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Brad Lander detained by masked federal agents inside immigration court
- sjsdaiuasgdia 1y agoCall your elected representatives. Attend a protest. Make noise. Above all else, protect your family, friends, and neighbors. We do not have to sit back and let this happen.
- deadbabe 1y ago[flagged]
- distortionfield 1y agoThis is the natural end result of giving the president qualified immunity for acts in office. There is now no reason for them to follow the law.
- lesuorac 1y agoHow? None of these individuals are the president. It's the effect of qualified immunity for non-presidents.
- blooalien 1y agoMostly because they're acting as agents of the president's agenda, and as such, even if one were to prosecute them for their crimes, the president would just blanket-pardon them all and executive-order that they're immune to any legal enforcement against them, and the toadies in D.C. would roll over and allow it all to happen.
- lesuorac 1y agoBut none of that has to do with a president's own qualified immunity. ICE isn't inheriting the president's qualified immunity; they have it because they're government employees. It doesn't matter if they're acting in the presidents interests or not and for state employees if they're acting in the governors interests or not. Pardon is a very clearly enumerated power of the president so any usage of it is very clearly legal (although typically undesirable).
- pjc50 1y agoThe problem with the presidential pardon is that it enables the president or his accomplices to carry out any amount of federal crimes. See Iran-Contra.
- RHSeeger 1y agoIt seems like it would be possible for state and local forces (police) to arrest and imprison ICE agents that are acting illegally. Specifically, arrest them for kidnapping when the nab people off the streets. Sure, they'll get out because they can lie and pretend they have cause; but they could be locked up for a while at least. And do it enough, and maybe they'll start thinking twice before acting stupid.
- dttze 1y agoI have bad news about the police. They are exactly the same as ICE. If they fight it would be more like gang warfare over turf and money, since that is all they really are.
- unyttigfjelltol 1y agoYour outrage is not that ICE is acting illegally but that they are enforcing US law. Having local law enforcement launch some kind of insurrection is the kind of myopic nonsense you would have condemned a few years ago, even months. Heck, for the last 50 years the Imperial Presidency also was a bipartisan consensus. It looks different when it's your ox getting gored, but the solution is actually temperance, restraint and dialog.
- janalsncm 1y agoProtests are usually messy and there’s not one single reason people are upset. Some people are upset with the deportations (US law). Some people are upset about rescinding visas due to political speech (violation of norms). Some people are upset because due process is being violated (law). Some people are upset because the law enforcers are hiding their identities (norm/law).
- someothherguyy 1y ago> Your outrage is not that ICE is acting illegally but that they are enforcing US law. https://www.aclu.org/news/immigrants-rights/how-ice-sidesteps-the-law-to-find-and-deport-people https://www.aclu.org/news/immigrants-rights/how-ice-sidestep...
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- bigyabai 1y agoMy elected representative gets (credible) death threats if they resist executive monarchy.
- sjsdaiuasgdia 1y agoTBH, I want such reps to be loud about that. We need to stop pretending that the right is not leveraging stochastic terrorism. The problem doesn't go away by ignoring it. Yes, that's risky. Some people might get hurt. A lot of people are being hurt, and will continue to be hurt, by the current situation. We all have to make our own choices about when principles and long-term outcomes outweigh our instinct for self preservation.
- crises-luff-6b 1y ago[dead]
- Avshalom 1y agoGas station clerks get credible death threats for not selling people alcohol before noon on Sunday and manage to show a hell of a lot more spine.
- bigyabai 1y agoGas station clerks typically don't face off against paramilitary organizations with the intent to kidnap them if they refuse their demands.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- jbm 1y ago> Call your elected representatives I have never seen this work for something this politicized.
- sjsdaiuasgdia 1y agoDoesn't mean I'm going to stop trying.
- matthewdgreen 1y agoElected representatives are going to be intransigent until a point in the very near future, when they realize they're about to be voted out en masse and their voters don't like them as much as they like another guy -- who isn't going to be on the ballot with them. So keep reminding them.
- immibis 1y agoThat happened - it was 2024. It's really seeming like Democrat politicians don't actually care about winning elections. They did terribly and they're still doing terribly and not acknowledging they're doing terribly, when they should have the easiest job in the world running against Trump.
- nemomarx 1y agothey did just shoot two elected representatives so I think we're a little beyond protests working
- potato3732842 1y agoPublicly they'll wring their hands and tell us a bunch of BS about how violence outside of the state is bad and whatnot but behind the scenes they'll go back to their research people and their focus groups and try and get to the bottom of whether it was just one crazy or an outlier who's of an existing trend in opinion they ought to care about. Same as they did when that CEO got shot.
- Avshalom 1y agoThey haven't even done the usual hand wringing this time. Publicly they've been claiming that he's some left wing extremist despite all available evidence.
- garciasn 1y agoWhen someone attempted to assassinate Trump would you have lumped all of those against Trump into "they"? I don't support what the current administration is doing; not by a long shot. But to say, "they did just shoot two elected representatives," is disingenuous at best.
- orwin 1y agoI have lumped every people with roughly the same ideology as the Trump shooter in a 'they'. I don't remember the exact sentence but it was something like that: "That's the issue with pandering to violent conspiracy theorists, if they feel betrayed they will aim that violence at you". Do you disagree with this characterization?
- sculper 1y agoThe current administration explicitly condones violence against political rivals. "They" seems fair.
- blindriver 1y ago[flagged]
- lesuorac 1y agoYou simply can't arrest people without cause. Generally that cause is a warrant.
- user3939382 1y agoYou don’t have to physically produce the warrant as long as it’s been issued.
- Juliate 1y agoFactually and obviously false.
- user3939382 1y agoThere’s a lot in the law that won’t be necessarily obvious or intuitive to you, that doesn’t mean you should assume you know what you’re talking about. Go ahead and look it up rather than commenting about something you don’t understand.
- Juliate 1y agoThe 4th amendment reads easy enough to me. Yet, I understand that case law might be debatable. And that deep political forces are at play. Still, a state were police can operate (out of probable cause) without judicial support is just a police state.
- blindriver 1y agoIt takes a simple google to figure out that you are incorrect. If an arrest warrant exists, police need to produce an arrest warrant as soon as possible but not at time of arrest.
- duxup 1y agoThe whole story of telling ICE agents to just go out and find people on their own seems like a setup to empower the executive branch to have their own group of thugs. Without guidance they do what want outside the judicial system and sensible oversight / rules. This seems to be a pattern in most non democratic countries...
- NickC25 1y agoThat's the gameplan, it's written in detail in the Project 2025 outline...
- krapp 1y agoBut Trump pinky swore he wouldn't do a fascism!
- crises-luff-6b 1y ago[dead]
- helf 1y ago[dead]
- mlsu 1y agoAnother thing that is troubling is that immigration law is sort of a parallel system to normal criminal law. The rights for the accused are lesser and obligations for officers are more lax. The burden of proof is lower. It's easier to get warrants and the rules of evidence are more relaxed. There is a parallel authoritarian system being built up, starting with the creation of DHS in 2001 and ending god knows where. The massive expansion of ICE should ring alarm bells for everyone. This power grab does not end. It will expand and continue. Why are the right libertarians and 2A folks not speaking up right now? We have masked feds rolling up and barging in without warrants...?
- duxup 1y agoAgreed, ICE seems like a natural org to begin extra legal actions with, fewer limits, you just claim you're doing immigration things and put the accused on a more oppressive track.
- NickC25 1y agoJust dumb. ICE are out of control. I wonder why...
- amanaplanacanal 1y agoNah, they are completely in the control of Stephen Miller. This is the way he wants it.
- xyst 1y ago[flagged]
- potato3732842 1y agoThe entire framing of this article fact that we don't even know the name of whoever he was trying to protect tells you a lot. Clearly we're not meant to be upset that fed-cops can behave this way generally, we're meant to be upset that they dared treat another agent of the state, a more equal animal, the way they'd treat a common peasant who got similarly uppity. Caring about these generalities is outside our lane.
- sjsdaiuasgdia 1y ago> we're meant to be upset that they dared treat another agent of the state, I'm upset because a US citizen was arrested for asking a reasonable question to some government officials before complying with the government officials.
- ars 1y ago[flagged]
- jzebedee 1y agoEditorializing what, exactly? The rule of law? "what they were doing" is attempting to illegally abduct someone. The comptroller's "impeding" was a demand to see the one thing that would make their request a legal arrest. Instead, they arrested the comptroller without even a pretense of the law.
- anthony_d 1y agoICE agents are not generally required to present warrants. The agent has all sorts of conditions where they get to say no. If you think you’re above the law and can tell them what to do then you’re going to be arrested.
- scienceman 1y agoAgents who are masked and don't have any obligations to present warrants before abducting someone... really are we saying this is reasonable?
- kjkjadksj 1y agoWon’t be the last. Wasn’t it last week we saw Sen. Padilla held to the floor by federal agents for asking questions?
- ars 1y agoThe article does not support the current HN title, not to mention that changing the title is against HN rules. Stick with the article title which is: "Brad Lander Detained by Masked Federal Agents Inside Immigration Court".
- stingrae 1y agoIt is insane that federal agents are allowed to roam around in masks, without ID and just arrest people.
- potato3732842 1y agoAny agent of the state. If I were King(TM) it wouldn't even be possible to call in an anonymous tip to the most mundane of local government offices. Sure a few people would get some retribution initially but eventually it'd result in better alignment between the interests of the state and people. Anything not worth doing fully above the table isn't worth doing.
- jkestner 1y agoEven more insane that the lack of accountability means that common criminals and vigilantes pose as federal agents to kidnap or rob people. https://www.cnn.com/2025/02/04/us/ice-impersonators-on-the-rise-arrests-made-as-authorities-issue-national-warning https://www.cnn.com/2025/02/04/us/ice-impersonators-on-the-r...
- mindslight 1y agoIt's also insane that state governors haven't deployed their national guards to keep the peace against these lawless masked kidnap gangs [0]. Arrest them with guns drawn like any other violent criminals in the act, and keep them in jail until state judges can review the details of their situation. This applies more to other kidnappings and less here, because this happened in a fascist-controlled building. But the point is we need to start drawing these types of hard dividing lines based on state authority following the law in good faith, rather than deferring to an autocratic federal executive that increasingly interprets it in bad faith. [0] sorry fascism-cheerleaders - without uniforms, legal documentation of their authority, accountability to bystanders, and duly-issued arrest warrants, this is what they are.
- rolph 1y ago[actual] Brad Lander Detained by Masked Federal Agents Inside Immigration Court https://www.thecity.nyc/2025/06/17/brad-lander-arrest-ice-immigration-court/ https://www.thecity.nyc/2025/06/17/brad-lander-arrest-ice-im...
- pyronik19 1y ago[dead]
- rrauenza 1y agoI hope to see qualified immunity eventually re-evaluated by the courts due to this...
- Juliate 1y agoThere's a thing I don't get, as a non-USAmerican. If someone unidentified, masked, showing no warrant, no legal justification of anything, kidnaps/attempts to kidnap someone, how are (organised) citizens not in their legitimate right to retaliate, according to what their local state allows them to? Similarly, why/how are the law enforcement units not taking side against those kidnapping? I mean, in my country, this would obviously call for immediate intervention of the police, but maybe that's because I'm still in a country where administrative enforcement is still ultimately under the control of the judiciary branch.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- nemomarx 1y agoThe cops personally agree with them, and so wouldn't intervene in any case. I do think there's precedent that it's self defense to fire on an unidentified stranger who knocks on your door or tries to arrest you without showing ID, but you need to make it to court to press that defense and I can't say it's a great strategy for that reason
- metalcrow 1y agoIn theory, they are within their rights to retaliate. If an unknown person tried to kidnap you and doesn't present any form of ID, you have a very very strong case of self defense and genuine threat, and that would likely (IANAL) hold up in court if you ended up shooting them. It ended up holding up for Randy Weaver! You would want to surrender immediately upon being shown some ID, of course, but you could get away with it. As for why law enforcement isn't taking sides, it's because doing so would basically be the start of a state succession attempt, and would bring federal agents in to take over the state. Some states have claimed they are willing to do that in certain situations (Alaska has said in the past it will use state troopers against government if they try to enact certain gun control laws), but no one is willing to go there yet. The best they can do now is categorically refuse to assist the feds.
- Juliate 1y ago
- potholereseller 1y agoThe actual title of the acticle is "Brad Lander Detained by Masked Federal Agents Inside Immigration Court". Contrary to the current title here on HN, Lander was not arrested for asking to see a warrant; TFA states the opposite, "It wasn’t immediately clear what charges, if any, the mayoral candidate will face. A spokesperson for ICE didn’t immediately return a request for comment." If an event is so important to know about, why fabricate such an important aspect of the event in this way?
- nathanaldensr 1y agoIt serves the narrative, which is more important than facts. That's why people often say we are living in a "post-truth society."
- Simulacra 1y agoA couple of reasons: Clickbait, Incitement, Selling something, or Bad Journalism It happens all the time, but your point is absolutely correct. Media fabrication undermines confidence in the reporting.
- potholereseller 1y agoThe other commenter mentioned "narrative", which is very relevant, because that is an important part of simulation (and your username) Baudrilliard was careful to point out that simulation isn't a matter of fabrication; to simulate is to obscure the absence of facts, not to create false facts. A simulacrum is a symbol that obscures the fact that it refers to nothing; whereas a symbol, in centuries past, invariably referred to something, real or imagined. The resulting reality (or maybe "mindspace"?) is a construct on top of the real world -- a hyper-reality -- in which every symbol is a simulacrum; the only thing real in hyper-reality is that the symbols hide the absence of facts. This is why, again as the other commenter mentions, we appear to live in a post-truth society; we are fully living in hyper-reality. >Bad Journalism The guy who created the Pullitzer prize also co-invented Yellow Journalism.[0][1] There is neither good journalism or bad journalism; it's all simulation. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Pulitzer#Pulitzer_Prize https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Pulitzer#Pulitzer_Prize [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellow_journalism#Origins:_Pulitzer_vs._Hearst https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellow_journalism#Origins:_Pul...
- 28304283409234 1y agoI do not understand why this is flagged.
- Simulacra 1y agoFlagged because it has nothing to do with technology, and actually goes against the rules.
- cosmicgadget 1y agoWhy do you continue to comment on this post then?
- Simulacra 1y ago[flagged]
- cosmicgadget 1y agoThat is a weird thing to take from, "yo man, you seem hypocritical in this very post". Or do you think you're on the_donald or something?
- Simulacra 1y agoStill has nothing to do with technology, it's only here because dang, and the left side of hacker news likes it.
- 28304283409234 1y agoThe destruction of a democracy is not left, nor is it right.
- cosmicgadget 1y agoSince you're so concerned about the rules, do you mind outlining the ones regarding comment quality, topicality, and personal attacks?
- peteyPete 1y agoGo forth and arrest 3000 people a day, says Trump.. I assume performance is tied to that 40k bonus they're supposed to be getting under the big beautiful bullshit bill? Are they being paid a performance bonus? An incentive to put anyone in cuffs if they don't care about how its done. History will not be kind to those amoebas.
- billy99k 1y ago"New York City Comptroller Brad Lander was detained inside a Lower Manhattan immigration court building Tuesday morning by masked federal agents as he attempted to escort a man from his court appearance there. " This is actually what happened, not the headline. He tried to forcibly remove someone there for court. It's all a a show, to make the Trump administration look bad.
- crooked-v 1y ago"From a court appearance" is referring to him escorting the man out after the court appearance, not evading the court.
- latentcall 1y agoI don’t think the administration needs any help to look bad.
- JohnTHaller 1y agoLink in case it's removed: https://www.thecity.nyc/2025/06/17/brad-lander-arrest-ice-immigration-court/ https://www.thecity.nyc/2025/06/17/brad-lander-arrest-ice-im...
- MasihMinawal 1y agopolitics digivolves to ... ... politics everywhere
- jimt1234 1y ago> "I know I will get due process and that my rights will be protected," Lander said. Huh? Has he been sleeping under a rock for the last six months?
- edoceo 1y agoLots of trust in his legal and PR teams? Any proletariat (90% of USA) would not be so fortunate.
- watusername 1y agoWell, read the next paragraph. It's clearly an acknowledgment of privilege and an appeal: “I know I will get due process and that my rights will be protected,” Lander said to a throng of supporters who gathered spontaneously in Foley Square that evening after his release. “But Edgardo will sleep in an ICE detention facility God knows where tonight…he has been stripped of his due process rights in a country that is supposed to be founded on equal justice under law,” Lander continued, naming the immigrant detained by federal agents at the same time the comptroller was taken into custody.
- speakfreely 1y agoSo I ask this question in good faith: What are the due process rights that have been taken away? What is this administration doing different from the prior ones in regards to detaining suspected illegal immigrants? While I don't doubt there could be something, I haven't seen a coherent answer to this question. I am happy to change my mind, but in this situation all I see is a political candidate interfering with federal agents and getting arrested for it. I see lots of really questionable things happening, like these agents wearing masks and dressing in hoodies, but mentioning that does not address the due process question. If someone could address this point directly and without hyperbole, I am eager to be better informed about it.
- UmGuys 1y agoThey're deporting them without trial. They don't even try to confirm they capture the right people. They've arrested several US citizens. Notice where this arrest occurred: at a courthouse. Why? Because this person was complying with the law and going through the immigration process. What about masked men kidnapping random people, then sending them somewhere like a prison in El Salvador seems just to you? Do you remember this happening previously in your life?
- zefalt 1y agoI feel like hackernews has been getting astroturfed by the same people that ruined reddit. Over the past few months, there have been increasingly one sided political stories and comments. It's a shame.
- affinepplan 1y agowhat on earth "other side" could there be to unidentified secret police arresting politicians of the opposite party
- zefalt 1y agoObstructing a federal officer. Watch the video. Any average citizen would be arrested and detained. https://x.com/w_terrence/status/1935025940075266435 https://x.com/w_terrence/status/1935025940075266435
- affinepplan 1y agoI've watched the video several times. > Any average citizen would be arrested and detained. yes, ICE thugs would probably behave equally lawlessly towards any civilian challenging them for a warrant. that doesn't make what happened less horrifying.
- zefalt 1y agoYour choice of words reveals a lot. Don't manipulate words to serve your conclusion. They are not "thugs". They are federal officers. ICE did not behave "lawlessly". They are upholding federal law. In fact, it was Brad Lander who acted lawlessly. This constant manipulation of words is tiring. I don't find what happened "horrifying" at all. Anyone impeding the law should face its consequences.
- affinepplan 1y ago> They are not "thugs". They are federal officers. are they? maybe they should identify themselves as such with names, badge numbers, and warrants? > They are upholding federal law. they clearly aren't given the number of court cases the Trump administration is rapidly losing related to its deportation activity. > This constant manipulation of words is tiring this constant sanewashing of cruelty is tiring. you should find it horrifying. but I'm not going to go in circles with you. I hope you eventually look back on this part of your life with shame about your beliefs and who and what you defended.
- leephillips 1y ago“The federal agents escorted him into an elevator, with one member of his NYPD security detail alongside him.” It sounds as if the “security detail” failed at protecting their protectee.
- computerthings 1y ago[dead]
- AStonesThrow 1y ago[dead]
- meansob 1y ago[dead]