16 ms·

Amazon raises overtime pay for warehouse workers

266 points by hhs 7y ago

rorykoehler 7y ago
Amazon workers should unionize immediately now that the virus has given them leverage.
- xixixao 7y ago
  Has it? There’s probably a ton of people looking for this kind of job on the market.
  - golergka 7y ago
    How fast would they be able to hire and train replacements, and how much would it cost?
    - guacamole4 7y ago
      You don't need much training for Amazon warehouse job. You start moving boxes from day one.
- TheAdamAndChe 7y ago
  I understand what you're saying, but walking out or forcing negotiations during a global pandemic is sociopathic, and the union would gather a massive amount of political venom.
  - pgt 7y ago
    I would not be surprised if the pay increase is a preemptive move prevent unionization. But then again, could just be real increase in demand.
  - ken 7y ago
    I don't know how you think bargaining works, but they don't just demand "do XYZ or we'll all walk out". There's lots of levers on both sides. The point of negotiation is to arrive at a mutually beneficial solution. Striking is always a last resort, and quite rare, since it's bad for workers, too.
  - tanilama 7y ago
    Not just venom, they are begging for destruction. People seem to forget the very meaning of a state. Spoiler: it is about power, and physical power.
- golergka 7y ago
  Even for a typical right-winger like me (I'm actively fighting against unionization in my own profession) it makes total sense in context of warehouse workers and current events.
  - jfk13 7y ago
    Interesting -- what's the basis for this distinction? Unions make sense for the dumb masses in low-end jobs, but not for smart professionals like yourself?
    - leetcrew 7y ago
      I think the common argument is that unions tend to flatten pay disparities among workers. if you're currently recognized as an outstanding performer and compensated accordingly, you might expect to lose out under unionization. not saying this is necessarily true (or untrue), just that this is what people think. in fields where productivity varies less by skill, you would tend to see less of this objection.
      - scarface74 7y ago
        Both police unions and teachers unions are well known for fighting against performance based pay.
    - golergka 7y ago
      Unions bring everyone toward the average. So, it's not in my interest.
- motbob 7y ago
  The virus, in some ways, has given them the opposite of leverage. The labor market is and will be flooded with laid off workers.
  - ken 7y ago
    Then again, lots of laid off workers (like me) come from other unions. What better way to unionize a workplace than by flooding it with union workers from other industries?
    - jcampbell1 7y ago
      Ex-union workers aren’t a protected class in the US and there is often discrimination.
  - claudeganon 7y ago
    That’s why it’s actually important to unionize in the very near term. Amazon can’t replace all of their workers if they unionize right away and the union leverage can guarantee safer working conditions for all the new hires.
    - leetcrew 7y ago
      it's a tricky time for both sides. imagine the optics of actually striking during the current crisis. not sure whether amazon or the union would come out looking worse, but it would be a big hit to both.
    - dahfizz 7y ago
      > Amazon can’t replace all of their workers if they unionize right away I bet they could.
      - deleted 7y ago
        [deleted]
- krapp 7y ago
  The virus has given them no such thing. These are only temporary measures meant to stem attrition because Amazon set a policy of unlimited UPT until the end of the month for anyone sick... as soon as that's no longer necessary, there will be mass layoffs and pay cuts across the board.
  - Klinky 7y ago
    Regardless, Amazon needs to play this very carefully. If they do not take appropriate actions to protect their workforce and the virus proliferates throughout their supply chain and logistics network, they will be completely shutdown. Paying workers double pay does not make COVID-19 cases go down, if anything, you're encouraging it to go up by having more employees working together for longer hours, and as those cases go up, the higher the chances of a legal mandate to shutdown becomes.
- pmorici 7y ago
  People are getting laid off from every other job left and right I would be surprised if they have the leverage you think they do. The increase in pay for people working through this is to compensate for the perceived risk of getting sick which is different than a shortage of workers. When you have record numbers of people applying for unemployment you can certainly replace striking workers quickly and with the current situation there would be zero sympathy from the public over a union causing that kind of mess.
  - claudeganon 7y ago
    Who is your public in this conception? Most people in the US works jobs closer to Amazon warehouse workers and don’t want to see they’re loved ones made sick or injured so upper middle class people can hoard prime deliveries. The UAW was pushing for factories to shutdown out of concern for worker safety in Michigan before they decided to, they were applauded for doing so by the governor, and none of my family there thinks they were in the wrong.
    - pmorici 7y ago
      Everyone who was caught unprepared and is trying to stock up on food, toilet paper, and household cleaning supplies. Your characterization of Prime Members doesn't jive with reality plenty of lower income house holds have prime memberships[0] and that isn't a requirement for ordering from Amazon either so I'm not sure why you bring it up. What do you think your family's opinion of UAW would be if they represented workers in Toilet Paper, Clorox, and Food manufacturing and got those plants to shut down and they could no longer get those products? Autos are a way different thing than the essentials. [0] https://www.statista.com/statistics/610070/amazon-prime-reach-usa-income/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/610070/amazon-prime-reac...
      - claudeganon 7y ago
        > During the measured period in August 2018, it was found that 55.7 percent of consumers with an income of 75,000 U.S. dollars and more had an Amazon Prime membership. I dunno where you live, but if a lot of your customer base in in this income range, you’re a good deal outside the median in the US. > What do you think family's opinion of UAW would be if they represented workers in Toilet Paper, Clorox, and Food manufacturing and got those plants to shut down and they could no longer get those products? I grew up knowing a fair amount of farmers and people manufacturing the exact kind of stuff you’re describing. Very few of them would side with the bosses. Most of these people in the Midwest are going to local grocery chains (there are huge regional players in the Midwest) to buy this stuff, not buying off Amazon. Going to Target or Trader Joe’s instead of these stores is seen as status signaling.
- pdelgallego 7y ago
  If workers unionize right now, then it will probably put the general public opinion against the workers. Specially as the pandemic get its way into the US, and more and more people self quarantine, and start relying in delivery services for all their shopping
  - simias 7y ago
    They could unionize without disrupting the service, just to increase their bargaining power and unify their representation.
    - scarface74 7y ago
      With as many service workers expected to be out of a job for awhile after this blows over, if warehouse workers try to strike, there will be plenty of people willing to take their place.
tcbawo 7y ago
If Amazon wanted to win immediate trust and lasting goodwill, they should secure suppliers for "Amazon's choice" cotton surgical masks, providing priority service to hospital systems in regions of need, but also (publicly), their own warehouse and delivery workforce. They have the leverage, analytics, and supply chain to make it happen. Edit: We need to provide enough masks so that people don't feel like they are depriving the hospital system. Also, we need more corporations in America to step up and set an example, protecting their workers and customers. People should stay home, but when they have to venture out (or are needed for work), they should be wearing masks!
- eloff 7y ago
  I'm pretty sure cotton masks offer little to no protection. What you need is a n95 respirator.
  - christkv 7y ago
    It will help if everyone wears it. The asymptotic infected will reduce their spread as it will stop them spreading it.
    - eloff 7y ago
      That's a bit of a pipe dream. It's better for people to just stay at home as much as possible. Everyone can do that regardless of the availability of masks.
      - tcbawo 7y ago
        People need to stay home, but they also need to go to the grocery store, bank, or other essential activities. When they do, they should be wearing a mask.
        eloff 7y ago
        I think we know that's just not going to happen in general. It's been impossible to buy masks for weeks.
mulm 7y ago
One of the Danish consumer NGOs called tænk recently tested the security of things bought off amazon, wish and other online retailers. More than half of the smoke alarms bought on amazon didn’t work. Around half of the baby toys didn’t meet choking hazard safety. Not sure why anyone still buys things from there. Or anywhere online really, all the other retailers failed as well.
- EarthIsHome 7y ago
  > Not sure why anyone still buys things from there. Or anywhere online really, all the other retailers failed as well. A combination of convenience and a monopoly. They have made purchasing as frictionless as possible.
- steve_adams_86 7y ago
  Due to isolation I ordered from them for the first time in a very long time. I'm blown away by how much garbage is on there now. Or was it always there? I'm glad I could stay inside but I really need to find something better.
  - christophilus 7y ago
    Target is much better, IMO, depending on what you’re looking for.
- marcrosoft 7y ago
  > More than half of the smoke alarms bought on amazon didn’t work. Around half of the baby toys didn’t meet choking hazard safety. This is a manufacturer issue. This has nothing to do with Amazon. > Not sure why anyone still buys things from there. Or anywhere online really, all the other retailers failed as well. This is just a blanket statement that is completely wrong. Amazon sells all sorts of reputable supplies and toys for babies. Name a reputable company. I'm sure they have an online store. Edit: This whole situation is going to drive even more shopping online and especially to Amazon. The elderly are getting on board.
  - 7y ago
bdefore 7y ago
Glad to see this from Amazon, although I see it heading off the inevitable. Wouldn't this be the most powerful moment for employees in 'essential' services to engage in worker strikes? Is there any legal precedent for what governments would do? With all this war rhetoric thrown around, it seems a reasonable jump to declare essential workers troops on the frontline deserving of what we give other troops (free health care, pension, heavily subsidized secondary education)
- dahfizz 7y ago
  > Is there any legal precedent for what governments would do? There is a long history of the government using the military to break strikes and fill the labor gap for things deemed necessary for national security. I'm not sure Amazon warehouses are in the same class as coal mines though...
  - leetcrew 7y ago
    not quite, but delivery services are extremely important to the vulnerable population right now. many of these people are old and, as we all know, these are the people that vote most consistently. no sitting politician wants to be the one who sat on their hands while a strike prevented the elderly from receiving their hand sanitizer order.
    - srtjstjsj 7y ago
      People shut in at home don't need hand sanitizer.
      - leetcrew 7y ago
        I mean that's sort of beside the point; it only matters whether they think they do. the older people I know are aggressively sanitizing stuff whenever they have anything delivered.
  - caymanjim 7y ago
    The government would absolutely step in and stop a strike at Amazon right now, or just about any other business. Anyone trying to strike right now would be run out of town by citizens with torches as well. It might sound like a good idea in the abstract, but if you factor in the emotional state of the country, people would be up in arms and those on strike would get zero sympathy.
legitster 7y ago
It's also worth noting that if our economy starts deflating (basically inevitable at this point), real incomes will rise. So $15 an hour next month is like $20 an hour last month (or some ratio like that).
- phreeza 7y ago
  Why do you think it's inevitable that there will be a deflation? Genuine question, it seems the money supply is going to be increasing?
  - Der_Einzige 7y ago
    Nope. The dollar is so strong that other countries are trying really hard to get as much USD as possible. This means that liquidity is drying up and there is a shortage of dollars world-wide. This is deflationary right until we see the banking sector collapse.
    - sfj 7y ago
      That's one factor, I'd argue it is caused by the $12 trillon is usd denominated debt, and due to the economic situation, no cashflow to pay it. But the Fed has been ramping up printing presses, creating a tug of war. How long before the latter overtakes the former? The Fed just expanded repo to $1 trillion per day: https://m.theepochtimes.com/fed-expands-repo-to-1-trillion-per-day-to-avert-liquidity-crunch_3280317.html https://m.theepochtimes.com/fed-expands-repo-to-1-trillion-p...
      - Der_Einzige 7y ago
        You're totally right about repo and massive amounts of loans, but the impact of other countries trying to get USD outweighs this - at least in the short term. Checkout currency trading right now - the USD is surging compared to every other world currency. That's because demand for USD is extremely high world wide.
  - buildawesome 7y ago
werber 7y ago
I run in mostly “Fuck the man” circles, so i feel weird saying this, but amazon has consistently been a good leader for other businesses in terms of compensation. I wish they’d go to 25 an hour, as that’s the minimum I could live on
- ip26 7y ago
  The slightly dimmer view is that amazon has consistently been a leader for precisely the same reason ford was a hundred years ago https://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2012/03/04/the-story-of-henry-fords-5-a-day-wages-its-not-what-you-think/#4bacffed766d https://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2012/03/04/the-stor...
jv22222 7y ago
I've been thinking that in this new reality Amazon warehouse workers and delivery folks are doing something pretty amazing by helping the rest of us. IMOH Jeff Bezos should really consider this and put something amazing together for these foundational people. (I say amazing because I think they should be rewarded in a big way - Amazon stock maybe?)
- rukittenme 7y ago
  They used to be paid in stock... they wanted $15/hr instead.
  - danbolt 7y ago
    It’s hard not to blame those workers if they’re living paycheque to paycheque. For a well-paid programmer it’s a different story but it’s not hard to imagine the immediate liquidity bieng more valuable when expenses take a bigger bite of your income.
    - jedberg 7y ago
      > For a well-paid programmer it’s a different story but it’s not hard to imagine the immediate liquidity bieng more valuable when expenses take a bigger bite of your income. One of the best parts about Netflix's compensation program when I worked there was that you could choose your ratio of stock to cash. You could do 100% stock if you wanted to, or 0%. Despite this freedom, almost no one chose to get any stock at all. Even people making $200K+ decided the cash was better than the stock.
      - mhb 7y ago
        Why is it better to get some stock instead of its cash equivalent which could be used to buy stock?
        jedberg 7y ago
        The stock was purchased at an 80% discount. To be clear, it was a stock option, and the option price was 20% of the stock price. So it had to go up 20% to break even. But if it went up 40% you doubled your money. This is basically what happens behind the scenes at other companies that offer you stock compensation in the form of options. It's just all hidden from you.
ColonelSanders 7y ago
I hope all these raises, unemployment resources, remote work and collectivization measures stick around after. Flexibility is great. What has all this coronavirus action made me feel? The virus effects everybody equally (generally there are age things in there) We're all about austerity of social benefits, "I get mine". How did the wonders of the free market help when we were in trouble? We don't share nearly enough. We criticize each other too much. We miss opportunities to improve the social system democratically because we fall for the intoxicating allure of being sidetracked by narrow groups pushing to get more, just for them. Enough to break up the vote to give us multi-pronged, layered, comprehensive, and fair social security. The nod to only help one group to spite everyone else draws ire, to keep the cycle repeating as an emotional back and forth. Every time. We don't fix the statutes. I hope anything that doles out benefits universally sticks around and becomes normal in life, after this. I hope after this labor and health policies get more generous. Way more generous. And value people for being human beings, without preferential treatment based on who is most this or that. Raise the bar for all natural persons.
one2know 7y ago
This is a PR stunt from Amazon. Amazon has sophisticated software to schedule employees so that no overtime is given. I think they would rather shut down than pay overtime.
paul7986 7y ago
Give these people, grocery store workers, sewers .. all the low end workers who we need more then ever at least $30 US dollars an hour. As well in other countries do a similar match!
nethergh0st 7y ago
I think this is a great idea. I also think it was pretty horrible to prevent shipments of non-essential items from 3rd-party sellers (we can still purchase these items now, but sellers can no longer ship these items to amazon FBA warehouses). Many of these sellers will now have to layoff their own staff, because they will be unable to make payroll/ship out products.

266 points by hhs 7y ago

rorykoehler 7y ago

Amazon workers should unionize immediately now that the virus has given them leverage.

xixixao 7y ago
Has it? There’s probably a ton of people looking for this kind of job on the market.
- golergka 7y ago
  How fast would they be able to hire and train replacements, and how much would it cost?
  - guacamole4 7y ago
    You don't need much training for Amazon warehouse job. You start moving boxes from day one.
TheAdamAndChe 7y ago
I understand what you're saying, but walking out or forcing negotiations during a global pandemic is sociopathic, and the union would gather a massive amount of political venom.
- pgt 7y ago
  I would not be surprised if the pay increase is a preemptive move prevent unionization. But then again, could just be real increase in demand.
- ken 7y ago
  I don't know how you think bargaining works, but they don't just demand "do XYZ or we'll all walk out". There's lots of levers on both sides. The point of negotiation is to arrive at a mutually beneficial solution. Striking is always a last resort, and quite rare, since it's bad for workers, too.
- tanilama 7y ago
  Not just venom, they are begging for destruction. People seem to forget the very meaning of a state. Spoiler: it is about power, and physical power.
golergka 7y ago
Even for a typical right-winger like me (I'm actively fighting against unionization in my own profession) it makes total sense in context of warehouse workers and current events.
- jfk13 7y ago
  Interesting -- what's the basis for this distinction? Unions make sense for the dumb masses in low-end jobs, but not for smart professionals like yourself?
  - leetcrew 7y ago
    I think the common argument is that unions tend to flatten pay disparities among workers. if you're currently recognized as an outstanding performer and compensated accordingly, you might expect to lose out under unionization. not saying this is necessarily true (or untrue), just that this is what people think. in fields where productivity varies less by skill, you would tend to see less of this objection.
    - scarface74 7y ago
      Both police unions and teachers unions are well known for fighting against performance based pay.
  - golergka 7y ago
    Unions bring everyone toward the average. So, it's not in my interest.
motbob 7y ago
The virus, in some ways, has given them the opposite of leverage. The labor market is and will be flooded with laid off workers.
- ken 7y ago
  Then again, lots of laid off workers (like me) come from other unions. What better way to unionize a workplace than by flooding it with union workers from other industries?
  - jcampbell1 7y ago
    Ex-union workers aren’t a protected class in the US and there is often discrimination.
- claudeganon 7y ago
  That’s why it’s actually important to unionize in the very near term. Amazon can’t replace all of their workers if they unionize right away and the union leverage can guarantee safer working conditions for all the new hires.
  - leetcrew 7y ago
    it's a tricky time for both sides. imagine the optics of actually striking during the current crisis. not sure whether amazon or the union would come out looking worse, but it would be a big hit to both.
  - dahfizz 7y ago
    > Amazon can’t replace all of their workers if they unionize right away I bet they could.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
krapp 7y ago
The virus has given them no such thing. These are only temporary measures meant to stem attrition because Amazon set a policy of unlimited UPT until the end of the month for anyone sick... as soon as that's no longer necessary, there will be mass layoffs and pay cuts across the board.
- Klinky 7y ago
  Regardless, Amazon needs to play this very carefully. If they do not take appropriate actions to protect their workforce and the virus proliferates throughout their supply chain and logistics network, they will be completely shutdown. Paying workers double pay does not make COVID-19 cases go down, if anything, you're encouraging it to go up by having more employees working together for longer hours, and as those cases go up, the higher the chances of a legal mandate to shutdown becomes.
pmorici 7y ago
People are getting laid off from every other job left and right I would be surprised if they have the leverage you think they do. The increase in pay for people working through this is to compensate for the perceived risk of getting sick which is different than a shortage of workers. When you have record numbers of people applying for unemployment you can certainly replace striking workers quickly and with the current situation there would be zero sympathy from the public over a union causing that kind of mess.
- claudeganon 7y ago
  Who is your public in this conception? Most people in the US works jobs closer to Amazon warehouse workers and don’t want to see they’re loved ones made sick or injured so upper middle class people can hoard prime deliveries. The UAW was pushing for factories to shutdown out of concern for worker safety in Michigan before they decided to, they were applauded for doing so by the governor, and none of my family there thinks they were in the wrong.
  - pmorici 7y ago
    Everyone who was caught unprepared and is trying to stock up on food, toilet paper, and household cleaning supplies. Your characterization of Prime Members doesn't jive with reality plenty of lower income house holds have prime memberships[0] and that isn't a requirement for ordering from Amazon either so I'm not sure why you bring it up. What do you think your family's opinion of UAW would be if they represented workers in Toilet Paper, Clorox, and Food manufacturing and got those plants to shut down and they could no longer get those products? Autos are a way different thing than the essentials. [0] https://www.statista.com/statistics/610070/amazon-prime-reach-usa-income/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/610070/amazon-prime-reac...
    - claudeganon 7y ago
      > During the measured period in August 2018, it was found that 55.7 percent of consumers with an income of 75,000 U.S. dollars and more had an Amazon Prime membership. I dunno where you live, but if a lot of your customer base in in this income range, you’re a good deal outside the median in the US. > What do you think family's opinion of UAW would be if they represented workers in Toilet Paper, Clorox, and Food manufacturing and got those plants to shut down and they could no longer get those products? I grew up knowing a fair amount of farmers and people manufacturing the exact kind of stuff you’re describing. Very few of them would side with the bosses. Most of these people in the Midwest are going to local grocery chains (there are huge regional players in the Midwest) to buy this stuff, not buying off Amazon. Going to Target or Trader Joe’s instead of these stores is seen as status signaling.
pdelgallego 7y ago
If workers unionize right now, then it will probably put the general public opinion against the workers. Specially as the pandemic get its way into the US, and more and more people self quarantine, and start relying in delivery services for all their shopping
- simias 7y ago
  They could unionize without disrupting the service, just to increase their bargaining power and unify their representation.
  - scarface74 7y ago
    With as many service workers expected to be out of a job for awhile after this blows over, if warehouse workers try to strike, there will be plenty of people willing to take their place.

tcbawo 7y ago

If Amazon wanted to win immediate trust and lasting goodwill, they should secure suppliers for "Amazon's choice" cotton surgical masks, providing priority service to hospital systems in regions of need, but also (publicly), their own warehouse and delivery workforce. They have the leverage, analytics, and supply chain to make it happen. Edit: We need to provide enough masks so that people don't feel like they are depriving the hospital system. Also, we need more corporations in America to step up and set an example, protecting their workers and customers. People should stay home, but when they have to venture out (or are needed for work), they should be wearing masks!

eloff 7y ago
I'm pretty sure cotton masks offer little to no protection. What you need is a n95 respirator.
- christkv 7y ago
  It will help if everyone wears it. The asymptotic infected will reduce their spread as it will stop them spreading it.
  - eloff 7y ago
    That's a bit of a pipe dream. It's better for people to just stay at home as much as possible. Everyone can do that regardless of the availability of masks.
    - tcbawo 7y ago
      People need to stay home, but they also need to go to the grocery store, bank, or other essential activities. When they do, they should be wearing a mask.
      - eloff 7y ago
        I think we know that's just not going to happen in general. It's been impossible to buy masks for weeks.

mulm 7y ago

One of the Danish consumer NGOs called tænk recently tested the security of things bought off amazon, wish and other online retailers. More than half of the smoke alarms bought on amazon didn’t work. Around half of the baby toys didn’t meet choking hazard safety. Not sure why anyone still buys things from there. Or anywhere online really, all the other retailers failed as well.

EarthIsHome 7y ago
> Not sure why anyone still buys things from there. Or anywhere online really, all the other retailers failed as well. A combination of convenience and a monopoly. They have made purchasing as frictionless as possible.
steve_adams_86 7y ago
Due to isolation I ordered from them for the first time in a very long time. I'm blown away by how much garbage is on there now. Or was it always there? I'm glad I could stay inside but I really need to find something better.
- christophilus 7y ago
  Target is much better, IMO, depending on what you’re looking for.
marcrosoft 7y ago
> More than half of the smoke alarms bought on amazon didn’t work. Around half of the baby toys didn’t meet choking hazard safety. This is a manufacturer issue. This has nothing to do with Amazon. > Not sure why anyone still buys things from there. Or anywhere online really, all the other retailers failed as well. This is just a blanket statement that is completely wrong. Amazon sells all sorts of reputable supplies and toys for babies. Name a reputable company. I'm sure they have an online store. Edit: This whole situation is going to drive even more shopping online and especially to Amazon. The elderly are getting on board.
- 7y ago

bdefore 7y ago

Glad to see this from Amazon, although I see it heading off the inevitable. Wouldn't this be the most powerful moment for employees in 'essential' services to engage in worker strikes? Is there any legal precedent for what governments would do? With all this war rhetoric thrown around, it seems a reasonable jump to declare essential workers troops on the frontline deserving of what we give other troops (free health care, pension, heavily subsidized secondary education)

dahfizz 7y ago
> Is there any legal precedent for what governments would do? There is a long history of the government using the military to break strikes and fill the labor gap for things deemed necessary for national security. I'm not sure Amazon warehouses are in the same class as coal mines though...
- leetcrew 7y ago
  not quite, but delivery services are extremely important to the vulnerable population right now. many of these people are old and, as we all know, these are the people that vote most consistently. no sitting politician wants to be the one who sat on their hands while a strike prevented the elderly from receiving their hand sanitizer order.
  - srtjstjsj 7y ago
    People shut in at home don't need hand sanitizer.
    - leetcrew 7y ago
      I mean that's sort of beside the point; it only matters whether they think they do. the older people I know are aggressively sanitizing stuff whenever they have anything delivered.
- caymanjim 7y ago
  The government would absolutely step in and stop a strike at Amazon right now, or just about any other business. Anyone trying to strike right now would be run out of town by citizens with torches as well. It might sound like a good idea in the abstract, but if you factor in the emotional state of the country, people would be up in arms and those on strike would get zero sympathy.

legitster 7y ago

It's also worth noting that if our economy starts deflating (basically inevitable at this point), real incomes will rise. So $15 an hour next month is like $20 an hour last month (or some ratio like that).

phreeza 7y ago
Why do you think it's inevitable that there will be a deflation? Genuine question, it seems the money supply is going to be increasing?
- Der_Einzige 7y ago
  Nope. The dollar is so strong that other countries are trying really hard to get as much USD as possible. This means that liquidity is drying up and there is a shortage of dollars world-wide. This is deflationary right until we see the banking sector collapse.
  - sfj 7y ago
    That's one factor, I'd argue it is caused by the $12 trillon is usd denominated debt, and due to the economic situation, no cashflow to pay it. But the Fed has been ramping up printing presses, creating a tug of war. How long before the latter overtakes the former? The Fed just expanded repo to $1 trillion per day: https://m.theepochtimes.com/fed-expands-repo-to-1-trillion-per-day-to-avert-liquidity-crunch_3280317.html https://m.theepochtimes.com/fed-expands-repo-to-1-trillion-p...
    - Der_Einzige 7y ago
      You're totally right about repo and massive amounts of loans, but the impact of other countries trying to get USD outweighs this - at least in the short term. Checkout currency trading right now - the USD is surging compared to every other world currency. That's because demand for USD is extremely high world wide.
- buildawesome 7y ago

werber 7y ago

I run in mostly “Fuck the man” circles, so i feel weird saying this, but amazon has consistently been a good leader for other businesses in terms of compensation. I wish they’d go to 25 an hour, as that’s the minimum I could live on

ip26 7y ago
The slightly dimmer view is that amazon has consistently been a leader for precisely the same reason ford was a hundred years ago https://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2012/03/04/the-story-of-henry-fords-5-a-day-wages-its-not-what-you-think/#4bacffed766d https://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2012/03/04/the-stor...

jv22222 7y ago

I've been thinking that in this new reality Amazon warehouse workers and delivery folks are doing something pretty amazing by helping the rest of us. IMOH Jeff Bezos should really consider this and put something amazing together for these foundational people. (I say amazing because I think they should be rewarded in a big way - Amazon stock maybe?)

rukittenme 7y ago
They used to be paid in stock... they wanted $15/hr instead.
- danbolt 7y ago
  It’s hard not to blame those workers if they’re living paycheque to paycheque. For a well-paid programmer it’s a different story but it’s not hard to imagine the immediate liquidity bieng more valuable when expenses take a bigger bite of your income.
  - jedberg 7y ago
    > For a well-paid programmer it’s a different story but it’s not hard to imagine the immediate liquidity bieng more valuable when expenses take a bigger bite of your income. One of the best parts about Netflix's compensation program when I worked there was that you could choose your ratio of stock to cash. You could do 100% stock if you wanted to, or 0%. Despite this freedom, almost no one chose to get any stock at all. Even people making $200K+ decided the cash was better than the stock.
    - mhb 7y ago
      Why is it better to get some stock instead of its cash equivalent which could be used to buy stock?
      - jedberg 7y ago
        The stock was purchased at an 80% discount. To be clear, it was a stock option, and the option price was 20% of the stock price. So it had to go up 20% to break even. But if it went up 40% you doubled your money. This is basically what happens behind the scenes at other companies that offer you stock compensation in the form of options. It's just all hidden from you.

ColonelSanders 7y ago

I hope all these raises, unemployment resources, remote work and collectivization measures stick around after. Flexibility is great. What has all this coronavirus action made me feel? The virus effects everybody equally (generally there are age things in there) We're all about austerity of social benefits, "I get mine". How did the wonders of the free market help when we were in trouble? We don't share nearly enough. We criticize each other too much. We miss opportunities to improve the social system democratically because we fall for the intoxicating allure of being sidetracked by narrow groups pushing to get more, just for them. Enough to break up the vote to give us multi-pronged, layered, comprehensive, and fair social security. The nod to only help one group to spite everyone else draws ire, to keep the cycle repeating as an emotional back and forth. Every time. We don't fix the statutes. I hope anything that doles out benefits universally sticks around and becomes normal in life, after this. I hope after this labor and health policies get more generous. Way more generous. And value people for being human beings, without preferential treatment based on who is most this or that. Raise the bar for all natural persons.

one2know 7y ago

This is a PR stunt from Amazon. Amazon has sophisticated software to schedule employees so that no overtime is given. I think they would rather shut down than pay overtime.

paul7986 7y ago

Give these people, grocery store workers, sewers .. all the low end workers who we need more then ever at least $30 US dollars an hour. As well in other countries do a similar match!

nethergh0st 7y ago

I think this is a great idea. I also think it was pretty horrible to prevent shipments of non-essential items from 3rd-party sellers (we can still purchase these items now, but sellers can no longer ship these items to amazon FBA warehouses). Many of these sellers will now have to layoff their own staff, because they will be unable to make payroll/ship out products.