20 ms·

Introducing Android 9 Pie

481 points by nsriv 8y ago

hateful 8y ago
> We partnered with DeepMind on a feature called Adaptive Battery that uses machine learning to prioritize system resources for the apps the user cares about most. You know what mind I would like to control what apps get more resources? Me
- fixermark 8y ago
  Not most people though. There was a time when in MacOS, one could manually limit the amount of memory a program was launched into by setting the required and preferred memory footprint. But that kind of low-level stuff isn't something most people care about or want to do. They just want the damn thing to work.
  - binomialxenon 8y ago
    I see your point that most people don't want to dig into the nitty-gritty details, but I don't think it'd hurt to be able to mark applications as High, Normal, or Low priority for memory and CPU use.
    - joshuamorton 8y ago
      But this isn't really high/normal/low priority for mem and cpu, its how often the applications should wake up. And from my cursory understanding, background resource consumption can be highly variable, and most apps don't really need that much. Its the same thing as using those battery manager task killer apps. For a pixel, those apps will result in worse battery life, because recent android versions manage resource consumption better than users will.
  - sjm-lbm 8y ago
    Furthermore, isn't the idea here to put the control into the user's hands? Think of it as a resource manager controlled by you, but with the only interface that the general market will be able to use for something with a fair amount of technical nuance - ML.
  - mtgx 8y ago
    Do you know what I would like? For Android to actually show what apps/services drain battery life. I noticed recently that WhatsApp, Reddit Sync, and a few other apps were draining battery life like crazy. But none of that drainage was being shown in the battery stats. Google is purposefully hiding how some apps use battery, and it started years ago when they allowed apps to hide under "Android OS" and "System" categories. In more recent versions they "fixed" this by simply not showing the Android OS and System categories in the battery stats anymore. Google doesn't want to show how some apps use your battery because they drain the battery with similar methods that Google itself uses to drain your battery (by polling your location all the time, etc).
    - izacus 8y ago
      Noone is purposefully hiding anything. If you need advanced battery data, you can use Battery Historian even on non-modified phones and you'll get all the battery stats your heart desires, down to reason for each CPU wakeup. https://developer.android.com/studio/profile/battery-historian https://developer.android.com/studio/profile/battery-histori...
  - scarface74 8y ago
    That wasn't a feature, it was a bug. It's not that you could limit the amount of memory a program could use, you had to implement one contiguous block of memory an app could use and you had to close apps even when you had plenty of memory to get a contiguous block. That was like Mac users who said that cooperative multitasking was better because it let games run more smoothly, while technically correct. It was like being happy that your dog pooped on your carpet because now you have free fertilizer.....
  - Dylan16807 8y ago
    I don't want to micromanage things but there's definitely an app or two that I want to ban from running in the background...
- ythn 8y ago
  Ugh, I want to be optimistic, but I think this feature is going to suck and here's why: I use snapchat, but I actually hate the app. It's a bloated memory and battery hog in my opinion. Is Adaptive Battery going to think I love Snapchat and prioritize more system resources for it just because I use it? Cause I want the exact opposite to happen. I want Snapchat using 0% of my system resources except for the few times a day when I check my snaps. Also I hate losing control of my system in favor of some nebulous decision making criteria I can't control (ML)
  - youseecomrade 8y ago
    That's why I only use Android with ROMs like LineageOS where I can block apps from opening on startup and running in the background (you also get more granular permissions for free).
    - scarface74 8y ago
      Why does Snapchat need to run at all when you’re not using it?
      - jhasse 8y ago
        To ruin your battery life.
  - ehsankia 8y ago
    I don't think it'll ever use /more/ resource than it is right now. From my understanding, all apps right now are at "maximum" usage. All this does it reduce usage of apps you never use. So in practice, the resource usage of Snapchat for you would probably not change at all, but that one game app you downloaded 2 months ago and never played will stop querying the master server every day to serve you more ads.
  - halflings 8y ago
    First, one thing: the people working on these projects are not dumb. They are not going to launch a feature that simply does not work. These teams run experiments and confirm that the feature actually does what it's supposed to do (e.g improve battery life) before launching them in production. It sounds like this feature is exactly made for cases like the one you describe: if you don't use Snapchat throughout the day, it won't stay in memory like it currently does (which seems to be ~ a LRU cache), instead staying in memory only when you're predicted to use the app over and over. (so not Snapchat in your case)
- tensor 8y ago
  Personally, I think my mind has better things to do then mechanistic micromanaging of OS level resources. Some people will be upset that ML is obsoleting these sorts of repetitive tasks, but not most people.
  - mrguyorama 8y ago
    making a feature available does not make it required
    - fixermark 8y ago
      It does, however, require supporting it, and those are engineering resources that could be spent elsewhere.
      - ehsankia 8y ago
        Software developers also often forget that UX is a thing. "Just add feature X, Y & Z". This is why you never let a programmer design UIs, you end up with a mess with dozens of buttons, menus and submenus everywhere. Every new feature comes at a UX cost, and in this case, the cost of the UX outweighs the benefits of you micromanaging your memory footprint.
        on_and_off 8y ago
        People also seem to underestimate how complex resource management on a mobile OS is. That's not exactly an easy problem. Currently used apps scheduled background work currently active foreground services like the navigation app you are curently using, the image that is uploading in the background or the music that is playing .. stuff without a visible UI (except for a notification so you know what is going on). All important but not the main thing displayed right now. You also need to throttle the CPU when the phone runs too hot. But not run it at minimum speed either because it would make everything laggy. Also, if you pick up your phone out of your pocket, it automatically wakes up and increase CPU frequency because it is likely you are going to use it. Etc .. This is very complex problem, it is ok to let a machine balance this for us.
- jasonvorhe 8y ago
  Good for you. I don't want to waste time on taking care of my phone. It should save energy regardless of my actions.
- danpalmer 8y ago
  I don't know a lot about kernel scheduling, memory allocation, I/O scheduling, etc, but from what I understand there are OSes with much cleverer implementations of these things, and OSes which are pretty dumb. I believe Linux is somewhere in the middle. Surely there is lots more scope to optimise these schedulers with regular rule-based approaches, rather than bringing in DeepMind magic? It's always difficult to understand the reasons why machine learning algorithms choose the things they choose, and they often have unintended consequences or awful edge cases. This just seems like it was done for marketing reasons more than technical reasons?
mikeevans 8y ago
Interesting that the Digital Wellbeing features that were teased at IO aren't being launched today, but part of _another_ beta that you have to opt in to. (And Pixel series only?)
- sigfubar 8y ago
  By the time Android P actually makes it to non-Pixel devices, the beta will have long since ended, so this doesn't really matter.
  - bitmapbrother 8y ago
    Android P is available for the Essential phone[0] the same day as the Pixel. Technically, every device in that was enrolled in the Android P beta could have also had it day one. [0]https://www.essential.com/ https://www.essential.com/
    - xd1936 8y ago
      Yup. I've got Android P on my Essential PH-1 right now. I'm bummed I don't have the wellbeing features that were promised.
      - curiousgal 8y ago
        You can have them if you're rooted. https://www.xda-developers.com/get-google-pixel-digital-wellbeing-essential-phone-android-pie/ https://www.xda-developers.com/get-google-pixel-digital-well...
- Mindwipe 8y ago
  It's almost like they're there to satisfy some strategist in Google so they can say to governments that they're trying, while not actually believing there's any issue and with zero chance of any user take-up.
- curiousgal 8y ago
  It seems like tracking began with the last beta update which I installed on July 30th if I remember correctly. https://i.imgur.com/lJkwFrt.png https://i.imgur.com/lJkwFrt.png
stephengillie 8y ago
What happened to the "3rd party brand" naming convention? No payday for PayDay?
- JustSomeNobody 8y ago
  Two names does not a convention make.
- pgeorgi 8y ago
  KitKat and Oreo were brands with international reach. On the other hand, what's "PayDay"?
- dragonwriter 8y ago
  The one with at least 3 unbranded releases immediately preceding each branded release and where the previous release was branded? Doesn't seem to have changed.
mmastrac 8y ago
One of the quieter features of Android 9 is that they are reducing the API surface of Android by explicitly black-listing and white-listing various APIs and fields that previously required reflection to access. None of these APIs were documented, but none of them were explicitly "off limits" before Android P. That suggests that the life of Java as Android's primary language might be really coming to an end, even though Android is very much a platform built on Java/C++ at its core.
- the_duke 8y ago
  undocumented => documented
  - mmastrac 8y ago
    Thanks, fixed my typo.
- makmanalp 8y ago
  > That suggests that the life of Java as Android's primary language might be really coming to an end Huh - how did you get to this conclusion? What would be the alternative? Do you mean Java was essentially "better" because it had access to all the undocumented APIs while other languages didn't?
- pjmlp 8y ago
  Apparently you haven't been paying attention, declaring off limits APIs started with Android Nougat for NDK developers. Because Linux APIs were never really intended to be called by NDK developers, only the POSIX subset and Android public native APIs. Likewise with Java, which is only a subset of proper Java. In any case, it might relate more to an eventual future support of Java 9 module system, where private really means private, than anything else.
  - Avamander 8y ago
    > Because Linux APIs were never really intended to be called by NDK developers But pretty much all the "unintended" uses of Android APIs (undocumented or not) have been the most original and best-integrating apps I've seen. It's a pity.
abhiminator 8y ago
Surprised with the naming, did Google just miss a great opportunity for collaborating with candy manufacturers like they did with Nestle for Android 4.4 'KitKat'?
- tjungblut 8y ago
  me too, but what would be a world-renowned candy that starts with 'P'?
  - mikeevans 8y ago
    Pez?
  - bitmapbrother 8y ago
    Pie seems consistent with their infatuation of the number and it just makes sense from a dessert naming perspective.
  - NSAID 8y ago
    I was pulling for (unbranded) Petit four https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petit_four https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petit_four
    - yoz-y 8y ago
      I've been living in France for 16 years and eaten a lot of petits fours. Today I learned that they can be sweet? I've never seen somebody use the term for sweet foot.
      - sjwright 8y ago
        I live in Australia and I only ever see petits fours used to describe small sweet morsels served at the end of fine dining (a three course meal, a tasting menu or degustation) often delivered with your order of coffee or tea. https://www.google.com/search?q=dinner+course+menu+petits+fours+pdf+site%3A.au https://www.google.com/search?q=dinner+course+menu+petits+fo...
unethical_ban 8y ago
* It looks like they've taken away the "apps" homerow button and swapped it for "swipe up from anywhere". So that is one less gesture available to apps, unless you install an alternative desktop. * Wi-Fi RTT sounds pretty neat, I had not heard of that before. * Shutting mic, camera and sensor data off for idle/background apps is neat, though I'm shocked that wasn't an option before.
- haldean 8y ago
  It also looks like the back button is gone... how is that supposed to work?
  - phalangion 8y ago
    Probably the same way it works on iPhone, where developers incorporate navigation into the apps.
    - vxNsr 8y ago
      Until apps adapt what is one supposed to do?
      - mikelward 8y ago
        Nothing. It's still there. It's just hidden when it wouldn't do anything.
  - DoofusOfDeath 8y ago
    That might not be a bad thing. I've used Android for a while, but I'm not always clear if/when the back button will do in-app navigation vs. return me to the phone's home screen.
    - craftyguy 8y ago
      I've always regarded the back button as a completely random thing.
DennisAleynikov 8y ago
I'm no longer surprised that Samsung doesn't feel the need to update to the latest version of Android! Grace UX (their skin) already had all of these features as of last year. I do not see anything worth upgrading for here. Potentially huge for people buying the notched phones. The support for that did improve in this update.
- untog 8y ago
  Surely the headline features here are the machine learning everything, not really the UI tweaks?
  - DennisAleynikov 8y ago
    You're right, but Samsung features go beyond UI changes. I am locked into the Samsung ecosystem by a few of these intangibles. Like: Samsung Pay (works on credit card readers) Samsung DeX (Chromebook in your pocket) Samsung Pass (auto fill with Iris scanning) Some of these features are made by other companies like, Huawei makes a Chromebook style UI too, but Iris scanning and Magnetic Payments are exclusive to Samsung platform.
    - NSAID 8y ago
      > Samsung Pay (works on credit card readers) I hadn't heard of that before. That's pretty cool. "Magnetic Secure Transmission (MST) is a technology that emits a magnetic signal that mimics the magnetic strip on a traditional payment card. MST sends a magnetic signal from your device to the payment terminal's card reader (to emulate swiping a physical card without having to upgrade the terminal’s software or hardware)" https://www.samsung.com/us/support/answer/ANS00043865/ https://www.samsung.com/us/support/answer/ANS00043865/
      - DennisAleynikov 8y ago
        It's literally the most epic thing, I feel like Harry Potter when I go into stores and wave my watch over their credit card reader :) I actually gave up my wallet 3 years ago to only use this and it's not let me down yet. Also nice to not have a wallet bulge in my back pocket cuz I do sit a lot and it's taken a toll on my spine being disaligned.
rayiner 8y ago
> App Actions is a new way to raise the visibility of your app and drive engagement. Actions take advantage of machine learning to surface your app to the user at just the right time, based on your app's semantic intents and the user's context. Aside from the unnecessary jargon, this irks me how it portrays the user as some passive consumer. It really drives home how Google is, first and foremost, an advertising company. Compare Apple's ad copy: https://developer.apple.com/ios https://developer.apple.com/ios > Siri can now intelligently pair users’ daily routines with your apps to suggest convenient shortcuts right when they’re needed. Use the Shortcuts API to help users quickly accomplish tasks related to your app, directly from the lock screen, in Search, or from the Siri watch face. See how this is much more respectful of the user, by treating her as an active entity? Overall, Apple's copy is less jargon-y and terrible too: https://developer.apple.com/ios/whats-new https://developer.apple.com/ios/whats-new.
- kayone 8y ago
  I don't really see any difference besides what appears to be your own personal bias.
  - rayiner 8y ago
    Google markets how a feature "drives engagement." Apple talks about how it "help users quickly accomplish tasks."
    - DennisAleynikov 8y ago
      You're comparing developer marketing materials which should show the reason devs would want this vs human marketing materials? I get apple is for developers too but they word things in the most utopian way it's almost like they believe they're in a Utopia.
      - rayiner 8y ago
        They're both "developer marketing materials." And Apple's marketing materials aren't "utopian." They're how developer marketing materials have always been written--in a user-centric way because the point of computers is to help humans do things. Even Balmer-era Microsoft never put out developer materials with anything as user-hostile as saying that a feature "drives engagement." It's a Freudian slip revealing that in the Google ecosystem, the user is the product, not the customer.
chappi42 8y ago
Great, system navigation looks like Palm webOS...
- ax__ 8y ago
  praise duarte
- cpeterso 8y ago
  Or iOS's swipe-up app switcher.
EpicBlackCrayon 8y ago
Did anyone see these privacy changes? https://developer.android.com/about/versions/p/android-9.0-changes-all#privacy-changes-all https://developer.android.com/about/versions/p/android-9.0-c... * Limited access to sensors in background * Restricted access to call logs * Restricted access to phone numbers * Restricted access to Wi-Fi location and connection information * Information removed from Wi-Fi service methods * Telephony information now relies on device location setting
- wyldfire 8y ago
  These are awesome. Android is slowly catching up with iOS in this regard.
  - ptx 8y ago
    They are both slowly catching up to Java ME[1] where all of this worked perfectly well, except for the silly decision to disable the "always allow" option for non-trusted apps. If they had just let the users (rather than Verisign) decide for themselves which apps they trusted, so that every app wouldn't have to pop up i confirmation dialog every time it wanted a network connection, I would be much happier with what we had then than with Android's model. [1] https://www.wosign.com/support/resources/MIDP_2_0_Tutorial_On_Signed_MIDlets_v1_1_en.pdf https://www.wosign.com/support/resources/MIDP_2_0_Tutorial_O...
    - pjmlp 8y ago
      And Symbian. :)
  - Paraesthetic 8y ago
    They are slowly catching the year dead Windows Phone
- confounded 8y ago
  Great stuff. However, while I'm happy that they're limiting third-party access to this data, given Google's business model, I still wouldn't trust them with it.
vesinisa 8y ago
As a developer working with an app that integrates fingerprint authentication - thank god for BiometricPrompt! It sounds awesome - finally a cross-OEM official API to do fingerprint auth with one callback and with a uniform, "standard" UI. Does anyone have any idea if and when will it be backported to the support library?
pjmlp 8y ago
Android Oreo, one year later in spite of Treble, 12.1%
- yathern 8y ago
  Oreo was in tandem with Treble. Updates in Oreo and in the future should show an increase. Not upgrades to Oreo.
  - scottlamb 8y ago
    Agreed. Put another way: Treble should make the Oreo distribution percentage go down more quickly than other versions did once they're not the latest. Since Pie was released today, this is the starting line. It'll be interesting to see how it goes. Where could one find graphs of the Android major versions' distribution percentage over time? https://developer.android.com/about/dashboards/ https://developer.android.com/about/dashboards/ just shows today's numbers. I'd like to see a "distribution vs days since following version released" with a line for each old version.
    - jeroenhd 8y ago
      Wikipedia has a nice graph: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_version_history#/media/File:Android_historical_version_distribution_-_vector.svg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_version_history#/media... Needs an update though; this one only goes up to February this year.
  - pjmlp 8y ago
    Which is why most OEMs went with Nougat instead of Oreo for their brand new 2017/2018 devices. I really like it went this bad as always, because apparently as disclosed at Google IO 2018 they are finally considering making updates a requirement on the license agreements.
    - Klathmon 8y ago
      Well considering they just got slapped by the EU for doing stuff like that, I can see that license agreement getting weaker not stronger.
dingo_bat 8y ago
Reading through the list of improvements leaves me quite underwhelmed. I thought the Oreo upgrade was basically useless, but this is literally a service pack style update. Also amusing to see "battery improvements" in every release without anything to show for it.
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  > Also amusing to see "battery improvements" in every release without anything to show for it. Whatever improvements are made are most likely quickly eaten by the cruft accumulating both in the system and in applications. The latter update frequently, which means you have a steady stream of bloat coming in...
  - dingo_bat 8y ago
    This is the first time I am considering an iphone as my next phone. But the lack of headphone jack makes it really hard.
    - TeMPOraL 8y ago
      Think of this experience next time someone tries to convince you that customers in this market get to "vote with their wallets".
      - MBCook 8y ago
        They do. Customers voted overwhelmingly ‘we don’t care’ so the headphone jack didn’t return.
        TeMPOraL 8y ago
        Did they? Or did they just express they care more about staying in Apple ecosystem than the headphone jack? This is my point: there isn't really a way to express a preference for something minor. Smartphone market is mostly "take it or leave it".
Sir_Cmpwn 8y ago
Surprised not to see mention of the cutout stuff yet. It seems pretty dumb to me that Google is jumping on board with this ridiculous feature. Maybe this'll be one of those Dropbox-style HN comments which in hindsight looks misled, but I honestly can't find any redeeming factors to the cutout idea.
- izacus 8y ago
  Except developers being able to properly support their apps around it? OEMs have decided to add notches, want it or not. Not having a API to work with them would be a huge pain.
  - ehsankia 8y ago
    The purpose of AOSP Android has always been to lower fragmentation. If every OEM implements their own notch handling, then apps have no chance to properly support every single implementation. Google providing a standard way will greatly help the ecosystem. To give a really awful analogy, think of providing clean needles to drug addicts. It doesn't necessary mean you approve, but the benefits are bigger.
- kcmp 8y ago
  People loved it when Apple did it which gave everyone else the okay to go ahead and do it themselves. It allows phone manafacturers to advertise higher screen to body ratios and is really just a step in the progression towards bezelless phones. There's definitely a loud group of people who strongly dislike it but I think most people are okay with it
  - 51Cards 8y ago
    Just have to comment that for myself a notch would be a deal beaker for a new device. I've played with a couple devices and really think it adds no actual value while complicating the user interface. I will avoid it as long as I can.
    - 8y ago
ythn 8y ago
But can we get scheduled SMS yet? Samsung has had this feature for ages...
- mikelward 8y ago
  The SMS app is not part of the base Android OS. Install whichever SMS app you like. It sounds like there are several that do what you want.
Legogris 8y ago
I can't be the only one getting a chill down my spine when I read this. Google, a company "committed to reach and engage the right users safely and cost-effectively around the world", doing deep analysis of my every input and my context in order to "drive engagement" and "surfacing the best parts of the apps [I] use all the time"? I hope this stuff is kept out of AOSP. Yes, I know it seems like at least some of the computation happens on-device, but I am not comfortable having it done on a device out of my full control regardless.
- ppeetteerr 8y ago
  They already do this with your searches and geolocation data. Why not this?
  - Legogris 8y ago
    I can still dodge those by disabling Location Services and using something else than Google app-wise. It is not clear how opt-out this will be. Even if it can be disabled today it might become pushed harder as time goes.
    - ehsankia 8y ago
      You can disable this too: Home Settings > Suggestions I believe the computation is done fully locally, as for "tracking", every single OS has a history of what applications you've launched recently, how is that any different?
      - anonytrary 8y ago
        > doing deep analysis of my every input and my context in order to "drive engagement" and "surfacing the best parts of the apps [I] use all the time"? This is much richer data than a list of recently used apps, right? Do OSs also record that information?
        ehsankia 8y ago
conradfr 8y ago
I was just hoping for them to retire those stupid round adaptive icons. They did not. Also it's not clear if the old style of switching "opened" apps will still be there? Because the new one with the full screen preview seems more flashy but less practical(think alt+tab vs win+tab on Windows).
- mikelward 8y ago
  I think the idea was good, it's just too bad so many apps (many by Google) went the lazy path of leaving the icon as-is and adding a white background layer. Also note that they're only circular on Pixel.
  - conradfr 8y ago
    I don't know, they are round by default on my OP5. I'm really against the idea of having a uniform shape for all apps, it makes it harder to quickly locate them.
    - izacus 8y ago
      So use another launcher which allows you to customize that? Nova is very popular and gives you what you want.
  - Avamander 8y ago
    To be fair the API given is pretty c*p when you have to target older Androids as well (and don't want to give them an uglier icon). If I remember right I had to simplify the icon as well (remove transparency I think) because Android doesn't like many things that are okay in svgs.
    - mikelward 8y ago
      I just used Android Studio to generate the icon for older versions. Yes, I would assume no transparency, since it needs to be a simple single-layered image, AFAIK. https://developer.android.com/studio/write/image-asset-studio#launcher https://developer.android.com/studio/write/image-asset-studi...
lgleason 8y ago
Funny. My Essential already has the update, but my pixel doesn't. Go figure...
- on_and_off 8y ago
  My pixel 2 sees it. I strongly suspect that this is a gradual rollout. Maybe that force checking if an update is available allows to force enroll ? that's how I saw the update and I now that Google has moved in this direction for the most impatient users.
  - radicalriddler 8y ago
    You are correct. If you force check for an update, then it lets you update to Android Pie. I assume that the gradual rollout will send notifications to phones that it's available.
    - givehimagun 8y ago
      Force check on my Pixel 2 did not work =(
      - radicalriddler 8y ago
        Ah well. That proves me the hell wrong then. Bad luck, try again tomorrow XD. FeelsBadMan.
blinkingled 8y ago
Essential has done a fabulous job with Android updates - https://twitter.com/essential/status/1026516461907369984?s=20 https://twitter.com/essential/status/1026516461907369984?s=2... I hope they stay afloat and release a successor to the PH-1.
- ishaanbahal 8y ago
  I heard they cancelled it, but in all honesty, they did something that every one caught up on, including Apple I think, the notch! And they even did it right. I think they should get to release another device, this time just pricing it right would probably help them get a better market hold. PH-1, is amazing because of the updates!
- watersb 8y ago
  Yes, this is great. I purchased an Essential Phone on Amazon Prime Day. Amazon was (is?) an investor in Essential; they sold these for $250 on that day. The 360-degree camera is available from Essential at a deep discount. I got the idea that they were winding down operations, but the unlocked bootloader gave me some hope that I would be able to use this device to learn Android app development. And here they are, supporting Android P as an OTA update on launch day! I'm typing this on Android P...
bedros 8y ago
is the new API open source or vendor-lock-in so app developers are forced to stick with google
bitL 8y ago
Can we please get a choice of a non-infantile UI in Android in the future? The candy-style material UI just pushes me not to use Android for serious work, more for fire-and-forget tasks I don't care about, as interfacing with it is extremely unpleasant (only slightly better than WP8).
adrian_mrd 8y ago
Given the number of times the post mentions Machine Learning (ML), I'm surprised they didn't skip the P for Pie and go straight to naming it Android ML ;)
adrian_mrd 8y ago
Does anyone know if Final Cut Pro X or Premiere Pro (or other popular video editing tools) yet support encoding to the "HDR VP9 Profile 2" ? (HDR VP9 Profile 2 is isted as a new feature, as per "Android 9 adds built-in support for HDR VP9 Profile 2, so you can now deliver HDR-enabled movies to your users on HDR-capable devices." yet I wonder if this is effectively a telco-friendly video codec not widely used by media publishers or creators?)
- sjwright 8y ago
  I don't think publishing to a single specific profile is an appropriate use of a desktop video editing application. It's like typesetting a paperback book by pressing "print" from Microsoft Word. You should be exporting a "master" file from your editor and getting your delivery platform (or at minimum a dedicated transcoding app) to output to the various profiles. Also, exporting HDR content isn't as simple as changing your export setting. HDR changes the way you handle content from the earliest moments of data capture; the real question is how you choose to crush the high dynamic range down to a standard dynamic range for everyone else.
  - adrian_mrd 8y ago
    Yeah, all good points, although sometimes one just needs to export a file or two (as opposed to setting up a publishing workflow or a system). And Compressor for Final Cut Pro X or Adobe Media Encoder CC for Premiere Pro CC are effectively integrated (or some of the export code) for such a function - or are launched via the apps when you ‘Export’ or ‘Share’, although this can depend upon your CC plan or whether you have purchased/installed Compressor, or not. The ‘crushing the HDR’ is a good point, I’ll have to look up how this codec handles DR and colour gamet :)
51Cards 8y ago
One small annoyance about the new version I've hoped they would revert is the new clock placement on the left. It was done to accommodate notches better but Android has always had notifications there. I've been running the beta for probably 6 weeks now and I still think I have notifications pending at a glance. It should move based on the presence of a notch only. Edit: Also there is now a 4 notification icon limit with the clock on the left, whether you have a notch or not. I often have a lot more than 4 notification icons up (1) (esp since a couple are permanent from background apps) and the rest will just disappear under a dot-dot icon. (1) - 3 email account alerts, Trillian, SMS, Ebay, and a Photos alert on my phone right now. Half aren't visible.
bitsoda 8y ago
Feels kind of lazy going with "Pie" after having used "Key Lime Pie" in the past. Though technically not a dessert, I was rooting for "Pancake".
- what_ever 8y ago
  It was changed from KLP to Kitkat though. So Pie was never used. Disc: Googler but nowhere close to Android.
  - cpeterso 8y ago
    I was rooting for "Pumpkin Pie", a nice alliterative two-word name. And not trademarked! :)
- curiousgal 8y ago
  Peppermint was the obvious choice in my book
zinckiwi 8y ago
My feature wish list: 1) working Smart Lock Trusted Places
pleasecalllater 8y ago
So to get all the privacy changes I will need to buy a new phone, as my current Samsung has 3 years now, so it won't get any updates. What a funny world.
cmurf 8y ago
I wonder if Google's own apps are exempt from adaptive battery? I continue to have problems with Google's apps soaking my phone's battery. Reset the phone, and I get 6 days of standby (this is LineageOS). Install Google apps, and it's now 4 hours. Wakelock detector says the apps Inbox, Google, and Google Contacts are the top offenders with dozens of wakes keeping the phone awake between 40% and 99% of the time. Super irritating.
- izacus 8y ago
  That wakelock detector is probably showing wrong data (especially on newer API levels). Can you try something more advanced like Battery Historian (in dev tools) to see what's waking up the CPU? (And no, Google apps are beholden to all power saving restrictions like other apps - Play Services being the exception because it services functionality that must work at all times.)
  - cmurf 8y ago
    Battery Historian isn't really helping pin this down. CPU is running the whole time over night, ~5%/hr drain doing nothing. Kernel only uptime has hundreds of events per minute with reason "unknown". Userspace wakelocks total less than 16s every 20 minutes with no app I recognize named (Babel_ConcService is the top offender). Top app is blank as is Long waklocks and Screen. Doze is "light" all night. Kernel Wakesources: Ranking | Name | Duration / Hr | Count / Hr | Total Duration | Total Count 0 | event1 | 17m59s340ms | 23457.57 | 3h2m57.557s | 238578 1 | event5 | 17m32s350ms | 23463.47 | 2h58m23.053s | 238638 2 | alarmtimer | 1m47s350ms | 53.59 | 18m11.818s | 545 3 | wlan | 45s341ms | 58.99 | 7m41.149s | 600 4 | bluetooth_timer | 23s642ms | 194.68 | 4m0.462s | 1980 No idea what event1 and event5 are, but that seems excessive. Kernel Wakeup Reasons: Ranking | Name | Duration / Hr | Count / Hr | Total Duration | Total Count | Show Count vs Time 0 | unknown | 57m26s285ms | 11789.25 | 9h44m10.852s | 119904 | App Wakeup Alarms: Ranking | Name | Uid | Frequency (count/hr) | Count 0 | GOOGLE_SERVICES | 10033 | 60.66 | 617 1 | com.android.providers.calendar | 10004 | 0.20 | 2 60 wakeup alarms per hour? Excessive anytime but absurd for night time. Time Spent In Each App State: Name | Uid | Top / Hr | Foreground Service / Hr | Top Sleeping / Hr | Foreground / Hr | Background / Hr | Cached / Hr GOOGLE_SERVICES | 10033 | 7s202ms | 59m52s311ms | 0ms | 486ms | 0ms | 0ms bbc.mobile.news.ww | 10109 | 5s312ms | 0ms | 0ms | 0ms | 762ms | 16m48s169ms net.sourceforge.opencamera | 10097 | 5s71ms | 0ms | 0ms | 0ms | 0ms | 59m54s209ms com.google.android.tts | 10072 | 4s910ms | 88ms | 0ms | 0ms | 0ms | 59m54s200ms com.cyanogenmod.trebuchet | 10026 | 3s247ms | 0ms | 59m44s851ms | 0ms | 0ms | 11s900ms Foreground service per hour? Anyway, battery life goes to about 4 days standby if I put the phone in airplane mode. Or if I reset the phone and then on next boot I don't enter my Google account info. I have one bugreport where the discharge rate varied between 15% and 40% per hour, but there's no battery data due to overflow (?) looks like I'm only getting 3-4 hours of detailed data after a reboot.
hateful 8y ago
Finally, a dark theme.
YZF 8y ago
Coming to my Nexus 4 soon? ;) It always feels like the goal here is to get people to buy new phones. I wonder what % of phones running the previous OS will be upgradable.
- dan1234 8y ago
  My Moto 4G finally got it's upgrade to Android 7.1… last week. Better late than never, I guess.
- dmitrygr 8y ago
  Not very hard to do, actually. N4 hw is well known
AndyKelley 8y ago
"Android 9 harnesses the power of machine learning to make your phone ...simpler" What a ridiculous concept. Have you ever tried to install TensorFlow? It's a giant, flaming shit-pile covered in a layered shit cake. A word such as "simple" in this context is obscene. This is all bloatware. Android is garbage and it's only getting worse. What phone can I get that isn't Android or iOS?
Raphmedia 8y ago
"It's nice!" ... or at least that's what I would say if my phone wasn't limited to Android 7.0
- zanny 8y ago
  I was worried my S5 was doomed to Lineage 14.1 forever, but some saint dev ported it to 15.1 last month. LTE doesn't work, but hey, 15.1. Whats really scary is that the official Samsung Touchwiz ROM stopped getting updates two years ago and is stuck on 5.1 I think. Ain't it great when hobbyists support a device for over 3 major revisions past when the billion dollar manufacturer that made it stopped updating it less than five years after it was released.
  - voltagex_ 8y ago
    >LTE doesn't work, but hey, 15.1 Ah, XDA, where critical features become optional.
  - scns 8y ago
    Thank you for writing this. I'll stay on 14.1 till it's fixed.
j_coder 8y ago
It is amazing how each new version of Android has a complete new UX and none of them are actually good. Google is basically a back-end company incapable of doing good UX (if it is more than a search bar).
- curun1r 8y ago
  I would agree with you, but after spending the last two years using an Android phone after almost a decade using iOS, I feel that Google has made some fundamentally bad decisions below the UI layer as well. Despite using a phone that is newer and more powerful, my Android phone is slower, less responsive and runs out of battery much faster than any of my iPhones. The only reason I stay with Android is Google Fi.
  - curiousgal 8y ago
    I wholeheartedly disagree. I tried using both the iPhone 8 and the iPhone X and none of them came close to the Pixel 2, UX and feature wise. I couldn't download files, couldn't even change my ringtone to a custom melody, couldn't attach files coorectly, the integration with their Maps app was awful, the battery life drained faster after one update... I just felt so limited!
  - cageface 8y ago
    iPhone X seems like a bunch of clever but costly gimmicks to fix a self inflicted problem. Instead of just moving the fingerprint sensor to the back of the phone they got rid of it entirely and replaced it with FaceID and this new gesture based interface. It's an impressive piece of technology but a step backward in UX overall. I find my Pixel 2 XL more usable and reliable than my iPhone X and Project Fi has saved me countless hours sitting in phone shop offices waiting for SIM cards in every new country I visit. The UI may not be quite as snappy as my iPhone but I don't feel it really holds back my use of the device at all and battery life is actually better and it recharges faster. I do think this new gesture stuff they added to Android P is kind of dumb though and seems like a cheap and failed effort to copy some buzz from Apple.
- sidlls 8y ago
paulcole 8y ago
Adoption of the previous version (Oreo) is at 12%. https://www.macrumors.com/2018/08/06/google-releases-android-9-pie/ https://www.macrumors.com/2018/08/06/google-releases-android...
pornel 8y ago
It's a shame that Google has stopped upgrading the OS on the Nexus line of phones.
- ilove_banh_mi 8y ago
  Is there a reason for them not upgrading Android on Nexus? Disappointing news since I bought mine a mere 2 years ago.
  - izacus 8y ago
    The major reason (according to the dev podcast) is that SoC vendors simply drop support and don't update drivers for new Android versions. This pretty much blocks any kind of updates since mobile drivers are all closed binary blobs. Before 8.0 Android driver layer wasn't separate from other OS layer so they couldn't upgrade Android separately.
- ilove_banh_mi 8y ago
  The Nexus 5X was released 3 years ago, on September 29, 2015. By contrast Apple's iOS 12 will run on the iPhone 5S, which was released 5 years ago, on September 20, 2013.
thewizardofaus 8y ago
Could they cram the world Machine Learning into the article much more? If this was 12 months ago, replace every instance of the word Machine Learning with "blockchain"... Oh boy, gotta love buzzwords.
- anonytrary 8y ago
  Each of the whopping 5 instances they use the phrase in are used correctly. The entire document is around 2500-3200 words. I think they could cram a lot more in and still keep it kosher.
bobbywordy 8y ago
Honestly, I was hoping they would call it Android Pizza ;)
lai 8y ago
I don't know if it's just me, but I don't really like the text magnifier. I select text better without it.
PopePompus 8y ago
Even in Pie, "Adaptive Brightness" is terrible. The display often abruptly drops in brightness for seemingly no reason. I think I could do better with a photocell and an opamp.
faragon 8y ago
In my opinion, Android should focus in quality/stability and UI responsiveness. E.g. it blows my mind that Nokia N900 (2009, Maemo Linux) was, in some cases, way more responsive in the UI than current Android running in hardware 20x faster.
edhelas 8y ago
It's crazy that in 2018 we are still using GIFs to do short animated demo. Those few "images" in the article were ~40Mb, come on.
sapphire_tomb 8y ago
Anyone know if there's a way to get the Oreo "Recent apps" feature back? The new one is fairly terrible in my opinion, it now takes many more swipes to get back to the app I want.

481 points by nsriv 8y ago

> We partnered with DeepMind on a feature called Adaptive Battery that uses machine learning to prioritize system resources for the apps the user cares about most. You know what mind I would like to control what apps get more resources? Me

fixermark 8y ago
Not most people though. There was a time when in MacOS, one could manually limit the amount of memory a program was launched into by setting the required and preferred memory footprint. But that kind of low-level stuff isn't something most people care about or want to do. They just want the damn thing to work.
- binomialxenon 8y ago
  I see your point that most people don't want to dig into the nitty-gritty details, but I don't think it'd hurt to be able to mark applications as High, Normal, or Low priority for memory and CPU use.
  - joshuamorton 8y ago
    But this isn't really high/normal/low priority for mem and cpu, its how often the applications should wake up. And from my cursory understanding, background resource consumption can be highly variable, and most apps don't really need that much. Its the same thing as using those battery manager task killer apps. For a pixel, those apps will result in worse battery life, because recent android versions manage resource consumption better than users will.
- sjm-lbm 8y ago
  Furthermore, isn't the idea here to put the control into the user's hands? Think of it as a resource manager controlled by you, but with the only interface that the general market will be able to use for something with a fair amount of technical nuance - ML.
- mtgx 8y ago
  Do you know what I would like? For Android to actually show what apps/services drain battery life. I noticed recently that WhatsApp, Reddit Sync, and a few other apps were draining battery life like crazy. But none of that drainage was being shown in the battery stats. Google is purposefully hiding how some apps use battery, and it started years ago when they allowed apps to hide under "Android OS" and "System" categories. In more recent versions they "fixed" this by simply not showing the Android OS and System categories in the battery stats anymore. Google doesn't want to show how some apps use your battery because they drain the battery with similar methods that Google itself uses to drain your battery (by polling your location all the time, etc).
  - izacus 8y ago
    Noone is purposefully hiding anything. If you need advanced battery data, you can use Battery Historian even on non-modified phones and you'll get all the battery stats your heart desires, down to reason for each CPU wakeup. https://developer.android.com/studio/profile/battery-historian https://developer.android.com/studio/profile/battery-histori...
- scarface74 8y ago
  That wasn't a feature, it was a bug. It's not that you could limit the amount of memory a program could use, you had to implement one contiguous block of memory an app could use and you had to close apps even when you had plenty of memory to get a contiguous block. That was like Mac users who said that cooperative multitasking was better because it let games run more smoothly, while technically correct. It was like being happy that your dog pooped on your carpet because now you have free fertilizer.....
- Dylan16807 8y ago
  I don't want to micromanage things but there's definitely an app or two that I want to ban from running in the background...
ythn 8y ago
Ugh, I want to be optimistic, but I think this feature is going to suck and here's why: I use snapchat, but I actually hate the app. It's a bloated memory and battery hog in my opinion. Is Adaptive Battery going to think I love Snapchat and prioritize more system resources for it just because I use it? Cause I want the exact opposite to happen. I want Snapchat using 0% of my system resources except for the few times a day when I check my snaps. Also I hate losing control of my system in favor of some nebulous decision making criteria I can't control (ML)
- youseecomrade 8y ago
  That's why I only use Android with ROMs like LineageOS where I can block apps from opening on startup and running in the background (you also get more granular permissions for free).
  - scarface74 8y ago
    Why does Snapchat need to run at all when you’re not using it?
    - jhasse 8y ago
      To ruin your battery life.
- ehsankia 8y ago
  I don't think it'll ever use /more/ resource than it is right now. From my understanding, all apps right now are at "maximum" usage. All this does it reduce usage of apps you never use. So in practice, the resource usage of Snapchat for you would probably not change at all, but that one game app you downloaded 2 months ago and never played will stop querying the master server every day to serve you more ads.
- halflings 8y ago
  First, one thing: the people working on these projects are not dumb. They are not going to launch a feature that simply does not work. These teams run experiments and confirm that the feature actually does what it's supposed to do (e.g improve battery life) before launching them in production. It sounds like this feature is exactly made for cases like the one you describe: if you don't use Snapchat throughout the day, it won't stay in memory like it currently does (which seems to be ~ a LRU cache), instead staying in memory only when you're predicted to use the app over and over. (so not Snapchat in your case)
tensor 8y ago
Personally, I think my mind has better things to do then mechanistic micromanaging of OS level resources. Some people will be upset that ML is obsoleting these sorts of repetitive tasks, but not most people.
- mrguyorama 8y ago
  making a feature available does not make it required
  - fixermark 8y ago
    It does, however, require supporting it, and those are engineering resources that could be spent elsewhere.
    - ehsankia 8y ago
      Software developers also often forget that UX is a thing. "Just add feature X, Y & Z". This is why you never let a programmer design UIs, you end up with a mess with dozens of buttons, menus and submenus everywhere. Every new feature comes at a UX cost, and in this case, the cost of the UX outweighs the benefits of you micromanaging your memory footprint.
      - on_and_off 8y ago
        People also seem to underestimate how complex resource management on a mobile OS is. That's not exactly an easy problem. Currently used apps scheduled background work currently active foreground services like the navigation app you are curently using, the image that is uploading in the background or the music that is playing .. stuff without a visible UI (except for a notification so you know what is going on). All important but not the main thing displayed right now. You also need to throttle the CPU when the phone runs too hot. But not run it at minimum speed either because it would make everything laggy. Also, if you pick up your phone out of your pocket, it automatically wakes up and increase CPU frequency because it is likely you are going to use it. Etc .. This is very complex problem, it is ok to let a machine balance this for us.
jasonvorhe 8y ago
Good for you. I don't want to waste time on taking care of my phone. It should save energy regardless of my actions.
danpalmer 8y ago
I don't know a lot about kernel scheduling, memory allocation, I/O scheduling, etc, but from what I understand there are OSes with much cleverer implementations of these things, and OSes which are pretty dumb. I believe Linux is somewhere in the middle. Surely there is lots more scope to optimise these schedulers with regular rule-based approaches, rather than bringing in DeepMind magic? It's always difficult to understand the reasons why machine learning algorithms choose the things they choose, and they often have unintended consequences or awful edge cases. This just seems like it was done for marketing reasons more than technical reasons?

mikeevans 8y ago

Interesting that the Digital Wellbeing features that were teased at IO aren't being launched today, but part of _another_ beta that you have to opt in to. (And Pixel series only?)

sigfubar 8y ago
By the time Android P actually makes it to non-Pixel devices, the beta will have long since ended, so this doesn't really matter.
- bitmapbrother 8y ago
  Android P is available for the Essential phone[0] the same day as the Pixel. Technically, every device in that was enrolled in the Android P beta could have also had it day one. [0]https://www.essential.com/ https://www.essential.com/
  - xd1936 8y ago
    Yup. I've got Android P on my Essential PH-1 right now. I'm bummed I don't have the wellbeing features that were promised.
    - curiousgal 8y ago
      You can have them if you're rooted. https://www.xda-developers.com/get-google-pixel-digital-wellbeing-essential-phone-android-pie/ https://www.xda-developers.com/get-google-pixel-digital-well...
Mindwipe 8y ago
It's almost like they're there to satisfy some strategist in Google so they can say to governments that they're trying, while not actually believing there's any issue and with zero chance of any user take-up.
curiousgal 8y ago
It seems like tracking began with the last beta update which I installed on July 30th if I remember correctly. https://i.imgur.com/lJkwFrt.png https://i.imgur.com/lJkwFrt.png

stephengillie 8y ago

What happened to the "3rd party brand" naming convention? No payday for PayDay?

JustSomeNobody 8y ago
Two names does not a convention make.
pgeorgi 8y ago
KitKat and Oreo were brands with international reach. On the other hand, what's "PayDay"?
dragonwriter 8y ago
The one with at least 3 unbranded releases immediately preceding each branded release and where the previous release was branded? Doesn't seem to have changed.

mmastrac 8y ago

One of the quieter features of Android 9 is that they are reducing the API surface of Android by explicitly black-listing and white-listing various APIs and fields that previously required reflection to access. None of these APIs were documented, but none of them were explicitly "off limits" before Android P. That suggests that the life of Java as Android's primary language might be really coming to an end, even though Android is very much a platform built on Java/C++ at its core.

the_duke 8y ago
undocumented => documented
- mmastrac 8y ago
  Thanks, fixed my typo.
makmanalp 8y ago
> That suggests that the life of Java as Android's primary language might be really coming to an end Huh - how did you get to this conclusion? What would be the alternative? Do you mean Java was essentially "better" because it had access to all the undocumented APIs while other languages didn't?
pjmlp 8y ago
Apparently you haven't been paying attention, declaring off limits APIs started with Android Nougat for NDK developers. Because Linux APIs were never really intended to be called by NDK developers, only the POSIX subset and Android public native APIs. Likewise with Java, which is only a subset of proper Java. In any case, it might relate more to an eventual future support of Java 9 module system, where private really means private, than anything else.
- Avamander 8y ago
  > Because Linux APIs were never really intended to be called by NDK developers But pretty much all the "unintended" uses of Android APIs (undocumented or not) have been the most original and best-integrating apps I've seen. It's a pity.

abhiminator 8y ago

Surprised with the naming, did Google just miss a great opportunity for collaborating with candy manufacturers like they did with Nestle for Android 4.4 'KitKat'?

tjungblut 8y ago
me too, but what would be a world-renowned candy that starts with 'P'?
- mikeevans 8y ago
  Pez?
- bitmapbrother 8y ago
  Pie seems consistent with their infatuation of the number and it just makes sense from a dessert naming perspective.
- NSAID 8y ago
  I was pulling for (unbranded) Petit four https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petit_four https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petit_four
  - yoz-y 8y ago
    I've been living in France for 16 years and eaten a lot of petits fours. Today I learned that they can be sweet? I've never seen somebody use the term for sweet foot.
    - sjwright 8y ago
      I live in Australia and I only ever see petits fours used to describe small sweet morsels served at the end of fine dining (a three course meal, a tasting menu or degustation) often delivered with your order of coffee or tea. https://www.google.com/search?q=dinner+course+menu+petits+fours+pdf+site%3A.au https://www.google.com/search?q=dinner+course+menu+petits+fo...

unethical_ban 8y ago

* It looks like they've taken away the "apps" homerow button and swapped it for "swipe up from anywhere". So that is one less gesture available to apps, unless you install an alternative desktop. * Wi-Fi RTT sounds pretty neat, I had not heard of that before. * Shutting mic, camera and sensor data off for idle/background apps is neat, though I'm shocked that wasn't an option before.

haldean 8y ago
It also looks like the back button is gone... how is that supposed to work?
- phalangion 8y ago
  Probably the same way it works on iPhone, where developers incorporate navigation into the apps.
  - vxNsr 8y ago
    Until apps adapt what is one supposed to do?
    - mikelward 8y ago
      Nothing. It's still there. It's just hidden when it wouldn't do anything.
- DoofusOfDeath 8y ago
  That might not be a bad thing. I've used Android for a while, but I'm not always clear if/when the back button will do in-app navigation vs. return me to the phone's home screen.
  - craftyguy 8y ago
    I've always regarded the back button as a completely random thing.

DennisAleynikov 8y ago

I'm no longer surprised that Samsung doesn't feel the need to update to the latest version of Android! Grace UX (their skin) already had all of these features as of last year. I do not see anything worth upgrading for here. Potentially huge for people buying the notched phones. The support for that did improve in this update.

untog 8y ago
Surely the headline features here are the machine learning everything, not really the UI tweaks?
- DennisAleynikov 8y ago
  You're right, but Samsung features go beyond UI changes. I am locked into the Samsung ecosystem by a few of these intangibles. Like: Samsung Pay (works on credit card readers) Samsung DeX (Chromebook in your pocket) Samsung Pass (auto fill with Iris scanning) Some of these features are made by other companies like, Huawei makes a Chromebook style UI too, but Iris scanning and Magnetic Payments are exclusive to Samsung platform.
  - NSAID 8y ago
    > Samsung Pay (works on credit card readers) I hadn't heard of that before. That's pretty cool. "Magnetic Secure Transmission (MST) is a technology that emits a magnetic signal that mimics the magnetic strip on a traditional payment card. MST sends a magnetic signal from your device to the payment terminal's card reader (to emulate swiping a physical card without having to upgrade the terminal’s software or hardware)" https://www.samsung.com/us/support/answer/ANS00043865/ https://www.samsung.com/us/support/answer/ANS00043865/
    - DennisAleynikov 8y ago
      It's literally the most epic thing, I feel like Harry Potter when I go into stores and wave my watch over their credit card reader :) I actually gave up my wallet 3 years ago to only use this and it's not let me down yet. Also nice to not have a wallet bulge in my back pocket cuz I do sit a lot and it's taken a toll on my spine being disaligned.

rayiner 8y ago

> App Actions is a new way to raise the visibility of your app and drive engagement. Actions take advantage of machine learning to surface your app to the user at just the right time, based on your app's semantic intents and the user's context. Aside from the unnecessary jargon, this irks me how it portrays the user as some passive consumer. It really drives home how Google is, first and foremost, an advertising company. Compare Apple's ad copy: https://developer.apple.com/ios https://developer.apple.com/ios > Siri can now intelligently pair users’ daily routines with your apps to suggest convenient shortcuts right when they’re needed. Use the Shortcuts API to help users quickly accomplish tasks related to your app, directly from the lock screen, in Search, or from the Siri watch face. See how this is much more respectful of the user, by treating her as an active entity? Overall, Apple's copy is less jargon-y and terrible too: https://developer.apple.com/ios/whats-new https://developer.apple.com/ios/whats-new.

kayone 8y ago
I don't really see any difference besides what appears to be your own personal bias.
- rayiner 8y ago
  Google markets how a feature "drives engagement." Apple talks about how it "help users quickly accomplish tasks."
  - DennisAleynikov 8y ago
    You're comparing developer marketing materials which should show the reason devs would want this vs human marketing materials? I get apple is for developers too but they word things in the most utopian way it's almost like they believe they're in a Utopia.
    - rayiner 8y ago
      They're both "developer marketing materials." And Apple's marketing materials aren't "utopian." They're how developer marketing materials have always been written--in a user-centric way because the point of computers is to help humans do things. Even Balmer-era Microsoft never put out developer materials with anything as user-hostile as saying that a feature "drives engagement." It's a Freudian slip revealing that in the Google ecosystem, the user is the product, not the customer.

chappi42 8y ago

Great, system navigation looks like Palm webOS...

ax__ 8y ago
praise duarte
cpeterso 8y ago
Or iOS's swipe-up app switcher.

EpicBlackCrayon 8y ago

Did anyone see these privacy changes? https://developer.android.com/about/versions/p/android-9.0-changes-all#privacy-changes-all https://developer.android.com/about/versions/p/android-9.0-c... * Limited access to sensors in background * Restricted access to call logs * Restricted access to phone numbers * Restricted access to Wi-Fi location and connection information * Information removed from Wi-Fi service methods * Telephony information now relies on device location setting

wyldfire 8y ago
These are awesome. Android is slowly catching up with iOS in this regard.
- ptx 8y ago
  They are both slowly catching up to Java ME[1] where all of this worked perfectly well, except for the silly decision to disable the "always allow" option for non-trusted apps. If they had just let the users (rather than Verisign) decide for themselves which apps they trusted, so that every app wouldn't have to pop up i confirmation dialog every time it wanted a network connection, I would be much happier with what we had then than with Android's model. [1] https://www.wosign.com/support/resources/MIDP_2_0_Tutorial_On_Signed_MIDlets_v1_1_en.pdf https://www.wosign.com/support/resources/MIDP_2_0_Tutorial_O...
  - pjmlp 8y ago
    And Symbian. :)
- Paraesthetic 8y ago
  They are slowly catching the year dead Windows Phone
confounded 8y ago
Great stuff. However, while I'm happy that they're limiting third-party access to this data, given Google's business model, I still wouldn't trust them with it.

vesinisa 8y ago

As a developer working with an app that integrates fingerprint authentication - thank god for BiometricPrompt! It sounds awesome - finally a cross-OEM official API to do fingerprint auth with one callback and with a uniform, "standard" UI. Does anyone have any idea if and when will it be backported to the support library?

pjmlp 8y ago

Android Oreo, one year later in spite of Treble, 12.1%

yathern 8y ago
Oreo was in tandem with Treble. Updates in Oreo and in the future should show an increase. Not upgrades to Oreo.
- scottlamb 8y ago
  Agreed. Put another way: Treble should make the Oreo distribution percentage go down more quickly than other versions did once they're not the latest. Since Pie was released today, this is the starting line. It'll be interesting to see how it goes. Where could one find graphs of the Android major versions' distribution percentage over time? https://developer.android.com/about/dashboards/ https://developer.android.com/about/dashboards/ just shows today's numbers. I'd like to see a "distribution vs days since following version released" with a line for each old version.
  - jeroenhd 8y ago
    Wikipedia has a nice graph: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_version_history#/media/File:Android_historical_version_distribution_-_vector.svg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_version_history#/media... Needs an update though; this one only goes up to February this year.
- pjmlp 8y ago
  Which is why most OEMs went with Nougat instead of Oreo for their brand new 2017/2018 devices. I really like it went this bad as always, because apparently as disclosed at Google IO 2018 they are finally considering making updates a requirement on the license agreements.
  - Klathmon 8y ago
    Well considering they just got slapped by the EU for doing stuff like that, I can see that license agreement getting weaker not stronger.

dingo_bat 8y ago

Reading through the list of improvements leaves me quite underwhelmed. I thought the Oreo upgrade was basically useless, but this is literally a service pack style update. Also amusing to see "battery improvements" in every release without anything to show for it.

TeMPOraL 8y ago
> Also amusing to see "battery improvements" in every release without anything to show for it. Whatever improvements are made are most likely quickly eaten by the cruft accumulating both in the system and in applications. The latter update frequently, which means you have a steady stream of bloat coming in...
- dingo_bat 8y ago
  This is the first time I am considering an iphone as my next phone. But the lack of headphone jack makes it really hard.
  - TeMPOraL 8y ago
    Think of this experience next time someone tries to convince you that customers in this market get to "vote with their wallets".
    - MBCook 8y ago
      They do. Customers voted overwhelmingly ‘we don’t care’ so the headphone jack didn’t return.
      - TeMPOraL 8y ago
        Did they? Or did they just express they care more about staying in Apple ecosystem than the headphone jack? This is my point: there isn't really a way to express a preference for something minor. Smartphone market is mostly "take it or leave it".

Sir_Cmpwn 8y ago

Surprised not to see mention of the cutout stuff yet. It seems pretty dumb to me that Google is jumping on board with this ridiculous feature. Maybe this'll be one of those Dropbox-style HN comments which in hindsight looks misled, but I honestly can't find any redeeming factors to the cutout idea.

izacus 8y ago
Except developers being able to properly support their apps around it? OEMs have decided to add notches, want it or not. Not having a API to work with them would be a huge pain.
- ehsankia 8y ago
  The purpose of AOSP Android has always been to lower fragmentation. If every OEM implements their own notch handling, then apps have no chance to properly support every single implementation. Google providing a standard way will greatly help the ecosystem. To give a really awful analogy, think of providing clean needles to drug addicts. It doesn't necessary mean you approve, but the benefits are bigger.
kcmp 8y ago
People loved it when Apple did it which gave everyone else the okay to go ahead and do it themselves. It allows phone manafacturers to advertise higher screen to body ratios and is really just a step in the progression towards bezelless phones. There's definitely a loud group of people who strongly dislike it but I think most people are okay with it
- 51Cards 8y ago
  Just have to comment that for myself a notch would be a deal beaker for a new device. I've played with a couple devices and really think it adds no actual value while complicating the user interface. I will avoid it as long as I can.
  - 8y ago

ythn 8y ago

But can we get scheduled SMS yet? Samsung has had this feature for ages...

mikelward 8y ago
The SMS app is not part of the base Android OS. Install whichever SMS app you like. It sounds like there are several that do what you want.

Legogris 8y ago

I can't be the only one getting a chill down my spine when I read this. Google, a company "committed to reach and engage the right users safely and cost-effectively around the world", doing deep analysis of my every input and my context in order to "drive engagement" and "surfacing the best parts of the apps [I] use all the time"? I hope this stuff is kept out of AOSP. Yes, I know it seems like at least some of the computation happens on-device, but I am not comfortable having it done on a device out of my full control regardless.

ppeetteerr 8y ago
They already do this with your searches and geolocation data. Why not this?
- Legogris 8y ago
  I can still dodge those by disabling Location Services and using something else than Google app-wise. It is not clear how opt-out this will be. Even if it can be disabled today it might become pushed harder as time goes.
  - ehsankia 8y ago
    You can disable this too: Home Settings > Suggestions I believe the computation is done fully locally, as for "tracking", every single OS has a history of what applications you've launched recently, how is that any different?
    - anonytrary 8y ago
      > doing deep analysis of my every input and my context in order to "drive engagement" and "surfacing the best parts of the apps [I] use all the time"? This is much richer data than a list of recently used apps, right? Do OSs also record that information?
      - ehsankia 8y ago

conradfr 8y ago

I was just hoping for them to retire those stupid round adaptive icons. They did not. Also it's not clear if the old style of switching "opened" apps will still be there? Because the new one with the full screen preview seems more flashy but less practical(think alt+tab vs win+tab on Windows).

mikelward 8y ago
I think the idea was good, it's just too bad so many apps (many by Google) went the lazy path of leaving the icon as-is and adding a white background layer. Also note that they're only circular on Pixel.
- conradfr 8y ago
  I don't know, they are round by default on my OP5. I'm really against the idea of having a uniform shape for all apps, it makes it harder to quickly locate them.
  - izacus 8y ago
    So use another launcher which allows you to customize that? Nova is very popular and gives you what you want.
- Avamander 8y ago
  To be fair the API given is pretty c*p when you have to target older Androids as well (and don't want to give them an uglier icon). If I remember right I had to simplify the icon as well (remove transparency I think) because Android doesn't like many things that are okay in svgs.
  - mikelward 8y ago
    I just used Android Studio to generate the icon for older versions. Yes, I would assume no transparency, since it needs to be a simple single-layered image, AFAIK. https://developer.android.com/studio/write/image-asset-studio#launcher https://developer.android.com/studio/write/image-asset-studi...

lgleason 8y ago

Funny. My Essential already has the update, but my pixel doesn't. Go figure...

on_and_off 8y ago
My pixel 2 sees it. I strongly suspect that this is a gradual rollout. Maybe that force checking if an update is available allows to force enroll ? that's how I saw the update and I now that Google has moved in this direction for the most impatient users.
- radicalriddler 8y ago
  You are correct. If you force check for an update, then it lets you update to Android Pie. I assume that the gradual rollout will send notifications to phones that it's available.
  - givehimagun 8y ago
    Force check on my Pixel 2 did not work =(
    - radicalriddler 8y ago
      Ah well. That proves me the hell wrong then. Bad luck, try again tomorrow XD. FeelsBadMan.

blinkingled 8y ago

Essential has done a fabulous job with Android updates - https://twitter.com/essential/status/1026516461907369984?s=20 https://twitter.com/essential/status/1026516461907369984?s=2... I hope they stay afloat and release a successor to the PH-1.

ishaanbahal 8y ago
I heard they cancelled it, but in all honesty, they did something that every one caught up on, including Apple I think, the notch! And they even did it right. I think they should get to release another device, this time just pricing it right would probably help them get a better market hold. PH-1, is amazing because of the updates!
watersb 8y ago
Yes, this is great. I purchased an Essential Phone on Amazon Prime Day. Amazon was (is?) an investor in Essential; they sold these for $250 on that day. The 360-degree camera is available from Essential at a deep discount. I got the idea that they were winding down operations, but the unlocked bootloader gave me some hope that I would be able to use this device to learn Android app development. And here they are, supporting Android P as an OTA update on launch day! I'm typing this on Android P...

bedros 8y ago

is the new API open source or vendor-lock-in so app developers are forced to stick with google

bitL 8y ago

Can we please get a choice of a non-infantile UI in Android in the future? The candy-style material UI just pushes me not to use Android for serious work, more for fire-and-forget tasks I don't care about, as interfacing with it is extremely unpleasant (only slightly better than WP8).

adrian_mrd 8y ago

Given the number of times the post mentions Machine Learning (ML), I'm surprised they didn't skip the P for Pie and go straight to naming it Android ML ;)

adrian_mrd 8y ago

Does anyone know if Final Cut Pro X or Premiere Pro (or other popular video editing tools) yet support encoding to the "HDR VP9 Profile 2" ? (HDR VP9 Profile 2 is isted as a new feature, as per "Android 9 adds built-in support for HDR VP9 Profile 2, so you can now deliver HDR-enabled movies to your users on HDR-capable devices." yet I wonder if this is effectively a telco-friendly video codec not widely used by media publishers or creators?)

sjwright 8y ago
I don't think publishing to a single specific profile is an appropriate use of a desktop video editing application. It's like typesetting a paperback book by pressing "print" from Microsoft Word. You should be exporting a "master" file from your editor and getting your delivery platform (or at minimum a dedicated transcoding app) to output to the various profiles. Also, exporting HDR content isn't as simple as changing your export setting. HDR changes the way you handle content from the earliest moments of data capture; the real question is how you choose to crush the high dynamic range down to a standard dynamic range for everyone else.
- adrian_mrd 8y ago
  Yeah, all good points, although sometimes one just needs to export a file or two (as opposed to setting up a publishing workflow or a system). And Compressor for Final Cut Pro X or Adobe Media Encoder CC for Premiere Pro CC are effectively integrated (or some of the export code) for such a function - or are launched via the apps when you ‘Export’ or ‘Share’, although this can depend upon your CC plan or whether you have purchased/installed Compressor, or not. The ‘crushing the HDR’ is a good point, I’ll have to look up how this codec handles DR and colour gamet :)

51Cards 8y ago

One small annoyance about the new version I've hoped they would revert is the new clock placement on the left. It was done to accommodate notches better but Android has always had notifications there. I've been running the beta for probably 6 weeks now and I still think I have notifications pending at a glance. It should move based on the presence of a notch only. Edit: Also there is now a 4 notification icon limit with the clock on the left, whether you have a notch or not. I often have a lot more than 4 notification icons up (1) (esp since a couple are permanent from background apps) and the rest will just disappear under a dot-dot icon. (1) - 3 email account alerts, Trillian, SMS, Ebay, and a Photos alert on my phone right now. Half aren't visible.

bitsoda 8y ago

Feels kind of lazy going with "Pie" after having used "Key Lime Pie" in the past. Though technically not a dessert, I was rooting for "Pancake".

what_ever 8y ago
It was changed from KLP to Kitkat though. So Pie was never used. Disc: Googler but nowhere close to Android.
- cpeterso 8y ago
  I was rooting for "Pumpkin Pie", a nice alliterative two-word name. And not trademarked! :)
curiousgal 8y ago
Peppermint was the obvious choice in my book

zinckiwi 8y ago

My feature wish list: 1) working Smart Lock Trusted Places

pleasecalllater 8y ago

So to get all the privacy changes I will need to buy a new phone, as my current Samsung has 3 years now, so it won't get any updates. What a funny world.

cmurf 8y ago

I wonder if Google's own apps are exempt from adaptive battery? I continue to have problems with Google's apps soaking my phone's battery. Reset the phone, and I get 6 days of standby (this is LineageOS). Install Google apps, and it's now 4 hours. Wakelock detector says the apps Inbox, Google, and Google Contacts are the top offenders with dozens of wakes keeping the phone awake between 40% and 99% of the time. Super irritating.

izacus 8y ago
That wakelock detector is probably showing wrong data (especially on newer API levels). Can you try something more advanced like Battery Historian (in dev tools) to see what's waking up the CPU? (And no, Google apps are beholden to all power saving restrictions like other apps - Play Services being the exception because it services functionality that must work at all times.)
- cmurf 8y ago
  Battery Historian isn't really helping pin this down. CPU is running the whole time over night, ~5%/hr drain doing nothing. Kernel only uptime has hundreds of events per minute with reason "unknown". Userspace wakelocks total less than 16s every 20 minutes with no app I recognize named (Babel_ConcService is the top offender). Top app is blank as is Long waklocks and Screen. Doze is "light" all night. Kernel Wakesources: Ranking | Name | Duration / Hr | Count / Hr | Total Duration | Total Count 0 | event1 | 17m59s340ms | 23457.57 | 3h2m57.557s | 238578 1 | event5 | 17m32s350ms | 23463.47 | 2h58m23.053s | 238638 2 | alarmtimer | 1m47s350ms | 53.59 | 18m11.818s | 545 3 | wlan | 45s341ms | 58.99 | 7m41.149s | 600 4 | bluetooth_timer | 23s642ms | 194.68 | 4m0.462s | 1980 No idea what event1 and event5 are, but that seems excessive. Kernel Wakeup Reasons: Ranking | Name | Duration / Hr | Count / Hr | Total Duration | Total Count | Show Count vs Time 0 | unknown | 57m26s285ms | 11789.25 | 9h44m10.852s | 119904 | App Wakeup Alarms: Ranking | Name | Uid | Frequency (count/hr) | Count 0 | GOOGLE_SERVICES | 10033 | 60.66 | 617 1 | com.android.providers.calendar | 10004 | 0.20 | 2 60 wakeup alarms per hour? Excessive anytime but absurd for night time. Time Spent In Each App State: Name | Uid | Top / Hr | Foreground Service / Hr | Top Sleeping / Hr | Foreground / Hr | Background / Hr | Cached / Hr GOOGLE_SERVICES | 10033 | 7s202ms | 59m52s311ms | 0ms | 486ms | 0ms | 0ms bbc.mobile.news.ww | 10109 | 5s312ms | 0ms | 0ms | 0ms | 762ms | 16m48s169ms net.sourceforge.opencamera | 10097 | 5s71ms | 0ms | 0ms | 0ms | 0ms | 59m54s209ms com.google.android.tts | 10072 | 4s910ms | 88ms | 0ms | 0ms | 0ms | 59m54s200ms com.cyanogenmod.trebuchet | 10026 | 3s247ms | 0ms | 59m44s851ms | 0ms | 0ms | 11s900ms Foreground service per hour? Anyway, battery life goes to about 4 days standby if I put the phone in airplane mode. Or if I reset the phone and then on next boot I don't enter my Google account info. I have one bugreport where the discharge rate varied between 15% and 40% per hour, but there's no battery data due to overflow (?) looks like I'm only getting 3-4 hours of detailed data after a reboot.

hateful 8y ago

Finally, a dark theme.

YZF 8y ago

Coming to my Nexus 4 soon? ;) It always feels like the goal here is to get people to buy new phones. I wonder what % of phones running the previous OS will be upgradable.

dan1234 8y ago
My Moto 4G finally got it's upgrade to Android 7.1… last week. Better late than never, I guess.
dmitrygr 8y ago
Not very hard to do, actually. N4 hw is well known

AndyKelley 8y ago

"Android 9 harnesses the power of machine learning to make your phone ...simpler" What a ridiculous concept. Have you ever tried to install TensorFlow? It's a giant, flaming shit-pile covered in a layered shit cake. A word such as "simple" in this context is obscene. This is all bloatware. Android is garbage and it's only getting worse. What phone can I get that isn't Android or iOS?

Raphmedia 8y ago

"It's nice!" ... or at least that's what I would say if my phone wasn't limited to Android 7.0

zanny 8y ago
I was worried my S5 was doomed to Lineage 14.1 forever, but some saint dev ported it to 15.1 last month. LTE doesn't work, but hey, 15.1. Whats really scary is that the official Samsung Touchwiz ROM stopped getting updates two years ago and is stuck on 5.1 I think. Ain't it great when hobbyists support a device for over 3 major revisions past when the billion dollar manufacturer that made it stopped updating it less than five years after it was released.
- voltagex_ 8y ago
  >LTE doesn't work, but hey, 15.1 Ah, XDA, where critical features become optional.
- scns 8y ago
  Thank you for writing this. I'll stay on 14.1 till it's fixed.

j_coder 8y ago

It is amazing how each new version of Android has a complete new UX and none of them are actually good. Google is basically a back-end company incapable of doing good UX (if it is more than a search bar).

curun1r 8y ago
I would agree with you, but after spending the last two years using an Android phone after almost a decade using iOS, I feel that Google has made some fundamentally bad decisions below the UI layer as well. Despite using a phone that is newer and more powerful, my Android phone is slower, less responsive and runs out of battery much faster than any of my iPhones. The only reason I stay with Android is Google Fi.
- curiousgal 8y ago
  I wholeheartedly disagree. I tried using both the iPhone 8 and the iPhone X and none of them came close to the Pixel 2, UX and feature wise. I couldn't download files, couldn't even change my ringtone to a custom melody, couldn't attach files coorectly, the integration with their Maps app was awful, the battery life drained faster after one update... I just felt so limited!
- cageface 8y ago
  iPhone X seems like a bunch of clever but costly gimmicks to fix a self inflicted problem. Instead of just moving the fingerprint sensor to the back of the phone they got rid of it entirely and replaced it with FaceID and this new gesture based interface. It's an impressive piece of technology but a step backward in UX overall. I find my Pixel 2 XL more usable and reliable than my iPhone X and Project Fi has saved me countless hours sitting in phone shop offices waiting for SIM cards in every new country I visit. The UI may not be quite as snappy as my iPhone but I don't feel it really holds back my use of the device at all and battery life is actually better and it recharges faster. I do think this new gesture stuff they added to Android P is kind of dumb though and seems like a cheap and failed effort to copy some buzz from Apple.
sidlls 8y ago

paulcole 8y ago

Adoption of the previous version (Oreo) is at 12%. https://www.macrumors.com/2018/08/06/google-releases-android-9-pie/ https://www.macrumors.com/2018/08/06/google-releases-android...

pornel 8y ago

It's a shame that Google has stopped upgrading the OS on the Nexus line of phones.

ilove_banh_mi 8y ago
Is there a reason for them not upgrading Android on Nexus? Disappointing news since I bought mine a mere 2 years ago.
- izacus 8y ago
  The major reason (according to the dev podcast) is that SoC vendors simply drop support and don't update drivers for new Android versions. This pretty much blocks any kind of updates since mobile drivers are all closed binary blobs. Before 8.0 Android driver layer wasn't separate from other OS layer so they couldn't upgrade Android separately.
ilove_banh_mi 8y ago
The Nexus 5X was released 3 years ago, on September 29, 2015. By contrast Apple's iOS 12 will run on the iPhone 5S, which was released 5 years ago, on September 20, 2013.

thewizardofaus 8y ago

Could they cram the world Machine Learning into the article much more? If this was 12 months ago, replace every instance of the word Machine Learning with "blockchain"... Oh boy, gotta love buzzwords.

anonytrary 8y ago
Each of the whopping 5 instances they use the phrase in are used correctly. The entire document is around 2500-3200 words. I think they could cram a lot more in and still keep it kosher.

bobbywordy 8y ago

Honestly, I was hoping they would call it Android Pizza ;)

lai 8y ago

I don't know if it's just me, but I don't really like the text magnifier. I select text better without it.

PopePompus 8y ago

Even in Pie, "Adaptive Brightness" is terrible. The display often abruptly drops in brightness for seemingly no reason. I think I could do better with a photocell and an opamp.

faragon 8y ago

In my opinion, Android should focus in quality/stability and UI responsiveness. E.g. it blows my mind that Nokia N900 (2009, Maemo Linux) was, in some cases, way more responsive in the UI than current Android running in hardware 20x faster.

edhelas 8y ago

It's crazy that in 2018 we are still using GIFs to do short animated demo. Those few "images" in the article were ~40Mb, come on.

sapphire_tomb 8y ago

Anyone know if there's a way to get the Oreo "Recent apps" feature back? The new one is fairly terrible in my opinion, it now takes many more swipes to get back to the app I want.