedocs.io/en/stable/plugins/stonesense/docs/Stonesense.html https://dfhack.readthedocs.io/en/stable/plugins/stonesense/d... DF is a bit rough as a casual gamer (me), but don’t many game designers consider it the greatest game ever made? The complexity of the underlying system of simulation is mind-boggling, especially for a two-person project.
- bmn__ 7y ago
  > pretty excellent 3D isometric front end for Dwarf Fortress. The name eludes me http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Utility:Stonesense http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Utility:Stonesense It's not a complete front end. It cannot control the game, just provide a visualisation of the world.
nineteen999 7y ago
I wonder how this will affect the performance; last time I played DF it was pretty much single-threaded and the performance would tank noticeably once your colony grew to around 100+ dwarves. Granted, it's been about 10 years since I played it.
- empath75 7y ago
  I don't think the graphics will add significantly to the work the simulation is doing.
  - nineteen999 7y ago
    No, but they are presumably going to add a little extra time per frame over the very basic display it uses now. It's certainly not going to make it any faster.
raytracer 7y ago
Don't let Dwarf Fortress put you off ASCII graphic games if Dwarf Fortress is the first you've played. I tried DF a while back but didn't have the time available to get comfortable with it. I found Cataclysm Dark Days Ahead much easier to get into. As a new Cataclysm DDA player I spent most of my time learning how to survive in the early days of a zombie apocalypse. Finding food, learning how to craft weapons, what the zombies are capable of. In one game I found a large mansion in the woods. There were a few zombies inside but not too many to prevent me from clearing it out. I set up camp in one of the bedrooms. The mansion had loads of food, water, materials for crafting. Good times! Cataclysm: Dark Days Ahead https://cataclysmdda.org/ https://cataclysmdda.org/
- autarch 7y ago
  CDDA also has a whole bunch of graphical options. I find it way easier to parse that way and I think most players use the tilesets these days.
Waterluvian 7y ago
If you like the Ascii aesthetic, check out Cogmind. It has amazing Ascii graphics. Full animations.
edem 7y ago
I think the problem is not the ASCII. It is the UX. I've been playing DF for years and what made the game for me from horrifying (not the complexity, but the UX!) to bearable is DFHack! It fixes a lot of the UX issues (not all of them of course) and obviates the need to use 3rd party tools like Dwarf Therapist. I also enabled TWBT and added a nice color theme. Take a look [here](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/469471886598995968/556182297989349377/unknown.png https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/469471886598995968/55...). I think the graphical tileset is kinda...empty and it doesn't hold that much information as the ASCII.
pengaru 7y ago
Having curiously perused the source for one of Tarn's earlier games, Liberal Crime Squad [0], and running away in horror, I'm really curious what the source for DF looks like... especially considering for how long they've plugged away at it. Looking at LCS source was a lesson in how unimportant good programming can be when it comes to making a fun game. But I still can't bring myself to shed all my hygienic programming practices whenever I sit down to hack on a toy. It's really kind of frustrating, since it does add significant time to the development process from waffling about good names and clean abstractions. [0] https://sourceforge.net/projects/lcsgame/ https://sourceforge.net/projects/lcsgame/
ultrasandwich 7y ago
The actual changelog of this game is legend. - "Dwarves form grudges with animals" - "Flying creatures stop flying, fall to the ground, and explode" - "Knocked out teeth dont bleed" - "Rodent men don't use their new teeth to bite." - "Eyes can't be gouged out" https://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/changelog_page.php https://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/changelog_page.p...

303 points by skibz 7y ago

I didn't know they were doing a graphics update, this looks great! It will be interesting to see what they do with the interface. I've thought before that a complete mapping and redesign of all Dwarf Fortress screens and actions would be material enough for an entire thesis on UX.

d4mi3n 7y ago

Nice to see the classic getting some modern graphics. I love text based games, but something as complex as DF really benefits from graphics that can make it easier to determine what is going on on the screen.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
nomel 7y ago
My main DF consumption is through Kruggsmash playthroughs/stories on Youtube [1], so I don't live it, but I know I would would enjoy watching the game more if I knew which of the more than 30 creatures the "C" that I'm looking at represents [2]. [1] Kruggsmash: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCaifrB5IrvGNPJmPeVOcqBA https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCaifrB5IrvGNPJmPeVOcqBA [2] Creature characters: https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Creature https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Creature
edem 7y ago
It might feel like that but you have to learn how to see the matrix. You have 256 characters and 256 colors to encode each and every entity in DF using only CP437 characters. That's more than enough to be able to tell all the things apart with a single glance.

bootlooped 7y ago

Seems like simply upgrading some of the characters to equivalent emoji would have been a big improvement. I know many people don't like emoji, but for the most part they are pretty universal and easy to understand.

gbrown 7y ago
This has been essentially the tileset approach for a long time.
Phrodo_00 7y ago
This is not really needed. The game doesn't actually use ascii output, it renders the text (windows terminals would probably be too slow), and it supports graphic packs than can show the dwarves as actual pictures of dwarves. The biggest problem is when a glyph is reused for multiple things, as in that case the graphic has to pick one of them or stay generic.
- bmn__ 7y ago
  > The biggest problem is when a glyph is reused for multiple things, as in that case the graphic has to pick one of them or stay generic. Solution: https://github.com/mifki/df-twbt https://github.com/mifki/df-twbt This is included in various content packs, so setting this up manually is optional. > The game doesn't actually use ascii output, it renders the text (windows terminals would probably be too slow) Linux and OS X terminals are fast enough. The init.txt setting [PRINT_MODE:TEXT] switches the renderer to ncurses.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

AdmiralAsshat 7y ago

Eagerly awaiting the graphical version to finally be available on Steam so that I can buy it and throw some money their way. I know the regular version has been available for free forever, but the ASCII graphics have always been a turn-off. I'm not opposed to MUD-style graphics in general, Dwarf Fortress is just so dense with stuff that I found I spent most of my time just trying to figure out what was going on.

lawlessone 7y ago
Same, i would have given them money years ago but always had issues with Paypal
- bbeekley 7y ago
  They have a Patreon now. I recently started supporting them there.
stevens32 7y ago
If it's encouraging at all - after some hours into the game the ASCII actually starts looking like what they represent, enough that even when you see a new character given its context you can figure out what it's meant to represent without really thinking about it.
- alpaca128 7y ago
  It's a bit like the Matrix. At first it's an overwhelming amount of mostly tiny green symbols and after a while things make more sense. I'm definitely looking forward to this graphical version, though. And hoping that one day the game will even support multiple threads, but that's probably wishful thinking.
silveroriole 7y ago
Why didn’t you install a tileset? Most people don’t play with ASCII nowadays.
- 7y ago

golergka 7y ago

I spent significant time in DF in the early part of 2010s, but in the end found that it's just too much to micromanage - the game (at the time, at least) didn't offer much help with it, and after awhile, all the clutter really got in the way. If you like this kind of game, but would want something not as demanding, try Rimworld. Out of all dwarffortresslikes (I don't think that calling them Dward Fortress clones is fair), it's got a good amount of polish, reasonable 2d graphics (nothing too fancy, but looks nice) and most importantly, you don't feel as if you have to manually tweak every little thing. You still can, you just don't have to.

bbrazil 7y ago
Seconding this. Out of all games in that general category Rimworld is scratching my DF itch, without me having to dig all the way back into full DF complexity.
bllguo 7y ago
the key thing about rimworld for me is the multiplayer mod. there are many things i am willing to sacrifice for that experience.
- LilBytes 7y ago
  Unsure if RimWorld is getting multiplayer or if they're planning on developing a new multi-player game, but they're advertising for a role that inc's multi-player experience at the moment. https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/fpe522/tynan_is_looking_for_multiplayerfocused_developers/ https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/fpe522/tynan_is_l...
hu3 7y ago
Rimworld is easily moddable with C#. And there's a vibrant mod community: https://discordapp.com/invite/rimworld https://discordapp.com/invite/rimworld I've created a few simple mods and it was a pleasant experience.
jredwards 7y ago
I've spent more time with Rimworld than any other game I've ever played. Between the vibrant mod community and the recent re-engagement of the original developers, it continues to grow and change, offering new experiences alongside the classic ones. Every colony I build is different. I will forever treasure this game.

jtolmar 7y ago

I never thought the ASCII graphics were a big problem in Dwarf Fortress; once you get used to it using a bunch of symbols as decoration, almost all the weird stuff ends up being things you placed yourself. On the other hand, the complete lack of UX consistency - whether a given submenu will use primary/secondary cursor keys, nested menus, or a pile of hotkeys - is a lot harder to deal with.

TylerE 7y ago
The complete refusal to integrate any sort of meaningful mouse support is mind boggling.
- Lockyy 7y ago
  The graphical version will have mouse support.
- danso 7y ago
  Yeah that's the issue for me. I don't mind interpreting ASCII characters, but the UI/menu navigation feels intimidating. Rimworld will (I assume) never be the type of indepth simulation that DF is, but it spoiled me with its point-and-click GUI
  - rstupek 7y ago
    I don't know if a point and click GUI precludes the depth of DF. If anything some things should be much easier to do with point and click. Factorio combines keyboard with point and click navigation and it has some depth to it.
    - munk-a 7y ago
      I think good mouse support wouldn't remove the ability to navigate menus using keystrokes - but for tasks like drawing out farms, the dig squares for a residential block or dragging and dropping workshops into the right place... that's where I think it'll shine. I don't dislike the keyboard approach used right now but DF hack and it's digging templates has clearly demonstrated that folks feel the lack of good dig designation sorely.

jshaqaw 7y ago

One day when I am retired and my kids are grown up I will have the proper bandwidth for DF and play it. Until them I am an admiring fanboy from afar.

gorogue 7y ago
Ditto. I would love to give it the attention it deserves, but unfortunately...life.
xtracto 7y ago
That's my thought but for Eve Online. I've read and heard about it, and the idea of it fascinates me. However I just dont have the time required to dedicate to it.
- edem 7y ago
  Same for DF and EVE. :D

koverda 7y ago

One thing worth checking out if you're looking for DF-Lite with nice graphics: Odd Realm.

starpilot 7y ago

Next step: going 3d http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=167533.0 http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=167533.0 A raytraced DF front end would be breathtaking.

zimpenfish 7y ago
Get someone to write a DF to Minecraft map converter and then use Mineways to export to Blender? (Admittedly, this won't be a real-time affair...)
- bmn__ 7y ago
  only works on old versions https://github.com/TroZ/DF2MC https://github.com/TroZ/DF2MC https://github.com/Thutmose/dorfgen https://github.com/Thutmose/dorfgen

xyzal 7y ago

In case you dislike Steam, take note Dwarf Fortress Premium is also available at Itch: https://kitfoxgames.itch.io/dwarf-fortress https://kitfoxgames.itch.io/dwarf-fortress

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

rstupek 7y ago

The biggest single thing DF can do after graphical improvements is fixing the performance, perhaps make it not single threaded. I've been able to get past the graphics, and work through using the keyboard menus, but having the fortress come to a screeching crawl when there's a ton of things going on is when I stopped playing.

HumanReadable 7y ago
I picked up dwarf fortress 7-8 years ago when I was in eighth grade, and have been playing it on and off since. Performance is always what kills the game for me. The game is supposed to be hard, but if you at all know what you're doing it's very easy to keep your fort well, and the only real risk of losing your fort is from you intentionally doing stuff that puts your fort at risk. You literally can defeat entire enemy armies by capturing them all with cage traps, for example. This I can forgive. Dwarf fortress is all about the crazy stupid ideas you can come up with after all. Want to build any interesting structures? Prepare for your dwarfs to get stuck every conceivable way one could possibly get stuck trying to build a simple wall. It can be incredibly tedious to accomplish something that ideally shouldn't take more than a few simple commands. All of this I could live with. The performance without fail is what eventually kills my will to play. Want to do cool stuff with magma? Watch the game slow to a crawl. Want to run a big society? Watch the game slow to a crawl. Want to do anything remotely interesting? Watch the game slow to a crawl. People go to obscene lengths to keep their performance, such as generating atom smashers that will 'delete' unwanted stuff from their fort completely, so the game stops wasting energy rendering 5000 rocks and how each dwarf is reminded about their childhood traumas as every rock reminds them of how their father died from a falling rock. This game is so close to being great but falls short at the very last mile because the basic gameplay is fundamentally flawed. This is a simulator first, game second and it shows :(
- rstupek 7y ago
  Yeah trying to build structures where the dwarf decides he can't build it because a rock is in the spot he's supposed to build on and that rock is assigned to be used on another section of wall is very frustrating. Having to continually revisit builds was laborious.

archgoon 7y ago

Dwarf Fortress strikes me as a game that would benefit from a strong engine / UI split, with an API for querying the world state. That said, DFHack is probably sufficient for this purpose. https://docs.dfhack.org/en/stable/ https://docs.dfhack.org/en/stable/

Octopodes 7y ago
I haven't used it, but Dwarf Fortress Remote for iOS seems to accomplish this somehow; the whole UI is iOS native. Obviously there's no official API, but the developer has somehow managed to achieve something similar. https://apps.apple.com/us/app/dwarf-fortress-remote/id1003660287 https://apps.apple.com/us/app/dwarf-fortress-remote/id100366...
- rashkov 7y ago
  I just got this, thanks to you. Appreciate it!

empo_simo 7y ago

fortnite is better

Der_Einzige 7y ago

There is already a pretty excellent 3D isometric front end for Dwarf Fortress. The name eludes me but it's well known within the community. However - I found that many parts of Dwarf Fortress disappointed me (and I was hyped as heck to play it - given that I'm a fan of Nethack, DCSS, Cataclysm, and basically any rougelike or rougelite). The game just feels extremely unfinished. Adventure mode is a total joke. Performance is totally garbage. The creator refuses to open source his game (no one will laugh at you man!). The documentation is horrific (no one quite knows how some of the BASIC SKILLS work or what they do) It's got the potential to be a true gem, but right now, it's like an uncut diamond in the rough. Might as well just play Rimworld. Rimworld solved every single problem that Dwarf Fortress had and its world is more compelling to me.

jointpdf 7y ago
> ...3D isometric front end for Dwarf Fortress There is more than one mod in this category, but you may be thinking of Stonesense: https://dfhack.readthedocs.io/en/stable/plugins/stonesense/docs/Stonesense.html https://dfhack.readthedocs.io/en/stable/plugins/stonesense/d... DF is a bit rough as a casual gamer (me), but don’t many game designers consider it the greatest game ever made? The complexity of the underlying system of simulation is mind-boggling, especially for a two-person project.
bmn__ 7y ago
> pretty excellent 3D isometric front end for Dwarf Fortress. The name eludes me http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Utility:Stonesense http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Utility:Stonesense It's not a complete front end. It cannot control the game, just provide a visualisation of the world.

nineteen999 7y ago

I wonder how this will affect the performance; last time I played DF it was pretty much single-threaded and the performance would tank noticeably once your colony grew to around 100+ dwarves. Granted, it's been about 10 years since I played it.

empath75 7y ago
I don't think the graphics will add significantly to the work the simulation is doing.
- nineteen999 7y ago
  No, but they are presumably going to add a little extra time per frame over the very basic display it uses now. It's certainly not going to make it any faster.

raytracer 7y ago

Don't let Dwarf Fortress put you off ASCII graphic games if Dwarf Fortress is the first you've played. I tried DF a while back but didn't have the time available to get comfortable with it. I found Cataclysm Dark Days Ahead much easier to get into. As a new Cataclysm DDA player I spent most of my time learning how to survive in the early days of a zombie apocalypse. Finding food, learning how to craft weapons, what the zombies are capable of. In one game I found a large mansion in the woods. There were a few zombies inside but not too many to prevent me from clearing it out. I set up camp in one of the bedrooms. The mansion had loads of food, water, materials for crafting. Good times! Cataclysm: Dark Days Ahead https://cataclysmdda.org/ https://cataclysmdda.org/

autarch 7y ago
CDDA also has a whole bunch of graphical options. I find it way easier to parse that way and I think most players use the tilesets these days.

Waterluvian 7y ago

If you like the Ascii aesthetic, check out Cogmind. It has amazing Ascii graphics. Full animations.

edem 7y ago

I think the problem is not the ASCII. It is the UX. I've been playing DF for years and what made the game for me from horrifying (not the complexity, but the UX!) to bearable is DFHack! It fixes a lot of the UX issues (not all of them of course) and obviates the need to use 3rd party tools like Dwarf Therapist. I also enabled TWBT and added a nice color theme. Take a look [here](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/469471886598995968/556182297989349377/unknown.png https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/469471886598995968/55...). I think the graphical tileset is kinda...empty and it doesn't hold that much information as the ASCII.

pengaru 7y ago

Having curiously perused the source for one of Tarn's earlier games, Liberal Crime Squad [0], and running away in horror, I'm really curious what the source for DF looks like... especially considering for how long they've plugged away at it. Looking at LCS source was a lesson in how unimportant good programming can be when it comes to making a fun game. But I still can't bring myself to shed all my hygienic programming practices whenever I sit down to hack on a toy. It's really kind of frustrating, since it does add significant time to the development process from waffling about good names and clean abstractions. [0] https://sourceforge.net/projects/lcsgame/ https://sourceforge.net/projects/lcsgame/

ultrasandwich 7y ago

The actual changelog of this game is legend. - "Dwarves form grudges with animals" - "Flying creatures stop flying, fall to the ground, and explode" - "Knocked out teeth dont bleed" - "Rodent men don't use their new teeth to bite." - "Eyes can't be gouged out" https://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/changelog_page.php https://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/changelog_page.p...