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'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

431 points by Stratoscope 3y ago

ShamelessC 3y ago
This sort of discourse would be flagged, moderated and possibly result in a ban here on HN. His actions seem to undermine a lot of what this community is meant to be about.
- infamouscow 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - mjhay 3y ago
    You do realize that the first amendment protects individuals from prosecution for protected speech, right? It does not guarantee protection from professional or social consequences. For some reason this distinction is very hard to understand for people of certain political stripes. Regardless, death threats are not protected under the first amendment, so you're even wrong under your idiotic assumptions of how the law works.
    - infamouscow 3y ago
      [flagged]
      - meepmorp 3y ago
        > I sincerely wish the worst things imaginable for these activist journalists. They are the enemy of the people. This is unironically the kind of shit that authoritarians love to say about journalists.
        infamouscow 3y ago
        That's an association fallacy and doesn't make it any less true.
        meepmorp 3y ago
        Your palpable anger at people who say things you don't like isn't helping your case. Maybe you made a fallacy fallacy.
        zoklet-enjoyer 3y ago
        Most journalists are just propogandists and misinformed people stating option as fact. I don't understand why anyone holds them in high regard. Like yeah, there are many great individual journalists who take their job seriously and get real information out to people, but for the most part, no.
- cdchn 3y ago
  Rules for thee, not for me.
- minimaxir 3y ago
  Hacker News has been pretty insulated from Y Combinator as an institution over the years. Nowadays, I'm impressed by that.
- infotainment 3y ago
  Sure, and that would be the system working as intended. I choose to post everything under random dictionary word pseudonyms just in case one of my hot takes is slightly too spicy. His real mistake was posting under his real name IMO.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- zzzeek 3y ago
  Well unless you tell the mods you were drunk, apparently. Then they shrug and say "well what can you do! It was the alcohol talking, not them "
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
justina20 3y ago
[dead]
threeseed 3y ago
I hope YC quickly moves on from Garry Tan. This sort of childish behaviour is not just dragging YC down but the startup community as a whole.
- pm90 3y ago
  Agreed. SF politics is profoundly broken, and many of the Supervisors are sclerotic and out of touch. But wishing death on them publicly is very very serious.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- justin66 3y ago
  It's worse than childish. The people called out in that bizarre tweet would probably have a conversation with their staff or the police about whether they or their families are in any kind of danger from this apparently popular guy wishing death upon them from the internet, or perhaps from one of his idiot followers. They might not know much about where Tan is coming from, but they know they work in a building where Moscone and Milk were assassinated.
  - colechristensen 3y ago
    They would be perfectly reasonable to hire private security and sue Tan for damages to pay for that and whatever other measures that seem prudent for their own protection along with the pain and suffering that goes along with the very reasonable fear this tweet and its effects caused. What he wrote was more or less the limit to what you can say before it becomes a serious crime.
- minimaxir 3y ago
  I wonder how many startup founders nowadays refuse to join an accelerator/take VC money due of the people leading it.
  - 3y ago
zombiwoof 3y ago
[flagged]
rayiner 3y ago
> Tan, for his part, apologized over the weekend, noting that his post was a reference to a Tupac Shakur lyric How famous does someone have to be joke about a politician dying before it’s a problem? Tan is less famous than Charlie Sheen or Johnny Depp, who have joked about Trump dying. Also, from Wikipedia: “Tan supported the 2022 recall campaign against progressive San Francisco District Attorney Chesa Boudin. Tan donated at least $100,000 to the effort. Tan blamed Boudin for physical attacks on Asians.” There’s a fair argument that Tan is joking about violence against people whose policies are facilitating actual violence.
- colechristensen 3y ago
  It wasn’t a joke, I don’t believe anyone can read it and think he was trying to be funny. I doubt he meant it particularly literally, but there’s little question it was written with malice.
- ekimehtor 3y ago
  Well I'm not famous but I will tell a joke about it politician. And remember Comedy equals tragedy plus time… Apart from the ending how was the show mrs. Lincoln?
- deleted 3y ago
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- roenxi 3y ago
  Not famous at all, really. It'd be reasonable (and good) to have a standard where people don't wish violence on their political opponents. Possibly even where cooperating with people they don't like is an option. Opponents of Trump please take note. However, after acknowledging that Tan shouldn't have done this, it doesn't look serious. Drunken rants on Twitter are not important in and of themselves.
- threeseed 3y ago
  Tan said he was drunk and apologised for his statements. Instead of oddly defending them maybe you should follow his lead and not act like saying someone should die slowly is a joke. Especially in this world where politicians have been subjected to credible death threats.
anonreeeeplor 3y ago
[flagged]
- spacecadet 3y ago
  [flagged]
- deleted 3y ago
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- stevenAthompson 3y ago
  [flagged]
- jpoijw 3y ago
  [dead]
- christoph 3y ago
  It’s not just California, just look at almost anywhere. Same story across the UK - taxes and prices ever increase, quality of everything and every service continues to decline. The greed and corruption on display by nearly all politicians is beyond brazen. Lucrative contracts for friends that deliver no value, insider trading, tax avoidance, offshore accounts, communicating government business on burner phones, deleting emails, fiddling expenses, huge infrastructure projects running vastly over budget then being cancelled, etc. What amazes me is how few realise the level of outright theft of their own hard earned money, and seek some form of comfort in blaming the other side, believing their team will fix it next time. There are even some that try to put it down to incompetence. The corruption is now so deeply rooted and endemic throughout all of society, government and media it’s impossible to know where rooting it out could ever start and end. So probably the only way to turn the tide is for everyday hard working people to start rejecting it and rejecting to support it in any way, shape or form, everyday throughout their own lives. No single person or group can fix this and any claiming to be able to is both a liar and a fraud.
  - anonreeeeplor 3y ago
    The entire administrative class needs to be flattened and replaced with doers. ZIRP phenomenon. The doers are checking out, entire system designed to discriminate against talent.
ekimehtor 3y ago
"these tech Bros should die a slow death" –venture capitalist "Will no one rid me of this turbulent priest?" –King Henry VII "he's dead now so that's that" –Microsoft founder
gfodor 3y ago
You'd never guess that this was a Tupac quote by the media coverage and wave after wave of forced outrage. The whole thing is so embarassing.
- ekimehtor 3y ago
  Thank goodness it wasn't a quote from the song W.A.P.:-)!
- colechristensen 3y ago
  “Die slow motherfuckers” Tupac wasn’t kidding or putting on a show. He was killed by the people he refers to there not long after. Tupac meant those words literally.
- davesque 3y ago
  I don't see how it makes it any better that it was a quote. The quote still had words in it. Does Garry Tan think the entire world listens to Tupac? And what wisdom does Tupac really have to offer in this case?
  - deleted 3y ago
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  - Our_Benefactors 3y ago
    > Does Garry Tan think the entire world listens to Tupac? Ever met a Tupac fan? They do seem to think this, yes.
  - gfodor 3y ago
    I mean, if someone says something like that and they’re conjuring it up directly or they’re quoting a piece of art, I think that’s obviously relevant to interpreting it. Without taking a position on how severe to interpret it, it’s plainly obvious this important detail is glossed over and ignored and the media coverage of this is desperately trying to leave readers walking away thinking this was a more direct straightforward statement not subject to interpretation of how much to take it at face value.
chrisbolt 3y ago
Previous: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39205676 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39205676
- gurchik 3y ago
  I read HN probably more than I should, and I was pretty surprised to see this has over 500 comments and I didn't see it at all. Turns out it was only on the frontpage for 1 hr. https://hnrankings.info/39205676/ https://hnrankings.info/39205676/
  - Macha 3y ago
    The way HN is set up, having 500 comments would have contributed to that. The "flamewar detector" the mods sometimes mention seems to take comments/votes and comments/time into consideration then penalises threads.
    - throwawaaarrgh 3y ago
      Yep. The HN users see is highly curated. Mostly by algorithms, sometimes by humans.
      - jpoijw 3y ago
        [dead]
      - dang 3y ago
        You're right. Here's 10 years' worth of me explaining that: https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=by%3Adang%20hn%20curated%20site&sort=byDate&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...
    - Brajeshwar 3y ago
      Yes, this is correct from my observation, too. The comment-to-vote ratios go fast; up south, they will likely be out of the pages quickly. One might think that a post that falls off the homepage would linger on page 2 for a while, but it can be out of even the first 100 posts fast. I have stopped thinking about HN's algorithms and just let it do its job.
762236 3y ago
I can find lots of tech workers that would tell Garry to keep up the good work.
cdchn 3y ago
That plaque on his Chinatown VIP club liquor cabinet really is pretty cringe. 'Added District 1 Supervisor Connie Chan: “I will waive rent for living in his head.”' Absolutely savage clapback.
- tpmoney 3y ago
  Doesn’t the phrase “living rent free in your head” refer to someone being preoccupied with another individual with whom they have a disagreement to an unhealthy degree? You can’t waive rent if you’re the one doing the living, and by definition if someone is letting someone else “live rent free” in their head, the rent is already waived. Without any commentary on the rest of this (because I have no idea what’s actually going on), unless this is referring to something other than the common idiom, no this is actually a lousy clapback because it completely misunderstands the idiom.
  - cdchn 3y ago
    They were riffing on the idiom. You're taking the idiom too literally.
    - card_zero 3y ago
      Like when Biff Tannen says "why don't you make like a tree and get outta here?", that kind of riffing on the idiom, riffing on it like that.
      - Rapzid 3y ago
        Too clever by 50%
  - OJFord 3y ago
    I suppose if they're thinking like if any third party wants to get in his head, they will declare rent is not due (waive seems wrong not just if you're living but in general if you're not the landlord) - which kind of works because of their position I think (but I'm not from the US so I don't really understand or want to bother looking into it), but yeah we've probably both thought about it too much and more than they did before posting as a quick joke at this point.
mjhay 3y ago
IMO, it is bad to threaten people with painful deaths. Apparently that is a controversial opinion within this community.
- justin66 3y ago
  You're not heterodox enough, apparently.
- monero-xmr 3y ago
  It isn’t illegal to say what he said but it’s not the right tone for his position. The slow drop into political violence begins with speech normalizing calling for death and murder. I just hope everyone outraged analyzes their own speech. I hold a lot of opinions outside the bounds of cocktail conversation, but I was having cocktails with my (blue city, professional) friends and they made a joke about someone needing to assassinate a certain right wing presidential candidate and everyone laughed really hard. The way she said it was funny and I laughed along but it’s easy to have outrage when you want it.
  - andsoitis 3y ago
    Assuming the report of what he wrote is true… What he said won’t cause someone to kill any of those people. Thats just nonsense. However, ranting drunk and incoherent publicly as the CEO of company shows terrible character.
  - asveikau 3y ago
    > The slow drop into political violence begins with speech normalizing calling for death and murder. I have seen this a lot lately in online discussions of homelessness and people accused of crime. It's very unsettling. That is the context of why Mr Tan wrote that -- there's a popular narrative that specific individuals are complicit in crime and homelessness in San Francisco. This leads to lots of ad hominem and in my view rises to the level of conspiracy theory in many -- it's not like every problem is the fault of a single office holder or even a "cabal" of them. Voting against someone or supporting different candidates is one thing. Calling them solely responsible for all that you consider evil, escalating to the level of death threats, is quite another. And that's just politicians. It's also routine to see people call for violence on homeless people or people accused of crime.
subarctic 3y ago
What's the best way to go read the actual tweets, rather than an article about them? I'm guessing he's deleted them by now.
- mcintyre1994 3y ago
  This article has a screenshot: https://missionlocal.org/2024/01/garry-tan-death-wish-sf-supervisors/ https://missionlocal.org/2024/01/garry-tan-death-wish-sf-sup...
infamouscow 3y ago
[flagged]
- snakeyjake 3y ago
  When you write comments like what Tan said on hn, some milquetoast fuckface nukes your comment. Freedom for me but not for thee. "Oh but that's differe.." fuck off
  - namaria 3y ago
    Ah I see you're just a troll.
  - dang 3y ago
    HN is different from Twitter. The reason users (correctly) flag such comments here is that we're trying for a specific kind of site (https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html). One thing I often say (to a certain type of commenter) is that this isn't an ethical or moral rule—it's more like a game. Different games have different rules. If you're playing chess you don't get to tackle the bishop. Think of the site guidelines like game rules, not a moral code.
- publius_0xf3 3y ago
  >This is nothing more than activist journalists hating successful people for leading a stand against a self-destructive ideology ruining lives. There's plenty of people in this very thread who profess a sympathy for Tan's causes but think his drunken remarks are deplorable and reflect poorly on him, even if not legally actionable. I'm among them. Wagon-circling is a sad pathology of politics. Nobility requires that we rise above it.
  - mistermann 3y ago
    So too with the premature formation of conclusions.
pg_bot 3y ago
[flagged]
Anon_Is_Truth 3y ago
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deleted 3y ago
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hakdbha 3y ago
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cj 3y ago
As a YC alum who worked with Gary Tan directly, this is… odd. Anyone who knows Gary knows he’s a (relatively) gentle human being. I can’t imagine him hurting a fly. His tweets seem totally out of character compared to the Gary Tan I personally knew. Maybe he has changed? I’m inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt.
- deadbabe 3y ago
  There’s a lot of “gentle human beings” who have turned out to be horrific monsters in the end.
  - DonsDiscountGas 3y ago
    True in general, although tweeting a shitty thing once does not make a person a horrific monster, nor is the current moment "the end".
- deleted 3y ago
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- minimaxir 3y ago
  It's more the state of modern social media. Post Elon acquisition, many influential tech figures have discovered that being a provocateur on Twitter/X is more consistently successful at building an audience than genuine insight.
  - nojs 3y ago
    Post Elon acquisition? I mean Twitter has always been this.
    - EasyMark 3y ago
      In a way, but now you can make sure your bot's racist post makes it to the top for $8 a month
      - 3y ago
gogogo_allday 3y ago
I’m sorry but WTF? We can disagree on politics, but calling for the death of politicians publicly — especially as an influential member of an already regionally important company — is disgusting. This behavior cannot be tolerated. I don’t care how inebriated someone is. I say this as someone who worked for a YC company (that is still in business) for almost a decade.
badrequest 3y ago
> Tan, for his part, apologized over the weekend, noting that his post was a reference to a Tupac Shakur lyric Ah, so if it's a quote, it doesn't matter, because even though you've decided when to use them, they're not "your words" Thanks, going to publish press releases with Cannibal Corpse lyrics going forward.
- artyom 3y ago
  That sounds actually interesting
- renewiltord 3y ago
  You know, like a Che T-shirt doesn't mean you're endorsing the killing of political prisoners and stuff. Or that a George Washington statue endorses slavery. It's like a "you came at me but I'm going to beat you" lyric, not literally as Tupac meant it. Whatever, it's not intended to mean killing someone. But you have to be a colossal dumbfuck to say it like that to a bunch of people wise in the ways of the street political machine.
  - vidarh 3y ago
    Most people who see a Che t-shirt don't know who he was, only that his face shows up a lot. The problem isn't referencing something or someone, but doing so expecting those on the receiving end to know the reference and not take it at face value.
    - mcv 3y ago
      Yeah, I think there's a big difference between wearing Che's face, and posting a quote of Che where he ordered people to kill someone. One, without context, is just a face. The other, without context, promotes murder. Context matters of course, but so does the actual quote itself without the context.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - romwell 3y ago
lxe 3y ago
This is more of a classic lesson in what effect can alcohol have on one's life and career.
- futtureboomr 3y ago
  [dead]
- arduanika 3y ago
  Yeah. This is the most boring take on the story, but also probably the most correct, and definitely the most actionable for the rest of us.
- deleted 3y ago
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- jojobas 3y ago
  What effect? He's got fuck you money and can afford to do a Notch if he wanted.
  - reasonabl_human 3y ago
    What’s a Notch?
    - lxe 3y ago
      Notch is Markus Presson, the creator of Minecraft. He got $2.5 billion in cash from Microsoft when he sold it. In the years since he had a whole lot of controversial tweets, but that didn't' seem to affect him due to his wealth.
hughesjj 3y ago
I had no idea who Dan Preston was until Tan complained about him, but given > In 2022, Preston proposed a ballot measure to tax vacant housing in San Francisco. I think I might just love the guy. Thanks for the awareness campaign Garry!
- onepointsixC 3y ago
  Perhaps I could interest you in some rent control too.
  - Sabinus 3y ago
    Ruins market mechanisms too much. Taxing vacancies doesn't ruin the supply and demand equations.
    - tempsy 3y ago
      it unfairly punishes property owners in soft rental markets like the one we have now. i’ve seen an unusual number of multifamily properties listed all over SF last few months.
      - anigbrowl 3y ago
        The market is sending a price signal, wouldn't you say?
      - bsder 3y ago
        So? Then they need to lower the damn rent. This idea that rising property values is a God-given right needs to stop. Capitalism is supposed to work BOTH directions--up and down.
        tempsy 3y ago
        not sure what you’re talking about but rents in SF are still very much down vs 2019 market has demonstrated plenty it can lower rents as is
unobatbayar 3y ago
[flagged]
23B1 3y ago
You can't get drunk and tweet dumb shit as a CEO. You cannot remain CEO if you do. This is not a controversial position to have.
- srpablo 3y ago
  I happen to agree with you, but I'll note one _very_ celebrated CEO loved tweeting-while-inebriated so much he bought Twitter
ChrisArchitect 3y ago
Related yesterday discussion: Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's online rant spurs threats to supes, police reports https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39205676 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39205676
- 650REDHAIR 3y ago
  That thread was nuked from the front page after ~1 hour.
  - dang 3y ago
    Yes, users flagged it. We eventually reduced the penalty, though not enough for that thread to get back on the front page. The current thread, however, ended up spending 8 hours on the front page, far more than we'd ever normally allow for this class of story. Here are the explanations I've posted about this so far: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39231365 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39231365 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39224560 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39224560 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39210947 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39210947 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39172045 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39172045 If anyone reads those and still has a question which isn't answered there, I'd be happy to take a crack at it.
mp05 3y ago
"...two $32 bottles of Roederer Estate sparkling wine" I have half a dozen of these in my closet to get me through the month; is this supposed to be exorbitant? What's the point of talking about his reasonably modest stash we've been shown? Weird. $24.99 on sale y'all.
- smugma 3y ago
  I felt like they were trolling… super fancy whiskey and then sparkling white wine that you pick up at Lucky on sale.
  - mp05 3y ago
    Maybe? Savvy shoppers know that Roederer Estate is about the best bang for the buck sparkling wine on the entire planet. One thing is for sure is Mr Tan has good taste in booze and doesn't waste money on Veuve any other overpriced shit from Champagne.
  - caskstrength 3y ago
    > super fancy whiskey and then sparkling white wine that you pick up at Lucky on sale. Off the shelf Macallan and Balvenie bottles from his photo is what some Eastern European owner of chain of car repair shops would buy in duty free airport store when going to his annual Turkey or Egypt vacation, definitely not a "super fancy whisky" and a bad value for money.
    - mp05 3y ago
      Hilariously specific person you invented there, but I'd not sneer at someone offering me a glass of what appears to be a Balvenie that itself is old enough to drink. I happen to have a 12 year old version of that bottle but it wasn't even expensive enough to fuss over.
    - reducesuffering 3y ago
      Those are Balvenie 21 and Macallan 18, ~$300 amazing bottles of scotch whisky. They're not worth the $ (diminishing returns after $50 bourbon and $80 scotch), and are incredibly poor taste when you're in the midst of a political fight with people who campaign on rent control as to not get evicted... But they're great quality whisky.
shipscode 3y ago
[flagged]
- cocacola1 3y ago
  Lol thank goodness we’ve softened, then.
- meepmorp 3y ago
  I can picture you in Office Space, rapping along to Scarface while you drive to your software job. Gangsta af, yo.
whoswho 3y ago
Not to sound snarky but who is mission local and why should a reader of HN care for their opinion? Have they done a noteworthy op-ed? If so, which one?
- usea 3y ago
  Is that how you judge others' words? By what accomplishments they have?
  - latency-guy2 3y ago
    Yes? I definitely don't plan on treating someone's opinion on how to handle fleets of server racks worth $15k/unit equivalent to mine when they're a 19 year old underachiever who has written basic calculator apps for 2 years.
tlogan 3y ago
The level of corruption in California and San Francisco is astonishing and there is so many things to be fixed. It's essential to engage in constructive discourse and have a clear action plan that will kill corruption. For example, he has money and he can support investigative journalism to investigate corruption in building/renovation permit system, to investigate San Francisco SAFE corruption/fraud scandal, etc. But you should not tweet like this.
- jeffbee 3y ago
  "I will simply solve this corruption with money", said no successful civic reformer, ever. Rich people buying journalism is how SF got to be what it is today.
  - tlogan 3y ago
    We are doomed :( The situation with journalism, particularly in the context of investigating significant issues like the SF SAFE fraud scandal, presents a complex paradox that indeed feels disheartening at times. On one hand, the reluctance to financially support news outlets has led to a scarcity of resources for journalists, limiting their ability to conduct in-depth investigations. This trend compromises the quality of journalism, as reporters are pressed for time and resources, often resulting in superficial coverage of complex issues. On the other hand, the alternative – journalism funded by wealthy individuals or entities – raises concerns about bias and influence. When the financial backers of journalism have vested interests, there's a risk that the news could be slanted to serve those interests, potentially undermining the integrity and objectivity that are foundational to the profession.
tpmoney 3y ago
> He employs partisan and apocalyptic language, calling opponents “cronies,” “corrupt” or “doom loop accelerationists,” and claiming they want to “destroy public safety” and “ruin” or “destroy” the city. Whether it should be or not, this is basically par for the course for modern political discourse. What a weird line for the article.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
p-e-w 3y ago
> “It’s shameful,” added a Y Combinator alumnus who, like others, declined to be named for fear of professional retaliation. He has been checking the Y Combinator internal Slack and monitoring their daily email updates, but there has been “no communication” from the company, he said. If these things are true, it sounds like the problem goes a lot deeper than just the person at the top. Even putting aside any moral implications, it's strange to see a company of this caliber not immediately go into damage control mode orchestrated by PR professionals.
deleted 3y ago
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chmod775 3y ago
The tweet is to be taken about as literally as "fuck you", but unsurprisingly that fact is being gleefully ignored. It's getting old anyhow. Shouldn't the outrage crowd have found something new by now?
wannacboatmovie 3y ago
Garry and Elon. We have to get these two together. "Deep-pocketed donor to moderate politics" is the most milquetoast attempt at an insult I've ever read in print.
janalsncm 3y ago
I have a pitch for a new LLM that will read your tweet before you send it and warn you if it is offensive. $1000/month, half off if you’re a CEO.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- throwup238 3y ago
  Why would you charge a drunk CEO less?
  - meepmorp 3y ago
    Right? That's where you make the revenue in your freemium pricing model.
  - lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 3y ago
    Nobody’s buying at $1000/month but “giving them half off” makes them think they’re getting a deal. What they don’t know is they could just have a file on their computer named “is this offensive (open when drunk).txt” with contents that read “yes”.
    - hnaccount_rng 3y ago
      Um… there are liters lawyers and PR professionals that make their living with that kind of service. And for a certain personality type… I don’t see the 1k$/month being the relevant factor. I’d bet there would be buyers for that service. Though: Probably not enough to actually sustain the liability insurance that you’d need to deal with the complaints of a faulty product
      - b112 3y ago
        It's OK. If the client tries to write a nasty tweet about you, or email a lawyer about you, it will "help" the client, by telling them this is offensive and blocking the action. Doubly so if you try to uninstall it.
Animats 3y ago
We need drug testing for CEOs. Seriously. This is a duty of the board.
tonymet 3y ago
I’m happy because every time this happens, more people move to private conversations, and soon we will be back where we started.
quadhome 3y ago
Can we separate the art from the artist?
- chris_wot 3y ago
  He's an artist now, is he?
m3kw9 3y ago
These CEO coming out asking for Gary’s head is what cancel culture, woke culture, virtue signalling looks like all rolled in one.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
RVuRnvbM2e 3y ago
This situation reminds me of the opening scene in office space where Michael is rapping in his car but turns the music down and pauses when the guy selling flowers walks past. Of course, that wasn't public and Michael wasn't a CEO. Whoops.
SLWW 3y ago
I can't imagine why anyone cares what a CEO says in a few tweets? I was under the understanding that people actually work in this industry instead of playing these cliquey games of reputation or scraping through social media. (which is meaningless) Only real valuable piece of information that I can glean from any of this is further evidence of the amount of vultures in this community who will publicly lambast another for the crime of "going off" (drunk or not) and calling for them to resign. History shows these types to be narcissists; I for one hope whatever is going on with Garry, that he can get some help and continue on doing what he does best, and I don't care what he said if he was really drunk, the content doesn't really matter too much when you are hammered.
aaron695 3y ago
[dead]
molteanu 3y ago
I thought the US was the land of Free Speech. And yet, when a guy speaks his mind he's burned at the stake. Of what use is that freedom, then? Or do you have to be poor and uninteresting to exercise it? Or only in front of your own mirror? So many paradoxes. If the reference to Biden is the unacceptable one, I see President Biden daily expressing his thoughts on other world leaders, calling them names, saying who must die and who not, who is a good guy, who is a bad one. Is that Free Speech done right?
- lxgr 3y ago
  Freedom of speech in the US protects you from government prosecution for speech, not from the criticism of people that don’t agree with your speech.
  - molteanu 3y ago
    If the government abstains from prosecution, maybe the people should abstain from the practice too, then.
    - supertimor 3y ago
      So you don’t consider people’s criticisms of Tan free speech? Or does he only get that privilege?
      - molteanu 3y ago
        That's a good observation! But then, my criticism of the people's criticism of Tan's free speech is also criticized. And then we only get criticism of criticism and no actual productive dialogue. Or so it seems. Looks complicated. Where does it end?
  - latency-guy2 3y ago
    That's not what free speech is. It is a concept that lives far beyond what's written in a document. You can violate free speech all day every day in full view of the world and them having taken very articulate notes on your violations and not see a single day in court or jail.
electrondood 3y ago
These idiot child CEOs need to Google "noblesse oblige." Can you technically say whatever you want? Yes. Do you have an obligation to be aware that your position amplifies the words you choose? YES.
lucubratory 3y ago
Isn't this the same guy who is constantly whining about guillotine jokes on the left without reference to specific people being "deadly serious" calls to violence? And he's tweeting a list of 5+ politicians with "die slow motherfuckers"? I don't think the description of him as a "moderate" is accurate.
oneepic 3y ago
Of course he's probably getting kicked out of YC for this, but I still feel that most politicians (and tech leaders too, actually) say the same worthless points and don't really do much good in the world. In some ways, I'm more interested in Tan.
hackideiomat 3y ago
oh man I didn't know I'd hate this guy :D
stodor89 3y ago
There's plenty of things to be outraged about in our timeline. An immature "fuck you" tweet is not one of these.
casercaramel144 3y ago
Surely this is fine yes? I haven't met a single person that hasn't ever wished death upon someone. Emotionality is fine, we just have some ridiculous high standards for Garry since he's YC CEO.
- swiftcoder 3y ago
  Given that this sort of public outburst would be grounds for firing an employee at pretty much every tech firm, it only seems right to hold the CEO to the same standard of behaviour
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- devnonymous 3y ago
  It would be fine if it wasn't just a teensy bit hypocritical https://x.com/garrytan/status/1515225506450272256?s=20 https://x.com/garrytan/status/1515225506450272256?s=20
fooker 3y ago
So what? What's the point of being triggered by a phrase which is usually an idiom for venting about someone you don't agree with. Should we expect our CEOs to be robots?
paganel 3y ago
> “If the CEO of Boeing or Coca-Cola said, ‘I hope Joe Biden dies a slow death,’ someone would be like, ‘Oh, whoops, that wasn’t supposed to happen,’” he said. No, they just their customers dead, one way or another.
tempestn 3y ago
I'm a little bit aghast at all the comments saying this is normal or no big deal. Maybe it is normal (or at least common), but it shouldn't be. If you believe it's no big deal, I can't agree. I can see this kind of behaviour from adolescents, but adults should understand that words are meaningful and have consequences, and that even if you disagree with someone, they're still a human being who deserves some modicum of respect, or at least decency. Wishing a slow death on someone, even rhetorically, shows neither, to put it mildly.
- tedk-42 3y ago
  He's paraphrased 2pac is his alcohol fuelled moment "Fuck Mobb Deep, fuck Biggie Fuck Bad Boy as a staff, record label and as a motherfuckin' crew And if you want to be down with Bad Bo, then fuck you too Chino XL, fuck you too All you motherfuckers, fuck you too (take money, take money) All of y'all motherfuckers, fuck you, die slow, motherfucker" It's immature and poor judgement but he's apologised for it so I don't think it's fair to drag him down.
  - littlestymaar 3y ago
    > It's immature and poor judgement Which is enough to make him unfit for the position at YC and justifies his resignation. Walmart cashiers are being fired everyday for things like immaturity and poor judgment, why should YC CEO be held under lower behavior standards than blue collar workers?!
    - dspillett 3y ago
      To put it in a bit more context: this was out-of-hours, and those Walmart cashiers shouldn't be sacked for immaturity and poor judgement in their personal lives if their work is life is up to scratch. I know it is more complicated than that when your actions have wider reach, especially for someone as high up as a CEO, but for all of us these days with ubiquitous social media potentially giving us all more reach, as what you do in your off-time can negatively impact the company, and your position can lead to your stupid moments having far more impact on people generally. Even a grade A class 1 drunken cockup, in personal time, shouldn't result in a firing unless it is part of a larger or repeating pattern. IMO: he has taken ownership of his actions, accepted that they were stupid, apologies for causing office (and not in the “sorry you found it offensive” non-apology sort of way), etc, so : ridicule him by all means, but sacking seems OTT at this point. And if he does it, or something else similarly foolish, again, then we break out the pitchforks.
AtNightWeCode 3y ago
It was a bad tweet and some people should have an alcohol lock on their social media accounts. But to call it a death threat is just silly.
BSDobelix 3y ago
CEOs, politicians and anyone under the age of 16 should not be allowed to use social media. However, for politicians, CEO's and other "public figures" I would argue for an intermediary, let's call it the Ministry of Truth, to clean, revise and fact check all interactions with the public. With this, damage to stakeholders (of companies and political parties) can be done in a controlled manner, and an artist's public perception can be adjusted.
jwmoz 3y ago
When a nerd tries to reference Tupac.
ChildOfChaos 3y ago
The world has gone mad. Why such nonsense over a tweet. People can’t say anything anymore. There doesn’t need to be a response, people need to get on with there lives instead of what someone said while angry/drunk. Maybe it hasn’t been addressed because it doesn’t need too? Too much crap happens because of public pressure but it doesn’t exists, just ignore the idiots and get on with life. This is why the world is becoming so boring and mundane, nobody can have an opinion or say anything anymore, everything has to be ‘nice’ or PR speak so we can never have people actually be human beings.
jongjong 3y ago
What I've heard about Garry Tan so far suggests he is childish and out of touch. - He blocks random people on Twitter over the slightest disagreement. - He capriciously refused a once-in-ten-thousand-lifetimes offer from Peter Thiel for the safety of a steady paycheck at Microsoft. Someone who is that risk-averse really shouldn't be role-playing as Tupac. How can he be a role-model to the thousands of founders who typically take massive personal risks with no backup plan?
gardenhedge 3y ago
I honestly couldn't care less. Outrage from people with nothing better to do.
anonZ3PbJ8FR7Xg 3y ago
[flagged]
j4yav 3y ago
Does social media attract people with brain worms or does it cause the brain worms?
- throwawaaarrgh 3y ago
  ¿Porqué no los dos?
gibsonf1 3y ago
As an SF resident, its incredibly painful to watch the policy based destruction of such a great city (and state).
- bakchodi 3y ago
  Please don’t criticize our perfect and above reproach Progressives Wouldn’t want to have to write a hit piece about you, too :)
Mouthfeel 3y ago
[dead]
hyperliner 3y ago
There are way too many people here that can’t pass the opportunity to exercise selective outrage. And yes, the culture of decency died a long time ago.
crest 3y ago
I wonder if he accepts the same conduct targeted at him for example from those on his staff e.g. "Fuck my life. The CEO came in drunk again. I wish his liver would finally give out and make space for a CEO who deserves the title instead of this useless motherfucker." Would he consider that normal social media use or would he see it in a different light when its about him or done by gasp an underling?
spacebacon 3y ago
Technically we are all dying slow. If we are going to take his statement literally then we should consider how literal the entire statement is. We all “should die slow” as that is inherit to the human condition. Each breath we inhale is slowly oxidizing us from the inside out. If he said they should die fast I would be more concerned. If he said they should all die on x date at y place by z method then that is definitely more of a real threat than drunken word play for attention. “They should” also implies he has no intent of a threat. A threat would be more like “I will”.
- spacebacon 3y ago
  I take no side here in this factual statement yet welcome even more down votes from anyone that can’t regulate their emotional response beyond a down vote to a reasonable and objective analysis of his statement. Carry on with the downvoting. You are doing great!
sublinear 3y ago
> Tan “should not have done any of that. He should go for a while. He should not represent tech anymore,” I'd argue that anyone who cares this much should "go for a while". For over at least a decade now it's made no sense that we hold people in certain roles to a higher standard than anyone else. These high standards are a form of power transfer that hurts those who believe in them. Can't we just admit we're all human?
- VikingCoder 3y ago
  We are all human, yes. And when there's a leadership role, there are multiple people who are qualified. It's okay to express your preference that the leadership role be filled by someone who doesn't go on a public, drunken, life-threatening rant.
  - sublinear 3y ago
    It's also okay to express your preference that the role be filled by someone who didn't get there by drumming up the media and casting aspersions.
- suslik 3y ago
  Does he actually "represents tech"? I am really not sure about that.
  - JohnFen 3y ago
    He doesn't represent "tech". He is one of the major figures who represents SV/SF tech culture, though.
greenie_beans 3y ago
one time i was on twitter and some asshole was tweeting mean, stupid stuff and i was like who is this asshole? what is e/acc? and then i realized he was the president of YC and it made me sad. and then i learned more about e/acc and i decided how dumb that shit is
srackey 3y ago
Who knew Garry Tan was this based!
- replwoacause 3y ago
  Not based. Foolhardy.
iainctduncan 3y ago
Whether he should have said it on moral grounds is one question, and whether it is indicative of handling part of the CEO's job very poorly is another. The CEO is the public face of a company - that is literally part of the job. He did this abysmally, and in many, many companies, it would be enough for a board to sack him. The CEO doesn't get a firewall between their personal life and work, or a pass for off work behaviour. They get paid to live it. I work in diligence on medium stage companies and the acquirer wondering if they have to ditch some of the current exectutive is very common. (I know nothing about the ownership of YC mind you.)
replwoacause 3y ago
I don’t know much about YC lore, but pg seemed like a pretty “buttoned up” person, and then came Altman and Tan, more freewheeling loose cannon types. Is that right?Is that just the new ilk for this generation of tech leaders?
- dluan 3y ago
  PG had a rule of no politics, even though he made many political donations and made unjustful imprisonment and overturning the death penalty one of his pet projects. Michael Seibel, Geoff Ralston, and Sam Altman were all very apolitical CEOs. Sam was the most, but usually it was only general/presidential election stuff. YC also does some lobbying with investors like Ron Conway, who in the past has supported gun control policy. Garry Tan is the only YC CEO with insanely thin skin.
qgin 3y ago
Note to everyone making death threats: just make sure to quote music, film, or theater in your threats. You’ll be protected from prosecution but your recipient will still get the message.
nohat 3y ago
It was a stupid and shameful tweet. The thing that elevates this above a drunk tweet though are the "real life" postcards. Should we ignore the fact that the postcards seem very much a false flag?
RickJWagner 3y ago
Following the model set by the likes of Jim Carrey, Robert De Niro, etc. It's high time we do recognize this as unacceptable speech.
randal_handle 3y ago
This is fine.
randal_handle 3y ago
This is fine. Not great, but it is fine.
rmrf100 3y ago
I don't think this' a big deal.

431 points by Stratoscope 3y ago

This sort of discourse would be flagged, moderated and possibly result in a ban here on HN. His actions seem to undermine a lot of what this community is meant to be about.

infamouscow 3y ago
[flagged]
- mjhay 3y ago
  You do realize that the first amendment protects individuals from prosecution for protected speech, right? It does not guarantee protection from professional or social consequences. For some reason this distinction is very hard to understand for people of certain political stripes. Regardless, death threats are not protected under the first amendment, so you're even wrong under your idiotic assumptions of how the law works.
  - infamouscow 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - meepmorp 3y ago
      > I sincerely wish the worst things imaginable for these activist journalists. They are the enemy of the people. This is unironically the kind of shit that authoritarians love to say about journalists.
      - infamouscow 3y ago
        That's an association fallacy and doesn't make it any less true.
        meepmorp 3y ago
        Your palpable anger at people who say things you don't like isn't helping your case. Maybe you made a fallacy fallacy.
      - zoklet-enjoyer 3y ago
        Most journalists are just propogandists and misinformed people stating option as fact. I don't understand why anyone holds them in high regard. Like yeah, there are many great individual journalists who take their job seriously and get real information out to people, but for the most part, no.
cdchn 3y ago
Rules for thee, not for me.
minimaxir 3y ago
Hacker News has been pretty insulated from Y Combinator as an institution over the years. Nowadays, I'm impressed by that.
infotainment 3y ago
Sure, and that would be the system working as intended. I choose to post everything under random dictionary word pseudonyms just in case one of my hot takes is slightly too spicy. His real mistake was posting under his real name IMO.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
zzzeek 3y ago
Well unless you tell the mods you were drunk, apparently. Then they shrug and say "well what can you do! It was the alcohol talking, not them "
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]

justina20 3y ago

[dead]

threeseed 3y ago

I hope YC quickly moves on from Garry Tan. This sort of childish behaviour is not just dragging YC down but the startup community as a whole.

pm90 3y ago
Agreed. SF politics is profoundly broken, and many of the Supervisors are sclerotic and out of touch. But wishing death on them publicly is very very serious.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
justin66 3y ago
It's worse than childish. The people called out in that bizarre tweet would probably have a conversation with their staff or the police about whether they or their families are in any kind of danger from this apparently popular guy wishing death upon them from the internet, or perhaps from one of his idiot followers. They might not know much about where Tan is coming from, but they know they work in a building where Moscone and Milk were assassinated.
- colechristensen 3y ago
  They would be perfectly reasonable to hire private security and sue Tan for damages to pay for that and whatever other measures that seem prudent for their own protection along with the pain and suffering that goes along with the very reasonable fear this tweet and its effects caused. What he wrote was more or less the limit to what you can say before it becomes a serious crime.
minimaxir 3y ago
I wonder how many startup founders nowadays refuse to join an accelerator/take VC money due of the people leading it.
- 3y ago

zombiwoof 3y ago

[flagged]

rayiner 3y ago

> Tan, for his part, apologized over the weekend, noting that his post was a reference to a Tupac Shakur lyric How famous does someone have to be joke about a politician dying before it’s a problem? Tan is less famous than Charlie Sheen or Johnny Depp, who have joked about Trump dying. Also, from Wikipedia: “Tan supported the 2022 recall campaign against progressive San Francisco District Attorney Chesa Boudin. Tan donated at least $100,000 to the effort. Tan blamed Boudin for physical attacks on Asians.” There’s a fair argument that Tan is joking about violence against people whose policies are facilitating actual violence.

colechristensen 3y ago
It wasn’t a joke, I don’t believe anyone can read it and think he was trying to be funny. I doubt he meant it particularly literally, but there’s little question it was written with malice.
ekimehtor 3y ago
Well I'm not famous but I will tell a joke about it politician. And remember Comedy equals tragedy plus time… Apart from the ending how was the show mrs. Lincoln?
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
roenxi 3y ago
Not famous at all, really. It'd be reasonable (and good) to have a standard where people don't wish violence on their political opponents. Possibly even where cooperating with people they don't like is an option. Opponents of Trump please take note. However, after acknowledging that Tan shouldn't have done this, it doesn't look serious. Drunken rants on Twitter are not important in and of themselves.
threeseed 3y ago
Tan said he was drunk and apologised for his statements. Instead of oddly defending them maybe you should follow his lead and not act like saying someone should die slowly is a joke. Especially in this world where politicians have been subjected to credible death threats.

anonreeeeplor 3y ago

[flagged]

spacecadet 3y ago
[flagged]
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
stevenAthompson 3y ago
[flagged]
jpoijw 3y ago
[dead]
christoph 3y ago
It’s not just California, just look at almost anywhere. Same story across the UK - taxes and prices ever increase, quality of everything and every service continues to decline. The greed and corruption on display by nearly all politicians is beyond brazen. Lucrative contracts for friends that deliver no value, insider trading, tax avoidance, offshore accounts, communicating government business on burner phones, deleting emails, fiddling expenses, huge infrastructure projects running vastly over budget then being cancelled, etc. What amazes me is how few realise the level of outright theft of their own hard earned money, and seek some form of comfort in blaming the other side, believing their team will fix it next time. There are even some that try to put it down to incompetence. The corruption is now so deeply rooted and endemic throughout all of society, government and media it’s impossible to know where rooting it out could ever start and end. So probably the only way to turn the tide is for everyday hard working people to start rejecting it and rejecting to support it in any way, shape or form, everyday throughout their own lives. No single person or group can fix this and any claiming to be able to is both a liar and a fraud.
- anonreeeeplor 3y ago
  The entire administrative class needs to be flattened and replaced with doers. ZIRP phenomenon. The doers are checking out, entire system designed to discriminate against talent.

ekimehtor 3y ago

"these tech Bros should die a slow death" –venture capitalist "Will no one rid me of this turbulent priest?" –King Henry VII "he's dead now so that's that" –Microsoft founder

gfodor 3y ago

You'd never guess that this was a Tupac quote by the media coverage and wave after wave of forced outrage. The whole thing is so embarassing.

ekimehtor 3y ago
Thank goodness it wasn't a quote from the song W.A.P.:-)!
colechristensen 3y ago
“Die slow motherfuckers” Tupac wasn’t kidding or putting on a show. He was killed by the people he refers to there not long after. Tupac meant those words literally.
davesque 3y ago
I don't see how it makes it any better that it was a quote. The quote still had words in it. Does Garry Tan think the entire world listens to Tupac? And what wisdom does Tupac really have to offer in this case?
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- Our_Benefactors 3y ago
  > Does Garry Tan think the entire world listens to Tupac? Ever met a Tupac fan? They do seem to think this, yes.
- gfodor 3y ago
  I mean, if someone says something like that and they’re conjuring it up directly or they’re quoting a piece of art, I think that’s obviously relevant to interpreting it. Without taking a position on how severe to interpret it, it’s plainly obvious this important detail is glossed over and ignored and the media coverage of this is desperately trying to leave readers walking away thinking this was a more direct straightforward statement not subject to interpretation of how much to take it at face value.

chrisbolt 3y ago

Previous: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39205676 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39205676

gurchik 3y ago
I read HN probably more than I should, and I was pretty surprised to see this has over 500 comments and I didn't see it at all. Turns out it was only on the frontpage for 1 hr. https://hnrankings.info/39205676/ https://hnrankings.info/39205676/
- Macha 3y ago
  The way HN is set up, having 500 comments would have contributed to that. The "flamewar detector" the mods sometimes mention seems to take comments/votes and comments/time into consideration then penalises threads.
  - throwawaaarrgh 3y ago
    Yep. The HN users see is highly curated. Mostly by algorithms, sometimes by humans.
    - jpoijw 3y ago
      [dead]
    - dang 3y ago
      You're right. Here's 10 years' worth of me explaining that: https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=by%3Adang%20hn%20curated%20site&sort=byDate&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...
  - Brajeshwar 3y ago
    Yes, this is correct from my observation, too. The comment-to-vote ratios go fast; up south, they will likely be out of the pages quickly. One might think that a post that falls off the homepage would linger on page 2 for a while, but it can be out of even the first 100 posts fast. I have stopped thinking about HN's algorithms and just let it do its job.

762236 3y ago

I can find lots of tech workers that would tell Garry to keep up the good work.

cdchn 3y ago

That plaque on his Chinatown VIP club liquor cabinet really is pretty cringe. 'Added District 1 Supervisor Connie Chan: “I will waive rent for living in his head.”' Absolutely savage clapback.

tpmoney 3y ago
Doesn’t the phrase “living rent free in your head” refer to someone being preoccupied with another individual with whom they have a disagreement to an unhealthy degree? You can’t waive rent if you’re the one doing the living, and by definition if someone is letting someone else “live rent free” in their head, the rent is already waived. Without any commentary on the rest of this (because I have no idea what’s actually going on), unless this is referring to something other than the common idiom, no this is actually a lousy clapback because it completely misunderstands the idiom.
- cdchn 3y ago
  They were riffing on the idiom. You're taking the idiom too literally.
  - card_zero 3y ago
    Like when Biff Tannen says "why don't you make like a tree and get outta here?", that kind of riffing on the idiom, riffing on it like that.
    - Rapzid 3y ago
      Too clever by 50%
- OJFord 3y ago
  I suppose if they're thinking like if any third party wants to get in his head, they will declare rent is not due (waive seems wrong not just if you're living but in general if you're not the landlord) - which kind of works because of their position I think (but I'm not from the US so I don't really understand or want to bother looking into it), but yeah we've probably both thought about it too much and more than they did before posting as a quick joke at this point.

mjhay 3y ago

IMO, it is bad to threaten people with painful deaths. Apparently that is a controversial opinion within this community.

justin66 3y ago
You're not heterodox enough, apparently.
monero-xmr 3y ago
It isn’t illegal to say what he said but it’s not the right tone for his position. The slow drop into political violence begins with speech normalizing calling for death and murder. I just hope everyone outraged analyzes their own speech. I hold a lot of opinions outside the bounds of cocktail conversation, but I was having cocktails with my (blue city, professional) friends and they made a joke about someone needing to assassinate a certain right wing presidential candidate and everyone laughed really hard. The way she said it was funny and I laughed along but it’s easy to have outrage when you want it.
- andsoitis 3y ago
  Assuming the report of what he wrote is true… What he said won’t cause someone to kill any of those people. Thats just nonsense. However, ranting drunk and incoherent publicly as the CEO of company shows terrible character.
- asveikau 3y ago
  > The slow drop into political violence begins with speech normalizing calling for death and murder. I have seen this a lot lately in online discussions of homelessness and people accused of crime. It's very unsettling. That is the context of why Mr Tan wrote that -- there's a popular narrative that specific individuals are complicit in crime and homelessness in San Francisco. This leads to lots of ad hominem and in my view rises to the level of conspiracy theory in many -- it's not like every problem is the fault of a single office holder or even a "cabal" of them. Voting against someone or supporting different candidates is one thing. Calling them solely responsible for all that you consider evil, escalating to the level of death threats, is quite another. And that's just politicians. It's also routine to see people call for violence on homeless people or people accused of crime.

subarctic 3y ago

What's the best way to go read the actual tweets, rather than an article about them? I'm guessing he's deleted them by now.

mcintyre1994 3y ago
This article has a screenshot: https://missionlocal.org/2024/01/garry-tan-death-wish-sf-supervisors/ https://missionlocal.org/2024/01/garry-tan-death-wish-sf-sup...

infamouscow 3y ago

[flagged]

snakeyjake 3y ago
When you write comments like what Tan said on hn, some milquetoast fuckface nukes your comment. Freedom for me but not for thee. "Oh but that's differe.." fuck off
- namaria 3y ago
  Ah I see you're just a troll.
- dang 3y ago
  HN is different from Twitter. The reason users (correctly) flag such comments here is that we're trying for a specific kind of site (https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html). One thing I often say (to a certain type of commenter) is that this isn't an ethical or moral rule—it's more like a game. Different games have different rules. If you're playing chess you don't get to tackle the bishop. Think of the site guidelines like game rules, not a moral code.
publius_0xf3 3y ago
>This is nothing more than activist journalists hating successful people for leading a stand against a self-destructive ideology ruining lives. There's plenty of people in this very thread who profess a sympathy for Tan's causes but think his drunken remarks are deplorable and reflect poorly on him, even if not legally actionable. I'm among them. Wagon-circling is a sad pathology of politics. Nobility requires that we rise above it.
- mistermann 3y ago
  So too with the premature formation of conclusions.

pg_bot 3y ago

[flagged]

Anon_Is_Truth 3y ago

[dead]

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

hakdbha 3y ago

[dead]

cj 3y ago

As a YC alum who worked with Gary Tan directly, this is… odd. Anyone who knows Gary knows he’s a (relatively) gentle human being. I can’t imagine him hurting a fly. His tweets seem totally out of character compared to the Gary Tan I personally knew. Maybe he has changed? I’m inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt.

deadbabe 3y ago
There’s a lot of “gentle human beings” who have turned out to be horrific monsters in the end.
- DonsDiscountGas 3y ago
  True in general, although tweeting a shitty thing once does not make a person a horrific monster, nor is the current moment "the end".
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
minimaxir 3y ago
It's more the state of modern social media. Post Elon acquisition, many influential tech figures have discovered that being a provocateur on Twitter/X is more consistently successful at building an audience than genuine insight.
- nojs 3y ago
  Post Elon acquisition? I mean Twitter has always been this.
  - EasyMark 3y ago
    In a way, but now you can make sure your bot's racist post makes it to the top for $8 a month
    - 3y ago

gogogo_allday 3y ago

I’m sorry but WTF? We can disagree on politics, but calling for the death of politicians publicly — especially as an influential member of an already regionally important company — is disgusting. This behavior cannot be tolerated. I don’t care how inebriated someone is. I say this as someone who worked for a YC company (that is still in business) for almost a decade.

badrequest 3y ago

> Tan, for his part, apologized over the weekend, noting that his post was a reference to a Tupac Shakur lyric Ah, so if it's a quote, it doesn't matter, because even though you've decided when to use them, they're not "your words" Thanks, going to publish press releases with Cannibal Corpse lyrics going forward.

artyom 3y ago
That sounds actually interesting
renewiltord 3y ago
You know, like a Che T-shirt doesn't mean you're endorsing the killing of political prisoners and stuff. Or that a George Washington statue endorses slavery. It's like a "you came at me but I'm going to beat you" lyric, not literally as Tupac meant it. Whatever, it's not intended to mean killing someone. But you have to be a colossal dumbfuck to say it like that to a bunch of people wise in the ways of the street political machine.
- vidarh 3y ago
  Most people who see a Che t-shirt don't know who he was, only that his face shows up a lot. The problem isn't referencing something or someone, but doing so expecting those on the receiving end to know the reference and not take it at face value.
  - mcv 3y ago
    Yeah, I think there's a big difference between wearing Che's face, and posting a quote of Che where he ordered people to kill someone. One, without context, is just a face. The other, without context, promotes murder. Context matters of course, but so does the actual quote itself without the context.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- romwell 3y ago

lxe 3y ago

This is more of a classic lesson in what effect can alcohol have on one's life and career.

futtureboomr 3y ago
[dead]
arduanika 3y ago
Yeah. This is the most boring take on the story, but also probably the most correct, and definitely the most actionable for the rest of us.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
jojobas 3y ago
What effect? He's got fuck you money and can afford to do a Notch if he wanted.
- reasonabl_human 3y ago
  What’s a Notch?
  - lxe 3y ago
    Notch is Markus Presson, the creator of Minecraft. He got $2.5 billion in cash from Microsoft when he sold it. In the years since he had a whole lot of controversial tweets, but that didn't' seem to affect him due to his wealth.

hughesjj 3y ago

I had no idea who Dan Preston was until Tan complained about him, but given > In 2022, Preston proposed a ballot measure to tax vacant housing in San Francisco. I think I might just love the guy. Thanks for the awareness campaign Garry!

onepointsixC 3y ago
Perhaps I could interest you in some rent control too.
- Sabinus 3y ago
  Ruins market mechanisms too much. Taxing vacancies doesn't ruin the supply and demand equations.
  - tempsy 3y ago
    it unfairly punishes property owners in soft rental markets like the one we have now. i’ve seen an unusual number of multifamily properties listed all over SF last few months.
    - anigbrowl 3y ago
      The market is sending a price signal, wouldn't you say?
    - bsder 3y ago
      So? Then they need to lower the damn rent. This idea that rising property values is a God-given right needs to stop. Capitalism is supposed to work BOTH directions--up and down.
      - tempsy 3y ago
        not sure what you’re talking about but rents in SF are still very much down vs 2019 market has demonstrated plenty it can lower rents as is

unobatbayar 3y ago

[flagged]

23B1 3y ago

You can't get drunk and tweet dumb shit as a CEO. You cannot remain CEO if you do. This is not a controversial position to have.

srpablo 3y ago
I happen to agree with you, but I'll note one _very_ celebrated CEO loved tweeting-while-inebriated so much he bought Twitter

ChrisArchitect 3y ago

Related yesterday discussion: Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's online rant spurs threats to supes, police reports https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39205676 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39205676

650REDHAIR 3y ago
That thread was nuked from the front page after ~1 hour.
- dang 3y ago
  Yes, users flagged it. We eventually reduced the penalty, though not enough for that thread to get back on the front page. The current thread, however, ended up spending 8 hours on the front page, far more than we'd ever normally allow for this class of story. Here are the explanations I've posted about this so far: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39231365 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39231365 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39224560 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39224560 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39210947 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39210947 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39172045 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39172045 If anyone reads those and still has a question which isn't answered there, I'd be happy to take a crack at it.

mp05 3y ago

"...two $32 bottles of Roederer Estate sparkling wine" I have half a dozen of these in my closet to get me through the month; is this supposed to be exorbitant? What's the point of talking about his reasonably modest stash we've been shown? Weird. $24.99 on sale y'all.

smugma 3y ago
I felt like they were trolling… super fancy whiskey and then sparkling white wine that you pick up at Lucky on sale.
- mp05 3y ago
  Maybe? Savvy shoppers know that Roederer Estate is about the best bang for the buck sparkling wine on the entire planet. One thing is for sure is Mr Tan has good taste in booze and doesn't waste money on Veuve any other overpriced shit from Champagne.
- caskstrength 3y ago
  > super fancy whiskey and then sparkling white wine that you pick up at Lucky on sale. Off the shelf Macallan and Balvenie bottles from his photo is what some Eastern European owner of chain of car repair shops would buy in duty free airport store when going to his annual Turkey or Egypt vacation, definitely not a "super fancy whisky" and a bad value for money.
  - mp05 3y ago
    Hilariously specific person you invented there, but I'd not sneer at someone offering me a glass of what appears to be a Balvenie that itself is old enough to drink. I happen to have a 12 year old version of that bottle but it wasn't even expensive enough to fuss over.
  - reducesuffering 3y ago
    Those are Balvenie 21 and Macallan 18, ~$300 amazing bottles of scotch whisky. They're not worth the $ (diminishing returns after $50 bourbon and $80 scotch), and are incredibly poor taste when you're in the midst of a political fight with people who campaign on rent control as to not get evicted... But they're great quality whisky.

shipscode 3y ago

[flagged]

cocacola1 3y ago
Lol thank goodness we’ve softened, then.
meepmorp 3y ago
I can picture you in Office Space, rapping along to Scarface while you drive to your software job. Gangsta af, yo.

whoswho 3y ago

Not to sound snarky but who is mission local and why should a reader of HN care for their opinion? Have they done a noteworthy op-ed? If so, which one?

usea 3y ago
Is that how you judge others' words? By what accomplishments they have?
- latency-guy2 3y ago
  Yes? I definitely don't plan on treating someone's opinion on how to handle fleets of server racks worth $15k/unit equivalent to mine when they're a 19 year old underachiever who has written basic calculator apps for 2 years.

tlogan 3y ago

The level of corruption in California and San Francisco is astonishing and there is so many things to be fixed. It's essential to engage in constructive discourse and have a clear action plan that will kill corruption. For example, he has money and he can support investigative journalism to investigate corruption in building/renovation permit system, to investigate San Francisco SAFE corruption/fraud scandal, etc. But you should not tweet like this.

jeffbee 3y ago
"I will simply solve this corruption with money", said no successful civic reformer, ever. Rich people buying journalism is how SF got to be what it is today.
- tlogan 3y ago
  We are doomed :( The situation with journalism, particularly in the context of investigating significant issues like the SF SAFE fraud scandal, presents a complex paradox that indeed feels disheartening at times. On one hand, the reluctance to financially support news outlets has led to a scarcity of resources for journalists, limiting their ability to conduct in-depth investigations. This trend compromises the quality of journalism, as reporters are pressed for time and resources, often resulting in superficial coverage of complex issues. On the other hand, the alternative – journalism funded by wealthy individuals or entities – raises concerns about bias and influence. When the financial backers of journalism have vested interests, there's a risk that the news could be slanted to serve those interests, potentially undermining the integrity and objectivity that are foundational to the profession.

tpmoney 3y ago

> He employs partisan and apocalyptic language, calling opponents “cronies,” “corrupt” or “doom loop accelerationists,” and claiming they want to “destroy public safety” and “ruin” or “destroy” the city. Whether it should be or not, this is basically par for the course for modern political discourse. What a weird line for the article.

deleted 3y ago
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p-e-w 3y ago

> “It’s shameful,” added a Y Combinator alumnus who, like others, declined to be named for fear of professional retaliation. He has been checking the Y Combinator internal Slack and monitoring their daily email updates, but there has been “no communication” from the company, he said. If these things are true, it sounds like the problem goes a lot deeper than just the person at the top. Even putting aside any moral implications, it's strange to see a company of this caliber not immediately go into damage control mode orchestrated by PR professionals.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

chmod775 3y ago

The tweet is to be taken about as literally as "fuck you", but unsurprisingly that fact is being gleefully ignored. It's getting old anyhow. Shouldn't the outrage crowd have found something new by now?

wannacboatmovie 3y ago

Garry and Elon. We have to get these two together. "Deep-pocketed donor to moderate politics" is the most milquetoast attempt at an insult I've ever read in print.

janalsncm 3y ago

I have a pitch for a new LLM that will read your tweet before you send it and warn you if it is offensive. $1000/month, half off if you’re a CEO.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
throwup238 3y ago
Why would you charge a drunk CEO less?
- meepmorp 3y ago
  Right? That's where you make the revenue in your freemium pricing model.
- lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 3y ago
  Nobody’s buying at $1000/month but “giving them half off” makes them think they’re getting a deal. What they don’t know is they could just have a file on their computer named “is this offensive (open when drunk).txt” with contents that read “yes”.
  - hnaccount_rng 3y ago
    Um… there are liters lawyers and PR professionals that make their living with that kind of service. And for a certain personality type… I don’t see the 1k$/month being the relevant factor. I’d bet there would be buyers for that service. Though: Probably not enough to actually sustain the liability insurance that you’d need to deal with the complaints of a faulty product
    - b112 3y ago
      It's OK. If the client tries to write a nasty tweet about you, or email a lawyer about you, it will "help" the client, by telling them this is offensive and blocking the action. Doubly so if you try to uninstall it.

Animats 3y ago

We need drug testing for CEOs. Seriously. This is a duty of the board.

tonymet 3y ago

I’m happy because every time this happens, more people move to private conversations, and soon we will be back where we started.

quadhome 3y ago

Can we separate the art from the artist?

chris_wot 3y ago
He's an artist now, is he?

m3kw9 3y ago

These CEO coming out asking for Gary’s head is what cancel culture, woke culture, virtue signalling looks like all rolled in one.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

RVuRnvbM2e 3y ago

This situation reminds me of the opening scene in office space where Michael is rapping in his car but turns the music down and pauses when the guy selling flowers walks past. Of course, that wasn't public and Michael wasn't a CEO. Whoops.

SLWW 3y ago

I can't imagine why anyone cares what a CEO says in a few tweets? I was under the understanding that people actually work in this industry instead of playing these cliquey games of reputation or scraping through social media. (which is meaningless) Only real valuable piece of information that I can glean from any of this is further evidence of the amount of vultures in this community who will publicly lambast another for the crime of "going off" (drunk or not) and calling for them to resign. History shows these types to be narcissists; I for one hope whatever is going on with Garry, that he can get some help and continue on doing what he does best, and I don't care what he said if he was really drunk, the content doesn't really matter too much when you are hammered.

aaron695 3y ago

[dead]

molteanu 3y ago

I thought the US was the land of Free Speech. And yet, when a guy speaks his mind he's burned at the stake. Of what use is that freedom, then? Or do you have to be poor and uninteresting to exercise it? Or only in front of your own mirror? So many paradoxes. If the reference to Biden is the unacceptable one, I see President Biden daily expressing his thoughts on other world leaders, calling them names, saying who must die and who not, who is a good guy, who is a bad one. Is that Free Speech done right?

lxgr 3y ago
Freedom of speech in the US protects you from government prosecution for speech, not from the criticism of people that don’t agree with your speech.
- molteanu 3y ago
  If the government abstains from prosecution, maybe the people should abstain from the practice too, then.
  - supertimor 3y ago
    So you don’t consider people’s criticisms of Tan free speech? Or does he only get that privilege?
    - molteanu 3y ago
      That's a good observation! But then, my criticism of the people's criticism of Tan's free speech is also criticized. And then we only get criticism of criticism and no actual productive dialogue. Or so it seems. Looks complicated. Where does it end?
- latency-guy2 3y ago
  That's not what free speech is. It is a concept that lives far beyond what's written in a document. You can violate free speech all day every day in full view of the world and them having taken very articulate notes on your violations and not see a single day in court or jail.

electrondood 3y ago

These idiot child CEOs need to Google "noblesse oblige." Can you technically say whatever you want? Yes. Do you have an obligation to be aware that your position amplifies the words you choose? YES.

lucubratory 3y ago

Isn't this the same guy who is constantly whining about guillotine jokes on the left without reference to specific people being "deadly serious" calls to violence? And he's tweeting a list of 5+ politicians with "die slow motherfuckers"? I don't think the description of him as a "moderate" is accurate.

oneepic 3y ago

Of course he's probably getting kicked out of YC for this, but I still feel that most politicians (and tech leaders too, actually) say the same worthless points and don't really do much good in the world. In some ways, I'm more interested in Tan.

hackideiomat 3y ago

oh man I didn't know I'd hate this guy :D

stodor89 3y ago

There's plenty of things to be outraged about in our timeline. An immature "fuck you" tweet is not one of these.

casercaramel144 3y ago

Surely this is fine yes? I haven't met a single person that hasn't ever wished death upon someone. Emotionality is fine, we just have some ridiculous high standards for Garry since he's YC CEO.

swiftcoder 3y ago
Given that this sort of public outburst would be grounds for firing an employee at pretty much every tech firm, it only seems right to hold the CEO to the same standard of behaviour
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
devnonymous 3y ago
It would be fine if it wasn't just a teensy bit hypocritical https://x.com/garrytan/status/1515225506450272256?s=20 https://x.com/garrytan/status/1515225506450272256?s=20

fooker 3y ago

So what? What's the point of being triggered by a phrase which is usually an idiom for venting about someone you don't agree with. Should we expect our CEOs to be robots?

paganel 3y ago

> “If the CEO of Boeing or Coca-Cola said, ‘I hope Joe Biden dies a slow death,’ someone would be like, ‘Oh, whoops, that wasn’t supposed to happen,’” he said. No, they just their customers dead, one way or another.

tempestn 3y ago

I'm a little bit aghast at all the comments saying this is normal or no big deal. Maybe it is normal (or at least common), but it shouldn't be. If you believe it's no big deal, I can't agree. I can see this kind of behaviour from adolescents, but adults should understand that words are meaningful and have consequences, and that even if you disagree with someone, they're still a human being who deserves some modicum of respect, or at least decency. Wishing a slow death on someone, even rhetorically, shows neither, to put it mildly.

tedk-42 3y ago
He's paraphrased 2pac is his alcohol fuelled moment "Fuck Mobb Deep, fuck Biggie Fuck Bad Boy as a staff, record label and as a motherfuckin' crew And if you want to be down with Bad Bo, then fuck you too Chino XL, fuck you too All you motherfuckers, fuck you too (take money, take money) All of y'all motherfuckers, fuck you, die slow, motherfucker" It's immature and poor judgement but he's apologised for it so I don't think it's fair to drag him down.
- littlestymaar 3y ago
  > It's immature and poor judgement Which is enough to make him unfit for the position at YC and justifies his resignation. Walmart cashiers are being fired everyday for things like immaturity and poor judgment, why should YC CEO be held under lower behavior standards than blue collar workers?!
  - dspillett 3y ago
    To put it in a bit more context: this was out-of-hours, and those Walmart cashiers shouldn't be sacked for immaturity and poor judgement in their personal lives if their work is life is up to scratch. I know it is more complicated than that when your actions have wider reach, especially for someone as high up as a CEO, but for all of us these days with ubiquitous social media potentially giving us all more reach, as what you do in your off-time can negatively impact the company, and your position can lead to your stupid moments having far more impact on people generally. Even a grade A class 1 drunken cockup, in personal time, shouldn't result in a firing unless it is part of a larger or repeating pattern. IMO: he has taken ownership of his actions, accepted that they were stupid, apologies for causing office (and not in the “sorry you found it offensive” non-apology sort of way), etc, so : ridicule him by all means, but sacking seems OTT at this point. And if he does it, or something else similarly foolish, again, then we break out the pitchforks.

AtNightWeCode 3y ago

It was a bad tweet and some people should have an alcohol lock on their social media accounts. But to call it a death threat is just silly.

BSDobelix 3y ago

CEOs, politicians and anyone under the age of 16 should not be allowed to use social media. However, for politicians, CEO's and other "public figures" I would argue for an intermediary, let's call it the Ministry of Truth, to clean, revise and fact check all interactions with the public. With this, damage to stakeholders (of companies and political parties) can be done in a controlled manner, and an artist's public perception can be adjusted.

jwmoz 3y ago

When a nerd tries to reference Tupac.

ChildOfChaos 3y ago

The world has gone mad. Why such nonsense over a tweet. People can’t say anything anymore. There doesn’t need to be a response, people need to get on with there lives instead of what someone said while angry/drunk. Maybe it hasn’t been addressed because it doesn’t need too? Too much crap happens because of public pressure but it doesn’t exists, just ignore the idiots and get on with life. This is why the world is becoming so boring and mundane, nobody can have an opinion or say anything anymore, everything has to be ‘nice’ or PR speak so we can never have people actually be human beings.

jongjong 3y ago

What I've heard about Garry Tan so far suggests he is childish and out of touch. - He blocks random people on Twitter over the slightest disagreement. - He capriciously refused a once-in-ten-thousand-lifetimes offer from Peter Thiel for the safety of a steady paycheck at Microsoft. Someone who is that risk-averse really shouldn't be role-playing as Tupac. How can he be a role-model to the thousands of founders who typically take massive personal risks with no backup plan?

gardenhedge 3y ago

I honestly couldn't care less. Outrage from people with nothing better to do.

anonZ3PbJ8FR7Xg 3y ago

[flagged]

j4yav 3y ago

Does social media attract people with brain worms or does it cause the brain worms?

throwawaaarrgh 3y ago
¿Porqué no los dos?

gibsonf1 3y ago

As an SF resident, its incredibly painful to watch the policy based destruction of such a great city (and state).

bakchodi 3y ago
Please don’t criticize our perfect and above reproach Progressives Wouldn’t want to have to write a hit piece about you, too :)

Mouthfeel 3y ago

[dead]

hyperliner 3y ago

There are way too many people here that can’t pass the opportunity to exercise selective outrage. And yes, the culture of decency died a long time ago.

crest 3y ago

I wonder if he accepts the same conduct targeted at him for example from those on his staff e.g. "Fuck my life. The CEO came in drunk again. I wish his liver would finally give out and make space for a CEO who deserves the title instead of this useless motherfucker." Would he consider that normal social media use or would he see it in a different light when its about him or done by gasp an underling?

spacebacon 3y ago

Technically we are all dying slow. If we are going to take his statement literally then we should consider how literal the entire statement is. We all “should die slow” as that is inherit to the human condition. Each breath we inhale is slowly oxidizing us from the inside out. If he said they should die fast I would be more concerned. If he said they should all die on x date at y place by z method then that is definitely more of a real threat than drunken word play for attention. “They should” also implies he has no intent of a threat. A threat would be more like “I will”.

spacebacon 3y ago
I take no side here in this factual statement yet welcome even more down votes from anyone that can’t regulate their emotional response beyond a down vote to a reasonable and objective analysis of his statement. Carry on with the downvoting. You are doing great!

sublinear 3y ago

> Tan “should not have done any of that. He should go for a while. He should not represent tech anymore,” I'd argue that anyone who cares this much should "go for a while". For over at least a decade now it's made no sense that we hold people in certain roles to a higher standard than anyone else. These high standards are a form of power transfer that hurts those who believe in them. Can't we just admit we're all human?

VikingCoder 3y ago
We are all human, yes. And when there's a leadership role, there are multiple people who are qualified. It's okay to express your preference that the leadership role be filled by someone who doesn't go on a public, drunken, life-threatening rant.
- sublinear 3y ago
  It's also okay to express your preference that the role be filled by someone who didn't get there by drumming up the media and casting aspersions.
suslik 3y ago
Does he actually "represents tech"? I am really not sure about that.
- JohnFen 3y ago
  He doesn't represent "tech". He is one of the major figures who represents SV/SF tech culture, though.

greenie_beans 3y ago

one time i was on twitter and some asshole was tweeting mean, stupid stuff and i was like who is this asshole? what is e/acc? and then i realized he was the president of YC and it made me sad. and then i learned more about e/acc and i decided how dumb that shit is

srackey 3y ago

Who knew Garry Tan was this based!

replwoacause 3y ago
Not based. Foolhardy.

iainctduncan 3y ago

Whether he should have said it on moral grounds is one question, and whether it is indicative of handling part of the CEO's job very poorly is another. The CEO is the public face of a company - that is literally part of the job. He did this abysmally, and in many, many companies, it would be enough for a board to sack him. The CEO doesn't get a firewall between their personal life and work, or a pass for off work behaviour. They get paid to live it. I work in diligence on medium stage companies and the acquirer wondering if they have to ditch some of the current exectutive is very common. (I know nothing about the ownership of YC mind you.)

replwoacause 3y ago

I don’t know much about YC lore, but pg seemed like a pretty “buttoned up” person, and then came Altman and Tan, more freewheeling loose cannon types. Is that right?Is that just the new ilk for this generation of tech leaders?

dluan 3y ago
PG had a rule of no politics, even though he made many political donations and made unjustful imprisonment and overturning the death penalty one of his pet projects. Michael Seibel, Geoff Ralston, and Sam Altman were all very apolitical CEOs. Sam was the most, but usually it was only general/presidential election stuff. YC also does some lobbying with investors like Ron Conway, who in the past has supported gun control policy. Garry Tan is the only YC CEO with insanely thin skin.

qgin 3y ago

Note to everyone making death threats: just make sure to quote music, film, or theater in your threats. You’ll be protected from prosecution but your recipient will still get the message.

nohat 3y ago

It was a stupid and shameful tweet. The thing that elevates this above a drunk tweet though are the "real life" postcards. Should we ignore the fact that the postcards seem very much a false flag?

RickJWagner 3y ago

Following the model set by the likes of Jim Carrey, Robert De Niro, etc. It's high time we do recognize this as unacceptable speech.

randal_handle 3y ago

This is fine.

randal_handle 3y ago

This is fine. Not great, but it is fine.

rmrf100 3y ago

I don't think this' a big deal.