11 ms·
How you breathe is like a fingerprint that can identify you
- XzetaU8 1y agohttp://archive.today/JX3go http://archive.today/JX3go
- eimrine 1y agoI have noticed that I need so much fresh air while sleeping that it is not very comfortable for me to sleep with another person. I can not say anything about breath patterns but I suspect that O2 consumption has to be among those patterns.
- zeristor 1y agoDoes an open window help? A CO2 monitor might be helpful too?
- stapedium 1y agoI suspect the fresh air is more an issue with temperature and humidity rather than oxygen content. Try a fan first.
- dudeinjapan 1y agoI always have to tell my girlfriend to stop hogging all the O2.
- NoPicklez 1y agoThat seems like a bit of an assumption. Your body needs less O2 when sleeping and your respiratory rate slows as a result of that and many factors. I highly doubt someone sleeping next to you is materially taking away from the O2 you're breathing in. If so, you'd be fairly out of breath in a room full of people during the day. Unless the room you're sleeping in already has such low level of O2, you might need to look into a monitor or even using a fan to move some air.
- encom 1y agoYou are now breathing manually.
- smcin 1y agobut we were promised Full Self-Breathing by now!
- gbnwl 1y agoWe have it! It’s just Full Self Breathing (Supervised)
- cnity 1y agoI like to take these types of comments as an invitation to be present for a moment. Thank you!
- silon42 1y agoTime to breathe without rhythm.
- yvely 1y agoI just lost the game
- tumsfestival 1y agoYou ahole!
- 1y ago
- bradley13 1y agoIncluding asymmetry between the nostrils brings in physiological factors other than breathing, i.e. sinuses, etc.. Still, I can see it. My wife and I are probably equally fit, but she breathes much faster than I do. I also notice that I sometimes don't take a breath (or feel any need to) for several seconds, if I'm being sedentary.
- meindnoch 1y ago>I also notice that I sometimes don't take a breath (or feel any need to) for several seconds, if I'm being sedentary. Normal adult breathing rate is 12-20 per minute. So by the pigeonhole principle, if you don't pause breathing for several seconds when idle, then you're breathing too fast than what's considered normal. Your wife is hyperventilating, which could be a sign of stress, or a compensatory reaction to metabolic acidosis.
- dpassens 1y agoOr you could take long breaths. 20 breaths per minute is only four seconds per breath which doesn't seem terribly long if it's both in- and out-breath.
- tbrownaw 1y ago> When 42 of the participants came back to the laboratory weeks, months and even two years later, to take part in another 24-hour measurement, the trained algorithm could identify them from their breath patterns. Data from periods when the participants were awake gave more accurate results than did those from sleeping periods, but when the researchers used a 100-parameter characterization of a full data set instead of one using 24 parameters, they could pick individuals out with 96.8% accuracy. The correctly identified .968x42=40.696 of the participants. Also any standard-ish physical activity that comes with instructions usually includes breathing in those instructions. So I would expect results to vary substantially depending on where they found the study participants.
- ortusdux 1y agoPrevious: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44262799 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44262799
- canadiantim 1y agoThis is brilliant. Could definitely use this for a very low-cost diagnostic tool. It's like reading someone's pulse, but through their breath.
- amelius 1y agoUnfortunately this can't be measured on a smartwatch.
- genewitch 1y agoAmazfit claim to monitor sleep breathing, and seem fairly accurate based on my observations (n=2)
- simulator5g 1y agoYou could very easily hook this up to a smartwatch. The device attached to the nasal cannula could be a simple BLE module + 2 air flow sensors. You don't even need a nasal cannula, thats just for increased accuracy for the study. The results of the study suggest that you can just observe someone's chest rise pattern to get similar results, though maybe with less accuracy.
- amelius 1y agoI get that you can collect data on a smartwatch, but having a separate device is not as convenient. Perhaps a system linked to a desktop with an (IR?) camera would be more convenient for working in the office. Or even a smartphone placed on a desk/stand.
- BLKNSLVR 1y agoThis is probably more 'voice' than breathing, but when I'm in the toilet cubicle at work I try to identify anyone who may be next door by the sound of their breathing. I rarely get to confirm whether I'm right or wrong, but everyone sounds slightly different.
- bilekas 1y agoAs someone with bathroom stage fright from time to time, this is terrifying.
- jcims 1y agoTry plugging your ears. For some reason it works like magic for me to get rid of that stage fright.
- matthewwolfe 1y ago
- thenewwazoo 1y agoNeato. I bet this could be trained to identify/differentiate people based on mmWave sensors, which can reliably detect breathing and muscle movements.
- blurbleblurble 1y agoThere are dozens if not hundreds of papers on exactly this topic :)
- kylehotchkiss 1y agoAh good, retailers will figure out a way to work this into their camera processing software! Just like gait tracking can help ID somebody if they're wearing a mask.
- pchew 1y agoPebble in the shoe, pebble in the nostril.
- reginald78 1y agoI know masks and ICP makeup were suggested as anti face recognition tools. Did anyone actually test pebble in the shoe? I would have thought clothing to hide the gait would be the answer, burkas or JNCO jeans.
- analog31 1y agoMy breathing is probably influenced by what song is going through my head at any given moment.
- 11235813213455 1y agoMine is silent, I find it gross when you can hear someone's breath, and hopefully sane (I hate cigarette smokers breathe, it still smells like death)
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- daveguy 1y ago> Mine is silent, I find it gross when you can hear someone's breath... Hate to break it to you, but you're in for an upsetting aging process. Also, your breath already isn't silent. Your brain attenuates the expected sounds, and our ears aren't nearly as sensitive as some microphones, especially microphone arrays.
- go_prodev 1y agoHold my CPAP Here's a fun fact, the CPAP machine lowers my Heart Rate Variability. HRV spikes when I sleep part of the night without it.
- glitchc 1y agoNot a mystery. This is directly correlated to the CPAP's primary goal which is to ensure a steady flow of air in and out of your lungs. Without the CPAP, your heart is reacting to variations in O2 (inflow) and CO2 (outflow), speeding up and slowing down accordingly, including experiencing stress during periods where the airway is completely obstructed.
- fudged71 1y agoI think that's backwards, higher HRV is better?
- go_prodev 1y agoYes, higher is better. The CPAP lowers HRV during use.
- tinyhouse 1y agoCan anyone share a link that doesn't require login?
- tantalor 1y ago> custom, wearable device that records airflow through each of a person’s nostrils Yeah, it turns out if you can strap a device to somebody then wow you can identify them. This is interesting, but not a big surprise! Now if they can do this from an external passive sensor like a camera or microphone, then yeah that would be a neat result.
- crusty 1y agoI thought those millimeter wave sensors that are used in newer home automation devices to detect when people are in an observable area have enough resolution to detect the displacement of the chest during breathing, which would suggest that the tech you fear is already here, it's just not configured to record and analyze the data YET.
- CraigJPerry 1y agoYeah they can have enough resolution to observe your pulse: https://ris.utwente.nl/ws/portalfiles/portal/359293305/2311.11275v2.pdf https://ris.utwente.nl/ws/portalfiles/portal/359293305/2311....
- simulator5g 1y agoI would bet a large amount of money that this is already in use somewhere in the world. The idea is very similar to gait tracking and the tech has been available for years.
- meindnoch 1y agoTrue privacy freaks use a diaphragm pacemaker hooked to a CSPRNG to securely randomize their breathing pattern in public. Also, make sure to use a different CSPRNG for your gait randomizer, to avoid entropy starvation.
- iwontberude 1y agoWe need a way to get quantum entangled particles delivered to various parts of our bodies for ultimate privacy guarantees.
- reginald78 1y agoRandom pattern would make you stick out, particularly when everyone else in the area has identifiable breathing patterns. You'll want to set your diaphragm pacemaker to mimic the most common breathing pattern, probably based on a sample of breathing patterns from your geographical area.
- tetris11 1y agoSome people would pay good money to have the breath profile of an athlete, in order to qualify them for only the best of careers.
- m463 1y agoWell, you'd get turned away at all-you-can-eat buffets.
- kridsdale1 1y agoI expect Champion Eaters have the breath-holding patterns of free divers. Epiglottigeal toggling is an esophageal inefficiency.
- zeristor 1y ago> Epiglottigeal toggling is an esophageal inefficiency. A tongue twister for the age!
- guzik 1y agoI might be missing something, but is there any _practical_ value in this line of research beyond academic curiosity? I've stumbled across this article a few times already, and still can't quite find the real-world application where you'd want to identify someone just by their breathing pattern (especially considering that from the article that "you need to be equipped with a nasal cannula"). Maybe I'm being dense?
- IshKebab 1y agoI think it's just out of interest. There doesn't necessarily need to be a practical application.
- etskinner 1y agoIf you can figure out a way to do without the nasal cannula, the possibilities are huge. Maybe a good IR camera could look at the air coming out of your nose and determine the velocity. Seems like it's actually already a thing [1]. Cynically, you could use it for surveillance, similar to how they do face recognition or temperature scanning in airports. The flip side of the coin is that it could be used for better authentication or medical purposes. Maybe your oxygen tank could realize you're breathing different than usual to warn you that you might be having a seizure, stroke, or heart attack. Or maybe we'd have "breathe to sign in" similar to FaceID [1] https://www.youtube.com/shorts/J_EBMhrinNc https://www.youtube.com/shorts/J_EBMhrinNc
- rebolek 1y ago"you need to be equipped with a nasal cannula" now. In few years, who knows. And then, spies.
- b0a04gl 1y ago96.8% accuracy sounds impressive until you realise they skipped the REM phase like it's a bug report. "user unpredictable when dreaming, exclude from dataset." also love how your breath is now a biometric. imagine getting locked out of your account because you had a cold or ran up stairs. future's looking wheezy
- Aachen 1y ago> imagine getting locked out of your account because you had a cold or ran up stairs. future's looking wheezy This is me trying to use our fucking touchscreen stove Landlord's kitchen, I didn't know this was even an option until moving in here or I'd have asked some questions about wet hands. I'd not have thought to ask about cold hands, like when I held a freezer product for a minute, though I'd think it a mere annoyance if there was a physical OFF button. There is not. You can go to the cellar and trip the breaker I guess? Otherwise, you better have reasonably warm and dry fingers (it can deal with a bit of moisture and chill, but has limits similar to trying to use a phone in the rain) Gotta say it looks sleek though, when it's free of fingerprints and other usage marks I love technology
- encom 1y agoYour post triggered a deep seething hatred in me of stoves with touch anything. Last place I lived (rented) was a stove with touch buttons on the stove top, which was itself a glass surface. Never mind that it beeped annoyingly on every input. Operating it with wet hands was impossible. A common situation in a kitchen. But the worst was that, if anything boiled over, the touch buttons went bananas, and usually ended up shutting everything off. Adding further annoyance and inconvenience to the situation. Because I had limited countertop space, I often wanted to use the stove as a working surface (when not in use, obviously), but it had some godforsaken detector that registered when something was put on top of (or near) the buttons (capacitive or not), and it would continuously beep until you moved it. I mean I kind of get it as a safety feature, but on the other hand I also want to override the machine, tell it to fuck off because I'm in control of the situation, and we wouldn't even have this problem in the first place, if it wasn't for this touch garbage. Whoever designed that thing should be fed feet first into a wood chipper.
- qwertox 1y agoYou could strap a band with a strong magnet around your tummy and have an IMU sensor below your mattress. It was a project I started and sampled it at 1 Hz, multisampled with min/max/avg, but I never did anything with the data. Looking at the real-time stream the breathing was noticeable, at 2Hz it would probably be very useful, if you have the dedication to write the tools to analyze the data. I was thinking about doing this with a fanny pack where I put the sensor and battery pack in the fanny pack and a strong magnet at the opposite side of the strip in order to measure my breathing frequency during excercising.
- jackschultz 1y agoI've been curious about what the best way to recording breathing rates with wearables would be. Thought was a chest strap with springs to measure tension with higher tension being air in lungs. But you're talking about a different way. How does the magnet work to get rates? I'd want something that can get rates and volumes from mouth vs nasal and also tell which vent the air in coming into the lungs from. Probably a case of how much intrusion you want vs how intricate and correct the data is.
- CrimsonCape 1y agoI believe that I and everyone "vibrate at a certain frequency" which I define loosely as the qualitative electrical/emotional impulses that drive daily mood and physiology. Like the baseline is a smooth sine wave of calmness. Some people seem agitated all the time, and I guarantee their frequency is vibrating at a higher hertz. Driving home from work, I get at least 2-3 "shocks" when other drivers cause close calls. I flinch, get a surge of adrenaline, and have to breathe to calm down. My sine wave is disturbed. Let's say a driver swerved close to my vehicle and I flinch and swerve away. The next day, a driver drifts close and I instinctively get a shock, flinch, and swerve away. I didn't intend to be jumpy and nervous, but apparently my electrical system is still "echoing" from the day before. At work, I experience anxiety, and it's a "softer" shock, but the long term result is nervousness, twitching, holding my breath in anticipation (of an attack that never comes), feelings of dread. People talk about fixing upset emotional states and psychology, but in thinking about this, I characterize my own problems as needing my electrical system tuned-up. How often did a farmer 1000 years ago get adrenaline dumps from fast-twitch motor neurons as he zoomed 80mph down the highway? And yet now it's literally all day. Vehicle noise at 4am, jump awake. Phone rings, jump and flinch. Driving, etc. I don't think we look often enough at the physiology of stress from the perspective of the electrical signals generated by the nervous system. It seems like all kinds of problems come from it. To the article's point, I know my breathing has been affected from stress and tensions. I don't think i'm particularly unhealthy, so I think a lot of people could relate to feeling "not-unhealthy" but also really twitchy and disturbed from stress and tension. In my thinking about this, fitness and health come from creating the electrical impulses in a steady, predictable way (i.e. walking, lifting) such that the electrical pathway can remember it's baseline frequency and "strengthen" the good frequency. And hopefully smooth-out the peaks and valleys of the signal interruptions caused by stresses.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- dbtc 1y agoI wonder if one were to use e.g. a gardening metaphor to conceptualize their perceived inner state, rather than an electricity metaphor, all things being otherwise the same, would their thoughts calm down and nervousness subside? This is a hypothesis. It might be true that electrical signals and magnetic frequencies define something fundamental about our physical reality, but don't underestimate utilitarian power of imagination and metaphor. Think about trees, feel better.
- NoPicklez 1y agoNext up, sensors can now detect and know exactly who farted.
- vismit2000 1y agoRelated: Detection from breathing audio data - A Three-Fold Machine Learning Approach for Detection of COVID-19 from Audio Data: https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-3-030-86970-0_35 https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-3-030-86970-0_...
- Noelia- 1y agoI never realized that the way we breathe could be as unique as a fingerprint and even used to identify us. I used to think of deep breathing as just a way to calm myself down, but now it seems like it reflects more than just emotions. It is part of who we are. If breathing can really be used to detect health or mental states in the future, that sounds promising. But it also makes me a bit uneasy. If even our breath can be tracked, is that one more doorway to being monitored?