4 ms·

The fact that Google has destroyed user trust is what gives Baidu an opening.

by gress 12y ago

EduardoBautista 12y ago
But what does Baidu offer that DuckDuckGo or Bing do not?
- w1ntermute 12y ago
  Backing by the Chinese government.
  - namenotrequired 12y ago
    What does Baidu offer to its users / customers that DuckDuckGo or Bing do not?
    - Chronic29 12y ago
      A promise that they're not with the NSA.
    - hueving 12y ago
      Faster trials in China because the government already has all of the data it needs.
maximumoverload 12y ago
"I am not trusting Google with my data, because it's in bed with US government too much. Instead, I will trust BaiDu, that's even more in bed with far more oppresive goverment." I don't know about that.
- krapp 12y ago
  The people who would follow this argument would likely refuse to concede that there is a government more oppressive than that of the United States. In other words - it's not an appeal to reason, it's an appeal to emotion and nationalism. Or anti-nationalism, as regards the US.
- levosmetalo 12y ago
  "U.S government can easily send drones to my country to shoot me, or at least force my country to get me extradicted, or their secret service could just take me to Guantanamo without anyone noticing" vs "Yes, Chinese government is much more oppressive than U.S, but they are not likely to share data with my government, or to get me in any way unless I decide to go to China". Heck, even if I were US citizen, I would trust Baidu more. Especially if I were US citizen. If you have to share your data, it's better to share it with someone that can't get you easily, or won't share it further with someone that can.
  - bsilvereagle 12y ago
    > that can't get you easily Who's to say that the political geography won't change in the next 50 years? Just because China doesn't have the ability to extradite _today_ doesn't mean they won't in the future.
  - hueving 12y ago
    Do you have examples of where people have been extradited from other countries due to NSA collected data? I'm also curious about the drone part. I know they have been used in Pakistan, Afghanistan, and Iraq to kill. Have there been cases where they've picked off people in London, etc?
    - krapp 12y ago
      The American government kidnapping people to torture at Gitmo or bombing people's homes into rubble over Google searches isn't something that actually happens. So, it's not something choosing another search engine can reliably protect against.
    - rjsw 12y ago
      It would be hard to prove whether the NSA provided the data but someone [1] was kidnapped in Milan. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hassan_Mustafa_Osama_Nasr https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hassan_Mustafa_Osama_Nasr
    - levosmetalo 12y ago
- mike-cardwell 12y ago
  Depends where you live. Americans have much more to fear from other Americans than they have from the Chinese government. Hell, I'm British and I have more to fear from the US than China. At least my government wont extradite me to China on a whim.
  - hueving 12y ago
    That sounds like a problem with your government rather than the US. If they are agreeing to extradite people who haven't committed a serious crime, you should be voting to change that.
    - mike-cardwell 12y ago
      I wasn't blaming the US. The fact remains, the US can do me more damage than China can. If I had to choose between surveilled services in China or surveilled services in the US, I'd go China every time. Same with hardware. I'd rather have bugged Chinese hardware than bugged American hardware. Obviously, I'd rather not have bugged hardware or be using surveilled services in the first place. Also, you can replace "American" with "British" above, and the argument would still apply.
- macspoofing 12y ago
  An American may look at it that way. A European may look at it that way. Would an African? Would a South American?
higherpurpose 12y ago
But Baidu has none to begin with. We already know they spy and censor for the Chinese government. I'm all for not using American services, but the Chinese ones wouldn't exactly be my first choice, as an alternative.

The fact that Google has destroyed user trust is what gives Baidu an opening.

by gress 12y ago

The fact that Google has destroyed user trust is what gives Baidu an opening.

EduardoBautista 12y ago

But what does Baidu offer that DuckDuckGo or Bing do not?

w1ntermute 12y ago
Backing by the Chinese government.
- namenotrequired 12y ago
  What does Baidu offer to its users / customers that DuckDuckGo or Bing do not?
  - Chronic29 12y ago
    A promise that they're not with the NSA.
  - hueving 12y ago
    Faster trials in China because the government already has all of the data it needs.

maximumoverload 12y ago

"I am not trusting Google with my data, because it's in bed with US government too much. Instead, I will trust BaiDu, that's even more in bed with far more oppresive goverment." I don't know about that.

krapp 12y ago
The people who would follow this argument would likely refuse to concede that there is a government more oppressive than that of the United States. In other words - it's not an appeal to reason, it's an appeal to emotion and nationalism. Or anti-nationalism, as regards the US.
levosmetalo 12y ago
"U.S government can easily send drones to my country to shoot me, or at least force my country to get me extradicted, or their secret service could just take me to Guantanamo without anyone noticing" vs "Yes, Chinese government is much more oppressive than U.S, but they are not likely to share data with my government, or to get me in any way unless I decide to go to China". Heck, even if I were US citizen, I would trust Baidu more. Especially if I were US citizen. If you have to share your data, it's better to share it with someone that can't get you easily, or won't share it further with someone that can.
- bsilvereagle 12y ago
  > that can't get you easily Who's to say that the political geography won't change in the next 50 years? Just because China doesn't have the ability to extradite _today_ doesn't mean they won't in the future.
- hueving 12y ago
  Do you have examples of where people have been extradited from other countries due to NSA collected data? I'm also curious about the drone part. I know they have been used in Pakistan, Afghanistan, and Iraq to kill. Have there been cases where they've picked off people in London, etc?
  - krapp 12y ago
    The American government kidnapping people to torture at Gitmo or bombing people's homes into rubble over Google searches isn't something that actually happens. So, it's not something choosing another search engine can reliably protect against.
  - rjsw 12y ago
    It would be hard to prove whether the NSA provided the data but someone [1] was kidnapped in Milan. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hassan_Mustafa_Osama_Nasr https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hassan_Mustafa_Osama_Nasr
  - levosmetalo 12y ago
mike-cardwell 12y ago
Depends where you live. Americans have much more to fear from other Americans than they have from the Chinese government. Hell, I'm British and I have more to fear from the US than China. At least my government wont extradite me to China on a whim.
- hueving 12y ago
  That sounds like a problem with your government rather than the US. If they are agreeing to extradite people who haven't committed a serious crime, you should be voting to change that.
  - mike-cardwell 12y ago
    I wasn't blaming the US. The fact remains, the US can do me more damage than China can. If I had to choose between surveilled services in China or surveilled services in the US, I'd go China every time. Same with hardware. I'd rather have bugged Chinese hardware than bugged American hardware. Obviously, I'd rather not have bugged hardware or be using surveilled services in the first place. Also, you can replace "American" with "British" above, and the argument would still apply.
macspoofing 12y ago
An American may look at it that way. A European may look at it that way. Would an African? Would a South American?

higherpurpose 12y ago

But Baidu has none to begin with. We already know they spy and censor for the Chinese government. I'm all for not using American services, but the Chinese ones wouldn't exactly be my first choice, as an alternative.