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Maryland will hand out 133k Chromebooks to the public
- shortrounddev2 3y agoSeems like a feel-good idea but one which would be better implemented by just giving people the money instead and letting them do what they will with it
- explaininjs 3y agoExcept 133,000 individuals could not buy 133,000 chromebooks for the amount of money that it takes one entity to buy 133,000 chromebooks. There’s plenty of free cash/food/shelter around for those who need it. Adding computers to the list is better than just slightly more cash.
- prepend 3y agoYeah, but it’s cheaper to administer cash outflows. Maybe the state can buy the books for $200 but they have to manage inventory, hire staff, etc etc. So it’s probably cheaper to just cut checks to people for $300 even though the cost per unit is higher.
- thatwasunusual 3y agoHow can you be assured that those money are used on those ChromeBooks?
- shortrounddev2 3y agoYou can't, but it doesn't matter
- prepend 3y agoThe same way you assure chromebooks aren’t ebayed. Basically a percentage will be wasted. But you give the money to parents who need a computer and trust them to get a computer. Not everyone will do the right thing, but I think it’s more efficient, and less wastage, to just hand out money than to hand out chromebooks.
- explaininjs 3y agoI can assure you the state already has plenty staff on hand with plenty of training on giving out free stuff. And even if they don’t: jobs program.
- mhb 3y ago> jobs program Bastiat would like a word.
- explaininjs 3y ago133,000 free laptops, but some employees is where he interjects?
- shortrounddev2 3y agoI believe you could do more good for the same price if you just gave people cash instead of implementing an administrative system to manage distributing laptops. Just give people money and they can buy what they need
- shortrounddev2 3y agoThe state could administer other tasks it's good at more effectively if it didn't need to spend human resources on such a program. >jobs program so is the point to help the poor, or is it to pay government workers to do unnecessary work?
- explaininjs 3y agoYou repeat yourself. In all seriousness, it’s amusing to see how many people in this thread want to apply capitalist principles to a welfare program. The two are opposite - the goal here is to lose as much capital as possible.
- shortrounddev2 3y agoI'm not arguing for "capitalist principles" (if there were such a thing). The goal with welfare is to do as much good as possible. I contend that by managing administrative bloat, you lose money which could otherwise be given directly to people and do more good. The goal should be to spend money as efficiently as possible, not to spend less money
- CapstanRoller 3y ago>There’s plenty of free cash/food/shelter around for those who need it. There's plenty, but very little is actually given to those who need it.
- Rebelgecko 3y agoIronically, the most recent survey in the special unhoused enforcement zone near me found that the number of people living on the streets was almost identical to the number of empty beds at the shelter.
- shortrounddev2 3y agoA lot of homeless people don't go to shelters because they can be more dangerous than sleeping on the street
- Rebelgecko 3y agoI really can't imagine how having a tiny home with 4 walls and a door with a 24/7 security guard would be more dangerous than a tent on the sidewalk. I do know that 1-2 people per month get kicked out of the shelter for fighting, but not sure how that compares to life on the streets. I think a bigger factor is that the tiny homes limit how much stuff you can bring (aka 1 bike per person, cant build your own structures on the land, no drugs, etc), which seems to be the most common reason people gave for not wanting to go.
- CapstanRoller 3y ago>a tiny home with 4 walls and a door with a 24/7 security guard You are not describing any homeless shelter that I've ever seen. Usually they are very crowded communal sleeping facilities with barely any security and zero privacy. Theft and assault are a common occurrence.
- shortrounddev2 3y ago> I really can't imagine how having a tiny home with 4 walls and a door with a 24/7 security guard would be more dangerous than a tent on the sidewalk One: many homeless people feel dehumanized by how they're treated by the staff, and Two: homeless shelters are full of homeless people
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- shortrounddev2 3y agoRight but the question is if the government knows what those 133k people need better than they do. There's also the administrative cost of such a system and logistics (if the government decides to ship or deliver the devices themselves). You could avoid having to pay government salaries for the people involved in finding qualified people, getting their info, auditing for fraud, etc.
- robertlagrant 3y agoThe idea is people get Chromebooks, not that people get something of the value of $300.
- graphe 3y agoI can't think of any good scenarios from buying a bunch of crappy Chromebooks for any purpose. What's the best that can happen?
- shortrounddev2 3y agoI think the idea is that internet connection is a basic necessity in modern society. A chromebook can help you look for a job, pay bills, etc. For kids it's an educational lifeline. I actually did all my CS work via a Chromebook in 2013 with a VPS I ssh'd into. Coded everything in vim with makefiles. Was a crucible, but these days I use IDEs
- hx8 3y agoThat's the debate. What if you give someone a Chromebook instead of $300 and they cannot afford to repair their car. On the other hand giving someone a Chromebook can have a bigger impact than many other ways they could spend $300.
- shortrounddev2 3y agoIf they need a laptop, they'll buy one. If they need something else, they'll buy that instead
- robertlagrant 3y agoSee my comment. The goal wasn't to give people $300.
- shortrounddev2 3y agoWhy
- hospitalJail 3y agoThe insatiable social spender: >No you can't just give parents money to go buy food for their kids, they will buy drugs. We need adult humans to prepare free lunches for children. >Why can't you just give them money? They know what they need most No skin in the game here, I just always found this thinking contradictory.
- gloyoyo 3y agoAre these Chromebooks the ones that are administered remotely? If so, they better say it up front.
- type0 3y agoI hope not. What would be the reason to do so, other than cementing a complete disregard for privacy that they already shown.
- throw555chip 3y agoThe following Dell laptop would be better than a vendor locked in Chromebook: https://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/dell-laptops/inspiron-15-laptop/spd/inspiron-15-3520-laptop/nn3520gmxph https://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/dell-laptops/inspiron-15-lap...
- jessenaser 3y agoYes, being a government body they could get a larger discount on bulk orders, and having a computer that can run all software instead of just the web browser (that Chrome OS only allows) will actually help communities.
- agbrrw 3y agoIt fills with malware so much faster, too!
- gjsman-1000 3y agoDude... This is a steal. Wow.
- hospitalJail 3y agoWait, vendor locked? I was about to get a chromebook for $120 and put some linux on it.
- afandian 3y agoI got one with the same intent and it’s not as easy as it used to be sadly. I was disappointed. https://github.com/dnschneid/crouton https://github.com/dnschneid/crouton If you want to get a Google account there’s Crostini, but it’s not the same. AFAICT you need to log in with a Google account.
- night-rider 3y ago> a vendor locked in Chromebook Choose your poison. Macbooks are tightly knit with Apple and phone home, but are absurdly expensive and people pay for the privilege of getting spied on. Same with Chromebooks: we're just another datapoint for Google, and much more data is collected. Why not hand out Thinkpads flashed with Trisquel Linux[0]? (A Libre Linux that respects privacy?). And don't get me started on Windows 10/11 lol. [0] https://trisquel.info/ https://trisquel.info/
- pton_xd 3y agoI think it'd more effectively go into the appropriate hands by at least charging some nominal amount. Advertise that anyone may visit the public library and purchase a subsidized internet-capable device for $20. Or $5. Free just has no chance of being an efficient distribution.
- ricksmith1962 3y agoI’m sure there are some prerequisites, similar to how the acp is managed.
- sokoloff 3y agoExactly this. The amount of wasteful greedy/hoarding behavior that is induced by free and is curbed by charging even $20 is quite high. Charging 50% of the going resale rate is probably enough to prevent hoarding and substantially curb resale. That might be slightly too much for the aims of the program, in which case adjust as needed, realizing that you're trading off one outcome for another.
- ricksmith1962 3y agoThey’re not just going to hand them out to anyone who asks for one.
- robocat 3y ago"user pays" prevents the benefit from occurring. For example in New Zealand (public healthcare) there used to be a $5 copay for prescribed medication (by government healthcare doctors). There is now no copay ($0) because 3% of people would not get the medicine because of cost. This was particularly true for low-income families, Māori, Pacific peoples, and disabled New Zealanders. That said, our conservative party wants to bring the fees back: https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/budget-2023-5-prescription-fee-scrapped-but-will-national-bring-it-back/VUV6MBOOFBABXEODSE4XG3SZBM/ https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/budget-2023-5-prescription-fee... If people don't pay a small amount to get something important like medicine, they perhaps wouldn't pay even a a token $20 or 50% for something luxury/"unnecessary" like easier access to the internet.
- sneak 3y agoIt’s bad that public funds are being used to coerce people into using adtech surveillance services. You can’t use these meaningfully without agreeing to the Google TOS. Tax money should not be used that way (but there are precedents in things like sports stadiums et cetera). It seems like simple public-private wealth transfer (ie corruption) to me.
- madars 3y agoRecent Chromebooks are extremely nice devices. For example, $299 at BestBuy gets you an Asus CM3401. It has AMD Ryzen CPU (with similar performance as 8th gen mobile i7), 1080p screen, and an M.2 SSD you can upgrade yourself. Downside is the weight -- 1.8kg (almost 4lbs) -- and that 16 GB RAM model costs extra. But perfectly good for using Crostini (ChromeOS's Linux VM -- you can run your favorite Debian programs, including those that use GUI, without reflashing your Chromebook a la Crouton).
- ge96 3y agoI wonder what is the percentage of people that would even consider "run [their] favorite Debian programs..." on their Chromebook.
- trog 3y agoI set up the Linux version of Firefox on our company's Chromebooks so we could use client certificates (not available in the Android version available from Play Store). It's super easy so I imagine any nerd with a Chromebook that wants more functionality that they can get from mobile apps would do it!
- ge96 3y agoYeah I have taken a $50 chromebook before and ran virtual box in it. I don't know why they would buy/give out these crippled OS devices vs. just Windows/easiest option.
- solarkraft 3y agoIt's so easy that it's great for education. Want to teach somebody Linux? If they have a Chromebook, there's very little you have to go through to get a near-native Linux shell (you can even open ports!).
- shimon 3y agoThe used/refurbished market for Chromebooks is great for buyers, too. There's not much demand for used Chromebooks so you can get something quite nice for personal/kid use around $100-200.
- graphe 3y agoInstead of creating jobs, or trying to help businesses, let's buy 133,000 laptops because lack of Chromebooks are what are holding people back. 28 million can't be spent better than buying Chromebooks.
- orangepurple 3y agoIn all, over the last decade, the [teachers] union spent $6,448,327 on travel expenses. That comes out to an average of $53,736 a month, every month, for 10 straight years. How does that fulfill the union’s tax-exempt mission to “elevate the quality of public education for all students”? That amount does not include "Conferences, conventions, and meetings." https://foxbaltimore.com/news/project-baltimore/marylands-teachers-union-spent-509k-on-travel-while-counties-struggle-to-fund-public-education-maryland-state-education-association-mesa-president-cheryl-bost-david-williams-taxpayers-protection-alliance https://foxbaltimore.com/news/project-baltimore/marylands-te... Baltimore City Schools received 29 federal Covid grants totaling $799M to fight learning loss. Yet, in 2023, just 9.1% of all 3rd-8th graders tested proficient in math. MEANING, taxpayers gave an additional $799M and 91% of Baltimore students are NOT math proficient. New test scores, known as MCAP (Maryland Comprehensive Assessment Program), obtained by Project Baltimore, revealed that 23 schools, including elementary, middle, and high schools, had not one student that could do math at grade level. A Calverton educator, who reached out to Fox45, claims to have received that text. “[It instructed me to] go into my grade book, make sure no students are failing, and essentially change the grade if they are failing so they will pass with a 60 percent,” said the teacher, whose identity we are concealing upon request. “I was frustrated as a teacher. We’re public servants. And when we see things like grade changing, that’s self-serving. That’s not helping the kids.” After watching Fox45’s recent investigations into allegations of grade changing at Calverton, the City Schools employee contacted Project Baltimore to say a couple things. First, according to the teacher, grade changing at Calverton is “very common.” Second, the educator told Fox45, changing grades is the easiest and fastest way to pass more students, which makes the school and its administrators look better. But, it does a huge disservice to not just the kids, but our entire community. “Teaching a whole generation of kids that they don’t have to be accountable for their actions, or that hard work isn’t valued or valuable when they are in school, is so discouraging and damaging.” Adding insult to injury, the same teacher said that he even passed kids who had been on his roster all year but didn’t bother to show up for a single day of class. But this teacher says grade changing at Calverton goes much further than just taking a failing grade and making it a 60. Some students who pass, according to this educator, don’t even have grades because they’ve never showed up to class. “There were students on my roster all year that I had never met, had never seen. On paper they passed my class and passed onto the next year.” “I love my job and I love my students,” concluded the teacher. “I want to see the students at Calverton and other schools across the city, get a fresh start. And it’s going to be hard because the students are used to this now. But the students deserve better and our city deserve better.” https://foxbaltimore.com/news/project-baltimore/project-baltimoretext-message-instructs-city-teachers-to-change-grades https://foxbaltimore.com/news/project-baltimore/project-balt...
- roschdal 3y agoThe public will use these for idle chit-chat and watch pornography.
- SoftTalker 3y agoWatch eBay, FBM and CL for Chromebooks for sale in Maryland.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- balozi 3y agotl;dr: Industrial waste being dumped on communities Handing out 133,000 devices is not enough without including a complete lifecycle management mechanism which will recover and recycling all 133,000 devices at the end of their useful life. Otherwise this is just industrial waste being dumped on unsuspecting communities. The Chromebooks will be in landfills in 3 years.
- 1letterunixname 3y agoOr whatever the AUE timer says. In my experience, homeless people use phones and laptops until the wheels fall off. Perhaps more of the essential consumables and durable goods society uses should have a responsible public or nonprofit coalitions supply chain: generic medications, microhousing, cereal and pulse crops, basic major electronic components, and software. Leaving everything to the magic invisible hand leads to the Charles Dickens' utopia of healthcare personal bankruptcy, widespread homelessness, and unlivable wage jobs we have now.
- adventured 3y agoSpent most of my life living in Maryland. This isn't going to go well. The results will be very mediocre. After the fact they'll say: well at least they tried something. It's just like burning $27 million. They need to focus on the education and severe crime problems in and around DC + Baltimore. Nothing is getting much better in Maryland for the poor until that improves. This is a temporary 1/4 of 1% improvement maneuver (temporary as in the benefit won't last a year). Make improvements to two dozen schools instead; or pay hundreds of teachers $10k more per year to do these very hard (and sometimes very dangerous) jobs.
- type0 3y agoThe best we can hope that can happen from this is that The Wire reboots with product placements for Chromebooks. Otherwise expect to find a bunch of very cheap Chromebooks on Craigslist
- yedava 3y agoI wish those had been Linux laptops. Now Google gets 133K more devices to spy on.
- ingen0s 3y agoYou mean, the Pentagon ;)
- verisimi 3y ago"The housing department partnered with HP Inc. and Daly Computers, a Mid-Atlantic IT services firm, to supply the Chromebooks. It also partnered with the University of Maryland’s TechExtension, which provides free, one-on-one tech support to any Marylander seeking assistance with a device." This is a good as it gets - a part of governance structure giving something back.
- javier_e06 3y agoThe major issue I see disadvantage groups face is that in government agencies and school system people are expected to navigate and fill forms, sign documents, submit documents. This can be done on phone but is very difficult. The government should make sure that in the so called chromebooks a user can download a pdf document, edit it and sign it and submit it. If agencies and schools stick to Google Docs and Google Drive, then is a complete solution that works. Everything else is a big if.
- bhpm 3y agoThe state of Maryland funneling the data of 133k low income citizens to a giant spy corp. This is dystopian as fuck. Couldn't they at least have put a lightweight linux distro on it?
- kube-system 3y ago> Couldn't they at least have put a lightweight linux distro on it? ChromeOS is a lightweight Linux distro.
- type0 3y agoSo what? Red Star OS is also Linux distro.
- nolist_policy 3y agoChromeOS is not worse than Windows 11, which would be the alternative here. Ironically enough ChromeOS has no Ads in the OS itself compared to Windows.
- type0 3y agodepends on who you ask, MS is practically mandating online account, maybe it's better if it doesn't sign in to it by default when browsing in Edge (have no idea how it does things) No irony here, Chrome has plenty of ads in the browser and that's why they're rolling out Manifest V3
- bhpm 3y ago[dead]
- type0 3y ago> Couldn't they at least have put a lightweight linux distro on it? They couldn't, but I agree, it's dystopian. They're using taxpayers money to give more Google users.
- type0 3y agoIs it sponsored by Google?
- 1letterunixname 3y agoThe almost laptops that are like IKEA furniture but worse: by a company that monetizes users' privacy, are unrepairable e-waste, and expire after X years. Instead, domestically-manufactured tablets or laptops based on open source would be more sustainable and waste less taxpayer money rather than just handing $50m USD to megacorp.
- array-species 3y agoAs a tax paying Marylander I believe this is a reasonable economic choice for the state. Especially Baltimore City which is receiving ~20k of these. The city does ongoing incremental social damage control, this is a part of it. The bottom 15% of people detract from the economy so thinking about it as service cost reduction rather than netting from it. The allocation rate for Baltimore City is something like 3.5% (!) while the rest of the state is like 2% and under. It is about getting another couple percent of the people on the internet. Some approximate thread of literacy and ability to type and click is huge. The laptop modality is important to have over touch keys only. There are many who don't have the wherewithal to get themselves online but it's a life changer for them to just have the basics. As for vendor, Google is the lesser evil than alternatives by a wide margin. Top concerns are AdWords tricking poor into buying junk which is a part of the greater plan anyways; cyclical chronic marginalization with a slight upward trajectory. Gmail account creation is sorta evil. But where else is their email going to live? Hard to imagine a solution other than adverts and gov. surveillance being the cost center recoup. Google is way good at warehouse scale computing for web services (internally, GCP sucks). Even crazier is that Maryland is already a top state for personal compute [1]. 1. https://www.indexmundi.com/facts/united-states/quick-facts/all-states/percentage-households-with-a-computer#chart https://www.indexmundi.com/facts/united-states/quick-facts/a... edit: grammar
- more_corn 3y agoI guess that’s one way to deal with ewaste. But a responsible government would dispose of them properly without putting it on citizens. If they actually wanted to help people they’d give them real computers.
- jfengel 3y agoIf the goal is to "bring high-speed internet to all corners of Maryland", then Chromebooks won't solve the problem. Much of Maryland has either zero broadband providers or one extremely expensive one. We do have a Maryland Emergency Broadband Benefit Program, but $15/month isn't going to make much of an inroads on a $100+/month bill. Rural places often have no broadband at all. We have an office trying to solve that over the next three years, but even that's not going to help if the price is over $100 per month.