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It’s amazing how fast we went from rarely seeing an electric Amazon van near me to seemingly most of them being EVs. Makes so much sense. I wonder how many (te

by MBCook 3y ago

It’s amazing how fast we went from rarely seeing an electric Amazon van near me to seemingly most of them being EVs. Makes so much sense. I wonder how many (tens of?) thousands a single warehouse location might save per day in gas alone. Last mile in urban/suburban areas is nearly ideal for an EV. The upfront is very expensive with all the ancillary costs, but it’s hot to pay off handsomely after a while. And if a real carbon tax were to ever appear it would be all the better.

wnc3141 3y ago
The ability to invest absurd upfront costs and (relatively) cheap access to capital is Amazon's competitive advantage
jollyllama 3y ago
A use case like this is probably one of the best for EV's. Presumably Amazon will be able to have a centralized maintenance facility where new batteries can be installed. They'll be able to price in their own maintenance and resale value will be of no concern.
- reactordev 3y ago
  And they likely have the batteries on the shelf since it’s a fulfillment center and they sell them. Just buy them from their own warehouse. Brilliant.
dymk 3y ago
It pays off fast. For my situation in Washington, I'd be paying ~$4.50/gal for an ICE car that gets ~28mi/gal, or ~$0.11/KWh (at the tier-2 rate) for an EV that gets 3.5mi/KWh. For the ICE car, that's ~6.2 mi/dollar, for the EV it's ~31.8 mi/dollar. ~5x cheaper per mile to drive the ICE. I drive ~15k miles per year, so ~$2.4k in gas, or $470 in electricity - saving ~$2k/year. This doesn't take into account the lower total cost of ownership of EVs in general. They're simple. They don't need oil changes. The transmission can't go out. And that's just for me driving once or twice a day; I'm sure the Amazon drivers are putting factors more miles on their cars, so a faster break-even point.
- Kirby64 3y ago
  It’s even better for delivery vans, too: EVs thrive in repeated stop-start conditions, which is what Amazon cans frequently do. It seems like only a matter of time before other similar vehicles that are more industrial make this shift (eg, garbage/recycling trucks). Imagine no more super loud garbage trucks in the mornings…
  - organsnyder 3y ago
    Given the loudest part of garbage trucks around me is their brakes, I'm thrilled at the prospect of them getting regen.
    - briffle 3y ago
      I chatted with a friend who used to be a garbage man in a mid-sized west coast city. Most drivers in our area have a daily route, and when they are done, they are done, but paid for the whole's day work. So they have an incentive to floor the throttle, and slam the brakes. The drivers don't pay for fuel or brake pads out of their salary, the company does, but if they drive like a maniac, they can finish a few hours earlier.
      - aitchnyu 3y ago
        Are accelerometer logs widespread now? Even with 100 USD phone hardware, companies could check drivers are not causing too much wear or causing disomfort to passengers.
        organsnyder 3y ago
        Probably not on the radar for many waste companies and municipalities. I'm pretty sure the passengers won't complain, either.
    - playingalong 3y ago
      Where I live the biggest noise is from the loading mechanism and the built in press.
pdabbadabba 3y ago
> It’s amazing how fast we went from rarely seeing an electric Amazon van near me to seemingly most of them being EVs. Interesting to hear you say that. I've been looking for them but I've still never seen an Amazon EV in the DC metro area.
- MBCook 3y ago
  I happen to live rather close to a large(?) Amazon fulfillment center they just built a few years ago. Our electricity isn’t very expensive either, though it’s not what hydro areas pay. I don’t know if we’re a test site or it was just easy to get the power installed or what. Perhaps being a new facility meant they just needed new vehicles anyway so it made sense to not buy gas. But once they started appearing they kept getting more common.

by MBCook 3y ago

wnc3141 3y ago

The ability to invest absurd upfront costs and (relatively) cheap access to capital is Amazon's competitive advantage

jollyllama 3y ago

A use case like this is probably one of the best for EV's. Presumably Amazon will be able to have a centralized maintenance facility where new batteries can be installed. They'll be able to price in their own maintenance and resale value will be of no concern.

reactordev 3y ago
And they likely have the batteries on the shelf since it’s a fulfillment center and they sell them. Just buy them from their own warehouse. Brilliant.

dymk 3y ago

It pays off fast. For my situation in Washington, I'd be paying ~$4.50/gal for an ICE car that gets ~28mi/gal, or ~$0.11/KWh (at the tier-2 rate) for an EV that gets 3.5mi/KWh. For the ICE car, that's ~6.2 mi/dollar, for the EV it's ~31.8 mi/dollar. ~5x cheaper per mile to drive the ICE. I drive ~15k miles per year, so ~$2.4k in gas, or $470 in electricity - saving ~$2k/year. This doesn't take into account the lower total cost of ownership of EVs in general. They're simple. They don't need oil changes. The transmission can't go out. And that's just for me driving once or twice a day; I'm sure the Amazon drivers are putting factors more miles on their cars, so a faster break-even point.

Kirby64 3y ago
It’s even better for delivery vans, too: EVs thrive in repeated stop-start conditions, which is what Amazon cans frequently do. It seems like only a matter of time before other similar vehicles that are more industrial make this shift (eg, garbage/recycling trucks). Imagine no more super loud garbage trucks in the mornings…
- organsnyder 3y ago
  Given the loudest part of garbage trucks around me is their brakes, I'm thrilled at the prospect of them getting regen.
  - briffle 3y ago
    I chatted with a friend who used to be a garbage man in a mid-sized west coast city. Most drivers in our area have a daily route, and when they are done, they are done, but paid for the whole's day work. So they have an incentive to floor the throttle, and slam the brakes. The drivers don't pay for fuel or brake pads out of their salary, the company does, but if they drive like a maniac, they can finish a few hours earlier.
    - aitchnyu 3y ago
      Are accelerometer logs widespread now? Even with 100 USD phone hardware, companies could check drivers are not causing too much wear or causing disomfort to passengers.
      - organsnyder 3y ago
        Probably not on the radar for many waste companies and municipalities. I'm pretty sure the passengers won't complain, either.
  - playingalong 3y ago
    Where I live the biggest noise is from the loading mechanism and the built in press.

pdabbadabba 3y ago

> It’s amazing how fast we went from rarely seeing an electric Amazon van near me to seemingly most of them being EVs. Interesting to hear you say that. I've been looking for them but I've still never seen an Amazon EV in the DC metro area.

MBCook 3y ago
I happen to live rather close to a large(?) Amazon fulfillment center they just built a few years ago. Our electricity isn’t very expensive either, though it’s not what hydro areas pay. I don’t know if we’re a test site or it was just easy to get the power installed or what. Perhaps being a new facility meant they just needed new vehicles anyway so it made sense to not buy gas. But once they started appearing they kept getting more common.