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Canada has arrested Huawei’s global chief financial officer in Vancouver

1081 points by ericzawo 8y ago

anonymous5133 8y ago
I also wonder what this is going to do to Canada's real estate market considering that Canada has basically been a "safe haven" for Chinese nationals to flock to basically launder their money.
- khuey 8y ago
  Probably nothing. The Chinese looking at Canada as "a safe haven" are worried about their own government, not Canada's.
  - mr_toad 8y ago
    On the other hand, Canadians who have helped Chinese people circumvent Chinese capital controls might want to think carefully about their holiday plans.
    - tlear 8y ago
      The good part is that PRC reach is mostly limited to China itself. Except if you get high enough profile they send a kidnap squad after you.
- pkaye 8y ago
  It depends on who the Chinese nationals are worried about. Does Canada have an extradition treaty with China?
- msie 8y ago
  It's sad how this has become a fact because it's insinuated enough times in the press by the same few reporters. First it was Chinese foreigners buying up all the real estate, but that was proven false. Now, it's all these foreigners are laundering their money. Yes, a few (although the RCMP is having trouble with their money laundering case) but not all. The press simplifies and that becomes the reality that everyone believes. I had a coworker mention this "fact" after hearing it on the radio. Ugh. Reminds me of the weapons of mass destruction debacle.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - cauldron 8y ago
    Just to remind you that a 1000 something square ft apartment in Shanghai's perimeters costs like 5 million rmb, that's 50 times the average income there, and in better areas, it easily costs 10 or 20 millions plus. Think about it.
  - DenisM 8y ago
    > First it was Chinese foreigners buying up all the real estate, but that was proven false. How was it proven false?
    - xapata 8y ago
      The market impact appears to be negligible. At least not as large as factor as implied or popularly claimed.
      - vtesucks 8y ago
        To convey the spirit of your parent, is there any credible source? Remember china has a huge media manipulation budget.
        xapata 8y ago
        Is there any credible source the other way around? How many foreign nationals own property in Vancouver? How many of those properties are unoccupied? I can't remember where I spotted reporting on those two questions, but I wouldn't be surprised if the city publishes real estate transaction data such that the number of foreign purchases can be gathered. I remember a very small portion reported.
        parthdesai 8y ago
        Google is your friend. Metro Vancouver has 9.2% of unoccupied homes and Vancouver itself has 8.2%, them being highest and second highest in Canada. Chinese drug mafia also allegedly moved more than $5bn through flipping properties in Vancouver. https://www.thestar.com/vancouver/2018/06/24/in-one-of-west-vancouvers-nicest-neighbourhoods-nobodys-home-except-dust-bunnies-and-raccoons.html https://www.thestar.com/vancouver/2018/06/24/in-one-of-west-...
- ssnistfajen 8y ago
  Basically any time someone who has more money than you do purchases something you can't afford, it's automatically assumed that they are laundering their money? It's difficult to take housing issues in Vancouver seriously because paranoia nonsense like "all Chinese are money launderers" just wouldn't stop coming. As soon as a discussion happens, it gets swarmed by (dare I say it) bigots and immediately derailed.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - taysic 8y ago
    I don't think they were insinuating that all Chinese are money launderers but it is a real issue that has an impact on the real estate market. https://globalnews.ca/news/4149818/vancouver-cautionary-tale-money-laundering-drugs/ https://globalnews.ca/news/4149818/vancouver-cautionary-tale...
- richardknop 8y ago
  The Chinese buying real estate property in Vancouver or Toronto don't care about house prices so it won't do anything. They are doing it to secure their children's outside of China, they are not trying to flip those properties. I don't think they care if the house they bought for their kids loses in value, it's still a house and the kids can live there.
deckar01 8y ago
https://outline.com/NWDj34 https://outline.com/NWDj34
fosk 8y ago
Can somebody explain to me on what authority the US can request the arrest of a Chinese national on Canadian soil for any action they took while conducting operations of a Chinese organization headquartered in China?
- donohoe 8y ago
  They don't have any. They asked Canada to arrest her and they agreed to do it.
  - cedivad 8y ago
    Just watch them come up with something.
    - donohoe 8y ago
      Not sure what you mean. They have come up with something - violating sanctions against Iran.
      - cedivad 8y ago
        Which to me doesn't sound that different from the above comment talking about Thailand wanting to extradite westerns for offending their king, breaking their law. The something doesn't matter, it's not why she is in trouble.
        fastball 8y ago
        If you don't want to be fucked by the US don't fuck with US sanctions?
        bjcy 8y ago
        As a point of clarification, the Guardian article referenced above reports a request from Thailand to extradite Thai nationals living overseas. Thailand's lèse-majesté law was broken by Thais, as opposed to this case where a foreign national broke a US law and was present in an extradition-friendly country (to note, the sanctions are also law in Canada).
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
mciak 8y ago
Note that this arrest was due to the lesser sin of export control busting, rather than Huawei's biggest sin: facilitating surveillance and IP theft. Remarkable that they (she?) went through all the effort to set up a HK front company, but then left the Huawei logo on their powerpoint decks
- xapata 8y ago
  She probably didn't write the PowerPoint.
- emmelaich 8y ago
  Maybe they're getting for what they can prove rather than what they suspect. Like Capote for tax fraud.
  - mips_avatar 8y ago
    I think you mean Capone
    - emmelaich 8y ago
      Hah. Yes.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
- kleim 8y ago
  "facilitating surveillance and IP theft" ... Which is pretty funny coming from the US!
arijun 8y ago
Wow this seems like a huge deal. If the whole company is suspected of breaking the embargo, why is just the CFO arrested? Was she just the one they could get? Also, it seems weird that Huawei can sell their own products to Iran but not American products they own.
- dreamcompiler 8y ago
  > Was she just the one they could get? This seems likely. Any officer of the company might do in this circumstance. She might be the only one currently accessible in a country friendly to US extradition.
- dragonwriter 8y ago
  > If the whole company is suspected of breaking the embargo, why is just the CFO arrested? If the basis of extradition is fraud by a corporate officer (which seems to be one of the more likely offenses in a trade sanctions case actually covered by the extradition treaty, as sanctions violations themselves are not), then the question is how many corporate officers of Huawei are in Canada and exposed to extradition?
- iscro 8y ago
  It is a big deal. It's not everyday that an exec of a major company gets arrested - especially one so politically connected. I'm guessing this is just a continuation of the trade war we've been having with china and we told the canadians to arrest the CFO to send a message to china. She was probably targeted because she was important enough to matter but not important enough to go to war over. It'll be interesting how china responds. I doubt china would go after one of our execs but I wouldn't want to be a canadian executive in china.
- danielvf 8y ago
  A shell company was setup to do the deal, and she helped setup the shell company and was on the board of directors of the shell company, and was the shell company's corporate secretary.
estsauver 8y ago
I would not look forward to being an American businessman abroad in China right now. I think we're all used to the fiction that we live in a world that's totally governed by fairness and laws. That's been a pretty useful fiction for a long time, and in (some) of the developed world that's basically been how it's worked. But I really wonder how many shocks this system can take. I would bet money that an important US executive for some company is arrested in the two years while visiting China. EDIT: There's another comment here asking how it's possibly legal for the US to do this. Whether you believe it or not, it's useful to know that the philosophy much of our state department believes in is called Realpolitik (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Realpolitik https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Realpolitik). It doesn't really matter what the law says or what treaties we've signed, the primary thing that matters for the US is what's pragmatic for it at the moment.
- bilbo0s 8y ago
  Unfortunately, this is a pretty safe bet. That's why I always recommend that if you are going to go to China to do business, you should go with the goal of making people over there extremely rich. This will give you some protection. But yeah, if this is the game that the nations are going to play, then you don't want to be the poor schmuck sitting in a Chinese prison for 10 years just so they can make a point. It's probably time to start considering business models that allow you to operate at a distance from China. (Same with the smaller Chinese operators I guess? I mean, if I'm being fair. They should probably start considering models that don't require them to be in North America.) If you're small, it's just a fact that this game is in danger of evolving beyond the capacity of your resources to play it. Bottom line, whether you're Chinese or American, no one wants to start spending years on years in foreign prisons because they wanted to go to a foreign country to work for a few years. It's just not worth the risk.
  - wybiral 8y ago
    > But yeah, if this is the game that the nations are going to play, then you don't want to be the poor schmuck sitting in a Chinese prison for 10 years just so they can make a point. Facilitating deals with Iran to deliver US products in defiance of US sanctions seems like something the average schmuck hopefully isn't getting mixed up in. It's not quite the same as accidentally violating some random domestic business laws.
forkLding 8y ago
Whats the Iranian perspective? Theres a lot of Americans here, I presume there are Iranians too?
- yourbandsucks 8y ago
  They're probably pissed at the USA welching on a made deal, at the very least..
- namirez 8y ago
  Nothing new here! She appears to have violated the US sanctions. Many people have ended up in prison for lesser offenses, some of whom were not even aware of their crime. The story of John Roth is really informative. He was indicted and jailed simply because of hiring two Iranian and Chinese students. https://archives.fbi.gov/archives/knoxville/press-releases/2012/former-university-of-tennessee-professor-john-reece-roth-begins-serving-four-year-prison-sentence-on-convictions-of-illegally-exporting-military-research-data https://archives.fbi.gov/archives/knoxville/press-releases/2...
  - fastball 8y ago
    The fact that it was a USAF drone project which he hired them for seems salient, no?
    - namirez 8y ago
      Maybe! Probably he should have known better, but that's beside the point. One can end up in jail by simply hiring nationals from sanctioned countries. This case is more clearcut in comparison. She was actually involved in exporting American technology to Iran.
      - colechristensen 8y ago
        "Exporting" technology for these sorts of legal purposes can be as simple as allowing a foreign national to see a document in passing. Punishment can range from "good job admitting it promptly" to decades in prison.
cronix 8y ago
> “Wanzhou Meng was arrested in Vancouver on December 1. She is sought for extradition by the United States, and a bail hearing has been set for Friday,” Justice department spokesperson Ian McLeod said in a statement to The Globe and Mail. “As there is a publication ban in effect, we cannot provide any further detail at this time. The ban was sought by Ms. Meng. I don't understand the last bit there about a "publicaton ban." So, in Canada, a suspect can request that some info of their arrest be withheld? I googled and came up with https://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/cj-jp/victims-victimes/factsheets-fiches/publication.html https://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/cj-jp/victims-victimes/factshe..., but it doesn't make much sense to me since her name was published? So how would a publication ban protect her identity? I guess there could be others involved that she was protecting and not wanting the names released?
- forkLding 8y ago
  https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Publication_ban https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Publication_ban As stated on the wiki, likely because the publicity generated could affect the case. This case likely will get a lot of publicity.
  - cronix 8y ago
    Yes, but her name was released. I'm questioning on what exactly this ban is protecting if her identity is already known?
    - forkLding 8y ago
      As in it could turn into a cause celebre and run amok due to the politics involved. Likely the cause celebre might not just be affecting court decisions but cause external effects like other clashes in society so best to keep it quiet to not risk random crises.
    - pducks32 8y ago
      I believe (based on the fact she was arrested Dec. 1) that her name was part of the tight information security but once it gets out that she has been arrested the news are allowed to publish that. Moreover, It also appears these may be international papers and I don’t know enough to say they have to or don’t have to follow the ban.
dsl 8y ago
A tl;dr to address some of the obvious questions here: In 2013 she set up a Hong Kong shell company called Skycom Tech. That company (attempted to) purchase HP computers from the United States and resell them to Iran. The deal did not involve Huawei products, but many of the documents related to the deal were labeled "Huawei confidential" indicating they created the shell company to conceal their involvement. She broke the law by attempting to do a straw purchase for the Iranian government of US manufactured restricted goods. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_purchase https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_purchase Canada has an extradition agreement with the United States, so the Canadian government arrested her on behalf of the US.
- floatboth 8y ago
  It's kinda scary that the US can do anything about straw purchases. US company sells to HK company, the stuff becomes property of HK company, US should be completely out of the goddamn picture at this point, HK company sells to Iran, done. The US govt must not be able to do anything about the HK company's intention to resell.
  - tathougies 8y ago
    > The US govt must not be able to do anything about the HK company's intention to resell. What does that statement mean?
    - floatboth 8y ago
      Ah, if it's not buying with the intention to resell that's illegal, but the resale itself, it means nothing. I just think it's weird that the US law handles the resale case. Like they think they have authority over the whole world. The US supposedly loves private property. But this transitive application of trade restrictions sounds like complete disrespect of private property. (And honestly even just any trade restrictions in general…)
      - tathougies 8y ago
crazy_monkey 8y ago
... this is basically trade hostage taking.
bobdylan425 8y ago
tesr
freewizard 8y ago
Notably she’s not just CFO, but also vice chairwoman of the board, daughter of founder/CEO, and very widely viewed as the successor of his father.
- jacquesm 8y ago
  his/her
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
nimbius 8y ago
double standard? I dont recall seeing any of the Bluecoat (Symantec now) CEO's cuffed at the airport when hackers found Bluecoat hardware in Syria... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Coat_Systems https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Coat_Systems It seems like the US Government has a serious axe to grind with Huawei.
- cedivad 8y ago
  And HN plays its part with the downvotes.
  - AnimalMuppet 8y ago
    I flagged this one as a dup, not for content.
    - nimbius 8y ago
      sorry about that, I duplicate posted by accident after realizing I hadnt whitelisted hn for cookies when switching back to firefox. dupe deleted. but seriously, just google ITAR violations and youll find a litany of other american companies that have been made to pay fines for violations and allowed to continue business as normal with no sanctions, no boycotts. https://spacenews.com/37071us-satellite-component-maker-fined-8-million-for-itar-violations/ https://spacenews.com/37071us-satellite-component-maker-fine... https://www.strtrade.com/news-publications-ITAR-AECA-violations-062314.html https://www.strtrade.com/news-publications-ITAR-AECA-violati... its just Huawei for some reason that sticks in the craw of DC, and has for months now starting with senators insisting they should be boycotted, to a defense procurement boycott that extends to DOD contractors, and eventually the evangelism of a boycott that extends to AT&T and others. Im genuinely curious what caused it? because the trade violation just seems convenient.
- jhall1468 8y ago
  Bluecoat was the vendor in this case. They sold software to an intermediary that then sold it to Syria. The intermediary was fined for the exchange.
refurb 8y ago
In case people aren't aware, Canadian-Iranian relations aren't exactly in a good place right now.[1] Extraditing someone to the US for violating US sanctions against Iran aligns pretty well with Canada's interests right now. [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canada%E2%80%93Iran_relations https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canada%E2%80%93Iran_relations
- KSS42 8y ago
  Huawei also has a large R&D presence in Canada. Maintaining good relations with Huawei is more in Canada's interest.
  - davemp 8y ago
    I believe that the USA's relationship is at least a bit more important than Huawei's R&D budget.
  - lainga 8y ago
    I take deep umbrage at the suggestion that my country and government would choose corporate money over the global democratic order.
  - product50 8y ago
    Seriously? Canada will try to maintain R&D for Huawei vs. risking their relationship with US? Don't say the answer - we know it.
- ahmedalsudani 8y ago
  You should actually read the article your shared. Relations have improved under Trudeau. It was the previous Harper government under which relations deteriorated. Going off on a tangent, but the hypocrisy around the Middle East is so brazen, it's embarrassing. I am by no means a fan of the Iranian regime. It's as rotten as all the autocraticies and theocraties in the region. However, to claim Iran is irredeemable for supporting Assad while at the same time inking arm deals and strategizing with Saudi Arabia is an insult to our intelligence.
api_or_ipa 8y ago
Suspicious how this comes right on the heels of negative publicity about Huawei's IP theft and possible infiltration of global telecom networks. I suspect someone might be wanting to apply pressure and forcing Huawei to respond.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
justinzollars 8y ago
Goodbye Vancouver real estate?
- hn_throwaway_99 8y ago
  The Chinese buy real estate in Vancouver to avoid the Chinese government, not the US. Canada does not have an extradition treaty with China.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
williesleg 8y ago
Good thing Nixon, Carter, Reagan, Bush 1, Clinton, Bush 2 all built up China to the point it is today! Great job all!
cauldron 8y ago
Expecting in couple months, there would be an American executive's nationally televised confession and contrition.
ineedasername 8y ago
Is she herself accused of breaking the Iran sanctions or is it Huawei, and as the CFO she's being held accountable? I can't tell from this article or the one from NYT. And it seems like that would be a big difference, and if it was Huawai then the US should just level sanctions against Huawai rather than arresting its executives on criminal charges.
- freddie_mercury 8y ago
  "It seems" is not really a useful starting point in discussions. It is better to actually know the relevant laws & practices.
  - ineedasername 8y ago
    "It seems" is just fine. I was expressing my opinion of how it should be handled, not making a statement of fact on applicable laws.
- danielvf 8y ago
  She herself was instrumental in setting up the shell company used to try to do the deal, and was at a minimum, on it's board of directors at the time.
- freeone3000 8y ago
  US can very well do both.
gtrubetskoy 8y ago
It's interesting that this happened on the same day Trump and Jinping met, there is a possibility they both knew about this prior to the meeting. On Monday stock market goes up on "improving China relations", on Tuesday the Dow tanks 800 points on "no news". Chances are the sell-off was because some people learned about it on Tuesday.
stevespang 8y ago
You can bet this means there will be a high level arrest of a US corporation CEO or the like in China almost immediately - - tit for tat.
throw2016 8y ago
This is a mockery of globalization, free markets and rule of law. It's sad for those of us who have supported some of these values to see them mocked like this. This is like China or Russia getting Trump's or Bill Gates daughter arrested on some made up charge in a third country. Who will support that? Unilateral sanctions against Iran or Cuba without the consensus of the UN is questionable in law in the first place. What crimes have Iran or Cuba committed? And yet these sanctions without basis by countries who count Saudi Arabia as their closest ally are allowed to cause suffering to millions of people for decades on end and no one cares. This is the twisted state of our world. It seems ultimately foolish to believe in ideals when they only apply to a certain group of countries in their benefit, and when not will use propaganda and their collective political and diplomatic power to harass others.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
chenpengcheng 8y ago
Intern camp.
mips_avatar 8y ago
China has a long history of disregarding United Nations and US sanctions. During the second Iraq war they defied UN sanctions by selling anti-aircraft defense systems to Iraq directly endangering US and coalition fighters. Edit: verb tense. https://books.google.com/books?id=grGMAwAAQBAJ&pg=PT221&lpg=PT221&dq=chinese+military+burying+fiber+optic+cables+iraq&source=bl&ots=Lke2jW4l_v&sig=fSORayYCs1bfvetAty4Cs3jBBUE&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjI8fKmn4rfAhVIvFkKHeyOC_sQ6AEwC3oECAcQAQ#v=onepage&q=chinese%20military%20burying%20fiber%20optic%20cables%20iraq&f=false https://books.google.com/books?id=grGMAwAAQBAJ&pg=PT221&lpg=...
- qd6pwu4 8y ago
  Keep in mind that US sanctions against foreign companies doing business with Iran are opposed by: The United Nations International Court of Justice, which ordered the US to withdraw sanctions, to which the US responded by pulling out of international agreements. The European Union, which has attempted to block its companies from complying with US sanctions. With that said, the US is free to sanction anyone for its own interests, that's its right as a sovereign state. It is also its right as a sovereign state to refuse market access and trade to any company that violates its sanctions. But arresting foreign nationals in other countries for violating US sanctions? That's the equivalent of Russia arresting American business executives and extraditing them to China for violating Chinese sanctions against Taiwan - and yes, there are sanctions against Taiwan, which are regularly ignored by the US, of course. This is a massive escalation and will undoubtedly cause a major international crisis. Stay tuned. Source:https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/a3hied/huawei_deputy_chairwoman_arrested_by_canada_at_us/ https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/a3hied/huawei_de...
  - mips_avatar 8y ago
    I mean you’re right that the UN has a lot of realpolitik, and you need to take those decisions with a grain of salt. But the rulings you are referring to are an instance where the US took a different ideological stance to the EU as to the best course of action to deal with Iran (which nobody wants to have intercontinental ballistic missiles, but really doesn’t want it to have nuclear weapons). The example I gave and what it looks like Meng did at Huawei are examples of the Chinese government actively supporting weapons programs in hostile regions. I very much feel that she should stand trial for the deception she did constructing these shell companies to sell US export controlled items to Iran.
rdl 8y ago
I’m curious where she was flying. If Chinese execs can’t do China to Mexico via Canada connections, that will be interesting. (I am pretty sure she was actively avoiding connections in the US. Overflight of the US is bad if you are Snowden level but it isn’t quite as risky as connecting in Canada and way less than connecting in the US, since the US doesn’t do sterile transit.)
- Laforet 8y ago
  Details are pretty scarce because of the publication ban atm, however rumour has it that she's arrested in the Vancouver suburb of Richmond, and she may have entered the country using a Canadian passport. Again these are just hearsay at the mlment, however it does explain why the US/Canadian authorities were enboldened to act and she had to seek an order to prevent publication of the particilars of the case against her.
crb002 8y ago
I'm hoping Canada puts her on a flight to Beijing instead of involving itself. She is acused of violating a trade embargo that Canada is not a party to.
- jhall1468 8y ago
  That would violate US-Canadian reciprocation agreements and could dramatically hinder relations between the countries. What your suggesting is a very small-picture POV that will only result in hurting both countries.
xttblog 8y ago
加拿大还是一个主权国家吗？
- mips_avatar 8y ago
  加拿大很好
hacknat 8y ago
It is telling that Chinese-US relations are at stake when a "private" citizen is arrested for a crime. Beijing was quick to say there was no wrong-doing before formal charges were even made. China wonders why we distrust their businesses, and this is the reason. They all seem to be heavily politically supported by the Chinese government. We're all discussing it with the presumption that, of course, it would. When we indicted half of FIFA everyone in the EU loved us for it, and certainly no political establishments condemned it.
mtw 8y ago
Many are lost in technicalities here, if Canada has the right to arrest a businesswoman, if the US can stop a foreign company to do business with another country. Who cares? I'm partial to Iran because a multi-lateral treaty was signed. Iran stopped nuclear enrichment. In exchange, western countries pledged to provide economic relief and stop sanctions. It is said that Iran has been developing various weapons, but these weapons do not fall under the treaty, and experts and controllers all agree the nuclear program has been stopped. It is wrong for the US to walk away from this treaty, in the same way it was wrong to walk away from the Paris accord agreement. You agree on one thing, you have to follow. That is the honourable thing to do. A few will say that Iran is threatening Middle East Peace. What is obvious is that its Saudi Arabia who's bombing its southern neighbour or sending tanks to Bahrain. If you want peace, you have to impose sanctions on Saudi Arabia as well. What is even wrong for the US is punishing foreign companies wanting to do business in Iran. Perhaps there are technicalities to demonstrate a law in the US is broken. This makes sense for bureaucrats. For the rest of the world, it's just abuse and plain wrong. History will judge.
- nostromo 8y ago
  > It is wrong for the US to walk away from this treaty The Iran Nuclear Deal and the Paris Accords were not treaties. We have a process to ratify treaties in the US. The president approves a treaty and sends it to the senate to approve or reject. It's easy for president to make executive order agreements because it doesn't require approval from the senate (something Obama knew he couldn't get for either deal). But all parties should know that these non-treaties can be undone without a second thought by a new president. The nice thing about the American system is that while treaties are difficult to pass, they are more or less permanent.
  - dis-sys 8y ago
    > The nice thing about the American system is that while treaties are difficult to pass, they are more or less permanent. The Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty was signed in 1987, it is now dead. so by your definition, 30 years is now called permanent? To me, a far better definition of the term permanent can be concluded from the matter of the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea - US permanently refused to join that convention.
lennydizzy 8y ago
Only if Huawei could dismember some journalists, then they would probably be fine, maybe even get to shake the President's hand.
dingoegret 8y ago
USA world police
xmly 8y ago
Huawei has a branch in the US and Canada. Why not arrest some of them now? If the criminal is done by other colleagues in the company, should the executives be punished? I highly doubt the CFO is arranging the shipment to Iran... Or simply because the CFO is the daughter of the founder?
- briandear 8y ago
  The CFO is a fiduciary if the company. The rank and file generally are not. The CFO couldn’t possibly be unaware of shipments to Iran. That would be absurd — and awareness of, is the same as agreement with, when you are the CFO of the company. Surely the receipts from Iranian payments crossed the CFO’s desk. This isn’t some subsidiary selling a few laptops illegally, this was far bigger. Some minion in the US office wasn’t making decisions unilaterally.
qd6pwu4 8y ago
Shameless, hypocrite countries
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qd6pwu4 8y ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/a3hied/huawei_deputy_chairwoman_arrested_by_canada_at_us/ https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/a3hied/huawei_de... Keep in mind that US sanctions against foreign companies doing business with Iran are opposed by: The United Nations International Court of Justice, which ordered the US to withdraw sanctions, to which the US responded by pulling out of international agreements. The European Union, which has attempted to block its companies from complying with US sanctions. With that said, the US is free to sanction anyone for its own interests, that's its right as a sovereign state. It is also its right as a sovereign state to refuse market access and trade to any company that violates its sanctions. But arresting foreign nationals in other countries for violating US sanctions? That's the equivalent of Russia arresting American business executives and extraditing them to China for violating Chinese sanctions against Taiwan - and yes, there are sanctions against Taiwan, which are regularly ignored by the US, of course. This is a massive escalation and will undoubtedly cause a major international crisis. Stay tuned.
- dillondoyle 8y ago
  Plus the arrested party is the daughter of the founder; I can't separate that fact when trying to infer intention here. I definitely feel anxious..
  - chvid 8y ago
    I think this is an extremely dangeruous move on the side of the Trump administration. This is supposed to be about Iran? Arresting the daugther of Huawei's founder definately makes it seem like there is more going on. How is any significant American business man flying through Hong Kong airport supposed to feel right now?
    - chvid 8y ago
      And I am pretty sure that the mullahs in Tehran are laughing in their beards over the US picking fights with China (and maybe the EU) over the Iran boycots. At least when this is the way it is done.
majia 8y ago
This reminds me of the Yinhe incident: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yinhe_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yinhe_incident
- qd6pwu4 8y ago
  丢掉幻想，准备斗争
  - throwfast1 8y ago
    this translates to "Lose fantasy, prepare to fight" according to google translate.
hurr_durr 8y ago
So let me get this straight, Huawei's CFO gets the book thrown at her for allegedly selling tech to Iran...while MBS gets a pass for murdering a US journalist (not to mention all the dead kids in Yemen). Lmao okay.
vorticalbox 8y ago
I was under the impression that unless you left the airport you're not technically in that country. That's how Julian Assange evaded arrest.
- goodcanadian 8y ago
  Not so. The airport is definitely the territory of the country in which it resides. You do not have to clear immigration to be subject to that nation's laws.
dude3 8y ago
Probably related to this: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-us-canada-46352336 https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-us-c.... Trump brought it up at the g20
farseer 8y ago
The only lesson here is: If your company has ever sold any products in Iran, I think its safe to avoid taking any connecting flights through US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand and possibly Britain. Fly Emirates, Qatar Airways or Cathay Pacific.
flexie 8y ago
It is ugly. The US and Canada is going down a rabbit hole. The dictatorship of Iran is disgusting and dangerous but the US trades with countries governed by equally disgusting and dangerous dictatorships such as Saudi Arabia and China. The US trade sanctions are imposed unilaterally and create mountains of troubles for US allies. Most of the world oppose the trade sanctions. Such sanctions rarely work anyways. It's a huge cost born not only by US companies but by companies in allied countries that have to obey US sanctions in order to avoid repercussions.
m00nlight 8y ago
Is Canada becoming little brother of US?
- Sacho 8y ago
  What do you mean by "becoming"? The extradition treaty that the US most likely invoked in this case has been in force for almost 50 years. https://www.oas.org/juridico/mla/en/traites/en_traites-ext-can-usa4.html https://www.oas.org/juridico/mla/en/traites/en_traites-ext-c...
  - m00nlight 8y ago
    So many double standard to the legal system from US & Canada. http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1130954.shtml http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1130954.shtml
  - m00nlight 8y ago
    And yes, you remind me that I use the wrong word, it should not be "becoming", it should be "always". :)
entity345 8y ago
It should be clear to anyone that the US have declared war on China. This won't make any difference long term.
gdfasfklshg4 8y ago
The Iran sanctions are yet another sad example of the US losing the moral high ground and soft power (followed by hard power). Americans might not like hearing this but increasingly the US is seen a dangerous, untrustworthy and negative value ally. As this continues the EU block will steadily move away from the US eventually NATO will fragment and this will have serious implications for global stability. Prior to the current return to Iran sanctions the USA had a monopoly on international payments clearance. The EU has responded by setting up an alternative system.
huahaiy 8y ago
Coincidentally, a Stanford Chinese American scientist, Prof. Shoucheng Zhang (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoucheng_Zhang https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoucheng_Zhang), who discovered the Quantum Spin Hall effect that plays a big part in the recent Intel announcement of the next generation of chip design, was found dead on Stanford campus on Dec. 1st. Before he's death, Prof. Zhang went together with Huawei's CFO to attend a dinner in Argentina on Dec. 1st. Basically, after that dinner in Argentina, one of them is dead, another is arrested.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- zavi 8y ago
  Suicide apparently https://www.chinamoneynetwork.com/2018/12/06/renowed-chinese-physicist-and-founder-of-danhua-capital-shoucheng-zhang-commits-suicide https://www.chinamoneynetwork.com/2018/12/06/renowed-chinese...
  - zachguo 8y ago
    That's not a trustworthy news source. Why would a renowned scientist doing world changing research commit suicide suddenly?
    - Laforet 8y ago
      My speculation is that he lost a lot of money on the crypto market. https://medium.com/blockchain-connect-conference/backing-theta-labs-and-orchid-shoucheng-and-dhvc-are-betting-big-on-blockchain-83e75ba7b7e3 https://medium.com/blockchain-connect-conference/backing-the...
    - Nasrudith 8y ago
      That isn't unprecedented sadly, Wallace Carothers [https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wallace_Carothers https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wallace_Carothers], the inventor of nylon committed suicide despite becoming head researcher of DuPont. Despite admitting serious red flags that could harm his ability to work the CEO came out to personally persuade him. In the great depression no less. Of course neither is murdering the turbulent.
emptyfile 8y ago
No problem USA! Go back on the Iran deal, go back on the Paris climate deal, go back on TPP. Just don't expect that anyone believes you anymore.
- AndrewUnmuted 8y ago
  You think THIS proves the US is not a trustworthy nation? Why choose to ignore the last 100+ years of the US's backstory and focus on this rather minor setback to make such a bold statement? I would imagine any amount of trust we had left was entirely exhausted more than 40 years ago, during the Nixon shock [0] and Exorbitant privilege [1]. Surely, you realize the US earns its status on the global stage via its violent & powerful military, and the PetroDollar? It is foolish to suggest that the US expects other nations to possess any pretense of trust. You don't have to believe me, because after all I'm just some dumb American. But you may want to take a good look in the mirror and ask yourself who is being the true "American" here. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixon_shock https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixon_shock [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exorbitant_privilege https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exorbitant_privilege
  - chopin 8y ago
    Trust is lost in buckets, and earned in drops. The US will learn this the hard way. There's never been a discussion about a European army, now it crops up, for example. Even if the next administration is deemed trustworthy what's with the one coming after that?
    - gonvaled 8y ago
      AND pushing for international clearing in Euros, which is much more damaging for the interests of the US.
    - creaghpatr 8y ago
      >There's never been a discussion about a European army, now it crops up, for example. Haha, good luck with that. EU will always come crawling to grovel for US military support, don’t be naive.
lukaa 8y ago
Is it only coincidence that this prosecution of Huawei come just after Huawei create best smartphone on market?
hkt 8y ago
Good for Canada - they showed a lot of spine in criticising Saudi Arabia this summer and they're showing a lot of spine with this. Combined with the UK's seizure of Facebook documents, it's a great week for assertive liberal democracies. Let's hope we're setting ourselves up for a 2019 where we'll get some sunlight into all the dark places that have been building up for the last couple of decades.
rqs 8y ago
Weird. Huawei made an carefully worded announcement early this day and states that they are didn't violate any related law: - https://www.zhihu.com/question/304821204 https://www.zhihu.com/question/304821204 - https://weibo.com/2557129567/H5WbTkTkj https://weibo.com/2557129567/H5WbTkTkj December 1, the same day Xi and Trump met at G20. Wonder if anything goes wrong. Americans better find something this time, one Yinhe incident[0] is bad enough for PR already :) [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yinhe_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yinhe_incident
Throwaway888899 8y ago
Woman accused of breaking a law is arrested, hacker news loses its mind over this. What?
lukaa 8y ago
Is it only coincidence that this prosecution of Huawei come just after Huawei create best smartphone on market?
- zeist 8y ago
  No it's due to their 5G network equipment success. Their tech is on par with Nokia & Ericsson and the price is very competitive.
Throwaway888899 8y ago
After reading these comments it's quite apparent that you can hold pretty much any opinion as long as you can cherry pick facts about either side.
thecleaner 8y ago
Could someone explain what laws were broken ? I can't understand what's the matter if a foreign national does trade with Iran ? And its kind of suspicious that Huawei, a telecom giant , is the prime target given how much lobbying is done by telecom companies in USA.
jussij 8y ago
I have no doubt this has a lot to do with two super powers trying very hard to flex their muscles, both trying to project a position of strength. However, I don't think China was helping it's cause when a month ago it decided to arrest the Interpol chief, only to have that chief released a few hours latter. Throw in that mix a crazy Putin itching for war in the Ukraine and we have three boys all trying very hard to take control the playground.
tu7001 8y ago
This is disgusting, I know what is the brand of my new mobile phone:-D
hsnewman 8y ago
Although the propaganda from the white house says a deal was made with China last week on tariffs, this I would consider would be seen by China as a major escalation of the nationalist behavior of the USA. The markets will likely respond with a sell off because the behavior of the USA is not correlating with the statements coming out. Hold on for a scary couple of days.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
ry4n413 8y ago
Is china still holding those Americans hostage? Victor and Cynthia Liu?
kelvin0 8y ago
It seems to me Canada is doing this for it's southern neighbor. Wondering if the fact that Huawei is putting a lot a pressure on American companies (by competing with them) is part of this?
- mips_avatar 8y ago
  The biggest Huawei competition is from Ericsson in Sweden and Nokia in Finland. The US feels very uncomfortable having it’s civilian and military networks serviced by Huawei because of the connections Huawei has to the Chinese military.
throwaway487550 8y ago
Taped Trump's calls? Okay.
benmmurphy 8y ago
For the conspiracy theorists O2 is currently suffering a massive mobile network outage in the UK [https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2018/12/06/o2-network-customers-lose-access-4g-data/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2018/12/06/o2-network...]. Apparently it has been caused by a third party supplier [https://twitter.com/O2/status/1070612301110226944 https://twitter.com/O2/status/1070612301110226944]. Apparently, O2 uses Huawei [http://telecoms.com/44197/huawei-wins-managed-services-deal-with-o2-uk/ http://telecoms.com/44197/huawei-wins-managed-services-deal-...] but has recently been boasting about moving away from them [can't find a reference]. But someone on twitter is claiming the third party is not Huawei. [https://twitter.com/NicFildes/status/1070606845881008128 https://twitter.com/NicFildes/status/1070606845881008128]
nickelcitymario 8y ago
And y'all thought we canucks we're nice.
Silmarilion 8y ago
I think that's totally fine. Only the US can spy on their own citizens, plus on the entire world.
squozzer 8y ago
Is Ms. Meng related to Meng Hongwei? https://www.yahoo.com/news/ex-interpol-chief-ousted-china-top-advisory-body-063307660.html https://www.yahoo.com/news/ex-interpol-chief-ousted-china-to...
fallingfrog 8y ago
So, we are willing to arrest foreign businesspeople and risk an international crisis in order to make sure that our supply of oil is secure, but if our own businesspeople rip off the American people to the tune of trillions of dollars, we not only let them walk free, but we compensate them for their losses. Interesting to see what kinds of behavior are actually punished. Shows you who's really in charge of the government. (Exxon, Goldman Sachs, etc)
AngeloAnolin 8y ago
Just a bit unclear on this: "Canada has arrested the chief financial officer of China’s Huawei Technologies, who now faces extradition to the United States on suspicion she violated U.S. trade sanctions against Iran." What violation was really committed? Was it Huawei doing business with Iran, like selling chips/devices/etc on their product line? If it (the Huawei company) did, shouldn't everyone on the company's employ who have had a hand on the products that were provided to Iran be arrested? I look forward to having more factual information on this, rather than mere speculations on the violations that were supposedly committed.
yes2right 8y ago
why Canada arrested Huawei’s global chief financial officer in Vancouver, this is not belong to Canada, really suck up to American. Canada got fuck good on tariff and still never learn. stupid the Canadian justice. tax fair paid him and he do job for American.
dmode 8y ago
I hope multiple US executives now get arrested in other countries for supporting a US regime that breaks human rights and ignores international everyday
yangxuecheng 8y ago
Sine when China has become one of USA's 50 states?
yes2right 8y ago
this is violation of international law, what is canada doing for us a favor. to arrest any citizen of country in canada. this is Canada looking own trouble now. really is suck up on us political .

1081 points by ericzawo 8y ago

I also wonder what this is going to do to Canada's real estate market considering that Canada has basically been a "safe haven" for Chinese nationals to flock to basically launder their money.

khuey 8y ago
Probably nothing. The Chinese looking at Canada as "a safe haven" are worried about their own government, not Canada's.
- mr_toad 8y ago
  On the other hand, Canadians who have helped Chinese people circumvent Chinese capital controls might want to think carefully about their holiday plans.
  - tlear 8y ago
    The good part is that PRC reach is mostly limited to China itself. Except if you get high enough profile they send a kidnap squad after you.
pkaye 8y ago
It depends on who the Chinese nationals are worried about. Does Canada have an extradition treaty with China?
msie 8y ago
It's sad how this has become a fact because it's insinuated enough times in the press by the same few reporters. First it was Chinese foreigners buying up all the real estate, but that was proven false. Now, it's all these foreigners are laundering their money. Yes, a few (although the RCMP is having trouble with their money laundering case) but not all. The press simplifies and that becomes the reality that everyone believes. I had a coworker mention this "fact" after hearing it on the radio. Ugh. Reminds me of the weapons of mass destruction debacle.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- cauldron 8y ago
  Just to remind you that a 1000 something square ft apartment in Shanghai's perimeters costs like 5 million rmb, that's 50 times the average income there, and in better areas, it easily costs 10 or 20 millions plus. Think about it.
- DenisM 8y ago
  > First it was Chinese foreigners buying up all the real estate, but that was proven false. How was it proven false?
  - xapata 8y ago
    The market impact appears to be negligible. At least not as large as factor as implied or popularly claimed.
    - vtesucks 8y ago
      To convey the spirit of your parent, is there any credible source? Remember china has a huge media manipulation budget.
      - xapata 8y ago
        Is there any credible source the other way around? How many foreign nationals own property in Vancouver? How many of those properties are unoccupied? I can't remember where I spotted reporting on those two questions, but I wouldn't be surprised if the city publishes real estate transaction data such that the number of foreign purchases can be gathered. I remember a very small portion reported.
        parthdesai 8y ago
        Google is your friend. Metro Vancouver has 9.2% of unoccupied homes and Vancouver itself has 8.2%, them being highest and second highest in Canada. Chinese drug mafia also allegedly moved more than $5bn through flipping properties in Vancouver. https://www.thestar.com/vancouver/2018/06/24/in-one-of-west-vancouvers-nicest-neighbourhoods-nobodys-home-except-dust-bunnies-and-raccoons.html https://www.thestar.com/vancouver/2018/06/24/in-one-of-west-...
ssnistfajen 8y ago
Basically any time someone who has more money than you do purchases something you can't afford, it's automatically assumed that they are laundering their money? It's difficult to take housing issues in Vancouver seriously because paranoia nonsense like "all Chinese are money launderers" just wouldn't stop coming. As soon as a discussion happens, it gets swarmed by (dare I say it) bigots and immediately derailed.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- taysic 8y ago
  I don't think they were insinuating that all Chinese are money launderers but it is a real issue that has an impact on the real estate market. https://globalnews.ca/news/4149818/vancouver-cautionary-tale-money-laundering-drugs/ https://globalnews.ca/news/4149818/vancouver-cautionary-tale...
richardknop 8y ago
The Chinese buying real estate property in Vancouver or Toronto don't care about house prices so it won't do anything. They are doing it to secure their children's outside of China, they are not trying to flip those properties. I don't think they care if the house they bought for their kids loses in value, it's still a house and the kids can live there.

deckar01 8y ago

https://outline.com/NWDj34 https://outline.com/NWDj34

fosk 8y ago

Can somebody explain to me on what authority the US can request the arrest of a Chinese national on Canadian soil for any action they took while conducting operations of a Chinese organization headquartered in China?

donohoe 8y ago
They don't have any. They asked Canada to arrest her and they agreed to do it.
- cedivad 8y ago
  Just watch them come up with something.
  - donohoe 8y ago
    Not sure what you mean. They have come up with something - violating sanctions against Iran.
    - cedivad 8y ago
      Which to me doesn't sound that different from the above comment talking about Thailand wanting to extradite westerns for offending their king, breaking their law. The something doesn't matter, it's not why she is in trouble.
      - fastball 8y ago
        If you don't want to be fucked by the US don't fuck with US sanctions?
      - bjcy 8y ago
        As a point of clarification, the Guardian article referenced above reports a request from Thailand to extradite Thai nationals living overseas. Thailand's lèse-majesté law was broken by Thais, as opposed to this case where a foreign national broke a US law and was present in an extradition-friendly country (to note, the sanctions are also law in Canada).

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

mciak 8y ago

Note that this arrest was due to the lesser sin of export control busting, rather than Huawei's biggest sin: facilitating surveillance and IP theft. Remarkable that they (she?) went through all the effort to set up a HK front company, but then left the Huawei logo on their powerpoint decks

xapata 8y ago
She probably didn't write the PowerPoint.
emmelaich 8y ago
Maybe they're getting for what they can prove rather than what they suspect. Like Capote for tax fraud.
- mips_avatar 8y ago
  I think you mean Capone
  - emmelaich 8y ago
    Hah. Yes.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
kleim 8y ago
"facilitating surveillance and IP theft" ... Which is pretty funny coming from the US!

arijun 8y ago

Wow this seems like a huge deal. If the whole company is suspected of breaking the embargo, why is just the CFO arrested? Was she just the one they could get? Also, it seems weird that Huawei can sell their own products to Iran but not American products they own.

dreamcompiler 8y ago
> Was she just the one they could get? This seems likely. Any officer of the company might do in this circumstance. She might be the only one currently accessible in a country friendly to US extradition.
dragonwriter 8y ago
> If the whole company is suspected of breaking the embargo, why is just the CFO arrested? If the basis of extradition is fraud by a corporate officer (which seems to be one of the more likely offenses in a trade sanctions case actually covered by the extradition treaty, as sanctions violations themselves are not), then the question is how many corporate officers of Huawei are in Canada and exposed to extradition?
iscro 8y ago
It is a big deal. It's not everyday that an exec of a major company gets arrested - especially one so politically connected. I'm guessing this is just a continuation of the trade war we've been having with china and we told the canadians to arrest the CFO to send a message to china. She was probably targeted because she was important enough to matter but not important enough to go to war over. It'll be interesting how china responds. I doubt china would go after one of our execs but I wouldn't want to be a canadian executive in china.
danielvf 8y ago
A shell company was setup to do the deal, and she helped setup the shell company and was on the board of directors of the shell company, and was the shell company's corporate secretary.

estsauver 8y ago

I would not look forward to being an American businessman abroad in China right now. I think we're all used to the fiction that we live in a world that's totally governed by fairness and laws. That's been a pretty useful fiction for a long time, and in (some) of the developed world that's basically been how it's worked. But I really wonder how many shocks this system can take. I would bet money that an important US executive for some company is arrested in the two years while visiting China. EDIT: There's another comment here asking how it's possibly legal for the US to do this. Whether you believe it or not, it's useful to know that the philosophy much of our state department believes in is called Realpolitik (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Realpolitik https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Realpolitik). It doesn't really matter what the law says or what treaties we've signed, the primary thing that matters for the US is what's pragmatic for it at the moment.

bilbo0s 8y ago
Unfortunately, this is a pretty safe bet. That's why I always recommend that if you are going to go to China to do business, you should go with the goal of making people over there extremely rich. This will give you some protection. But yeah, if this is the game that the nations are going to play, then you don't want to be the poor schmuck sitting in a Chinese prison for 10 years just so they can make a point. It's probably time to start considering business models that allow you to operate at a distance from China. (Same with the smaller Chinese operators I guess? I mean, if I'm being fair. They should probably start considering models that don't require them to be in North America.) If you're small, it's just a fact that this game is in danger of evolving beyond the capacity of your resources to play it. Bottom line, whether you're Chinese or American, no one wants to start spending years on years in foreign prisons because they wanted to go to a foreign country to work for a few years. It's just not worth the risk.
- wybiral 8y ago
  > But yeah, if this is the game that the nations are going to play, then you don't want to be the poor schmuck sitting in a Chinese prison for 10 years just so they can make a point. Facilitating deals with Iran to deliver US products in defiance of US sanctions seems like something the average schmuck hopefully isn't getting mixed up in. It's not quite the same as accidentally violating some random domestic business laws.

forkLding 8y ago

Whats the Iranian perspective? Theres a lot of Americans here, I presume there are Iranians too?

yourbandsucks 8y ago
They're probably pissed at the USA welching on a made deal, at the very least..
namirez 8y ago
Nothing new here! She appears to have violated the US sanctions. Many people have ended up in prison for lesser offenses, some of whom were not even aware of their crime. The story of John Roth is really informative. He was indicted and jailed simply because of hiring two Iranian and Chinese students. https://archives.fbi.gov/archives/knoxville/press-releases/2012/former-university-of-tennessee-professor-john-reece-roth-begins-serving-four-year-prison-sentence-on-convictions-of-illegally-exporting-military-research-data https://archives.fbi.gov/archives/knoxville/press-releases/2...
- fastball 8y ago
  The fact that it was a USAF drone project which he hired them for seems salient, no?
  - namirez 8y ago
    Maybe! Probably he should have known better, but that's beside the point. One can end up in jail by simply hiring nationals from sanctioned countries. This case is more clearcut in comparison. She was actually involved in exporting American technology to Iran.
    - colechristensen 8y ago
      "Exporting" technology for these sorts of legal purposes can be as simple as allowing a foreign national to see a document in passing. Punishment can range from "good job admitting it promptly" to decades in prison.

cronix 8y ago

> “Wanzhou Meng was arrested in Vancouver on December 1. She is sought for extradition by the United States, and a bail hearing has been set for Friday,” Justice department spokesperson Ian McLeod said in a statement to The Globe and Mail. “As there is a publication ban in effect, we cannot provide any further detail at this time. The ban was sought by Ms. Meng. I don't understand the last bit there about a "publicaton ban." So, in Canada, a suspect can request that some info of their arrest be withheld? I googled and came up with https://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/cj-jp/victims-victimes/factsheets-fiches/publication.html https://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/cj-jp/victims-victimes/factshe..., but it doesn't make much sense to me since her name was published? So how would a publication ban protect her identity? I guess there could be others involved that she was protecting and not wanting the names released?

forkLding 8y ago
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Publication_ban https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Publication_ban As stated on the wiki, likely because the publicity generated could affect the case. This case likely will get a lot of publicity.
- cronix 8y ago
  Yes, but her name was released. I'm questioning on what exactly this ban is protecting if her identity is already known?
  - forkLding 8y ago
    As in it could turn into a cause celebre and run amok due to the politics involved. Likely the cause celebre might not just be affecting court decisions but cause external effects like other clashes in society so best to keep it quiet to not risk random crises.
  - pducks32 8y ago
    I believe (based on the fact she was arrested Dec. 1) that her name was part of the tight information security but once it gets out that she has been arrested the news are allowed to publish that. Moreover, It also appears these may be international papers and I don’t know enough to say they have to or don’t have to follow the ban.

dsl 8y ago

A tl;dr to address some of the obvious questions here: In 2013 she set up a Hong Kong shell company called Skycom Tech. That company (attempted to) purchase HP computers from the United States and resell them to Iran. The deal did not involve Huawei products, but many of the documents related to the deal were labeled "Huawei confidential" indicating they created the shell company to conceal their involvement. She broke the law by attempting to do a straw purchase for the Iranian government of US manufactured restricted goods. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_purchase https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_purchase Canada has an extradition agreement with the United States, so the Canadian government arrested her on behalf of the US.

floatboth 8y ago
It's kinda scary that the US can do anything about straw purchases. US company sells to HK company, the stuff becomes property of HK company, US should be completely out of the goddamn picture at this point, HK company sells to Iran, done. The US govt must not be able to do anything about the HK company's intention to resell.
- tathougies 8y ago
  > The US govt must not be able to do anything about the HK company's intention to resell. What does that statement mean?
  - floatboth 8y ago
    Ah, if it's not buying with the intention to resell that's illegal, but the resale itself, it means nothing. I just think it's weird that the US law handles the resale case. Like they think they have authority over the whole world. The US supposedly loves private property. But this transitive application of trade restrictions sounds like complete disrespect of private property. (And honestly even just any trade restrictions in general…)
    - tathougies 8y ago

crazy_monkey 8y ago

... this is basically trade hostage taking.

bobdylan425 8y ago

tesr

freewizard 8y ago

Notably she’s not just CFO, but also vice chairwoman of the board, daughter of founder/CEO, and very widely viewed as the successor of his father.

jacquesm 8y ago
his/her

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

nimbius 8y ago

double standard? I dont recall seeing any of the Bluecoat (Symantec now) CEO's cuffed at the airport when hackers found Bluecoat hardware in Syria... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Coat_Systems https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Coat_Systems It seems like the US Government has a serious axe to grind with Huawei.

cedivad 8y ago
And HN plays its part with the downvotes.
- AnimalMuppet 8y ago
  I flagged this one as a dup, not for content.
  - nimbius 8y ago
    sorry about that, I duplicate posted by accident after realizing I hadnt whitelisted hn for cookies when switching back to firefox. dupe deleted. but seriously, just google ITAR violations and youll find a litany of other american companies that have been made to pay fines for violations and allowed to continue business as normal with no sanctions, no boycotts. https://spacenews.com/37071us-satellite-component-maker-fined-8-million-for-itar-violations/ https://spacenews.com/37071us-satellite-component-maker-fine... https://www.strtrade.com/news-publications-ITAR-AECA-violations-062314.html https://www.strtrade.com/news-publications-ITAR-AECA-violati... its just Huawei for some reason that sticks in the craw of DC, and has for months now starting with senators insisting they should be boycotted, to a defense procurement boycott that extends to DOD contractors, and eventually the evangelism of a boycott that extends to AT&T and others. Im genuinely curious what caused it? because the trade violation just seems convenient.
jhall1468 8y ago
Bluecoat was the vendor in this case. They sold software to an intermediary that then sold it to Syria. The intermediary was fined for the exchange.

refurb 8y ago

In case people aren't aware, Canadian-Iranian relations aren't exactly in a good place right now.[1] Extraditing someone to the US for violating US sanctions against Iran aligns pretty well with Canada's interests right now. [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canada%E2%80%93Iran_relations https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canada%E2%80%93Iran_relations

KSS42 8y ago
Huawei also has a large R&D presence in Canada. Maintaining good relations with Huawei is more in Canada's interest.
- davemp 8y ago
  I believe that the USA's relationship is at least a bit more important than Huawei's R&D budget.
- lainga 8y ago
  I take deep umbrage at the suggestion that my country and government would choose corporate money over the global democratic order.
- product50 8y ago
  Seriously? Canada will try to maintain R&D for Huawei vs. risking their relationship with US? Don't say the answer - we know it.
ahmedalsudani 8y ago
You should actually read the article your shared. Relations have improved under Trudeau. It was the previous Harper government under which relations deteriorated. Going off on a tangent, but the hypocrisy around the Middle East is so brazen, it's embarrassing. I am by no means a fan of the Iranian regime. It's as rotten as all the autocraticies and theocraties in the region. However, to claim Iran is irredeemable for supporting Assad while at the same time inking arm deals and strategizing with Saudi Arabia is an insult to our intelligence.

api_or_ipa 8y ago

Suspicious how this comes right on the heels of negative publicity about Huawei's IP theft and possible infiltration of global telecom networks. I suspect someone might be wanting to apply pressure and forcing Huawei to respond.

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

justinzollars 8y ago

Goodbye Vancouver real estate?

hn_throwaway_99 8y ago
The Chinese buy real estate in Vancouver to avoid the Chinese government, not the US. Canada does not have an extradition treaty with China.

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

williesleg 8y ago

Good thing Nixon, Carter, Reagan, Bush 1, Clinton, Bush 2 all built up China to the point it is today! Great job all!

cauldron 8y ago

Expecting in couple months, there would be an American executive's nationally televised confession and contrition.

ineedasername 8y ago

Is she herself accused of breaking the Iran sanctions or is it Huawei, and as the CFO she's being held accountable? I can't tell from this article or the one from NYT. And it seems like that would be a big difference, and if it was Huawai then the US should just level sanctions against Huawai rather than arresting its executives on criminal charges.

freddie_mercury 8y ago
"It seems" is not really a useful starting point in discussions. It is better to actually know the relevant laws & practices.
- ineedasername 8y ago
  "It seems" is just fine. I was expressing my opinion of how it should be handled, not making a statement of fact on applicable laws.
danielvf 8y ago
She herself was instrumental in setting up the shell company used to try to do the deal, and was at a minimum, on it's board of directors at the time.
freeone3000 8y ago
US can very well do both.

gtrubetskoy 8y ago

It's interesting that this happened on the same day Trump and Jinping met, there is a possibility they both knew about this prior to the meeting. On Monday stock market goes up on "improving China relations", on Tuesday the Dow tanks 800 points on "no news". Chances are the sell-off was because some people learned about it on Tuesday.

stevespang 8y ago

You can bet this means there will be a high level arrest of a US corporation CEO or the like in China almost immediately - - tit for tat.

throw2016 8y ago

This is a mockery of globalization, free markets and rule of law. It's sad for those of us who have supported some of these values to see them mocked like this. This is like China or Russia getting Trump's or Bill Gates daughter arrested on some made up charge in a third country. Who will support that? Unilateral sanctions against Iran or Cuba without the consensus of the UN is questionable in law in the first place. What crimes have Iran or Cuba committed? And yet these sanctions without basis by countries who count Saudi Arabia as their closest ally are allowed to cause suffering to millions of people for decades on end and no one cares. This is the twisted state of our world. It seems ultimately foolish to believe in ideals when they only apply to a certain group of countries in their benefit, and when not will use propaganda and their collective political and diplomatic power to harass others.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

chenpengcheng 8y ago

Intern camp.

mips_avatar 8y ago

China has a long history of disregarding United Nations and US sanctions. During the second Iraq war they defied UN sanctions by selling anti-aircraft defense systems to Iraq directly endangering US and coalition fighters. Edit: verb tense. https://books.google.com/books?id=grGMAwAAQBAJ&pg=PT221&lpg=PT221&dq=chinese+military+burying+fiber+optic+cables+iraq&source=bl&ots=Lke2jW4l_v&sig=fSORayYCs1bfvetAty4Cs3jBBUE&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjI8fKmn4rfAhVIvFkKHeyOC_sQ6AEwC3oECAcQAQ#v=onepage&q=chinese%20military%20burying%20fiber%20optic%20cables%20iraq&f=false https://books.google.com/books?id=grGMAwAAQBAJ&pg=PT221&lpg=...

qd6pwu4 8y ago
Keep in mind that US sanctions against foreign companies doing business with Iran are opposed by: The United Nations International Court of Justice, which ordered the US to withdraw sanctions, to which the US responded by pulling out of international agreements. The European Union, which has attempted to block its companies from complying with US sanctions. With that said, the US is free to sanction anyone for its own interests, that's its right as a sovereign state. It is also its right as a sovereign state to refuse market access and trade to any company that violates its sanctions. But arresting foreign nationals in other countries for violating US sanctions? That's the equivalent of Russia arresting American business executives and extraditing them to China for violating Chinese sanctions against Taiwan - and yes, there are sanctions against Taiwan, which are regularly ignored by the US, of course. This is a massive escalation and will undoubtedly cause a major international crisis. Stay tuned. Source:https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/a3hied/huawei_deputy_chairwoman_arrested_by_canada_at_us/ https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/a3hied/huawei_de...
- mips_avatar 8y ago
  I mean you’re right that the UN has a lot of realpolitik, and you need to take those decisions with a grain of salt. But the rulings you are referring to are an instance where the US took a different ideological stance to the EU as to the best course of action to deal with Iran (which nobody wants to have intercontinental ballistic missiles, but really doesn’t want it to have nuclear weapons). The example I gave and what it looks like Meng did at Huawei are examples of the Chinese government actively supporting weapons programs in hostile regions. I very much feel that she should stand trial for the deception she did constructing these shell companies to sell US export controlled items to Iran.

rdl 8y ago

I’m curious where she was flying. If Chinese execs can’t do China to Mexico via Canada connections, that will be interesting. (I am pretty sure she was actively avoiding connections in the US. Overflight of the US is bad if you are Snowden level but it isn’t quite as risky as connecting in Canada and way less than connecting in the US, since the US doesn’t do sterile transit.)

Laforet 8y ago
Details are pretty scarce because of the publication ban atm, however rumour has it that she's arrested in the Vancouver suburb of Richmond, and she may have entered the country using a Canadian passport. Again these are just hearsay at the mlment, however it does explain why the US/Canadian authorities were enboldened to act and she had to seek an order to prevent publication of the particilars of the case against her.

crb002 8y ago

I'm hoping Canada puts her on a flight to Beijing instead of involving itself. She is acused of violating a trade embargo that Canada is not a party to.

jhall1468 8y ago
That would violate US-Canadian reciprocation agreements and could dramatically hinder relations between the countries. What your suggesting is a very small-picture POV that will only result in hurting both countries.

xttblog 8y ago

加拿大还是一个主权国家吗？

mips_avatar 8y ago
加拿大很好

hacknat 8y ago

It is telling that Chinese-US relations are at stake when a "private" citizen is arrested for a crime. Beijing was quick to say there was no wrong-doing before formal charges were even made. China wonders why we distrust their businesses, and this is the reason. They all seem to be heavily politically supported by the Chinese government. We're all discussing it with the presumption that, of course, it would. When we indicted half of FIFA everyone in the EU loved us for it, and certainly no political establishments condemned it.

mtw 8y ago

Many are lost in technicalities here, if Canada has the right to arrest a businesswoman, if the US can stop a foreign company to do business with another country. Who cares? I'm partial to Iran because a multi-lateral treaty was signed. Iran stopped nuclear enrichment. In exchange, western countries pledged to provide economic relief and stop sanctions. It is said that Iran has been developing various weapons, but these weapons do not fall under the treaty, and experts and controllers all agree the nuclear program has been stopped. It is wrong for the US to walk away from this treaty, in the same way it was wrong to walk away from the Paris accord agreement. You agree on one thing, you have to follow. That is the honourable thing to do. A few will say that Iran is threatening Middle East Peace. What is obvious is that its Saudi Arabia who's bombing its southern neighbour or sending tanks to Bahrain. If you want peace, you have to impose sanctions on Saudi Arabia as well. What is even wrong for the US is punishing foreign companies wanting to do business in Iran. Perhaps there are technicalities to demonstrate a law in the US is broken. This makes sense for bureaucrats. For the rest of the world, it's just abuse and plain wrong. History will judge.

nostromo 8y ago
> It is wrong for the US to walk away from this treaty The Iran Nuclear Deal and the Paris Accords were not treaties. We have a process to ratify treaties in the US. The president approves a treaty and sends it to the senate to approve or reject. It's easy for president to make executive order agreements because it doesn't require approval from the senate (something Obama knew he couldn't get for either deal). But all parties should know that these non-treaties can be undone without a second thought by a new president. The nice thing about the American system is that while treaties are difficult to pass, they are more or less permanent.
- dis-sys 8y ago
  > The nice thing about the American system is that while treaties are difficult to pass, they are more or less permanent. The Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty was signed in 1987, it is now dead. so by your definition, 30 years is now called permanent? To me, a far better definition of the term permanent can be concluded from the matter of the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea - US permanently refused to join that convention.

lennydizzy 8y ago

Only if Huawei could dismember some journalists, then they would probably be fine, maybe even get to shake the President's hand.

dingoegret 8y ago

USA world police

xmly 8y ago

Huawei has a branch in the US and Canada. Why not arrest some of them now? If the criminal is done by other colleagues in the company, should the executives be punished? I highly doubt the CFO is arranging the shipment to Iran... Or simply because the CFO is the daughter of the founder?

briandear 8y ago
The CFO is a fiduciary if the company. The rank and file generally are not. The CFO couldn’t possibly be unaware of shipments to Iran. That would be absurd — and awareness of, is the same as agreement with, when you are the CFO of the company. Surely the receipts from Iranian payments crossed the CFO’s desk. This isn’t some subsidiary selling a few laptops illegally, this was far bigger. Some minion in the US office wasn’t making decisions unilaterally.

qd6pwu4 8y ago

Shameless, hypocrite countries

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qd6pwu4 8y ago

https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/a3hied/huawei_deputy_chairwoman_arrested_by_canada_at_us/ https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/a3hied/huawei_de... Keep in mind that US sanctions against foreign companies doing business with Iran are opposed by: The United Nations International Court of Justice, which ordered the US to withdraw sanctions, to which the US responded by pulling out of international agreements. The European Union, which has attempted to block its companies from complying with US sanctions. With that said, the US is free to sanction anyone for its own interests, that's its right as a sovereign state. It is also its right as a sovereign state to refuse market access and trade to any company that violates its sanctions. But arresting foreign nationals in other countries for violating US sanctions? That's the equivalent of Russia arresting American business executives and extraditing them to China for violating Chinese sanctions against Taiwan - and yes, there are sanctions against Taiwan, which are regularly ignored by the US, of course. This is a massive escalation and will undoubtedly cause a major international crisis. Stay tuned.

dillondoyle 8y ago
Plus the arrested party is the daughter of the founder; I can't separate that fact when trying to infer intention here. I definitely feel anxious..
- chvid 8y ago
  I think this is an extremely dangeruous move on the side of the Trump administration. This is supposed to be about Iran? Arresting the daugther of Huawei's founder definately makes it seem like there is more going on. How is any significant American business man flying through Hong Kong airport supposed to feel right now?
  - chvid 8y ago
    And I am pretty sure that the mullahs in Tehran are laughing in their beards over the US picking fights with China (and maybe the EU) over the Iran boycots. At least when this is the way it is done.

majia 8y ago

This reminds me of the Yinhe incident: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yinhe_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yinhe_incident

qd6pwu4 8y ago
丢掉幻想，准备斗争
- throwfast1 8y ago
  this translates to "Lose fantasy, prepare to fight" according to google translate.

hurr_durr 8y ago

So let me get this straight, Huawei's CFO gets the book thrown at her for allegedly selling tech to Iran...while MBS gets a pass for murdering a US journalist (not to mention all the dead kids in Yemen). Lmao okay.

vorticalbox 8y ago

I was under the impression that unless you left the airport you're not technically in that country. That's how Julian Assange evaded arrest.

goodcanadian 8y ago
Not so. The airport is definitely the territory of the country in which it resides. You do not have to clear immigration to be subject to that nation's laws.

dude3 8y ago

Probably related to this: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-us-canada-46352336 https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-us-c.... Trump brought it up at the g20

farseer 8y ago

The only lesson here is: If your company has ever sold any products in Iran, I think its safe to avoid taking any connecting flights through US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand and possibly Britain. Fly Emirates, Qatar Airways or Cathay Pacific.

flexie 8y ago

It is ugly. The US and Canada is going down a rabbit hole. The dictatorship of Iran is disgusting and dangerous but the US trades with countries governed by equally disgusting and dangerous dictatorships such as Saudi Arabia and China. The US trade sanctions are imposed unilaterally and create mountains of troubles for US allies. Most of the world oppose the trade sanctions. Such sanctions rarely work anyways. It's a huge cost born not only by US companies but by companies in allied countries that have to obey US sanctions in order to avoid repercussions.

m00nlight 8y ago

Is Canada becoming little brother of US?

Sacho 8y ago
What do you mean by "becoming"? The extradition treaty that the US most likely invoked in this case has been in force for almost 50 years. https://www.oas.org/juridico/mla/en/traites/en_traites-ext-can-usa4.html https://www.oas.org/juridico/mla/en/traites/en_traites-ext-c...
- m00nlight 8y ago
  So many double standard to the legal system from US & Canada. http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1130954.shtml http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1130954.shtml
- m00nlight 8y ago
  And yes, you remind me that I use the wrong word, it should not be "becoming", it should be "always". :)

entity345 8y ago

It should be clear to anyone that the US have declared war on China. This won't make any difference long term.

gdfasfklshg4 8y ago

The Iran sanctions are yet another sad example of the US losing the moral high ground and soft power (followed by hard power). Americans might not like hearing this but increasingly the US is seen a dangerous, untrustworthy and negative value ally. As this continues the EU block will steadily move away from the US eventually NATO will fragment and this will have serious implications for global stability. Prior to the current return to Iran sanctions the USA had a monopoly on international payments clearance. The EU has responded by setting up an alternative system.

huahaiy 8y ago

Coincidentally, a Stanford Chinese American scientist, Prof. Shoucheng Zhang (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoucheng_Zhang https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoucheng_Zhang), who discovered the Quantum Spin Hall effect that plays a big part in the recent Intel announcement of the next generation of chip design, was found dead on Stanford campus on Dec. 1st. Before he's death, Prof. Zhang went together with Huawei's CFO to attend a dinner in Argentina on Dec. 1st. Basically, after that dinner in Argentina, one of them is dead, another is arrested.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
zavi 8y ago
Suicide apparently https://www.chinamoneynetwork.com/2018/12/06/renowed-chinese-physicist-and-founder-of-danhua-capital-shoucheng-zhang-commits-suicide https://www.chinamoneynetwork.com/2018/12/06/renowed-chinese...
- zachguo 8y ago
  That's not a trustworthy news source. Why would a renowned scientist doing world changing research commit suicide suddenly?
  - Laforet 8y ago
    My speculation is that he lost a lot of money on the crypto market. https://medium.com/blockchain-connect-conference/backing-theta-labs-and-orchid-shoucheng-and-dhvc-are-betting-big-on-blockchain-83e75ba7b7e3 https://medium.com/blockchain-connect-conference/backing-the...
  - Nasrudith 8y ago
    That isn't unprecedented sadly, Wallace Carothers [https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wallace_Carothers https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wallace_Carothers], the inventor of nylon committed suicide despite becoming head researcher of DuPont. Despite admitting serious red flags that could harm his ability to work the CEO came out to personally persuade him. In the great depression no less. Of course neither is murdering the turbulent.

emptyfile 8y ago

No problem USA! Go back on the Iran deal, go back on the Paris climate deal, go back on TPP. Just don't expect that anyone believes you anymore.

AndrewUnmuted 8y ago
You think THIS proves the US is not a trustworthy nation? Why choose to ignore the last 100+ years of the US's backstory and focus on this rather minor setback to make such a bold statement? I would imagine any amount of trust we had left was entirely exhausted more than 40 years ago, during the Nixon shock [0] and Exorbitant privilege [1]. Surely, you realize the US earns its status on the global stage via its violent & powerful military, and the PetroDollar? It is foolish to suggest that the US expects other nations to possess any pretense of trust. You don't have to believe me, because after all I'm just some dumb American. But you may want to take a good look in the mirror and ask yourself who is being the true "American" here. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixon_shock https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixon_shock [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exorbitant_privilege https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exorbitant_privilege
- chopin 8y ago
  Trust is lost in buckets, and earned in drops. The US will learn this the hard way. There's never been a discussion about a European army, now it crops up, for example. Even if the next administration is deemed trustworthy what's with the one coming after that?
  - gonvaled 8y ago
    AND pushing for international clearing in Euros, which is much more damaging for the interests of the US.
  - creaghpatr 8y ago
    >There's never been a discussion about a European army, now it crops up, for example. Haha, good luck with that. EU will always come crawling to grovel for US military support, don’t be naive.

lukaa 8y ago

Is it only coincidence that this prosecution of Huawei come just after Huawei create best smartphone on market?

hkt 8y ago

Good for Canada - they showed a lot of spine in criticising Saudi Arabia this summer and they're showing a lot of spine with this. Combined with the UK's seizure of Facebook documents, it's a great week for assertive liberal democracies. Let's hope we're setting ourselves up for a 2019 where we'll get some sunlight into all the dark places that have been building up for the last couple of decades.

rqs 8y ago

Weird. Huawei made an carefully worded announcement early this day and states that they are didn't violate any related law: - https://www.zhihu.com/question/304821204 https://www.zhihu.com/question/304821204 - https://weibo.com/2557129567/H5WbTkTkj https://weibo.com/2557129567/H5WbTkTkj December 1, the same day Xi and Trump met at G20. Wonder if anything goes wrong. Americans better find something this time, one Yinhe incident[0] is bad enough for PR already :) [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yinhe_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yinhe_incident

Throwaway888899 8y ago

Woman accused of breaking a law is arrested, hacker news loses its mind over this. What?

lukaa 8y ago

Is it only coincidence that this prosecution of Huawei come just after Huawei create best smartphone on market?

zeist 8y ago
No it's due to their 5G network equipment success. Their tech is on par with Nokia & Ericsson and the price is very competitive.

Throwaway888899 8y ago

After reading these comments it's quite apparent that you can hold pretty much any opinion as long as you can cherry pick facts about either side.

thecleaner 8y ago

Could someone explain what laws were broken ? I can't understand what's the matter if a foreign national does trade with Iran ? And its kind of suspicious that Huawei, a telecom giant , is the prime target given how much lobbying is done by telecom companies in USA.

jussij 8y ago

I have no doubt this has a lot to do with two super powers trying very hard to flex their muscles, both trying to project a position of strength. However, I don't think China was helping it's cause when a month ago it decided to arrest the Interpol chief, only to have that chief released a few hours latter. Throw in that mix a crazy Putin itching for war in the Ukraine and we have three boys all trying very hard to take control the playground.

tu7001 8y ago

This is disgusting, I know what is the brand of my new mobile phone:-D

hsnewman 8y ago

Although the propaganda from the white house says a deal was made with China last week on tariffs, this I would consider would be seen by China as a major escalation of the nationalist behavior of the USA. The markets will likely respond with a sell off because the behavior of the USA is not correlating with the statements coming out. Hold on for a scary couple of days.

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

ry4n413 8y ago

Is china still holding those Americans hostage? Victor and Cynthia Liu?

kelvin0 8y ago

It seems to me Canada is doing this for it's southern neighbor. Wondering if the fact that Huawei is putting a lot a pressure on American companies (by competing with them) is part of this?

mips_avatar 8y ago
The biggest Huawei competition is from Ericsson in Sweden and Nokia in Finland. The US feels very uncomfortable having it’s civilian and military networks serviced by Huawei because of the connections Huawei has to the Chinese military.

throwaway487550 8y ago

Taped Trump's calls? Okay.

benmmurphy 8y ago

For the conspiracy theorists O2 is currently suffering a massive mobile network outage in the UK [https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2018/12/06/o2-network-customers-lose-access-4g-data/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2018/12/06/o2-network...]. Apparently it has been caused by a third party supplier [https://twitter.com/O2/status/1070612301110226944 https://twitter.com/O2/status/1070612301110226944]. Apparently, O2 uses Huawei [http://telecoms.com/44197/huawei-wins-managed-services-deal-with-o2-uk/ http://telecoms.com/44197/huawei-wins-managed-services-deal-...] but has recently been boasting about moving away from them [can't find a reference]. But someone on twitter is claiming the third party is not Huawei. [https://twitter.com/NicFildes/status/1070606845881008128 https://twitter.com/NicFildes/status/1070606845881008128]

nickelcitymario 8y ago

And y'all thought we canucks we're nice.

Silmarilion 8y ago

I think that's totally fine. Only the US can spy on their own citizens, plus on the entire world.

squozzer 8y ago

Is Ms. Meng related to Meng Hongwei? https://www.yahoo.com/news/ex-interpol-chief-ousted-china-top-advisory-body-063307660.html https://www.yahoo.com/news/ex-interpol-chief-ousted-china-to...

fallingfrog 8y ago

So, we are willing to arrest foreign businesspeople and risk an international crisis in order to make sure that our supply of oil is secure, but if our own businesspeople rip off the American people to the tune of trillions of dollars, we not only let them walk free, but we compensate them for their losses. Interesting to see what kinds of behavior are actually punished. Shows you who's really in charge of the government. (Exxon, Goldman Sachs, etc)

AngeloAnolin 8y ago

Just a bit unclear on this: "Canada has arrested the chief financial officer of China’s Huawei Technologies, who now faces extradition to the United States on suspicion she violated U.S. trade sanctions against Iran." What violation was really committed? Was it Huawei doing business with Iran, like selling chips/devices/etc on their product line? If it (the Huawei company) did, shouldn't everyone on the company's employ who have had a hand on the products that were provided to Iran be arrested? I look forward to having more factual information on this, rather than mere speculations on the violations that were supposedly committed.

yes2right 8y ago

why Canada arrested Huawei’s global chief financial officer in Vancouver, this is not belong to Canada, really suck up to American. Canada got fuck good on tariff and still never learn. stupid the Canadian justice. tax fair paid him and he do job for American.

dmode 8y ago

I hope multiple US executives now get arrested in other countries for supporting a US regime that breaks human rights and ignores international everyday

yangxuecheng 8y ago

Sine when China has become one of USA's 50 states?

yes2right 8y ago

this is violation of international law, what is canada doing for us a favor. to arrest any citizen of country in canada. this is Canada looking own trouble now. really is suck up on us political .