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The ChompSaw: A benchtop power tool that's safe for kids to use
- jakedata 1y agoLooks a lot like my glass grinder. Nice idea but only cuts cardboard and $249 is crazy expensive.
- d--b 1y agouh? We used to have a jig or scroll saw when we were kids, it could cut thin plywood, but you could put your finger on the blade when it was working and it wouldn't hurt at all.
- jakedata 1y agoUnlike the woodburning tool...
- floxy 1y agoThe scroll saw seems like about the safest power saw that a kid could use. But every one I've ever owned/used could definitely cut human flesh. Maybe someone could come up with one that has a very limited range of motion, so that it works like a cast saw / oscillatory multi-tool, where the teeth movement is so small that it is within the elastic range of your skin. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bx1AiQdMQro https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bx1AiQdMQro
- whartung 1y agoBack in the day, I had a Mattel Power Shop. https://corporate.mattel.com/brand-portfolio/power-shop https://corporate.mattel.com/brand-portfolio/power-shop It had was a combined jig saw, lathe, drill press, and disc sander. Now, I don’t know much about modern scroll saws, but the “blade” on this thing was more like a thin, round file. Perfectly adequate for something like popsicle stick thick wood. It more ground it’s way through wood than actually cutting it. I think it would take some pressure to really hurt a finger. I can say there was no real bloodletting on my projects. The drill bits were pointed, flat pieces of metal. It was all designed for really soft wood.
- floxy 1y agohttps://www.homedepot.com/p/Olson-Saw-5-in-L-Pin-End-Scroll-Saw-Blade-Assortment-with-6-each-FR42401-SC41101-and-SC441201-FR49501/305663864 https://www.homedepot.com/p/Olson-Saw-5-in-L-Pin-End-Scroll-...
- xyzzy123 1y agoThis includes what you asked for: https://4in1workshop.com https://4in1workshop.com There are 4 tools and one is a finger-safe jigsaw.
- d--b 1y agoYes I think it worked like that. I can’t find any info on it though, this was back in the mid 1980s.
- alwa 1y agoYes—startling, but not catastrophic. I first used something like that at age 6. It probably COULD cut flesh if you really tried, but it would take some determination, and just the specter of damage was enough to keep me on good behavior. I remember it as helping me develop a healthy respect for tools, and also to relate to the material world as something I can manipulate rather than something to be passively consumed. And to manage risks, and confront my fears.
- ethan_smith 1y agoScroll saws operate at 400-1800 strokes per minute with metal teeth that can absolutely cause serious injury - please don't test this safety assumption with children.
- stirfish 1y agoI think I know what they're talking about; I had a wood lathe that ran on D batteries, and I think there was a saw version too.
- bradly 1y agoScroll saws, unlike more common woodworking power tools (table saw, bandsaw, router, joiner, planer), is one of the only tools that touching the blade does not typically cause an injury.
- giarc 1y agoThat's incorrect. A scroll blade is just like any other saw blade, but moves up and down many times a minute. It will 100% cut you if you touch the front of the blade.
- bradly 1y ago> A scroll blade is just like any other saw blade No, not all saws are the same and treating your tools like that will cause injury to yourself. Different tools have orders of magnitudes of different consequences when a blade is touched. I've worked in multiple production and educational woodshops. I've touched running scrollsaw blades and even touched a running table saw blade and seen live a hand into a joiner. These things are no where close to being the same.
- giarc 1y agoWhat are you talking about? Are you referring to touching a blade that is not moving? Sure, you can touch any object that is sharp if it's not moving. I'm referring to an operating scroll saw. You can absolutely not touch the blade when it's oscillating at 1200 strokes per minute.
- bradly 1y agoMy kids (8, 10, 12) have all used my scrollsaw with supervision without issue. Jigsaw is a bit more sketchy and reminds me of most the injuries I've seen in the shop around handheld router after the cut is complete. My lathe is the kids favorite tool to be honest.
- WillAdams 1y agoYeah, I am trying to re-arrange my house so that I can make and store and set up and use a spring pole lathe (bodge for the Brits) --- seems a nice fit for kids (and great exercise!).
- bradly 1y agoMy dream is a spring pole lathe!, but it seems most people make there own, and my skills/confidence are not quite there to tackle that project.
- WillAdams 1y agoAs an alternative, the folks at Tools for Working Wood have been developing a foot-powered lathe w/ a flywheel: https://toolsforworkingwood.com/store/item/GT-LATHE.XX/Introducing+the+Gramercy+Tools+Folding+Portable+Treadle+Lathe https://toolsforworkingwood.com/store/item/GT-LATHE.XX/Intro... which kind of makes me want to repurpose my wife's (unused) stationary bicycle...
- mauvehaus 1y agoI built one out of home center 4x4 posts with hand planes, chisels, and a mallet. I did mortise and tenon joinery on mine, but honestly, construction screws and plywood gussets would probably get you there too. Go for it; you can probably do it! Learning how to turn on one is a bit of a trick. A lot of good turning technique is body motion rather than arm motion. Standing on one foot while you treadle makes it harder to do the body motion well.
- wmeredith 1y agoThis is very cool. The price point puts it beyond the toy category though. Maybe that will come down. Great idea.
- Aachen 1y ago250$ for anyone else wondering
- Ariarule 1y agoThis could be "bad, actually" if it gives an incorrect impression that power tools are unequivocally safe, rather than somewhat risky but usually safe when used correctly.
- bigstrat2003 1y agoYou're right, but one presumably would still teach kids to treat this tool with respect. And given that, it seems safer to me as this won't hurt them when they get careless (as kids are wont to do). That way you get a chance to reinforce the safety lesson before they graduate to the dangerous stuff.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- stirfish 1y agoI'm finding that a lot of parenting is teaching my kid that safety is something you have to do, and risks are something you have to look for and understand. For example, brushing your teeth is usually safe, but you shouldn't brush your teeth at a dead sprint down the stairs.
- taitems 1y agoNot sure why you've been downvoted so heavily. That seems like a misuse of the downvote purpose. But yes, I kind of agree with other commenters here in that maybe teaching absolute respect of a knife/table saw/power tool and its power to maim is a really important lesson that this sidesteps?
- sonofhans 1y agoIt’s basically a tabletop router for cardboard. That’s super cool. The free motion in two dimensions is better than what kids usually get with toy saws and drills. Routers are great tools but very powerful and finicky. This turns a router into a finger-safe jigsaw, which is a great idea.
- Doxin 1y agoIt's not quite free motion in two dimensions. The mechanism is a nibbler, not a router. I.e. you can do 90 degree turns just fine, but you can't go sideways. You need to turn the cardboard to make a turn.
- fnordian_slip 1y agoIf anyone in here buys it anyway, they could test if it works with leather, too. That would open up a lot of additional projects.
- AlotOfReading 1y agoI suspect you could probably work with pretty heavy leather, since the 3mm cardboard it's designed for is going to be pretty comparable to 5-6oz.The bed size might be too small for typical panel sizes though.
- Animats 1y agoThat thing would be useful for cutting leather to a pattern. Jigsaws just move the leather up and down, leather is too flexible for routers, scissors don't work well on thick materials, and knife work takes a lot of skill.
- Karliss 1y agoFor similar price you can get a metal nibbler. Which is a handheld powertool designed for cutting metal sheets using a similar mechanism. They should definitely have more than enough power for leather although the cleanness of cuts will depend on sharpness and tolerance of blades. You might want to also look into electric shears.
- WillAdams 1y agoNeat! Would make a nice pairing with: https://www.make.do/ https://www.make.do/ which is sold by Lee Valley: https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/shop/home/toys-and-games/crafts/112323-makedo-cardboard-building-system https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/shop/home/toys-and-games/cra... (an excellent company to do business with). A prototype of this was on Reddit/Imgur a while back: https://old.reddit.com/r/DIY/comments/9en02z/kids_table_saw/ https://old.reddit.com/r/DIY/comments/9en02z/kids_table_saw/ with instructions on making one w/ a parts list at: https://imgur.com/a/kids-table-saw-2cg0HJB https://imgur.com/a/kids-table-saw-2cg0HJB
- tomcam 1y agothat looks awesome. thanks for the link
- lotophage 1y agoI have the makedo and the screws are legit amazing. I never imagined that they could possibly work so well. It's one of those things I always recommend to other parents. The very real downside is that your kids become attached to their creations. So you end up with a house perpetually full of cardboard and fighting a constant battle to part with some of it.
- itronitron 1y agoIn one of my art history classes we learned of a Bauhaus (or Dada?) artist that would stack their old belongings into the corners of their apartment and then plaster over it in order to reduce the clutter in their home. Might be worth trying out.
- yojo 1y agoFWIW, my kids never took to the screws, but are still ridiculously attached to their creations. I strive to be open and honest in my parenting, but these battles just don’t seem worth everyone’s investment. A box spaceship that hasn’t been touched in a week is quietly “disappeared” to the basement, and if it’s not inquired after by the end of a month it goes to recycling.
- danfunk 1y agoI help run a Makerspace, will definitely be looking into this. Great idea. I know many adults that should start out on such a tool!
- ghysznje 1y agoIf it's for cutting cardboard, why not just use a pair of scissors?
- crazygringo 1y agoHave you tried using scissors to cut corrugated cardboard? Especially trying to cut curves? The difficulty seems self-evident. For straight lines you need something like a box cutter -- with scissors it will neither be easy nor particularly straight. While for even medium-sized curves or smaller details you really do need something like this.
- hinkley 1y agoIt’s possible but tricky. For grownups. Kids will bork the scissors or get a cramp.
- bilsbie 1y agoI wanted this but the price seems way high. By the way, could this concept be scaled up to cut wood?
- marssaxman 1y agoIndeed it can: https://www.rockler.com/power-tools/routers/router-tables/router-table-packages https://www.rockler.com/power-tools/routers/router-tables/ro...
- WillAdams 1y agoAlternately, have a robot control the motion? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CNC_router https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CNC_router
- coderjames 1y ago> the price seems way high. How much is your child's finger worth? I'm looking at getting a SawStop table saw so I can teach my child woodworking with slightly more peace-of-mind that if something goes wrong, they'll be less likely to lose one or more fingers. Kids get distracted, they forget what rules you've taught them in the past, accidents happen. This is also a tool I'll consider purchasing to provide my child an introduction to the concepts before graduating to the bigger, louder, stronger wood saws.
- starwatch 1y agoThere's an interesting planet money podcast[0] about SawStop and why it's not a bigger thing in the world. TLDR: the big power tool companies didn't want to pay to licence the tech, so evidently came to some mutual agreement to ignore it as a feature to save customer fingers. [0]:https://www.npr.org/2024/10/11/nx-s1-5135668/planet-money-what-does-it-take-to-make-table-saws-safer https://www.npr.org/2024/10/11/nx-s1-5135668/planet-money-wh...
- WillAdams 1y agoOr skip the power tools to begin? I use a: https://bridgecitytools.com/products/jmpv2-jointmaker-pro https://bridgecitytools.com/products/jmpv2-jointmaker-pro and have worked with a number of kids to make small projects using it (and hand saws/drills/yankee screwdrivers/braces/planes) Their Chopstick Master is a great introduction.
- hatthew 1y agoIs anyone else bothered by hyperspecific products like this? 95% of what it does can also be done by scissors for 5% of the price and 10x the lifespan.
- tptacek 1y agoNot at all; you've missed the point. Everyone knows you can cut a box with scissors. The point is that you can't cut a board with scissors. This is a basic woodworking skill, and I think it's great if you can come up with a way to safely get kids accustomed to what those tools can do.
- michaelt 1y agoAre there all that many parents who want to teach their kid woodworking, but can't use the classic teaching method of taking them to the workshop and handing them a coping saw under careful supervision? I mean, I'm sure there's a handful of parents who value woodworking skills but do no woodworking themselves - but are there enough to support a whole product category of $250 cardboard tools?
- tptacek 1y agoI mean, it's a specialized $250 toy, I'm sure it has a very narrow audience! I'm just saying: it's not a scissor replacement.
- schwartzworld 1y agoI actually think this isn’t really an “at home” toy. A couple of these in an elementary classroom or a library or even a community maker space, make a lot of sense, since the building material is basically free.
- ckozlowski 1y agoDepends on the age. I've had my 4yo in my garage with me at times. And while he's "helped" me with a few things, it generally consists of me holding the tool with his hands on the handle as well. His strength, dexterity, and simply small size prevents him from really getting much out of it other than a sense of participation. Valuable, but he's not learning anything. When he's older and bigger, then using real tools will be more practical, and we can using the real thing. The risk will be more manageable then. At this stage however, this chompsaw looks appealing. Instead of disappointing him when he wants to drive and having to diplomatically explain that he lacks the strength and coordination to use the actual tool, I can just hand him this. Give a bit of instruction, and then let him experiment. That feeling of "hey, I'm doing this myself" is exciting to him and gives him a sense of accomplishment. Long story short, I see this as a product aimed at a younger audience who aren't old enough to take the lead (with guidance) in the workshop yet, but want the feeling of doing it themselves in a safe way. I like it. $250 though. Ooof.
- modeless 1y agoFor the price you could get five of these cardboard cutting tool kits. https://www.make.do/products/makedo-discover https://www.make.do/products/makedo-discover
- tptacek 1y agoIf the only goal you have is cutting cardboard there are obviously more cost-effective ways to do that.
- modeless 1y agoBut these specific tools are similar in that they can't cut skin so they are completely safe for kids, and can make curved shapes in cardboard relatively easily (more easily than scissors at least).
- felixgallo 1y agoI was a little worried in the video by the kid wearing a sleeve. Seems like that could get sucked up into the mechanism pretty quick.
- analog31 1y agoI'm a pretty OK machinist, but not a professional. My reaction is to think about long / loose hair, long sleeves and loose clothing, and (unlikely for kids) neckties. Those would be of concern for any open blade cutting machine, grinder, etc.
- Dylan16807 1y agoWill an oscillating cutter suck up much of anything?
- felixgallo 1y agohttps://www.osha.gov/ords/imis/accidentsearch.accident_detail?id=170633515 https://www.osha.gov/ords/imis/accidentsearch.accident_detai...
- foobarian 1y ago> Keywords: ROTATING PARTS There are no rotating parts in the OP tool
- puetzk 1y agoThat's a rotating spindle, which indeed can catch a loose thread and reel it in. An oscillating cuter moves back and forth, so it unrolls just as much as it rolls, with no net pull. And if the oscillation strokes are short enough it can saw rigid material while just vibrating jiggly flesh (this is how the saws used for cutting off casts work). Though cardboard is also pretty floppy, so the mechanism here is probably different (mostly the puck guard keeping fingers out)
- petesergeant 1y agoIn the product video they address this concern, and literally show kids covering it with their hair while it's on, and say it's safe
- wingmanjd 1y agoMy wife bought one of these. First one arrived was dead on arrival, but the second works great!
- throwaway889900 1y agoMaybe it's just me, but I'd rather teach how to use a knife safely? And a cut from a blade is a lesson to be learned, hopefully only once. Edit: Oh and if anyone's looking for the tool name, it's called a nibbler. This one is just table-mounted, there are power tool and unpowered versions ofc.
- viraptor 1y ago> And a cut from a blade is a lesson to be learned, hopefully only once. A cut from a simple blade (that can't chop your finger off) can be anything from easily healed to going through just the right part to limit the dexterity for life if you're unlucky. There's lots of time to learn using a sharp knife when they have great fine motor skills already.
- rtkwe 1y agoYou can introduce this way before you can trust a kid with a knife sharp enough to cut cardboard and they can use it way more independently.
- conductr 1y agoExactly, you're basically telling them you can't build stuff until you're 8+. Which coincidentally is around the age they'd lose interest
- rtkwe 1y agoThere are other tools you can safely use as a young kid and young kids can use knives etc they just need a lot of supervision and instruction. Hand saws are relatively safe compared to box cutters for example, they're unlikely to cut super deep but working with wood is a lot harder and more expensive. The cardboard hand tools mentioned elsewhere in the comments here are neat though they look like they work pretty well without having any sharp edges.
- conductr 1y ago
- fhub 1y agoMy five year old played with this quite a bit at Maker Faire last year. He picked it up quite well. I had it in my mind to get him one for his next birthday but forgot until I saw this post. His school has Makedo tools and he likes them. So the combination might be something that he'd use on a semi-regular basis. We have no shortage of "material" being delivered.
- conception 1y agoGot one of these yesterday that was on sale for prime day. They are super fun!
- IAmBroom 1y agoHow much sale?
- dylan604 1y ago"The nibblings are collected in a bin below, allowing you to recycle the waste." In my area, this type of waste is not accepted in the recycling. Just like you can put paper in recycle, but you can't put shredded paper. This would work pretty well in the compost pile though.
- Wingman4l7 1y agoYeah, this is 100% wish-cycling -- and honestly, the total amount of shavings you'd be throwing away after using this device heavily wouldn't even amount to a single small cardboard box.
- dylan604 1y agoI took out my comment calling it wish-cycling propaganda as a selling point, and decided to be less cynical. Anytime I see that kind of obvious play on the recycling heart string as a selling point just makes me throw up a little and roll my eyes all at the same time. The marketing department just goes overboard and nobody calls them on it
- Retric 1y agoRecycle is more than just the municipal recycling stream, you can use that kind of shavings for some things. For example use glue to add fur to a cardboard creation.
- jasonpeacock 1y agoI’ve got one, my 3yr old loves it and uses it with supervision to make large pieces of cardboard into smaller pieces… A warning, it’s a bit loud, definitely invest in kid’s hearing protection to wear when using it.
- sheiyei 1y agoFor $250, it was not worth it even before you told that.
- grues-dinner 1y agoFor 250 dollars I'd expect a motor you can barely hear, not one that needs hearing protection! And at least a partly alloy case. Proxxon is a fairly pricy German mini-tool brand, has a far smaller addressable market (i.e. serious miniature hobbyists) and can still sell you a made-in-Europe MP 400 Micro Shaper, a mini router table, with 10 cutters, for about 200. The manual says it's 104dBA, but this video indicates it's actually fairly quiet in practice: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpmzqvHqQM0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpmzqvHqQM0
- WillAdams 1y agoEven so, hearing loss is irreversible --- best to begin a life-long habit of wearing PPE with this tool.
- hinterlands 1y agoThe article starts by dismissing scrollsaws as "pretty darn dangerous", but that's a pretty big stretch. They're less dangerous than a sharp kitchen knife. You want to talk to your kids and watch them closely the first couple of times they use it, but you'd be hard-pressed to find any accounts of serious injuries caused by scrollsaws. This toy doesn't seem bad as a crafts tool that buys you several quiet weekends, but at $250... that's actually more than a miniature desktop scrollsaw (Proxxon 37088).
- bityard 1y agoI don't have direct experience with a scroll saw but I own (well, made) a bandsaw and it's my favorite power tool. There's a lot you can do with it but more importantly, it's incredibly safe: The blade stays in one place and will never jump out at you or throw your workpiece into your abdomen. If you let your mind wander, you might end up with a cut on your finger. But that's about it. It's pretty much impossible to lose your finger to a bandsaw unless you have permanent nerve damage or are doing your woodworking on meth.
- incanus77 1y agoI saw a classmate push a bandsaw right up between two fingers in eighth grade shop, watching the workpiece and not their hand.
- MadnessASAP 1y agoYou've never seen the blade of a bandsaw break? Throwing the blade at you is definitely one of the bandsaws failure modes.
- Doxin 1y ago> If you let your mind wander, you might end up with a cut on your finger. If you let your mind wander you might lob off a finger before the pain signal reaches your brain. Band saws are safe in that they are largely unlikely to do anything unexpected. They are very dangerous in that they seem so safe. No one is going to messing around with a table saw. The danger is obvious. It's very tempting to be unsafe around a band saw since it seems so safe. If you want to see some scary stuff go look up how bandsaws are used in slaughterhouses. They'll use them to lob a whole cow in half in under a second. Now imagine what it'll do to a finger while you're looking the other way.
- Hnrobert42 1y agoThis thing is so much fun. My friend's children have one. I was like, "Get the heck out of the way kid. This thing is mine now!"
- hinkley 1y agoEveryone has dust collection in their wood shops now because wood dust is a Class 1 carcinogen.
- jstanley 1y ago> The nibblings are collected in a bin below, allowing ... ...the child to spread them all around the house!
- jeffrallen 1y agoMy kids just take paring knives from the kitchen when they want to cut cardboard. More dangerous, but cheaper. Though they've probably destroyed $250 of knives... Hmm.
- sebstefan 1y ago>an oscillating cutter that's safely tucked beneath a puck-like protrusion If it's an oscillation cutter it doesn't need to be that tiny, it can protrude just like a real band saw, it won't cut meat
- 0x445442 1y agoI want one!
- lupusreal 1y agoA small oscillating scroll saw is pretty safe for kids, I used one a lot when I was a kid. Of course it's not impossible to hurt yourself with one, but losing a finger is quite unlikely. Very different animal than a handheld jigsaw, those still spook me (and aren't very good anyway, IMHO)
- amelius 1y agoCan it do more than cardboard? Can it saw through plywood? Then it could replace the jigsaw.
- IAmBroom 1y agoCool! When I was a tyke I had a powertool set that worked on 1/8-inch balsa wood (not easy to find!). It was powered with a 12V radio battery, and Could Not cut fingers. There was a drill (spade bit, so it sucked), a circular saw, and another tool I have forgotten. Pulled it out decades later for my niece to play with. This, however, has more input material than 1/8th inch balsa. And thus, more outputs possible.
- WillAdams 1y ago1/8" balsa was sold in hobby shops for making airplane wings and model rocket fins.
- knowitnone 1y agoa pair of scissors costs $10
- adolph 1y agoWhat is the purpose of a "power tool" that cuts cardboard? Is it for kids with dexterity challenges? Ex: blunt safety scissors to difficult
- mbonnet 1y agoLight injuries from misused tool is an important lesson I will not deny my children.
- shermantanktop 1y agoI'm still experiencing that lesson decades later from a finger nerve which was knicked by a pocket knife at 8yo. I'd be okay with denying my kid self that lesson.
- tines 1y agoNice, lingerie ads! Just what I want to see on my kids power tool website.
- nickpeterson 1y agoHeads up, I’ve found the tools don’t work well on lingerie.
- kevin_thibedeau 1y agoThis needs a movable fence to maintain straight lines.
- shermantanktop 1y agoThis is one of those rare marketing videos where kids using the product look like they are actually enjoying themselves, and not acting fake-excited. Maybe they are great actors....or maybe I'm projecting because I wish i had one of these when I was a kid.
- cicloid 1y agoI was one of the backers who got his money back because they “discovered” very late in the process that selling to Mexico was not worth it. I only got a small discount If I wanted to get a regular order in the US. Bit disappointed and had to handle the expectations of my kid, that was super excited about this for Christmas. It seems TMEC/NAFTA is worthless if even small entrepreneurs discover is very difficult to sell across Mexico and Canada. But decidedly they see less value in selling to Mexico to pass similar (in theory) regulatory hurdles to Canada. The same story with Kiwico, Lovevery, etc. Even considered building something like this, but I don’t have time. Honestly, I feel like people just underestimate the market size because of the language barriers.