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How the US got left behind in the electric car race
- _aavaa_ 1y agoIt wasn’t “left” behind, it is actively choosing to go backwards.
- burnt-resistor 1y agoBecause protectionist corruption due to absurdly-increases in all sorts of corruption selectively favoring specific billionaires while harming America.
- more_corn 1y ago[flagged]
- consumer451 1y ago> maybe there’s no sense to any of it. Hello nihilism, my dark friend.
- RajT88 1y agoIt's perfectly acceptable to be nihilistic in our current political climate.
- grues-dinner 1y agoI don't think it's nihilism as much as the realisation the vaunted capital-letters Free Market Economy isn't run by level-headed experts who while maybe not benevolent, work within a framework that produces long-term benevolence as a deliberate side effect. Rather it is instead a fractious, squabbling cabal of, to put it lightly, deeply flawed people with aims rather at odds with the average person's long-term well-being. Saying that the economy currently doesn't seem to be progressing rationally according to the last century of dogma doesn't necessarily mean it's hopeless. Senseless isn't hopeless (but they are roommates).
- consumer451 1y agoYeah, you are correct. “There are no adults in the room.” I now realize that expecting any more than what you described from business turns out to have been one of my most naïve beliefs.
- baby 1y agoWhat is the US behind on? Access to healthcare, maternal mortality rate, access to abortion, minimum wages, paid time off, public transport, walkable cities, ...
- testfrequency 1y agoDid you hit the character limit? edit: anyone downvoting me really needs to use one of their 5 llm subs and ask what america is ahead on atm Europe is going bed, have your fun with the karma
- supportengineer 1y ago“When it gets down to it — talking trade balances here — once we've brain-drained all our technology into other countries, once things have evened out, they're making cars in Bolivia and microwave ovens in Tadzhikistan and selling them here — once our edge in natural resources has been made irrelevant by giant Hong Kong ships and dirigibles that can ship North Dakota all the way to New Zealand for a nickel — once the Invisible Hand has taken away all those historical inequities and smeared them out into a broad global layer of what a Pakistani brickmaker would consider to be prosperity — y'know what? There's only four things we do better than anyone else: music movies microcode (software) high-speed pizza delivery”
- jmclnx 1y agoForgot one, weapons that kill massive amounts of people at once, the US is by far number one in that.
- floatrock 1y agoIncluding schoolchildren!
- Onavo 1y agoThat's kinda the point. The whole neoliberal push for capitalism and market access is rooted in the idea of comparative advantages and specialization driving costs down.
- VectorLock 1y agoTheres a video on YouTube of some people who got to drive a bunch of Chinese EVs/hybrids in Alaska and aside from some quality and i18n issues, the US is absolutely cooked here.
- freedomben 1y agoThat's very interesting to me, as having lived in Alaska, I can't imagine EVs being your only option there. There are plenty of routes with >500 miles between gas stations. If you don't bring extra fuel cans, you are gambling big time. I would imagine there are even less charging stations. Hybrids obviously wouldn't have that problem, though I haven't heard much about Chinese hybrids.
- epistasis 1y agoNot all routes see equal traffic and any route with > 500 miles between gas stations is going to see insignificant traffic. Those who drive it already need specialized equipment. It will not have an effect on the market of cars in Alaska.
- tracker1 1y agoWhat specialized equipment do you think you need to drive 500 miles on a paved roadway? You do realize there's places that are pretty close to that driving across the US even if there are gas stations, there aren't EV stations.
- ASalazarMX 1y agoDo they have electricity? They could become EV stations if they needed to. Much easier to sell electricity than different kinds of combustible.
- bluGill 1y agoNot in between, no power lines, no houses, businesses, no cell towers. 500 miles with nothing other than a barely passable road. Often the road is seasonal and not passible in the summer (mud).
- jmclnx 1y agoYou do not need a analysis on this :) Simple, the US Fossil Fuel Industry + Political Contributions, or as all other countries call these contributions, bribes. Also, I heard today the last remaining law that restricts these bribes is up before the US Supreme Court. We all know how they will rule, soon anything goes. Soon in the US, getting elected to a Federal Office will be much better than winning a lottery. Free Dinner, Free Vacations, Free Housing and a padded bank account can be fully legally had by any US Congress Person. Edit: forgot, getting elected as President pretty can much makes you a billionaire.
- gtirloni 1y ago> Soon in the US, getting elected to a Federal Office will be much better than winning a lottery The future is now: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2025/08/18/the-number https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2025/08/18/the-number
- lisbbb 1y agoBut he was already a billionaire before he was elected...
- bluGill 1y agoi'm amused they compare 20000 uk pounds to 30000 us dollars without mentioning exchange rates - the two values are close to the same, but raw numbers makes thing look worse for the us.
- djcapelis 1y agoTariffs in a rapidly growing and innovative industry always makes the country with lots of protectionism end up with less competitive products because they’ve removed the competitive pressures from everywhere else in the world. We were left behind because we shelter our own car companies in a gentle cradle where they don’t have to compete. Both parties did this while saying they wanted to “level the playing field” but chose rates that were protectionist and made competitive products prohibitive not rates that actually created a level field. We were left behind because we tried to protect our companies from facing the future. People in this country expect that one can stand on the shore of a beach and vote on whether the tide should go in or out, and that’s just not how the world works.
- freedomben 1y agoYep, precisely. It really blows my mind to see so many people who normally support a free market suddenly forget (or ignore) what effect a tariff has on a market. Somehow it's now become a hammer and every problem is a nail. I get that there are some real (or perceived) issues that are trying to be solved with these tariffs, but that doesn't magically make the realities of what tariffs do to a market go away. "Just do something" is a good way to get a "solution" that makes you worse off.
- epistasis 1y agoEspecially people that are usually anti-tax! Tariffs are the worse sort of tax, massive amounts of deadweight loss, and a burden specifically on the pooorest. Perhaps that second part is why they are so popular.
- adventured 1y agoChina has a hyper protected domestic market. There is no other major economy in the world as shielded from foreign competition as China. How does that fact correlate to China's EV segment booming?
- ToucanLoucan 1y agoHow are U.S. automakers "ruthlessly competing" in the global market otherwise? Can you name a single American car that competes well overseas? I know the F-150 did at one time but I don't know if that's even true anymore given that what was once Ford's workhorse has been turned into a luxury SUV for suburbanites cosplaying as blue collar workers occasionally. Most American OEMs are now all but entirely in the SUV/pickup truck markets precisely because the Asian makes already kick the shit out of them in every other category. Several prominent brands have nothing on sale but SUVs right now! And they're STILL going broke.
- leesec 1y agoweird how the best selling EV in the world and even china is the American Tesla Model Y then
- verdverm 1y agoBYD sells more than Tesla now
- boznz 1y agoOnly because Elon acts like a dick sometimes, not that the cars are better.
- _aavaa_ 1y agoEven if true, a useless distinction. You’d need a clean the Elon off Tesla and make it desirable to a large portion of people.
- tracker1 1y agoNo, because China is HEAVILY subsidized and given unfair market advantages. It's pretty easy to advance tech when your country will steal secrets for you and completely ignore patent protections, violating treaties in doing so.
- throwacct 1y agoExactly. I don't understand why we always have to bash the US. I dislike the way China does business, and I believe the greatest error of the 20th century was moving all manufacturing there. I don't know why the government allowed companies to move everything to Asia when we could have killed two birds with one stone by moving operations to Latin America. This would keep all manufacturing on the continent and result in much less illegal migration to the US. Given the political climate of the past 20 years, China hasn't had to do much to plot the United States' demise or at least become the top economic power in 20 years or less. That if the US gets its house in order and at least 2/3 of the country rallies around, becoming, cue the music, great again (I'll see myself out, hehe).
- geff82 1y ago(Deleted because not well thought through).
- givemeethekeys 1y agoIsn't China an enormous landmass?
- verdverm 1y agoroughly the size of america with 4x the population largely concentrated into the area of the east coast
- mrdatawolf 1y agoBut only a thin section is impacted by EV issues. I'm not knocking them BTW. I'm saying that we have interconnected the two coasts (and by extension everything in-between) and they don't have the same issue as us. It changes the dynamics as the earlier post was saying.
- sokoloff 1y agoDoes the size of America somehow make someone more prone to drive 2500 miles? That seems exceptional here and in Germany.
- shadowtree 1y agoLove the doomerism, while millions of people would love to move to the US and others are currently fighting deportations into their local paradise tooth and nail. So what is it now? Best country or totally behind? With that, good luck moving to China.
- cmdli 1y agoMillions would also love to live in Europe. Does that make them better than the US?
- klooney 1y agoIt turns out that if you subsidize manufacturing less than other countries, your products will cost more.
- rsynnott 1y agoI assume you're thinking of China. However, if anything the US subsidises car manufacturing _more_ than Europe (in particular it's always ready with a cheeky bailout, whereas European countries have been more prone to just let failing car companies die or merge), and, for all the talk about BYD (understandable; the media likes novelty, and "scary Chinese upstart is making lotsa EVs" is more media-friendly than "Boring old VW AG is making lotsa EVs"), the European manufacturers are also doing far better here than the US legacy manufacturers.
- wnevets 1y ago> But President Donald Trump, who recently called climate change a "con job", has pushed to scrap many of those measures, including the $7,500 credit, arguing that they were pushing people to buy cars they would not otherwise want. There is a significance portion of the US populace that is vehemently opposed to the very concept of electric cars, claiming to be "Dark MAGA" isn't going to fix that.
- TinkersW 1y agoI don't that that is true, it is more that electric cars still have pretty serious downsides, especially in rural areas or if you do long distance driving.
- wyre 1y agoBoth things can be true
- wnevets 1y agoAre you asking me to believe that people who "roll coal" [1] are simply concerned about long distance driving? [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal > Some drivers intentionally trigger coal rolling in the presence of hybrid vehicles (a practice nicknamed "Prius repellent") to cause their drivers to lose sight of the road and inhale harmful air pollution. Coal rolling may also be directed at foreign vehicles, bicyclists, protesters, and pedestrians
- UrineSqueegee 1y agoare you attributing something that maybe 8 people do, to the entire populace? lol that's extremely funny
- wnevets 1y agoYou believe the man who recently called climate change a "con job" is president because only 8 Americans hate electric cars and any form of environmentalism? Now that is funny.
- alexnewman 1y agoI live in Puerto Rico. Electrics don’t make a ton of sense here cause our grid is very strained. I got a used plugin hybrid Lincoln aviator for like 25k. I only got the plugin hybrid because it and electric vehicles are exempt from import duties. I basically never use gas cause the island is so small. I think it’s the best option for island life
- ok_dad 1y agoHawaii here, you are right islands are great for electrics as long as you can charge them. No one here without a home with a dedicated charger can use them because there’s so few public chargers. I am lucky to be able to install a charger. It’s sad because we’re the perfect places for EVs with the current ranges.
- ratelimitsteve 1y agowe didn't get left behind, we stayed behind
- ASalazarMX 1y agoHence you were left behind, although I get the difference is the effort exerted. USA didn't try to compete, it refused to move or made token efforts aimed at the wrong market. USA made EVs look like luxury items, in contrast with the old, affordable oil vehicles.
- ratelimitsteve 1y agomy point was to emphasize that we had agency in these decisions. we didn't do our best and get beat, we purposely chose not to compete. this isn't me trying to recapture some amount of pride like the guy at your local bar who keeps insisting he could've been a bad ass in the army but he would've beaten up all his superior officers first, it's me making sure that everyone realizes that this was a conscious choice to sell out the next generation in order to pad the fossil fuel industry's already record-high profits.
- rsynnott 1y agoSee the chart in the article; the divergence only _really_ started around 2016 with China and 2018 with Europe.
- HardCodedBias 1y agoThat title is silly. The US is #2 in the world in EVs behind China. Tesla leads the US in EVs, and is #2 in the world. A sample of more reasonable titles: 1. US is #2 in EV manufacturing and sales, can they catch up to China? 2. How did BYD catch up so quickly to Tesla? 3. Why can't Europe create its own Tesla?
- lisbbb 1y agoYes, learn to recognize a hit piece readers, sheesh. BYD likely has government subsidy and next to no regulations, particularly on the production side. It's easy to make money when you dump waste into rivers, just like how the US once was.
- vanviegen 1y agoAren't environmental regulations in China stricter than in the US nowadays? In terms of (not) exploiting people without any other options, the US still may have a bit of a moral high ground... when compared to China.
- tracker1 1y agoThey (China) aren't great on upholding their regulations.. not to mention the level of subsidies and meddling that China does with their own corporations is far beyond what any nation in the world would do for the most part. From state sponsored corporate espionage to simply cornering markets, China will not compete fairly. I'm less than convinced the solution is for the US to play the same games. I'm rather against it altogether.
- UrineSqueegee 1y agothis isn't true in the slightest
- epistasis 1y agoLosing a lead is not "silly" it's something to be very concerned about.
- tehjoker 1y agoI don’t understand the analyst comment about whether electric is really the next big thing. She didn’t list alternatives though the main thing I can think of is a major investment in green public transport.
- gtirloni 1y ago> major investment in green public transport. In the US? Not a chance.
- ASalazarMX 1y agoThe commercial war with China was in part about protecting domestic car monopolies. Public transport would harm those mono- I mean, the economy!
- tracker1 1y agoI think that a large part of the puzzle that is missing here comparing to other countries is the US is massive in terms of size, it's not much smaller than the whole of Europe including European parts of Russia and quite a bit larger than Europe without Russia. In the Chart, China is pretty large, but I don't know that there is that much travel in terms of distances away from metro areas for its EV owners or what the infrastructure inland looks like. But the US is simply a big place, and there is a lot of value assigned to being able to drive across it. I've done road trips where I'd drive for 8-12 hours a day for a few weeks as part of vacation routines. It's a really nice way to break away from daily stresses. I couldn't have done that with an EV... I'd have to plan for several additional stops and cut my daily travel distances to quite a bit shorter for the "stretch" days. I'd also have had to be far more careful in terms of going off-route to see a national park, or catch a touristy spot unplanned. And while there are EV models with longer ranges, you still have to face the relatively limited infrastructure in place. It's gotten and continues to get better though. That said, it's still a massive country and will vary a lot by travel patterns.
- gtirloni 1y agoI think the article is talking in terms of % of total sales. Even with the US being big, most people aren't doing those kind of trips. They need a car for city use. Those people should be driving the % of total sales up but they aren't.
- tracker1 1y agoA lot of people in cities, especially younger people arent even buying cars.
- UncleMeat 1y agoI don't find the "what about road trips" super compelling. First, because there really are enough EV chargers for most road trips with a small amount of planning. And second, because so many households have two cars and could have one gas vehicle to cover road trips if that really is a priority for them. It is true that if I was in Europe and wanted to go somewhere 400 miles away I'd take a train. But I don't think that road trips explains everything.