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Cryptocurrency enables a big part of this. Not saying that there weren't any wire scams before crypto, but crypto has made it much easier for average people to

by naet 1y ago

Cryptocurrency enables a big part of this. Not saying that there weren't any wire scams before crypto, but crypto has made it much easier for average people to make anonymous international money transfers that can't be reversed. Not to start a big argument, but to my eyes the main usecases of cryptocurrency are to bet on them as a speculative asset or to use them for various forms of crime. Someone will probably tell me about some theoretical situation where it is a positive force, but I still think those are by far the two most common daily uses.

whimsicalism 1y ago
i bet heavily using crypto against AI progress on coding to hedge my career
- gavagai691 1y ago
  Is your job developing AI coding tools?
  - whimsicalism 1y ago
    no, but i do work in ML - i think there are two channels through which this derisking makes sense, but people on here get aggressive if you mention the other one.
- dantillberg 1y ago
  How is crypto relevant to betting?
  - whimsicalism 1y ago
    because it gives you access to binary options markets with deep liquidity that you can’t get access to in any other way. i guess it counts under various forms of crime because we criminalize offering useful financial instruments
alexey-salmin 1y ago
Whether you see international money transfers outside of the government control as a positive or negative force largely depends on how much you trust your government. How much it should limit things for your own safety? I suspect that for majority of the earth population the trust level is rather low, even though in some countries it could be different.
- os2warpman 1y ago
  If I had to throw out a number describing how many more times I trust the FDIC than I trust some cryptobro, the first thing that comes to mind is "ten billion". And my trust in the current administration is rather low.
  - homebrewer 1y ago
    Well, they're pretty comparable in many parts of the world (and I despise cryptocurrency, btw). Despite what you might think, the current US administration is far from the worst compared to what some of us live under. Americans simply lack a proper "zero point" to be able to properly gauge this. I place exactly zero trust in what our administration says, because they've lied about the country's economic situation and what they're planning to do about it four times during my lifetime, and several more times during our parents' lifetimes. Our savings were cut in half (or more) several times because of this, and so much of it was lost, the total amount of time wasted working for effectively free is in the decades now. There's really no reliable way of saving money long-term here, unless you scrounge enough to buy real estate or something else that is unlikely to be devalued to 30% of its original value with a stroke of a pen. I can imagine why some people would resort to cryptocurrency and extracting money out of the country asap.
    - palmfacehn 1y ago
      These are all good points. Like others here, I will preemptively state my dislike of the political classes. Perhaps if financial regulations were not so onerous, traditional payment processors like PayPal would be able to handle more types of transactions with a lower overhead. As it is, the large number of prohibited categories creates a demand for cryptocurrency. As you noted, inflationary monetary policy is another source of discontent. Perhaps if central bankers had exercised a bit more restraint, there would be less demand for cryptocurrency. The same can be said for capital controls and more... So there is a bit of irony when posters appeal for even heavier regulations and prohibitions. These are the forces which have created demand for wholly unregulated markets. It shouldn't be hard to see how these overreaches have created a counterbalancing force. Tragically, these overreaches generate a safe-haven for additional bad actors.
tbrownaw 1y ago
> main usecases of cryptocurrency are to bet on them as a speculative asset or to use them for various forms of crime. Someone will probably tell me about some theoretical situation where it is a positive force When you don't agree with the laws that are being broken in a particular case.
- porridgeraisin 1y ago
  So if 57% in a country agree with a law, the remaining 43% should be allowed to circumvent that law through these means? Of course, the opposite argument is "what about north korea", but it's a package deal is my point.
  - johngladtj 1y ago
    Generally speaking you shouldn't be able to impose your will on others
    - porridgeraisin 1y ago
      Sure, but in every democracy most laws pass with such just-about majorities.
  - naming_the_user 1y ago
    Pretty much, yeah. If almost half of the population disagree with something then it’s probably a stupid restriction to begin with.
    - porridgeraisin 1y ago
      But most laws in democracies pass with just about majority. The president in america was selected with just-about majority. Do you suggest changing elections so that we keep doing them until the vote skews to 100%? 90%? What's the threshold?
      - naming_the_user 1y ago
anovikov 1y ago
Reason of most scams is the absurd level of trust existing in Western countries. When i first saw Upwork where hours were paid by the tracker in a guaranteed manner and people SIGNED for it, i knew West was doomed. I still find it hard to believe people can be that easy to dupe. Level of trust in the Western societies needs to be radically reduced through government propaganda, church and other channels. The world has become global. Westerners are now a small minority in an ocean of people where the manner of relationship that will be seen as sociopathic in the West, is the everyday norm and always have been. If they won't adapt, they will cease to exist. The cozy world where one could trust another because they all shared fear of God and had a reputation to lose, is gone.
- Waterluvian 1y ago
  A high trust society is actually a good trait, not a bad one. It’s rather easy, lazy even, for a culture to devolve into a low trust minima. That’s basically the default state that people have endeavoured to evolve out of. I think it’s also the kind of thing that can easily overwhelm anxious minds. The kind where “what if it’s a scam?” leads them to never taking a risk, donating to a cause, doing someone a favour. Not that there isn’t a fight to be fought here. But waving the surrender flag on fostering a trusting society is a very weak move.
  - anovikov 1y ago
    [flagged]
    - ksenzee 1y ago
      Sorry, are you saying that the main reason immigrants from Eastern Europe and India become rich is through scamming hapless fools? Not through, say, hard work and educational opportunities? And are you saying this is a change, or how it’s always been?
      - anovikov 1y ago
        [flagged]
kalaksi 1y ago
The banks here have said that if you get scammed and money has been transferred (no cryptocurrency involved), there's nothing they can do. It was a bit surprising to hear since you only hear cryptocurrency transactions being irreversible.
- silisili 1y ago
  Banks aren't perfect, but they also aren't anonymous. If you feel wronged, you can take appropriate legal recourse. Crypto offers no such thing.
  - whatsupdog 1y ago
    Good luck taking legal action against an off shore entity, especially when the legal fees is more than the money transferred, and the money most likely moved to three different accounts in as many countries from that first off shore account.
    - theptip 1y ago
      You’re right that you don’t have guaranteed recourse for foreign fraud. But at least the banks play whack-a-mole and make it somewhat expensive for criminals to set up accounts; crypto undoubtedly makes money laundering substantially easier and cheaper.
  - SXX 1y ago
    Banks are good if you live in a functional democratic country with sane politics. If you don't then you'll easily get the bad side of it since abusing the power is not that hard.
  - TechDebtDevin 1y ago
    How is paypal / venmo / cashapp different?
    - veidr 1y ago
      you can sue them modulo all the ToS / arbitration clauses, that is still the fundamental difference and although not a recourse available to most people, still not nothing
whatsupdog 1y ago
[flagged]
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
dfxm12 1y ago
use them for various forms of crime It's not a coincidence that a guy who was found liable for financial fraud is reducing regulations around crypto currency and then launched a meme coin.
NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago
>Not to start a big argument, but to my eyes the main usecases of cryptocurrency are to bet on them as a speculative asset or to use them for various forms of crime. What argument can even be had? This is factually true. Whatever other use cases were hoped for when it was invented, they have failed to materialize.
eugene3306 1y ago
I use crypto often. I am Russian, I left Russia when Putin started the war. For me, it is quite hard to open a bank account. So I use crypto. I work remotely for a Singaporian company. Now I'm in Vietnam, I can pay for my groceries with crypto using QR code. I can cash USDT crypto with a rate better than paper bills. I have two bank accounts in Kazakhstan. Both card credentials were stolen after I used a popular hotel booking website, which, by the words of reddit, shares my card details with hotels. Some money was stolen. Seems like 3D-security only affects my payments, and theifs have a freedom to choose a website without 3D. Now I have to keep that cards always locked. Unlocking them for a short moments, when I need to make a card payment. Like booking an hotel, or buying an airline ticket.
- exFAT 1y ago
  >Now I'm in Vietnam, I can pay for my groceries with crypto using QR code. That sounds great. What do you use?
  - eugene3306 1y ago
    Fizen
- latchkey 1y ago
  It is wild how Vietnam really transformed from a complete cash society to a mostly digital one in just a few years. Covid did it. Nothing more annoying than having your largest bill be worth about $20 and having to carry stacks of them around for things like just paying rent.
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
fennecfoxy 1y ago
Totally agree, I think crypto is cool from a technological standpoint, but I don't think I've seen one common genuine use of BTC, etc. And before someone comes in with very specific, anecdotal examples - notice I said "common", ie not buying your indie music from a retro-Serb band that plays using the concept of instruments as instruments and from abandoned sewers; but only on Mondays. I definitely feel like the majority of crypto traffic is primarily due to bubbles/moneymaking/bets/pumps+dump and then the secondary/next closest use case is for criminal activity. And then after that perhaps the myriad of much smaller use cases like people paying for Proton using crypto.
- latchkey 1y ago
  > I've seen one common genuine use of BTC One of my favorited comments/threads: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26238410 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26238410
  - skybrian 1y ago
    The most surprising part of that thread is the claim that they’re using Bitcoin rather than a stablecoin. But perhaps things have changed in four years?
    - latchkey 1y ago
      To be fair, the article for the thread is about how Tether was forced to end in NY.
  - JamesBarney 1y ago
    Even that technically falls under the crime umbrella (though I don't believe it is immoral or unethical). It's basically the getting around government imposed capital controls.
    - latchkey 1y ago
      The comment (and thread) isn't about getting around capital controls, which is why it is so powerful. The comment argues that for people in stable, wealthy countries, Bitcoin can seem unnecessary or overhyped. But for those living in countries with dysfunctional banking systems, currency controls, or even mild corruption (like Argentina), it solves very real problems. Traditional financial systems often restrict access to dollars, limit foreign transfers, and are vulnerable to government seizure or devaluation, leaving people with few safe options to save or send money. Bitcoin offers a practical alternative for remittances, savings, and financial autonomy in places where the local system fails to protect or empower its citizens. While Bitcoin may look inefficient compared to ACH transfers in the U.S., it’s a lifeline elsewhere, and one that could become more relevant globally in times of instability.
isk517 1y ago
The biggest impact cryptocurrency has had on my life is the ability to pay criminals after they've taken your data hostage. It's awesome that we've invented a way to make creating and distributing malware profitable.
- pas 1y ago
  it definitely helps to motivate some people to consider security as a functional requirement
gradschool 1y ago
> Someone will probably tell me about some theoretical situation where it is a positive force Challenge accepted. My positive use case for cryptocurrency pertains to someone like me being over sixty and worried about being swept up into the guardianship system. With most of my assets in crypto and assuming decent opsec, they would be inaccessible to the guardian. If a judge ordered me to grant access, could I be cited for contempt by refusing to comply given that I had already been legally ruled incompetent? If I were cited regardless, would the threat of incarceration carry any weight given that I would be already incarcerated in an old age home? Unless there's some principle the guardian is trying to uphold, the rational course would be to choose a different victim.
- washadjeffmad 1y ago
  That's what happened to my grandfather, and the same happened to a friend's father two years ago. There are greater protections against elder abuse today, but often by the time their broker or finance manager finds out, the damage has been done.
- LiquidSky 1y ago
  Elder abuse is certainly a real problem, but the guardianship/conservatorship system also does address a real problem: many seniors actually do become mentally unable to manage themselves. You're worried about falsely being forced into a guardianship, but what happens if you actually do develop Alzheimer's or some other form of dementia and your family legitimately needs access to your assets to care for you? It's easy to say you'd just give them access before it gets really bad, but an insidious part of the problem is that someone suffering from such a decline either doesn't, or refuses to, recognize it happening.
  - Symbiote 1y ago
    Before she died, my grandmother couldn't remember where she'd hidden her most valuable jewellery. She was an excellent card player 10 years before that, probably because she could recall most/all of the playing cards in the discard pile, so I'm sure she could have remembered a Bitcoin wallet passphrase — until the last few years.
lupusreal 1y ago
Crypto is hard for most scam victims to buy. Ban gift cards. Gift cards have always been a lame thoughtless gift anyway.
- tayo42 1y ago
  This is what I'm wondering. How do you get the typical person to fall for a scam to open a crypto account, buy it, go through kyc, etc
  - xsmasher 1y ago
    I think they are doing bank transfers directly to the scammers, who give them a FAKE website that shows a crypto balance + great investment returns. I'm not sure crypto is involved at all; it's just the old Spanish prisoner / Nigerian prince scam with a new coat of paint.
  - nobody9999 1y ago
    >How do you get the typical person to fall for a scam to open a crypto account, buy it, go through kyc, etc With spam like the below (note that the original contains mostly UTF8 characters to avoid spam filters). I get these every so often on the NOC and postmaster addresses of domains I manage. It's not even phishing. Just spam blasts to find anyone uninformed enough to believe it, and insecure enough to be afraid of the (empty) "threat": Ţaƙе a second tо ѕtор, іոhɑlе ԁeерly, aոd соոсеntrate оn this мeѕsaԍе. It'ѕ сruсiɑl to gіѵe it yоur ϲомplete focus. Wе'rе about tо ԁisϲusѕ а ѕіgnіficɑnt mɑttеr bеtweеո uѕ, аոԁ І'м аbsоlutely ոоt kidԁіոɡ. Үоu miɡht nоt recоgոіᴢe me, but І'м fаmіlіar with yоu and at thіѕ mомеnt, yоu'rе lіkеlẏ ẇоnderіոɡ hоԝ, rіght? Үоur brоwѕіոɡ hаbіtѕ hɑѵe beeո riѕky - ѕϲrоllіnɡ thrоuɡh vіԁеоs, clickіոɡ lіnκs, аnԁ vіѕіtiոɡ some unѕɑfe ẇеbѕitеѕ. I dерlоуеd мalwɑrе oո ɑո ɑdult sіtе, aոd уou ѕtuмblеd ɑcross it. Whіlе уоu ẇerе streɑміng, ẏour ѕуѕtем wаѕ eẋрosеd thrоugh rdp, аllowing ме full аcсeѕѕ to your deѵiϲe. Noᴡ I cаn mоnitоr everẏthіnɡ oո your ѕϲrееn, rемоtеly ɑсtіvаte your ϲɑmеra and мiсrорhoոе, aոd yоu wоulԁո't eѵen notice. I alѕо hɑνе соmpletе ɑccеsѕ to ẏour eмaіls, ϲontаcts and other acϲountѕ. I'νе beеո obserѵіnԍ your аctivitіеs fоr quite somе tіme now. Іt's ѕiмрlẏ unfоrtunate for yоu thаt I ϲɑmе ɑcrosѕ whɑt уоuâνe beeո up to. I speոt morе tiме thаn neсеsѕarẏ dіԍԍinԍ іnto уоur pеrѕoոɑl datɑ. І'vе соllected a significɑոt aмount оf ѕeոsitіνе іnformɑtion frом ẏour devicе аnd reѵiеwеd it thоroughlу. І еѵen hɑve reсordiոgs of yоu еոԍagіոɡ іn ѕoме rather ԛuеѕtiоnаble behɑviоr аt hoме. I've сoмріlеd viԁеоѕ anԁ sոɑрshots (incluԁiոԍ іmagеѕ оf ẏour liviոԍ spaсе) ẇhеrе оnе siԁe ԁisрlays the соոtеոt ẏou wеre viewing, ɑnԁ thе other siԁе shoᴡs you... ԝеll, let'ѕ just saу уоu κոоԝ what I меаո. With a singlе ϲlіcƙ, I could ѕharе thiѕ with еѵery оnе оf ẏоur ϲoոtactѕ. І uոderstanԁ уоur uncertaіոty, but don't eхpect anу leոieոcẏ from mе. Тhat ѕaid, I'м рrерarеd tо let thiѕ ԍо aոd аllоẇ yоu tо ϲarry on аѕ іf nothing еνer оϲсurred. Неre'ѕ thе deɑl - I'm offеrinɡ ẏоu twо chоiсеs: - Igոore this меѕsаɡe ɑnԁ fіոd оut ԝhɑt hаpреոs next. If ẏоu taƙе thіѕ рath, I'll ѕhаre thе ѵiԁeo with аll уour coոtaсts. It's ԛuіtе а reѵеɑlіng ϲlip, aոd I can oոlẏ іmаginе the huміlіаtіоn уоu'ԁ facе whеn your сollеaɡueѕ, friends, and fаmіly ѵіeẇ іt. But, ɑѕ they ѕay, аctіоnѕ have соnѕequеnceѕ. Dоn't роsitiоո yourѕelf aѕ thе νіctiм here. - Раy me tо kеeр thіѕ мɑttеr privatе. Let's rеfer tо іt aѕ a prіvɑcy fеe. Hеrе'ѕ thе ԁeal іf you ԍo thіs route: уour sесrеt reмɑiոs sаfe, ոo one еlsе ᴡіll eνer knоẇ. Օոcе I reсеіve thе pаẏмеոt, І'll dеlеtе еverẏthіոɡ. Thе paуmеոt iѕ to bе mаdе eхϲluѕivеly iո сrẏptо. І'м ɑімing for a rеsolutioո that ẇоrκs for bоth оf uѕ, but mу termѕ are fiոal anԁ noո neԍоtіɑble. 1100 USD tо мy bitcoiո ɑԁԁrеѕs beloᴡ (remove whitespaces if any): bc1qt30ya4ssczyhzpe03t6jt8524hgfswe7pdxq9u Onϲe the paymеnt іѕ мɑԁе, yоu ϲаn rеst еɑsy κnoᴡiոԍ І ƙeер му word. Үou hаνе 50 hоurs tо сoмplеte the trɑnsaсtion, аnd btс іѕ the onlу fоrм оf pɑymeոt І'll ɑccept. Thе syѕtем I'vе sеt uр ԝіll ɑutомаticɑllу ԁеtect thе payment anԁ imмedіɑtely dеlete eѵеrуthіnɡ I hаνe on you. Don't wаste tіme rеѕpоndіnԍ or atteмрtіոg tо ոeԍotіatе - it wоո't work. Іf І notiсe yоu'vе sроƙeո to аnyоոе about thіѕ оr ѕоuԍht aԁνicе, thе vіԁеo will be sеnt to уоur соntaсtѕ withоut hesitatіоn. Aոd ԁoո't thіոk аbоut turniոg off ẏоur рhonе оr attеmрtiոԍ a fаctоrẏ rеѕеt - it won't мaκe a diffеrеոϲe. І ԁon't makе errors, aոd I'm ѕimplẏ ԝаіtіnԍ for the pɑyмent. As you can see, the claims and threats are cartoonish. But folks who aren't tech savvy could be fooled by this. I'd expect that each spam recipient is given a unique BTC address, so that they can be identified for further "blackmail"[0] should they actually comply. And to clarify, the above message was received by a "postmaster@domain" account on 23 May 2025. And since I've been seeing them for at least a few years I can only assume they are at least occasionally successful. There are other scams that target folks with bitcoin demands too. Likely with similar claims. [0] https://malwaretips.com/blogs/ive-recorded-many-videos-of-you-email-scam/ https://malwaretips.com/blogs/ive-recorded-many-videos-of-yo...
kjkjadksj 1y ago
In the past they might have asked you to mail them USD. Same risk there. Not like the post office is funded sufficiently to open all mail. And once that money is out of your bank account and out of your hands it is also gone.
deadbabe 1y ago
The idea that someone could just beat you with a lead pipe until you open up your bitcoin wallet and surrender all the bitcoins and then there is nothing you can do about it in any kind of legal system or even cryptographically should terrify anyone into boasting about having any kind of bitcoin assets.
- dpassens 1y ago
  I wouldn't recommend boasting about owning bitcoin either but why couldn't you involve the legal system? They can go after the criminals who beat you with the pipe just as they could if they beat you to get to your cash/luxury car/art/jewelry/other valuable stuff.
throwaway494932 1y ago
> various forms of crime. Keep in mind that most of the world doesn't live in a perfectly functioning country with proper rule of law. Being able to use crypto to commit a crime in those countries is a feature. You never know when you will need this feature in your own. (Stupid example: tomorrow Trump wakes up and decide to block all bank accounts of non-citizen until they prove that they are in the US legally: will being able to make crypto transfers be good or bad ?) But even assuming that all criminal use of crypto is bad, as our money become more digital, we are more and more dependent on a small number of payment processors that get to decide what is good and what is bad, regardless of the legal status (or decide that the legal status that matters is the one of the US, even if you live in Nigeria). This is particularly true for businesses that handle anything sex-related. For an example of the latter, just a few days ago a payment processor suspended its services to Civitai [1] because it lets people to make ai-generated porn. "The company that had been processing credit card payments for Civitai made the decision to cease processing payments beginning May 23, 2025, due to their discomfort with enabling AI-generated explicit content." [1] https://www.laweekly.com/civitai-ditched-by-credit-card-processor/ https://www.laweekly.com/civitai-ditched-by-credit-card-proc...
robomartin 1y ago
> Cryptocurrency enables at big part of this Interesting panel discussion on the state of crypto today at the Regan National Economic Forum event. I believe it is the third panel in the stream: https://www.reaganfoundation.org/events/videos/2025-reagan-national-economic-forum-presidential-learning-center https://www.reaganfoundation.org/events/videos/2025-reagan-n...
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
cyanydeez 1y ago
porn and fraud seem to be leading indicators of technological progress.
UltraSane 1y ago
Turns out making fraudulent transactions photographically irreversible wasn't such a good idea.

by naet 1y ago

whimsicalism 1y ago

i bet heavily using crypto against AI progress on coding to hedge my career

gavagai691 1y ago
Is your job developing AI coding tools?
- whimsicalism 1y ago
  no, but i do work in ML - i think there are two channels through which this derisking makes sense, but people on here get aggressive if you mention the other one.
dantillberg 1y ago
How is crypto relevant to betting?
- whimsicalism 1y ago
  because it gives you access to binary options markets with deep liquidity that you can’t get access to in any other way. i guess it counts under various forms of crime because we criminalize offering useful financial instruments

alexey-salmin 1y ago

Whether you see international money transfers outside of the government control as a positive or negative force largely depends on how much you trust your government. How much it should limit things for your own safety? I suspect that for majority of the earth population the trust level is rather low, even though in some countries it could be different.

os2warpman 1y ago
If I had to throw out a number describing how many more times I trust the FDIC than I trust some cryptobro, the first thing that comes to mind is "ten billion". And my trust in the current administration is rather low.
- homebrewer 1y ago
  Well, they're pretty comparable in many parts of the world (and I despise cryptocurrency, btw). Despite what you might think, the current US administration is far from the worst compared to what some of us live under. Americans simply lack a proper "zero point" to be able to properly gauge this. I place exactly zero trust in what our administration says, because they've lied about the country's economic situation and what they're planning to do about it four times during my lifetime, and several more times during our parents' lifetimes. Our savings were cut in half (or more) several times because of this, and so much of it was lost, the total amount of time wasted working for effectively free is in the decades now. There's really no reliable way of saving money long-term here, unless you scrounge enough to buy real estate or something else that is unlikely to be devalued to 30% of its original value with a stroke of a pen. I can imagine why some people would resort to cryptocurrency and extracting money out of the country asap.
  - palmfacehn 1y ago
    These are all good points. Like others here, I will preemptively state my dislike of the political classes. Perhaps if financial regulations were not so onerous, traditional payment processors like PayPal would be able to handle more types of transactions with a lower overhead. As it is, the large number of prohibited categories creates a demand for cryptocurrency. As you noted, inflationary monetary policy is another source of discontent. Perhaps if central bankers had exercised a bit more restraint, there would be less demand for cryptocurrency. The same can be said for capital controls and more... So there is a bit of irony when posters appeal for even heavier regulations and prohibitions. These are the forces which have created demand for wholly unregulated markets. It shouldn't be hard to see how these overreaches have created a counterbalancing force. Tragically, these overreaches generate a safe-haven for additional bad actors.

tbrownaw 1y ago

> main usecases of cryptocurrency are to bet on them as a speculative asset or to use them for various forms of crime. Someone will probably tell me about some theoretical situation where it is a positive force When you don't agree with the laws that are being broken in a particular case.

porridgeraisin 1y ago
So if 57% in a country agree with a law, the remaining 43% should be allowed to circumvent that law through these means? Of course, the opposite argument is "what about north korea", but it's a package deal is my point.
- johngladtj 1y ago
  Generally speaking you shouldn't be able to impose your will on others
  - porridgeraisin 1y ago
    Sure, but in every democracy most laws pass with such just-about majorities.
- naming_the_user 1y ago
  Pretty much, yeah. If almost half of the population disagree with something then it’s probably a stupid restriction to begin with.
  - porridgeraisin 1y ago
    But most laws in democracies pass with just about majority. The president in america was selected with just-about majority. Do you suggest changing elections so that we keep doing them until the vote skews to 100%? 90%? What's the threshold?
    - naming_the_user 1y ago

anovikov 1y ago

Reason of most scams is the absurd level of trust existing in Western countries. When i first saw Upwork where hours were paid by the tracker in a guaranteed manner and people SIGNED for it, i knew West was doomed. I still find it hard to believe people can be that easy to dupe. Level of trust in the Western societies needs to be radically reduced through government propaganda, church and other channels. The world has become global. Westerners are now a small minority in an ocean of people where the manner of relationship that will be seen as sociopathic in the West, is the everyday norm and always have been. If they won't adapt, they will cease to exist. The cozy world where one could trust another because they all shared fear of God and had a reputation to lose, is gone.

Waterluvian 1y ago
A high trust society is actually a good trait, not a bad one. It’s rather easy, lazy even, for a culture to devolve into a low trust minima. That’s basically the default state that people have endeavoured to evolve out of. I think it’s also the kind of thing that can easily overwhelm anxious minds. The kind where “what if it’s a scam?” leads them to never taking a risk, donating to a cause, doing someone a favour. Not that there isn’t a fight to be fought here. But waving the surrender flag on fostering a trusting society is a very weak move.
- anovikov 1y ago
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  - ksenzee 1y ago
    Sorry, are you saying that the main reason immigrants from Eastern Europe and India become rich is through scamming hapless fools? Not through, say, hard work and educational opportunities? And are you saying this is a change, or how it’s always been?
    - anovikov 1y ago
      [flagged]

kalaksi 1y ago

The banks here have said that if you get scammed and money has been transferred (no cryptocurrency involved), there's nothing they can do. It was a bit surprising to hear since you only hear cryptocurrency transactions being irreversible.

silisili 1y ago
Banks aren't perfect, but they also aren't anonymous. If you feel wronged, you can take appropriate legal recourse. Crypto offers no such thing.
- whatsupdog 1y ago
  Good luck taking legal action against an off shore entity, especially when the legal fees is more than the money transferred, and the money most likely moved to three different accounts in as many countries from that first off shore account.
  - theptip 1y ago
    You’re right that you don’t have guaranteed recourse for foreign fraud. But at least the banks play whack-a-mole and make it somewhat expensive for criminals to set up accounts; crypto undoubtedly makes money laundering substantially easier and cheaper.
- SXX 1y ago
  Banks are good if you live in a functional democratic country with sane politics. If you don't then you'll easily get the bad side of it since abusing the power is not that hard.
- TechDebtDevin 1y ago
  How is paypal / venmo / cashapp different?
  - veidr 1y ago
    you can sue them modulo all the ToS / arbitration clauses, that is still the fundamental difference and although not a recourse available to most people, still not nothing

whatsupdog 1y ago

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dfxm12 1y ago

use them for various forms of crime It's not a coincidence that a guy who was found liable for financial fraud is reducing regulations around crypto currency and then launched a meme coin.

NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago

>Not to start a big argument, but to my eyes the main usecases of cryptocurrency are to bet on them as a speculative asset or to use them for various forms of crime. What argument can even be had? This is factually true. Whatever other use cases were hoped for when it was invented, they have failed to materialize.

eugene3306 1y ago

I use crypto often. I am Russian, I left Russia when Putin started the war. For me, it is quite hard to open a bank account. So I use crypto. I work remotely for a Singaporian company. Now I'm in Vietnam, I can pay for my groceries with crypto using QR code. I can cash USDT crypto with a rate better than paper bills. I have two bank accounts in Kazakhstan. Both card credentials were stolen after I used a popular hotel booking website, which, by the words of reddit, shares my card details with hotels. Some money was stolen. Seems like 3D-security only affects my payments, and theifs have a freedom to choose a website without 3D. Now I have to keep that cards always locked. Unlocking them for a short moments, when I need to make a card payment. Like booking an hotel, or buying an airline ticket.

exFAT 1y ago
>Now I'm in Vietnam, I can pay for my groceries with crypto using QR code. That sounds great. What do you use?
- eugene3306 1y ago
  Fizen
latchkey 1y ago
It is wild how Vietnam really transformed from a complete cash society to a mostly digital one in just a few years. Covid did it. Nothing more annoying than having your largest bill be worth about $20 and having to carry stacks of them around for things like just paying rent.

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fennecfoxy 1y ago

Totally agree, I think crypto is cool from a technological standpoint, but I don't think I've seen one common genuine use of BTC, etc. And before someone comes in with very specific, anecdotal examples - notice I said "common", ie not buying your indie music from a retro-Serb band that plays using the concept of instruments as instruments and from abandoned sewers; but only on Mondays. I definitely feel like the majority of crypto traffic is primarily due to bubbles/moneymaking/bets/pumps+dump and then the secondary/next closest use case is for criminal activity. And then after that perhaps the myriad of much smaller use cases like people paying for Proton using crypto.

latchkey 1y ago
> I've seen one common genuine use of BTC One of my favorited comments/threads: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26238410 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26238410
- skybrian 1y ago
  The most surprising part of that thread is the claim that they’re using Bitcoin rather than a stablecoin. But perhaps things have changed in four years?
  - latchkey 1y ago
    To be fair, the article for the thread is about how Tether was forced to end in NY.
- JamesBarney 1y ago
  Even that technically falls under the crime umbrella (though I don't believe it is immoral or unethical). It's basically the getting around government imposed capital controls.
  - latchkey 1y ago
    The comment (and thread) isn't about getting around capital controls, which is why it is so powerful. The comment argues that for people in stable, wealthy countries, Bitcoin can seem unnecessary or overhyped. But for those living in countries with dysfunctional banking systems, currency controls, or even mild corruption (like Argentina), it solves very real problems. Traditional financial systems often restrict access to dollars, limit foreign transfers, and are vulnerable to government seizure or devaluation, leaving people with few safe options to save or send money. Bitcoin offers a practical alternative for remittances, savings, and financial autonomy in places where the local system fails to protect or empower its citizens. While Bitcoin may look inefficient compared to ACH transfers in the U.S., it’s a lifeline elsewhere, and one that could become more relevant globally in times of instability.

isk517 1y ago

The biggest impact cryptocurrency has had on my life is the ability to pay criminals after they've taken your data hostage. It's awesome that we've invented a way to make creating and distributing malware profitable.

pas 1y ago
it definitely helps to motivate some people to consider security as a functional requirement

gradschool 1y ago

> Someone will probably tell me about some theoretical situation where it is a positive force Challenge accepted. My positive use case for cryptocurrency pertains to someone like me being over sixty and worried about being swept up into the guardianship system. With most of my assets in crypto and assuming decent opsec, they would be inaccessible to the guardian. If a judge ordered me to grant access, could I be cited for contempt by refusing to comply given that I had already been legally ruled incompetent? If I were cited regardless, would the threat of incarceration carry any weight given that I would be already incarcerated in an old age home? Unless there's some principle the guardian is trying to uphold, the rational course would be to choose a different victim.

washadjeffmad 1y ago
That's what happened to my grandfather, and the same happened to a friend's father two years ago. There are greater protections against elder abuse today, but often by the time their broker or finance manager finds out, the damage has been done.
LiquidSky 1y ago
Elder abuse is certainly a real problem, but the guardianship/conservatorship system also does address a real problem: many seniors actually do become mentally unable to manage themselves. You're worried about falsely being forced into a guardianship, but what happens if you actually do develop Alzheimer's or some other form of dementia and your family legitimately needs access to your assets to care for you? It's easy to say you'd just give them access before it gets really bad, but an insidious part of the problem is that someone suffering from such a decline either doesn't, or refuses to, recognize it happening.
- Symbiote 1y ago
  Before she died, my grandmother couldn't remember where she'd hidden her most valuable jewellery. She was an excellent card player 10 years before that, probably because she could recall most/all of the playing cards in the discard pile, so I'm sure she could have remembered a Bitcoin wallet passphrase — until the last few years.

lupusreal 1y ago

Crypto is hard for most scam victims to buy. Ban gift cards. Gift cards have always been a lame thoughtless gift anyway.

tayo42 1y ago
This is what I'm wondering. How do you get the typical person to fall for a scam to open a crypto account, buy it, go through kyc, etc
- xsmasher 1y ago
  I think they are doing bank transfers directly to the scammers, who give them a FAKE website that shows a crypto balance + great investment returns. I'm not sure crypto is involved at all; it's just the old Spanish prisoner / Nigerian prince scam with a new coat of paint.
- nobody9999 1y ago
  >How do you get the typical person to fall for a scam to open a crypto account, buy it, go through kyc, etc With spam like the below (note that the original contains mostly UTF8 characters to avoid spam filters). I get these every so often on the NOC and postmaster addresses of domains I manage. It's not even phishing. Just spam blasts to find anyone uninformed enough to believe it, and insecure enough to be afraid of the (empty) "threat": Ţaƙе a second tо ѕtор, іոhɑlе ԁeерly, aոd соոсеntrate оn this мeѕsaԍе. It'ѕ сruсiɑl to gіѵe it yоur ϲомplete focus. Wе'rе about tо ԁisϲusѕ а ѕіgnіficɑnt mɑttеr bеtweеո uѕ, аոԁ І'м аbsоlutely ոоt kidԁіոɡ. Үоu miɡht nоt recоgոіᴢe me, but І'м fаmіlіar with yоu and at thіѕ mомеnt, yоu'rе lіkеlẏ ẇоnderіոɡ hоԝ, rіght? Үоur brоwѕіոɡ hаbіtѕ hɑѵe beeո riѕky - ѕϲrоllіnɡ thrоuɡh vіԁеоs, clickіոɡ lіnκs, аnԁ vіѕіtiոɡ some unѕɑfe ẇеbѕitеѕ. I dерlоуеd мalwɑrе oո ɑո ɑdult sіtе, aոd уou ѕtuмblеd ɑcross it. Whіlе уоu ẇerе streɑміng, ẏour ѕуѕtем wаѕ eẋрosеd thrоugh rdp, аllowing ме full аcсeѕѕ to your deѵiϲe. Noᴡ I cаn mоnitоr everẏthіnɡ oո your ѕϲrееn, rемоtеly ɑсtіvаte your ϲɑmеra and мiсrорhoոе, aոd yоu wоulԁո't eѵen notice. I alѕо hɑνе соmpletе ɑccеsѕ to ẏour eмaіls, ϲontаcts and other acϲountѕ. I'νе beеո obserѵіnԍ your аctivitіеs fоr quite somе tіme now. Іt's ѕiмрlẏ unfоrtunate for yоu thаt I ϲɑmе ɑcrosѕ whɑt уоuâνe beeո up to. I speոt morе tiме thаn neсеsѕarẏ dіԍԍinԍ іnto уоur pеrѕoոɑl datɑ. І'vе соllected a significɑոt aмount оf ѕeոsitіνе іnformɑtion frом ẏour devicе аnd reѵiеwеd it thоroughlу. І еѵen hɑve reсordiոgs of yоu еոԍagіոɡ іn ѕoме rather ԛuеѕtiоnаble behɑviоr аt hoме. I've сoмріlеd viԁеоѕ anԁ sոɑрshots (incluԁiոԍ іmagеѕ оf ẏour liviոԍ spaсе) ẇhеrе оnе siԁe ԁisрlays the соոtеոt ẏou wеre viewing, ɑnԁ thе other siԁе shoᴡs you... ԝеll, let'ѕ just saу уоu κոоԝ what I меаո. With a singlе ϲlіcƙ, I could ѕharе thiѕ with еѵery оnе оf ẏоur ϲoոtactѕ. І uոderstanԁ уоur uncertaіոty, but don't eхpect anу leոieոcẏ from mе. Тhat ѕaid, I'м рrерarеd tо let thiѕ ԍо aոd аllоẇ yоu tо ϲarry on аѕ іf nothing еνer оϲсurred. Неre'ѕ thе deɑl - I'm offеrinɡ ẏоu twо chоiсеs: - Igոore this меѕsаɡe ɑnԁ fіոd оut ԝhɑt hаpреոs next. If ẏоu taƙе thіѕ рath, I'll ѕhаre thе ѵiԁeo with аll уour coոtaсts. It's ԛuіtе а reѵеɑlіng ϲlip, aոd I can oոlẏ іmаginе the huміlіаtіоn уоu'ԁ facе whеn your сollеaɡueѕ, friends, and fаmіly ѵіeẇ іt. But, ɑѕ they ѕay, аctіоnѕ have соnѕequеnceѕ. Dоn't роsitiоո yourѕelf aѕ thе νіctiм here. - Раy me tо kеeр thіѕ мɑttеr privatе. Let's rеfer tо іt aѕ a prіvɑcy fеe. Hеrе'ѕ thе ԁeal іf you ԍo thіs route: уour sесrеt reмɑiոs sаfe, ոo one еlsе ᴡіll eνer knоẇ. Օոcе I reсеіve thе pаẏмеոt, І'll dеlеtе еverẏthіոɡ. Thе paуmеոt iѕ to bе mаdе eхϲluѕivеly iո сrẏptо. І'м ɑімing for a rеsolutioո that ẇоrκs for bоth оf uѕ, but mу termѕ are fiոal anԁ noո neԍоtіɑble. 1100 USD tо мy bitcoiո ɑԁԁrеѕs beloᴡ (remove whitespaces if any): bc1qt30ya4ssczyhzpe03t6jt8524hgfswe7pdxq9u Onϲe the paymеnt іѕ мɑԁе, yоu ϲаn rеst еɑsy κnoᴡiոԍ І ƙeер му word. Үou hаνе 50 hоurs tо сoмplеte the trɑnsaсtion, аnd btс іѕ the onlу fоrм оf pɑymeոt І'll ɑccept. Thе syѕtем I'vе sеt uр ԝіll ɑutомаticɑllу ԁеtect thе payment anԁ imмedіɑtely dеlete eѵеrуthіnɡ I hаνe on you. Don't wаste tіme rеѕpоndіnԍ or atteмрtіոg tо ոeԍotіatе - it wоո't work. Іf І notiсe yоu'vе sроƙeո to аnyоոе about thіѕ оr ѕоuԍht aԁνicе, thе vіԁеo will be sеnt to уоur соntaсtѕ withоut hesitatіоn. Aոd ԁoո't thіոk аbоut turniոg off ẏоur рhonе оr attеmрtiոԍ a fаctоrẏ rеѕеt - it won't мaκe a diffеrеոϲe. І ԁon't makе errors, aոd I'm ѕimplẏ ԝаіtіnԍ for the pɑyмent. As you can see, the claims and threats are cartoonish. But folks who aren't tech savvy could be fooled by this. I'd expect that each spam recipient is given a unique BTC address, so that they can be identified for further "blackmail"[0] should they actually comply. And to clarify, the above message was received by a "postmaster@domain" account on 23 May 2025. And since I've been seeing them for at least a few years I can only assume they are at least occasionally successful. There are other scams that target folks with bitcoin demands too. Likely with similar claims. [0] https://malwaretips.com/blogs/ive-recorded-many-videos-of-you-email-scam/ https://malwaretips.com/blogs/ive-recorded-many-videos-of-yo...

kjkjadksj 1y ago

In the past they might have asked you to mail them USD. Same risk there. Not like the post office is funded sufficiently to open all mail. And once that money is out of your bank account and out of your hands it is also gone.

deadbabe 1y ago

The idea that someone could just beat you with a lead pipe until you open up your bitcoin wallet and surrender all the bitcoins and then there is nothing you can do about it in any kind of legal system or even cryptographically should terrify anyone into boasting about having any kind of bitcoin assets.

dpassens 1y ago
I wouldn't recommend boasting about owning bitcoin either but why couldn't you involve the legal system? They can go after the criminals who beat you with the pipe just as they could if they beat you to get to your cash/luxury car/art/jewelry/other valuable stuff.

throwaway494932 1y ago

> various forms of crime. Keep in mind that most of the world doesn't live in a perfectly functioning country with proper rule of law. Being able to use crypto to commit a crime in those countries is a feature. You never know when you will need this feature in your own. (Stupid example: tomorrow Trump wakes up and decide to block all bank accounts of non-citizen until they prove that they are in the US legally: will being able to make crypto transfers be good or bad ?) But even assuming that all criminal use of crypto is bad, as our money become more digital, we are more and more dependent on a small number of payment processors that get to decide what is good and what is bad, regardless of the legal status (or decide that the legal status that matters is the one of the US, even if you live in Nigeria). This is particularly true for businesses that handle anything sex-related. For an example of the latter, just a few days ago a payment processor suspended its services to Civitai [1] because it lets people to make ai-generated porn. "The company that had been processing credit card payments for Civitai made the decision to cease processing payments beginning May 23, 2025, due to their discomfort with enabling AI-generated explicit content." [1] https://www.laweekly.com/civitai-ditched-by-credit-card-processor/ https://www.laweekly.com/civitai-ditched-by-credit-card-proc...

robomartin 1y ago

> Cryptocurrency enables at big part of this Interesting panel discussion on the state of crypto today at the Regan National Economic Forum event. I believe it is the third panel in the stream: https://www.reaganfoundation.org/events/videos/2025-reagan-national-economic-forum-presidential-learning-center https://www.reaganfoundation.org/events/videos/2025-reagan-n...

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cyanydeez 1y ago

porn and fraud seem to be leading indicators of technological progress.

UltraSane 1y ago

Turns out making fraudulent transactions photographically irreversible wasn't such a good idea.