4 ms·

So, a typical Disney product then?

by steve1977 3y ago

Towaway69 3y ago
[flagged]
- aleph_minus_one 3y ago
  > Typical capitalistic product? Quite the opposite: patents are artificial monopolies issued by the country - thus the actual opposite of free markets.
  - rpmisms 3y ago
    They are nice for a reason, though. They're a temporary monopoly in exchange for open access to the patented mechanism. They're far better than copyright, basically.
    - felipeko 3y ago
      Yet most patented inventions are pretty obvious on how to copy without the need to look at the patent, same with this case. So we have no benefit of "open access to the mechanism" but with the deleterious effect of the "temporary (1/5 of a long human life) monopoly".
      - rpmisms 3y ago
        Well, the equation there is simple, as evidenced by the fact that many companies still opt for trade secrets instead of patents.
  - Towaway69 3y ago
    Are we speaking of patents or the product made from those patents? Are we speaking of how capitalism enforces permanent growth and profit requirements upon us so that most anything that can be monetised will be monetised. Even feeding the homeless is monetised by the state[1] - in the form of fines. I for one can no longer distinguish between capitalistic greed and profiteering via patents, food, housing, warmth, freedoms, user data, .... [1] https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/aug/04/texas-volunteers-fined-feeding-homeless-heat https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/aug/04/texas-volunt...
  - orwin 3y ago
    Free market = liberalism. Capitalism is about owning the means of exchange and production, and how to distribute the generated capital. [edit] which is fine, but rely a bit much on the 'benevolent dictator' trope recently.
  - theK 3y ago
    I think the problems with IP rights startend when the law allowed companies to be treated as persons, from there on it was just downhill. Instead of protecting the inventor we started weaponising IP rights.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - throwaway-blaze 3y ago
      You know the latin root for the word 'corporation' is 'corpus' meaning 'body'. A corporation in English common law is literally a fictitious person created for the purpose of performing business activities independent of its shareholders. The fact that corporations inherit many of the legal abilities of people in our system (including property rights like intellectual property) is a good thing.
      - theK 3y ago
        > The fact that corporations inherit many of the legal abilities of people in our system is a good thing In general I agree with this. But on the specific case of intellectual property I do not.
  - elmomle 3y ago
    It is worthwhile to distinguish between capitalism and a free market. A free market engenders capitalism, which (with sufficient accumulation of wealth and creeping market and regulatory capture) creates forces that oppose the free market.
  - jdksmdbtbdnmsm 3y ago
    Capitalism is literally defined by the ability to exercise capital to accumulate more of it, which is literally the only way for a monopoly to exist. By definition, capitalism has nothing to do with so-called "free markets".
    - jazzyjackson 3y ago
      And "free markets" are the results of showing up with a Navy to help negotiate a trade deal.
  - mensetmanusman 3y ago
    Patents solve the first mover disadvantage in game theory. If you come up with a better solution, please share.
    - aleph_minus_one 3y ago
      I don't claim that I have an easy solution for this problem (at best, I have some fragmentary ideas). I just claim that patents (and copyright) are actually quite the opposite of free markets.
      - mensetmanusman 3y ago
        They are like stop signs and stop lights. It prevents you from driving like you want, but makes everyone more free to get to where they want to go.
- bigfishrunning 3y ago
  Better then the alternative (no product, starvation)
- OfficeChad 3y ago
  [dead]
BiteCode_dev 3y ago
Today's Disney. If you looked at the video from the studio showing off tech decades ago, you could hear, see and feel the passion.
- CharlesW 3y ago
  You can definitely hear, see, and feel the passion of Larry Smoot in the video on that page. Also, Disney has patented their inventions since the beginning: https://patentyogi.com/technology/celebrity-patent-walt-disney-invented-this-multi-plane-camera-to-produce-feature-length-movies/ https://patentyogi.com/technology/celebrity-patent-walt-disn...
  - BiteCode_dev 3y ago
    That's a good example. Look at the video showing off this exact tech: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdHTlUGN1zw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdHTlUGN1zw You feel like you are part of the family while watching this. It's a completely different vibe. Honestly, I feel vaguely threatened by the HoloTile Floor demo tone. The way he answers the question about what's it's going to be used for feels like a parent that doesn't want to reveal something to a child.
    - CharlesW 3y ago
      > You feel like you are part of the family while watching this. Fair enough! I'd just note that Walt was pioneer of content marketing, and I'm sure that was the goal. (This segment was broadcast in the television series Disneyland (1954–1959) in the episode, "Tricks of Our Trade".) > Honestly, I feel vaguely threatened by the HoloTile Floor demo tone. The way he answers the question about what's it's going to be used for feels like a parent that doesn't want to reveal something to a child. This one? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68YMEmaF0rs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68YMEmaF0rs Agreed, it's terrible — overscripted, artificial, inauthentic — and a failed simulacrum of what Walt's Disney did above. The only honest part is 2:15-3:00, marred only by the terrible reading of the pretend guest.
    - walterclifford 3y ago

So, a typical Disney product then?

Towaway69 3y ago

[flagged]

aleph_minus_one 3y ago
> Typical capitalistic product? Quite the opposite: patents are artificial monopolies issued by the country - thus the actual opposite of free markets.
- rpmisms 3y ago
  They are nice for a reason, though. They're a temporary monopoly in exchange for open access to the patented mechanism. They're far better than copyright, basically.
  - felipeko 3y ago
    Yet most patented inventions are pretty obvious on how to copy without the need to look at the patent, same with this case. So we have no benefit of "open access to the mechanism" but with the deleterious effect of the "temporary (1/5 of a long human life) monopoly".
    - rpmisms 3y ago
      Well, the equation there is simple, as evidenced by the fact that many companies still opt for trade secrets instead of patents.
- Towaway69 3y ago
  Are we speaking of patents or the product made from those patents? Are we speaking of how capitalism enforces permanent growth and profit requirements upon us so that most anything that can be monetised will be monetised. Even feeding the homeless is monetised by the state[1] - in the form of fines. I for one can no longer distinguish between capitalistic greed and profiteering via patents, food, housing, warmth, freedoms, user data, .... [1] https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/aug/04/texas-volunteers-fined-feeding-homeless-heat https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/aug/04/texas-volunt...
- orwin 3y ago
  Free market = liberalism. Capitalism is about owning the means of exchange and production, and how to distribute the generated capital. [edit] which is fine, but rely a bit much on the 'benevolent dictator' trope recently.
- theK 3y ago
  I think the problems with IP rights startend when the law allowed companies to be treated as persons, from there on it was just downhill. Instead of protecting the inventor we started weaponising IP rights.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - throwaway-blaze 3y ago
    You know the latin root for the word 'corporation' is 'corpus' meaning 'body'. A corporation in English common law is literally a fictitious person created for the purpose of performing business activities independent of its shareholders. The fact that corporations inherit many of the legal abilities of people in our system (including property rights like intellectual property) is a good thing.
    - theK 3y ago
      > The fact that corporations inherit many of the legal abilities of people in our system is a good thing In general I agree with this. But on the specific case of intellectual property I do not.
- elmomle 3y ago
  It is worthwhile to distinguish between capitalism and a free market. A free market engenders capitalism, which (with sufficient accumulation of wealth and creeping market and regulatory capture) creates forces that oppose the free market.
- jdksmdbtbdnmsm 3y ago
  Capitalism is literally defined by the ability to exercise capital to accumulate more of it, which is literally the only way for a monopoly to exist. By definition, capitalism has nothing to do with so-called "free markets".
  - jazzyjackson 3y ago
    And "free markets" are the results of showing up with a Navy to help negotiate a trade deal.
- mensetmanusman 3y ago
  Patents solve the first mover disadvantage in game theory. If you come up with a better solution, please share.
  - aleph_minus_one 3y ago
    I don't claim that I have an easy solution for this problem (at best, I have some fragmentary ideas). I just claim that patents (and copyright) are actually quite the opposite of free markets.
    - mensetmanusman 3y ago
      They are like stop signs and stop lights. It prevents you from driving like you want, but makes everyone more free to get to where they want to go.
bigfishrunning 3y ago
Better then the alternative (no product, starvation)
OfficeChad 3y ago
[dead]

BiteCode_dev 3y ago

Today's Disney. If you looked at the video from the studio showing off tech decades ago, you could hear, see and feel the passion.

CharlesW 3y ago
You can definitely hear, see, and feel the passion of Larry Smoot in the video on that page. Also, Disney has patented their inventions since the beginning: https://patentyogi.com/technology/celebrity-patent-walt-disney-invented-this-multi-plane-camera-to-produce-feature-length-movies/ https://patentyogi.com/technology/celebrity-patent-walt-disn...
- BiteCode_dev 3y ago
  That's a good example. Look at the video showing off this exact tech: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdHTlUGN1zw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdHTlUGN1zw You feel like you are part of the family while watching this. It's a completely different vibe. Honestly, I feel vaguely threatened by the HoloTile Floor demo tone. The way he answers the question about what's it's going to be used for feels like a parent that doesn't want to reveal something to a child.
  - CharlesW 3y ago
    > You feel like you are part of the family while watching this. Fair enough! I'd just note that Walt was pioneer of content marketing, and I'm sure that was the goal. (This segment was broadcast in the television series Disneyland (1954–1959) in the episode, "Tricks of Our Trade".) > Honestly, I feel vaguely threatened by the HoloTile Floor demo tone. The way he answers the question about what's it's going to be used for feels like a parent that doesn't want to reveal something to a child. This one? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68YMEmaF0rs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68YMEmaF0rs Agreed, it's terrible — overscripted, artificial, inauthentic — and a failed simulacrum of what Walt's Disney did above. The only honest part is 2:15-3:00, marred only by the terrible reading of the pretend guest.
  - walterclifford 3y ago