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Nvidia announces RTX 2000 GPU series with ‘6x more performance’ and ray-tracing
- etiam 8y agoSince the post with the product page got merged here: https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/graphics-cards/rtx-2080-ti/ https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/graphics-cards/rtx-2080... Most of it is dramatically lit renderings of fans and vacuous marketing-speak of course, but there's a tidbit near the bottom of the page about NVLink I find interesting. "GeForce RTX™ NVLINK™ Bridge The GeForce RTX™ NVLink™ bridge connects two NVLink SLI-ready graphics cards with 50X the transfer bandwidth of previous technologies." I guess NVLink is finally becoming relevant as a consumer technology then? Do you think this will be the GPU generation when consumer motherboards capable of pushing things to the GPU by NVLink will appear as well?
- PeCaN 8y ago> Do you think this will be the GPU generation when consumer motherboards capable of pushing things to the GPU by NVLink will appear as well? first you'll need CPUs that support NVLink, and that's currently limited to the not so consumer oriented POWER9.
- lightsighter 8y agoNVLink works fine between GPUs even if the CPUs are x86. Just look at the NVIDIA DGX boxes/stations. https://devblogs.nvidia.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/NVLink-topology-e1491278374674.png https://devblogs.nvidia.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/NVLin...
- zamadatix 8y ago"NVLink is a wire-based communications protocol for near-range semiconductor communications developed by Nvidia that can be used for data and control code transfers in processor systems between CPUs and GPUs and solely between GPUs" Sounds like you're assuming operational mode A when this is going to be operational mode B.
- flyinfungi 8y agoAny clue on how this thing will compare to a 1080 TI?
- fh973 8y agoHere are some data points: https://www.forbes.com/sites/antonyleather/2018/08/20/new-leaks-reveal-nvidia-rtx-2070-quicker-than-gtx-1080-40-quicker-than-1070 https://www.forbes.com/sites/antonyleather/2018/08/20/new-le...
- bayesian_horse 8y agoIn terms of real time raytracing the RTX will blow the GTXs out of the water... For anything else? Remains to be seen.
- smacktoward 8y agoThis is my big question too. It's pretty standard marketing: if your new product isn't impressively better than the old one on commonly used benchmarks, you invent a new benchmark where your new product is impressively better. I wonder how much of the "look how much better these cards are at ray-tracing!" actually reflects real-world improvements users will see, and how much is there to create a benchmark that shows a big improvement over existing GPUs.
- bayesian_horse 8y agoI don't think it's that bad. The RTX is a whole new architecture and will have significantly more cores. The bigger question is probably just how the performance is compared to the price and power consumption. Realtime raytracing wasn't feasible before.
- shaklee3 8y agoFor fp16, int8 and int4, the RTX blows the GTX out of the water. For fp32 it's a tiny increase. The memory bandwidth is about 40% higher as well. You'll always find people complaining about each release, but overall I think this is a solid card.
- ocdtrekkie 8y agoThe prices are obscene. The '70 tier has usually been my tier of choice, but they're sliding that up from the $400 range to the $600 range. I actually just scored a 1080 in the realm of $400, presumably because crypto demand dived, and they had a lot of stock coming into the new generation announcement. I'm glad I got it, because it's going to be a while before I touch cards at these price points. Presumably when they filter down to a 2060 or something it'll be affordable?
- wmf 8y agoI think I spent $300 for a 970 and I've been keeping an eye out for something that has 2x the performance at the same price. I guess the replacement will be the 2050?
- voltagex_ 8y agoI think I'm in the same boat as you - but I'm hoping for 1.5x performance and a bit less heat / power usage. I think I'll leave the "4K" gaming to the Xbox One X.
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- emodendroket 8y agoYeah, I've been thinking about replacing my 970, but for these kind of prices I don't know if it makes much sense.
- whichdan 8y ago2080 Ti FE RTX 2080 Ti GTX 1080 Ti Price $1,199 $999 $699 GPU Architecture Turing Turing Pascal Boost Clock 1635 MHz 1545 MHz 1582 MHz Frame Buffer 11 GB GDDR6 11 GB GDDR6 11 GB GDDR5X Memory Speed 14 Gbps 14 Gbps 11 Gbps Memory Interface 352-bit 352-bit 352-bit CUDA Cores 4352 4352 3584 TDP 260W 250W 250W Giga Rays 10 10 ? 2080 FE RTX 2080 GTX 1080 Price $799 $699 $549 GPU Architecture Turing Turing Pascal Boost Clock 1800 MHz 1710 MHz 1733 MHz Frame Buffer 8 GB GDDR6 8 GB GDDR6 8 GB GDDR5X Memory Speed 14 Gbps 14 Gbps 10 Gbps Memory Interface 256-bit 256-bit 256-bit CUDA Cores 2944 2944 2560 TDP 225W 215W 180W Giga Rays 8 8 ? 2070 FE RTX 2070 GTX 1070 Ti GTX 1070 Price $599 $499 $449 $399 GPU Architecture Turing Turing Pascal Pascal Boost Clock 1710 MHz 1620 MHz 1607 MHz 1683 MHz Frame Buffer 8 GB GDDR6 8 GB GDDR6 8 GB GDDR5 8 GB GDDR5 Memory Speed 14 Gbps 14 Gbps 8 Gbps 8 Gbps Memory Interface 256-bit 256-bit 256-bit 256-bit CUDA Cores 2304 2304 2432 1920 TDP 175W 185W 180W 150W Giga Rays 6 6 ? ?
- Bedon292 8y agoWow, were the founders editions really that cheap on the last gen? Guess the inflated prices from all the crypto mining really threw me off.
- dragontamer 8y agoYeah, they were. NVidia's lesson from the Crypto-boom seems to be: "Some gamers are willing to pay >$1000 for their cards". EDIT: To be fair, NVidia is still on 14nm or 12nm class lithography (I forgot which one). So the increased die size of these new chips will naturally be more expensive than the 10xx series. Bigger chips cost more to produce after all. So if you fail to shrink the die, the economics demand that you increase the price instead. Still, we all know that NVidia has fat margins. We also know that they overproduced the 1080 series during the Cryptoboom, and that they still want to sell all of their old cards. If they push the prices down too much, then no one will buy the old stuff.
- p1esk 8y ago
- magnat 8y agoUsing DNN for generating higher resolution images[1] in realtime at fraction of the performance cost is quite brilliant. Is there any info it if this is nvidia proprietary technology or general feature of DirectX Raytracing that will eventually be available also from AMD and Intel? [1] Though showing CT/medical imaging as one of it's applications is a big no-no
- foota 8y agoI think this will integrate with Microsoft new Ray tracing api?
- brandonjm 8y ago> Is there any info it if this is nvidia proprietary technology or general feature of DirectX Raytracing that will eventually be available also from AMD and Intel? This is a general feature of their RTX 'pipeline', not just DirectX, so I imagine Vulkan will introduce support eventually. Whether AMD will be able to put it into GPUs is a different story, but it appears they are doing some of their own work in the area of Tensorflow so they may provide their own equivalent. > Though showing CT/medical imaging as one of it's applications is a big no-no Why is that? They weren't showing it as an application of their higher res image DNNs, that was just an example of where they have used DNNs in general.
- MikeLui 8y agoCan someone point me towards the deep learning tech they reference for improving ray tracing performance?
- Svoka 8y agoThey're using deep learning as fancy Anti-Aliasing mechanism, to fill gaps which GPU didn't have time to properly raytrace or to upscale parts of images. As I understood from what I seen ML there mostly for AA.
- the8472 8y agoYou mean denoising? In RT raytracing you're generally short on samples and need to interpolate between them / smooth over the shot noise.
- magoghm 8y agoIn their Siggraph presentation last week they mentioned using AI for both denoising and antialisasing (but they didn't provide anymore details about it).
- xxs 8y agoIt's likely mostly for denoising, I highly doubt it can have enough power to perform both denoising and antialiasing. The ray tracing presented would be sampling and then use the model to fill the gaps.
- mattnewport 8y agoYou're effectively training the network for both when training for denoising as your ground truth images are both denoised and anti aliased. With ray tracing both problems are brute forced by the same approach of throwing more samples per pixel at the problem.
- mattnewport 8y ago
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- stcredzero 8y agoHere's how a VR enthusiast should think about this news. Make an estimate for when 90Hz 1440P VR can be supported by the average laptop. I think that would be a good benchmark for the time a year before the widespread adoption of VR/AR by the general public.
- bitL 8y agoHmm, 24%-42% performance increase (14/16TFlops vs 11.3TFlops) for 70-90% price increase... And prices were already inflated by crypto that is now collapsing. Not sure who is the target market for this tech honestly. Still only 11GB RAM, even if 50% faster, making it a nonsense purchase for Deep Learning enthusiasts (state-of-art models are already larger). Unless somebody invented RTX-based coin of course, then this is the minimal price...
- kmkemp 8y agoWell, one audience is obvious from your own sentence: people who are willing to pay to have the best performance currently possible.
- bitL 8y ago2x Quadro RTX 8000 96GB ~$20000.
- dogma1138 8y agoTuring and Volta can do concurrent Integer and FP operations wich will give them a huge boost in traditional graphics as well. How much will be the real question here.
- AstralStorm 8y agoI'd expect total of around 15% on 2080 TI, mostly due to more shaders and improved scheduler.
- aqme28 8y agoWhere are you getting a 70-90% price increase? 1080s are ~$450, will now be $799. 1070s are ~$400, will now be $599. (I'm going off the top hits on Newegg)
- kup0 8y agoThese are also Founders Edition prices. Still the 2080ti is pretty expensive even at non-FE pricing: RTX 2070 cards will start at $499, with RTX 2080 at $699, and the RTX 2080 Ti starting at $999.
- TwoNineA 8y agoTitle is clickbait, 6 x performance gain is for ray tracing only, which is normal, Pascal cards didn't have the ray tracing muscle of the new cards.
- alkonaut 8y agoWhat are the approximate gains from the last gen, i.e. 1080->2080 or 1070->2070, for a non RTX enabled game? Would be speculation at this point I assume, but just based on clock freqs, mem bandwidth and the number of units on the chip?
- test6554 8y ago24% - 42% improvement according to an earlier Top comment...
- Valmar 8y agoDid you notice the '' quotes?
- natmaster 8y agoWhy do you need major performance increases for old looking games that are already maxing out your monitor's refresh rate? Next you're gonna say programmable shaders are overkill.
- jhasse 8y agoBecause a 1080 Ti can't do 144 FPS at 1440p or 60 FPS at 4K in all current gen titles with maxed out settings.
- sieabahlpark 8y agoCould you reenforce the gamer meme a little more?
- gabcoh 8y agoDoes anyone know how they are offering better raytracing performance? Are there new api’s or something?
- bearjaws 8y agoThis is exactly what im wondering, with the next gen consoles confirmed for AMD CPU/GPU I doubt there will be much Ray Tracing tech in the next generation, which means we're looking at 3-5 years before this tech can be mainstream. These GPUs will be antiquated by the time Ray Tracing can gain any real traction...
- xxs 8y agoI would presume some games (and engines) will have an option to enable "real" and/or off-screen shadows/reflections. Other than that it feels like a pure gimmick. Even in the demo of Lara Croft the fps drop is noticeable during the explosion sequence.
- Rebelgecko 8y agoI believe that lots of games already do ray tracing/casting when they render (especially for things like lighting and reflections), so there can be benefits even before games switch to 100% ray tracing.
- penagwin 8y agoFor the most part it really isn't "ray tracing", it's _close_ but almost everybody "cheats" because of the performance gains. Even if some games do using ray tracing for some things, the developers would have to update their game to support the features of a currently very expensive and uncommon card. Not to mention most gamers have a GTX 1060 or less according to steam to give you an idea of what the current "mainstream" is at.
- sscotth 8y agoI agree. It won't become mainstream until the next gen of consoles are able to take advantage, because developers will still be required handle the current generation. However, the demand from from developers themselves could be enough for console manufacturers to make sure it is available in their next iteration. Where have you seen that next gen consoles are confirmed for AMD? Also, if there is Nvidia tech here that AMD can't replicate, it doesn't mean that AMD can't license it.
- nabla9 8y agoAny idea of how these GeForce RTX's perform in deep learning applications compared to Quadro RTX? (price/performance ratio) I assume that they might have decent inference speed, but how about learning? $800 card would be nice for initial testing and developing in personal desktop machine. Or are they somehow crippled??
- bitL 8y agoI am curious as well. So far IMO RTX 5000 seems to be the card to get from this generation due to 16GB RAM and a bit slower performance.
- andrepd 8y agoWait for benchmarks. Until then it's anyone's guess.
- asparagui 8y agoThese will make a good card to experiment with. I am going to purchase one when I can. More RAM which is nice for larger models, but you can do a lot with 8GB of ram, especially if you are just getting going. Do not let worrying about having the latest and greatest hardware keep you from getting started. Time is the most important resource to have, not spec sheets. These cards look like they will have Tensor Cores, which should give a significant boost (e.g. ~50% of P100/V100 performance for certain operations at ~10% of the cost) over the 1080 series. The Quadro's have a higher spec ram (think ECC vs. DDR) which is important for a workstation GPU, but the price difference goes up in a hurry. My suggestion would be to learn on a RTX and then you can rent a Quadro if you need more power to play with.
- old-gregg 8y agoPutting AI/ML aside, I have a question for graphics experts or/and gamers: what is the practical [1] ceiling of the current champion, the 1080ti? I was under impression that that card already was much more than most people needed. In other words, is the new generation only useful for 4K gaming? [1] By "practical" I mean on 1440p@144Hz monitors.
- xxs 8y ago1080 ti can't do even 60fps on 4k on high settings for quite a lot of games. I doubt 2080 ti would be able either.
- physguy1123 8y agoFor me, it's around ~45-50fps@4k for a good set of games, and often ~100-120fps@144hz for me. 1000$ is a steep price for the 2080TI, although depending on the 2080 performance it might be the only card which can and will continue to reliably hit 60fps@4k. Not upping ram with such a huge price increase is absolutely absurd.
- ihuman 8y ago> ~100-120fps@144hz Do you mean @1440p?
- izacus 8y agoLast time I checked (when I was thinking of buying it), 1080Ti isn't even close to being able to push 4K/60fps on high settings in newest games.
- nilkn 8y agoYou can easily push the 1080 Ti to its limit with 4K or 21:9 1440p (3440x1440). It's an incredible card, but it only feels overpowered at 1080p or maybe 16:9 1440p.
- wilsonnb3 8y agoI'm currently running a 1070ti on a 1440p@144Hz monitor and I can maintain a solid 110-120 in AAA games that aren't pieces of shit (looking at you, PUBG) while on medium-high settings. The 1080ti is still definitely more than you need for 1440p@144hz, as long as you're willing to mess with the settings. There are so many settings that eat performance for very little visual benefit, so if you're dead set on running every graphical setting at the highest, then you probably won't always hit 144hz at 1440p with a 1080ti. IMHO you're correct, the new generation is right now only useful for 4k gaming. In a year or two after the full 20xx range is out, newer games with better graphics will be out and my 1070ti will probably no longer give the performance I want at 1440p.
- Giorgi 8y agoBut will it mine?
- Retr0spectrum 8y agoI sure hope not.
- xxs 8y agoIt has ddr6 - it will be quite decent albeit overly expensive/inefficient.
- djsumdog 8y agoCan it play Crysis?
- visionscaper 8y agoIs anything known about the number of tensor cores in the new 2080 Ti? What about the float16 performance using the Tensor cores? I couldn't find this on the spec page [1]. [1] https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/graphics-cards/rtx-2080-ti/ https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/graphics-cards/rtx-2080...
- asparagui 8y agoA couple of sites have said 384 TC's, which would be approximately ~50% of the v100/new high-end Quadro card. Would like to see a confirmed source as well.
- mattnewport 8y agoYeah, it seems at the moment that there's no confirmation on to what degree they're actually enabled either. It may well be that NVidia will make them available for inference via DirectX so they can do AI based denoising and anti aliasing in games but artificially limit support in frameworks for training so as not to eat into the Quadro / Tesla markets. I'm holding off on ordering one until I see more info on that.
- visionscaper 8y ago> It may well be that NVidia will make them available for inference via DirectX so they can do AI based denoising and anti aliasing in games but artificially limit support in frameworks for training so as not to eat into the Quadro / Tesla markets. I'm holding off on ordering one until I see more info on that. Good point, that would not be cool. I'll wait with ordering until more is known about this.
- visionscaper 8y agoI got this response from Nvidia customer care concerning these questions: "Hello Freddy, Thus far we do not have any information from PR / Marketing on GeForce GTX 20 series Tensor core nor float16 compute performance. If or when such information is available from them we would be glad to discuss it. Best Regards, Troy NVIDIA Customer Care L2"
- gambiting 8y agoThe prices are absolutely insane. I was prepared to pay £599 for the 2080, but £749 for a non-Ti card is a joke. It feels to me like Nvidia knows there's no competition from AMD so they can ask for literally any price and people will pay it.
- gameswithgo 8y agofor a non ti card? that's just a name. you have a very wide array of cards, at a wide array of s prices, that can do various amounts of maths per second. pick the one you want.
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- css 8y agoRemember that in the US you have to factor in the upcoming 25% import tariff.
- plandis 8y agoAbsolutely insane? I’ll pay for it if it’s better 1080Ti and it should be a pretty significant jump from the 980Ti I have now. Just because something seems expensive to you doesn’t mean it looks that way to others.
- dostres 8y agoWhile we’re at this, has anyone got significant training perf improvements for Titan V. Best I’ve seen is 2x of 1080ti for 4x the price.
- gok 8y agoLove the idea of using ConvNets for spatial and temporal resolution interpolation.
- djsumdog 8y agoI feel like there is a hard limit on rendering tech right now. We saw 4k upgrades to the PS4/xbox and next gen consoles might be a way off. I thought the gaming industry was waiting for hardware that would let you render Marvel movie style graphics. Things that just barely hit that uncanny divide; that would give the player comic book film style immersions. The demo video they posted does look pretty impressive. Is this the generation of video cards that will take us there, or if not, what is the next big innovation in gaming/graphics going to be?
- mattnewport 8y agoRealtime ray tracing will take us there and this is the first hardware generation to offer dedicated hardware acceleration for that which makes it practical for games for the first time. Don't expect things to change over night though, it will be a while before this hardware is mainstream and a while before rendering engines are designed around it. We'll see hybrid rendering approaches first and there's no upper limit on the horizon for the amount of compute that can be burned to improve visuals.
- alkonaut 8y agoTriangles and fragments per second for rasterization grew exponentially because of growth in circuit performance . Ray tracing needs to grow say 3 orders of magnitude in performance now (at least) but do so without (that) massive advances in semiconductors. That will be a challenge.
- mattnewport 8y agoDepends what you mean by 'needs'. The combination of dedicated ray tracing acceleration hardware and APIs to drive it with some remarkable advances in denoising, in part driven by deep learning plus associated dedicated hardware, means that we are at a threshold where hybrid techniques that mix rasterization with ray tracing are viable for games and can advance the state of the art in real time rendered image quality. That certainly doesn't mean real time rendering is 'solved'. We could certainly use another 3 orders of magnitude compute performance (and more) if we had it to get better visuals. That's pretty much always been true for graphics though.
- baybal2 8y ago>RTX 2080 draws up to 215 watts of power. It actually went up over baseline 1080. 175 vs 215. And so did the 2070, it also eats more than 1080 while using a more modern litho.
- mrb 8y agoKinda disappointed that there is no improvement—in fact a small reduction—of the raw GFLOPS computing power, compared to Volta: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Nvidia_graphics_processing_units#GeForce_20_series https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Nvidia_graphics_proces...
- jdietrich 8y agoTitan V is a $3000 card. Getting close to that performance on a $1000 card is a big leap forward.
- mrb 8y agoGood point, but what about the comparison with the old 10-series Titan Xp (released at $1200)? The 20-series improved peak GFLOPS perf by a meager 10%. I still would have expected more from upgrading from 16nm to 12nm. I guess floating point perf wasn't a priority for Nvidia in this microarchitecture refresh...
- shaklee3 8y agoMuch of the silicon is now used by RT cores and tensor cores. These were not on the Titan xp, for better or for worse.
- gigatexal 8y agoI think the RTX 2080ti FE might be the first card worth the 1200. I’d get one and never get another for 3 years probably.
- andybak 8y agoAnyone know if the raytracing cores on these things can be used to accelerate Shadertoy style raymarching stuff? This technique has been threatening to break through into the mainstream for a while now.
- Nihilartikel 8y agoIt could, but to the best of my knowledge the OpenGL(/es) Vulkan extensions for raytracing don't exist yet as standards or implementation. But most of the Shadertoy raymarching scenes could be implemented using the raytracing API and custom intersecting functions. I'm personally curious about the performance on custom intersections with the new hardware. Shadertoy demos have a lot of flexibility and tend more towards procedural geometry, since polygonal ray intersection is hard. The new hardware raytracing will be highly optimized for polygonal geometry though, since that's the bread and butter of current realtime engines. Guessing that you'll provide a simple bounding primitive for it to do the ray test against, and then it will fall back on more or less identical shader code to resolve the custom ray intersection.
- Impossible 8y agoThis DirectX raytracing sample does a variant of shadertoy style raymarching. https://github.com/Microsoft/DirectX-Graphics-Samples/tree/master/Samples/Desktop/D3D12Raytracing/src/D3D12RaytracingProceduralGeometry https://github.com/Microsoft/DirectX-Graphics-Samples/tree/m... This is basically a rewrite of iq's primitive shadertoy using DXR, with additional, non-SDF objects like metaballs. https://www.shadertoy.com/view/Xds3zN https://www.shadertoy.com/view/Xds3zN I'm not sure how much of a speed up you'd get from using this API though. Most of the complex shadertoy shaders are unoptimized and brute-force given the limitations of the environment, and you can render similar scenes without a raytracing API using similar techniques in more efficient ways. The talk on Claybook at GDC 2018 or Alex Evan's Siggraph 2015 talk are good examples of ways to scale procedural sign distance field rendering. They both assume dynamic scenes or user edited content, there are probably other tricks that could be used to accelerate mostly static content.
- andybak 8y ago
- bratao 8y agoI really hope that the next generation of AMD Radeon have a good performance and their efforts to port TensorFlow and others works. AMD need to put on NVIDIA on the same heat that Intel got with the Zen architecture. NVIDIA is too comfortable, with a very high price and crazy demands ( you can´t use Customer cards on Data centers)
- ndesaulniers 8y agoWhat effort to port tensorflow?
- y2kenny 8y agohttps://gpuopen.com/rocm-tensorflow-1-8-release/ https://gpuopen.com/rocm-tensorflow-1-8-release/
- ndesaulniers 8y agoUpstream it.
- archagon 8y agoI wonder how long it'll take to get these cards into a "Nano"/ITX/small form factor? Is it even going to be possible after a certain point? IMO, it's the ideal size for eGPU builds, but so far, you can only go as high as a 1080. (Here's my hacky 1080 eGPU build over TB2: http://archagon.net/blog/2018/07/25/egpu-redux/ http://archagon.net/blog/2018/07/25/egpu-redux/ And just to assuage any fears, there are attractive, pre-built options of the same size for TB3! I had to go this route because TB3->TB2 adapters don't work with my model of laptop.)
- archi42 8y agoIt was about time... The old series is, well, pretty old by now, but (to me) never really seemed worth the upgrade from my r9 290 (used for Vive/VR gaming). Maybe mid-2019 will see me dropping some money on a new GPU, once prices settled.
- mclehman 8y agoI'm right there with you. I'm still running a 290 as well, and haven't really been able to justify an upgrade, especially given I really only play Overwatch and Rocket League.
- ErneX 8y agoSome clips of the Battlefield V demo real-time reflections: https://twitter.com/dan_mitre/status/1031599285576650757 https://twitter.com/dan_mitre/status/1031599285576650757 https://twitter.com/dan_mitre/status/1031599199316529158 https://twitter.com/dan_mitre/status/1031599199316529158 https://twitter.com/dan_mitre/status/1031598556585582595 https://twitter.com/dan_mitre/status/1031598556585582595
- test6554 8y agoI can already imagine having this, being amazed and then the amazement wearing off. Probably Going to cancel my preorder... probably.
- Eridrus 8y agoThe water reflections are better, but the non-RTX water is already pretty good; the last link with the fire reflection is pretty baller though.
- holografix 8y agoWhen we can expect gfx 1080 prices to drop given this new release?!
- saudioger 8y agocan't wait to not afford these because of bitcoin miners
- jamesblonde 8y agoStats that matter for deep learning: 616 GB/s Memory Bandwidth, 11GB memory. About 27% improvement over 1080Ti, assuming mem b/w is bottleneck. 11GB is too low - business decision to segment gaming and deep learning markets.
- pier25 8y agoAt these prices I think I will keep on playing 1080p/60Hz for a couple more years.
- Sol- 8y agoIs ray-tracing a very large improvement for rendering quality or do you have diminishing returns now that "conventional" rendering techniques already employ such good heuristics and approximations to make the scenes look good? Just curious since I don't know much about the state of the art of rendering and the implication of ray-tracing (other than the fact that it's, somewhat trivially by how it works, the most accurate method).
- mattnewport 8y agoA lot of the clever tricks employed to get effects like reflections, ambient occlusion, soft shadows and GI effects using rasterization are 'hacks' with a lot of edge cases and artifacts. They're not terribly robust. Ray tracing let's you get better quality with fewer artifacts because there's less 'cheating' going on. You can get better quality in more situations with less manual tweaking, if you can afford the performance cost. Artifacts around the contact points of shadows and reflections and artifacts for reflections and ambient occlusion of off screen objects are places where ray tracing can give much better visual results.
- SolarNet 8y agoRay tracing replaces parts of the pipeline that are using heuristics and approximations that are at their limits with the "correct" solutions (because ray tracing is physically correct). The problem is that there probably aren't better techniques for these approximations that aren't marginal improvements, we've started to hit a limit of what we can achieve (with physically based rendering being the target; stylized rendering still has plenty to explore) with classical rendering. Ray tracing has always been the future of graphics, we are slowly getting there. So it should provide a standard "generation" worth of increase in graphical quality.
- outworlder 8y agoWhy would we want raytracing as for 'gaming' as opposed to the rasterizers we have now? Is this a gimmick or are there algorithms for post processing and the like that could take advantage of this?
- MikeLui 8y agoI believe there are a lot of “tricks” engineers have developed to accomplish rendering goals that would be more natural with ray tracing. The added simplicity would lower the barrier of entry for more complex effects.
- Nition 8y agoAs the other reply said, currently lighting and shadows in games is a huge mixed bag of tricks. Raycasting would make everything simpler and more robust... and slower.
- exDM69 8y agoRasterization will always win for primary rays. It's the secondary rays that are interesting: reflections, soft shadows, ambient occlusion. There are hacks to do the same things with rasterization and screen space image tricks but they need to be customized with the art. E.g. shadow maps can provide fake soft shadows but all shadow mapping techniques need fine tuning to look good in a certain scene.
- fizixer 8y agoCan anyone suggest a 4 GPU build for a non-GPU budget of USD 1500 to 2000 (i.e., not including the cost of the 4 GPUs, which will vary depending on which GPU is chosen)? I will add to this the cost of 4 GPUs (like GTX 1080 Ti or higher).
- gregf 8y agoI am usually able to keep a card for several generations before I can't get 60fps at 1080p in games anymore. Unless you're a professional gamer I don't get the appeal of throwing that kind of money at a card.
- trumped 8y agoif you have bionic eyes, you need 200fps... some people use video cards for other purposes, also.
- trumped 8y agothose can't be used for crypto mining, otherwise, you will find out that they aren't worth the money.
- latchkey 8y agoNvidia has also pulled out of crypto mining. https://cryptocoinspy.com/nvidia-pulls-out-of-crypto-mining-sector/ https://cryptocoinspy.com/nvidia-pulls-out-of-crypto-mining-...
- audunw 8y agoI wish there was more information about the acceleration structures and how they're generated. When I worked on hardware raytracing, my conclusion was that the actual tracing was not the difficult part. That can be very well optimized, requires very little silicon to do and is only really limited by memory bandwidth. The difficult part for real-time raytracing of animated scenes is generating efficient acceleration structures fast enough. It makes sense that the API for this is opaque, but it would still be nice to know what goes on behind the scenes.
- ksec 8y agoAre these Ray Tracing Extensions and Hardware going to be exclusive to Nvidia, at least for the time being? Assuming AMD didn't know about it until now and had to work and implement it, it would be at least 3 years before a Ray Tracing hardware are included in their GPU. And in terms of efficiency, how much better is this Hybrid Ray Tracing (HRT) compared to current Shadow Maps and reflection? I assume the latter needs a lot of fine tuning but are faster while HRT is a lot simpler and slower? I think right now the "highest" graphics quality isn't bottleneck or most important part at all, ( Whether majority of gamers were able to go to the highest graphics quality is a different question ) we sort of reach that stage some time after Crysis. It is how to reduce the time needed for designer and developers to reach that fidelity. I assume HRT will help designer to get what they want quicker? Because somewhere along the line, most game developers only wants to give me the best graphics looking gaming possible, and the fun and storyline part seems to have faded. Apart from Nintendo. P.S To those calling this expensive, the $999 RTX 1080ti gets you a silicon Die Size of 775mm2, along with very fast GDDR6 memory. Even your top of the line CPU don't come close to this die size, let alone the inclusion of memory.
- zamadatix 8y agoFor the software side: All of the games demoed were using DXR (DirectX Raytracing) for which RTX is just a backend for. DXR works on any recent AMD GPU (albeit slowly due to the lack of dedicated hardware) and AMD was a hardware partner in development of DXR. For the hardware side: AMD has not said anything about specialized hardware for ray tracing. They almost certainly have known about it for quite a while but nobody (publicly at least) knows if they ever started on this.
- Lio 8y agoCould anyone comment on the likely state of Linux drivers for these new cards? I've anecdotally, previously been recommended to use either AMD or Intel GPUs, even when out performed by Nvidia, because their open source drivers will usually easier to deal with. Is this still the case? My own use case would be mainly for Blender.
- gameswithgo 8y agoDo you have an ethical requirement to only use open source drivers? Because there are official closed source nvidia drivers for linux. That is what I have always used and they have worked well. Games work, dual monitors with weird aspect ratios work, etc.
- Lio 8y agoI don't personally, not for this anyway. It's more about community support. If the close source linux drivers are up to date and work well that would probably be enough for me.
- Svoka 8y agoI just realized that what in dark corners of mobile games we call Whales, NVidia calls "enthusiasts".