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Samsung's smart TVs are inserting unwanted ads into users' own movies

265 points by lukashed 12y ago

juliangregorian 12y ago
And this on top of spying on all your conversations? Sheesh, what kind of world are we inventing for ourselves.
- aluhut 12y ago
  We don't know. But we'll find out! We have algorithms for that.
vidarh 12y ago
The whole voice recognition thing seemed to me to be an unfair storm in a teacup to me, but this.... This is beyond ridiculous. My next TV will not be a Samsung, whether they fix this or not.
- galonk 12y ago
  How much you want to bet the average "smart" TV will start popping up "network error" dialog boxes every minute in that situation?
  - Too 12y ago
    Oh this is the worst part, i could once not start my viasat-app on smart-tv because samsungs, not viasats, servers were down. The workaround was to reconfigure the dns to point samsung to a local server that just said "im alive" and then i could start my apps and use them without any problems. T_T
- Ysx 12y ago
  My next anything won't be a Samsung, now.
gadders 12y ago
I am running out of curse words to describe the people that make these decisions.
- wadcd 12y ago
  The ones designing such products or the ones buying them?
ourmandave 12y ago
They're not unwanted ads until you tell Samsung and Yahoo they're unwanted. And that convenient opt out is only 5,000 clicks through a maze of twisty passages away. I'd bet the pop-up confirmation box on the opt-out has a Pepsi ad on it.
- cauterized 12y ago
  Is there such a things as a wanted ad?
  - rblatz 12y ago
    Lots of people watch the Super Bowl for the ads.
    - jbob2000 12y ago
      Only because they're unique and don't get repeated for months on end. If you could show me a unique ad every time, I might be ok with it. But in general, I see the same shit day in and day out and that's what's annoying about it.
    - michaelt 12y ago
      I'll believe there are "wanted ads" when Samsung and Yahoo set the ads to off by default and let customers opt in.
  - jpindar 12y ago
    Yes, I like seeing ads for upcoming shows that I otherwise would not have known about. They should only be between shows or when using the guide or menus, though.
  - asavadatti 12y ago
    I actually watch some of the ads on YouTube Channels that I like (Provided the ads are moderately interesting). It is a small sacrifice to pay to get content that I like for free.
  - tomjen3 12y ago
jsilence 12y ago
It is easy to opt-out of buying Samsung smart TVs.
- tedunangst 12y ago
  From the sound of it, the ads only appear when using smart TV apps? So you could still use a "smart" TV but with normal inputs.
  - blumkvist 12y ago
    Or just don't buy TVs from these creeps!
  - toxican 12y ago
    Then why not just save yourself some money and get a "dumb" TV? I can only imagine they jack the price up a hundred or two for the "smart"
    - pjc50 12y ago
      Soon it may be more expensive to buy a dumb TV than a smart TV, if the manufacturer is counting on ad revenue.
    - jfb 12y ago
      Because the panels are commodities and market pressures are such that "Smart" TV features are the battleground that the manufacturers are trying to differentiate on. You can get a reference monitor, which will be the same panel as a $800 Smart TV for $4k.
      - jfb 12y ago
        I am considering [1] replacing my last TV (a 50" Panasonic reference plasma) with another reference monitor, but sadly plasma is no longer an option, unless I strike right. this. very. second. [1] http://homonculus.net/2015/01/27/so_i_may_have_to_buy_a_new_tv.html http://homonculus.net/2015/01/27/so_i_may_have_to_buy_a_new_...
_lce0 12y ago
that's why I bought a dumb-tv. we need to go dumb-everything: phone, tv, computer, car..
Fundlab 12y ago
Personally a dumb tv/roku/media server has been my go to choice. This whole smartTV hype is still beyond me. Could someone please touch on the advantages of a smart TV offerings over my setup?
- daigoba66 12y ago
  Some people like the concept of having fewer boxes to plug in. That means fewer cords, fewer remotes, etc. Personally I would love to have a TV running a decent OS (as long as it still boots instantly). Unfortunately TV manufactures do such a shitty job with the software. Both in terms of quality/performance/usability, and now with privacy issues and injected ads.
  - delecti 12y ago
    Exactly. If it was an option to get a smart tv that was actually competent then it wouldn't be such an easy decision to avoid them like the plague. Though even then, I'm always going to have devices plugged into my TV. A combination of my PS3 and PC can access any of the content I might want to watch.
  - tomjen3 12y ago
    I used to agree with you, kinda regretted I brought a dumb tv. Then I got a Chrome cast. Plug and go, no remotes (you use your phone or tablet) the ugly wires are hidden behind the tv.
- FreakyT 12y ago
  I think main purpose of a Smart TV is to act as a single-device solution for people who don't already have a Roku/Chromecast/whatever.
  - spiritplumber 12y ago
    Good, some more high profile fiascos like this, and people will understand that it's best when they control what's wired up to what.
- 12y ago
rathish_g 12y ago
It clearly says... SMART TV
Sharlin 12y ago
So... do smart TVs actually have a single feature that's actually useful to the consumer?
- jon-wood 12y ago
  The only "Smart" feature I use on mine is Amazon Prime Video, and that's just because Amazon are too damn stubborn to support Chromecast streaming. The app on the TV is slow, clunky, and occasionally decides it doesn't feel like playing any video today.
- alistairSH 12y ago
  Not really. Dad installed smart TVs in his beach house (he figured it was easier than wiring up DVD players and Rokus in 10 rooms). While the apps do work, they are slow, clunky, and the UX is never as good as that which is delivered on dedicated streaming devices. The configuration is always buried, so switching accounts is an exercise in futility. So, he just leaves his Roku account signed in and deals with the clutter in his personal watch list.
- vpeters25 12y ago
  At least in my case the apps for Netflix and Amazon get a lot of use. Netflix support was one of the key features I wanted when purchasing my current SmartTV.
- gutnor 12y ago
  Soon they will be cheaper than their non-smart equivalent.
  - bediger4000 12y ago
    The question there is "Why?" Are the "smart" tee vee makers counting on a stream of ad revenue? Or having crapware/shovelware on it like mass market PCs?
    - gutnor 12y ago
      Unless you go second hand, price of tech product does not drop. An entry level camera, phone, monitor is not yesterday high end model that dropped in price, it is a brand new model that can be made cheaper. We tend not to notice it, because basically entry level CPU and RAM is faster than older high end. But that is very visible when there is optic involved ( like camera, projectors, ... ) or other intangible ( DRM ink, size for mobile phone, smart feature ) For example - you don't like 16:9 monitor. Tough luck, you need to look at monitor produced for image professional to find something else ( well last time I looked for a monitor, which was some time ago ) Another one: in the middle of the camera pixel race, there were sweet spot models that just go replaced the year after and would end up on EBay for more than their original price. So, all TV from cheap to expensive will become "smart". If you want a non-smart one will probably need to look at TV made for niche sectors, for a premium.
mpeg 12y ago
A bit disappointing that a hacker community's first reaction is to position against smart TVs. Smart TVs are awesome, we just need open source firmware for them in the same way that we have DDWRT/OpenWRT, XBMC and such. Imagine the control scheme using a wiimote-style pointer, built-in webcam, quad core CPU and an API to give you access to your viewing habits, or interface with other smart devices around your home. Right now, I turn on my ps4 and the channel doesn't change automatically and turn on game mode, why? I have a smart TV, it should know exactly what I want to do. I do still think this is a bug, and not intended by Samsung. My tv doesn't seem to be affected by it.
- pfisch 12y ago
  They will never be awesome. It is like having built in navigation in your car vs an iPhone. Built in is proprietary bs that will always be out of date, and hardware refreshes will take like 5+ years because how often do you get a new tv. Right now my roku runs about 1000x faster than my smart tv and is really just superior in every way. Stand alone boxes will always be better because the software will be better and hardware refreshes happen much faster.
  - mpeg 12y ago
    I have a few set top boxes too, but I'd like deeper integration with the tv firmware itself, and that's something that they can't do unless the firmware was open. In which case, we could have the same regular updates you get with a roku.
    - fnordfnordfnord 12y ago
      There are smart TV's with open firmware?
      - xai3luGi 12y ago
        http://www.samygo.tv/ http://www.samygo.tv/
  - 12y ago
snarfy 12y ago
> Samsung explained that these sorts of ads were supposed to be opt-in only and was working with Yahoo to improve the system. No user would opt-in to commercials, ever. I don't believe for a second this system was designed with opt-in in mind. Whenever an ill conceived feature like this is brought to the light, it's always explained as a bug, glitch, or some screw up in engineering. Well, it's not a bug. It was specifically designed to do what it does. If anybody screwed up it's the people at the top that think smart TVs are a good idea.
- ChrisLTD 12y ago
  Smart TVs are a good idea. Who doesn't want less crap plugged into their TV? However, TV manufacturers – for some reason – are ill-suited to developing the software that would make for a good experience.
  - ohaal 12y ago
    Smart TVs being a good idea, all depends on who you are. It's good for TV manufacturers, because old TVs get older faster (outdated processor / software and so on). For consumers however, having a separate box for the "smart" part of your TV is much better, because it makes it easier to upgrade. Personally, I prefer the dumbest possible TV. Most of the time, I don't need a new panel, all I need is an upgrade of whatever smartbox I'm using at the moment. So far my Chromecast is carrying me quite well. The biggest upgrade of my TV I'll be doing in the near future will be an upgrade to 4K and/or maybe OLED down the line.
  - andybak 12y ago
    Smart TVs are a terrible idea for the same reason that combined printer and scanners are a bad idea but with the negative aspect magnified many times. The cost and life expectancy of each part is very different and you don't want their replacement/upgrade to be tied together. A display panel should last you more than a decade and probably costs many 100s or 1000s. The 'smart' bit is probably worth less than $200 and is probably going to be obsolete in a couple of years. EDIT - another thing. I want the people that make my 'smart' box to be nimble, forward looking new media companies - not box shifters like Samsung, LG, Philips et al. Most Smart TVs have awful software (LG's purchase of WebOS might lead them to be an exception here) I've been asked by non-tech friends and relatives about SmartTVs many times and my answer is always "don't touch them with a barge-pole" and a link to a Roku/Chromecast/AppleTV etc.
bitL 12y ago
Basically, buy a NUC or 4K Android XBMC/Plex box, and use Smart TVs as dumb TVs with HDMI 2.0 input. BTW, I have just bought a Samsung UHD TV so it's completely necessary for me now...
- morganvachon 12y ago
  Or do all of that and buy a dumb TV instead of the "smart" TV, putting the ~$200 savings into the NUC or other box. No sense in paying for a component you'll never use.
  - jbinto 12y ago
    As others have noted here already, the smart TVs are quickly becoming the only thing you can buy now, at least in North America.
    - morganvachon 12y ago
      If you do all your shopping in brick-and-mortar stores that only carry expensive Samsung and LG TVs, I'd believe that. But there's a wealth of "dumb" TVs available online and even in big-box stores like Best Buy and Walmart. I'd say if someone is savvy enough to know they don't want a "smart" TV, they will know where to look for a good deal.
      - bitL 12y ago
        Unfortunately, it seems there are no 4K dumb TVs :-(
        morganvachon 12y ago
        Sure there are. Twenty seconds on Amazon yielded this: http://smile.amazon.com/Upstar-P55EWX-55-Inch-Definition-Widescreen/dp/B00SCP34LM/ http://smile.amazon.com/Upstar-P55EWX-55-Inch-Definition-Wid... That's at the budget end of the spectrum, but there are non-"smart" 4K TVs among the better brands as well. This site has reviews of several low to high-end 4K TVs: http://www.whathifi.com/products/tvs/4k-tvs http://www.whathifi.com/products/tvs/4k-tvs Or, you could get a 4K computer monitor, and an HDMI splitter to port the sound over to your surround system. There are always options.
bane 12y ago
I submitted this at the source of the report a few days ago https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9021305 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9021305
lultimouomo 12y ago
> By either selecting that I agree or by not selecting that I disagree, I agree to the Yahoo Connected TV Terms of Service Written under the deselected "I Agree" checkbox, with no "I disagree" option visible. This has to be some kind of record. And on a TV that you paid hundreds if not thousands of dollars, not in some spooky shareware download.
- userbinator 12y ago
  In other words, they're trying to say agree = iAgree || !iDisagree; and the disagree option is somehow missing, so they can conveniently default it to being unselected and you're "agreeing" whether or not "I Agree" is selected. Damned if you do, damned if you don't...
- a3n 12y ago
  Not defending it, but I notice there's a scroll button at the bottom of that panel. Perhaps disagree is below the fold.
- omega_rythm 12y ago
  I guess the text tries to cover both opt-in and opt-out dialog boxes, which perhaps indicates that somewhere in the admin level configuration is an option to choose which mode the service should work in. Or Samsung and Yahoo just did not understand each other and this dialog is a collateral damage.
- verytrivial 12y ago
  This reminds me of Android's terrible UI for opting in to GPS snoop recording^H^H^HGoogle Location Services: You can either (disagree) OR (agree and not answer again). It is not possible to to disagree once and for all! It's like they're trying to catch you off guard.
  - higherpurpose 12y ago
    They are. Also when you enable GPS you enable it for everything, which also sucks. Maybe I want GPS to only work for the Nav app.
IgorPartola 12y ago
This is why I am not keen on smart TV's. They are getting too smart for what they should do. Voice control? Why? Otis slower and more annoying than a simple remote. Streaming content? Unless this is the One True TV the company will make, they will quickly drop support for it. Then, when FooBarTube (tm) comes out and is the new Netflix, good luck getting the software for it. Do what I do: buy the TV for the nice screen and get a Roku 3. Your life will get easier.
hamoid 12y ago
In this thread it looks like there are only two options: smart TV and dumb TV. But there's a third one: no TV. It has it's own set of advantages.
- fsloth 12y ago
  But that's like suggesting selibacy in a discussion about sex positions.
mariuolo 12y ago
It's time to start buying large monitors, I think.
- boldrikboldrik 12y ago
  That's exactly my plan.
- thinkr 12y ago
  I haven't done much research on this but is it possible to even buy a 70in+ monitor?
  - dragonwriter 12y ago
    > I haven't done much research on this but is it possible to even buy a 70in+ monitor? Yes, though for many uses you may be better off with just getting a projector and an appropriate projection surface if you want 70in+ display.
mariuolo 12y ago
It's time to start buying large monitors, I think.
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
acd 12y ago
Not so smart Samsung Tvs, not so smart watches with 1 day battery life. Why are these products called smart when they are not? iStupid
occam65 12y ago
That's it, I've had it. I'm going to set my router to take all traffic from the MAC address of my TV and route it to 127.0.0.1. I'll disable the redirect when I want to check for firmware updates, but that's it.
- TheCraiggers 12y ago
  Might want to reconsider that last part. My Vizio had an update a week or so ago that seemingly broke optical audio out. In the future, I'm leaning towards the "if it ain't broke, don't let it patch itself" mantra.
- ghkbrew 12y ago
  I personally prefer to keep my glorified display panel disconnected from any sort of ip network. It puts the HDMI input on the screen or else it gets the hose again.
verytrivial 12y ago
Attention Samsung mobile phone division! Malignancy detected in TV division! Excise without delay!
- jimrandomh 12y ago
  This sounds humorous, but it's also true; this will damage Samsung's reputation and affect everything sold under the name, not just televisions. The little bit of extra revenue goes to one division, but hurts the others, and they should take action to defend themselves. I would certain hesitate before buying a Samsung-branded phone, watch or VR headset now.
- outworlder 12y ago
  Thing is, they are probably working together already. Witness the samsung-phone-only video inputs that started appearing on TVs and monitors for the last few years.
jensen123 12y ago
If I had seen this story on The Onion, I would have laughed, and thought "that would never happen in the real world". But here we are. In the real world. My mind is blown. Just WOW.
belorn 12y ago
This business practice of hiding secret drawbacks in Terms of Service need be sent to the courts and stopped. In the history of contact law, the practice has come, been outlawed, reinvented, been outlawed again, and repeated with new schemes every 10-20 year or so. Last time it was Hidden fees and surcharges, before that, incomplete prices and hidden costs. The law adapted and with it business practices, but the lure of addition revenue after sale are still going strong. So instead of hiding costs in contracts, companies now simply takes control of the property they have sold. Same attack vector, same intent as before, and contract law is lagging behind as usually. It is extremely doubtful that this kind of TOS is legal, and without the TOS, Samsung is commercially invading peoples private property. They are not allowed to plant advertisement signs on land they don't own, and a TOS which no one reads or understand should not change that fact.
- sheensleeves 12y ago
  Wikipedia: "Asymmetric recognition in this way is authority without responsibility, on the side of the Master, and responsibility without authority, on the side of the Slave. And Hegel's argument is that unless authority and responsibility are commensurate and reciprocal, no actual normative statuses are instituted." (EULA=master, customer=slave.)
EliRivers 12y ago
Well of course they fucking are. YOU'RE THE PRODUCT, punters. They're selling you. This isn't new. They've been a bit clumsy this time and you've noticed, but nothing will change.
- MereInterest 12y ago
  The usual line is "If you're not paying for simething, you're the product.". As a follow-up, if I am paying for something, I certainly expect not to be the product.
  - freyr 12y ago
    > * if I am paying for something, I certainly expect not to be the product.* And yet cable exists. Pay $30+/month to watch 15 minutes of commercials an hour.
spiritplumber 12y ago
Step 1: Buy a projector. Step 2: Buy a roku box, or a used laptop. Step 3: Buy a decent pair of speakers. Step 4: Set it all up. Step 5: Enjoy a large screen that is also portable, and that probably cost significantly less than the same-size TV would have.
- jessaustin 12y ago
  Do you have recommendations for projectors? Anything that can be used during the day?
  - spiritplumber 12y ago
    Good blackout curtains. Pretty much anything with HDMI input will do, honestly... I generally get projectors from places that recycle office furniture, you can get a 4000 lumen XGA projector for $75 that way. I prefer LCD over DLP because they degrade more gracefully. http://robots-everywhere.com/re_wiki/index.php?n=Main.ProjectorLampLifeExtension http://robots-everywhere.com/re_wiki/index.php?n=Main.Projec... may help with lamp life if you end up with something pre-LED.
- lukashed 12y ago
  I think it's only a matter of time until projectors get "dumb-smart" as well, unfortunately. So yeah, you'd better get a projector now.
arca_vorago 12y ago
You know what I'm curious about? Why so many people rail against GPL for business use, claiming it makes it more difficult to monetize a product, but then companies like Samsung and Google turn around and use GNU/Linux and other GPL code on a project and then lock it down with proprietary blobs and DRM. Doesn't seem to really be hurting them at all, but it is certainly hurting consumers that linux is being used to abuse peoples rights. If I buy a TV with a quad core processor in it, there is no reason I should not, if I so choose (and potentially void warranty) that I shouldn't be able to install whatever I want to on that. The only technical limitations to rooting a Samsung smart tv are artificially placed there by Samesung, and with recent updates they made it so trying to root can brick your TV! I would love to buy a completely FOSS smart tv, but it infuriates me to know I have linux but can't do anything with it on mine. Contrary to popular opinion, I'm increasingly convinced that RMS was just a man ahead of his time and the principles of the GPL are more important than ever to uphold.
- jessaustin 12y ago
  I haven't used one of these TVs, but if they're using linux and you can't patch it, why haven't they been sued? That is the point of the GPL.
  - arca_vorago 12y ago
    Perhaps we need to contact the FSF about this? That's a good question. For any curious this is the page that details what they need for such a report. I will be doing this sometime this week and sending all of it to them. https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-violation.html https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-violation.html
  - tbirdz 12y ago
    You're thinking of the GPLv3's anti "tivoization" clause. Linux is released under the GPLv2 only, and that license does not include that clause.
    - jessaustin 12y ago
click170 12y ago
First of all, outbound filtering. You might want to look into it. I'm installing outbound filters for all my friends and family, with stuff like this it's not hard to help them see the benefit. Second, what's the big deal? If it only takes 15-30 minutes for an ad to appear, simply return the TV the first time it displays one. I could understand the outrage if the TV waited until after the return period had expired before doing this, but this doesn't seem like a big deal to me. Return it and blog about your experience, naming and shaming the manufacturer, and share your experience with your friends and family as well so they can avoid the same mistake. Shame on you Samsung for thinking it would ever be appropriate to insert advertisements into the consumer's own content. Edit: As an afterthought, I wonder how the TV behaves if it can't access the Internet to download said Ads. Anyone with experience able to speak to this?
JonFish85 12y ago
Just a continuation on a theme, and I'd expect this to become a bigger thing. I imagine that advertising will continue to move closer and closer to the consumer and away from the "medium". Until recently, media ads were essentially controlled by the networks (whether radio or TV), but I would expect the trend to be towards cutting them out of it a bit. In-game advertising is already a ~$1bn/year thing, and this seems a logical extension of that. Imagine if your TV could insert ads depending on exactly what you were watching, based on your specific habits--it's an ad company's wet dream. Coca Cola wouldn't have to spend the time figuring out which programs to advertise to, they could target specific customers without having to go to a second-order of research (who do we want to advertise to, and where are they?). That second step is completely cut out. I hate it, but I could definitely see a trend in this direction. Isn't this essentially exactly what Google Glass is about? If Google can figure out exactly what you're looking at, exactly where you are and draw conclusions from that data, they have extraordinarily valuable information for advertisers.
- shostack 12y ago
  This trend is nothing new, and is one of the main reasons that video CPMs for digital media are as high as they are. Sites like Youtube can bring a wealth of targeting data to the table, and Google is obviously very good at making that as accurate as possible. It is one of the main reasons behind their big push to get you logged-in whenever you use a Google service, device, browser, app, etc. A single GUID to link behavior across everything. One ring to rule them all so speak ;)
frik 12y ago
The brand new xmax 2014 Samsung SmartTVs models come with a crippled firmware. Many features are disabled until you connect to the internet and "update". You cannot even use the menu bar (smart hub) and therefor cannot access USB devices. For me this was the only time I attached the TV to the internet. The two different remotes have entirely different navigation buttons and changing a sender with the "mouse remote" is a nightmare. But LG and other TV manufactures are not better. Suggestion: Remove the dozens of buttons on your remote and scrap your complicated menu structure. I would buy an Apple TV (a television screen, not the box) in a second - at least Apple (and Google) understand how to design an user interface. A simple remote like the second generation iPod touch wheel would be enough. Or a dumb TV, but they are already hard to find - and then you have to use at least two remotes with dozens buttons as well.
JohnTHaller 12y ago
Smart TVs' apps generally lag FAR behind the equivalent apps on a Playstation, Xbox, Roku box or similar anyway, so it's generally a better option to go with a regular TV. The money you save can more than pay for a Roku box. Or even an Xbox 360 depending on brand. A TV without the annoying apps, added commercials, and privacy issues is a smarter choice. Stop calling them dumb TVs. They're "Smarter TVs".
- winslow 12y ago
  Are non smart TVs even available (once you get into the big 55in and above range)? I suppose you could always buy the smart version and just don't enable/use it
  - JohnTHaller 12y ago
    I bought a 50" RCA in October for a really good deal. No smart features at all. Don't need em, don't want em.
  - rkuykendall-com 12y ago
    I wonder if we'll start to see "Start TV Lobotomy" guides.
Evolved 12y ago
Isn't the solution to this just not having an internet-connected TV? I don't know about any of you but of the TVs I've used to run apps, the ones with an Xbox/PS or Roku/Chromecast/AppleTV run YouTube/Netflix/etc. a lot better than the ones that run these apps natively.
joannerr 12y ago
Samsung may just feel they haven't good luck this time. Compared with it, I personally prefer Chromecast or Apple.
debian69 12y ago
So like boycott samsung already?
beloch 12y ago
I've become convinced there's no such thing as an "opt-in" feature. There are only obfuscated opt-out "features" that companies claim they meant to make "opt-in" as a way of mollifying the few who figure out who is to blame for the "feature". Meanwhile, the silent majority watches the advertising and Samsung watches the ad bucks roll in.
RIMR 12y ago
Smart TVs are completely unnessary. I don't want apps on my TV. Sure, apps on something connected to my TV can be nice, but even the most basic TVs have too many features. Built-in speakers? They sound awful and I have an amp. Get rid of them. Oh, you cropped my 1080P HDTV signal? Well, I've plugged in a computer, so I need you to display the whole frame. Oh, less than half of TVs even let you turn that feature off? Well fuck! TVs don't need to be anything more than monitors. They can have special features, like 3D, or built-in cameras, but make it something that I can plug into something else. How Samsung thought they could record private conversations in people's homes and push ads into their private videos without consequence is unbelievable. I will NEVER buy a smart TV.
- mey 12y ago
  I disagree about the speakers but agree with everything else. I will not buy a "SmartTV", give me a A/V interface, that's all I want. I'll swap out Roku's or consoles or computers on the back end over standard interfaces. The rest of it is a massive security hole, and apparently also a violation of privacy.
- danudey 12y ago
  I love my AppleTV, and I would buy an Apple TV if one came out, for a few reasons. I actually only use my ATV to watch Netflix and buy Doctor Who and Archer off iTunes, but I'd buy a TV made by Apple because I feel like they would do a good job. My TV, when I hit the power button on the remote, takes about 5 seconds to give me any indication that it heard me; I then get another 5 seconds of the LG logo before I get dumped onto whatever input I was last on. In comparison, when I move my mouse on my computer, my Apple cinema display wakes up almost instantaneously (display), and my AppleTV goes from sleep mode to showing me the last menu I was on in less than a second (processing). Thus, I expect an Apple television to be on and available to use within moments of my requesting it, and off as soon as I tell it I'm done. The AppleTV 3rd Gen also maxes out at about 1W of power used[1], which means that there's no reason why the brains of a smart TV shouldn't be able to be on 100% of the time, ready at any moment to power on for incoming content, rather than having my television add 30s to the simple act of showing someone a YouTube video. That said, Apple make their money by making high-quality, high-margin devices, and not by racing to the bottom of the price structure and selling out customers to make ends meet. [1] http://www.anandtech.com/show/6834/apple-tv-2013-a1469-short-review-analysis-of-a-new-a5 http://www.anandtech.com/show/6834/apple-tv-2013-a1469-short...

265 points by lukashed 12y ago

juliangregorian 12y ago

And this on top of spying on all your conversations? Sheesh, what kind of world are we inventing for ourselves.

aluhut 12y ago
We don't know. But we'll find out! We have algorithms for that.

vidarh 12y ago

The whole voice recognition thing seemed to me to be an unfair storm in a teacup to me, but this.... This is beyond ridiculous. My next TV will not be a Samsung, whether they fix this or not.

galonk 12y ago
How much you want to bet the average "smart" TV will start popping up "network error" dialog boxes every minute in that situation?
- Too 12y ago
  Oh this is the worst part, i could once not start my viasat-app on smart-tv because samsungs, not viasats, servers were down. The workaround was to reconfigure the dns to point samsung to a local server that just said "im alive" and then i could start my apps and use them without any problems. T_T
Ysx 12y ago
My next anything won't be a Samsung, now.

gadders 12y ago

I am running out of curse words to describe the people that make these decisions.

wadcd 12y ago
The ones designing such products or the ones buying them?

ourmandave 12y ago

They're not unwanted ads until you tell Samsung and Yahoo they're unwanted. And that convenient opt out is only 5,000 clicks through a maze of twisty passages away. I'd bet the pop-up confirmation box on the opt-out has a Pepsi ad on it.

cauterized 12y ago
Is there such a things as a wanted ad?
- rblatz 12y ago
  Lots of people watch the Super Bowl for the ads.
  - jbob2000 12y ago
    Only because they're unique and don't get repeated for months on end. If you could show me a unique ad every time, I might be ok with it. But in general, I see the same shit day in and day out and that's what's annoying about it.
  - michaelt 12y ago
    I'll believe there are "wanted ads" when Samsung and Yahoo set the ads to off by default and let customers opt in.
- jpindar 12y ago
  Yes, I like seeing ads for upcoming shows that I otherwise would not have known about. They should only be between shows or when using the guide or menus, though.
- asavadatti 12y ago
  I actually watch some of the ads on YouTube Channels that I like (Provided the ads are moderately interesting). It is a small sacrifice to pay to get content that I like for free.
- tomjen3 12y ago

jsilence 12y ago

It is easy to opt-out of buying Samsung smart TVs.

tedunangst 12y ago
From the sound of it, the ads only appear when using smart TV apps? So you could still use a "smart" TV but with normal inputs.
- blumkvist 12y ago
  Or just don't buy TVs from these creeps!
- toxican 12y ago
  Then why not just save yourself some money and get a "dumb" TV? I can only imagine they jack the price up a hundred or two for the "smart"
  - pjc50 12y ago
    Soon it may be more expensive to buy a dumb TV than a smart TV, if the manufacturer is counting on ad revenue.
  - jfb 12y ago
    Because the panels are commodities and market pressures are such that "Smart" TV features are the battleground that the manufacturers are trying to differentiate on. You can get a reference monitor, which will be the same panel as a $800 Smart TV for $4k.
    - jfb 12y ago
      I am considering [1] replacing my last TV (a 50" Panasonic reference plasma) with another reference monitor, but sadly plasma is no longer an option, unless I strike right. this. very. second. [1] http://homonculus.net/2015/01/27/so_i_may_have_to_buy_a_new_tv.html http://homonculus.net/2015/01/27/so_i_may_have_to_buy_a_new_...

_lce0 12y ago

that's why I bought a dumb-tv. we need to go dumb-everything: phone, tv, computer, car..

Fundlab 12y ago

Personally a dumb tv/roku/media server has been my go to choice. This whole smartTV hype is still beyond me. Could someone please touch on the advantages of a smart TV offerings over my setup?

daigoba66 12y ago
Some people like the concept of having fewer boxes to plug in. That means fewer cords, fewer remotes, etc. Personally I would love to have a TV running a decent OS (as long as it still boots instantly). Unfortunately TV manufactures do such a shitty job with the software. Both in terms of quality/performance/usability, and now with privacy issues and injected ads.
- delecti 12y ago
  Exactly. If it was an option to get a smart tv that was actually competent then it wouldn't be such an easy decision to avoid them like the plague. Though even then, I'm always going to have devices plugged into my TV. A combination of my PS3 and PC can access any of the content I might want to watch.
- tomjen3 12y ago
  I used to agree with you, kinda regretted I brought a dumb tv. Then I got a Chrome cast. Plug and go, no remotes (you use your phone or tablet) the ugly wires are hidden behind the tv.
FreakyT 12y ago
I think main purpose of a Smart TV is to act as a single-device solution for people who don't already have a Roku/Chromecast/whatever.
- spiritplumber 12y ago
  Good, some more high profile fiascos like this, and people will understand that it's best when they control what's wired up to what.
12y ago

rathish_g 12y ago

It clearly says... SMART TV

Sharlin 12y ago

So... do smart TVs actually have a single feature that's actually useful to the consumer?

jon-wood 12y ago
The only "Smart" feature I use on mine is Amazon Prime Video, and that's just because Amazon are too damn stubborn to support Chromecast streaming. The app on the TV is slow, clunky, and occasionally decides it doesn't feel like playing any video today.
alistairSH 12y ago
Not really. Dad installed smart TVs in his beach house (he figured it was easier than wiring up DVD players and Rokus in 10 rooms). While the apps do work, they are slow, clunky, and the UX is never as good as that which is delivered on dedicated streaming devices. The configuration is always buried, so switching accounts is an exercise in futility. So, he just leaves his Roku account signed in and deals with the clutter in his personal watch list.
vpeters25 12y ago
At least in my case the apps for Netflix and Amazon get a lot of use. Netflix support was one of the key features I wanted when purchasing my current SmartTV.
gutnor 12y ago
Soon they will be cheaper than their non-smart equivalent.
- bediger4000 12y ago
  The question there is "Why?" Are the "smart" tee vee makers counting on a stream of ad revenue? Or having crapware/shovelware on it like mass market PCs?
  - gutnor 12y ago
    Unless you go second hand, price of tech product does not drop. An entry level camera, phone, monitor is not yesterday high end model that dropped in price, it is a brand new model that can be made cheaper. We tend not to notice it, because basically entry level CPU and RAM is faster than older high end. But that is very visible when there is optic involved ( like camera, projectors, ... ) or other intangible ( DRM ink, size for mobile phone, smart feature ) For example - you don't like 16:9 monitor. Tough luck, you need to look at monitor produced for image professional to find something else ( well last time I looked for a monitor, which was some time ago ) Another one: in the middle of the camera pixel race, there were sweet spot models that just go replaced the year after and would end up on EBay for more than their original price. So, all TV from cheap to expensive will become "smart". If you want a non-smart one will probably need to look at TV made for niche sectors, for a premium.

mpeg 12y ago

A bit disappointing that a hacker community's first reaction is to position against smart TVs. Smart TVs are awesome, we just need open source firmware for them in the same way that we have DDWRT/OpenWRT, XBMC and such. Imagine the control scheme using a wiimote-style pointer, built-in webcam, quad core CPU and an API to give you access to your viewing habits, or interface with other smart devices around your home. Right now, I turn on my ps4 and the channel doesn't change automatically and turn on game mode, why? I have a smart TV, it should know exactly what I want to do. I do still think this is a bug, and not intended by Samsung. My tv doesn't seem to be affected by it.

pfisch 12y ago
They will never be awesome. It is like having built in navigation in your car vs an iPhone. Built in is proprietary bs that will always be out of date, and hardware refreshes will take like 5+ years because how often do you get a new tv. Right now my roku runs about 1000x faster than my smart tv and is really just superior in every way. Stand alone boxes will always be better because the software will be better and hardware refreshes happen much faster.
- mpeg 12y ago
  I have a few set top boxes too, but I'd like deeper integration with the tv firmware itself, and that's something that they can't do unless the firmware was open. In which case, we could have the same regular updates you get with a roku.
  - fnordfnordfnord 12y ago
    There are smart TV's with open firmware?
    - xai3luGi 12y ago
      http://www.samygo.tv/ http://www.samygo.tv/
- 12y ago

snarfy 12y ago

> Samsung explained that these sorts of ads were supposed to be opt-in only and was working with Yahoo to improve the system. No user would opt-in to commercials, ever. I don't believe for a second this system was designed with opt-in in mind. Whenever an ill conceived feature like this is brought to the light, it's always explained as a bug, glitch, or some screw up in engineering. Well, it's not a bug. It was specifically designed to do what it does. If anybody screwed up it's the people at the top that think smart TVs are a good idea.

ChrisLTD 12y ago
Smart TVs are a good idea. Who doesn't want less crap plugged into their TV? However, TV manufacturers – for some reason – are ill-suited to developing the software that would make for a good experience.
- ohaal 12y ago
  Smart TVs being a good idea, all depends on who you are. It's good for TV manufacturers, because old TVs get older faster (outdated processor / software and so on). For consumers however, having a separate box for the "smart" part of your TV is much better, because it makes it easier to upgrade. Personally, I prefer the dumbest possible TV. Most of the time, I don't need a new panel, all I need is an upgrade of whatever smartbox I'm using at the moment. So far my Chromecast is carrying me quite well. The biggest upgrade of my TV I'll be doing in the near future will be an upgrade to 4K and/or maybe OLED down the line.
- andybak 12y ago
  Smart TVs are a terrible idea for the same reason that combined printer and scanners are a bad idea but with the negative aspect magnified many times. The cost and life expectancy of each part is very different and you don't want their replacement/upgrade to be tied together. A display panel should last you more than a decade and probably costs many 100s or 1000s. The 'smart' bit is probably worth less than $200 and is probably going to be obsolete in a couple of years. EDIT - another thing. I want the people that make my 'smart' box to be nimble, forward looking new media companies - not box shifters like Samsung, LG, Philips et al. Most Smart TVs have awful software (LG's purchase of WebOS might lead them to be an exception here) I've been asked by non-tech friends and relatives about SmartTVs many times and my answer is always "don't touch them with a barge-pole" and a link to a Roku/Chromecast/AppleTV etc.

bitL 12y ago

Basically, buy a NUC or 4K Android XBMC/Plex box, and use Smart TVs as dumb TVs with HDMI 2.0 input. BTW, I have just bought a Samsung UHD TV so it's completely necessary for me now...

morganvachon 12y ago
Or do all of that and buy a dumb TV instead of the "smart" TV, putting the ~$200 savings into the NUC or other box. No sense in paying for a component you'll never use.
- jbinto 12y ago
  As others have noted here already, the smart TVs are quickly becoming the only thing you can buy now, at least in North America.
  - morganvachon 12y ago
    If you do all your shopping in brick-and-mortar stores that only carry expensive Samsung and LG TVs, I'd believe that. But there's a wealth of "dumb" TVs available online and even in big-box stores like Best Buy and Walmart. I'd say if someone is savvy enough to know they don't want a "smart" TV, they will know where to look for a good deal.
    - bitL 12y ago
      Unfortunately, it seems there are no 4K dumb TVs :-(
      - morganvachon 12y ago
        Sure there are. Twenty seconds on Amazon yielded this: http://smile.amazon.com/Upstar-P55EWX-55-Inch-Definition-Widescreen/dp/B00SCP34LM/ http://smile.amazon.com/Upstar-P55EWX-55-Inch-Definition-Wid... That's at the budget end of the spectrum, but there are non-"smart" 4K TVs among the better brands as well. This site has reviews of several low to high-end 4K TVs: http://www.whathifi.com/products/tvs/4k-tvs http://www.whathifi.com/products/tvs/4k-tvs Or, you could get a 4K computer monitor, and an HDMI splitter to port the sound over to your surround system. There are always options.

bane 12y ago

I submitted this at the source of the report a few days ago https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9021305 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9021305

lultimouomo 12y ago

> By either selecting that I agree or by not selecting that I disagree, I agree to the Yahoo Connected TV Terms of Service Written under the deselected "I Agree" checkbox, with no "I disagree" option visible. This has to be some kind of record. And on a TV that you paid hundreds if not thousands of dollars, not in some spooky shareware download.

userbinator 12y ago
In other words, they're trying to say agree = iAgree || !iDisagree; and the disagree option is somehow missing, so they can conveniently default it to being unselected and you're "agreeing" whether or not "I Agree" is selected. Damned if you do, damned if you don't...
a3n 12y ago
Not defending it, but I notice there's a scroll button at the bottom of that panel. Perhaps disagree is below the fold.
omega_rythm 12y ago
I guess the text tries to cover both opt-in and opt-out dialog boxes, which perhaps indicates that somewhere in the admin level configuration is an option to choose which mode the service should work in. Or Samsung and Yahoo just did not understand each other and this dialog is a collateral damage.
verytrivial 12y ago
This reminds me of Android's terrible UI for opting in to GPS snoop recording^H^H^HGoogle Location Services: You can either (disagree) OR (agree and not answer again). It is not possible to to disagree once and for all! It's like they're trying to catch you off guard.
- higherpurpose 12y ago
  They are. Also when you enable GPS you enable it for everything, which also sucks. Maybe I want GPS to only work for the Nav app.

IgorPartola 12y ago

This is why I am not keen on smart TV's. They are getting too smart for what they should do. Voice control? Why? Otis slower and more annoying than a simple remote. Streaming content? Unless this is the One True TV the company will make, they will quickly drop support for it. Then, when FooBarTube (tm) comes out and is the new Netflix, good luck getting the software for it. Do what I do: buy the TV for the nice screen and get a Roku 3. Your life will get easier.

hamoid 12y ago

In this thread it looks like there are only two options: smart TV and dumb TV. But there's a third one: no TV. It has it's own set of advantages.

fsloth 12y ago
But that's like suggesting selibacy in a discussion about sex positions.

mariuolo 12y ago

It's time to start buying large monitors, I think.

boldrikboldrik 12y ago
That's exactly my plan.
thinkr 12y ago
I haven't done much research on this but is it possible to even buy a 70in+ monitor?
- dragonwriter 12y ago
  > I haven't done much research on this but is it possible to even buy a 70in+ monitor? Yes, though for many uses you may be better off with just getting a projector and an appropriate projection surface if you want 70in+ display.

mariuolo 12y ago

It's time to start buying large monitors, I think.

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]

acd 12y ago

Not so smart Samsung Tvs, not so smart watches with 1 day battery life. Why are these products called smart when they are not? iStupid

occam65 12y ago

That's it, I've had it. I'm going to set my router to take all traffic from the MAC address of my TV and route it to 127.0.0.1. I'll disable the redirect when I want to check for firmware updates, but that's it.

TheCraiggers 12y ago
Might want to reconsider that last part. My Vizio had an update a week or so ago that seemingly broke optical audio out. In the future, I'm leaning towards the "if it ain't broke, don't let it patch itself" mantra.
ghkbrew 12y ago
I personally prefer to keep my glorified display panel disconnected from any sort of ip network. It puts the HDMI input on the screen or else it gets the hose again.

verytrivial 12y ago

Attention Samsung mobile phone division! Malignancy detected in TV division! Excise without delay!

jimrandomh 12y ago
This sounds humorous, but it's also true; this will damage Samsung's reputation and affect everything sold under the name, not just televisions. The little bit of extra revenue goes to one division, but hurts the others, and they should take action to defend themselves. I would certain hesitate before buying a Samsung-branded phone, watch or VR headset now.
outworlder 12y ago
Thing is, they are probably working together already. Witness the samsung-phone-only video inputs that started appearing on TVs and monitors for the last few years.

jensen123 12y ago

If I had seen this story on The Onion, I would have laughed, and thought "that would never happen in the real world". But here we are. In the real world. My mind is blown. Just WOW.

belorn 12y ago

This business practice of hiding secret drawbacks in Terms of Service need be sent to the courts and stopped. In the history of contact law, the practice has come, been outlawed, reinvented, been outlawed again, and repeated with new schemes every 10-20 year or so. Last time it was Hidden fees and surcharges, before that, incomplete prices and hidden costs. The law adapted and with it business practices, but the lure of addition revenue after sale are still going strong. So instead of hiding costs in contracts, companies now simply takes control of the property they have sold. Same attack vector, same intent as before, and contract law is lagging behind as usually. It is extremely doubtful that this kind of TOS is legal, and without the TOS, Samsung is commercially invading peoples private property. They are not allowed to plant advertisement signs on land they don't own, and a TOS which no one reads or understand should not change that fact.

sheensleeves 12y ago
Wikipedia: "Asymmetric recognition in this way is authority without responsibility, on the side of the Master, and responsibility without authority, on the side of the Slave. And Hegel's argument is that unless authority and responsibility are commensurate and reciprocal, no actual normative statuses are instituted." (EULA=master, customer=slave.)

EliRivers 12y ago

Well of course they fucking are. YOU'RE THE PRODUCT, punters. They're selling you. This isn't new. They've been a bit clumsy this time and you've noticed, but nothing will change.

MereInterest 12y ago
The usual line is "If you're not paying for simething, you're the product.". As a follow-up, if I am paying for something, I certainly expect not to be the product.
- freyr 12y ago
  > * if I am paying for something, I certainly expect not to be the product.* And yet cable exists. Pay $30+/month to watch 15 minutes of commercials an hour.

spiritplumber 12y ago

Step 1: Buy a projector. Step 2: Buy a roku box, or a used laptop. Step 3: Buy a decent pair of speakers. Step 4: Set it all up. Step 5: Enjoy a large screen that is also portable, and that probably cost significantly less than the same-size TV would have.

jessaustin 12y ago
Do you have recommendations for projectors? Anything that can be used during the day?
- spiritplumber 12y ago
  Good blackout curtains. Pretty much anything with HDMI input will do, honestly... I generally get projectors from places that recycle office furniture, you can get a 4000 lumen XGA projector for $75 that way. I prefer LCD over DLP because they degrade more gracefully. http://robots-everywhere.com/re_wiki/index.php?n=Main.ProjectorLampLifeExtension http://robots-everywhere.com/re_wiki/index.php?n=Main.Projec... may help with lamp life if you end up with something pre-LED.
lukashed 12y ago
I think it's only a matter of time until projectors get "dumb-smart" as well, unfortunately. So yeah, you'd better get a projector now.

arca_vorago 12y ago

You know what I'm curious about? Why so many people rail against GPL for business use, claiming it makes it more difficult to monetize a product, but then companies like Samsung and Google turn around and use GNU/Linux and other GPL code on a project and then lock it down with proprietary blobs and DRM. Doesn't seem to really be hurting them at all, but it is certainly hurting consumers that linux is being used to abuse peoples rights. If I buy a TV with a quad core processor in it, there is no reason I should not, if I so choose (and potentially void warranty) that I shouldn't be able to install whatever I want to on that. The only technical limitations to rooting a Samsung smart tv are artificially placed there by Samesung, and with recent updates they made it so trying to root can brick your TV! I would love to buy a completely FOSS smart tv, but it infuriates me to know I have linux but can't do anything with it on mine. Contrary to popular opinion, I'm increasingly convinced that RMS was just a man ahead of his time and the principles of the GPL are more important than ever to uphold.

jessaustin 12y ago
I haven't used one of these TVs, but if they're using linux and you can't patch it, why haven't they been sued? That is the point of the GPL.
- arca_vorago 12y ago
  Perhaps we need to contact the FSF about this? That's a good question. For any curious this is the page that details what they need for such a report. I will be doing this sometime this week and sending all of it to them. https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-violation.html https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-violation.html
- tbirdz 12y ago
  You're thinking of the GPLv3's anti "tivoization" clause. Linux is released under the GPLv2 only, and that license does not include that clause.
  - jessaustin 12y ago

click170 12y ago

First of all, outbound filtering. You might want to look into it. I'm installing outbound filters for all my friends and family, with stuff like this it's not hard to help them see the benefit. Second, what's the big deal? If it only takes 15-30 minutes for an ad to appear, simply return the TV the first time it displays one. I could understand the outrage if the TV waited until after the return period had expired before doing this, but this doesn't seem like a big deal to me. Return it and blog about your experience, naming and shaming the manufacturer, and share your experience with your friends and family as well so they can avoid the same mistake. Shame on you Samsung for thinking it would ever be appropriate to insert advertisements into the consumer's own content. Edit: As an afterthought, I wonder how the TV behaves if it can't access the Internet to download said Ads. Anyone with experience able to speak to this?

JonFish85 12y ago

Just a continuation on a theme, and I'd expect this to become a bigger thing. I imagine that advertising will continue to move closer and closer to the consumer and away from the "medium". Until recently, media ads were essentially controlled by the networks (whether radio or TV), but I would expect the trend to be towards cutting them out of it a bit. In-game advertising is already a ~$1bn/year thing, and this seems a logical extension of that. Imagine if your TV could insert ads depending on exactly what you were watching, based on your specific habits--it's an ad company's wet dream. Coca Cola wouldn't have to spend the time figuring out which programs to advertise to, they could target specific customers without having to go to a second-order of research (who do we want to advertise to, and where are they?). That second step is completely cut out. I hate it, but I could definitely see a trend in this direction. Isn't this essentially exactly what Google Glass is about? If Google can figure out exactly what you're looking at, exactly where you are and draw conclusions from that data, they have extraordinarily valuable information for advertisers.

shostack 12y ago
This trend is nothing new, and is one of the main reasons that video CPMs for digital media are as high as they are. Sites like Youtube can bring a wealth of targeting data to the table, and Google is obviously very good at making that as accurate as possible. It is one of the main reasons behind their big push to get you logged-in whenever you use a Google service, device, browser, app, etc. A single GUID to link behavior across everything. One ring to rule them all so speak ;)

frik 12y ago

The brand new xmax 2014 Samsung SmartTVs models come with a crippled firmware. Many features are disabled until you connect to the internet and "update". You cannot even use the menu bar (smart hub) and therefor cannot access USB devices. For me this was the only time I attached the TV to the internet. The two different remotes have entirely different navigation buttons and changing a sender with the "mouse remote" is a nightmare. But LG and other TV manufactures are not better. Suggestion: Remove the dozens of buttons on your remote and scrap your complicated menu structure. I would buy an Apple TV (a television screen, not the box) in a second - at least Apple (and Google) understand how to design an user interface. A simple remote like the second generation iPod touch wheel would be enough. Or a dumb TV, but they are already hard to find - and then you have to use at least two remotes with dozens buttons as well.

JohnTHaller 12y ago

Smart TVs' apps generally lag FAR behind the equivalent apps on a Playstation, Xbox, Roku box or similar anyway, so it's generally a better option to go with a regular TV. The money you save can more than pay for a Roku box. Or even an Xbox 360 depending on brand. A TV without the annoying apps, added commercials, and privacy issues is a smarter choice. Stop calling them dumb TVs. They're "Smarter TVs".

winslow 12y ago
Are non smart TVs even available (once you get into the big 55in and above range)? I suppose you could always buy the smart version and just don't enable/use it
- JohnTHaller 12y ago
  I bought a 50" RCA in October for a really good deal. No smart features at all. Don't need em, don't want em.
- rkuykendall-com 12y ago
  I wonder if we'll start to see "Start TV Lobotomy" guides.

Evolved 12y ago

Isn't the solution to this just not having an internet-connected TV? I don't know about any of you but of the TVs I've used to run apps, the ones with an Xbox/PS or Roku/Chromecast/AppleTV run YouTube/Netflix/etc. a lot better than the ones that run these apps natively.

joannerr 12y ago

Samsung may just feel they haven't good luck this time. Compared with it, I personally prefer Chromecast or Apple.

debian69 12y ago

So like boycott samsung already?

beloch 12y ago

I've become convinced there's no such thing as an "opt-in" feature. There are only obfuscated opt-out "features" that companies claim they meant to make "opt-in" as a way of mollifying the few who figure out who is to blame for the "feature". Meanwhile, the silent majority watches the advertising and Samsung watches the ad bucks roll in.

RIMR 12y ago

Smart TVs are completely unnessary. I don't want apps on my TV. Sure, apps on something connected to my TV can be nice, but even the most basic TVs have too many features. Built-in speakers? They sound awful and I have an amp. Get rid of them. Oh, you cropped my 1080P HDTV signal? Well, I've plugged in a computer, so I need you to display the whole frame. Oh, less than half of TVs even let you turn that feature off? Well fuck! TVs don't need to be anything more than monitors. They can have special features, like 3D, or built-in cameras, but make it something that I can plug into something else. How Samsung thought they could record private conversations in people's homes and push ads into their private videos without consequence is unbelievable. I will NEVER buy a smart TV.

mey 12y ago
I disagree about the speakers but agree with everything else. I will not buy a "SmartTV", give me a A/V interface, that's all I want. I'll swap out Roku's or consoles or computers on the back end over standard interfaces. The rest of it is a massive security hole, and apparently also a violation of privacy.
danudey 12y ago
I love my AppleTV, and I would buy an Apple TV if one came out, for a few reasons. I actually only use my ATV to watch Netflix and buy Doctor Who and Archer off iTunes, but I'd buy a TV made by Apple because I feel like they would do a good job. My TV, when I hit the power button on the remote, takes about 5 seconds to give me any indication that it heard me; I then get another 5 seconds of the LG logo before I get dumped onto whatever input I was last on. In comparison, when I move my mouse on my computer, my Apple cinema display wakes up almost instantaneously (display), and my AppleTV goes from sleep mode to showing me the last menu I was on in less than a second (processing). Thus, I expect an Apple television to be on and available to use within moments of my requesting it, and off as soon as I tell it I'm done. The AppleTV 3rd Gen also maxes out at about 1W of power used[1], which means that there's no reason why the brains of a smart TV shouldn't be able to be on 100% of the time, ready at any moment to power on for incoming content, rather than having my television add 30s to the simple act of showing someone a YouTube video. That said, Apple make their money by making high-quality, high-margin devices, and not by racing to the bottom of the price structure and selling out customers to make ends meet. [1] http://www.anandtech.com/show/6834/apple-tv-2013-a1469-short-review-analysis-of-a-new-a5 http://www.anandtech.com/show/6834/apple-tv-2013-a1469-short...