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I'm sure the game is good, but (not to say it's bad, just haven't had the time yet) the only part I've browsed for a significant period of time so far is the co

• deleted 3y ago
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• ddingus 3y ago
  You are not kidding! I just sent a quick note to CMJ in recognition of what I must call a sustained, exemplary act of community management. Reading that was gratifying. That team should feel really good about their work.
• DoItToMe81 3y ago
  The code of conduct immediately made me realize that this place will be cliquey and run by rules lawyers who take delight in making a billion subcategories for the sake of empowering themselves to ban. I've never seen an instance where this was not the case. Anything that needs to write paragraph after paragraph for what could be summarized in 4 to 8 rules, especially with weird, no doubt completely irrelevant to the game itself "DRUMPF GAMERGATE VACCINE" clauses on top of that, is not something anybody who values their time should involve themselves in.
  • rtkwe 3y ago
    Or it's a community that's successfully kept itself alive for a very long time and "simple" rules get interpreted wildly differently so over time you're naturally going to build up at lot of explicit rules around edge cases.
    • rykar 3y ago
      EXACTLY. The game used to have one rule: "Don't be a dick." The game used to pride itself on having banned fewer players than the number of players who met and got married in real life. Eventually the community realized that wasn't a good thing. If you've banned almost nobody, it doesn't mean that everyone in your community is being nice and wonderful and not harming anyone else, it means that you've only been told about the most egregious and obvious cases. It means a dozen different cliques can decide for themselves on how people "ought to" interact and play. A big CoC doesn't mean everyone's a judgmental lawyer. Traffic codes in the US have thousand and thousands of words for different edge cases. But it doesn't mean everyone goes around with a camera and a lawyer in their backseat, people generally understand "hey don't speed and don't run red lights and don't drive drunk".
• kazinator 3y ago
  The best post in that thread is the (currently) last one: https://mstdn.social/@GregStolze@mastodon.social/109376701434157145 https://mstdn.social/@GregStolze@mastodon.social/10937670143...
• martin82 3y ago
  A dissertation as CoC. Great. Impossible to read and then keep in your head. In their desperate attempt to be as inclusive as possible, they actually created a framework under which everyone will eventually become guilty of something.
• drewzero1 3y ago
  A few years ago the admin Dan ("Caveman Joe") wrote a massive thread [1] about what he's learned about online communities, moderation, and dealing with users in general (both good-faith and bad-faith varieties). I thought it was worth a read for anyone thinking about creating or moderating any online community. It felt kind of like a peek behind the scenes of that code of conduct. There were some hard-earned pearls of wisdom there, and I'll have to read through it again when I have some time. 1: https://mstdn.social/@ifixcoinops/109354147264054179 https://mstdn.social/@ifixcoinops/109354147264054179
  • howenterprisey 3y ago
    Yes!! What an amazing thread. That and the CoC above should honestly be read together. I've added a link with credit.
• serf 3y ago
  I'd rather my CoC not try to replace a mental health advocate or psychologist. 'Appendix A' is particularly egregious. I understand the dark patterns of psychology that an administrator should be on the look-out for; it's another thing to task the player-base with the witch hunt through explanation. P.S. I think it's noble that you read the CoC before product usage, and I wish more people -- including myself at time -- would do that.
  • nonethewiser 3y ago
    Id go further and say the CoC has 0 impact. The first rule by itself is absurdly long. No one is reading that. Its not shaping anything. It’s for the writer.
    • Auguste 3y ago
      I disagree. I've never heard of this game before, but I just read the whole CoC and it made me want to give it a try. I respect that the developer went to great lengths to outline their expectations in such clear detail. It sounds like a cool community to me.
    • michaelt 3y ago
      > No one is reading that. Its not shaping anything. That may well be the case. But in any online community, eventually some people are going to get banned. And many people - even those who aren't getting banned - prefer it if the banning is conducted according so some sort of written document, even if they've never read that document in detail themselves. Other online communities with far more lightweight rules are also available, for people who prefer that :)
      • VectorLock 3y ago
        (Un)Just In Time Code of Conducting to be even more hilariously capricious: your "ban user" button has a "reason" field that then appends that "reason" to your Code of Conduct.
      • rykar 3y ago
• kazinator 3y ago
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  • vidarh 3y ago
    I'm quite convinced that the person who wrote that code of conduct is entirely happy with turning people who take issue with that rule off the game - see the linked Mastodon thread and it's linked thread giving the advice about any community management to "remove the people who don't like being there", and it would seem that in this case would include turning off people who are unable or unwilling to figure out the community norms without a detailed set of explicit rules that leave them plenty of room to push past the community norms by exploiting ambiguities or loopholes. Would you be happier about it if they didn't try to explain how they operated? Because most places mods finds way of "working around" the rules for behaviours they don't like but that may not technically violate rules. There's slack and ambiguity in any wording.
  • zilti 3y ago
    LOL whoever wrote that CoC has a worse case of snowflakism than the local college reading club and a Trump rally combined, yet has the audacity to tell others to go see a therapist? That's bold.
    • 2dos 3y ago
      [flagged]
      • zilti 3y ago
        Amused is the word you're looking for.
  • fenomas 3y ago
    > That's precisely the kind of thing that turns people off codes of conduct. I don't know if you've ever moderated a large community, but if you do it by the letter of any law, people will endlessly probe for loopholes and argue over edge cases. I'd imagine the wording you quoted is there to head off such issues, not because the moderator loves vagueness for it's own sake.
• slily 3y ago
  > Support of Gamergate, racial supremacist groups, the redpill/incel movement, or any other hate group - including, and especially, hate groups that have gained political power such as the Donald Trump administration - is a direct challenge to the lives and well-being of other players and will result in a permanent ban. I don't know man, I don't care about your TDS, this is just eyeroll-worthy. Pure political soapboxing.
  • jstarfish 3y ago
    That's a shame. I thought this much was progressive: > Do not roleplay racist, sexist, homophobic or otherwise bigoted characters in public-facing or semi-public areas (emphasis mine) Too good to be true? > hate groups that have gained political power such as the Donald Trump administration That's not a hate group, that's the other half of the entire country that doesn't toe your party's line. And it'll probably happen again because this sort of sophistry has made life an insufferable pain in the ass. Like or hate Bush/Clinton/Obama, nobody was kicking you out of a community because of your political affiliation. I miss the inclusiveness of the 90s.
    • morsch 3y ago
      > That's not a hate group, that's the other half of the entire country We have historical evidence from many countries that those need not be mutually exclusive categories.
      • robertlagrant 3y ago
        So why add the unnecessary category?
    • Propelloni 3y ago
      > Like or hate Bush/Clinton/Obama, nobody was kicking you out of a community because of your political affiliation. I miss the inclusiveness of the 90s. The 1990s weren't more inclusive, quite the opposite. But the groups you are talking about just all at least tried to work with the community. They actively sought out common ground and were willing to compromise. Today's populists, e.g. Trump, say the aforementioned community is not the real community, they are all crooks, or pests, and in fact only the populists and their followers are the real community and everybody else is the enemy and needs to be locked up, denied citizenship, or be exterminated. There can't be compromise. It is a big part of their sales pitch. Witness how so called moderate Republicans are treated -- you know, the ones who seek to work within the community and are willing to compromise -- they call them RINO "Republican In Name Only", i.e. they are not _real_ Republicans. There are more examples you are probably aware of. I, for one, can see how this makes it really hard for all involved to find some common ground to work together, don't you?
• klyrs 3y ago
  Wow, I'm the opposite. I probably sunk triple-digit hours into this game, and never bothered to interact with another soul on it. The code of conduct is great now that I'm reading it.
  • smusamashah 3y ago
    As you have played it, does it have player owned places/shrines which can be built via some drag drop interface? I couldn't find any more info on it except what's there on the About page.
    • rykar 3y ago
      It has player-owned places that are done with a fairly clunky interface, but the focus is far more on the writing that you put into your place. It's a callback to the MUDs of old, to my understanding. I think the record for a group-written player-made place was something on the order of tens of thousands of words.
  • rykar 3y ago
    Poke your head into Banter sometime! I'm almost the exact opposite, having barely touched the mechanical side of the game in ages, and I always like to say hi to other players. Especially if they've been around and love the setting!
  • deleted 3y ago
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