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Only aristocrats can play that game. The soldier is being punished for doing something not allowed for his class status. This is how a caste system works. Peop
by Frieren 6mo ago
Only aristocrats can play that game. The soldier is being punished for doing something not allowed for his class status.
This is how a caste system works. People is not judged based on their actions but their relationship to power.
- spwa4 6mo ago> This is how a caste system works. Not at all. In a caste system a lower caste person will get attacked if he (or especially she) has any success at all. Whether or not what they did was legal or not does not factor into the equation. First priority is that the highest up dalit is lower than the worst drunkard brahmin, even if they have to kill them.
- Fricken 6mo agoTulsa once had what was known as Black Wall Street. There were too many successful black men, so 1921 in the whites massacred everybody. They even brought in planes and dropped bombs. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulsa_race_massacre https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulsa_race_massacre
- b112 6mo ago[flagged]
- Fricken 6mo ago[flagged]
- b112 6mo ago[flagged]
- deleted 6mo ago[deleted]
- the_gipsy 6mo agoIt's... pretty simple.
- b112 6mo ago[flagged]
- uoaei 6mo agoYour refusal to interact with subtext has me guffawing. I wonder if you even recognize what you're doing. In the history of revolution, there is never (except in elementary school) all that much weight put on the singular act which instigated the final result. The conditions in place (Jim Crow laws, Southern pride, etc.) lead up to a final moment which our monkey brains like to point to as the cause but in reality there is a simmering cultural froth which could boil over in any number of ways: it just happens that one of the ways is what's described in the Wikipedia article, but it could have started many other ways. All of our understanding about the experience of being Black in the US during that time helps to contextualize the extreme and disproportionate outburst of violence by the White population as racially motivated, serving under an ideology best described as ur-"Great Replacement Theory". In simpler words, the destruction of Black Wall Street is not without precedent, indeed this was merely one of the more famous and complete examples of destroying the wealth that Black people enjoyed, if only briefly due to the hate of those visiting violence upon them.
- rithdmc 6mo ago> I wonder if you even recognize what you're doing. "Don't feed the trolls". They absolutely do know what they're doing.
- kennywinker 6mo agoYou really read a single wikipedia article and think you understand what happened and why? Impressive levels of dunning-kruger on display. Go read a book about it, and then if you still want to, you can tell us why this interpretation is wrong.
- lukan 6mo agoWell, I am also having trouble with stating it as a fact, that the reason was they were too wealthy. Might have played a role later, but that is not clear to me from what is stated on wiki: "The massacre began during Memorial Day weekend after 19-year-old Dick Rowland, a black shoeshiner, was accused of assaulting Sarah Page, a white 21-year-old elevator operator in the nearby Drexel Building.[25] He was arrested and rumors spread that he was to be lynched. Several hundred white residents assembled outside the courthouse, appearing to have the makings of a lynch mob. A group of approximately 50–60 black men, armed with rifles and shotguns, arrived at the jail to support the sheriff and his deputies in defending Rowland from the mob. Having seen the armed black men, some of the whites who had been at the courthouse went home for their own guns. There are conflicting reports about the exact time and nature of the incident, or incidents, that immediately precipitated the massacre. According to the 2001 Commission, "As the black men were leaving, a white man attempted to disarm a tall, African American World War I veteran. A struggle ensued, and a shot rang out." Then, according to the sheriff, "all hell broke loose."[26] The two groups shot at each other until midnight when the group of black men was greatly outnumbered and forced to retreat to Greenwood."
- Spooky23 6mo agoSo you take issue with the idea that an out of mob that burned down 35 blocks of a mid sized city was motivated by envy and resentment of the prosperous black community. Instead, you assert it was a mob that assembled to lynch a young man who was arrested for assault after he stepped on the foot of or grabbed the arm of a white female elevator operator when he tripped in the elevator. I guess they got out of hand when there was resistance to their murdering the kid. Why is that distinction so important to you?
- rectang 6mo agoThe broader theme of antagonism to Black success motivating the thoroughness of the destruction is a common observation about Tulsa.
- b112 6mo ago[flagged]
- shakna 6mo agoNice to see sealioning is alive and well on HN.
- Muromec 6mo agoBut do we actually have a proof that ** bombed *, maybe they bombed their own school to make you feel sad?
- notahacker 6mo agoHere's a contemporary opinion, from the state attorney general at the time, the highest ranking person in a judicial apparatus that didn't prosecute anyone for participating in it. Looks like the fact that "the Negro" was so rich he didn't "accept the white man as his benefactor" was a pretty big deal... The cause of this riot was not Tulsa. It might have happened anywhere for the Negro is not the same man he was thirty years ago when he was content to plod along his own road accepting the white man as his benefactor. But the years have passed and the Negro has been educated and the race papers have spread the thought of race equality.
- b112 6mo agoThere is no discussion of wealth in your quote. And further, that quote supports what I've been saying. It specifically says "the cause of this riot was not Tulsa", and "It might have happened anywhere". If it "might have happened anywhere", it therefore has nothing to do with the unique high-wealth of this area.
- Muromec 6mo agoWould you feel bad if it was actually true? Would it pose even a minor inconvenience for your life if that was exactly the case? What's the problem anyway.
- gzread 6mo agoRead between the lines.
- pmc123 6mo ago[flagged]
- stonogo 6mo ago[flagged]
- gadders 6mo agoThat's the urban myth, yes.
- deleted 6mo ago[deleted]
- kennywinker 6mo agoWell documented historical events aren’t urban myths.
- gadders 6mo agoPeople died, yes. But there was no white supremacism. There was no Wall Street. It was just like any high street. It was triggered by an attempted rape.
- kennywinker 6mo ago> there was no white supremacism People were murdered and homes and businesses destroyed by a white mob because they were black. How is that anything but white supremacy? > There was no Wall Street. It was just like any high street. It was one of the wealthiest black communities in america at a time. “Black wall street” was a nickname, not a literal description of a stock exchange. > It was triggered by an attempted rape. No, it was triggered by an attempted lynching of a black man. Or if you want to be more specific, because the community there stood up to protect the arrested man. It was triggered by a black community stopping a lynching. Your assertions are an ahistorical revisionist fantasy.
- spwa4 6mo agoAre we now not at all allowed to reference problems in other societies? We can complain about western society, and complaints from 100 years ago, when even my grandfather wasn't born yet, are valid criticism of America/Europe/... but things that happen today in India, Pakistan, Turkey are off limits?
- joe_mamba 6mo ago[flagged]
- oh_my_goodness 6mo agoWho complained about bringing up the foul stuff that goes on outside the US?
- bandofthehawk 6mo agoNo one did of course, but it's a common tactic of distraction to try to focus the attention on something else. That way people don't have to experience the discomfort thinking about the negative thing going on in their own society.
- samsari 6mo agoYou're almost right, but "class" and "caste" are not synonyms and cannot be used interchangeably.
- rob74 6mo agoWell, as social mobility between classes becomes increasingly difficult, they become more and more like castes...
- baxtr 6mo agoOP is right. Status games take many shapes, distinct castes is one special shape.
- 21asdffdsa12 6mo agoYou can already hear the pseudo-theories, justifying the differences for eternity. Blue blooded, of lazy blood, etc. Apply yourselfs and you will win.. adding insult to injury, when you can not win, you must in addition be lazy with only yourself to blame.
- deleted 6mo ago[deleted]
- darepublic 6mo agoI don't think it's really as simple as that. Source: lazybones
- Dylan16807 6mo agoBeing in Congress is very mobile, and they're the ones with the special exemption.
- dyauspitr 6mo agoSounds like people’s lot in life is becoming hereditary. Caste can be used.
- alistairSH 6mo ago
- burnt-resistor 6mo agoNot so much class or caste, but a dual-state where an elite have a normative or lawless state, and specific or arbitrary others suffer a parallel prerogative or punitive state. This is the essence of corrupt authoritarianism. Most Americans share a delusion of perpetual glory days like a former star high school football quarterback with the refusal to accept factual reality that their country isn't uniformly excellent and is terrible in many ways including being extremely superficial, corrupt, dangerous, unhealthy, unhappy, paranoid, over-reacting, immature, selfish, unfair, disinformed, and unequal.
- Muromec 6mo agoMore like three. One class where you can do whatever you can pay for, another with a set of annoying but almost reasonable rules and the last one for whom any actions and their mere existence is illegal, but whose presence is very much relied upon to do things.
- burnt-resistor 6mo agoIt's a simplified model to expose unseen hypocrisy and injustice that originated with the persecution of jews in the German Nazi justice system. In reality, 2 or 3 is too simplistic as the US values people differently in different contexts with numerous attribute privilege points. Don't be old, brown, short, homeless, and unattractive in America except to be constantly harassed.
- pixl97 6mo agoFrank Wilhoit: “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition …There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.”
- Razengan 6mo ago> their relationship to power The word "power" is so ironic in human cultures: It's the people with the guns (and muscles) that have the literal physical power. They could shoot the aristocrats dead if they wanted to. The aristocrats' "power" is make-believe like the rest of their papers and numbers: The various psychological barriers which dissuade the gun-bearers from ever reaching the "want to" part.
- IsTom 6mo agoHistorically aristocracy was the military class. Nowadays in authoritarian societies it looks like it's mostly matter of time before military takes the lead.
- dctoedt 6mo ago> Nowadays in authoritarian societies it looks like it's mostly matter of time before military takes the lead. See, e.g., Iran's IGRC. Counterexamples: China, Russia — and the U.S.?
- argomo 6mo agoA military coup in the U.S. is imaginable, which probably explains some of the top brass purges (until recently, where it's probably an attempt to deflect blame for the massive Iran fuck up). Putin did it better; he kept the military weak and aggressively managed the risk via the FSB.
- simonh 6mo agoI don't think it's plausible, but an authoritarian president invoking emergency powers and deploying military and paramilitary forces to exert control on the streets is, on the basis it's already going on at a limited scale. All it takes is for that scale to gradually dial up over time until the frog's cooked. The problem you have is these elected kings. Not just any king, pretty specifically the majority of the powers enjoyed by George III in the 1790s. The fact that you still have this, unreformed over 200 years later and still think that somehow your constitutional system is modern, is a matter for despair. Get yourselves a proper parliamentary system, with maybe a head of state as a figurehead.
- globalnode 6mo agosoldiers are disposable, they prolly threw him under the bus hoping that would be the end of the matter and they could walk away with the rest of the money.
- renticulous 6mo agoMost Americans Can't Afford This Basic...Commodity? https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Zzwp_Ypsi9I https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Zzwp_Ypsi9I
- globalnode 6mo agoVery funny, thanks for adding that to my list of cynical ideas.
- smcin 6mo agoWhat, can't afford a Senator or two??
- vlan0 6mo ago[flagged]
- kstrauser 6mo ago[dead]
- roysting 6mo agoI think an important distinction is not really the class matter, it’s really more a jealousy and spite that the political and bureaucratic betters could not profit from it, not that he did so much. If he had had the means of letting all or maybe just a relevant and important enough cadre of aristocrats know the inside information, he would have surely not been prosecuted. I know this from first hand knowledge. It may seem the same or like a distinction without a difference to some, but that is really how things work and why he was prosecuted, not because he profited, but because he did not let others in on it and they really want to discourage that behavior, hence his flogging and his public flogging at that. And yes, if you get the sense that it’s like organized crime, then yes, that is and long has been how the US government and many other governments have functioned for a long time now. It’s what also makes them so easily controlled by the US. It could have easily also been swept under the rug while still sending a signal within the system, but it wasn’t and we were all told about it. And that is how the ruling parasites really get rich, none of that hard work and smarts stuff; those are the stories told to keep the peasant cattle voting for the slaughterhouse, dreaming of the wide open pastures of also becoming rich by working hard. Fraud, cheating, lying, manipulation … that’s the name of the American dream game. I again apologize to anyone who feels what and how I say things is “flame bait” or a personal attack, it’s simply just how I speak and like to challenge people’s comfortable assumptions. Feel free to dismiss what I say of you disagree with me. No offense intended and no flaming or whatever necessary, it’s just people speaking to each other or not. We’ll all be fine if we keep talking, even if you don’t like what others have to say or want to control how they say things.