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Boeing 737 crashes during take-off in Senegal
- orbital-decay 2y agohttps://avherald.com/h?article=51867a11 https://avherald.com/h?article=51867a11 > the crew rejected takeoff due to a hydraulic defect but veered left off the runway. The aircraft came to a stop on soft ground next to the Presidential Pavillion (about 2000 meters/6000 feet down the runway), the left wing briefly caught fire. All occupants evacuated via slides
- chefkd 2y agoquestion for a book I'm writing: how easy would planes be to mess up in such a way no issues appear until plane takes off?
- ceejayoz 2y agoVery. Examples: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Airlines_Flight_102 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Airlines_Flight_102 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaska_Airlines_Flight_261 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaska_Airlines_Flight_261 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_Air_Lines_Flight_123 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_Air_Lines_Flight_123 The last one was caused by a bad repair from a tail strike seven years earlier.
- bombcar 2y agoThe harder part would be a way that isn’t traceable afterwards. Read some NTSB documents about crashes especially ones where “maintenance” appears.
- huslage 2y agoThank you for this. The plane didn’t “crash” or fall out of the sky. It rejected takeoff and left the runway.
- addandsubtract 2y agoSo, a car driving into a ditch, didn't crash, it just rejected the road? A crash is a crash.
- ninju 2y agoA "crash" implies a collision with something. Per your example, a car can leave the road but when it collides with drainage ditch it becomes a crash In this case there was NO COLLSION with another object and therefore no crash
- CarVac 2y agoThat's a -300, an old model that predates the modern production issues.
- notahacker 2y agoMore specifically, it's nearly 30 years old, will have been through thousands of flight cycles and multiple rebuilds, and the limited available information suggests an issue with an engine (i.e something which will have been designed, overhauled and refitted by organizations unrelated to Boeing)
- aworks 2y agoIn the eighties, I worked on host development tools used for the Flight Management Computer System firmware in the 737-300. Presumably, the hardware, the software, the tools, the language (Ratfor), the host OS (VAX/VMS), the development process, and my life have all been upgraded since then. On the other hand, the overall project verification team was as big as the development team. I never saw that again the rest of my career.
- nomilk 2y ago> injuring 11 people, four of them severely (no fatalities)
- jandrese 2y agoFrom the description of the crash either there were some unbelted passengers or the injuries were from people falling off of the emergency exit slide.
- Jolter 2y agoCould be other things, too. Unsecured luggage, other loose objects falling on passengers. Injuries can happen to a belted passenger as well.
- afavour 2y agoAs ever, best to wait and see. Pilot error is a thing, poor maintenance is a thing. This isn’t the MAX variant Boring has had so much trouble with.
- Yotsugi 2y agoIronic to see this considering planes could land and takeoff by themselves since 60's and the only reason why it's not all of them that can do this is because of greed.
- gruez 2y ago>the only reason why it's not all of them that can do this is because of greed ???
- Yotsugi 2y agoL-1011
- p_l 2y agoYou're very much uninformed on what is involved in having AUTOLAND (yes, capitalization was part of the name) happening, or automated takeoff. Reality is that unless you're landing at minority of airports in the world, you can't use automated landing, and takeoff isn't automated until at least you pass into a SID route or into normal climb. And it's not just "greed" - deploying and maintaining setup to support automated landing (ILS Class 3b with extensions and DME, among others) is non-trivial technically and to do safely can require over a year of testing. Aircraft autopilots are also simply said very dumb PIDs 99% of the time. P.S. L-1011 wasn't even the first plane with AUTOLAND equipped, that goes to Trident 2E
- IndySun 2y agoCan the BBC reign in its news headline writers and reverse a fairly recent (5-10 years?) policy of juicing up what was 'unbiased' news? But in fact, I have a rose-tinted view of the BBC so I should just reign in my reactions instead.
- resolutebat 2y agoWhat exactly is "juiced up" about "Boeing 737 crashes during take-off in Senegal"? I'd be hard put to craft a more neutral/factual/boring summary of what just happened. Update: Apparently "crash" is misleading here since the plane was never airborne, it aborted takeoff but veered off the runway and likely hit something since the wing caught fire.
- ceejayoz 2y agoI’d probably have used “skids off runway” or “leaves runway” instead of “crashes”. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-guernsey-68886071.amp https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-guernsey-68886071.amp https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-leeds-67174117.amp https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-leeds-67174117.amp https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-42680238.amp https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-42680238.amp
- notahacker 2y agoAnd the referencing the essentially unrelated Max production issues in an article about the fairly routine case of a 30 year old aircraft in a developing country experiencing issues which might be related to maintenance is probably more egregious. It's like suggesting that the stakes in whatever the latest Microsoft scandal is have been raised by someone installing malware on their XP system
- peatmoss 2y agoOr in this case (1994) Windows 3.1. I agree this story is a red herring. By and large 737s preceding the MAX variants had a rather amazing reputation, which is part of the reason 737s are so ubiquitous. The issues today are that the MAX planes are enough different than the previous planes, that they should have likely been sold as a different product with different training. And the second issue is the erosion of Boeing's formerly engineer-led culture through various business / regulatory shenanigans such as outsourcing and self-oversight.
- cqqxo4zV46cp 2y agoSigh, something that would be much less likely to even make it to HN if not for the fact that everyone is hungry to find the next thread to post their pre-canned “damn MBAs!!” rant on. It’s not a Max.
- amelius 2y agoDoes the Max have different MBAs behind it?
- ceejayoz 2y agoSome of the MBAs probably weren’t born when this specific plane was made. 737-300s stopped being built twenty four years ago.
- amelius 2y agoWell, that's clear but that was not the question. I'm thinking about maintenance.
- ceejayoz 2y agoThe vast majority of maintenance is done by non-Boeing mechanics employed by airlines and their contractors. They generally cheap out on it as much as they can get away with. https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2015/11/airplane-maintenance-disturbing-truth https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2015/11/airplane-maintenance...
- shrubble 2y agoVery likely a maintenance-related issue, given the age of the plane.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- martyvis 2y agoIs that photo possibly the most unrepresentative stock photo of a working 737 aircraft that they could find that actually has a 737 in it?
- resolutebat 2y agoUnsurprisingly, it's an old airframe (built 1994), operated by a state-owned African carrier: rarely a recipe for good maintenance. It's quite unlikely that Boeing is in any way to blame for this. https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/387749 https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/387749
- kvetching 2y agoBoeing is a money maker now for news outlets. We will hear absolutely everything going wrong with a Boeing plane for the foreseeable future. Honestly, I am surprised there isn't more failures given the current narrative.
- huygens6363 2y agoOne, that’s not that old and shouldn’t be crashing on take-off and two, the narrative that it’s shady African carriers that are to blame is getting old. In fact, it’s exactly what Boeing always says right before they are in fact to blame.
- Grimburger 2y agoAir travel disaster rates are basically the same across the entire planet except Africa. You are 15x more likely to die in a plane crash there than anywhere else on Earth. GP comment is on point.
- huygens6363 2y agoThe same is true for basically everything in Africa. Just pointing out that Boeing pulled the same trick with the MAX and I think it’s in bad taste to start off with this line of reasoning. We don’t know. So we don’t know if it’s Africans being shady or not is all I’m saying. Let’s wait.
- tucosan 2y agoThis was not a 737 Max, but a widely deployed model that is in use for decades. The likelihood that Boeing is at fault here is extremely slim. It is very likely that this was a piloting error or a maintenance issue, or a combination of both.
- malkia 2y agoWhen you've become so bad at quality, they would even find bad cases from when you did real good years before that!
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- algorias 2y agoI have a question on manifold about Boeing's troubles: https://manifold.markets/VitorBosshard/number-of-major-incidents-involving https://manifold.markets/VitorBosshard/number-of-major-incid... I'm only counting incidents where Boeing is at fault, this one might still be bad maintenance or other operator error.
- syngrog66 2y agoskid off runway. 10 people injured. not what people consider normally an airliner crash: a plane falling out of air hitting groind or sea hard in a fireball, killing alk/most etc