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I was very pissed at this, and when I read this part I couldn't continue, it boiled my blood. > *EU politicians exempt themselves from this surveillance under

• lordnacho 1y ago
  Can't make this shit up. The Danish government (currently holding the rotating chair) also raised the pension age for everyone. Other than themselves. But also, how does this get implemented? What's stopping me from using, say, Signal, which being OSS would likely have a single line I could comment out and compile for myself? How would I get busted for that? Or I could get clever and have AI generate some random chat text to send to the government while I send the actual text to my friends?
  • amarcheschi 1y ago
    It doesn't say how AFAIK, although it's been a few months from when I read the original proposal. If I'm not wrong it would delegate that to service providers - the organizations managing the apps, telegram, meta, whatever the name of the foundation for the signal app is ecc
  • shark1 1y ago
    It's like any other crime. They cannot stop you from stealing, for example. By doing it, you will not be a lawful citizen.
    • AlecSchueler 1y ago
      You mean "an illegal?"
      • bombela 1y ago
        nah they meant unlawful. https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/unlawful https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/unlawful
        • AlecSchueler 1y ago
          I know. It was a pity comment born out of my frustration with certain classes of offenders being labelled as "illegals" while others are granted human-first language like "unlawful citizens." It wasn't a comment in keeping with the site guidelines but that was rooted in my continuing frustration with the community here denying the dehumanising nature of language like "illegals." I'm aware of the definition of unlawful but thank you for your effort and apologies for the wasted time.
  • rdm_blackhole 1y ago
    This is only the first step in the process. First they will force all messaging/email providers to implement the scanning. Those who refuse or decide to leave the EU as Signal said they would do, would end up being unlisted from Google Play or the Apple (EU) app store. Then the second phase is coming by 2030. Read about the ProtectEU (what a fucking ridiculous name) proposal which will mandate the scanning on device and basically record everything you do on your device. This will be forced on Apple and other manufacturers directly.
    • cbeach 1y ago
      ProtectEU sounds incredibly dark. Do you have a source for the information regarding on-device scanning? I had a look but only found the bureaucrat-speak overview and they didn’t discuss details.
      • nickslaughter02 1y ago
        I don't know about scanning (that's the goal of this proposal - ChatControl - including scanning of storage*) but ProtectEU involves creating hardware and software backdoors. * https://www.patrick-breyer.de/en/posts/chat-control/ https://www.patrick-breyer.de/en/posts/chat-control/ , see the table "The Chat Control 2.0 proposal in detail" Technical experts call on Commissioner Virkkunen for a seat on the table of the European Commission’s Technology Roadmap on encryption https://edri.org/our-work/technical-experts-call-on-virkkunen-for-a-seat-on-the-table-european-commissions-technology-roadmap-on-encryption/ https://edri.org/our-work/technical-experts-call-on-virkkune... Concluding report of the High-Level Group on access to data for effective law enforcement https://home-affairs.ec.europa.eu/document/download/4802e306-c364-4154-835b-e986a9a49281_en?filename=Concluding%20Report%20of%20the%20HLG%20on%20access%20to%20data%20for%20effective%20law%20enforcement_en.pdf* https://home-affairs.ec.europa.eu/document/download/4802e306...
    • pakitan 1y ago
      > Read about the ProtectEU (what a fucking ridiculous name) proposal which will mandate the scanning on device and basically record everything you do on your device. Where can we read about that? The official documents are quite vague and I don't see anything as specific as mandatory device scanning.
  • whatevaa 1y ago
    You would get labeled a "potential criminal". See some comment from police labelling Graphene OS users as criminals. Steganography exists and is undefeatable, though very low bandwith.
  • dachris 1y ago
    Hopefully it doesn't get implemented, but obviously they could force OS providers to implement this in Android and iOS.
  • rdm_blackhole 1y ago
    Even if you compile your own version of Signal, will your friends do it too? Will your grandma/grandpa do it as well? It only takes one person in the chain to be compromised by using the "real" app and then all your efforts would be defeated because now your messages have been exposed by this other person unknowingly.
    • JoshTriplett 1y ago
      > the "real" app The backdoored app will hopefully not be called Signal, since Signal themselves would never do this. I hope they own a trademark on it and could enforce it against anyone who would try to upload a backdoored version under their name.
      • rdm_blackhole 1y ago
        I used Signal as an example. People will use what is most convenient. If tomorrow Signal leaves the EU, WhatsApp will happily take its place and will happily enforce the scanning and everyone will just have to fall in line. What good is it if you are the only one of your family who has the only "uncompromised" app on your phone? How will you talk to them? Any message you send will be scanned on the other end. That also applies if you have friends overseas. Your friend from Japan/US will be compromised as well.
      • bqmjjx0kac 1y ago
        Well... "TM Signal" was just in the news. It's close enough I bet it could fool some percentage of otherwise security-conscious users. https://www.wired.com/story/tm-signal-telemessage-plaintext-message-archive/ https://www.wired.com/story/tm-signal-telemessage-plaintext-...
    • bqmjjx0kac 1y ago
      Do phones have trusted execution environments? I suppose you could require the recipient provide attestation that it's running the expected binary. Of course, this is pointless if the hardware manufacturer shares their root keys with the government.
  • ncr100 1y ago
    So stop them.
• zwnow 1y ago
  What a surprise, they are also paid a handsome pension after having worked in EU parliament for a few years, 4 I think. Most of us have to work for 40+ years and dont even get good retirement money
• amarcheschi 1y ago
  If it hasn't been changed, not only politicians but law enforcement officers too would be exempt This is one of the many abuses by Leo(s), part why I don't love and trust police in italy: https://it.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatti_del_G8_di_Genova#p-lang https://it.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatti_del_G8_di_Genova#p-lan... I thought there was an English Wikipedia page but there isn't, translate it
• hagbard_c 1y ago
  Quod licet Iovi non licet bovi. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quod_licet_Iovi,_non_licet_bovi https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quod_licet_Iovi,_non_licet_bov...
• jaharios 1y ago
  A lot of actual pedophiles will be exposed if it was used on politicians, we don't want that.
  • cloudhead 1y ago
    This.
  • echelon 1y ago
    While we're talking about corrupt politicians, why is this all happening all at once? America, Great Britain, and the EU are all creating tracking, monitoring, and censorship regulations. All at the same time. We're turning the internet into the 1984 inevitability it was predicted to become. We need a Bill of Rights against this. But the public is too lay to push for this. Bolstering or eroding privacy rights will never happen in the direction we want, only the one we don't. It's so frustrating.
    • r33b33 1y ago
      They are gearing for WW3 and population control. This is obvious. Get out of EU. Now.
      • rvz 1y ago
        Before they could do that, you will see many countries amending their conscription laws. Now they just need to find a reason to brainwash the general public to sleepwalk into fighting another war.
    • api 1y ago
      For over a decade now there’s been a huge global shift toward authoritarianism, and to some extent it’s grassroots. My speculation is that this is a time of unprecedented change and that scares people. We also have aging populations due to lower birth rates and older people tend (on average) toward nostalgic reactionary politics.
      • ncr100 1y ago
• CM30 1y ago
  Yeah this really annoys me, because it appears to show that any pretense that the law applies to everyone equally is disappearing fast.* If it at least affected politicians you could write it off as "idiotic idea that wasn't thought through in the slightest", but here it's clear that they have some idea how stupid and dangerous the law is, and see themselves as worth exempting from it instead.
• einarfd 1y ago
  That they exempt politicians is basically admitting that the security problems that detractors bring up is true, and is something that should be used against them. After all exempting some police, that work on investigating child molesting, from the scanning, that is understandable. Exempting prime minster Mette Frederiksen, on the other hand. Means either that they understand that it undermines security, or that she or some other top politicians are child molester. So which is it?
• chr15m 1y ago
  Rules for thee but not for me.
• rvz 1y ago
  > *EU politicians exempt themselves from this surveillance under "professional secrecy" rules. They get privacy. You and your family do not. Demand fairness. That is what a scam looks like. In fact it should be the opposite: Government officials should have even far less privacy since you're paying your taxes to them and you need that transparency on where the money is going. As corrupt as they already are, this just tells you that EU politicians just want even more corruption.