23 ms·

It is true and documented that the reason TikTok was challenged and censored was because it was exposing too many people to Israeli crimes in the genocide in Ga

by tehjoker 11mo ago

It is true and documented that the reason TikTok was challenged and censored was because it was exposing too many people to Israeli crimes in the genocide in Gaza. This was stated by high level officials. Of course, it also provides grist for accusing China of interfering in American politics, but of course, doing so would be a voice of morality, and you can't have that. https://forward.com/culture/688840/tiktok-ban-gaza-palestine-israel-antisemitism/ https://forward.com/culture/688840/tiktok-ban-gaza-palestine... Edit: As a Jew, I also want to note that there is at least one dead comment mixing this with actual antisemitism, which has been apparently increasingly promoted by the right-wing media. My presumption is this is an attempt to create an actual anti-semitism crisis Israel can point to in order to shut down criticism from the left.

propagandist 11mo ago
You're being downvoted but Greenblatt has stated it plainly. Also the reason behind the 60 minutes fiasco and the CBS acquisition which had Bari Weiss installed there.
- reaperducer 11mo ago
  You're being downvoted but Greenblatt has stated it plainly. Maybe he's being downvoted for taking the discussion off-topic.
  - an0malous 11mo ago
    How is the reason for the TikTok sale off topic for a post about the TikTok sale?
Seattle3503 11mo ago
Both can be true, no? TikTok can be a tool that China uses to aid its geopolitical goals. TikTok has lots of criticism of Israel. Both can be true.
- tehjoker 11mo ago
  Should American owned or controlled companies be banned in other countries? Should Israel be banned from interfering in American politics? If yes, then I am more open to this concept. For what it's worth, I am not aware of any evidence that TikTok did anything intentional to promote anti-US narratives. To be honest, I think they accomplished that goal by simply promoting what people wanted to see, which is in large part, simply the truth. The so-called enemies of America do not have to work very hard or lie, they just need to expose our propaganda in a very straightforward fashion. Since the COVID crisis at least, US owned social media companies have become very censorious and we know they tamper with the algorithms. It may be that simply having a less biased algorithm is too clarifying for American elites.
  - ronnier 11mo ago
    Try using American social media and offerings in China, and lately, Russia.
    - Daishiman 11mo ago
      But it's not about reciprocity if you're truly committed to free speech right?
      - zeroonetwothree 11mo ago
        Americans still have free speech. There are many other platforms to use. Foreign governments never have had free speech rights and I doubt most people support them having those rights.
        LtWorf 11mo ago
        > There are many other platforms to use. That will promptly proceed to bury whatever the government tells them to bury.
      - loeg 11mo ago
strangattractor 11mo ago
It was bad until General Bone Spur found a way to profit from it. Now it's ok. As usual the deal was just some verbal agreement that was not binding in anyway. How many times will people keep falling for this?
babypuncher 11mo ago
It's been clear to me since the very beginning of this TikTok drama, even before the war in Gaza, that it was never about TikTok being naughty; it is about TikTok not being owned by the wealthiest people in America. These people have no problem with Facebook, Instagram, et al. being naughty because they profit from it. That's why the every proposed TikTok ban is so specific to TikTok, and never does anything to actually regulate the naughty things TikTok does, because that would mean hurting American social media companies.
- throw310822 11mo ago
  > These people have no problem with Facebook, Instagram, et al. being naughty because they profit from it. Facebook, Instagram are not naughty. They're well embedded in the political economic ruling elite of the country. They amplify or mute whatever messages that elite wants amplified or muted. The US can't make rules for TikTok to do the same because that would be illegal, besides being too obviously partisan.
  - Aunche 11mo ago
    The idea that TikTok is somehow less corruptible than Facebook or Instagram is laughable as American investors were largest investors of ByteDance to begin with. If it was only about Israel, they can be pressured into censorship the same way Meta supposedly is*. The difference is that TikTok can also be pressured by China, where its parent company resides. *What is more likely is that TikTok isn't actually more pro-Palestinian than Meta, but the demographics that use it actually are which affects the algorithm and user reports.
wilg 11mo ago
This is brainrot conspiracy garbage. Preventing a geopolitical rival which we have no democratic control over from exerting algorithmic influence over our country is a no-brainer. Efforts to remove TikTok from PRC control predate the Oct 7, 2024 attacks. Additionally, information about what was going on in Gaza was widely available and widely discussed on all social media platforms and in the mainstream media. Additionally, if you're defending TikTok because it allowed them to amplify support for the Palestinian cause, it's interesting that TikTok themselves claim that you are wrong, as they said to the US Supreme court that "allegations that TikTok has amplified support for either side of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict are unfounded". Are they lying here? If so, why should we trust them with control over mass social media? If they're not lying, you are wrong. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Restrictions_on_TikTok_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Restrictions_on_TikTok_in_the_...
- LtWorf 11mo ago
  in short: freedom of speech, unless you say something I don't like?
- tehjoker 11mo ago
  TikTok allowed the algorithm to amplify what people wanted to see while palestine content was suppressed on other platforms. What they said was true and they also allowed this content to be amplified, which was a good thing.
  - deleted 11mo ago
    [deleted]
  - wilg 11mo ago
    So, in your opinion the TikTok algorithm is politically neutral?
    - crazygringo 11mo ago
      Is there any evidence it's not? All the worries are about what TikTok could do. Not about anything they've done so far. If you like progressive stuff, you get progressive stuff. If you like right-wing stuff, you get right-wing stuff.
Dig1t 11mo ago
Netanyahu, the Prime Minister of Israel, outright said that it was important for this deal to go through and that is part of the "eighth front" in their war. https://www.youtube.com/shorts/gPKw3cM3DUI https://www.youtube.com/shorts/gPKw3cM3DUI Larry Ellison is a vocal Zionist, leaked emails show that he vetted Marco Rubio for "fealty to Israel". In one email he outright said "Great meeting with Marco Rubio. I set him up to meet with Tony Blair. Marco will be a great friend for Israel". https://www.dropsitenews.com/p/larry-ellison-vetted-marco-rubio-israel-hacked-emails-ron-prosor https://www.dropsitenews.com/p/larry-ellison-vetted-marco-ru... This is the man who would be given control of Tik Tok and its algorithm.
derektank 11mo ago
No, it’s not true. The bill which banned TikTok (H.R. 7521 Protecting Americans from Foreign Adversary Controlled Applications Act)[1] was introduced by Mike Gallagher and Raja Krishnamoorthi in 2024, but a near identical bill, the ANTI-SOCIAL CCP Act (H.R.1081)[2] was introduced by those same lawmakers in February of 2023, long before the Gaza War began, though it did not make it out of committee at that time. It’s conceivable that the bill’s passage was prioritized by house leadership due to concerns about content on TikTok, but the text of the bill contains no reference to the Israel-Palestine conflict and its very obvious from public statements by both co-sponsors that the primary motivation for this bill was concern with Chinese influence. [1] https://docs.house.gov/billsthisweek/20240311/HR%207521%20Updated.pdf https://docs.house.gov/billsthisweek/20240311/HR%207521%20Up... [2] https://www.congress.gov/118/bills/hr1081/BILLS-118hr1081ih.pdf https://www.congress.gov/118/bills/hr1081/BILLS-118hr1081ih....
- user982 11mo ago
  The bill had no traction, "until Oct. 7. The attack that day in Israel by Hamas and the ensuing conflict in Gaza became a turning point in the push against TikTok, Helberg said. People who historically hadn’t taken a position on TikTok became concerned with how Israel was portrayed in the videos and what they saw as an increase in antisemitic content posted to the app." "How TikTok Was Blindsided by U.S. Bill That Could Ban It" (https://www.wsj.com/tech/how-tiktok-was-blindsided-by-a-u-s-bill-that-could-ban-it-7201ac8b https://www.wsj.com/tech/how-tiktok-was-blindsided-by-a-u-s-...) > its very obvious from public statements by both co-sponsors that the primary motivation for this bill was concern with Chinese influence. Here's an op-ed authored by bill sponsor Mike Gallagher entitled, "Why Do Young Americans Support Hamas? Look at TikTok.": https://www.thefp.com/p/tik-tok-young-americans-hamas-mike-gallag https://www.thefp.com/p/tik-tok-young-americans-hamas-mike-g...
- doctorpangloss 11mo ago
  Around the time the second bill was passed, banning TikTok was polling at 50%. Why make this complicated? Banning TikTok is popular. People don’t like it because it’s brain rot. Many vice bans poll highly.
madeofpalk 11mo ago
I have less cynical view on essentially the same thing - US lawmakers saw how effective TikTok was at spreading a pro- Palestine/anti-Israel story, and became afraid that China would weaponise it (more?) against the US population on a separate topic. This is essentially the same thing though I guess
zappb 11mo ago
As a Jew, when’s the last time you kept Shabbat?
- ImPostingOnHN 11mo ago
  as a jew, I ask, why do you care about somebody else's religious life, and how does that tie into the discussion?
  - mobtrain 11mo ago
    As a jew, it is obvious he asked because GP somehow brought the topic of being jewish up in his edit for some weird authority reason? Hence the reply I would assume.
    - ImPostingOnHN 11mo ago
      maybe gp did, maybe gp didn't, but that still wouldn't explain the weird, non-sequitur reply about shabbat, hence the question.
879565375987587 11mo ago
[flagged]

propagandist 11mo ago

You're being downvoted but Greenblatt has stated it plainly. Also the reason behind the 60 minutes fiasco and the CBS acquisition which had Bari Weiss installed there.

reaperducer 11mo ago
You're being downvoted but Greenblatt has stated it plainly. Maybe he's being downvoted for taking the discussion off-topic.
- an0malous 11mo ago
  How is the reason for the TikTok sale off topic for a post about the TikTok sale?

Seattle3503 11mo ago

Both can be true, no? TikTok can be a tool that China uses to aid its geopolitical goals. TikTok has lots of criticism of Israel. Both can be true.

tehjoker 11mo ago
Should American owned or controlled companies be banned in other countries? Should Israel be banned from interfering in American politics? If yes, then I am more open to this concept. For what it's worth, I am not aware of any evidence that TikTok did anything intentional to promote anti-US narratives. To be honest, I think they accomplished that goal by simply promoting what people wanted to see, which is in large part, simply the truth. The so-called enemies of America do not have to work very hard or lie, they just need to expose our propaganda in a very straightforward fashion. Since the COVID crisis at least, US owned social media companies have become very censorious and we know they tamper with the algorithms. It may be that simply having a less biased algorithm is too clarifying for American elites.
- ronnier 11mo ago
  Try using American social media and offerings in China, and lately, Russia.
  - Daishiman 11mo ago
    But it's not about reciprocity if you're truly committed to free speech right?
    - zeroonetwothree 11mo ago
      Americans still have free speech. There are many other platforms to use. Foreign governments never have had free speech rights and I doubt most people support them having those rights.
      - LtWorf 11mo ago
        > There are many other platforms to use. That will promptly proceed to bury whatever the government tells them to bury.
    - loeg 11mo ago

strangattractor 11mo ago

It was bad until General Bone Spur found a way to profit from it. Now it's ok. As usual the deal was just some verbal agreement that was not binding in anyway. How many times will people keep falling for this?

babypuncher 11mo ago

It's been clear to me since the very beginning of this TikTok drama, even before the war in Gaza, that it was never about TikTok being naughty; it is about TikTok not being owned by the wealthiest people in America. These people have no problem with Facebook, Instagram, et al. being naughty because they profit from it. That's why the every proposed TikTok ban is so specific to TikTok, and never does anything to actually regulate the naughty things TikTok does, because that would mean hurting American social media companies.

throw310822 11mo ago
> These people have no problem with Facebook, Instagram, et al. being naughty because they profit from it. Facebook, Instagram are not naughty. They're well embedded in the political economic ruling elite of the country. They amplify or mute whatever messages that elite wants amplified or muted. The US can't make rules for TikTok to do the same because that would be illegal, besides being too obviously partisan.
- Aunche 11mo ago
  The idea that TikTok is somehow less corruptible than Facebook or Instagram is laughable as American investors were largest investors of ByteDance to begin with. If it was only about Israel, they can be pressured into censorship the same way Meta supposedly is*. The difference is that TikTok can also be pressured by China, where its parent company resides. *What is more likely is that TikTok isn't actually more pro-Palestinian than Meta, but the demographics that use it actually are which affects the algorithm and user reports.

wilg 11mo ago

This is brainrot conspiracy garbage. Preventing a geopolitical rival which we have no democratic control over from exerting algorithmic influence over our country is a no-brainer. Efforts to remove TikTok from PRC control predate the Oct 7, 2024 attacks. Additionally, information about what was going on in Gaza was widely available and widely discussed on all social media platforms and in the mainstream media. Additionally, if you're defending TikTok because it allowed them to amplify support for the Palestinian cause, it's interesting that TikTok themselves claim that you are wrong, as they said to the US Supreme court that "allegations that TikTok has amplified support for either side of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict are unfounded". Are they lying here? If so, why should we trust them with control over mass social media? If they're not lying, you are wrong. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Restrictions_on_TikTok_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Restrictions_on_TikTok_in_the_...

LtWorf 11mo ago
in short: freedom of speech, unless you say something I don't like?
tehjoker 11mo ago
TikTok allowed the algorithm to amplify what people wanted to see while palestine content was suppressed on other platforms. What they said was true and they also allowed this content to be amplified, which was a good thing.
- deleted 11mo ago
  [deleted]
- wilg 11mo ago
  So, in your opinion the TikTok algorithm is politically neutral?
  - crazygringo 11mo ago
    Is there any evidence it's not? All the worries are about what TikTok could do. Not about anything they've done so far. If you like progressive stuff, you get progressive stuff. If you like right-wing stuff, you get right-wing stuff.

Dig1t 11mo ago

Netanyahu, the Prime Minister of Israel, outright said that it was important for this deal to go through and that is part of the "eighth front" in their war. https://www.youtube.com/shorts/gPKw3cM3DUI https://www.youtube.com/shorts/gPKw3cM3DUI Larry Ellison is a vocal Zionist, leaked emails show that he vetted Marco Rubio for "fealty to Israel". In one email he outright said "Great meeting with Marco Rubio. I set him up to meet with Tony Blair. Marco will be a great friend for Israel". https://www.dropsitenews.com/p/larry-ellison-vetted-marco-rubio-israel-hacked-emails-ron-prosor https://www.dropsitenews.com/p/larry-ellison-vetted-marco-ru... This is the man who would be given control of Tik Tok and its algorithm.

derektank 11mo ago

No, it’s not true. The bill which banned TikTok (H.R. 7521 Protecting Americans from Foreign Adversary Controlled Applications Act)[1] was introduced by Mike Gallagher and Raja Krishnamoorthi in 2024, but a near identical bill, the ANTI-SOCIAL CCP Act (H.R.1081)[2] was introduced by those same lawmakers in February of 2023, long before the Gaza War began, though it did not make it out of committee at that time. It’s conceivable that the bill’s passage was prioritized by house leadership due to concerns about content on TikTok, but the text of the bill contains no reference to the Israel-Palestine conflict and its very obvious from public statements by both co-sponsors that the primary motivation for this bill was concern with Chinese influence. [1] https://docs.house.gov/billsthisweek/20240311/HR%207521%20Updated.pdf https://docs.house.gov/billsthisweek/20240311/HR%207521%20Up... [2] https://www.congress.gov/118/bills/hr1081/BILLS-118hr1081ih.pdf https://www.congress.gov/118/bills/hr1081/BILLS-118hr1081ih....

user982 11mo ago
The bill had no traction, "until Oct. 7. The attack that day in Israel by Hamas and the ensuing conflict in Gaza became a turning point in the push against TikTok, Helberg said. People who historically hadn’t taken a position on TikTok became concerned with how Israel was portrayed in the videos and what they saw as an increase in antisemitic content posted to the app." "How TikTok Was Blindsided by U.S. Bill That Could Ban It" (https://www.wsj.com/tech/how-tiktok-was-blindsided-by-a-u-s-bill-that-could-ban-it-7201ac8b https://www.wsj.com/tech/how-tiktok-was-blindsided-by-a-u-s-...) > its very obvious from public statements by both co-sponsors that the primary motivation for this bill was concern with Chinese influence. Here's an op-ed authored by bill sponsor Mike Gallagher entitled, "Why Do Young Americans Support Hamas? Look at TikTok.": https://www.thefp.com/p/tik-tok-young-americans-hamas-mike-gallag https://www.thefp.com/p/tik-tok-young-americans-hamas-mike-g...
doctorpangloss 11mo ago
Around the time the second bill was passed, banning TikTok was polling at 50%. Why make this complicated? Banning TikTok is popular. People don’t like it because it’s brain rot. Many vice bans poll highly.

madeofpalk 11mo ago

I have less cynical view on essentially the same thing - US lawmakers saw how effective TikTok was at spreading a pro- Palestine/anti-Israel story, and became afraid that China would weaponise it (more?) against the US population on a separate topic. This is essentially the same thing though I guess

zappb 11mo ago

As a Jew, when’s the last time you kept Shabbat?

ImPostingOnHN 11mo ago
as a jew, I ask, why do you care about somebody else's religious life, and how does that tie into the discussion?
- mobtrain 11mo ago
  As a jew, it is obvious he asked because GP somehow brought the topic of being jewish up in his edit for some weird authority reason? Hence the reply I would assume.
  - ImPostingOnHN 11mo ago
    maybe gp did, maybe gp didn't, but that still wouldn't explain the weird, non-sequitur reply about shabbat, hence the question.

879565375987587 11mo ago

[flagged]