14 ms·
Seems like Microsoft is just taking whatever Chromium releases and repackages it to show more ads and to make Bing the default search engine. In this case, it's
by AnonC 2y ago
Seems like Microsoft is just taking whatever Chromium releases and repackages it to show more ads and to make Bing the default search engine. In this case, it's just dropping support for Manifest V2 extensions, such as uBlock Origin, and moving to Manifest V3, which does not support extensions intercepting and blocking requests using blockingWebRequest.
Just three days ago, Mozilla reiterated [1] that Firefox would continue to support Manifest V2 alongside Manifest V3. So if you want a better web experience with uBlock Origin, Firefox is your only choice (or use Firefox forks that support it). While you're at it, note that "uBlock Origin works best on Firefox". [2]
[1]: https://blog.mozilla.org/en/products/firefox/firefox-manifest-v3-adblockers/ https://blog.mozilla.org/en/products/firefox/firefox-manifes...
[2]: https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock/wiki/uBlock-Origin-works-best-on-Firefox https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock/wiki/uBlock-Origin-works-b...
- nout 2y agoIt's quite relevant to highlight that Mozilla is removing the promise that they won't sell your data: https://github.com/mozilla/bedrock/commit/d459addab846d8144b61939b7f4310eb80c5470e#commitcomment-153095625 https://github.com/mozilla/bedrock/commit/d459addab846d8144b... Another browser option is Brave, but you have to disable the altcoins stuff :/
- WithinReason 2y agoNo you don't, it's opt in.
- handoflixue 2y agoFull context, from the link you provided: ""Mozilla doesn’t sell data about you (in the way that most people think about “selling data“), and we don’t buy data about you. Since we strive for transparency, and the LEGAL definition of “sale of data“ is extremely broad in some places, we’ve had to step back from making the definitive statements you know and love." I don't think that's an unreasonable stance, and they're still explicitly saying "We are as close to not selling data as it is legally possible to be". This is reiterated in the linked Privacy FAQ on their official site: https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/privacy/faq/ https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/privacy/faq/
- ginko 2y agoStill makes it sound like they want to profit from user data.
- pbhjpbhj 2y agoWhat "sale of data" falls under a legal definition but would be understood by everyone to not be selling data? An example? It sounds more like 'we sell your data, but we do it in a legally protracted way so we could claim up to now that we don't'. Given this relates to Firefox's central selling proposition, they surely have an essay detailing exactly what data they're selling?
- tgsovlerkhgsel 2y agoI would expect that the default search engine deals that Firefox mostly relies on for financing could be interpreted as such. Mozilla gets money, and as a result of the deal, the searches (data) of anyone who didn't change the default go to the company running the default search engine.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
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- Yizahi 2y agoIt is always the same idea - if the data is even slightly touched and/or processed, it is suddenly not a personal data anymore and is "ok" to be sold.
- Xiol32 2y agoThere's also Zen, which is Firefox based.
- bix6 2y agoBy altcoins do you mean BAT? What’s the issue with it?
- Ylpertnodi 2y agoTurn off bat - no issues. I installed brave from a portable version and update the parts - found thru trial and error - as required, from the latest downloads
- bix6 2y agoWhat’s the issue with BAT though?
- _cenw 2y agoThey falsely advertised that creators who didn't opt in (or even knew about this) could be supported by donating BAT, and then kept it once it remained unclaimed. BAT is also different from adblocking, because it monetizes other people's content. It's about as close to stealing as you can get in the ad business, aside from the Honey affiliate highjacking.
- Dylan16807 2y agoI don't think they kept any BAT in that situation.
- soundnote 2y agoThe BAT was Brave's to begin with as far as I know, part of a pool to promote the launch of their tipping system. It makes perfect sense to return the BAT users could assign from the pool to creators back to the pool if the creators didn't sign up. Which is not to say that the tipping UI wasn't a hot mess, which it was. Hard to tell who was onboard, who wasn't and eg. Tom Scott got a bunch of tips when he had no interest in the platform whatsoever. > BAT is also different from adblocking, because it monetizes other people's content. It doesn't. The browser literally shows you toaster popups all by itself, and gives you some pocket change amounts of BAT for viewing them.
- herbst 2y agoI also thought Brave is the browser with the annoying token. But I still haven't seen anything about BAT but happily using brave for a while now.
- SllX 2y agoArc is a Chromium web browser that also includes uBlock Origin in the default install. Orion is a WebKit web browser from the folks at Kagi that supports both Firefox and Chromium extensions (including on iPhones and iPads) and has zero telemetry, and I have the Firefox version of uBlock Origin installed. Firefox is not the only option for people that want alternatives to Chrome that support uBlock Origin.
- elcomet 2y agoIf it's chromium based, they will need to remove manifest v2 at some point to stay close to the upstream version.
- SllX 2y agoPossibly in Arc, although Brave also continues to support Manifest v2 so it’s possible it will continue to persist in some subset of Chromium-based browsers and as I said, it ships with the browser and is installed by default; but Orion is not Chromium-based.
- ffsm8 2y agoBrave supports it right now, which is 2 months after it's been removed upstream. I strongly suspect they're gonna drop support as soon as the first bigger merge issue happens along with a heartfelt blog that "they did they everything to support it, but it was just too much for the resources available to them" I doubt it's gonna take more then 1-2 years (December 2027) for this to happen, but we will see.
- lillecarl 2y agoI don't understand or know alot about extensions, but what is so incredibly impossible about adding new capabilities to manifestv3? It's a manifest describing what the addon wants to do and some UX to allow it right?
- 2y ago
- pyeri 2y agoThe end of extensions like uBlock Origin will mark the end of power user era in web development history.
- ahartmetz 2y agoI think power users are the type of users who can be bothered to install a browser that supports the features that they want (and doesn't implement the misfeatures that they don't want) ;)
- alberto-m 2y agoYes, but there seems to be a growing hiatus between the tools used by power users and normal ones. Fifteen years ago everyone had a PC with Firefox, now this browser has a marginal market share, and even personal computers are starting to be a second-class platform, the focus being phones. And products used by a minority tend to be less supported – as shown by the increasing number of sites that don't support Firefox.
- CalRobert 2y agoUntil sites block them completely, which will be easier with attestation
- viraptor 2y agoIt's already been trivial. There's a few sites showing you a special message or denying access if you block ads. uBlock doesn't really help here that much and if they tried, the issue is very asymmetric - it's much easier to update the site than to patch it again.
- tgsovlerkhgsel 2y agoSo far, most of these sites that try to exclude adblocker users don't detect uBO on Firefox.
- 2y ago
- 7bit 2y agoThat is sad. I need multiple profiles for my work and I cannot use Firefox because the profile support is awful. Creating and managing profiles as well as switching profiles is so intuitive in Chrome, it just works. In Firefox it's extremely user hostile. Hearing that Microsoft will also remove uBlock from Edge makes me angry, because that will make my work-life so much more annoying.
- captn3m0 2y agoBetter profile support is coming soon, already in Nightly. Edit: https://connect.mozilla.org/t5/discussions/try-out-firefox-profiles-in-nightly/m-p/84223 https://connect.mozilla.org/t5/discussions/try-out-firefox-p...
- ourmandave 2y agoI assume this means they've added AI to better tie together the profile you use for work and the one you use for sh*t posting. Working title: Copilot for Tracking.
- viraptor 2y agoAre containers not good enough to replace profiles for your use case? I've been juggling those like profiles and I'm very happy.
- hypercube33 2y agoOnly thing I can suggest is filing feedback. They don't have market share so they still listen, for now
- tharos47 2y agoYou should use "Multi account containers" instead of profiles in firefox. It's like profiles in chrome/edge but it works by tab instead.
- zeeZ 2y agoIt doesn't allow for different extensions though. I need to use a full profile in order to use separate bitwarden accounts, for example.
- tomohawk 2y ago[dead]
- pbronez 2y agoEdge has two features I actually like: - integrated screen shot, which includes a “full webpage” option that handles scrolling for you - Split View, which lets you open two webpages side by side within a single tab I use both of these daily and get a decent productivity boost from them.
- madeofpalk 2y agoIt's funny because Firefox and Chrome both support full webpage screenshots natively, but they just bury it in their dev tools.
- meew0 2y agoThe screenshot feature is easily accessible in Firefox using the right-click context menu on any webpage
- Izkata 2y agoIf you customize your toolbar you can also add a button for it there
- madeofpalk 2y agoTIL! Thanks!
- rdlw 2y agoIf Mozilla really is as shady about user data as some people think they've become, someone's about to be pretty confused about why they suddenly have hundreds of nearly-identical screenshots of this HN page on their servers
- virtualcharles 2y agoAll the major browsers can do the screenshot thing, most just keep it hidden in the dev tools for some reason while MS realized “hey, people who have no idea what html is might like taking screenshots too”.
- 2y ago
- paul7986 2y agoIndeed, Ive used firefox (since 2004) with uBlock (since 2015 or so) and have mac Mini(s) connected to TVs; use wireless mouse to enjoy the web from my couch or in my room. There are zero ads or popups seen. On other TVs like my Roku i do pay for a few streaming services with ads and get bombarded with ads on that tv. But its a group tv that many use.
- spacephysics 2y agoMeanwhile FireFox just removed their commitment to not sell user data. Its their “Don’t be evil” moment https://www.osnews.com/story/141825/mozilla-deletes-promise-not-to-sell-firefox-users-data/ https://www.osnews.com/story/141825/mozilla-deletes-promise-...
- cma 2y ago> Nope. Never have, never will. Promissory estoppel maybe? Stronger case for it if you ever paid them for anything after this promise.
- lp0_on_fire 2y agoGiven most EULAs contain standard tech boilerplate that paraphrases to "We can change anything about this agreement at any time without warning or notice to you", I doubt it.
- bink 2y agoIt's really hard to take someone seriously when they say things like this: > For years I’ve been warning about this inevitable outcome, and for just as many years people told me I was overreacting, that it wouldn’t happen, that I was crazy. The removal of that language is important but this person is trying to make it about themselves.
- CursedUrn 2y agoI can understand them being frustrated
- preisschild 2y agoIndependent FOSS forks of firefox without Mozilla services / tracking exist https://librewolf.net/ https://librewolf.net/
- orphea 2y agoThey are not prepared to maintain a fork of Firefox: https://codeberg.org/librewolf/issues/issues/2252#issuecomment-2886286 https://codeberg.org/librewolf/issues/issues/2252#issuecomme...
- iamkonstantin 2y agoVivaldi is a chromium browser with a built-in ad blocker that doesn’t require extensions at all.
- internetter 2y agoMV3 is non-negotiable. The second its dropped in Arc I am jumping ship... somewhere. Firefox isn't appealing, Zen isn't fleshed out, Orion is coming along nicely but isn't done yet. But above all else I need MV3. Very sad Vivaldi won't be supporting it, before I was an Arc user I used Vivaldi and I quite liked it
- lostmsu 2y agoAs mentioned in the parallel thread Orion does not support v2 and uBlock Origin does not work there. The commenter mistook Orion's internal adblocker for uBlock functioning.
- biugbkifcjk 2y agoI've been looking at Floorp and Zen, maybe add those to your list to check out
- lxgr 2y agoThat's exactly what Edge is. It reminds me of the mobile operator branded versions of feature- and early smartphones: Same core functionality, more intrusive ads, delayed feature updates.
- bastard_op 2y agoMicrosoft loves ad revenue as much as anyone, why would they argue it? They can just blame google, having their cake and eating it too.
- Terretta 2y ago> So if you want a better web experience with uBlock Origin, Firefox is your only choice (or use Firefox forks that support it). Stand up against the browser hegemony*, choose WebKit with support for UBlock Origin: https://kagi.com/orion/ https://kagi.com/orion/ --- * Tongue in cheek, of course. Long live Firefox.
- gamedever 2y agoCan you explain in detail what feature of UBlock Origin I will lose because of V3 vs V2 extensions? I see people complaining, I don't see concrete examples, only panic
- Arrowmaster 2y agoAll of them. UBlock Origin does not work on V3. There was a Lite version that used V3 but they stopped work on it because it was so limited. It looks like there's been some updates to it recently now. The size of blacklists has gone from unlimited to a limited size. The blocking ability has been limited. And the worst of all, blocklists have to be bundled in extension updates and not downloaded. While they have increased the limited blocklist size for V3 overtime, I don't know if they ever changed the other limits.
- Technetium 2y agoHere is the official FAQ: https://github.com/uBlockOrigin/uBOL-home/wiki/Frequently-asked-questions-(FAQ) https://github.com/uBlockOrigin/uBOL-home/wiki/Frequently-as... For some context, I currently have 393,405 network filters + 385,476 cosmetic filters. "The current limit imposed by the various implementations is a guaranteed 30K. It is possible for an extension to use more rules, but anything above the global limit will not be enforced. Currently, the global limit in Chromium is 330K static rules."
- throwaway019254 2y ago> So if you want a better web experience with uBlock Origin, Firefox is your only choice Too bad a lot of websites just don't work with Firefox. It seems web devs are not testing with Firefox anymore.
- notpushkin 2y agoWhich ones? I’ve had exactly one problem with Firefox lately (one component didn’t work on LinkedIn).