3 ms·

Not even a price listed. I don't understand the market for this - fancy musical instruments for creativity, sure, there's a market, but who wants to own cuttin

Not even a price listed. I don't understand the market for this - fancy musical instruments for creativity, sure, there's a market, but who wants to own cutting vinyl? How many records would you need to make for this to be more economical than paying a dedicated shop? How many would you need to do to "achieve higher quality"? How consistent are your results?

pstuart 4mo ago
Nor any clue on what blanks cost. But I could see the thrill of this if money was no object.
jagged-chisel 4mo ago
These are Designed. The target audience has tremendous disposable income, and Taste (subjectively, of course.) No one is buying this for economy’s sake.
onlypassingthru 4mo ago
Are there bootlegs on vinyl? Maybe now there can be.
- actionfromafar 4mo ago
  Isn't a vinyl cutter the first step when pressing records?
  - deleted 4mo ago
    [deleted]
  - wmf 4mo ago
    You might need different machines to cut wax/vinyl directly vs cutting lacquer to make a stamper.
- fileoffset 4mo ago
  yes there is, I bought one by accident the other day
klodolph 4mo ago
Teenage Engineering seems to run partly on hype and halo effect. It makes cool things you can’t afford, and you buy something cheaper. Selling a vinyl cutting machine keeps them in the news, which keeps them in your mind, and then you think about how you always wanted an OP-1 but oh maybe you could buy the EP-133 instead. I’m sure there’s a price at which the vinyl cutter is profitable.
- darnfish 4mo ago
  It's also possible that TE are full of people who are passionate about design and sound and want to work on and release interesting products in that space. Not everything is a psyop
  - klodolph 4mo ago
    That took my comment to a much darker place than I anticipated—I think basic marketing is ok, and even if you’re passionate about design, you still should be thinking about the business’s bottom line. But, like, https://teenage.engineering/store/field-desk https://teenage.engineering/store/field-desk Or maybe the TP-7 is a better example. They are obviously following the playbook from brands like Supreme. At least in part.
    - kev009 4mo ago
      That is hilarious. Ikea with the Rexroth price tag.
    - steve1977 4mo ago
      That's basically a bad Eiermann desk ripoff, but about twice as expensive as the original. https://www.richard-lampert.de/en/furniture/eiermann-1/ https://www.richard-lampert.de/en/furniture/eiermann-1/
      - actionfromafar 4mo ago
        The Eiermann looks more sturdy at a glance too, since the legs aren't at the corners.
retired_account 4mo ago
There’s certainly novelty to this, I’d love one if the price were reasonable. Direct capture, almost like a polaroid for vinyl records, no need to “develop” it. I imagine artists could sell a super-limited (i.e. 1 copy) live recording of a show the second it ends for a premium, especially if they kept the machine on stage and personally packaged and signed it.
pembrook 4mo ago
Sir, I commend you for your lack of taste for aesthetics, "coolness", and for maintaining the cynical, pessimistic Hackernews status quo. I've been worried this place has gotten eternal september'd full of redditors, AI bots, and low-IQ emotional mainstream political rants. But then you swoop in here and remind me that it's still 2007 in Hackernews land: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9224 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9224 Never change.
- nine_k 4mo ago
  To me, "cool" is a slightly derogatory term when applied to design. It usually means that smoke and mirrors play a significant role.
Waterluvian 4mo ago
I have a real “I was born yesterday” feeling having realized that “Teenage Engineering” has nothing to do with making audio tech accessible to young newcomers.
- fragmede 4mo ago
  rich young newcomers are totally welcome!
- Lio 4mo ago
  Is that entirely fair? Their Pocket Operators are pretty cheap and accessible.
  - picofarad 4mo ago
    They're like $100! That's not affordable for a thing that makes beeps and boops. I can only hope behringer continues to undercut them on things I care about.
    - Lio 4mo ago
      You can get Pocket Operators new from $59 depending on the model. That’s cheaper than any of beringer’s copies. If you can’t afford that consider used or stick to software.
rtpg 4mo ago
This isn't that but their "record factory" toy[0]... I'm like 90% sure is the same thing as something Gakken released in Japan for half the price as a little fun toy[1] Even in the age of the internet there's a huge business in people basically taking a "normal" thing from another market and then rebadging it to release as an elevated thing. Studio neat has a $231 tiny box cutter[2]. OLFA (A "professional" box cutter maker) sells a 2 pack of tiny box cutters that probably are 5x more ergonomic on account of being made to be used instead of to look nice on a website, for $10. [3] The best version of a thing is likely whatever people who do it all day use. But you can totally make a market for consumers who want "fashionable" things but who don't really get the space. Studio Neat is a big offender on this honestly... basically all of their stuff have "better" things at least at half the cost just available in random stationary stores. I'm all for wasting money on pens, but at least waste them on good pens! [0]: https://teenage.engineering/products/po-80 https://teenage.engineering/products/po-80 [1]: https://hon.gakken.jp/book/1575072200 https://hon.gakken.jp/book/1575072200 [2]: https://www.studioneat.com/products/keen https://www.studioneat.com/products/keen [3]: https://www.amazon.co.jp/-/en/OLFA-Compact-Knife-Pieces-95B2/dp/B001D38XR0 https://www.amazon.co.jp/-/en/OLFA-Compact-Knife-Pieces-95B2...
- 1123581321 4mo ago
  That fancy box cutter looks high utility; what don't you like about it besides the price? The retraction seems designed for frequently opening boxes, but not constantly. (I open few boxes and have a bog standard box cutter; I haven't used Studio Neat's or OLFA.)
  - Our_Benefactors 4mo ago
    It’s not made to fit in the hand. There’s no way to lock the blade forward. It’s one of the stupidest designs you could have for a box cutter.
    - sandcat_ 4mo ago
      For what it’s worth, a non-locking blade is a plus for some people. I wouldn’t really want to leave a locking box cutter around, I’m too forgetful, but one that stows itself away automatically I’d feel a bit safer about. Still a silly price, though.
cmrdporcupine 4mo ago
Back when I DJ'd techno in the 90s I would have killed for this for what it could bring creatively to a set. Just the ability to cut my own tracks onto white labels and put custom loops etc on vinyl would have really changed things entirely without having to front a whole bunch of cash (which I def did not have) to get a batch of records pressed which probably nobody else would order or play. But now mixing is done digitally and playing with vinyl is a mostly lost art and it's trivial to put your own material together into audio files and mix it.
- dylan604 4mo ago
  I've heard tales of Ritchie Hawtin playing multiple turntables (6-8 depending on who's telling) where he'd have tracks separated as stems into dub plates and do live remixes by swapping out the plates. The things people did before Ableton!
  - cmrdporcupine 4mo ago
    I saw him do 3... maybe 4? tables? But mostly 2 or 3 decks plus a 909. Around here in Toronto area we had a local (Jeff Milligan / "Algorithm") who was famous for absolutely precise beatmatching, and often 4 deck mixing. Very minimal wonky/bleepy techno. https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=2083209238436343 https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=2083209238436343 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAthnDk7ZcA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAthnDk7ZcA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6EJOzGj4xM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6EJOzGj4xM
    - dylan604 4mo ago
      Playing that minimal techno, I'd need at least that many tables just to keep from being bored.
      - cmrdporcupine 4mo ago
        I mean, it's not listening music, it's dancing music, and contextually needs to be placed in a very atmospheric, very dark room. And mixed well.
colechristensen 4mo ago
Market: music industry veterans that won the race and have boutique record labels for small runs of obscure or promotional or small bands. Have five records printed for the merch table and the next show. Once you have the machine hopefully the marginal cost of a record would make sense for extremely small runs. Where a band with no money might struggle to afford a $1000 minimum run somewhere else, they might be able to make beer money at a show with records made on one of these. Probably not "economical" in the machine may never pay for itself, but somebody rich buying one as a mechanism to promote musicians on a small scale probably makes sense to them.
Brian_K_White 4mo ago
I would buy a machine that makes new floppy disk media if it existed, and not because of any economical argument. I would buy a machine that makes new laserdiscs if it existed, and not because of any economical argument. ... aluminized paper for electric arc printers ... wax film thermal print head ribbon ... a re-inker for cloth typewriter ribbon (at least this one is straightforward to design and build myself some day) ... extra wide cloth matrix printer ribbon with 4 colors ... 1.9mm magnetic tape for exatron wafers A record cutter has way more potential audience than any of those. They will sell every one they can even manage to make.
thenthenthen 4mo ago
There is one company that sells similar lathe cutters in Europe. To aquire it you need to go on a multi day training in a remote Swiss forest. Then it’s around 10.000 EUR in equipment, granted you supply your own record player (sl1200 ~700EUR). But yeah cutting high quality stereo records is an art. No matter the money you throw at it, it will involve a lot of maintenance, skill, experience, spare parts, mastering skills, consumables, and time (these cut in real time). Indeed, who wants to do that? I welcome any effort in this niche though!
- thenthenthen 4mo ago
  Consistency is super hard to achieve if you are not cutting daily in a (climate) controlled environment, even then, you will burn out the cutting head transducers, your cutting heads will dull (super fast). Operational costs are pretty high. Wonder how much they will charge for this lathe. I guess 40-80k USD?
dylan604 4mo ago
Might I introduce you to the concept of dub plates? I absolutely love playing vinyl as a dj, and being able to cut my own would be worth it to me. Some people are just silly about their hobbies even without going into lalaland like an audiophile. Growing up, my dad had an 8-track recorder and a box of blank cassettes. I would record my music to them as the car I drove still had an 8-track player. It's goofy. It's fun. It's not logical per se, but it's also not hurting you. So leave me to my idiosyncrasies and go back to your Spotify feed and obey and consume as you do
phodo 4mo ago
>> "who wants to own cutting vinyl?" Well, Sega gamers for one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c744iD0_fWU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c744iD0_fWU
- enoeht 4mo ago
  they list them too https://teenage.engineering/retailers https://teenage.engineering/retailers
- picofarad 4mo ago
  There was software distributed by radio and vinyl i believe, which means my query if minidisc could be used was a silly one (in lieu of a tape drive, not for Sega!)
CyberDildonics 4mo ago
Maybe a party novelty for hipsters. This stuff is like expensive watches. If there was no one to show it off to there would be no one who would buy it.
dhosek 4mo ago
There used to be places where you could make your own one-of-a-kind record: pretty much direct microphone to vinyl¹ which I’m guessing this essentially is. But that said, I kind of feel like most of Teenage Engineering is more stunt than practical. ⸻ 1. A booth for making records like this plays a role in the plot of Graham Greene’s Brighton Rock. Elvis Presley’s very first recordings were a similar thing, the two sides recorded in a booth to make a singular record to give his mother as a present in 1953.
TylerE 4mo ago
Producing a lathe cut is the first (physical) step of many of pressing vinyl. This isn’t targeting consumers, or even record stores, but record pressing plants. This is kind of a big deal because this sort of fundamental equipment hasn’t been available new for decades. The vast majority of plants/mastering facilities are using old Scully lathes from the ‘50s and ‘60s. Those are getting ever older and harder to source parts for, and with the vinyl boom the number of pressing plants is actually going up.
deleted 4mo ago
[deleted]
atoav 4mo ago
Teenage Engineering has the market of people who have a lot of money to spend on a hobby, want a fancy product design and don't care about cost. The exception is their PO series stuff which is actually kind of affordable for what you can get out of them.
gizajob 4mo ago
Vinylrecorder.com There’s been a market for this for nearly 30 years (and the rest).

pstuart 4mo ago

Nor any clue on what blanks cost. But I could see the thrill of this if money was no object.

jagged-chisel 4mo ago

These are Designed. The target audience has tremendous disposable income, and Taste (subjectively, of course.) No one is buying this for economy’s sake.

onlypassingthru 4mo ago

Are there bootlegs on vinyl? Maybe now there can be.

actionfromafar 4mo ago
Isn't a vinyl cutter the first step when pressing records?
- deleted 4mo ago
  [deleted]
- wmf 4mo ago
  You might need different machines to cut wax/vinyl directly vs cutting lacquer to make a stamper.
fileoffset 4mo ago
yes there is, I bought one by accident the other day

klodolph 4mo ago

Teenage Engineering seems to run partly on hype and halo effect. It makes cool things you can’t afford, and you buy something cheaper. Selling a vinyl cutting machine keeps them in the news, which keeps them in your mind, and then you think about how you always wanted an OP-1 but oh maybe you could buy the EP-133 instead. I’m sure there’s a price at which the vinyl cutter is profitable.

darnfish 4mo ago
It's also possible that TE are full of people who are passionate about design and sound and want to work on and release interesting products in that space. Not everything is a psyop
- klodolph 4mo ago
  That took my comment to a much darker place than I anticipated—I think basic marketing is ok, and even if you’re passionate about design, you still should be thinking about the business’s bottom line. But, like, https://teenage.engineering/store/field-desk https://teenage.engineering/store/field-desk Or maybe the TP-7 is a better example. They are obviously following the playbook from brands like Supreme. At least in part.
  - kev009 4mo ago
    That is hilarious. Ikea with the Rexroth price tag.
  - steve1977 4mo ago
    That's basically a bad Eiermann desk ripoff, but about twice as expensive as the original. https://www.richard-lampert.de/en/furniture/eiermann-1/ https://www.richard-lampert.de/en/furniture/eiermann-1/
    - actionfromafar 4mo ago
      The Eiermann looks more sturdy at a glance too, since the legs aren't at the corners.

retired_account 4mo ago

There’s certainly novelty to this, I’d love one if the price were reasonable. Direct capture, almost like a polaroid for vinyl records, no need to “develop” it. I imagine artists could sell a super-limited (i.e. 1 copy) live recording of a show the second it ends for a premium, especially if they kept the machine on stage and personally packaged and signed it.

pembrook 4mo ago

Sir, I commend you for your lack of taste for aesthetics, "coolness", and for maintaining the cynical, pessimistic Hackernews status quo. I've been worried this place has gotten eternal september'd full of redditors, AI bots, and low-IQ emotional mainstream political rants. But then you swoop in here and remind me that it's still 2007 in Hackernews land: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9224 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9224 Never change.

nine_k 4mo ago
To me, "cool" is a slightly derogatory term when applied to design. It usually means that smoke and mirrors play a significant role.

Waterluvian 4mo ago

I have a real “I was born yesterday” feeling having realized that “Teenage Engineering” has nothing to do with making audio tech accessible to young newcomers.

fragmede 4mo ago
rich young newcomers are totally welcome!
Lio 4mo ago
Is that entirely fair? Their Pocket Operators are pretty cheap and accessible.
- picofarad 4mo ago
  They're like $100! That's not affordable for a thing that makes beeps and boops. I can only hope behringer continues to undercut them on things I care about.
  - Lio 4mo ago
    You can get Pocket Operators new from $59 depending on the model. That’s cheaper than any of beringer’s copies. If you can’t afford that consider used or stick to software.

rtpg 4mo ago

This isn't that but their "record factory" toy[0]... I'm like 90% sure is the same thing as something Gakken released in Japan for half the price as a little fun toy[1] Even in the age of the internet there's a huge business in people basically taking a "normal" thing from another market and then rebadging it to release as an elevated thing. Studio neat has a $231 tiny box cutter[2]. OLFA (A "professional" box cutter maker) sells a 2 pack of tiny box cutters that probably are 5x more ergonomic on account of being made to be used instead of to look nice on a website, for $10. [3] The best version of a thing is likely whatever people who do it all day use. But you can totally make a market for consumers who want "fashionable" things but who don't really get the space. Studio Neat is a big offender on this honestly... basically all of their stuff have "better" things at least at half the cost just available in random stationary stores. I'm all for wasting money on pens, but at least waste them on good pens! [0]: https://teenage.engineering/products/po-80 https://teenage.engineering/products/po-80 [1]: https://hon.gakken.jp/book/1575072200 https://hon.gakken.jp/book/1575072200 [2]: https://www.studioneat.com/products/keen https://www.studioneat.com/products/keen [3]: https://www.amazon.co.jp/-/en/OLFA-Compact-Knife-Pieces-95B2/dp/B001D38XR0 https://www.amazon.co.jp/-/en/OLFA-Compact-Knife-Pieces-95B2...

1123581321 4mo ago
That fancy box cutter looks high utility; what don't you like about it besides the price? The retraction seems designed for frequently opening boxes, but not constantly. (I open few boxes and have a bog standard box cutter; I haven't used Studio Neat's or OLFA.)
- Our_Benefactors 4mo ago
  It’s not made to fit in the hand. There’s no way to lock the blade forward. It’s one of the stupidest designs you could have for a box cutter.
  - sandcat_ 4mo ago
    For what it’s worth, a non-locking blade is a plus for some people. I wouldn’t really want to leave a locking box cutter around, I’m too forgetful, but one that stows itself away automatically I’d feel a bit safer about. Still a silly price, though.

cmrdporcupine 4mo ago

Back when I DJ'd techno in the 90s I would have killed for this for what it could bring creatively to a set. Just the ability to cut my own tracks onto white labels and put custom loops etc on vinyl would have really changed things entirely without having to front a whole bunch of cash (which I def did not have) to get a batch of records pressed which probably nobody else would order or play. But now mixing is done digitally and playing with vinyl is a mostly lost art and it's trivial to put your own material together into audio files and mix it.

dylan604 4mo ago
I've heard tales of Ritchie Hawtin playing multiple turntables (6-8 depending on who's telling) where he'd have tracks separated as stems into dub plates and do live remixes by swapping out the plates. The things people did before Ableton!
- cmrdporcupine 4mo ago
  I saw him do 3... maybe 4? tables? But mostly 2 or 3 decks plus a 909. Around here in Toronto area we had a local (Jeff Milligan / "Algorithm") who was famous for absolutely precise beatmatching, and often 4 deck mixing. Very minimal wonky/bleepy techno. https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=2083209238436343 https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=2083209238436343 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAthnDk7ZcA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAthnDk7ZcA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6EJOzGj4xM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6EJOzGj4xM
  - dylan604 4mo ago
    Playing that minimal techno, I'd need at least that many tables just to keep from being bored.
    - cmrdporcupine 4mo ago
      I mean, it's not listening music, it's dancing music, and contextually needs to be placed in a very atmospheric, very dark room. And mixed well.

colechristensen 4mo ago

Market: music industry veterans that won the race and have boutique record labels for small runs of obscure or promotional or small bands. Have five records printed for the merch table and the next show. Once you have the machine hopefully the marginal cost of a record would make sense for extremely small runs. Where a band with no money might struggle to afford a $1000 minimum run somewhere else, they might be able to make beer money at a show with records made on one of these. Probably not "economical" in the machine may never pay for itself, but somebody rich buying one as a mechanism to promote musicians on a small scale probably makes sense to them.

Brian_K_White 4mo ago

I would buy a machine that makes new floppy disk media if it existed, and not because of any economical argument. I would buy a machine that makes new laserdiscs if it existed, and not because of any economical argument. ... aluminized paper for electric arc printers ... wax film thermal print head ribbon ... a re-inker for cloth typewriter ribbon (at least this one is straightforward to design and build myself some day) ... extra wide cloth matrix printer ribbon with 4 colors ... 1.9mm magnetic tape for exatron wafers A record cutter has way more potential audience than any of those. They will sell every one they can even manage to make.

thenthenthen 4mo ago

There is one company that sells similar lathe cutters in Europe. To aquire it you need to go on a multi day training in a remote Swiss forest. Then it’s around 10.000 EUR in equipment, granted you supply your own record player (sl1200 ~700EUR). But yeah cutting high quality stereo records is an art. No matter the money you throw at it, it will involve a lot of maintenance, skill, experience, spare parts, mastering skills, consumables, and time (these cut in real time). Indeed, who wants to do that? I welcome any effort in this niche though!

thenthenthen 4mo ago
Consistency is super hard to achieve if you are not cutting daily in a (climate) controlled environment, even then, you will burn out the cutting head transducers, your cutting heads will dull (super fast). Operational costs are pretty high. Wonder how much they will charge for this lathe. I guess 40-80k USD?

dylan604 4mo ago

Might I introduce you to the concept of dub plates? I absolutely love playing vinyl as a dj, and being able to cut my own would be worth it to me. Some people are just silly about their hobbies even without going into lalaland like an audiophile. Growing up, my dad had an 8-track recorder and a box of blank cassettes. I would record my music to them as the car I drove still had an 8-track player. It's goofy. It's fun. It's not logical per se, but it's also not hurting you. So leave me to my idiosyncrasies and go back to your Spotify feed and obey and consume as you do

phodo 4mo ago

>> "who wants to own cutting vinyl?" Well, Sega gamers for one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c744iD0_fWU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c744iD0_fWU

enoeht 4mo ago
they list them too https://teenage.engineering/retailers https://teenage.engineering/retailers
picofarad 4mo ago
There was software distributed by radio and vinyl i believe, which means my query if minidisc could be used was a silly one (in lieu of a tape drive, not for Sega!)

CyberDildonics 4mo ago

Maybe a party novelty for hipsters. This stuff is like expensive watches. If there was no one to show it off to there would be no one who would buy it.

dhosek 4mo ago

There used to be places where you could make your own one-of-a-kind record: pretty much direct microphone to vinyl¹ which I’m guessing this essentially is. But that said, I kind of feel like most of Teenage Engineering is more stunt than practical. ⸻ 1. A booth for making records like this plays a role in the plot of Graham Greene’s Brighton Rock. Elvis Presley’s very first recordings were a similar thing, the two sides recorded in a booth to make a singular record to give his mother as a present in 1953.

TylerE 4mo ago

Producing a lathe cut is the first (physical) step of many of pressing vinyl. This isn’t targeting consumers, or even record stores, but record pressing plants. This is kind of a big deal because this sort of fundamental equipment hasn’t been available new for decades. The vast majority of plants/mastering facilities are using old Scully lathes from the ‘50s and ‘60s. Those are getting ever older and harder to source parts for, and with the vinyl boom the number of pressing plants is actually going up.

deleted 4mo ago

[deleted]

atoav 4mo ago

Teenage Engineering has the market of people who have a lot of money to spend on a hobby, want a fancy product design and don't care about cost. The exception is their PO series stuff which is actually kind of affordable for what you can get out of them.

gizajob 4mo ago

Vinylrecorder.com There’s been a market for this for nearly 30 years (and the rest).