8 ms·

The depth and coverage that cloudflare has is crazy

sschueller 9mo ago
Yes and that is a very bad thing for the rest of the world. Time for non-us companies especially ones not doing business in the US to migrate away.
- Fokamul 9mo ago
  I wouldn't touch anything US-based with 10m long pole. At this this, US is basically enemy to EU. Good for us, we will be less dependent on US global oil police. I hope EU companies will stop manufacturing US airplanes and other things.
  - rs_rs_rs_rs_rs 9mo ago
    >I wouldn't touch anything US-based with 10m long pole. And yet, here you are...
    - pbhjpbhj 9mo ago
      Just when you think it's only the evil dictatorial regime trying to break up NATO along comes a helpful, presumably USA-based HN commenter, to remind you that a lot of USA citizens are also supportive of destroying any semblance of accord with former allied nations and spreading disharmony wherever they go. It's right for all of us to consider whether our online presence supports fascist dictators be they from USA, Russia, Venezuela, or wherever. Thanks for the reminder that even here people are sometimes shit, I guess.
    - urbandw311er 9mo ago
      > And yet, here you are... I'm pretty sure you know what the parent poster meant, and you should take it as a compliment to you and our HN community that they didn't intend you, or us, to be included in that definition of 'anything US-based'. Stirring the pot like that isn't helpful to you, to HN itself, or any of our community.
    - anthk 9mo ago
      Hackers -the ones from MIT- and smart people hate the US goverment snooping and Echelon like projects more than Europeans. These were either privacy first since forever. If not, they fought hard to say whatever they liked without consequences. In current times, encrypted accesses to Usenet and IRC via I2P and the like will boost the platforms more than ever. Why? IRC and Usenet are dead simple, Emacs has ports to everything and among being a Lisp env, an editor and a minimal web browser, it's an IRC and Usenet client too even under Android. Oh, and you can set I2P under Android too. Thus, you just have to set Emacs against it. There are several guides online. Rocksolid BBS' federate with the whole Usenet (and some newsgroups catch anything text based, no binaries). On I2P proxies to Libera.chat, it's just a matter of time to exist. Meanwhile, there's ILITA IRC with I2PD. Difficult? A Chinese Bluetooth keyboard it's worth very little today, and the gains are enormous. You can chat with people with really small bandwidths but encrypted either with TLS or I2P. You don't have blocks (except bans under IRC), comment limits, enforced timelines and any enshittification coming from social networks. Also, you can short Usenet threads by score. That's it, it's there a brilliant poster and comp.misc, you set the score for all his comment to 1000; then that random Joe will always be on top in any group. Try that with X/Twitter, Reddit or whatever. You will be able to chat with Western Europeans, Eastern Europeans, the Japanese, anyone. Forget tribes, forget the bullshit made to earn zillions of cash from X with shitty fabricated polemics. Forget Meta's snooping and industrial stealing. You aren't enforced to give your real name and address.
  - f1shy 9mo ago
    That the relations between EU and USA are not in an historical maximum, no discussion... but enemy? The hyperbole is a little big too far fetched. > I hope EU companies will stop manufacturing US airplanes and other things. Independent of how little we may like current US politics: a) it will probably change, more sooner than later. And b) starting a trade war with the US is not very good idea. We like it or not, there are many things that we need desperately to be able to produce. Starting with computers and SW. And please don't start with "OOS SW" as much as I like the idea, and I constantly advocate for it, even if we start yesterday, it will take decades to build everything again.
    - DrScientist 9mo ago
      > The hyperbole is a little big too far fetched. Sure. Though I think the EU is thinking that blowing up critical energy pipelines and seriously damaging Europes economy through the resulting much higher energy prices wasn't too friendly. All to boost US energy exports, make US manufacturing more competitive and met US geopolitical goals. ie that's not declaring war - but's it's a pretty big FU wake up call. Turning a blind eye when the US treats central and south american countries with contempt is one thing, but it's a bit of a shock when it openly does the same to you - cf Greenland as another example.
      - f1shy 9mo ago
        > Though I think the EU is thinking that blowing up critical energy pipelines and seriously damaging Europes economy through the resulting much higher energy prices wasn't too friendly. Although if you ask "cui bono?" there are some pointers in that direction, is not proven, and there are also pointers in other directions. I refrain of accusing without reasonable proof. >All to boost US energy exports, make US manufacturing more competitive and met US geopolitical goals. I cannot blame them for that. Of course anything they do is in their benefit. Some may argue, is precisely what the government should do. It is clear, that while the action in Venezuela was against a very shady government, was done thinking in US interests (as can be clearly seen by titles as "Trump Says Venezuela Will Buy Only US-Made Products From Oil Deal Proceeds"). So yes, they do all in own interest, and the EU isn't and wasn't very different. Alone if you consider the long colonialism years. Now the EU is acting poorly, but I would say not out of altruism, but incompetence and bureaucratic stagnation. I will not say "is impossible" they do the same in Greenland... For good reason I think. BUT comparing the 2 is also farfetched. I know plenty of people from Venezuela, and unless you were part of the government, you were strongly against it. I know no venezuelan (from the at least 100 I know) that wanted Maduro there. And many are still in party modus. Granted, I know primarily expats, so, survivor bias may apply... but still.
  - heraldgeezer 9mo ago
    People like you drive EU to China instead. USA an enemy to EU because of Venezuela? LMAO, EU has said nothing. In fact we agree. We have no relations to Venezuela. Now if the USA attacks Greenland, that is different.
    - dekrg 9mo ago
      It is the US and its recent actions, including its rhetoric, that are driving people towards China. Also, only reacting to US aggression after Greenland is attacked? Not prepare at all and then write a strongly worded letter after the fact? If, after everything Trump has done, you still think he isn't serious about annexing Greenland then you and people like you, including the eurocrats, are truly hopeless.
      - DrScientist 9mo ago
        Or to put it another way - is the binary US/China choice as top dog a false one? I suspect most countries would prefer a multi-polar world where the majority is dominant ( democratic ), not one particular country ( autocratic ). ie why do we have to choose to be under the heel of the US or under the heel of China? The US has been playing the benevolent dictator role for the last 70 years, but when faced with losing the dictator role, the benevolent facade is dropping. The US is mistaken to think that countries not wanting US dominance is the same as wanting Chinese dominance - they, in fact, want neither.
        amrocha 9mo ago
        The global south would argue that there’s been nothing benevolent about pax americana.
        esseph 9mo ago
        How are those Chinese infrastructure loans going in Africa and South America?
        9mo ago
  - richwater 9mo ago
    > we will be less dependent on US global oil police EU, Germany especially Loves Russian oil. So congrats?
supriyo-biswas 9mo ago
It is perfectly normal for an anycast network operator to have multiple sites from which they make BGP announcements (which is how anycast works in the first place), which gives them multiple vantage points for this sort of analysis. Other CDN companies can do it too, it's just that they don't work on signalling their engineering focused organization.
- bandrami 9mo ago
  This was a while ago but I think it was Akamai that pioneered that. I remember how impressive it was in the early oughts though we take it for granted now.
usefulposter 9mo ago
[flagged]
samsari 9mo ago
They have a lot of resources, Cloudflare Is Awesome
- bayindirh 9mo ago
  > Cloudflare Is Awesome Until their systems block you for no reason. I recently had a similar issue on a work related site. Fortunately, I was able to reach to the administrator (which is on another country) and had the knowledge to write a report which was useful enough for the said administrator. And this is for a system which has the same static IP which is not shared with anything for 10ish years.
  - afandian 9mo ago
    I recently, with great reluctance, had to put a personal site behind Cloudflare free option. It gets lots of use, but brings no revenue (costs me to run) and I have little spare time. Found out that I was blocked from it in my default setup. Firefox with default settings, and no VPN. I'm working hard to turn Cloudflare off. Cloudflare is not remotely awsome. It's also a solution to a problem (aggressive scrapers that produce DOS) which is worse.
    - duskdozer 9mo ago
      What malicious usage are you seeing? You might have a lot more usage than me, but fail2ban has been enough
      - afandian 9mo ago
        Just very high usage all of a sudden, after years of reasonable usage. Google has indexed it (respectfully) since 2008 just fine. New traffic isn't humans. I blocked some AI scraper user-agents, which helped, a bit. But most new user agents are identifying as vanilla browsers, not scrapers. I don't have numbers. It was enough to consume all nginx worker_connections. Raising the number doesn't help, as it's just reverse proxying to JVM. After the switch, Cloudflare showed USA and Singapore as heavy traffic sources. I don't mind scrapers on the site, but app is a search engine (of sorts) so every page view consumes some CPU. Including 'facet this search' buttons. My (WIP) solution is to rewrite to make it all client-side and put it all on a CDN.
bauruine 9mo ago
You don't have to be cloudflare for this kind of analysis you can do it yourself without even needing an ASN using RIPE RIS. https://www.ripe.net/analyse/internet-measurements/routing-information-service-ris/ https://www.ripe.net/analyse/internet-measurements/routing-i...

Yes and that is a very bad thing for the rest of the world. Time for non-us companies especially ones not doing business in the US to migrate away.

Fokamul 9mo ago
I wouldn't touch anything US-based with 10m long pole. At this this, US is basically enemy to EU. Good for us, we will be less dependent on US global oil police. I hope EU companies will stop manufacturing US airplanes and other things.
- rs_rs_rs_rs_rs 9mo ago
  >I wouldn't touch anything US-based with 10m long pole. And yet, here you are...
  - pbhjpbhj 9mo ago
    Just when you think it's only the evil dictatorial regime trying to break up NATO along comes a helpful, presumably USA-based HN commenter, to remind you that a lot of USA citizens are also supportive of destroying any semblance of accord with former allied nations and spreading disharmony wherever they go. It's right for all of us to consider whether our online presence supports fascist dictators be they from USA, Russia, Venezuela, or wherever. Thanks for the reminder that even here people are sometimes shit, I guess.
  - urbandw311er 9mo ago
    > And yet, here you are... I'm pretty sure you know what the parent poster meant, and you should take it as a compliment to you and our HN community that they didn't intend you, or us, to be included in that definition of 'anything US-based'. Stirring the pot like that isn't helpful to you, to HN itself, or any of our community.
  - anthk 9mo ago
    Hackers -the ones from MIT- and smart people hate the US goverment snooping and Echelon like projects more than Europeans. These were either privacy first since forever. If not, they fought hard to say whatever they liked without consequences. In current times, encrypted accesses to Usenet and IRC via I2P and the like will boost the platforms more than ever. Why? IRC and Usenet are dead simple, Emacs has ports to everything and among being a Lisp env, an editor and a minimal web browser, it's an IRC and Usenet client too even under Android. Oh, and you can set I2P under Android too. Thus, you just have to set Emacs against it. There are several guides online. Rocksolid BBS' federate with the whole Usenet (and some newsgroups catch anything text based, no binaries). On I2P proxies to Libera.chat, it's just a matter of time to exist. Meanwhile, there's ILITA IRC with I2PD. Difficult? A Chinese Bluetooth keyboard it's worth very little today, and the gains are enormous. You can chat with people with really small bandwidths but encrypted either with TLS or I2P. You don't have blocks (except bans under IRC), comment limits, enforced timelines and any enshittification coming from social networks. Also, you can short Usenet threads by score. That's it, it's there a brilliant poster and comp.misc, you set the score for all his comment to 1000; then that random Joe will always be on top in any group. Try that with X/Twitter, Reddit or whatever. You will be able to chat with Western Europeans, Eastern Europeans, the Japanese, anyone. Forget tribes, forget the bullshit made to earn zillions of cash from X with shitty fabricated polemics. Forget Meta's snooping and industrial stealing. You aren't enforced to give your real name and address.
- f1shy 9mo ago
  That the relations between EU and USA are not in an historical maximum, no discussion... but enemy? The hyperbole is a little big too far fetched. > I hope EU companies will stop manufacturing US airplanes and other things. Independent of how little we may like current US politics: a) it will probably change, more sooner than later. And b) starting a trade war with the US is not very good idea. We like it or not, there are many things that we need desperately to be able to produce. Starting with computers and SW. And please don't start with "OOS SW" as much as I like the idea, and I constantly advocate for it, even if we start yesterday, it will take decades to build everything again.
  - DrScientist 9mo ago
    > The hyperbole is a little big too far fetched. Sure. Though I think the EU is thinking that blowing up critical energy pipelines and seriously damaging Europes economy through the resulting much higher energy prices wasn't too friendly. All to boost US energy exports, make US manufacturing more competitive and met US geopolitical goals. ie that's not declaring war - but's it's a pretty big FU wake up call. Turning a blind eye when the US treats central and south american countries with contempt is one thing, but it's a bit of a shock when it openly does the same to you - cf Greenland as another example.
    - f1shy 9mo ago
      > Though I think the EU is thinking that blowing up critical energy pipelines and seriously damaging Europes economy through the resulting much higher energy prices wasn't too friendly. Although if you ask "cui bono?" there are some pointers in that direction, is not proven, and there are also pointers in other directions. I refrain of accusing without reasonable proof. >All to boost US energy exports, make US manufacturing more competitive and met US geopolitical goals. I cannot blame them for that. Of course anything they do is in their benefit. Some may argue, is precisely what the government should do. It is clear, that while the action in Venezuela was against a very shady government, was done thinking in US interests (as can be clearly seen by titles as "Trump Says Venezuela Will Buy Only US-Made Products From Oil Deal Proceeds"). So yes, they do all in own interest, and the EU isn't and wasn't very different. Alone if you consider the long colonialism years. Now the EU is acting poorly, but I would say not out of altruism, but incompetence and bureaucratic stagnation. I will not say "is impossible" they do the same in Greenland... For good reason I think. BUT comparing the 2 is also farfetched. I know plenty of people from Venezuela, and unless you were part of the government, you were strongly against it. I know no venezuelan (from the at least 100 I know) that wanted Maduro there. And many are still in party modus. Granted, I know primarily expats, so, survivor bias may apply... but still.
- heraldgeezer 9mo ago
  People like you drive EU to China instead. USA an enemy to EU because of Venezuela? LMAO, EU has said nothing. In fact we agree. We have no relations to Venezuela. Now if the USA attacks Greenland, that is different.
  - dekrg 9mo ago
    It is the US and its recent actions, including its rhetoric, that are driving people towards China. Also, only reacting to US aggression after Greenland is attacked? Not prepare at all and then write a strongly worded letter after the fact? If, after everything Trump has done, you still think he isn't serious about annexing Greenland then you and people like you, including the eurocrats, are truly hopeless.
    - DrScientist 9mo ago
      Or to put it another way - is the binary US/China choice as top dog a false one? I suspect most countries would prefer a multi-polar world where the majority is dominant ( democratic ), not one particular country ( autocratic ). ie why do we have to choose to be under the heel of the US or under the heel of China? The US has been playing the benevolent dictator role for the last 70 years, but when faced with losing the dictator role, the benevolent facade is dropping. The US is mistaken to think that countries not wanting US dominance is the same as wanting Chinese dominance - they, in fact, want neither.
      - amrocha 9mo ago
        The global south would argue that there’s been nothing benevolent about pax americana.
        esseph 9mo ago
        How are those Chinese infrastructure loans going in Africa and South America?
        9mo ago
- richwater 9mo ago
  > we will be less dependent on US global oil police EU, Germany especially Loves Russian oil. So congrats?

supriyo-biswas 9mo ago

It is perfectly normal for an anycast network operator to have multiple sites from which they make BGP announcements (which is how anycast works in the first place), which gives them multiple vantage points for this sort of analysis. Other CDN companies can do it too, it's just that they don't work on signalling their engineering focused organization.

bandrami 9mo ago
This was a while ago but I think it was Akamai that pioneered that. I remember how impressive it was in the early oughts though we take it for granted now.

usefulposter 9mo ago

[flagged]

samsari 9mo ago

They have a lot of resources, Cloudflare Is Awesome

bayindirh 9mo ago
> Cloudflare Is Awesome Until their systems block you for no reason. I recently had a similar issue on a work related site. Fortunately, I was able to reach to the administrator (which is on another country) and had the knowledge to write a report which was useful enough for the said administrator. And this is for a system which has the same static IP which is not shared with anything for 10ish years.
- afandian 9mo ago
  I recently, with great reluctance, had to put a personal site behind Cloudflare free option. It gets lots of use, but brings no revenue (costs me to run) and I have little spare time. Found out that I was blocked from it in my default setup. Firefox with default settings, and no VPN. I'm working hard to turn Cloudflare off. Cloudflare is not remotely awsome. It's also a solution to a problem (aggressive scrapers that produce DOS) which is worse.
  - duskdozer 9mo ago
    What malicious usage are you seeing? You might have a lot more usage than me, but fail2ban has been enough
    - afandian 9mo ago
      Just very high usage all of a sudden, after years of reasonable usage. Google has indexed it (respectfully) since 2008 just fine. New traffic isn't humans. I blocked some AI scraper user-agents, which helped, a bit. But most new user agents are identifying as vanilla browsers, not scrapers. I don't have numbers. It was enough to consume all nginx worker_connections. Raising the number doesn't help, as it's just reverse proxying to JVM. After the switch, Cloudflare showed USA and Singapore as heavy traffic sources. I don't mind scrapers on the site, but app is a search engine (of sorts) so every page view consumes some CPU. Including 'facet this search' buttons. My (WIP) solution is to rewrite to make it all client-side and put it all on a CDN.

bauruine 9mo ago

You don't have to be cloudflare for this kind of analysis you can do it yourself without even needing an ASN using RIPE RIS. https://www.ripe.net/analyse/internet-measurements/routing-information-service-ris/ https://www.ripe.net/analyse/internet-measurements/routing-i...