14 ms·

Japan to introduce six-month residency visa for 'digital nomads'

239 points by mikhael 3y ago

Pursu 3y ago
I have a quick question, maybe someone can help. They talk about a yearly income of 10 million Yen, so roughly 70 000 US$. Where i live i pay pretty high income tax. Do these 10 million Yen refer to the money that actually ends up on my bank account, or the amount before tax and health insurance is deducted? Because if they take the amount of money, before i pay tax, it would work, otherwise i am not even close. I have not found any information concerning this, did i miss something?
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
andybak 3y ago
The salary requirement seems harsh for people working on non-profit, self-funded or early-stage.
- gottorf 3y ago
  On the other hand, if you meet any of those criteria, perhaps it's not the best use of your resources to be a digital nomad in Japan.
  - andybak 3y ago
    That's fairly presumptuous of you.
    - gottorf 3y ago
      Perhaps, but perhaps also less presumptuous than anybody who thinks they have an innate right to go to Japan on whatever terms they please.
      - andybak 3y ago
        My mistake. You're not presumptuous. You're just rude.
- mytailorisrich 3y ago
  Obviously this type of visa is aimed at getting people to spend money in the country. Why would they want people with no money?
  - informatimago 3y ago
    Well, the digital nomad doesn't spend a lot of money. Some on accommodation, some for internet, some for food, and that's it. He spends his time remote working on his laptop. His income is paid offshore. Apart from the tourist aspect of it, the point of a digital nomad is to save money on rent, food and taxes, not to spend all your money in a foreign country. Of course, a business hub, or a technological hub can attract digital nomads punctually, even if accommodations are more expensive. Now Japan has a problem with its age pyramid and desertification of its country side. So it should be possible to attract digital nomad for longer and cheaper stays, even if they don't have a lot of money (to spend in Japan), at least that's good for the young body count, and perhaps they'd eventually fixate and have families. But again, this wouldn't be a six-month thing, they would have to add more incentive (free or $1-house in the countryside with minimal occupancy, good internet connection (I don't know if Japan has 100% territory fiber coverage) (that said nowadays there's Starlink), etc.
    - mytailorisrich 3y ago
      I would have thought that the point of spending 6 months in Japan was to experience Japan in a deeper and more relaxed way than a short-ish trip as a tourist. Spending money on living expenses, including rent, and touristy stuff is indeed spending money in the country. And if you are well paid then that may be more than the average local: the threshold for this visa is $68k while the average annual pay in Japan is apparently $41-45k.
    - lupire 3y ago
      Why would a nomad spend less than a resident?
  - andybak 3y ago
    How is everyone reading this as me saying "no money"? You can have significantly less than $58k provable income and live very nicely while travelling. Is this some silicon valley bubble thing?
- totetsu 3y ago
  Japan legislature seems to spend a lot of time passing these kind of laws that only ever affect a few people. But with some of the other ones after a few years of no one using the residency statuses, they loosened up the requirement a bit.
- spidersenses 3y ago
  Japan is a country that is expensive to live in. Having minimum salary requirements already filters out the type of 'digital nomad' who would otherwise become a burden on society or those who merely seek immigration from Africa or South Asia under the disguise of the 'digital nomad'.
  - keiferski 3y ago
    It really isn't though, especially with the currency exchange. Tokyo is comparable in cost to a second or third tier American city, not to NYC/LA/SF/London. See: https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=United+States&city1=San+Francisco%2C+CA&country2=Japan&city2=Tokyo https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?cou... I do agree that $68k as a salary requirement is fairly reasonable, though – but it's much higher than the "average" salary for a Japanese person.
  - andybak 3y ago
    There's a large gap between "burden on society" and "provable $58k income"
  - nerdbert 3y ago
    Japan is not particularly expensive. It's significantly cheaper than USA, Canada, Western Europe, Australia, NZ, etc. US$68,000 is enough for a very comfortable life there.
    - mywittyname 3y ago
      $68k about the median household income in the USA - and higher than the median in a lot of states. One could live a comfortable life in many parts of the USA for that salary.
    - jwells89 3y ago
      Particularly if you’re not living in Tokyo, Fukuoka for instance is significantly cheaper despite also being a densely populated city with the usual amenities.
- prg20 3y ago
  Totally. They should allow anyone, even those with no income, to come to their country and use their services for nothing in return. We can see how well that's worked in the US.
  - dvngnt_ 3y ago
    US has a bigger economy though so something is working
    - jskxneks777 3y ago
      US is a shit hole compared to japan lmao
  - andybak 3y ago
    You obviously want to soapbox an entirely different topic - nobody said "no income" so your answer just makes you look slightly off-kilter.
  - OfficeChad 3y ago
    [dead]
- mc32 3y ago
  They don't want pretenders. They want people who are going to be productive and bring something to the country. They're not looking for "backpackers," they're looking for well paid professionals who will spend money and also conform better (these people would hire people to do paperwork, translate, etc., rather than drain local resources.) People may not agree with the above, but that's what they want, and I can't blame them for wanting good for their country.
  - andybak 3y ago
    Nice line in unveiled insults you've got there. EDIT - you changed "poser" to "pretender" which was a small improvement. It's polite to make it clear that you've edited a comment if someone has replied.
- wharvle 3y ago
  The point is to get people in who'll spend money. Governments don't usually create visa programs to be nice—they do it for some benefit.
nothercastle 3y ago
Can you make a Japanese bank account while on visa? If not it’s pretty useless
- williamdclt 3y ago
  why is a Japanese bank account so necessary?
  - ekianjo 3y ago
    some activities require a proof of residency AND salary in Japan
    - j4yav 3y ago
      The kinds of activities someone does while travelling for 3-6 months?
      - datpiff 3y ago
        I believe renting somewhere to live often does, so yes.
        sersi 3y ago
        If you rent for short term (6 months), monthly mansions don't need bank accounts or proof of residency. It costs about 50% more than you'd pay for long term but you don't have to pay reikin (key money you don't get back), shikikin (deposit for damages).
        ekianjo 3y ago
        it may be cheaper to live in a hostel rather than a monthly mansion, but depends on your tastes
    - true_religion 3y ago
      Like what activities?
arwineap 3y ago
Has anyone done the digital nomad thing with children? It'd be great if childcare/schooling was easier overseas, maybe even an opportunity for kids to get an early mind opening experience
- 0xcoffee 3y ago
  I was an expat child that moved many times in my childhood. The broken connections of each move hurt me more than any 'new experience'. I wouldn't recommend it, imo social stability is very important.
- walthamstow 3y ago
  If you're not paying tax in a country it's a bit out of order to send your kids to their schools.
  - RobRivera 3y ago
    [flagged]
  - JoeAltmaier 3y ago
    Not everything is funded from federal or state income tax. Where I live it's a combination of local option sales tax and property tax. So yes, digital nomads may pay taxes for schools.
  - true_religion 3y ago
    I would assume the kids would go to private schools. Probably necessary since they're traveling so much that they need to follow a foreign curriculum or an international one like IB.
  - mc32 3y ago
    You can send them to private schools -which you may want to do anyway if they don't speak Japanese.
  - ericmcer 3y ago
    Why? If your from the USA our stance is exactly the opposite.
walthamstow 3y ago
180 days with a salary threshold and country restrictions, or 90 days pretending to be a tourist. I know which I'd choose.
- alibarber 3y ago
  Pretending to be a tourist is a good way to get deported usually in a lot of places.
  - NineStarPoint 3y ago
    Is it? I know that legally they could deport you so its not a great idea, but how often does someone actually get deported for doing remote work while spending a few months in another country?
    - nerdbert 3y ago
      Literally never. This topic is one of those things that draws resentful ruleboys out of the woodwork to preach about something they have no firsthand knowledge of because none exists.
      - alibarber 3y ago
        No, I think people are missing the wood for the trees here. The fact that these visas are becoming available means that governments are wising up to the fact that people have been working remotely on tourist visas and want in on it. They want to be able to charge for it, or set a limit on who can do it, or tax it. Now that these visas exist, and immigration officers know that, it’s only obvious that they’ll start to ask ‘tourists’ if they plan on working remotely or not. You can lie all you want, but if they find evidence (two laptops, notebooks, equipment) then good luck. What happened in the past is just that.
        petronio 3y ago
        I think you're confusing their goal. It's not that they have a problem with people working remotely on tourist visas, it's that they want them to do it for longer as it brings economic benefit to the country. If they disliked the idea they wouldn't be creating new visas for the purpose, since that only makes it more prevalent and normalized.
oldtownroad 3y ago
“The most similar existing status is usually used by tourists, does not allow work and allows a maximum stay of just 90 days” I don’t think that’s correct. A tourist visa doesn’t allow you to work locally but they do not limit working remotely for an overseas company. For example, if you’re on vacation in Japan from the US and an emergency happens at work, you can join a call without risk of deportation.
- alibarber 3y ago
  No, this is the correct interpretation in a lot of countries, you are performing paid work there regardless of who and where the employer is. Emergencies are all well and good, but turning up at the immigration desk and saying you don’t plan on working when you actually do will lead to trouble in a lot of places.
  - oldtownroad 3y ago
    Can you share the tourist visa regulations for Japan that say this? I haven’t been able to find any. Thank you :)
    - makeitdouble 3y ago
      That's implied. If you're working with your tourist visa you're changing the purpose of your stay and thus lying regarding your visa declaration: > Single-entry short-term stay visa for the purpose of Tourism (for a period of up to 90 days) (Note). > [...] > If you wish to visit Japan for other purposes or for a long-term stay, please submit your application to the Japanese Embassy, Consulate General or Consular office with jurisdiction over your place of residence. https://www.mofa.go.jp/j_info/visit/visa/visaonline.html https://www.mofa.go.jp/j_info/visit/visa/visaonline.html
      - nerdbert 3y ago
        The purpose of the visit is still tourism, even when people are also working remotely. Otherwise they could have stayed home and worked remotely.
treprinum 3y ago
I spent 1 month around Kyoto's UNESCO sites 10 years ago while working remotely for a company in the US and am not sure I'd want to spend whole 6 months in Japan when there are so many interesting places all around the world. One needed to know basic Japanese as very few people spoke English, finding an accommodation was a chore as AirBnB was non-existing and hotels with unlimited fast WiFi scarce and one had to book an apartment in some of their temporary housings months in advance. Overall a nice and unique country though people looked overworked (young people complaining about working 996 lifestyles) and isolated from foreigners, similar to Germans (except their children that always wanted to practice Engrish with anyone not looking Japanese).
- gejose 3y ago
  Everyone’s preferences differ when it comes to travel destinations. What may not have worked for you might actually be great for someone else. Ultimately, the decision to visit a destination should be based on personal interests and experiences.
  - treprinum 3y ago
    Sure, I just remember on my last day in Japan I actually felt sadness that I didn't find whatever I was looking for, despite seeing like 15 UNESCO World Heritage sites, but essentially didn't make any lasting connection on a personal level with anyone due to being unable to break the formal shell of anyone. Total opposite to e.g. Brazil when one could make friends in 5 minutes and those folks remembered you for years.
    - boringg 3y ago
      To each their own - I think its rather crass to castigate a whole country because your own travel didn't find whatever deeper level bond you were searching for. I for one am suspect at being able make a good friend that lasts forever in 5 minutes. That sounds more like power dynamics in that you had something to offer them then some kind of mutual friendship based on shared interests. That said to each their own.
haunter 3y ago
> for up to six months while enjoying sightseeing trips, the agency said Almost sounds like the sightseeing trips are part of the visa
elzbardico 3y ago
In most countries you can't do any kind of work while in a tourist Visa, but this was never enforced, because it was so exceedingly rare for not to be on governments radar. But once it became more prevalent, it creates the problem (on governments view, especially post 9/11) of having a bunch of foreign folks living for months and receiving money from abroad for god knows which reason. This creates the problem for law enforcement of having to separate nomad workers from more shady characters that have exactly the same "signature": long term stays, getting regular money from above, not doing the usual tourist stuff that people that have money and free time enough to stay in a foreign country for months usually do. So, for law enforcement purposes, it makes sense to have an specific kind of Visa for those "working tourists", so they can pre-filter this population and get back to a smaller working set of persons of interest without the added noise of "working tourists" (digital nomad as a term is incorrect, after all, true nomads would be working locally)
- kybernetyk 3y ago
  >So, for law enforcement purposes, it makes sense to have an specific kind of Visa for those "working tourists", so they can pre-filter this population and get back to a smaller working set of persons of interest So I guess terrorists/bad actors won't get the idea to apply for this Visa to fly under the radar then?
  - Jensson 3y ago
    Applying for a visa probably entails explaining where your money is coming from, such low effort barriers actually helps a ton since most criminals aren't very conscientious.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - lupire 3y ago
    There's a checkbox on the customs form that asks if you are a terrorist.
  - nerdponx 3y ago
herbst 3y ago
People seem to underestimate how limiting tourist visas actually are. Imagine you sell digital products automated or something like that. You would have to literally shut your website down if you go somewhere on a tourist visa so you don't accidently make money. You might think there are exceptions, but no there usually aren't. And now imagine you actually live from a digital business you run yourself. You literally can't travel on a tourist visa. I can't legally leave the EU, more or less, as I have no control when and where I earn money. I also wouldn't travel so far for just a month or two so this is really speaking to me :)
- verticalscaler 3y ago
  I give you permission to spread your wings and leave the EU for a stint. Of course don't take the word of an internet stranger, confirm with a lawyer.
- oldtownroad 3y ago
  That’s not true. The jurisdiction that your business operates in doesn’t change depending on where you’re located. If you’re running a business without a business entity (why?) then you can use a merchant of record service (like Paddle) which will serve that role for you.
  - herbst 3y ago
    Guess that's a good point. However I still wouldn't be legally allowed to work.
- m_dupont 3y ago
  I mean sure, but the chances of that ever being enforced are close to 0. I'm a full time digital nomad for over a year in various latin american countries, always on tourist visas. Nobody notices or cares. The only time I ever had an issue is when entering the united states, the immigration department gave me a grilling because my passport showed that I was clearly a nomad and they expected me to be working online. Go ahead, take that holiday.
  - 3y ago
Shank 3y ago
It's exciting to see progress, but I think 180 days is too short for this to be worthwhile for people who really wanted this. They've leaned heavily into the "nomad" part, but the issue is more of practicality. This visa doesn't come with a Residency Card, which means that getting a traditional lease in Japan is going to be difficult. For 6 months, you'll be on an uphill battle with some services like housing, which can be important. It's just long enough that you won't want to maintain a home in your home country unless it's paid for, and short enough that it makes moving your possessions impractical. You also can't renew it, and you have to be out of the country for 6 months before you can get it again. I think this would be very appealing if it was a 1 year visa at minimum, but comparable visas (e.g., the Taiwan Gold Card) are up to 3 years. I'm not terribly upset at the lack of Individual Number or Residence Card, but the length is definitely something that makes it unappealing except in the most nomad-of-nomad situations. Apparently they'll be opening it for public comments in the second half of February. They said that they based the 6 month time period on questions they asked foreigners about how long they would want to stay -- so maybe this is the time to push for a longer period of time.
- rldjbpin 3y ago
  this perspective works for those who can get similar duration for tourism because of their strong passport. meanwhile some european countries gave short visit visa as short as a couple weeks, while charging hundreds of euros for the entire process. then all of a sudden it seems very generous in comparison.
- honeylemonnuin 3y ago
  Thank you for your comment. I'm interested in this program too and agree with you that 6 months maybe too short to move and rent an apartment there. I assume most place have at lease 1 year contract, right? I would like to give them my comment too. Can you please share where can we give them feedback when they open for public comment? And will it possible if we ask them to let us apply for residency card? Thank you
- thehappypm 3y ago
  Don’t you think that the housing market will create a niche for these people? Foreigners with deep pockets coming in for six months sounds like a great thing for landlords. Plus, you know they won’t squat because they’re gone after 6 months or they get deported
seydor 3y ago
why are cities trying to attract nomads? They are almost by definition doing location arbitrage, thus paying less in both their country of origin and country of destination.
- lupire 3y ago
  Are you asking why international trade exists?
- nicbou 3y ago
  They spend money and leave. They have a very small negative footprint (excluding the housing market), and require almost no obligations from the host country, but spend money locally.
- Jcampuzano2 3y ago
  The answer is simple - money. Digital nomads typically don't take jobs from local residents, they on average have more and are willing to spend more money than the typical local resident, and additionally the country has no responsibility to provide social benefits to a digital nomad and thus they are low cost. Additionally while digital nomads may sometimes be ignorant of local culture/tradition and that can be somewhat annoying, they typically don't cause problems when it comes to crime. Now there are legitimate concerns with respect to housing with things like AirBNB's/under the table housing arrangements and causing the housing prices to increase, but while that is an issue to a local resident it is actually seen as a positive to the city itself when it comes to the economy.
  - seydor 3y ago
    they also dont pay taxes like local residents. And they spend less than tourists
    - iamjackg 3y ago
      True, but I'd imagine tourists hang out for a few weeks at most, not six months.
    - 3y ago
somenameforme 3y ago
Most aren't aware of the situation Japan is in today because of the world we all grew up in, where Japan was at one point nearly the largest economy in the world. Japan has been in between a recession and stagnation for 30 years. Their GDP was higher 31 years ago than it is today. [1] Their GDP/capita is $33,950 with most wages well below that. They hit a record high for average wages in 2022 of ¥311,800 - about $2,100. [2] Next - they're dying off. They hit their inflection point in 2009 and they've been shrinking since [3]. They've lost more than 5million people since 2009. And the "fun" thing about fertility collapse is that the decline will never stop. Their population will keep shrinking down at the 'equilibrium rate' (decided by fertility rate) until they start having babies, or go extinct. The exact same will happen to every other country with sub-replacement fertility rates. This, IMO, is an effort to try to attract a certain type of immigrant largely for the purposes of revenue generation. --- [1] - https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.MKTP.CD?locations=JP https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.MKTP.CD?location... [2] - https://www.nippon.com/en/japan-data/h01631/ https://www.nippon.com/en/japan-data/h01631/ [2] - https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/japan-population/ https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/japan-populat...
- fxtentacle 3y ago
  Yeah I also find it weird because "To be eligible for the new status, applicants must have an annual income equivalent to 10 million yen ($68,000) or more" which means the newly created Digital Nomad class needs to have 2x the average GDP/capita in income?
  - FirmwareBurner 3y ago
    So they only want high earning workers from developed countries, basically the kind of immigrants every other country wants but doesn't dare say it out loud. What's wrong with that? Their country, their rules.
    - kdmccormick 3y ago
      Nothing innately "wrong" but I can see it fueling resentment among working class Japanese towards these foreign, exclusively-wealthy digital nomads.
xhkkffbf 3y ago
Can anyone guess on what the tax scenario might be for a US resident going to Japan for 4-6 months?
dazamarquez 3y ago
I don't understand why this would be interesting. These "digital nomads" who would travel to Japan for work+sightseeing aren't taking local jobs and don't have a Japanese bank account. Does Japan want to tax income produced within its borders, regardless of where one is actually a tax resident? Most countries I'm aware of treat people as tax residents if they reside there for more than 180 days a year.
rkagerer 3y ago
What's the end-game with these 'digital nomad' VISA's several countries are beginning to offer? Is it basically just 'live here for a few months like a tourist' or is there some pathway to permanent residence/citizenship?
feliciegerald 3y ago
[dead]
holoduke 3y ago
I think within 10 years this is also needed in Europe. Back in 2000 1 in 5 eligible for working were pensioned. Now its 1 in the 3. This mumber only gets worse. Japan is a few years ahead. But population decline in a growth based economy is not good. So yeah. Attrack the right people is what needs to happen. Imho still ducktape on the original issue.
jalapenos 3y ago
This already exists: visit twice in one year on a tourist visa, and don't loudly yell out your hotel window "hey immigration - I'm doing work in here!". And that's better because not of those income or insurance criteria apply. So just some empty "look at us we're doing something (not really)" fluff.
mekoka 3y ago
I've often seen suggested in forums that tourist visas forbid any kind of work while visiting a country. I've yet to see a single article of the law that actually points to this. So, I'm inclined to think that when people repeat this, they actually haven't checked. I have looked at the clauses on many tourist visas, as given to me by various consulates, and seen no evidence of this new interpretation. A tourist visa often forbids working or doing any kind of local business, other than volunteering and the likes (i.e. taking a local job, selling stuff locally, meeting with local businesses, etc). That this new interpretation coincides with the emergence of nomad visas just tells me that nomads have been questioning their appeal and it's been suggested that they might be infringing some law, if they keep using tourist visas instead. Think of the ramifications of trying to regulate all the fuzzy definitions of what constitutes "work". What about someone writing their memoir? What about any kind of opus you're working on while on vacation (electronics, code, writing, etc)? What about needing to manage your business at home for an hour everyday? What about being on-call for work emergencies? What about meetings? Such a visa would easily make anyone an outlaw, which many people think is a non-issue, because the country doesn't enforce it, but is actually a big deal.
- unnah 3y ago
  Visa rules were typically set up at a time when there was no such thing as remote work to speak of. When they mention working, they don't make any distinction between remote or local work. For example, a US B-2 visitor visa allows "tourism" and also specific business purposes such as "consult with business associates" or "attend a conference". What is prohibited is simply "employment", without making any distinction between remote or local employment. Source: https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/us-visas/tourism-visit/visitor.html https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/us-visas/tourism-...
  - mekoka 3y ago
    "Employment" on that list is among other items of "Not permitted travel purposes" that hint at an obvious implied context for the said purposes, i.e. the United States. You are not allowed to visit the United States for the purpose of employment while on a visitor's visa. A digital nomad typically is already employed and doesn't visit countries for that purpose. Having traveled to the US a number of times and been asked by border agents, I've explained that although employment not being the purpose of my visit, I often work on my computer for my own business, in my own country. After a brief exchange to clarify that my activities in no way involved US businesses or clients, I was cleared. I agree with you that the rule might seem fuzzy, but based on the questions asked, the intent has never been. In the many years that I've traveled, it's historically been the same in any countries that I've visited. Even the ones where it's currently suggested that the issue might be blurrier (coincidentally after they start issuing nomad visas). Meanwhile, no one can tell you specifically what exactly constitutes a "digital nomad" and what makes them "not a tourist". I think it's unfortunate that instead of asking for more clarity from regulators, travelers are playing along by repeating the suggested tropes.
zkid18 3y ago
Please note it is only available to nationals of countries and regions that are either visa waiver countries or have tax treaties with Japan, which is different from the conditions of Korea and Taiwan. Only 48 countries are eligible to be visa applicants; 25% of the world’s 192 countries are covered [0] So it's kinda like a "first-world" toy for now. [0] https://medium.com/@oseraryo/latest-updadats-japans-digital-nomad-visa-03f0848163cf https://medium.com/@oseraryo/latest-updadats-japans-digital-...
confusedengie 3y ago
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a_vanderbilt 3y ago
I don't see how this is worth it given the differences from the tourist visa. Sure it's a "legal" way to work while you're in the country, but the difficulties that already exist is going to make it not worth it. It's hard finding longer-term housing in Japan as a foreigner, much less doing banking. While it might be a nice springboard to find a job locally, the remote types that meet the income requirements are going to make much more working in the US, so why give that up? If it was at least a year, then it might be worth it. If it also had the option to extend it without having to leave, then it would be very attractive.
gn4d 3y ago
It is difficult even getting a gym membership (yes, there are alternative such as pay-as-you-go at ward gyms) without a bank account. And if you are from a country such as the USA, obtaining a bank account even with a residency (zairyu) card is cumbersome on account of FATCA (some banks will even outright reject Americans unless they are on a corporate expat package or are working for a Japanese company which "takes care of things" for them). These hurdles, along with many others, make Japan a difficult proposition for typical nomads. Show up in a new country... >Let me rent a place No zairyu? See ya! (yes, there are sharehouses and places which allow foreigners for medium to long term stays, as well as expensive corporate housing type places, but you are limited to options such as these) >That sucks. Well, let me get a local phone number because that's required for some services No zairyu? See ya! (yes, there are now more MVNOs and services which will allow foreigners to get temporary Japanese numbers but at a higher cost) >Alright, what a frustrating day, I'll go to the gym, and I'll bring a wad of cash to pay for my first 3 months membership until I get everything set up No bank account? See ya! Are these things surmountable? Of course. But even for foreigners who speak Japanese decently well (such as N2 and above, though N4 is still probably more than enough to navigate basic bureaucratic procedures), navigating these almost circular tasks is not any easier. Are these things that a nomad wants to deal with? lol, *highly* doubtful. Even for foreigners who can speak Japanese and who are studying in Japan or have a job at a Japanese company, there are many hurdles that take time to set up to get fully "situated" there. Japan is not structured for short term knowledge workers. Heck, it is not structured for even most foreigners (enjoy being stopped on your bicycle by police for the sole reason that you do not look Japanese). Every year, the Japanese government comes out with new initiatives to attract knowledge workers, from the Fukuoka startup zone to the "blue collar labourer visa" to the "PhD visa". Yet they can never even come close to meeting quotas, because the hidden requirements of these visas, combined with friction/hurdles that still exist upon arrival, render all these attempts stillborn. These initiatives are done such that the Japanese government and government-controlled press can say "Look, we're trying!", without doing anything substantive. Now, Japan *is* structured for short term labourers from Southeast Asia and countries like Nepal, but poor conditions in factory dormitories and having your passport seized upon arrival are not exactly the types of jobs that HN readers have in mind. Don't get me wrong, Japan is a beautiful country to visit, with a rich history and culture. And if you are a foreign expat on a nice package, there is good money to be made. Students on semesters or years abroad? Probably fun, as well! But as a short term digital nomad? That's a huge ask. So many barriers that do not exist nearly anywhere else in the world for your typical digital nomad reader here. If you want to see Japan, it is probably best to just travel as a tourist. [Side note: even for long term foreign workers in Japan, the new laws passed in 2015/2016 are brutal for foreign income, high taxes on global assets, which caused a bit of an exodus of highly-paid foreign expats. Those taxes hit after 5 years spent in Japan as a resident, so your time is limited to 4.99 years if you want to avoid them. Not relevant to short term digital nomads, but just pointing out that, if anything, Japan is increasingly unfriendly to skilled foreign workers, not that other way around. There are *always* massive strings attached when it comes to "friendly" initiatives from the Japanese government.]
pangolinja 3y ago
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pangolinja 3y ago
[flagged]

239 points by mikhael 3y ago

I have a quick question, maybe someone can help. They talk about a yearly income of 10 million Yen, so roughly 70 000 US$. Where i live i pay pretty high income tax. Do these 10 million Yen refer to the money that actually ends up on my bank account, or the amount before tax and health insurance is deducted? Because if they take the amount of money, before i pay tax, it would work, otherwise i am not even close. I have not found any information concerning this, did i miss something?

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

andybak 3y ago

The salary requirement seems harsh for people working on non-profit, self-funded or early-stage.

gottorf 3y ago
On the other hand, if you meet any of those criteria, perhaps it's not the best use of your resources to be a digital nomad in Japan.
- andybak 3y ago
  That's fairly presumptuous of you.
  - gottorf 3y ago
    Perhaps, but perhaps also less presumptuous than anybody who thinks they have an innate right to go to Japan on whatever terms they please.
    - andybak 3y ago
      My mistake. You're not presumptuous. You're just rude.
mytailorisrich 3y ago
Obviously this type of visa is aimed at getting people to spend money in the country. Why would they want people with no money?
- informatimago 3y ago
  Well, the digital nomad doesn't spend a lot of money. Some on accommodation, some for internet, some for food, and that's it. He spends his time remote working on his laptop. His income is paid offshore. Apart from the tourist aspect of it, the point of a digital nomad is to save money on rent, food and taxes, not to spend all your money in a foreign country. Of course, a business hub, or a technological hub can attract digital nomads punctually, even if accommodations are more expensive. Now Japan has a problem with its age pyramid and desertification of its country side. So it should be possible to attract digital nomad for longer and cheaper stays, even if they don't have a lot of money (to spend in Japan), at least that's good for the young body count, and perhaps they'd eventually fixate and have families. But again, this wouldn't be a six-month thing, they would have to add more incentive (free or $1-house in the countryside with minimal occupancy, good internet connection (I don't know if Japan has 100% territory fiber coverage) (that said nowadays there's Starlink), etc.
  - mytailorisrich 3y ago
    I would have thought that the point of spending 6 months in Japan was to experience Japan in a deeper and more relaxed way than a short-ish trip as a tourist. Spending money on living expenses, including rent, and touristy stuff is indeed spending money in the country. And if you are well paid then that may be more than the average local: the threshold for this visa is $68k while the average annual pay in Japan is apparently $41-45k.
  - lupire 3y ago
    Why would a nomad spend less than a resident?
- andybak 3y ago
  How is everyone reading this as me saying "no money"? You can have significantly less than $58k provable income and live very nicely while travelling. Is this some silicon valley bubble thing?
totetsu 3y ago
Japan legislature seems to spend a lot of time passing these kind of laws that only ever affect a few people. But with some of the other ones after a few years of no one using the residency statuses, they loosened up the requirement a bit.
spidersenses 3y ago
Japan is a country that is expensive to live in. Having minimum salary requirements already filters out the type of 'digital nomad' who would otherwise become a burden on society or those who merely seek immigration from Africa or South Asia under the disguise of the 'digital nomad'.
- keiferski 3y ago
  It really isn't though, especially with the currency exchange. Tokyo is comparable in cost to a second or third tier American city, not to NYC/LA/SF/London. See: https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=United+States&city1=San+Francisco%2C+CA&country2=Japan&city2=Tokyo https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?cou... I do agree that $68k as a salary requirement is fairly reasonable, though – but it's much higher than the "average" salary for a Japanese person.
- andybak 3y ago
  There's a large gap between "burden on society" and "provable $58k income"
- nerdbert 3y ago
  Japan is not particularly expensive. It's significantly cheaper than USA, Canada, Western Europe, Australia, NZ, etc. US$68,000 is enough for a very comfortable life there.
  - mywittyname 3y ago
    $68k about the median household income in the USA - and higher than the median in a lot of states. One could live a comfortable life in many parts of the USA for that salary.
  - jwells89 3y ago
    Particularly if you’re not living in Tokyo, Fukuoka for instance is significantly cheaper despite also being a densely populated city with the usual amenities.
prg20 3y ago
Totally. They should allow anyone, even those with no income, to come to their country and use their services for nothing in return. We can see how well that's worked in the US.
- dvngnt_ 3y ago
  US has a bigger economy though so something is working
  - jskxneks777 3y ago
    US is a shit hole compared to japan lmao
- andybak 3y ago
  You obviously want to soapbox an entirely different topic - nobody said "no income" so your answer just makes you look slightly off-kilter.
- OfficeChad 3y ago
  [dead]
mc32 3y ago
They don't want pretenders. They want people who are going to be productive and bring something to the country. They're not looking for "backpackers," they're looking for well paid professionals who will spend money and also conform better (these people would hire people to do paperwork, translate, etc., rather than drain local resources.) People may not agree with the above, but that's what they want, and I can't blame them for wanting good for their country.
- andybak 3y ago
  Nice line in unveiled insults you've got there. EDIT - you changed "poser" to "pretender" which was a small improvement. It's polite to make it clear that you've edited a comment if someone has replied.
wharvle 3y ago
The point is to get people in who'll spend money. Governments don't usually create visa programs to be nice—they do it for some benefit.

nothercastle 3y ago

Can you make a Japanese bank account while on visa? If not it’s pretty useless

williamdclt 3y ago
why is a Japanese bank account so necessary?
- ekianjo 3y ago
  some activities require a proof of residency AND salary in Japan
  - j4yav 3y ago
    The kinds of activities someone does while travelling for 3-6 months?
    - datpiff 3y ago
      I believe renting somewhere to live often does, so yes.
      - sersi 3y ago
        If you rent for short term (6 months), monthly mansions don't need bank accounts or proof of residency. It costs about 50% more than you'd pay for long term but you don't have to pay reikin (key money you don't get back), shikikin (deposit for damages).
        ekianjo 3y ago
        it may be cheaper to live in a hostel rather than a monthly mansion, but depends on your tastes
  - true_religion 3y ago
    Like what activities?

arwineap 3y ago

Has anyone done the digital nomad thing with children? It'd be great if childcare/schooling was easier overseas, maybe even an opportunity for kids to get an early mind opening experience

0xcoffee 3y ago
I was an expat child that moved many times in my childhood. The broken connections of each move hurt me more than any 'new experience'. I wouldn't recommend it, imo social stability is very important.
walthamstow 3y ago
If you're not paying tax in a country it's a bit out of order to send your kids to their schools.
- RobRivera 3y ago
  [flagged]
- JoeAltmaier 3y ago
  Not everything is funded from federal or state income tax. Where I live it's a combination of local option sales tax and property tax. So yes, digital nomads may pay taxes for schools.
- true_religion 3y ago
  I would assume the kids would go to private schools. Probably necessary since they're traveling so much that they need to follow a foreign curriculum or an international one like IB.
- mc32 3y ago
  You can send them to private schools -which you may want to do anyway if they don't speak Japanese.
- ericmcer 3y ago
  Why? If your from the USA our stance is exactly the opposite.

walthamstow 3y ago

180 days with a salary threshold and country restrictions, or 90 days pretending to be a tourist. I know which I'd choose.

alibarber 3y ago
Pretending to be a tourist is a good way to get deported usually in a lot of places.
- NineStarPoint 3y ago
  Is it? I know that legally they could deport you so its not a great idea, but how often does someone actually get deported for doing remote work while spending a few months in another country?
  - nerdbert 3y ago
    Literally never. This topic is one of those things that draws resentful ruleboys out of the woodwork to preach about something they have no firsthand knowledge of because none exists.
    - alibarber 3y ago
      No, I think people are missing the wood for the trees here. The fact that these visas are becoming available means that governments are wising up to the fact that people have been working remotely on tourist visas and want in on it. They want to be able to charge for it, or set a limit on who can do it, or tax it. Now that these visas exist, and immigration officers know that, it’s only obvious that they’ll start to ask ‘tourists’ if they plan on working remotely or not. You can lie all you want, but if they find evidence (two laptops, notebooks, equipment) then good luck. What happened in the past is just that.
      - petronio 3y ago
        I think you're confusing their goal. It's not that they have a problem with people working remotely on tourist visas, it's that they want them to do it for longer as it brings economic benefit to the country. If they disliked the idea they wouldn't be creating new visas for the purpose, since that only makes it more prevalent and normalized.

oldtownroad 3y ago

“The most similar existing status is usually used by tourists, does not allow work and allows a maximum stay of just 90 days” I don’t think that’s correct. A tourist visa doesn’t allow you to work locally but they do not limit working remotely for an overseas company. For example, if you’re on vacation in Japan from the US and an emergency happens at work, you can join a call without risk of deportation.

alibarber 3y ago
No, this is the correct interpretation in a lot of countries, you are performing paid work there regardless of who and where the employer is. Emergencies are all well and good, but turning up at the immigration desk and saying you don’t plan on working when you actually do will lead to trouble in a lot of places.
- oldtownroad 3y ago
  Can you share the tourist visa regulations for Japan that say this? I haven’t been able to find any. Thank you :)
  - makeitdouble 3y ago
    That's implied. If you're working with your tourist visa you're changing the purpose of your stay and thus lying regarding your visa declaration: > Single-entry short-term stay visa for the purpose of Tourism (for a period of up to 90 days) (Note). > [...] > If you wish to visit Japan for other purposes or for a long-term stay, please submit your application to the Japanese Embassy, Consulate General or Consular office with jurisdiction over your place of residence. https://www.mofa.go.jp/j_info/visit/visa/visaonline.html https://www.mofa.go.jp/j_info/visit/visa/visaonline.html
    - nerdbert 3y ago
      The purpose of the visit is still tourism, even when people are also working remotely. Otherwise they could have stayed home and worked remotely.

treprinum 3y ago

I spent 1 month around Kyoto's UNESCO sites 10 years ago while working remotely for a company in the US and am not sure I'd want to spend whole 6 months in Japan when there are so many interesting places all around the world. One needed to know basic Japanese as very few people spoke English, finding an accommodation was a chore as AirBnB was non-existing and hotels with unlimited fast WiFi scarce and one had to book an apartment in some of their temporary housings months in advance. Overall a nice and unique country though people looked overworked (young people complaining about working 996 lifestyles) and isolated from foreigners, similar to Germans (except their children that always wanted to practice Engrish with anyone not looking Japanese).

gejose 3y ago
Everyone’s preferences differ when it comes to travel destinations. What may not have worked for you might actually be great for someone else. Ultimately, the decision to visit a destination should be based on personal interests and experiences.
- treprinum 3y ago
  Sure, I just remember on my last day in Japan I actually felt sadness that I didn't find whatever I was looking for, despite seeing like 15 UNESCO World Heritage sites, but essentially didn't make any lasting connection on a personal level with anyone due to being unable to break the formal shell of anyone. Total opposite to e.g. Brazil when one could make friends in 5 minutes and those folks remembered you for years.
  - boringg 3y ago
    To each their own - I think its rather crass to castigate a whole country because your own travel didn't find whatever deeper level bond you were searching for. I for one am suspect at being able make a good friend that lasts forever in 5 minutes. That sounds more like power dynamics in that you had something to offer them then some kind of mutual friendship based on shared interests. That said to each their own.

haunter 3y ago

> for up to six months while enjoying sightseeing trips, the agency said Almost sounds like the sightseeing trips are part of the visa

elzbardico 3y ago

In most countries you can't do any kind of work while in a tourist Visa, but this was never enforced, because it was so exceedingly rare for not to be on governments radar. But once it became more prevalent, it creates the problem (on governments view, especially post 9/11) of having a bunch of foreign folks living for months and receiving money from abroad for god knows which reason. This creates the problem for law enforcement of having to separate nomad workers from more shady characters that have exactly the same "signature": long term stays, getting regular money from above, not doing the usual tourist stuff that people that have money and free time enough to stay in a foreign country for months usually do. So, for law enforcement purposes, it makes sense to have an specific kind of Visa for those "working tourists", so they can pre-filter this population and get back to a smaller working set of persons of interest without the added noise of "working tourists" (digital nomad as a term is incorrect, after all, true nomads would be working locally)

kybernetyk 3y ago
>So, for law enforcement purposes, it makes sense to have an specific kind of Visa for those "working tourists", so they can pre-filter this population and get back to a smaller working set of persons of interest So I guess terrorists/bad actors won't get the idea to apply for this Visa to fly under the radar then?
- Jensson 3y ago
  Applying for a visa probably entails explaining where your money is coming from, such low effort barriers actually helps a ton since most criminals aren't very conscientious.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- lupire 3y ago
  There's a checkbox on the customs form that asks if you are a terrorist.
- nerdponx 3y ago

herbst 3y ago

People seem to underestimate how limiting tourist visas actually are. Imagine you sell digital products automated or something like that. You would have to literally shut your website down if you go somewhere on a tourist visa so you don't accidently make money. You might think there are exceptions, but no there usually aren't. And now imagine you actually live from a digital business you run yourself. You literally can't travel on a tourist visa. I can't legally leave the EU, more or less, as I have no control when and where I earn money. I also wouldn't travel so far for just a month or two so this is really speaking to me :)

verticalscaler 3y ago
I give you permission to spread your wings and leave the EU for a stint. Of course don't take the word of an internet stranger, confirm with a lawyer.
oldtownroad 3y ago
That’s not true. The jurisdiction that your business operates in doesn’t change depending on where you’re located. If you’re running a business without a business entity (why?) then you can use a merchant of record service (like Paddle) which will serve that role for you.
- herbst 3y ago
  Guess that's a good point. However I still wouldn't be legally allowed to work.
m_dupont 3y ago
I mean sure, but the chances of that ever being enforced are close to 0. I'm a full time digital nomad for over a year in various latin american countries, always on tourist visas. Nobody notices or cares. The only time I ever had an issue is when entering the united states, the immigration department gave me a grilling because my passport showed that I was clearly a nomad and they expected me to be working online. Go ahead, take that holiday.
- 3y ago

Shank 3y ago

It's exciting to see progress, but I think 180 days is too short for this to be worthwhile for people who really wanted this. They've leaned heavily into the "nomad" part, but the issue is more of practicality. This visa doesn't come with a Residency Card, which means that getting a traditional lease in Japan is going to be difficult. For 6 months, you'll be on an uphill battle with some services like housing, which can be important. It's just long enough that you won't want to maintain a home in your home country unless it's paid for, and short enough that it makes moving your possessions impractical. You also can't renew it, and you have to be out of the country for 6 months before you can get it again. I think this would be very appealing if it was a 1 year visa at minimum, but comparable visas (e.g., the Taiwan Gold Card) are up to 3 years. I'm not terribly upset at the lack of Individual Number or Residence Card, but the length is definitely something that makes it unappealing except in the most nomad-of-nomad situations. Apparently they'll be opening it for public comments in the second half of February. They said that they based the 6 month time period on questions they asked foreigners about how long they would want to stay -- so maybe this is the time to push for a longer period of time.

rldjbpin 3y ago
this perspective works for those who can get similar duration for tourism because of their strong passport. meanwhile some european countries gave short visit visa as short as a couple weeks, while charging hundreds of euros for the entire process. then all of a sudden it seems very generous in comparison.
honeylemonnuin 3y ago
Thank you for your comment. I'm interested in this program too and agree with you that 6 months maybe too short to move and rent an apartment there. I assume most place have at lease 1 year contract, right? I would like to give them my comment too. Can you please share where can we give them feedback when they open for public comment? And will it possible if we ask them to let us apply for residency card? Thank you
thehappypm 3y ago
Don’t you think that the housing market will create a niche for these people? Foreigners with deep pockets coming in for six months sounds like a great thing for landlords. Plus, you know they won’t squat because they’re gone after 6 months or they get deported

seydor 3y ago

why are cities trying to attract nomads? They are almost by definition doing location arbitrage, thus paying less in both their country of origin and country of destination.

lupire 3y ago
Are you asking why international trade exists?
nicbou 3y ago
They spend money and leave. They have a very small negative footprint (excluding the housing market), and require almost no obligations from the host country, but spend money locally.
Jcampuzano2 3y ago
The answer is simple - money. Digital nomads typically don't take jobs from local residents, they on average have more and are willing to spend more money than the typical local resident, and additionally the country has no responsibility to provide social benefits to a digital nomad and thus they are low cost. Additionally while digital nomads may sometimes be ignorant of local culture/tradition and that can be somewhat annoying, they typically don't cause problems when it comes to crime. Now there are legitimate concerns with respect to housing with things like AirBNB's/under the table housing arrangements and causing the housing prices to increase, but while that is an issue to a local resident it is actually seen as a positive to the city itself when it comes to the economy.
- seydor 3y ago
  they also dont pay taxes like local residents. And they spend less than tourists
  - iamjackg 3y ago
    True, but I'd imagine tourists hang out for a few weeks at most, not six months.
  - 3y ago

somenameforme 3y ago

Most aren't aware of the situation Japan is in today because of the world we all grew up in, where Japan was at one point nearly the largest economy in the world. Japan has been in between a recession and stagnation for 30 years. Their GDP was higher 31 years ago than it is today. [1] Their GDP/capita is $33,950 with most wages well below that. They hit a record high for average wages in 2022 of ¥311,800 - about $2,100. [2] Next - they're dying off. They hit their inflection point in 2009 and they've been shrinking since [3]. They've lost more than 5million people since 2009. And the "fun" thing about fertility collapse is that the decline will never stop. Their population will keep shrinking down at the 'equilibrium rate' (decided by fertility rate) until they start having babies, or go extinct. The exact same will happen to every other country with sub-replacement fertility rates. This, IMO, is an effort to try to attract a certain type of immigrant largely for the purposes of revenue generation. --- [1] - https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.MKTP.CD?locations=JP https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.MKTP.CD?location... [2] - https://www.nippon.com/en/japan-data/h01631/ https://www.nippon.com/en/japan-data/h01631/ [2] - https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/japan-population/ https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/japan-populat...

fxtentacle 3y ago
Yeah I also find it weird because "To be eligible for the new status, applicants must have an annual income equivalent to 10 million yen ($68,000) or more" which means the newly created Digital Nomad class needs to have 2x the average GDP/capita in income?
- FirmwareBurner 3y ago
  So they only want high earning workers from developed countries, basically the kind of immigrants every other country wants but doesn't dare say it out loud. What's wrong with that? Their country, their rules.
  - kdmccormick 3y ago
    Nothing innately "wrong" but I can see it fueling resentment among working class Japanese towards these foreign, exclusively-wealthy digital nomads.

xhkkffbf 3y ago

Can anyone guess on what the tax scenario might be for a US resident going to Japan for 4-6 months?

dazamarquez 3y ago

I don't understand why this would be interesting. These "digital nomads" who would travel to Japan for work+sightseeing aren't taking local jobs and don't have a Japanese bank account. Does Japan want to tax income produced within its borders, regardless of where one is actually a tax resident? Most countries I'm aware of treat people as tax residents if they reside there for more than 180 days a year.

rkagerer 3y ago

What's the end-game with these 'digital nomad' VISA's several countries are beginning to offer? Is it basically just 'live here for a few months like a tourist' or is there some pathway to permanent residence/citizenship?

feliciegerald 3y ago

[dead]

holoduke 3y ago

I think within 10 years this is also needed in Europe. Back in 2000 1 in 5 eligible for working were pensioned. Now its 1 in the 3. This mumber only gets worse. Japan is a few years ahead. But population decline in a growth based economy is not good. So yeah. Attrack the right people is what needs to happen. Imho still ducktape on the original issue.

jalapenos 3y ago

This already exists: visit twice in one year on a tourist visa, and don't loudly yell out your hotel window "hey immigration - I'm doing work in here!". And that's better because not of those income or insurance criteria apply. So just some empty "look at us we're doing something (not really)" fluff.

mekoka 3y ago

I've often seen suggested in forums that tourist visas forbid any kind of work while visiting a country. I've yet to see a single article of the law that actually points to this. So, I'm inclined to think that when people repeat this, they actually haven't checked. I have looked at the clauses on many tourist visas, as given to me by various consulates, and seen no evidence of this new interpretation. A tourist visa often forbids working or doing any kind of local business, other than volunteering and the likes (i.e. taking a local job, selling stuff locally, meeting with local businesses, etc). That this new interpretation coincides with the emergence of nomad visas just tells me that nomads have been questioning their appeal and it's been suggested that they might be infringing some law, if they keep using tourist visas instead. Think of the ramifications of trying to regulate all the fuzzy definitions of what constitutes "work". What about someone writing their memoir? What about any kind of opus you're working on while on vacation (electronics, code, writing, etc)? What about needing to manage your business at home for an hour everyday? What about being on-call for work emergencies? What about meetings? Such a visa would easily make anyone an outlaw, which many people think is a non-issue, because the country doesn't enforce it, but is actually a big deal.

unnah 3y ago
Visa rules were typically set up at a time when there was no such thing as remote work to speak of. When they mention working, they don't make any distinction between remote or local work. For example, a US B-2 visitor visa allows "tourism" and also specific business purposes such as "consult with business associates" or "attend a conference". What is prohibited is simply "employment", without making any distinction between remote or local employment. Source: https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/us-visas/tourism-visit/visitor.html https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/us-visas/tourism-...
- mekoka 3y ago
  "Employment" on that list is among other items of "Not permitted travel purposes" that hint at an obvious implied context for the said purposes, i.e. the United States. You are not allowed to visit the United States for the purpose of employment while on a visitor's visa. A digital nomad typically is already employed and doesn't visit countries for that purpose. Having traveled to the US a number of times and been asked by border agents, I've explained that although employment not being the purpose of my visit, I often work on my computer for my own business, in my own country. After a brief exchange to clarify that my activities in no way involved US businesses or clients, I was cleared. I agree with you that the rule might seem fuzzy, but based on the questions asked, the intent has never been. In the many years that I've traveled, it's historically been the same in any countries that I've visited. Even the ones where it's currently suggested that the issue might be blurrier (coincidentally after they start issuing nomad visas). Meanwhile, no one can tell you specifically what exactly constitutes a "digital nomad" and what makes them "not a tourist". I think it's unfortunate that instead of asking for more clarity from regulators, travelers are playing along by repeating the suggested tropes.

zkid18 3y ago

Please note it is only available to nationals of countries and regions that are either visa waiver countries or have tax treaties with Japan, which is different from the conditions of Korea and Taiwan. Only 48 countries are eligible to be visa applicants; 25% of the world’s 192 countries are covered [0] So it's kinda like a "first-world" toy for now. [0] https://medium.com/@oseraryo/latest-updadats-japans-digital-nomad-visa-03f0848163cf https://medium.com/@oseraryo/latest-updadats-japans-digital-...

confusedengie 3y ago

[dead]

a_vanderbilt 3y ago

I don't see how this is worth it given the differences from the tourist visa. Sure it's a "legal" way to work while you're in the country, but the difficulties that already exist is going to make it not worth it. It's hard finding longer-term housing in Japan as a foreigner, much less doing banking. While it might be a nice springboard to find a job locally, the remote types that meet the income requirements are going to make much more working in the US, so why give that up? If it was at least a year, then it might be worth it. If it also had the option to extend it without having to leave, then it would be very attractive.

gn4d 3y ago

It is difficult even getting a gym membership (yes, there are alternative such as pay-as-you-go at ward gyms) without a bank account. And if you are from a country such as the USA, obtaining a bank account even with a residency (zairyu) card is cumbersome on account of FATCA (some banks will even outright reject Americans unless they are on a corporate expat package or are working for a Japanese company which "takes care of things" for them). These hurdles, along with many others, make Japan a difficult proposition for typical nomads. Show up in a new country... >Let me rent a place No zairyu? See ya! (yes, there are sharehouses and places which allow foreigners for medium to long term stays, as well as expensive corporate housing type places, but you are limited to options such as these) >That sucks. Well, let me get a local phone number because that's required for some services No zairyu? See ya! (yes, there are now more MVNOs and services which will allow foreigners to get temporary Japanese numbers but at a higher cost) >Alright, what a frustrating day, I'll go to the gym, and I'll bring a wad of cash to pay for my first 3 months membership until I get everything set up No bank account? See ya! Are these things surmountable? Of course. But even for foreigners who speak Japanese decently well (such as N2 and above, though N4 is still probably more than enough to navigate basic bureaucratic procedures), navigating these almost circular tasks is not any easier. Are these things that a nomad wants to deal with? lol, *highly* doubtful. Even for foreigners who can speak Japanese and who are studying in Japan or have a job at a Japanese company, there are many hurdles that take time to set up to get fully "situated" there. Japan is not structured for short term knowledge workers. Heck, it is not structured for even most foreigners (enjoy being stopped on your bicycle by police for the sole reason that you do not look Japanese). Every year, the Japanese government comes out with new initiatives to attract knowledge workers, from the Fukuoka startup zone to the "blue collar labourer visa" to the "PhD visa". Yet they can never even come close to meeting quotas, because the hidden requirements of these visas, combined with friction/hurdles that still exist upon arrival, render all these attempts stillborn. These initiatives are done such that the Japanese government and government-controlled press can say "Look, we're trying!", without doing anything substantive. Now, Japan *is* structured for short term labourers from Southeast Asia and countries like Nepal, but poor conditions in factory dormitories and having your passport seized upon arrival are not exactly the types of jobs that HN readers have in mind. Don't get me wrong, Japan is a beautiful country to visit, with a rich history and culture. And if you are a foreign expat on a nice package, there is good money to be made. Students on semesters or years abroad? Probably fun, as well! But as a short term digital nomad? That's a huge ask. So many barriers that do not exist nearly anywhere else in the world for your typical digital nomad reader here. If you want to see Japan, it is probably best to just travel as a tourist. [Side note: even for long term foreign workers in Japan, the new laws passed in 2015/2016 are brutal for foreign income, high taxes on global assets, which caused a bit of an exodus of highly-paid foreign expats. Those taxes hit after 5 years spent in Japan as a resident, so your time is limited to 4.99 years if you want to avoid them. Not relevant to short term digital nomads, but just pointing out that, if anything, Japan is increasingly unfriendly to skilled foreign workers, not that other way around. There are *always* massive strings attached when it comes to "friendly" initiatives from the Japanese government.]

pangolinja 3y ago

[flagged]

pangolinja 3y ago

[flagged]