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Helldivers 2 has caused over 20k Steam accounts to be banned

70 points by josephcsible 2y ago

wiseowise 2y ago
[flagged]
- geek_at 2y ago
  I hate it to be true but when you spend time in competitive online games like Counter Strike you really start to sigh when you read a Cyrillic username. They usually don't communicate, unless it's insults and God forbid you play with a woman in your team then it's full on sexism mode.
  - RedShift1 2y ago
    Russian players can be annoying but I can live with that (just put them on mute), I find cheaters to be much more of a problem.
- adrianN 2y ago
  What’s toxic about circumventing geofencing?
  - thatguy0900 2y ago
    I assume they mean the Russian community is toxic in the in game chat when they play games. It's a very common stereotype along with Chinese username players being cheaters
    - vsnf 2y ago
      The (obvious) Chinese players on the US wow servers were always good farmers (aka cheaters), but perhaps counter intuitively, if you managed to befriend them, they were usually pretty cool people. Very friendly, would chat back and forth in a new created English-mandarin pidgin, maybe they’d share some gold or items with you.
      - thatguy0900 2y ago
        From what I understand Chinese gaming culture just legitimatly doesn't see cheating as a shameful or cheap thing, it's just a way to play the game.
      - SunlitCat 2y ago
        Way back in the 2000's when I was playing WoW, we had someone in our guild using some Chinese service to level his character and farm gold with it. After some time everyone befriended that Chinese person playing his character and we even invited him to come along with us doing quests and stuff. (Never interacted much with the original owner of the account, as he had a busy real life and wasn't on that much).
- bitcharmer 2y ago
  You're getting down voted by people who have never been in a multiplayer game lobby but you're absolute right about Russian players.
MisterBiggs 2y ago
Not sure why Steam is in the headline as the cause when this is really on Sony. Adding region restrictions well after release was a terrible decision on their part and I think Steam being very lenient with refunds was the best they could do given the situation.
- oefrha 2y ago
  What? Sony can ban Steam accounts (as in banned people can’t use their Steam accounts any more, not just in Sony games) and those banned by Steam should thank Steam for generous refund policy? Edit: I have to reiterate: people are banned from accessing Steam games, not this one game or Sony games. The puzzling replies seemingly believing in the latter won’t stop coming.
  - unixhero 2y ago
    It begs the question: Is this the downfall of steam?
    - oefrha 2y ago
      No, even completely pulling out of Russia wouldn’t be the downfall of Steam. But I don’t know how this is related to my comment, which is response to a puzzling comment claiming that Steam has nothing to do with Steam account bans, and moreover people should be thankful for their leniency wrt refunds.
    - iamacyborg 2y ago
      Why would it be? Gamers literally rush to defend the platform when competitors appears and they have effectively a captive audience as games aren’t portable to other launchers.
      - londons_explore 2y ago
        > Gamers literally rush to defend the platform Could also be an effective paid PR team. Just because 'everyone' on the internet appears to have one opinion doesn't mean it's real.
frenchie14 2y ago
Is there an actual source for this? Where is the 20,000 number coming from? There are no references to back up any of the claims in the article
- ga2mer 2y ago
  This is a clickbait (or fake) news from a user (site has UGC feature) on a Russian news site, which some English-language news media for some reason used without fact checking https://overclockers.ru/blog/Dante/show/160459/Po-rossijskim-akkauntam-Steam-prokatilas-volna-bannov-Maj-2024-goda https://overclockers.ru/blog/Dante/show/160459/Po-rossijskim... (you can translate it via google translate)
yayitswei 2y ago
> Argentina where titles are often up to 60% cheaper due to the strength of the local currency I assume they mean the opposite about the Argentine Peso?
- poochkoishi728 2y ago
  No, they worded it like that to avoid saying something like 'due to the weak-a** currency'.
- codetrotter 2y ago
  Due to the strength of the local currency being weak, is what they mean and then they omit spelling it out completely. But yeah weird wording.
gmerc 2y ago
[flagged]
wudangmonk 2y ago
What was the logic behind Sony banning the purchase of games?, was Sony compelled by U.S law?. Was this done as a way to try and try to win brownie points and free pr from those reporting on it?. I can understand valve enforcing the discounted price difference among countries but I don't like the idea of not being able to purchase a game at full price and play it because a company wants to virtue signal. All valve has is its reputation, bad move for them to shake people's confidence in their game collection.
- bilekas 2y ago
  It sure wasn’t to make a drama so occams razor here, it’s most likely to distributor rights
- Kwpolska 2y ago
  The game requires a PlayStation Network account, and those cannot be created in the banned countries. The controversy was caused by the fact that the PSN requirement and country bans weren't enforced on launch, so people bought a game that then stopped being available to them.
  - armada651 2y ago
    > The controversy was caused by the fact that the PSN requirement and country bans weren't enforced on launch, so people bought a game that then stopped being available to them. From the article it doesn't sound like those people are getting banned though. It's specifically the people who use a VPN to purchase the game in another region. So it's not the people just trying to play their game that they bought on launch, it's the people trying to get around region restrictions put in place on the Steam store after the PSN requirement was added.
  - codetrotter 2y ago
    But why is PSN not in those countries
    - Propelloni 2y ago
modeless 2y ago
Steam still supports Russia? How do they do payments?
- londons_explore 2y ago
  Presumably they have a Russian subsidiary company and use local payment providers. MasterCard and visa do the same.
- VladimirGolovin 2y ago
  Steam works in Russia, but it doesn't accept payments. Free and previously owned games can be played, but new ones cannot be bought. The usual way to circumvent this is via gifting from another account that has working a payment method, e.g. a Georgian or Armenian bank card, or simply playing bought games on the new account.
moneywoes 2y ago
is the game that good?
- thatguy0900 2y ago
  The vision and theme and gameplay is excellent. The game is absolutely riddled with bugs, though, and every update adds more. It was a massive surprise success from a small studio and they are really struggling to keep it together, the game is made on a engine that stopped getting support like 8 years ago. It's worth the money now but hopefully in a year it's a lot more solid technically.
  - Hamuko 2y ago
    >The game is absolutely riddled with bugs, though, and every update adds more. Isn't that the primary gameplay loop?
    - m4rtink 2y ago
      Yeah, too many people just fight bugs and ignore the bots. ;-)
- jakebasile 2y ago
  I enjoyed it for a time. It's a particularly well executed blend of co-op and third person shooting, like the Starship Troopers game I've wanted for a while. Amusingly, there was an officially licensed Troopers game that came out shortly before Helldivers 2, and it basically went nowhere. I stopped playing because the developers don't wish for me to continue playing at my preferred difficulty, and lock me out of mission types and progression unless I play at the annoying, stressful high difficulties they prefer.
  - bun_terminator 2y ago
    They truly hate their own game. It's been a while since I've witnessed such a fumble
- 2y ago
Aeolun 2y ago
This sounds extremely politically motivated, and is a very bad look for Steam.
- threeseed 2y ago
  Of course it is politically motivated. Doing any sort of business with people from Russia or Belarus is fraught with danger.
  - throwaway48476 2y ago
    Politics aside, these kind if situations happen which is why digital ownership is so important.
instagib 2y ago
If you don’t read the article or do not have showdead on in your profile, you may miss that it is related to players according to the article from Russia or Belarus using VPN’s to bypass restrictions. “Players in these countries have taken to using VPNs to change their location to be able to access Steam in other parts of the world where the restrictions aren’t in place. (…) Valve has smartened up to this practice and has made it difficult to do and many users are banned once it is discovered.”
- defrost 2y ago
  Players actively banned in two countries, enforcing the Helldivers 2 has been delisted in 177 countries, despite the repealed PSN requirement shitshow that has surrounded the release: https://www.videogamer.com/news/playstation-secretly-locked-177-countries-out-of-helldivers-2-despite-repealing-the-psn-requirement/ https://www.videogamer.com/news/playstation-secretly-locked-... TBH this is a difficult story for an outside such as myself to get across the current state of play; there are many press articles outlining different aspects of an evolving clusterfuck of release requirements and walkbacks.
- leereeves 2y ago
  Sony's decision to forbid people in certain countries from playing Helldivers 2 was bad policy, and caused a lot of backlash. I'm surprised Valve would support Sony's rather unpopular side in this issue. They should be encouraging the use of VPNs to bypass arbitrary and unfair geofencing.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - page_fault 2y ago
    Sony is a joke of a company. Players from Central Asian countries used Russian PSN for years because Sony did not have a local presence. After leaving Russia and Belarus, they still refused to establish presence in those countries because it then might be used by players from Russia and Belarus to circumvent sanctions. So according to them it's fine not only to collectively punish people of those two countries, but also to drag in completely innocent third parties because of what might happen. IMHO what they actually think is "you're not worth our money to bother to go through all the bureaucratic processes", and it would be far less insulting if they just said so directly, but I guess this may have something to do with Japanese notions of politeness. The best thing people could do these kinds of situations is "buying" their games on the closest torrent tracker. What I actually see is people spending money on VPNs and payment cards from far away places to still give them money. (I don't do either, fuck them.)
test6554 2y ago
So we are talking about more tech savvy users who use VPNs to violate steam’s rules. Rules like region (b)locking, largely for Russia… and taking advantage of price differences in different countries to get games for less money. Like cheaper prices in Argentina. This isn’t necessarily about hell divers 2 players. At first I assumed this was about angry users who left negative reviews and got banned for brigading. I don’t feel too sorry for countries who are banned because of sanctions or people who pretend to be from LCOL countries to save a buck.
- vsuperpower2020 2y ago
  Funny you said "I don’t feel too sorry for Russians or people who pretend to be from LCOL countries to save a buck." and then decided to change it. At least it was more honest before.
xyproto 2y ago
Some regions (mainly Russia and Belarus) were not allowed to play the game (not a decision made by Steam) and then some players used VPN and were banned for that (by Steam).
- devwastaken 2y ago
  Very few services do this. Steam is not forced to comply unless there's an order to do so.
  - stubish 2y ago
    Even today, some people and companies choose to follow the law without being forced to. It might even be important from a business perspective to remain squeaky clean if you are in a dominant market position, when competitors are looking for leverage against you.
    - wudangmonk 2y ago
      What law?, if there is a law you have to follow it, it being a law by definition forces you to follow it. Whether anything is done to those that do not follow it is another question. The issue is that there is absolutely no legal reason to ban Russians from buying games. This seems like an arbitrary 'moral' choice, an honestly after the bs we've seen from Israel and the U.S, they have no moral high ground to stand on and criticize the Russians. Losing all your games is a massive issue, they are effectively holding your games hostage in an effort to exert politically motivated influence.
      - page_fault 2y ago
        Add Docker Hub to the list, just a couple of days ago they banned access from all of Russia on their own accord. Judging by reactions of people I know from there, I can't say actions like this bring us closer to good relations and a peaceful world. They're having exactly the opposite effect. https://habr.com/ru/news/818177 https://habr.com/ru/news/818177
rcpt 2y ago
Recently I've been getting banned all over the place. Just last week I permanently lost Reddit access (even on new accounts that they can map to me) because I tried to bulk delete my old comments using an app. A few months before that I lost Blind. I don't know why. Neither site has been responsive when I ask for what they know about me using GDPR/CCPA I've used the internet for decades and never been banned from anything before and I don't think my behavior has changed. I assume that sites are just getting real strict for whatever reason.
- dgellow 2y ago
  > Neither site has been responsive when I ask for what they know about me using GDPR/CCPA Report the issue to your local watchdog
  - rcpt 2y ago
    Yes. Still haven't hit the 45 day window on my last request but once I do boom
    - dgellow 2y ago
      Thanks for doing this, wishing you the best
      - rcpt 2y ago
        Sure. Any reason in particular why you're so supportive? Most people I've talked to just say something along the lines "stop being a troll"
- gaiagraphia 2y ago
  Cloudflare and Captchas are becoming far more aggressive in the last couple of months, too. I even failed a Cloudflare check for the first time ever recently, which was a bit of a surprise. It seems we're sleepwalking into not being able to do much on the internet unless you have a profile paired 1 to 1 with your IRL ID. I imagine a lot of it is connected with the upcoming US election and escalating conflict between 'east and west' going on at the moment. Though chipping away at enlightenment values in such a a manner is exactly how we lose.
KronisLV 2y ago
I am in the EU and use a VPN with servers in other EU countries and don’t particularly try to hide my location from Steam when it comes to billing, but this still feels kind of worrying. What if they also suddenly decide to purge my account with all of the games I have? Or, for example, getting an affordable non-region-locked (global) key, or even a key that’s no longer for sale on Steam itself (like the first DIRT Rally game) from gray market sites like G2A. Revoking any product that they find problematic or refusing to activate it, I could understand. But blocking the whole account? Kind of crazy.
- jkhanlar 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - Dylan16807 2y ago
    Please use sentences.
- Silphendio 2y ago
  AFAIK a steam ban in this case just means that you can't buy stuff or activate keys anymore. You should still be able to play previously purchased games.
  - Gud 2y ago
    So from then on you will need to have TWO accounts? Or what are you supposed to do, considering most games are played using Steam?
    - pacifika 2y ago
      You’re supposed to not get banned I think.
      - stavros 2y ago
        Getting banned by an impenetrable, omniscient entity is exactly the dystopian Panopticon future (well, present) people want to avoid.
matt3210 2y ago
1. Bought the game 2. Drama 3. His country banned 4. VPN to play 5. Stream account banned and all paid games lost Capitalism
nottorp 2y ago
So basically it's not safe to play any sort of networked game via your Steam account because you risk losing everything on your account. Particulars are irrelevant. You paid years ago for a game and Steam will ban your whole account because of another game.
- tiberious726 2y ago
  No. It's just not safe to try to skirt international sanctions.
- npteljes 2y ago
  No, what's not safe is to exchange ownership to a service. The number of accounts banned in this wave, compared to the Monthly Active Users of Steam, comes out to 0.01%, so one banned player for every 10.000. It's a shitshow, but if risk is part of life, especially when using a service, and then going consciously going against the terms of the service.
  - nottorp 2y ago
    Details. Perhaps you two forget that those banned accounts probably existed before said international sanctions and they lost all purchases, even the ones that were legal at the time they were made.
    - npteljes 2y ago
      I'm not talking about the sanctions at all. In my opinion, and even according to the article, the thing is about banning users who use VPNs to defeat geofencing, and region pricing. This was, at most, tolerated by Steam. I personally wouldn't mind if they banned more, but I'm not Steam, I don't know how to run such a large service. I'm sure there are many nuances. The other thing is that there is no source cited at all, and no ban type specified at all. To me, banning means that a user can no longer log in. But Steam actually applies a wide range of restrictions to an account: https://help.steampowered.com/en/faqs/view/4F62-35F9-F395-5C23 https://help.steampowered.com/en/faqs/view/4F62-35F9-F395-5C... The "20.000 ban" issue is further discussed on Reddit, where it's labeled as "misleading". https://www.reddit.com/r/Helldivers/comments/1d43qql/helldivers_2_may_have_triggered_a_wave_of_bans/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Helldivers/comments/1d43qql/helldiv... Also, I'd like to emphasize my original argument. The risk itself comes from trusting a service, and furthermore, from consciously violating the terms of service. And using VPNs to make Steam behave different is against the terms of service. Information can be found here, when searching for "proxy": https://store.steampowered.com/subscriber_agreement/ https://store.steampowered.com/subscriber_agreement/
BSDobelix 2y ago
That's how you bring generations together and on the same side, bravo! Perfect shot to the knee.
everyone 2y ago
The biggest issue with this game is that it crashes to desktop constantly, maybe a conflict with Discord? and when it crashes it also somehow closes Discord. I havent seen a game actually crash to desktop like that, that often, in a long time. That's shockingly bad imo.
Ingaz 2y ago
Funny thing is that Baltic states (Estonia, Latvia, Litva) are banned too. What are you doing Sony?
- kmlx 2y ago
  there’s no PS Store in those countries. that’s why people can’t play it. https://www.playstation.com/country-selector/index.html https://www.playstation.com/country-selector/index.html
alex_f_k 2y ago
The source for the news is a clickbait farm with low quality rage-baiting content and no information about its sources (overclockers ru). The Sun but about games, phones and computers According to user reports, most bans are not due to vpn itself, but cheating in games (mostly cs2), fraud (vpn + stolen card) and bots (I dunno about this one) So no, it’s not because of helldivers Sony made a stupid decision, can’t deny this part tho
slackstation 2y ago
Couldn't the players who purchased legal copies of the game in territories when it was allowed and now is banned; couldn't they file a class-action lawsuit against Sony? They bought a game and now cannot play it. Classic breach of contract and expected product that was paid for.
jauntywundrkind 2y ago
Semi-related, what's with Sony PSN being so common in games? Ghost of Tsushima, new God of War both have it. Maybe fixable, but Ghost for example can't multiplayer on Steam Deck because of PSN. PSN not being available in anything but a handful of countries seems massively off-putting. I'd guess that cross-play has kind of become an expected feature these days, and just using PSN directly is the easiest integration path? Seems wild to me that suddenly this one very restrictive player is suddenly what everyone uses. I do wonder what other factors are leading to everyone not just integrating with PSN, but being PSN primary.

70 points by josephcsible 2y ago

wiseowise 2y ago

[flagged]

geek_at 2y ago
I hate it to be true but when you spend time in competitive online games like Counter Strike you really start to sigh when you read a Cyrillic username. They usually don't communicate, unless it's insults and God forbid you play with a woman in your team then it's full on sexism mode.
- RedShift1 2y ago
  Russian players can be annoying but I can live with that (just put them on mute), I find cheaters to be much more of a problem.
adrianN 2y ago
What’s toxic about circumventing geofencing?
- thatguy0900 2y ago
  I assume they mean the Russian community is toxic in the in game chat when they play games. It's a very common stereotype along with Chinese username players being cheaters
  - vsnf 2y ago
    The (obvious) Chinese players on the US wow servers were always good farmers (aka cheaters), but perhaps counter intuitively, if you managed to befriend them, they were usually pretty cool people. Very friendly, would chat back and forth in a new created English-mandarin pidgin, maybe they’d share some gold or items with you.
    - thatguy0900 2y ago
      From what I understand Chinese gaming culture just legitimatly doesn't see cheating as a shameful or cheap thing, it's just a way to play the game.
    - SunlitCat 2y ago
      Way back in the 2000's when I was playing WoW, we had someone in our guild using some Chinese service to level his character and farm gold with it. After some time everyone befriended that Chinese person playing his character and we even invited him to come along with us doing quests and stuff. (Never interacted much with the original owner of the account, as he had a busy real life and wasn't on that much).
bitcharmer 2y ago
You're getting down voted by people who have never been in a multiplayer game lobby but you're absolute right about Russian players.

MisterBiggs 2y ago

Not sure why Steam is in the headline as the cause when this is really on Sony. Adding region restrictions well after release was a terrible decision on their part and I think Steam being very lenient with refunds was the best they could do given the situation.

oefrha 2y ago
What? Sony can ban Steam accounts (as in banned people can’t use their Steam accounts any more, not just in Sony games) and those banned by Steam should thank Steam for generous refund policy? Edit: I have to reiterate: people are banned from accessing Steam games, not this one game or Sony games. The puzzling replies seemingly believing in the latter won’t stop coming.
- unixhero 2y ago
  It begs the question: Is this the downfall of steam?
  - oefrha 2y ago
    No, even completely pulling out of Russia wouldn’t be the downfall of Steam. But I don’t know how this is related to my comment, which is response to a puzzling comment claiming that Steam has nothing to do with Steam account bans, and moreover people should be thankful for their leniency wrt refunds.
  - iamacyborg 2y ago
    Why would it be? Gamers literally rush to defend the platform when competitors appears and they have effectively a captive audience as games aren’t portable to other launchers.
    - londons_explore 2y ago
      > Gamers literally rush to defend the platform Could also be an effective paid PR team. Just because 'everyone' on the internet appears to have one opinion doesn't mean it's real.

frenchie14 2y ago

Is there an actual source for this? Where is the 20,000 number coming from? There are no references to back up any of the claims in the article

ga2mer 2y ago
This is a clickbait (or fake) news from a user (site has UGC feature) on a Russian news site, which some English-language news media for some reason used without fact checking https://overclockers.ru/blog/Dante/show/160459/Po-rossijskim-akkauntam-Steam-prokatilas-volna-bannov-Maj-2024-goda https://overclockers.ru/blog/Dante/show/160459/Po-rossijskim... (you can translate it via google translate)

yayitswei 2y ago

> Argentina where titles are often up to 60% cheaper due to the strength of the local currency I assume they mean the opposite about the Argentine Peso?

poochkoishi728 2y ago
No, they worded it like that to avoid saying something like 'due to the weak-a** currency'.
codetrotter 2y ago
Due to the strength of the local currency being weak, is what they mean and then they omit spelling it out completely. But yeah weird wording.

gmerc 2y ago

[flagged]

wudangmonk 2y ago

What was the logic behind Sony banning the purchase of games?, was Sony compelled by U.S law?. Was this done as a way to try and try to win brownie points and free pr from those reporting on it?. I can understand valve enforcing the discounted price difference among countries but I don't like the idea of not being able to purchase a game at full price and play it because a company wants to virtue signal. All valve has is its reputation, bad move for them to shake people's confidence in their game collection.

bilekas 2y ago
It sure wasn’t to make a drama so occams razor here, it’s most likely to distributor rights
Kwpolska 2y ago
The game requires a PlayStation Network account, and those cannot be created in the banned countries. The controversy was caused by the fact that the PSN requirement and country bans weren't enforced on launch, so people bought a game that then stopped being available to them.
- armada651 2y ago
  > The controversy was caused by the fact that the PSN requirement and country bans weren't enforced on launch, so people bought a game that then stopped being available to them. From the article it doesn't sound like those people are getting banned though. It's specifically the people who use a VPN to purchase the game in another region. So it's not the people just trying to play their game that they bought on launch, it's the people trying to get around region restrictions put in place on the Steam store after the PSN requirement was added.
- codetrotter 2y ago
  But why is PSN not in those countries
  - Propelloni 2y ago

modeless 2y ago

Steam still supports Russia? How do they do payments?

londons_explore 2y ago
Presumably they have a Russian subsidiary company and use local payment providers. MasterCard and visa do the same.
VladimirGolovin 2y ago
Steam works in Russia, but it doesn't accept payments. Free and previously owned games can be played, but new ones cannot be bought. The usual way to circumvent this is via gifting from another account that has working a payment method, e.g. a Georgian or Armenian bank card, or simply playing bought games on the new account.

moneywoes 2y ago

is the game that good?

thatguy0900 2y ago
The vision and theme and gameplay is excellent. The game is absolutely riddled with bugs, though, and every update adds more. It was a massive surprise success from a small studio and they are really struggling to keep it together, the game is made on a engine that stopped getting support like 8 years ago. It's worth the money now but hopefully in a year it's a lot more solid technically.
- Hamuko 2y ago
  >The game is absolutely riddled with bugs, though, and every update adds more. Isn't that the primary gameplay loop?
  - m4rtink 2y ago
    Yeah, too many people just fight bugs and ignore the bots. ;-)
jakebasile 2y ago
I enjoyed it for a time. It's a particularly well executed blend of co-op and third person shooting, like the Starship Troopers game I've wanted for a while. Amusingly, there was an officially licensed Troopers game that came out shortly before Helldivers 2, and it basically went nowhere. I stopped playing because the developers don't wish for me to continue playing at my preferred difficulty, and lock me out of mission types and progression unless I play at the annoying, stressful high difficulties they prefer.
- bun_terminator 2y ago
  They truly hate their own game. It's been a while since I've witnessed such a fumble
2y ago

Aeolun 2y ago

This sounds extremely politically motivated, and is a very bad look for Steam.

threeseed 2y ago
Of course it is politically motivated. Doing any sort of business with people from Russia or Belarus is fraught with danger.
- throwaway48476 2y ago
  Politics aside, these kind if situations happen which is why digital ownership is so important.

instagib 2y ago

If you don’t read the article or do not have showdead on in your profile, you may miss that it is related to players according to the article from Russia or Belarus using VPN’s to bypass restrictions. “Players in these countries have taken to using VPNs to change their location to be able to access Steam in other parts of the world where the restrictions aren’t in place. (…) Valve has smartened up to this practice and has made it difficult to do and many users are banned once it is discovered.”

defrost 2y ago
Players actively banned in two countries, enforcing the Helldivers 2 has been delisted in 177 countries, despite the repealed PSN requirement shitshow that has surrounded the release: https://www.videogamer.com/news/playstation-secretly-locked-177-countries-out-of-helldivers-2-despite-repealing-the-psn-requirement/ https://www.videogamer.com/news/playstation-secretly-locked-... TBH this is a difficult story for an outside such as myself to get across the current state of play; there are many press articles outlining different aspects of an evolving clusterfuck of release requirements and walkbacks.
leereeves 2y ago
Sony's decision to forbid people in certain countries from playing Helldivers 2 was bad policy, and caused a lot of backlash. I'm surprised Valve would support Sony's rather unpopular side in this issue. They should be encouraging the use of VPNs to bypass arbitrary and unfair geofencing.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- page_fault 2y ago
  Sony is a joke of a company. Players from Central Asian countries used Russian PSN for years because Sony did not have a local presence. After leaving Russia and Belarus, they still refused to establish presence in those countries because it then might be used by players from Russia and Belarus to circumvent sanctions. So according to them it's fine not only to collectively punish people of those two countries, but also to drag in completely innocent third parties because of what might happen. IMHO what they actually think is "you're not worth our money to bother to go through all the bureaucratic processes", and it would be far less insulting if they just said so directly, but I guess this may have something to do with Japanese notions of politeness. The best thing people could do these kinds of situations is "buying" their games on the closest torrent tracker. What I actually see is people spending money on VPNs and payment cards from far away places to still give them money. (I don't do either, fuck them.)

test6554 2y ago

So we are talking about more tech savvy users who use VPNs to violate steam’s rules. Rules like region (b)locking, largely for Russia… and taking advantage of price differences in different countries to get games for less money. Like cheaper prices in Argentina. This isn’t necessarily about hell divers 2 players. At first I assumed this was about angry users who left negative reviews and got banned for brigading. I don’t feel too sorry for countries who are banned because of sanctions or people who pretend to be from LCOL countries to save a buck.

vsuperpower2020 2y ago
Funny you said "I don’t feel too sorry for Russians or people who pretend to be from LCOL countries to save a buck." and then decided to change it. At least it was more honest before.

xyproto 2y ago

Some regions (mainly Russia and Belarus) were not allowed to play the game (not a decision made by Steam) and then some players used VPN and were banned for that (by Steam).

devwastaken 2y ago
Very few services do this. Steam is not forced to comply unless there's an order to do so.
- stubish 2y ago
  Even today, some people and companies choose to follow the law without being forced to. It might even be important from a business perspective to remain squeaky clean if you are in a dominant market position, when competitors are looking for leverage against you.
  - wudangmonk 2y ago
    What law?, if there is a law you have to follow it, it being a law by definition forces you to follow it. Whether anything is done to those that do not follow it is another question. The issue is that there is absolutely no legal reason to ban Russians from buying games. This seems like an arbitrary 'moral' choice, an honestly after the bs we've seen from Israel and the U.S, they have no moral high ground to stand on and criticize the Russians. Losing all your games is a massive issue, they are effectively holding your games hostage in an effort to exert politically motivated influence.
    - page_fault 2y ago
      Add Docker Hub to the list, just a couple of days ago they banned access from all of Russia on their own accord. Judging by reactions of people I know from there, I can't say actions like this bring us closer to good relations and a peaceful world. They're having exactly the opposite effect. https://habr.com/ru/news/818177 https://habr.com/ru/news/818177

rcpt 2y ago

Recently I've been getting banned all over the place. Just last week I permanently lost Reddit access (even on new accounts that they can map to me) because I tried to bulk delete my old comments using an app. A few months before that I lost Blind. I don't know why. Neither site has been responsive when I ask for what they know about me using GDPR/CCPA I've used the internet for decades and never been banned from anything before and I don't think my behavior has changed. I assume that sites are just getting real strict for whatever reason.

dgellow 2y ago
> Neither site has been responsive when I ask for what they know about me using GDPR/CCPA Report the issue to your local watchdog
- rcpt 2y ago
  Yes. Still haven't hit the 45 day window on my last request but once I do boom
  - dgellow 2y ago
    Thanks for doing this, wishing you the best
    - rcpt 2y ago
      Sure. Any reason in particular why you're so supportive? Most people I've talked to just say something along the lines "stop being a troll"
gaiagraphia 2y ago
Cloudflare and Captchas are becoming far more aggressive in the last couple of months, too. I even failed a Cloudflare check for the first time ever recently, which was a bit of a surprise. It seems we're sleepwalking into not being able to do much on the internet unless you have a profile paired 1 to 1 with your IRL ID. I imagine a lot of it is connected with the upcoming US election and escalating conflict between 'east and west' going on at the moment. Though chipping away at enlightenment values in such a a manner is exactly how we lose.

KronisLV 2y ago

I am in the EU and use a VPN with servers in other EU countries and don’t particularly try to hide my location from Steam when it comes to billing, but this still feels kind of worrying. What if they also suddenly decide to purge my account with all of the games I have? Or, for example, getting an affordable non-region-locked (global) key, or even a key that’s no longer for sale on Steam itself (like the first DIRT Rally game) from gray market sites like G2A. Revoking any product that they find problematic or refusing to activate it, I could understand. But blocking the whole account? Kind of crazy.

jkhanlar 2y ago
[flagged]
- Dylan16807 2y ago
  Please use sentences.
Silphendio 2y ago
AFAIK a steam ban in this case just means that you can't buy stuff or activate keys anymore. You should still be able to play previously purchased games.
- Gud 2y ago
  So from then on you will need to have TWO accounts? Or what are you supposed to do, considering most games are played using Steam?
  - pacifika 2y ago
    You’re supposed to not get banned I think.
    - stavros 2y ago
      Getting banned by an impenetrable, omniscient entity is exactly the dystopian Panopticon future (well, present) people want to avoid.

matt3210 2y ago

1. Bought the game 2. Drama 3. His country banned 4. VPN to play 5. Stream account banned and all paid games lost Capitalism

nottorp 2y ago

So basically it's not safe to play any sort of networked game via your Steam account because you risk losing everything on your account. Particulars are irrelevant. You paid years ago for a game and Steam will ban your whole account because of another game.

tiberious726 2y ago
No. It's just not safe to try to skirt international sanctions.
npteljes 2y ago
No, what's not safe is to exchange ownership to a service. The number of accounts banned in this wave, compared to the Monthly Active Users of Steam, comes out to 0.01%, so one banned player for every 10.000. It's a shitshow, but if risk is part of life, especially when using a service, and then going consciously going against the terms of the service.
- nottorp 2y ago
  Details. Perhaps you two forget that those banned accounts probably existed before said international sanctions and they lost all purchases, even the ones that were legal at the time they were made.
  - npteljes 2y ago
    I'm not talking about the sanctions at all. In my opinion, and even according to the article, the thing is about banning users who use VPNs to defeat geofencing, and region pricing. This was, at most, tolerated by Steam. I personally wouldn't mind if they banned more, but I'm not Steam, I don't know how to run such a large service. I'm sure there are many nuances. The other thing is that there is no source cited at all, and no ban type specified at all. To me, banning means that a user can no longer log in. But Steam actually applies a wide range of restrictions to an account: https://help.steampowered.com/en/faqs/view/4F62-35F9-F395-5C23 https://help.steampowered.com/en/faqs/view/4F62-35F9-F395-5C... The "20.000 ban" issue is further discussed on Reddit, where it's labeled as "misleading". https://www.reddit.com/r/Helldivers/comments/1d43qql/helldivers_2_may_have_triggered_a_wave_of_bans/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Helldivers/comments/1d43qql/helldiv... Also, I'd like to emphasize my original argument. The risk itself comes from trusting a service, and furthermore, from consciously violating the terms of service. And using VPNs to make Steam behave different is against the terms of service. Information can be found here, when searching for "proxy": https://store.steampowered.com/subscriber_agreement/ https://store.steampowered.com/subscriber_agreement/

BSDobelix 2y ago

That's how you bring generations together and on the same side, bravo! Perfect shot to the knee.

everyone 2y ago

The biggest issue with this game is that it crashes to desktop constantly, maybe a conflict with Discord? and when it crashes it also somehow closes Discord. I havent seen a game actually crash to desktop like that, that often, in a long time. That's shockingly bad imo.

Ingaz 2y ago

Funny thing is that Baltic states (Estonia, Latvia, Litva) are banned too. What are you doing Sony?

kmlx 2y ago
there’s no PS Store in those countries. that’s why people can’t play it. https://www.playstation.com/country-selector/index.html https://www.playstation.com/country-selector/index.html

alex_f_k 2y ago

The source for the news is a clickbait farm with low quality rage-baiting content and no information about its sources (overclockers ru). The Sun but about games, phones and computers According to user reports, most bans are not due to vpn itself, but cheating in games (mostly cs2), fraud (vpn + stolen card) and bots (I dunno about this one) So no, it’s not because of helldivers Sony made a stupid decision, can’t deny this part tho

slackstation 2y ago

Couldn't the players who purchased legal copies of the game in territories when it was allowed and now is banned; couldn't they file a class-action lawsuit against Sony? They bought a game and now cannot play it. Classic breach of contract and expected product that was paid for.

jauntywundrkind 2y ago

Semi-related, what's with Sony PSN being so common in games? Ghost of Tsushima, new God of War both have it. Maybe fixable, but Ghost for example can't multiplayer on Steam Deck because of PSN. PSN not being available in anything but a handful of countries seems massively off-putting. I'd guess that cross-play has kind of become an expected feature these days, and just using PSN directly is the easiest integration path? Seems wild to me that suddenly this one very restrictive player is suddenly what everyone uses. I do wonder what other factors are leading to everyone not just integrating with PSN, but being PSN primary.