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Pandora is laying off 7% of its US workforce
- pinaceae 10y agoArticle talks about Apple Music and Spotify - but I think they're is a bigger problem: Amazon Prime Music. Bezos is killing the streaming space with 'good enough' services all bundled into the same, basic Prime subscription. The Prime Music app on iOS got updated last year and it even looks great. Streaming music is a commodity, good luck fighting for scraps.
- charlesdm 10y agoSo is video. Netflix shareholders haven't realised that yet though, so they're still buying more shares at 350 times annual earnings.
- fooey 10y agoNetflix has been pivoting away from being just a video streaming service for a while, that's why they've been working so hard on their original content.
- throwaway91111 10y agoYup. Today the main reason to pay for Netflix is the content, lack of ads, and universal device support.
- ra1n85 10y agoUse Amazon Prime, but they'll need to deliver a bigger catalog and better recommendation feature for me to try Prime Music. I have hundreds of songs saved in Spotify playlists, love the selection, as well as the recommendation feature (Discover) - Spotify is sticky for me.
- toomuchtodo 10y agoTotally. I pay the $15/month for Spotify family (up to six people); I have Amazon Prime and I've never once used a Prime digital service.
- Cyph0n 10y agoPrime Video is very good by the way. Their original series catalog is expanding, but they also have other great shows available. For instance, you can stream lots of popular HBO classics for free (Curb, The Wire, etc.). Oh, and the video player is excellent. The "X-Ray" feature is pretty nifty when it's done well: it lists on-screen actors, name of music playing, and general trivia. The Prime Video Android app is surprisingly smooth as well, and in my opinion is as good as the Netflix app. For me, it's essentially a free video service, as I already need Prime for the free shipping.
- ascagnel_ 10y agoMy problem with Prime Video is that Amazon is that there's no good way to watch it on your TV, unless you feel like buying their own streaming boxes. They refuse to release an app for Apple TV or Android TV, the Roku channel is merely serviceable (like all Roku channels), and the PS4 and Xbox One apps don't work as expected (for example, the Xbox One app doesn't respond to the official hardware remote's play/puase button). The experience on their own hardware is great; everything else is second-class.
- marpstar 10y agoSame goes for Prime Video. Almost nothing I like to watch, though some HBO shows are (were?) available as part of Prime for awhile, which was nice. Beyond that, I find their catalog to be quite lacking in comparison to HBO Now and Netflix.
- stuckagain 10y agoThe entire HBO back catalog is free on Prime. Prime has a somewhat limited selection but Amazon Instant Video in general is excellent. If you think of it as pay per view you'll be a lot happier. I for one do not mind shelling out a few bucks for a movie.
- dubin 10y agoAnd the Echo is for many people the perfect and most convenient way to listen to music in the home.
- wagecuck 10y agoThe perfect way to listen and be listened to!
- pgrote 10y agoI just received my pandora one subscription renewal notice and it is due on Sunday. I've thought about it and the only reason I would stay with Pandora is that I have trained it to play music I like. When I turn on my station, I know I'll hear music I want to work to. With that said ... Today was the first time I've listened to pandora in close to a month. I've been listening to playlists through Prime Music .. the free version. I listen through our echos, my phone and my desktop. I haven't missed the tailored station I've built through Pandora over 10+ years. I think you are correct with "good enough." Oh, and the Pandora Premium doesn't sound like much of a game changer unless I missed a killer feature: http://blog.pandora.com/us/coming-soon-pandora-premium/ http://blog.pandora.com/us/coming-soon-pandora-premium/
- pducks32 10y agoAmazon is killing it. Bezos works there just like hundreds of other talented and hardworking people.
- nickdavidhaynes 10y agoOthers have made similar points, but I think it bears repeating - Prime is (currently) a clearly inferior offering for music and video. In both cases, their selection isn't even close to their competitors and the UI/UX are so completely fucked that they're unusable a good percentage of the times I try to access them. I agree that streaming media is becoming a commodity. If Amazon made modern apps and shelled out some cash for better libraries, they could deal serious blows to Spotify and Netflix.
- barney54 10y agoI agree about music, but completely disagree about video. We watch Amazon Video 10 to 1 compared to Netflix. Amazon's selection works for us.
- dublinben 10y agoI think it's a significant dark pattern how they include paid rentals in the interface for Prime video. If you're already a paying streaming customer, why should you be presented with videos you don't have access to, unless you pay even more?
- ghaff 10y ago>Prime is (currently) a clearly inferior offering for music and video Yes, but for a very casual streaming music listener like myself who also has a pretty big music library on iTunes, free (with Prime) + Echo makes paying for any other music streaming service just not worth it. I'll take my free streaming and buy a song or album every now and then with the savings. Amazon is somewhat inferior to Netflix in streaming. I have both in this case. But there are Amazon exclusives as well plus again, for many people, what's available with Prime is good enough to not make it worth paying for Netflix.
- matwood 10y agoI have tried to use the Prime music service in the past, and the catalog was always terrible. Maybe I'll check again.
- massysett 10y agoThe way to use it is for preprogrammed playlists. If you want some Christmas music or jazz music or classical for the background, they've got something, with no commercials. Or you might use the playlist to discover a thing or two. It's worthless for finding a specific piece of music on demand. I would never pay for Prime Music on its own but it's a nice throw-in. I can also see why it would be good to have with an Amazon Echo.
- matwood 10y agoYeah, I already have Google Music and have looked at Prime music as a replacement so I could save the $8/month.
- throwaway91111 10y agoiTunes has match and local music; Spotify allows playing local music. What is the amazon story for combining previously owned music with streaming music?
- weavie 10y agoI'd say a bigger one is Youtube. You'd be hard pressed to find a track that isn't an Youtube. In addition there are plenty of live sets and DJ mixes. I don't find the ads too intrusive. It works well enough.
- kalleboo 10y agoWhenever I'm at a party and people are putting on their own music... it's YouTube
- gtirloni 10y agoSo about ~150 people (Wikipedia says they have 2200+ employees).
- Dylan16807 10y agoWow. What do all those people do? What's the difference between a 100 employee music streamer and a 2000 employee music streamer?
- freddyc 10y agoPandora acquired Ticketfly and The Next Big Sound a couple of years back so they're not just a music streaming company. I still can't tell you what they all do though!
- miguelrochefort 10y agoThey acquired Rdio as well.
- charlesdm 10y agoNo clue. But the answer to your question is being a public company. Market participants generally expect publicly traded companies (above a certain market cap) to have lots of employees.
- Altay- 10y agoHuh? I never heard that being a thing. If anything, investors tend to reward lowering head count.
- hkmurakami 10y agoThey seem to have a decent number of partnerships going on. My Mazda dashboard has Pandora integration built in.
- kaspm 10y agoI would like to know this too! Say my team has 40 people on it. Every month at least, someone asks what do "40 people do?" and I take them through it 2-4 people at a time across several lines of business maintaining and improving lots of software. Would be amazing to see some people break down their teams publicly!
- pokemon-trainer 10y agoMy wife listens to and enjoys Pandora daily. She especially enjoys the curated playlists put together by Pandora. I remember the gimmick at launch had the system build playlists for you based on your preferences. It's interesting to see how the service has pivoted to provide a more radio station-like experience. What other services do folks enjoy? What's the best streaming service out today?
- arebop 10y agoI understand the licensing deals with record companies set much lower prices for radio-station-like ux compared to on-demand ux. ML-built playlists aren't necessarily ideally equivalent to the playlist you'd make yourself with infinite time and patience, but... I wonder if licensing terms influenced the pivot.
- pokemon-trainer 10y agoI'm not sure how much ML applies to Pandora. They apply a list of characteristics to music, which is done manually, and select music with similar characteristics. Their algorithm seems to favor music is cheap to play from an unknown artist and small label.
- nitrogen 10y agoTheir algorithm seems to favor music is cheap to play from an unknown artist and small label. One exception I noticed a couple of years back is that Pandora started playing Mumford and Sons on pretty much all of my stations. I like their music, but it is definitely not dubstep, so something fishy was definitely going on. That year M&S was Pandora's highest paid artist.
- kevin_thibedeau 10y agoPayola 2.0
- rjp0008 10y ago
- sytelus 10y agoI really think Pandora should start full on-demand music service for additional subscription fee instead of just being radio. Playlist creation and sharing is becoming huge but still in fancy from tech perspective. Lot of people are stuck on particular service just because of their carefully created playlists over long time. That generates significant sticky factor. I've personally paid Rhapsody subscription for couple of years without much using it just to keep my playlists alive. This in addition can massively help improve radio itself. Also it can eliminate all that nonsense of not allowing to skip unlimited number of tracks. In my opinion, Pandora still has best of the best radio service (although far from perfect) and if they can supplement that with huge catelogues like Google Music with family subscription, there would be one more reason to stay there.
- jmtulloss 10y agohttps://www.google.com/amp/blog.pandora.com/us/coming-soon-pandora-premium/amp/ https://www.google.com/amp/blog.pandora.com/us/coming-soon-p...
- JonathonW 10y agoDirect link: http://blog.pandora.com/us/coming-soon-pandora-premium/ http://blog.pandora.com/us/coming-soon-pandora-premium/
- vlunkr 10y agoBut that would make them just like Spotify, and several other services. I think it would be hard to compete that way. And I have nothing to confirm this, but I doubt preserving playlists is a common reason to keep paying for a music service. If you really want it, you can find a way to export it, or copy it by hand. Otherwise you just make a new playlist from scratch.
- robzyb 10y ago> But that would make them just like Spotify, and several other services. I think it would be hard to compete that way. Its even harder to compete if your product is crappy... which is essentially what the OP was suggesting. > If you really want it, you can find a way to export it, or copy it by hand. The thing is that most people don't really want it. Therefore it is significantly harder to move to Pandora than it is to leave Pandora.
- edblarney 10y agoMusic streaming/distribution has to be a heavily commoditized business. Moreover, even the music itself is heavily commoditized, it's hard to eke out a living unless you build a major brand, or can 'roll your own' fanbase. I don't even understand how Spotify can stay in business in the long run with competitive margin erosion. Perhaps when the industry shakes out, the major streamers will have some value chain power and hold onto their margins. In the meantime, I'm weary of Spotify's valuation as long term credible.
- stuckagain 10y agoSucks because it's practically the only tech company in Oakland.
- throwaway91111 10y agoYup. I was literally just about to apply this month to make my commute sane....
- notte 10y agoNot exactly. Ask.com is in Oakland! Makes my date everytime I see the logo on that high rise off of 880.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- jkodumal 10y agoThere's VSCO, Fluid, Roofstock, LaunchDarkly, and Uber coming soon. There's probably a few more great companies that I'm forgetting.
- SystemOut 10y agoUber is also moving into the old Sears building that's a few blocks from Pandora's offices
- cobbzilla 10y agoa shameless plug for the coworking space my company uses, the Port Workspaces [1]. there are a ton of startups in here; tech, nonprofits & more. it's a huge, awesome, quirky space (used to be a mall years ago), just around the corner from Pandora, easily walkable from Bart, close to the lake & uptown/nightlife. [1] http://portworkspaces.com http://portworkspaces.com
- bleachedsleet 10y agoThis is such a non-issue for many users, but the simple fact that Pandora requires flash on their web interface is a deal breaker for me.
- burkaman 10y agoThey switched to HTML5 like 5 years ago.
- mey 10y agoIf they did, they don't provide any good ways to enable it or cleanly fall back from Flash on Windows.
- selectodude 10y agoPandora asks me to install Flash on Safari 10.
- cmelone 10y agoChange your user agent to Firefox and it should load the HTML5 version
- bleachedsleet 10y agoA well designed website shouldn't require a user agent change to get added functionality. If I have to mess with my user agent, install resource heavy plugins or change my browser of choice to use your service, then you just lost me as a customer.
- frozenport 10y agoSafari is the new IE
- FireBeyond 10y ago
- runj__ 10y agoI remember emailing Pandora in what must have been 2008 realizing about the fact that I could not use the service from Sweden (I had been a foreign exchange student in high school in the US). I got a reply from Tim Westergren which felt huge. I would not be as much into 80's synth pop without Pandora, that's for sure.
- grogenaut 10y agoI've told this before but I haven't used pandora since they wouldn't stop playing me ashley madison ads even after I complained to support about it. They said they only played ads that network tv would run. Every other ad for 6 months was asking me to cheat on my wife. We all know how that went.
- nradov 10y agoYou know you can eliminate the ads for $3 a month, right? It's pretty cheap compared to the other streaming services.
- withdavidli 10y agoYou're likely talking to the wrong user base. There's a reason why ads business models work, people rather deal with ads than pay anything. Though your suggestion would solve one set of problems, it doesn't solve the fact that it was an inappropriate ad with a crappy response from the company if true. Guess network tv allowed, includes those 2am ads.
- grogenaut 10y agoI guess. We actually talked on the phone. When the lady said that to me I said, "Are you seriously trying to make that claim." Silence. Then she made some non-apology and ended the call.
- grogenaut 10y agoYou know this was not yesterday but in 2010 right? IIRC it was like 70$ for premium. You know the radio and their competitors were free back then right, and the radio had less ads? I had actually paid previously but they screwed up my account a few times, I forget the details. Now I get prime music with my prime account and a bunch of other stuff including video for $9 a month. I thought it was pretty dumb to pay for a service where I couldn't pick what I wanted to hear. I also didn't play for XM at $10 a month when it came out.
- 10y ago
- chefandy 10y agoFunny. Just saw a medium article where some talking head from Pandora was giving patronizing advice about how to fire people.
- yeukhon 10y agoI miss turntable.fm. If only Spotify / Pandora has it, then I am a happier customer.
- fourthark 10y agoLast.fm was the only one that worked for me. Musical preference is a perfect social recommendation problem. Pandora's supposedly socially-neutral algorithms always circled in on tighter and tighter loops of bland. This was a bunch of years ago. Maybe they fixed it.
- pmlnr 10y agoSpotify is lightyears from Last.fm both in personal recommendation and album/artist/track radios. I really miss last.fm :(
- probably_wrong 10y agoMaybe now they'll finally consider expanding to Europe? I don't know if their own hype is true, but I always wanted to try their music recommendation service. It used to be that you could at least play with it (get similar song titles, even if you couldn't listen to them), but now I can't even see the main page.
- disiplus 10y agohave you tried last.fm. i loved the service before they where bought by cbs, i used it to stream music, the playlist created where great and i could discover new music. now with spotify its the same songs or artists all the time.
- probably_wrong 10y agolast.fm and Spotify both have the same problem: Let's say I like this one song from a Chilean singer. Not that album, not that singer, just that one specific song. What both systems do is recommend "here is all of South America's music, and here are all Chilean singers from that decade". Did you pick a Chilean rock song from the late 80's? Here's a Peruvian Charango song from the early '90s. They don't know anything about the songs themselves, only their network effect. Pandora's "Music Genome Project" was supposedly designed around this issue, but I can't say whether it actually works or not.
- disiplus 10y agosorry i did not have that feeling with last.fm, i had the premium feature of last.fm ( before they removed it ) so you could not request a song but you could play a playlist based on tags or artists ( if i remember it correctly ) the suggestions where great, i loved that feature. i still scrobble from my desktop to last.fm and im in 98 percentile of all users. i listen to a lot of music and with spotify i get the felling its always the same , it cannot learn my preference so i have to manually search for playlists that im ok with. i would say i listen to deep house mostly, but there is also rock, and hip hop, but i get only the latest edm tracks in my recommendation playlist in spotify, with lastfm i would get indie rock and hip hop artists.
- rm2889 10y agoAfter I discovered Pandora back in 2010, I haven't looked back. While it lacks ability to play a song on demand, where it truly outshines are its recommendations. Maybe its the nature of their recommendation algorithm - they call it the music genome project; a content based recommendation ending using very finely refined categorizations as opposed to the methodologies most other recommenders follow - a mix of collaborative filtering and content-based, but not as detailed on creating categories that a song can fall into. I know I'm sounding like such a fanboy but I discovered some of my favorite bands and artists after hearing them first through Pandora's recommendations. I've often heard songs I liked at random places, shazammed them, and created a channel on Pandora, which has led to some really good artists that I would've never heard through other media. So for music discovery, Pandora is where its at. I really hope this company sticks around.
- nixy 10y agoI haven't used Pandora in a long time, but I have to say that everything you mention can be applied to my experience of Spotify's discovery/radio features as well. Plus it handles playing songs on-demand.
- josteink 10y agoSame can be said for Google Play All Access. And you can fill the gaps in their catalog by uploading your own music. Tldr: I really don't see the case for pandora in 2017.
- gtaylor 10y agoI like and use Play Music, but find their recommendation engine to be less great. The channels work a bit differently, too.
- cschmittiey 10y agoOddly enough I love GP's recommendation set so much more than Pandora's. It's so much better attuned to what I like and don't and what I like to explore. It's very good at distinguishing what I like and what I don't, and I'm pretty picky about what I listen to.
- new_hackers 10y agoI am also a Pandora fanboy. I pay for their ad-free service. I have heard more "new to me" music through Pandora than any other source, and for that I am truly grateful.
- ossmaster 10y agoFunny this comes right after they released a brand new app, after they had the same old web app for more than 4 years it seemed.