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New Surface Pro

• romanovcode 9y ago
  You could link on the official page tho: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/devices/surface-pro/overview https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/devices/surface-pro/...
• Roritharr 9y ago
  No Thunderbolt 3 as the leaks said. Can't buy it for that reason alone​. (Our office goes for TB3 Docks everywhere so Mac and Windows Users can use the same Flex Desks)
  • moduspwnens14 9y ago
    That's interesting. I'd bet Flex desks could work well like that.
  • nicpottier 9y ago
    Which dock and what has your experience been with them? Seems there are very few out there..
    • Roritharr 9y ago
      Currently CalDigits TS3 Lite works well, we have a couple, but we want to Rollout the full TS3 as soon as they become available so we can ditch the chargers aswell.
    • FireBeyond 9y ago
      I have a Dell XPS 15 9560 with the TB16 dock. I had tried a couple (Kensington, etc), and had issues (like, buried waaaaay down in the Kensington fine print was the fact that if you had a 4K display, the USB3 ports would "downshift" to USB2, and the GigE port would go to 100mbps...) The TB16 dock is great though, works seamlessly and smoothly with 4K displays, GigE, supports Power Delivery and remote 'wake' (there's a power button on the dock that if the laptop is sleeping will wake it).
      • Roritharr 9y ago
        Have you tried using the TB 16 with a MacBook Pro?
        • FireBeyond 9y ago
          No. But I could try with my partner's MB if you're curious.
          • Roritharr 9y ago
            Yes I am. :)
• Longhanks 9y ago
  > The most versatile laptop. ...that doesn't ship with a keyboard (pen isn't included either). No USB-C. 16GB RAM maximum.
  • nilved 9y ago
    Are you saying that 16 GB isn't enough?
    • dawnerd 9y ago
      I would considering it's a "pro" device. 16 should be minimum.
      • georgeecollins 9y ago
        OK its pro, but it is also mobile. Who has a mobile device (not something that just sits at your desk all day) with 32 GB of ram?
        • mgkimsal 9y ago
          Lenovo has laptops with 32g. HP does too. ASUS... gosh... lots of companies offer it... What's the point of the question? Lots of end users want a laptop with 32g.
          • dagw 9y ago
            I think the point they're trying to make is that the sort of person who wants 32 or 64 GB of RAM in their laptop (and I'm definitely in that group) also wants a fast processor and a decent graphics card. The number of people who need 32+ GB of RAM and are happy with a slow processor is probably quite small. The sort of work I'd use my Surface Pro for doesn't need more than 8GB of RAM and the sort of work I need 32+GB of RAM for I wouldn't do on a Surface Pro.
            • tracker1 9y ago
• raesene6 9y ago
  Looks like a nice incremental improvement to the Surface Pro line. The "no fan" option on the Core i5 could be quite nice, one of the annoyances about the Surface Pro 3 that I've seen was the noise of the fans.
  • vezycash 9y ago
    I'm curious, does "no fan" mean no vents? Cos it will overheat once dust accumulates.
    • bobsam 9y ago
      It has vents. It may even have active cooling by other means (e.g. Lumia 950 smartphones are water-cooled). Don't think dust will gather inside the device that easily if there is no fan to suck it in.
• Kurtz79 9y ago
  "2.5x more performance than Surface Pro 3" This statement begs an obvious question...
  • xd1936 9y ago
    Should they call it the Surface Pro 7.5?
  • deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
• apapli 9y ago
  I love my Pro 4. This video won't convince me to upgrade, but I'll be a tad jealous of every new starter at our firm who gets assigned one!
  • tzaman 9y ago
    Care to elaborate why? I'm somewhat of an apple-fanboy but Surface seems more and more appealing, and I'm leaning towards giving one a try.
    • sebtoast 9y ago
      In my case, I wouldn't upgrade just for the sake of upgrading to a newer device since the ones we have are still doing the job, maybe parent poster is in the same boat.
      • apapli 9y ago
        You got it in one. I'm very happy with my pro4, so no need to upgrade. It is perfect for meetings and quickly doing work on the move. I will never[1] go back to a standard laptop, my desktop does the heavy lifting. [1] Never say never, but it is a pretty big improvement!
    • nrki 9y ago
      The form-factor is pretty amazing. The portability is very good. The performance is also very good within the above two factors. The problem is the software and features: - Windows 10 is a known factor, and it constantly frustrates. - No Thunderbolt or USB-C is ridiculous in 2017. I'd like to see Microsoft releasing Linux drivers for the Surface Pro. If they really love Linux enough to support it on Azure, they should support it everywhere. (I know, they support it on Azure to compete with AWS and Googs)
      • monochromatic 9y ago
        I've pretty much gotten used to Windows 10 at this point, and there are even a couple of minor UI tweaks that I miss when I use my Windows 7 machine at work. What frustrates you?
• franciscop 9y ago
  They are still using the SurfaceDock with the SurfaceConnect Cable: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/accessories/surface-dock https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/accessories/surface-... , which does basically the same as USB-C. In an era when even Apple is rumored (and even if false, still plausible) to be switching to USB-C for the iPhone, Microsoft still tries to force a proprietary connector. Didn't they learn anything from IE? Even if it's good for them for a while, it'll be their demise not following standars and thus locking thenselves out of everything.
  • eb0la 9y ago
    Looks more complicated that it sounds. MSFT already did the job of sourcing cables, connectors, and power supplies for all their surface line for the next XXX years (where XXX is the time they're commited to support all their hardware products). Switching to USB-C from the bussiness perspective would be a great expense... and would involve higher price tag.
    • franciscop 9y ago
      That is what I mean, it's basically a similar situation to 2005's IE. From the business perspective it wouldn't have made sense to support standards and would have involved a higher price tag. What this means is now people (those who buy an extra $200 device) will be happy for a while until their devices start to be incompatible or work slower than the competition who have a single cable type for everything. Then they will resent the brand and thus not buy again. Of course totally my opinion.
      • nailer 9y ago
        I like a single magnetic cable that does power and data. Until there's some open connector that does that [1] I'm happy to keep using the excellent Surface Dock cables. They could add USB C, but I still have more USB A devices, and I suspect others do too. [1] USB C isn't magnetic, and the fake 'magnetic USB C' is just an adaptor and doesn't do data.
    • deleted 9y ago
• eb0la 9y ago
  At first sight it has similar specs to HP Envy and Spectre series. I'm wondering about the price.
• TekMol 9y ago
  I use my tablet quite a lot to browse the web. It's an old iPad 2. Everytime a new tablet comes out, I wonder if I should update but cannot find a reason. Is there anything new in this tablet that would benefit me? All I really care for in a tablet is that it is: 1) Fanless (The iPad is fanless) 2) Lightweight (The iPad weights 600g)
  • dagw 9y ago
    Is there anything new in this tablet that would benefit me? Do you ever want to use keyboard with your tablet? Can you see that advantage of a pen? Is there any windows software that you might want to run on your tablet? If no, then no. Basically this isn't a tablet that is competing against the iPad, it's a tablet that's competing against the macbook/macbook air.
    • TekMol 9y ago
      I use my laptop to do anything else then browsing the web. If a tablet would run Linux smoothly, I could see myself using it with an external keyboard. So I could put the tablet onto something so it's on eyelevel and put the keyboard on the desk. I guess that would work with a bluetooth keyboard? However, as far as I know the surface line does not support Linux well.
      • hxegon 9y ago
        Windows has a linux subsystem now, so it depends on how you define "support"
        • TekMol 9y ago
          What can one do with that "subsystem"? I want to use all the software that is in the Debian repos. I don't want Microsoft to spy on me. And I don't want to be exposed to their security issues.
          • lmm 9y ago
• AdmiralAsshat 9y ago
  Following the Apple school of numbering things up to a point the throwing a random self-titled reboot, I see. It won't work, Microsoft. It didn't work for Apple. Just ask anyone who owns an iPad, and count the amount of time it takes to figure out exactly which model iPad they own.
  • ClassyJacket 9y ago
    I have the The New iPad, which is the old iPad now.
    • IanDrake 9y ago
      I think the numbering system goes away when the innovation ends. Meaning, the only thing changing in the future is slight hardware upgrades, like the MB Air or Mini which are identified by date.
  • josefresco 9y ago
    Does it matter? I have a newer iPad and couldn't tell you what model/year is - and I'm pretty tech-obsessed. Does this mean I'm less apt to upgrade?
• chiph 9y ago
  I've been very happy with my SP4, but I wish I'd gone for the i7 CPU instead of the i5. It would be nice if the top-level configuration on the SP5 had 32gb of memory - I end up swapping sometimes (which TBH isn't that bad with a SSD, compared to the old rotating rust drives)
  • jrs95 9y ago
    Still waiting on new low power memory for that I think. Same reason why Apple had a 16GB cap on the new MBP.
  • neogodless 9y ago
    What Core i5 model does your SP4 carry? Does anyone know where you can find the models they are using in the new SPP? I'm sure the Core i7 are something like the 7500U (i.e. dual core, four threads) - is your Core i5 dual core, dual threads?
    • chiph 9y ago
      It's an i5-6300U at 2.4 GHz. 1 socket, 2 cores, 4 logical processors.
      • neogodless 9y ago
        That's the really weird thing about Core i7 mobile processors. They are also 1 socket, 2 cores, 4 logical processors. Just slightly faster base/turbo clocks than the i5. I dislike the naming. I only recently realized my work laptop is a U series, which explains why my 8 year old desktop (AMD quad core) is much faster at compiling the same projects...
        • Const-me 9y ago
          My laptop with U-series i3 builds C++ just as fast as my 3 years old quad core desktop i5. The reason is eDRAM i.e. large L4 cache in the mobile CPU. Some workloads (compiling C++ appears to be one of them) like lower RAM latency even more than extra CPU cores.
• lytfyre 9y ago
  Still need to take the i7 to get 16GB of RAM. I really appreciate that even the base spec, touch-bar less MBP can be fully loaded out with memory.
• staticelf 9y ago
  I have a SP4 and I really, really like it. But this doesn't seem to differ that much from it. Does it? :) What's new compared to SP4?
  • rtkwe 9y ago
    50% more battery life than the 4, fanless options for the m3 and i5 versions, on screen support for the surface dial, and a new hinge that lays a little flatter seem like the big changes. It's largely an incremental improvement.
    • e12e 9y ago
      More battery is a big one - I love my sp4, but I think (even with the improvements with the pro) they should have added a few 100 grams for more battery. Fanless i5 would be nice - my sp4 i5 isn't loud, but quiet would be better. Was hoping the new sp would be waterproof though (it's the only remaining "obvious" improvement I see. We'll that and enough gpu power to drive vr - but I suppose we're still a few years from that in a small, light, quiet battery-powered device).
    • popcorncolonel 9y ago
      And LTE. It would be pretty damn surprising if you got any more than an incremental improvement this late in the game.
      • rtkwe 9y ago
        Oh yeah LTE is neat but I don't really have a use for it so I always forget to look.
• dilemma 9y ago
  Needs better storage options. I want an i5 with 512GB or 1TB, but not for $2,000++.
• nailer 9y ago
  One import thing with all Surface laptops that most people don't know: > Support is limited to the country you purchased the device in. Eg: - If you buy an Apple laptop, and need a repair, they'll fix it if it's in warranty, regardless of where you are. - If you buy a Microsoft laptop, and need a warranty repair done in a different country, Microsoft won't help you. I purchased a Surface Book (which I love) in a Microsoft store in the US. It's been sporadically doing this since a couple of months after I unboxed it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_f85KlC5Bc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_f85KlC5Bc Microsoft UK won't fix it. Even when I travel to the US I'm not sure I'll be there long enough for Microsoft to do the repairs. I love the hardware, but this policy is really bad. I paid for the top of the range laptop and expect support for it. Edit: I've raised this with Microsoft Support in the past and they've simply restated the policy and closed the case as resolved. When I attempted to escalate it, they told me to post a complaint to Microsoft's legal department (?!?).
  • dilap 9y ago
    wow, that's crazy customer unfriendly.
    • paulcole 9y ago
      Eh, is it really? How many customers does this really affect? If you're from a European country and buying in the US, odds are you're trying to avoid VAT.
      • dilap 9y ago
        ah yes, let's assume the customer was just trying to dodge taxes, even better! it's crazy, even if common, to treat your customers like shit. it's not MS's problem of people are dodging taxes, and it should be (if they want customers) their aim to help their customers.
      • kybernetikos 9y ago
        Or perhaps purchase a device like the studio or the book before their EU debut.
• lz400 9y ago
  Anybody knows if they are going to release a new surface book too?
• rimher 9y ago
  How many cores will the new CPUs have? I remember someone telling me that the older version all had 2 cores only
• primis 9y ago
  Honestly, $100 for the pen? That should honestly be included since the keyboard isn't.
  • jclardy 9y ago
    Wow, that means they really jacked up the price this year. My SP4 was pen included. $1060 for the m3 model with a pen and type cover.
    • Analemma_ 9y ago
      They lowered the prices on the SKUs to compensate. Honestly, there's no pleasing some people. When the pen was included, everyone was saying, "let me buy a cheaper SKU without the pen; I don't want it!", and now that they've done that everyone is complaining.
    • StreakyCobra 9y ago
      I got mine for the equivalent of 1028 USD: SP4 i5, 256G, 8GO pen and type cover (this was a special offer though). This was one month ago. So when the new model will go out, the prices of SP4 will probably drop. So far the only drawback of the SP4 is the battery life, so except if they improved it a lot I don't see the point of paying the 500-600$ more. They say it's possible to watch 13.5 hours of videos, but manufacturers tests are not trustable anyway. It would probably be more like 7-8 hours of real-world usage. Are the extra 3 hours worth the difference? Maybe, but for my usage no.
      • tracker1 9y ago
        Depends... being able to get through a day at a conference center matters a lot to some people. Not so much to me, but to some.
        • StreakyCobra 9y ago
          Yes, it is why I said "Maybe" :-) I'm actually working in research and I'm going to conferences, but the limit of ~4 hours kind of forces me to focus on talks instead of coding all day long. I mean, during the conference day I'm kind of depressed of not having battery any more, but with cold head I tell myself it is better for me.
• SurrealSoul 9y ago
  I got excited, then I saw prices. Then I saw the keyboard isn't even included and costs $160. Ouch. This will be $1800+ after tax, why not just get a really solid laptop at that point? Hell you could buy two solid desktops
  • tbihl 9y ago
    The pen is amazing for what it does. You can annotate things on the same machine where you're doing everything else. It's also a wonderful machine for flying. But you pay up for those things. So for you, definitely just get the solid laptop. Surface pros can be maddening, and often feel finicky enough that they can't be primary machines.
  • bobsam 9y ago
    I ran to get my wallet, then I realised I have to ask the house too..
  • bpicolo 9y ago
    > why not just get a really solid laptop at that point Their goal is to be a more versatile version of exactly that, though? The surface isn't meant to be a tablet alternative, it's more of a laptop alternative that's also sort of a tablet.
  • rb808 9y ago
    > This will be $1800+ after tax, why not just get a really solid laptop at that point? Hell you could buy two solid desktops Yeah a solid desktop, plus a decent laptop, tablet, chromebook and a kindle.
  • jkchu 9y ago
    For me personally, I bought my Surface Pro for its capabilities as a drawing tablet. Comparable dedicated drawing tablets run close to $1000, so shelling extra for a fully functional laptop was a no-brainer.
• drej 9y ago
  I've been waiting for this for a while (despite being a Mac user for years and years). And it doesn't quite compute (ba dum tss). Two reasons really. 1. No USB-C. 2. If I want 16 gigs of RAM, I need to opt for an i7 and half a terabyte of SSD. I wish I could just go for an i5 with 256 gigs of storage and 16 gigs of RAM. That would be sweet (and not as expensive). Too bad, let's see what others come up with.
  • giancarlostoro 9y ago
    On the same boat, waiting for the sweet spot laptop, of a good enough processor, but still 16GB ram and enough hdd space. Whoever provides the better laptop will get me as their customer, whether Apple or Microsoft. Anyone else has to fight for it hard enough, I am considering Dell for Ubuntu though.
    • j45 9y ago
      I've been told to check out Asus
      • giancarlostoro 9y ago
        My current laptop is an ASUS ROG but I'm waiting to see who else is competing, I kinda want hardware that'd be most likely to have better Linux support.
        • j45 9y ago
          Haha, you literally stole the thought out of my mind when I had hit send - Asus has some great value/performance, but I wasn't sure of the Linux support. I have a good friend who runs linux natively (I use a VM) and is raving about the new Lenovo Carbon X1 as well.
          • giancarlostoro 9y ago
            Don't get me wrong, I run a Ubuntu Variant natively, no dual-booting on my ASUS ROG laptop, but the Nvidia drivers are iffy, also battery life is a downer. Would love to see a Linux compliant laptop with amazing battery life. I would think MacBooks are very common enough hardware wise to where Linux support would be pretty decent, same with a Surface... Maybe even the Dell ones, so I'm just waiting and waiting...
• wakkaflokka 9y ago
  Alright, now that this is out: what should I get? Most of my heavy-duty work is done via SSH into a remote VM. I watch movies, but mostly browse the web. Most of my actual work is programming intensive. I like pretty screens. Larger is usually better. I want to be able to take it on a plane without hassle when I travel. New surface? HP Elite x360 15"? Wait for Surface Book refresh? Yoga?
  • rch 9y ago
    Dell Precision 5520 looks like the best machine out right now, among the larger/higher-performing options.
    • wakkaflokka 9y ago
      Looking for a hybrid though (tablet mode), doesn't look like Precision does that? Otherwise that'd be a solid choice.
      • vladimir-y 9y ago
        XPS 13" has convertible model. Nowadays Precision laptops come with the same chassis as XPS, nothing premium there as XPS is the regular multimedia laptop. I'd recommend before getting Dell's laptop to first go through the owners comments at the Amazom/reddit/etc, I saw many complaints about quality control and the coil whine problem, so for me Dell is not an option.
      • rch 9y ago
        A 15" tablet? The 3520 and 7520 have optional touch displays.
    • vladimir-y 9y ago
      Precision 5520 has the same chassis as XPS. Dell's laptops used to have coil whine issue and quality control seems to be bad at least during the past few years. This is a strong competitor of the XPS https://www.notebookcheck.net/Gigabyte-Aero-15-7700HQ-GTX-1060-FHD-Laptop-Review.215364.0.html https://www.notebookcheck.net/Gigabyte-Aero-15-7700HQ-GTX-10... and this is a competitor on the workstation area http://store.hp.com/wcsstore/hpusstore/pdf/HP_ZBook_Studio_G4_MWS.pdf http://store.hp.com/wcsstore/hpusstore/pdf/HP_ZBook_Studio_G...
• 6stringmerc 9y ago
  Look I'm a fan but until I see it running some real heavy artillery (Ableton Live 9 Suite, Massive, AmpliTube, and a half-dozen VSTs) in real-time vs. the competition, then it's just another hollow claim. Sure, hardware and performance are getting better. Sure, the Surface Dial is a massive game changer in the long term. But, look, the problem with marketing to creative people is that they take it sort of as a challenge to prove you wrong. It's like ingrained. Kind of a bad habit, but, hey, it is what it is and I will happily admit I want one of these new devices and would consider it a major upgrade from my current gear.
  • noahbradley 9y ago
    I'm a fairly professional creative myself and have been using Surface products to do my work for the last 4~ years almost exclusively. Heavy Photoshop work, lots of video editing, 3D modeling & rendering, etc. Sure, I'd love to have 32GB of memory and an even more powerful machine in general, but I've been damn happy with all of the Surface products I've owned.
    • fumar 9y ago
      I would love to hear your feedback on the new Surface Pen features. Keep up the great work!
  • exodust 9y ago
    You might want to check out 'molten music tech' youtube channel. He has tons of info about the surface pro and music making... he puts it through paces and provides a good analysis. Recent videos he looks at the surface book. Much better to watch people actually using the software rather than just reading reviews... Surface Book review for music production https://youtu.be/jqPhTDM-uBg?t=1m21s https://youtu.be/jqPhTDM-uBg?t=1m21s surface pro 4 https://youtu.be/NwpebBvLBSI https://youtu.be/NwpebBvLBSI
  • smilekzs 9y ago
    I run FL Studio and a bunch of VSTs, and I agree with you on at least this: the processor still can't meet the need if you use a lot of synth, and 16GiB RAM is still too small if you replace the synths with samplers instead.
• delegate 9y ago
  Top model has 1TBGB SSD ! That's 1 terabyte gigabyte or zillions of all kinds of bytes :). Typos aside, hardware looks promising, but Windows... The only place were I'm ok with Windows is a multi monitor gaming rig.. And that's because there's no other choice.
  • deno 9y ago
    1000 exabytes² to be exact!
  • dingo_bat 9y ago
    Windows is probably the best OS on this form of PC. The form itself is shit, that's another matter.
• trendia 9y ago
  Any Linux support? I'll buy Microsoft hardware if I can keep my full development environment (Qt creator included)
  • tracker1 9y ago
    That was my first thought as well... I'm currently using a MBP for my work laptop and personal, but my next personal laptop will probably run linux... and I've considered switching my MBP over.
  • bergie 9y ago
    You may want to ask on https://www.reddit.com/r/SurfaceLinux/ https://www.reddit.com/r/SurfaceLinux/
  • shahbaby 9y ago
    Linux support will be limited. I'm running Ubuntu 16.04 and Win10 on a Surface Book - no pen input, can't use dedicated GPU, wifi signal occasionally dies, can't wake up from sleep Other then that, Linux actually runs pretty well and is very usable.
    • komali2 9y ago
      >other than that That's... a pretty big "that"
  • e12e 9y ago
    I only have the sp4, and apparently Linux support is getting there. On my first attempt (almost a year ago) there were a number of issues - but now a recent distro/kernel should work out of the box (on the sp4). But I haven't gotten around to trying yet, as with the Linux subsystem and hyper-v - I have enough Linux for my current needs. I do plan to try and move to Linux (again) now - for better window management and better package management (scoop.sh and chocolatey notwithstanding) - and because I strongly believe in FOSS.
• Analemma_ 9y ago
  I'm interested to see if the claims of ~20ms latency on the pen hold up in reviews. That's less than half of the latency of the Apple Pencil and within spitting distance of the 10ms considered to be the holy grail of imperceptibility. I could never get into pen-based input because the latency drove me nuts, but may have to rethink that.
  • dingo_bat 9y ago
    Apple pencil was never touted as having particularly low latency. On the other hand surface devices have always made a point of having the best touch/stylus experience, so I won't be surprised if that 20ms really holds good.
    • jacobolus 9y ago
      A year ago when I tested the two back to back, the Apple stylus had something like half the latency of the MS one, and also seemed more accurate. It’s hard to tell how much of that is hardware difference vs. optimization of the signal processing software though.
  • smilekzs 9y ago
    I tried Apple Pencil at an Apple store, and can't help but feel that it low-pass filters much more aggressively than my Surface Pro 4 which uses a version of NTrig2 tech. More low-pass filtering means more effective latency.
• nateroling 9y ago
  I'm mostly curious what they're doing with that 4x5 view camera connected to a laptop...
  • tlack 9y ago
    Could be a scanning back.. but they also don't seem to have a shutter cable attached :)
• atroll 9y ago
  Am I poor or is this thing crazy expensive ?
  • IanDrake 9y ago
    Expensive compared to what?
  • devopsproject 9y ago
    It is only expensive if you compare it to the craptops from dell and hp. Its got the same pixel density of a macbook pro, weights half as much, has a touchscreen, etc.
    • bhauer 9y ago
      > Its got the same pixel density of a macbook pro Just to clarify, the Surface Pro and Surface Book have a 267 DPI 2:3 aspect ratio display. They are fantastic. The MacBook Pro's display is ~227 DPI and is not 2:3.
      • maxxxxx 9y ago
        From my subjective experience my MBP's screen is still better than the Surface Book screen. Despite lower DPI.
  • chiph 9y ago
    It's a premium device, like the Mac Book Pro. You can even say it's better because it can function as a tablet (has a digitizer), and it costs less.
  • fuzzybeard 9y ago
    I'm an IT professional and this is a work machine for me. Looking at it that way, for what it does, it's worth every penny. For a casual home user? No, I would never recommend a Surface Pro.
• nateroling 9y ago
  I'm very curious what they're doing with that 4x5 view camera connected to a laptop...
• whistlerbrk 9y ago
  Is the RAM still soldered in and therefore not expandable / upgradeable? I'd love to get the 256Gb SSD / i7 version and upgrade to 16Gb RAM
  • MikusR 9y ago
    Let me gues. A light, tablet like device, so it definately takes full size dd4 ram sticks with huge heatsinks.
  • rtkwe 9y ago
    Soldered or purely onboard everything is the only way to get devices that thin. There's just not enough space to include a RAM socket that's 50% the height of your entire device.
• deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
• Helmet 9y ago
  How is this a functional laptop? And I'm being dead serious here and 100% literal - how do I work with this machine while it's on my lap? It looks like it would be a real pain in the ass to do so, with the "Kickstand" and all.
  • thesuitonym 9y ago
    It's not a functional laptop. Putting a Surface on your lap is the worst experience you'll ever have. But as a portable Windows 10 device, my Surface Pro 1 is one of my favorite devices.
    • passive 9y ago
      I don't know what kind of laps other people have, but I'm decidedly average in every way, physically, and I use my SP3 on my lap every day. Usually it's on a table or desk, but it's fine on my lap too.
      • seanmcdirmid 9y ago
        It is completely lapable, but typing on keyboard without anything underneath is a bit weird. I hope they upgrade the SurfaceBook next.
    • robotresearcher 9y ago
      > Putting a Surface on your lap is the worst experience you'll ever have. If true, that would be a wonderful life.
    • rhodysurf 9y ago
      The Surface Pro 3 and on are completely different to use on your lap than the first and second gens.
  • fumar 9y ago
    I use the SP3 on my lap every day, its my work PC. Actually the kickstand works as an anchor when I cross my legs and stays fixed. Suggest you try it in person.
• zghst 9y ago
  Microsoft is completely unashamed and masterfully brilliant at copying and improving on Apple's strategy. The only concern is that they're making a bunch of machines not many people will buy, however, in the long run it's better that they have the production expertise and well minted engineers. Apple should and probably isn't resting on its heels, I bet we're going to see a preemptive strike on HoloLens (and probably .NET) sometime soon, maybe starting at WWDC this year...
  • tomtheelder 9y ago
    What about this are you describing as copying Apple's strategy?
    • zghst 9y ago
      MS built out an entire hardware line that mimics Apple's hardware line and then put up counter points to Mac alongside each competing Apple product. It is obvious and Microsoft's collective ego shows. It is a very late response to Apple's old campaign, they have moved on completely.
      • binarycrusader 9y ago
        Mimics? At last check, none of Apple's laptops had full touch screens or supported a stylus. If you're talking about design or style, you might be able to argue that.
        • zghst 9y ago
          You are talking about features. Not the products themselves. Tablet. Laptop. Convertible (in-between). There usage and perception is the same. There is no defining feature that make them different. They go after the same market, that is the key. None of these products (Surface) really matter because Microsoft is just buying time and expertise with the Surface line. HoloLens will change everything, as soon as it drops. Microsoft will be working furiously to spin down the Surface line and ramp up its new platform. It is the gold key. We don't always have our phone in our hands but imagine you have these lenses on all the time to help you experience a deeper world.
• ikeboy 9y ago
  Why is it comparing battery to surface pro 4 but performance to surface pro 3?
  • princeb 9y ago
    i think 4 and 5 are using skylake and kaby lake which is a minor perf improvement. the cpu comparison is not very interesting. we will have to wait for the next intel 'tick' before cpu comparison becomes meaningful again.
  • IanDrake 9y ago
    Because 10% more powerful than the Pro 4 is a bad headline and realistically upgrades are going to come from SP3 users. I have an SP4 and this would be a very hard to sell upgrade to me.
  • rsynnott 9y ago
    Intel hasn't provided any interesting performance improvements in Kaby Lake; it'll probably be about the same performance as the Pro 4.
• gallerdude 9y ago
  They picked some low-rez pictures to show this off. Check out the picture of all the software being demonstrated. Apple is always really good at showing you a crisp picture of the software side.
• pwaivers 9y ago
  > Surface Pro boasts 50% longer battery life than Surface Pro 4, 2.5x more performance than Surface Pro 3 Why do they compare it to the Surface Pro 3, and not the 4??
  • sbov 9y ago
    Because "1x the performance of a Surface Pro 4" didn't get past the guys in marketing.
    • codinghorror 9y ago
      Well 1.05x but yeah. Truth hurts!
  • tbihl 9y ago
    To get a higher number, no doubt. However, it may be excusable given that many buyers may be coming from SP3.
  • exodust 9y ago
    The new surface pro is not a huge update from SP4 in terms of processing power. SP4 is still in the game, just without the extra pen sensitivity and battery life. That's my guess.
    • 8note 9y ago
      it's also now getting towards time to retire my SP3
• ericfrederich 9y ago
  I would really love one but need to be able to use something on my lap when I'm on the couch. Think I may go for an XPS 13. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e_aSht_ssls https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e_aSht_ssls
  • popcorncolonel 9y ago
    If you're fine with the on-screen keyboard (which is fine for browsing, once you get used to it), flipping the keyboard so the keys are on your lap and the back rest lies on the back of the keycover is pretty good for lap usage.
• kayoone 9y ago
  I love my SP2, but i only use it for note taking in onenote for all my study related stuff and its amazing for that. Syncs to my Windows Desktop and Macbook in a few seconds. The whole note taking experience still has some small issues, but in general it's been a huge boon to my productivity.
• binarycrusader 9y ago
  The biggest note to me seems to be the addition of tilt sensitivity, which will also be available via Windows Update for other surface devices (the footnote is vague on which ones).
• passive 9y ago
  I've been using a Surface Pro 3 as my one-and-only for almost 3 years, and it really feels like time to upgrade, so I've been looking forward to this one. My workload is probably something like 40% reading, 30% writing, 25% coding, and 5% running code, and the Surface has been a nearly ideal form factor for this. The new "Surface Pro" ticks a lot of boxes for me: - Supports my existing keyboard, pen, dock, and power adapter - Improves battery life substantially - Offers improved keyboard and pen for when I get around to it - Fanless options - Improved performance (not that I need much more) Unfortunately, the configurations are weird. My ideal machine is an i5/256GB/16GB. The closest I can get is i7/512GB/16GB, which nearly doubles the cost, and requires a fan. I just don't get how they can make the floor for 16GB RAM $2200. Is there any professional workload where 8GB isn't constricting today, let alone in another 3 years? My only thought here is that maybe the RAM increases the thermal envelope enough to require the fan, but that seems unlikely, and I would still happily make that sacrifice if I didn't have to also pay for the processor and disk upgrades. I'm going to harangue them on Twitter, and also look into clearance SP4s with 16GB.
  • pfooti 9y ago
    what sort of coding do you do on the spro? I'm going to be buying a new laptop / ultraportable / tablet in the near future, and I'm curious about this. Can you comfortably run some kind of linux VM on it? What kind of external keyboard does it support? How does the display hold up in moderate lighting conditions? For a lot of work, I've got a desktop, but I use my 2013 mbp at cafes and such. I mostly do node and frontend work, so while a strict windows dev env is feasible, I prefer linux.
    • passive 9y ago
      Most of what I do is python, but I've done a fair amount of JS, some PHP, Java and others, as needed. I have run VMs on this, but 8GB RAM gets tight, so it's not something I do regularly. I do use Microsofts version of Bash on Ubuntu for things where I am more comfortable with standard linux tools. I use the type cover for almost everything, but I've got a more traditional keyboard hooked up to my dock. The display is excellent. It's glossy, so direct sunlight is problematic, but otherwise it gets plenty bright and looks very good to me, though I suspect my tolerance for colour inaccuracy is pretty high.
• novaleaf 9y ago
  back to naming hell I see. Surface Pro > Surface Pro 4 > Surface Pro 3 etc... Is it bad to have higher numbers in product titles? I don't see a problem with "Surface Pro 5" but maybe "normal" people do?
  • vezycash 9y ago
    I don't mind the name. However, differentiating between versions when buying a surface from a third party site e.g. EBay would become problematic and unnecessarily time consuming.
  • IanDrake 9y ago
    It will probably be identified by date the way many Apple products are. Mac Mini and MB Air and such. When you go to sell it 5 years from now, it will be the 2017 Surface Pro.
• neogodless 9y ago
  These are neat, but expensive. I just ordered a laptop this weekend. * 17.3" 1080p * Core i7 (quad core) * 16GB RAM * Discrete graphics * Backlit keyboard (at no extra charge!) $800 shipped to my door. Only thing I need to do yet is order an M.2 SSD and I'll be happy for the next 4 years. So my heart leaped a little seeing a new Surface announcement, but personally, smaller screens will never work for these tired eyes. That and when I bumped up to 16GB of RAM... I hit $2200. (It's also hard to see which Core i7 they put in these, but I have a sneaking suspicion there's a 'U' in the model name, meaning it's actually dual core. Obviously the laptop I'm getting weighs 3-4 times as much and has a fraction of the battery life. It's a completely different animal. But for me, personally, the Surface will just remain "interesting" until it's portable, powerful AND the pricing is not exorbitant. Then I could see trying to get some work done on it when I'm out and about.
  • JBReefer 9y ago
    That's a really good deal - mind sharing the manufacturer?
    • stagger87 9y ago
      Not the OP, but I had a similar deal with a Lenovo P50 during their black Friday sale, 1k USD for 15" quad core i7, discrete graphics, and 256 SSD. I've never seen the OPs price point except for vendors like Sager.
      • neogodless 9y ago
        15" is usually easier to find deals on. And to get the SSD included. I am spending $100 to get an M.2 Samsung 850 EVO 250GB. I'm willing to do refurbished and previous generation CPU/GPU, which gets me most of the performance for less money. If I was more into gaming, I think the newer Geforce would've mattered more to me. Lenovo Clearance does have a Y700 (17.3" 1080p) with GTX 960, Core i7 quad, 256GB SSD, but only 8GB RAM. Brand new for $799. http://www3.lenovo.com/us/en/laptops/ideapad/ideapad-y700-series/Lenovo-IdeaPad-Y700-17ISK/p/80Q0008WUS http://www3.lenovo.com/us/en/laptops/ideapad/ideapad-y700-se...
• vladimir-y 9y ago
  12.3 screen, no thank you, I'd rather take the new 14" Lenovo X1 Yoga 2nd gen, which also has a 3 USB + 2 TB3 ports (amazing ports set for such a slim form factor).
• usaphp 9y ago
  Laptop that you can't even put on your lap...
  • wmeredith 9y ago
    This also made me chuckle.
  • bussierem 9y ago
    I don't know if you own one or not, but as someone who has owned one for several years now, I can tell you I've NEVER had a problem using mine, with the keyboard, on my lap.
    • trimbo 9y ago
      I've had a couple since the original Surface RT and I have a tough time with it. I really don't use the device anymore because balancing it on my lap became really annoying. It's fantastic on a table though.
• Hasz 9y ago
  I recently purchased a new laptop, after looking through a bunch of options -- Dell, HP, Lenovo, Microsoft, etc. Ultimately, I settled on one from Xiaomi. For $720, I get an i5-6200U, 8gb of DDR4 RAM, 256gb SSD, 1gb dedicated graphics card, a 13.3" panel, aluminum body, backlit keyboard, USB C + HMDI + 2 USB 3.0 ports etc. Build quality is similar to Surfacebook, but I would have to spend another ~600 to match the stats. Is the whole touchscreen tablet combo worth that premium?
  • ehsankia 9y ago
    The issue is, specs often don't tell the whole story. Look at phones for example. The Pixel is still according to a lot of reviewers the best every day phone. You can find other phones with similar specs for half the price, but the hardware/software integration is what really makes a big difference. I'm not saying the extra 600$ is worth it in this case, we'll have to wait for reviews to know that, but generally you're paying for better build quality, integration, support and form factor.
    • Hasz 9y ago
      I only use specs because it's sometimes tricky to describe qualitative things in a way that's easy to compare quickly. I was wondering if the pen/stylus input method really was worth the money over a traditional touchpad+keyboard.
      • createmyaccount 9y ago
        Which model exactly and where did you buy your Xiaomi? Sounds interesting
  • e12e 9y ago
    > Is the whole touchscreen tablet combo worth that premium? I would say it depends. I love the touch screen (I've disabled my touchpad) - and I love the real pen/digitizer. The sp4 is basically the dynabook: high dpi screen, a pen that works. Still some annoyances with scaling in legacy apps - and I've yet to find a great "smart" drawing/cad program that really takes advantage of the pen - I'm thinking something like Ivan Sutherland's "Sketchpad". I haven't quite gotten around to it, but I believe it would make a great Smalltalk companion (although it's a "button" short). It does work quite well with MIT's "scratch" system.
• sixdimensional 9y ago
  One trend I am noticing is that I keep sensing a clear difference between, say, a standard iPad vs. a Surface. A standard iPad feels like a tablet appliance, whereas a Surface is a full-bore laptop in tablet form. Mentally, whenever I hold a Surface, I don't find myself thinking of the kind of experience I expect from the iPad. I realize now there is the iPad Pro, which has more horsepower/keyboard/pen etc., but it still doesn't feel like a full laptop. Does anyone else feel like the iPad experience is more.. I dunno, geared towards casual use and entertainment with the walled garden of apps, and Microsoft really doesn't reach/target the same market (even though they are trying)? EDIT: I guess I am trying to say, something about this market still doesn't feel quite right.. maybe there are still options to innovate.
  • dmix 9y ago
    The primary use-case I'd imagine using with the Surface during the time I'm using it as a tablet is via the web browser. So as long as it has the web browsing UX down in tablet mode then I'd be perfectly happy with a product that switches between tablet vs laptop/desktop mode.
  • romaniv 9y ago
    I had really bad experience with Surface Pro 3 (lots of hardware and software issues), but I have to say this: Microsoft is trying to do the right thing here. There is no reason tablets should be dumb-down media consumption devices when they have computing power equivalent to desktop PCs of a few years ago. But to be used as real computers they must have keyboard and stylus by default and must allow to install arbitrary apps without jailbreaking and hoops. The biggest thing that's dragging Surface down is its UI. Neither classic Windows apps, nor Metro apps are very pleasant to use on the given hardware. I wonder what Alan Kay thinks of Surfaces compared to iPads.
    • freeone3000 9y ago
      Surface Pros run Windows 10, so they have the same UI as other computers. I don't see the problem?
• marricks 9y ago
  Intentionally omitting a USB-C port kind of reveals how petty microsoft is being. Deciding to omit backtracks from a nice universal standard presumably to intentionally hinder Apple who put all there chips in it. Now accessory manufacturers (thumb drives, displays, etc) are forced to support older ports now longer, potentially forever, until MS adopts. Lest we forget, the dream that was USB-C was that we wouldn’t need half a dozen different cords and adapters to connect things, we could just use one port for everything. Sure dongles are slightly worse than cords, but one cord for everything is the best solution. So Mac users need dongles now, but MS is like “fuck that, give people what they immediately want and screw the future”.
  • ocdtrekkie 9y ago
    Most people will have replaced their new Surface Pro long before they actually need a USB Type-C port. Apple chooses to act against it's own customers' interests by rushing to new ports and requiring they buy all new hardware. This will be the third generation of Surface Pro that does not require any new accessories. If I end up buying the new one (which I might for the built-in LTE), I won't have to buy a new type cover, pen, dock, or spare chargers. Everything is compatible. In my car I keep a Mini-DP video adapter, a portable DVD-RW drive, and an Ethernet adapter, all are USB Type-A, and all would still work with the new Surface Pro. Consider how much loathing I hear from Mac fans about Apple taking away MagSafe. Why would Microsoft do that to their Surface customers? This is Microsoft making a pro-consumer decision.
    • marricks 9y ago
      Heck man, I didn’t say take away anything, just add USB-C. Perhaps take away a USB 3 port for it or something. They’re now making a stink about “People who love USB-C love dongles. so we have a dongle for you” so it seems like they’re going after the standard intentionally for short term gains.
      • ocdtrekkie 9y ago
        ...It only has one USB 3 port. The one everyone uses. The dongle method makes sense. People using USB-C right now, are indeed pretty used to dongles. And by offering a SurfaceConnect to USB-C dongle, they'll let you use your USB-C charger... while still having the full benefits of a magnetic charging port that won't yank your tablet off the desk if someone trips over the cable.
• mrfrasha 9y ago
  I honestly wish Microsoft would have have just loaded their surface with USB c ports. I guess there is always next gen :/
• devereaux 9y ago
  The keyboard looks bad. I don't want the oversized left and right arrows. I want pageup and pagedown there instead. The XPS 13 2-in-1 is better for me if only for this reason. The XPS also comes with a pen, USB-C, and a decent hardware configuration like 16Gb of ram because we are in 2017!!! I just wish I could get QHD+ screen. No option on dell.com, while I see that on https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01N5MV7YA https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01N5MV7YA so it must exist somewhere. I also have been told that it may be possible to get a trackpoint on similar models that share the chassis - but no touchscreen then. Oh, and there is no LTE in any case. I guess I will have to wait for 2018 to at least get the QHD+ option.
  • e12e 9y ago
    IMHO the sp4 keyboard is among the best you can get on a portable device today. I like the old thinkpads better - but other than that I prefer the sp4 to Apple, lenovo or dell keyboards I've tried. Came as a surprise to me.
  • gbl08ma 9y ago
    I own a Surface Pro 3 with the SP4 type cover (i.e. the version before the one that just came out and which is basically the same). I thought I'd miss all the keys from my laptop and desktop keyboards. Turns out, there are lots of hidden shortcuts. I got used to doing Fn+Arrows for Home/End/PageUp/PageDown and now I wish I could use that on other keyboards too. To me it's easier than having to reach for those keys when they are to the right or to the top of the keyboard, so much that I think I type a bit faster on the type cover, as long as I'm properly seated and the keyboard is on a solid surface (e.g. a desk). I find the keyboard very good (the right menu key is a bit useless, but you can remap that using many methods) and the touchpad is the best I've used too, although it's probably not as good as the ones in Macbooks. If the keyboard is the only thing holding you back, rethink it. You should be more worried about the price and the kickstand which is not a problem for me but might be for you, especially if your legs are short and you intend on using it on your lap a lot.
    • devereaux 9y ago
      The keyboard is holding me up. I have shortcuts mapped to the keys above the left and right arrow. I use them extensively to navigate between desktop and tabs. A few years ago I read about using such shortcuts and now they are deeply ingrained into my workflow. I don't think I could do without them, and they are one of the only reason I'm considering the XPS: a proper keyboard. FYI, by default these 2 keys go to the next tab, when using the shift key right above: they go to next desktop, using the control or menu key right next to them they reorder the tabs, etc.) For the tool I use everyday, price is not the problem. However, a bad keyboard is.
• smnplk 9y ago
  Anyone bought the new Lenovo X270 yet ?
• jpkeisala 9y ago
  Is this locked to install apps from Windows Store only?
  • Azerb 9y ago
    No, that was only Surface Laptop - this is full Windows 10 Pro based on the pre-order page.
    • bhauer 9y ago
      And to be clear, the Surface Laptop can be upgraded to Windows 10 Pro as well. Eventually that will be a $50 upgrade, but for the first year after launch, it will be a free upgrade.
    • popcorncolonel 9y ago
      Interesting that the more laptop-y (and more expensive!) device is the more restricted one than the tablet.
• rbanffy 9y ago
  People are pushing this as a MacBook killer but it's more like an iPad Pro killer. With the same 4GB of RAM, a Core m3 and 128 GB of storage, it costs $100 less than the iPad Pro with the same RAM and storage (but an ARM processor). The m3 here makes a good difference. For the same as the 8GB i5 with 256 GB, you get a MacBook with a Core m and the built-in keyboard. It's slower than the i5, but it's an actual laptop.
• rbanffy 9y ago
  How easy is it to remove Windows and install Fedora 25 or Ubuntu 17.04?
• ghrifter 9y ago
  Nothing like confusing naming/branding than having a new product called "Surface Pro" when the Surface Pro 4 was released a few year(s) ago. > Xbox > Xbox 360 > back to "Xbox One" Microsoft sure has weird naming tendencies,.
  • komali2 9y ago
    Angular Angular 2 Angular Facebook Facebook Messenger Messenger Not to mention... google play store vs play store vs google play music vs google books vs Inbox vs gmail vs Google docs vs Google Drive (wtf is even the difference between these two?) I want to mock but then I recall every naming meeting we've ever had at my company and I totally get it
• joemi 9y ago
  Can you actually use this "laptop" on your lap? Doesn't the fact that it has a kickstand make it extremely awkward, if not impossible? I have not tried one like that myself, so I honestly don't know, but I'd be very surprised if it worked on one's lap.
  • bobbles 9y ago
    I have SP4 - despite many other issues I have with it, the kickstand DOES make it great to use on a lap. In fact I find it much easier to use on my lap than any laptop that I have used. Being able to adjust to any angle means you can use it just as comfortably in an airport chair vs on a lounge etc.
    • joemi 9y ago
      I don't get how the kickstand could actually make it easier to use than a normal laptop. Can't you adjust the angle on any laptop?
  • MatmaRex 9y ago
    I have a Surface 3 and it's doable. Mind that the device is also a bit smaller than the usual laptop, so there's enough space (on my knees at least) to place the kickstand.
  • Clubber 9y ago
    I've never used one, but I suspect one of the benefits is with the CPU on the screen side, you don't get bacon legs like you would with a traditional laptop.
• mirekrusin 9y ago
  Nice, but... have they hired people who left apple to make this website?
  • ramanujank 9y ago
    Ha! I wish I could upvote this all the way to the top!
• komali2 9y ago
  SP3 user for ~3 years. Usecases: Web Dev in node/javascript/HTML/CSS, now using WSL. Notetaking in onenote + surface pen for general journaling, notes at meetups, notes from MOOCs, notes from self-language-study. Vague low-power gaming sometimes. Adobe Lightroom photo editing. Issues: Onenote is absolute fucking garbage at syncing. It is absolutely unusable when offline. It will throw unskippable error dialogs about being unable to sync when offline, meaning I can't use it to write or take notes at all unless I tether. It is so useful in all the above usecases, with no competitor, that I have subjected myself to just getting my tether on my phone ready when I'm out and about and needing to use onenote. However, it is frustrating to the extreme. Anybody here at Microsoft care to comment on this actually being addressed? Syncing and offline issues have been a "top priority" for the onenote team since 2014 according to the flares of investigating I do occasionally.
  • mel919 9y ago
    I hear you. OneNote uses OneDrive which is a huge mess itself. Sync to Dropbox would help so much... there's even ticket for that on their uservoice. OneNote also sucks massively at searching in notes...
    • rainbowmverse 9y ago
      My #1 gripe about OneNote is that it can't be moved to the SD card on Android. It's manageable since you can decide which notebooks to keep on the device, but still annoying.
• calsy 9y ago
  Why are kickstand hybrid laptops a thing? Its the combination of an over-sized tablet that you find impossible to hold and touch type on comfortably at the same time because 'TOUCH ON EVERYTHING', mixed with the idea the family photo frame sitting on your desk would make a great workstation if I just added a detachable keyboard. Lame!!!
• make3 9y ago
  Do people still use these¹ cameras seriously, or is Microsoft trying to out hipster Apple? [1] : https://c.s-microsoft.com/en-us/CMSImages/Surface_J_Overview_HighlightFeature_V1.png.jpg?version=13555b4d-c642-8dbb-e1af-83661faadf0a https://c.s-microsoft.com/en-us/CMSImages/Surface_J_Overview...
  • hug 9y ago
    Of course they do. Just like people still use vinyl, drive restored 1930s cars, collect antique furniture, and watch black-and-white silent films. There is a certain cachet to old technology.
  • ahakki 9y ago
    Yes, it is very rare as it is highly expensive. These cameras use film sheets with a size of 4x5 or 8x10 inches (depending on how you process the film and scan it the total might be in the hundreds of dollars per image). The image quality however is unmatched by any digital equipment. Scanning back solutions also exist (basically a scanner that you can attach to the camera) . These cost thousands of dollars each and may take a few minutes per image. You cannot use them for moving subjects. [1] These factors make cameras like this a very rare sight indeed. [0] http://www.dannyburk.com/drum_scanning.htm http://www.dannyburk.com/drum_scanning.htm [1] http://www.betterlight.com/products4X5.html http://www.betterlight.com/products4X5.html
• faragon 9y ago
  Current Windows logo in the tablet is ugly. The old with colors was nicer, in my opinion.
• faragon 9y ago
  799 USD for 4GB RAM, 128GB of flash, and an "Intel Core m3"? Come on. I understand that the Intel CPU is almost 300 USD per unit, and that pushes the price. I hope that Snapdragon SoCs running Windows 10 with emulation for x86 stuff drive down Windows 10 tablet/laptop prices dramatically. BTW, despite being expensive, the new Surface Pro looks great. In my opinion, Intel is playing Serguéi Bubka's technique: because there is no enough competition, they go as slow as possible in the mobile market, just matching the performance of the second competitor.
• hnjp 9y ago
  I have used Surface pro 1, and I got too many problems such as keyboard's key is broken which I had to buy a new keyboard twice. The surface is totally freezed when I connected keyboard to it. I again convinced myself that the Surface pro 3 is better so I bought it. Wow, some problems are: - The top right of backside is extremely hot when I watch youtube. - Again, the Alt btn of the surface pro 3 keyboard is broken. - batter length is not as advertised. Therefore, I wont never buy a new surface even if it is cheaper than macbook pro. I am saving money to buy a new macbook pro.
• patrickg_zill 9y ago
  I am pretty sure that the view camera in the picture on their home page is no more a USB 2.0 device rather than USB-C, XD
• locusm 9y ago
  4GB of memory for the $999 i5 model is so 2005. I cant think of a single client that could operate with those specs.
• AzzieElbab 9y ago
  If only it did not run Windows
• downandout 9y ago
  Their pricing structure floors me. On the i7 models, you pay $1100 more for 750GB of extra SSD space and 8GB of extra RAM over the entry level i7 model. That is ridiculous. With that kind of premium to protect, they'll also make it nearly impossible to manually upgrade/replace the RAM and SSD, which makes buying one of these things a pretty bad decision.
  • JTenerife 9y ago
    Agreed, but how's that different to what the competition is doing? 16GB RAM starts at 2199 $US. That indeed quite off-putting for something that should replace my laptop.
    • downandout 9y ago
      I'd argue that iPad Pro isn't really competition for the Surface Pro. It's a tablet; the Surface Pro is a full-fledged PC. I would absolutely buy one because I love the weight and form factor, but I'd need at least 16GB of RAM, and I just won't pay an $1100 idiot tax for the top of the line model. I'll watch to see what iFixIt says about soldered RAM etc., but I'm not hopeful.
• willj 9y ago
  I made an account just to provide some balance to the glowing reviews about the Surface Pros, and to see if I'm the only one here that feels this way. I own a Surface Pro 3. I want to like it but a few things ruined it for me. TL;DR: Unless they redesign the charger and make the touchscreen resilient to cracks, I won't be buying another Surface in the future. Complaint #1: Am I the only one here super frustrated by the design of the SP3's (and SP4's) charger? Specifically, the magsafe-like plug. It frays right where the cord meets the plastic plug and short-circuits. You can actually see the spark inside the plastic piece that connects to the computer, and the LED indicating it's connected to power will flicker on and off. I've owned two cables now (the original and the replacement I got for this issue) and it's happened on both. There's a thread here about this: http://www.surfaceforums.net/threads/power-cable-fraying.10845/ http://www.surfaceforums.net/threads/power-cable-fraying.108... The result is I have to be very careful when it's plugged in, because if I move and shift the cable, it might short-out and the computer shuts off (and it resets my Surface's time, too). Also, annoyingly, sometimes the LED in the plastic magsafe plug indicates it's connected to power, but when I connect it to the Surface the Surface says "plugged in, NOT charging" (emphasis mine). Microsoft recalled the power cords due to the AC power plug, but not the magsafe connector. So when I contacted Microsoft about the recall, they sent me the part that plugs to the wall, which was not the problem. I've tried reinforcing the connection with electrical tape, and that helps to a very limited extent. Complaint #2: A month into owning the SP3 I dropped it and the screen cracked. This broke the touch screen (the Surface thinks I'm repeatedly tapping where the screen is cracked.) I had to disable the touchscreen drivers to make the Surface usable, so now the tablet functionality is all gone, which is a bummer because I bought it in part for reading and videos. And, even with the drivers disabled, when the computer boots up from power off, it often waits indefinitely at the screen with the word "Surface" unless I "massage" the area where the screen is cracked. This behavior (and recommendation to massage the screen) is documented in this reddit thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/Surface/comments/4vmimv/surface_pro_3_i7_256_gets_stuck_on_surface_logo/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Surface/comments/4vmimv/surface_pro.... Dropping it was my mistake, but I wish the Surface's touchscreen was more resilient/better able to handle cracks. iPads and iPhones seem much better off in this respect. Complaint #3: Occasionally, the Surface will turn itself back on when I've pressed the power button to turn it off. The result is I'll come back to use the Surface later and the battery will be totally dead. I'm 85% sure that it's not me hitting the power button to turn it back on, especially because my power settings are such that, if it's sitting idle for 5 minutes, it should go to sleep. I really like the Surface in a lot of ways, but the issue with the power cable and the fragility of the touchscreen make me unlikely to buy another Surface, and make me hesitate about recommending a Surface to a friend.
• martijn_himself 9y ago
  As a side-note: if you are selling premium devices with these mark ups and charging extra for essential accessories (a keyboard) you better have premium physical stores where I can try them out. I'm in the UK and PC World does not count: they will most likely not know the difference between this and a Surface Pro 4.
• dayaz36 9y ago
  Can Microsoft stop making laptop/tablet hybrids please?
  • gjm11 9y ago
    Why should they? How would that benefit anyone?
• WhiteOwlLion 9y ago
  At $899 USD, there are a lot of options besides the Surface Pro. Our organization will buy it though because they take a corporate approach to purchasing and they always buy warranties. I never understand that... but whatever. Just buy 10 more Surface Pro and swap 'em out if want "warranty". Still cheaper that way.