5 ms·

Always try to sit in seats where your back is toward the direction of motion.

xlbuttplug2 9mo ago
Huh. I'd never thought of this. If that is actually meaningfully beneficial, I wonder if they'd design self driving cars with the seats facing backwards, given there's no longer a necessity to look at the road. (edit: I guess it's more of no-brainer on a train/bus where you don't have a seat belt)
- radicaldreamer 9mo ago
  Infant car seats face backwards, they recommend backwards facing for a long as possible (until the kid is too big to fit comfortably in a backwards facing position).
- keyle 9mo ago
  Not the author, but I think there was some research and it's indeed better for you if you have head support, to be facing back towards the front. If prevents a whole range of injuries, from your neck, to becoming a projectile yourself. But it's really theoretical, and does not account for the passenger in front of you headed head-first into your throat. PS: I laughed hard that xlbuttplug2 is answering to deadbabe. The internet lives!
  - rooo999 9mo ago
    Not sure what kind of cars you drive but in mine all the seats face the same direction. Why would they change that when making it safer?
    - denkmoon 9mo ago
      Consider the "booth seats" in trains and busses. So people can chat etc facing each other. If you've got a waymo with your friends why wouldn't you want the seats facing each other so you can be social, excluding this safety factor.
  - raaron773 9mo ago
    Interesting. I didnt know this, i always get motiom sickness if i sit facing the opposite direction.
  - deleted 9mo ago
    [deleted]
- 0xfaded 9mo ago
  Disclaimer I work for Zoox, but here is us crash testing https://youtu.be/597C9OwV0o4 https://youtu.be/597C9OwV0o4
  - deadbolt 9mo ago
    I enjoyed watching that - though it wasn't really related to the seating direction, specifically. Are you one of the safety engineers? Have you discovered anything which isn't included in normal safety tests which should be?
- dtech 9mo ago
  It's incredibly beneficial. However many people dislike it and want to be facing the direction they are moving in, so best case is probably a train-style 4-seater. Which 2 seats facing forward and 2 backwards.
- holowoodman 9mo ago
  Sitting backwards is beneficial if looking at accidents. But sitting backwards is very very uncomfortable if there is any kind of uneven acceleration, bumps, swaying, rolling, curvy tracks or whatever. Humans need to look forward at the horizon to get their visual stimuli aligned with their motion/balance sense in the inner ear. If that alignment isn't there, you will get seasick. Backwards makes this even worse. Babies don't suffer from this, because closing your eyes helps, and infants don't have as strong a reaction to motions anyways, due to them usually being carried by their parents until walking age. So reverse baby seats only work for babies.
  - jurip 9mo ago
    That's a serious overgeneralization. It's true for some people, but trains mostly don't bump and swerve enough for that to be a significant problem. Finnish trains have lots of seats facing backwards and while they're not anywhere as fast as something like a TGV, they're still often going 200+ km/h. People seem to be just fine. I just spent 1 hour 40 minutes yesterday sitting backwards, mostly reading a book, with no ill effects.
bjackman 9mo ago
Train crashes like this are _so_ rare. It's not as safe as flying but AFAICT in rich countries it's the same rough order of magnitude in terms of danger level. I don't have data but I would imagine crashes on these high speed lines (which always seem to be run at a higher level of professionalism than the general networks) are rarest of all. I don't think it's a good use of mental energy to plan for a crash like this. You're better off using your brain cycles on hygiene or not losing your luggage.
- sillysaurusx 9mo ago
  Brain cycles aren’t a limited supply. Besides, you’ll get to feel a nice jolt of serotonin when you remember to sit backwards. > I would imagine crashes on these high speed lines (which always seem to be run at a higher level of professionalism than the general networks) are rarest of all If this crash is anything like the other ones, you might be surprised. Safety complacency tends to cause maintenance failures. Plus the low speed lines are less deadly since the total energy is proportional to velocity squared, and v is low. In other words, it might be more helpful to look at it as "if they’re run at a higher level of standards, it’s because they have to be". Statistically you’re probably right, but considering how many brain cycles we waste on non-essentials, it’s just as fun to waste them on this. That way you can start a nerdy conversation with your travel companions, and they can learn to travel without you next time.
  - Dylan16807 9mo ago
    > Brain cycles aren’t a limited supply. Sure they are. > Besides, you’ll get to feel a nice jolt of serotonin when you remember to sit backwards. I can also get that by remembering that I'm conquering a superstition and fitting my behavior closer to real risks.
  - lxgr 9mo ago
    Zero-risk bias at work. If it’s actually fun for you, don’t let anyone stop you, but I wouldn’t go as far as making it a confident general recommendation.
  - crote 9mo ago
deleted 9mo ago
[deleted]
mitthrowaway2 9mo ago
I feel like airplanes should be designed this way. Outside of takeoff and landing it would be pretty hard to even notice the difference, once you're seated.
- cromulent 9mo ago
  At least BEA airliners used to have quite a few backward facing seats, up to half the plane. However, there were a number of problems - people didn't like sitting in them, people didn't like hearing that their seat wasn't as safe as the others, you can't get as many rows in unless you turn them all backwards, and the structure needs to be designed differently so then you need more spares.
- whatevaa 9mo ago
  C5 Galaxy (US military jumbo cargo plane) has a passenger compartment with rear facing seats.
gitaarik 9mo ago
Or sit in the back of the train rather than the front
- cyberpunk 9mo ago
  It was the rear carriage which derailed
  - pantulis 9mo ago
    ... but it seems most casualties in this accident are the passengers in the first carriages of the second train. You never know.
- dboreham 9mo ago
  Middle.
rsynnott 9mo ago
This is so rare that it's not really worth thinking about, as a passenger (of course, it should be on the _operators_ minds). You're far more likely to die getting to the station.
sillyfluke 9mo ago
I mean if there is actually conclusive evidence that this is safer how is it not criminal to not have all trains adhere to this? The only thing I can think of is motion sickness for some sizable minority of passengers, but even then I would expect them to know the rough percentage of passengers that would discomforted enough to not get on the train.

Huh. I'd never thought of this. If that is actually meaningfully beneficial, I wonder if they'd design self driving cars with the seats facing backwards, given there's no longer a necessity to look at the road. (edit: I guess it's more of no-brainer on a train/bus where you don't have a seat belt)

radicaldreamer 9mo ago
Infant car seats face backwards, they recommend backwards facing for a long as possible (until the kid is too big to fit comfortably in a backwards facing position).
keyle 9mo ago
Not the author, but I think there was some research and it's indeed better for you if you have head support, to be facing back towards the front. If prevents a whole range of injuries, from your neck, to becoming a projectile yourself. But it's really theoretical, and does not account for the passenger in front of you headed head-first into your throat. PS: I laughed hard that xlbuttplug2 is answering to deadbabe. The internet lives!
- rooo999 9mo ago
  Not sure what kind of cars you drive but in mine all the seats face the same direction. Why would they change that when making it safer?
  - denkmoon 9mo ago
    Consider the "booth seats" in trains and busses. So people can chat etc facing each other. If you've got a waymo with your friends why wouldn't you want the seats facing each other so you can be social, excluding this safety factor.
- raaron773 9mo ago
  Interesting. I didnt know this, i always get motiom sickness if i sit facing the opposite direction.
- deleted 9mo ago
  [deleted]
0xfaded 9mo ago
Disclaimer I work for Zoox, but here is us crash testing https://youtu.be/597C9OwV0o4 https://youtu.be/597C9OwV0o4
- deadbolt 9mo ago
  I enjoyed watching that - though it wasn't really related to the seating direction, specifically. Are you one of the safety engineers? Have you discovered anything which isn't included in normal safety tests which should be?
dtech 9mo ago
It's incredibly beneficial. However many people dislike it and want to be facing the direction they are moving in, so best case is probably a train-style 4-seater. Which 2 seats facing forward and 2 backwards.
holowoodman 9mo ago
Sitting backwards is beneficial if looking at accidents. But sitting backwards is very very uncomfortable if there is any kind of uneven acceleration, bumps, swaying, rolling, curvy tracks or whatever. Humans need to look forward at the horizon to get their visual stimuli aligned with their motion/balance sense in the inner ear. If that alignment isn't there, you will get seasick. Backwards makes this even worse. Babies don't suffer from this, because closing your eyes helps, and infants don't have as strong a reaction to motions anyways, due to them usually being carried by their parents until walking age. So reverse baby seats only work for babies.
- jurip 9mo ago
  That's a serious overgeneralization. It's true for some people, but trains mostly don't bump and swerve enough for that to be a significant problem. Finnish trains have lots of seats facing backwards and while they're not anywhere as fast as something like a TGV, they're still often going 200+ km/h. People seem to be just fine. I just spent 1 hour 40 minutes yesterday sitting backwards, mostly reading a book, with no ill effects.

bjackman 9mo ago

Train crashes like this are _so_ rare. It's not as safe as flying but AFAICT in rich countries it's the same rough order of magnitude in terms of danger level. I don't have data but I would imagine crashes on these high speed lines (which always seem to be run at a higher level of professionalism than the general networks) are rarest of all. I don't think it's a good use of mental energy to plan for a crash like this. You're better off using your brain cycles on hygiene or not losing your luggage.

sillysaurusx 9mo ago
Brain cycles aren’t a limited supply. Besides, you’ll get to feel a nice jolt of serotonin when you remember to sit backwards. > I would imagine crashes on these high speed lines (which always seem to be run at a higher level of professionalism than the general networks) are rarest of all If this crash is anything like the other ones, you might be surprised. Safety complacency tends to cause maintenance failures. Plus the low speed lines are less deadly since the total energy is proportional to velocity squared, and v is low. In other words, it might be more helpful to look at it as "if they’re run at a higher level of standards, it’s because they have to be". Statistically you’re probably right, but considering how many brain cycles we waste on non-essentials, it’s just as fun to waste them on this. That way you can start a nerdy conversation with your travel companions, and they can learn to travel without you next time.
- Dylan16807 9mo ago
  > Brain cycles aren’t a limited supply. Sure they are. > Besides, you’ll get to feel a nice jolt of serotonin when you remember to sit backwards. I can also get that by remembering that I'm conquering a superstition and fitting my behavior closer to real risks.
- lxgr 9mo ago
  Zero-risk bias at work. If it’s actually fun for you, don’t let anyone stop you, but I wouldn’t go as far as making it a confident general recommendation.
- crote 9mo ago

deleted 9mo ago

[deleted]

mitthrowaway2 9mo ago

I feel like airplanes should be designed this way. Outside of takeoff and landing it would be pretty hard to even notice the difference, once you're seated.

cromulent 9mo ago
At least BEA airliners used to have quite a few backward facing seats, up to half the plane. However, there were a number of problems - people didn't like sitting in them, people didn't like hearing that their seat wasn't as safe as the others, you can't get as many rows in unless you turn them all backwards, and the structure needs to be designed differently so then you need more spares.
whatevaa 9mo ago
C5 Galaxy (US military jumbo cargo plane) has a passenger compartment with rear facing seats.

gitaarik 9mo ago

Or sit in the back of the train rather than the front

cyberpunk 9mo ago
It was the rear carriage which derailed
- pantulis 9mo ago
  ... but it seems most casualties in this accident are the passengers in the first carriages of the second train. You never know.
dboreham 9mo ago
Middle.

rsynnott 9mo ago

This is so rare that it's not really worth thinking about, as a passenger (of course, it should be on the _operators_ minds). You're far more likely to die getting to the station.

sillyfluke 9mo ago

I mean if there is actually conclusive evidence that this is safer how is it not criminal to not have all trains adhere to this? The only thing I can think of is motion sickness for some sizable minority of passengers, but even then I would expect them to know the rough percentage of passengers that would discomforted enough to not get on the train.