6 ms·

Parental controls? What parental controls?

131 points by gjsman-1000 3y ago

gregw2 3y ago
They really are awful. You definitely get the sense that these things were developed by software developers who didn’t eat their own dogfood. YouTube options for parents are the worst.
prox 3y ago
But at least the ads work! :) Good article. I really wonder if the management of these companies use their own products (or have kids?) Maybe there is a weird Venn diagram here?
iamthepieman 3y ago
Been so frustrated by the plethora of controls, their various inability to do what I want and the constant need to check the settings to make sure they didn't fail open or that I just forgot to lock something back down because my children needed access to do school and I was in a hurry and just disabled everything because it was simpler. Adding multiple devices of different types just exacerbates the problem and made me set everything to max lockdown and only unlock on demand. We have a switch. You can't lock it. You can set a minimum playtime of 15 minutes but then the kids sneak up to the attic and get their "free" 15 minutes of playtime in the middle of a school day. You can't set playtimes individually per kids account either. We have a family imac and our teens have android phones so now I've got three separate family account managers to use, family link (Google), screen time (apple) and Nintendo. No, make that 4, because I also have ubiquiti networking and have a separate WiFi network for kids devices so I can block the school provided chromebooks which I otherwise have no control over. You know what we've resorted to? Keeping devices in our bedroom and physically controlling them. Super simple, no passwords or random fail states.
- jraby3 3y ago
  On the switch parental controls if you choose to set limits by day then you can choose zero minutes. Our issue is that there is no cross platform parent control. Laptop, iPhone, switch, and let’s not forget about the TV. If I want to set a limit of screen time there is no way to just limit all time to 2 hours a day.
- Joeri 3y ago
  Enforcing screen time in any way other than physical device security is an exercise in frustration. With apple screen time is sometimes not counted, and sometimes counted when the screen is off. On mac especially it is basically useless. And in a multi-device scenario you cannot have the times add up across platforms, so unless you’re micromanaging they can have their full screen time allotment per platform. If you do go in for micromanaging you find that the syncing is unreliable, so the kids keep nagging to enable something that’s already enabled. There needs to be an interoperable standard for screen time and parental controls, with pluggable management apps that allow flexibility in the rule sets, and unified views across devices, accounts and platforms. This is on the tech companies to make it happen, because these platforms are so locked down that nobody else can do it.
magicseth 3y ago
We are tackling this at hellowonder.ai . I took what I learned building ai tools at Google and built a system that does more than just block bad content for kids. It helps kids find exciting content that is aligned with their parents, effectively allowing them much more freedom. It’s amazing how this system actually brings kids and parents closer together in practice. Email seth@ that domain if you have kids and would like to skip the waitlist.
- iamthepieman 3y ago
  Sounds like a really interesting system but the devil's in the details. I really don't see how you solve this without some combination of layer 3 filtering and individual kernel level apps for all supported devices.
- freedomben 3y ago
  Does this work for Android? I'd be interested but we have only Android and desktop Linux devices
wmf 3y ago
I heard MacOS screen time can't control Java apps like Minecraft.
- hotnfresh 3y ago
  It can. The trouble with Minecraft is that it phones home to a dozen IPV6 addresses every time it launches, and it practically never contacts the same one twice. Makes it impractical to apply allow-only address access to the Internet and still allow Minecraft. I’ve not manage to find any kind of list from MS of addresses to allow to stop the insanity. I hate whoever made this happen.
obviouslynotme 3y ago
Here's the actual problem. Kids are cute and annoying. You love them but they will drive you nuts if you don't drain their energy and attention. The previous solution to this was that parents booted their kids out of the house and made them play outside. This has somehow gone from normal parenting to abusive behavior that could get you arrested in some places with a possibility of losing the child. So instead, we throw tvs, ipads, and phones at them just so we can get a modicum of quiet. Not surprisingly, each one of those is bad for the kid. The developmental problem is screen time but the scary one is strangers on the Internet. Elsa Gate upset a lot of people, and that's not the worst thing that happens. Policing the Internet is a bad decision. Any Internet Safety Committee will eventually be staffed by the people you would least like to be there. That's especially problematic because one person's bad guy is another person's hero a lot of the time. Although this is the inevitable future due to increasing clamor by Internet companies for regulatory capture, it won't even be effective. Parental controls never work. Your kid has way more time and motivation to figure out workarounds, even if the parents and the company set everything correctly. Everyone also knows that there will be at least one friend whose parents don't care. This is true whether the parental controls are local or done by a central committee. The only solution to this mess is: * Remove the insane laws and policies that prevent parents from letting their children play outside, especially unaccompanied. * Educate parents on the importance of moderating and monitoring electronics use. * Educate parents on how to educate their children about the dangers of the Internet, especially social media, pornography, and pedophiles. * Accept that some parents don't care and will neglect their children no matter what you do. Instead, empower the parents that do care to easily and safely raise their children.
- Libcat99 3y ago
  The media has been pushing for years that playing outside is dangerous and to be punished. It's not just laws that need to change, it's public opinion.
  - w-ll 3y ago
    Look, i dont have kids, so take this with a grain of salt, but even crossing the street at an interstion with clear rules, in a walkable city, is dangerous these days. Everyone is on their phones, not paying attention. I dont know who to blame, but collectively we are kinda F'd. Just the other day someone almost hit, while i was walking in a desiginated walking area and they just said "sorry, didnt see you." I replied in kind "duck you get off your phone" it sucks kids cant run around and play, i did, but also we've gotten ourselves in a bad spot with screens and phone. im not advocating anything, just saying, it sucks everwhere
ipython 3y ago
I'm so glad someone has called this out. I bought my kids Nintendo Switches and was appalled at the sad state of the Switch parental controls. No PIN locking, so my little ones can just swipe my teenager's Switch (which I don't bother with parental controls with). You can't specify "no time today" - your minimum time choice is 15 minutes. It's just plain awful. Apple TV is just as bad- I have Apple TVs throughout the house... but there's no way to lock them down either! Want to enforce no TV until a certain hour of the morning on Saturday? Too bad! I've just resorted to physically moving the errant devices into what we call "Switch jail" - aka my lockable network rack in the basement. Trouble is... I bought my teenage daughter a lockpicking set for Christmas... guess what happened next... I guess I should be proud of the effort!
- hotnfresh 3y ago
  One thing I can’t believe about Apple TV is that you can’t require a PIN for all apps but an allow-list—just for all apps. This, coupled with the fact that nothing other than first-party Apple apps respect the age rating settings makes the parental controls basically useless for anything but “lock everything”.
- Zak 3y ago
  I suggest progressively more challenging locks to hone her skills.
  - askiiart 3y ago
    "This is the Lock Picking Daughter, and what I have for you today is a network cabinet with my Nintendo Switch locked inside."
    - ipython 3y ago
      Ha! I love it.
- arp242 3y ago
  > I bought my teenage daughter a lockpicking set for Christmas... guess what happened next I'm surprised you didn't see that one coming. There's an old saying: "give a small boy a hammer and he will discover everything needs pounding". Lockpicks are the same: "give a teen a lockpick, and they will discover every lock needs picking".
Spivak 3y ago
Posts like these make me appreciate my parents for not bothering to do any of this nonsense. Absolutely zero care in the slightest for movie/game/music ratings, completely unfiltered internet. The only standard I was held to as a kid was "will she have nightmares if we let her watch it." Honestly there's something to the theory that if you don't make it a thing it stops being a thing. At any point I could have put on an R rated movie, took one of my mom's cigarettes, or drank one of my dad's beers if I wanted but I didn't. For I'm sure their own amusement they even offered them to me just to watch me go bleh. And why would I -- ewwww those were boring dad movies. Hell I could have found porn but what stopped me wasn't parental controls, it was being 9 and not knowing such a thing existed. I'm still embarrassed that I never realized that that's what was behind the swinging doors at hollywood video until I was at college. And I still remember the moment that was tossed aside too; I was like 8-9 years old, couldn't sleep and came down stairs because my dad was still up watching a movie. He must been in the bathroom or getting something from the fridge but regardless he wasn't there so I got into his chair, put on his headphones and hit play. Didn't know at the time what I was watching but it was Kill Bill and I thought it was so cool these two badass women were fighting each other. When my dad came back and caught me I was mortified so sure I was gonna get in trouble. But no, he was like, "you think this is cool?" and got our another pair of headphones so we could watch together. Big don't tell your mom I'm letting you stay up late energy. After that my dad was like I know what she's goona like and we watched the entire Alien series together and Alien 2 is still my favorite movie to this day.
- smoldesu 3y ago
  Yeah, I posted this in one of these threads last time and got beaten down with sticks and swords. Oh well, I'm on a hot streak and have karma to burn, so I'll agree with you. Parents, if you don't want your children to have internet access, then don't give it to them. If you have reached a point where that is no longer possible (eg. grade school) then it's time to figure things out. Your kids will be perambulating around recess and interacting with all the lovely publicly schooled children. You know, the nose-pickers that stole their brother's smut magazine and brag about it being in their backpack. It's horrifying! But also real-life. I sympathize with my parents for trying to make the best environment for me growing up. I'm even happier (for my sake and theirs) that they didn't overreact when I was playing violent video games or walking in on them watching Shaun of the Dead. I'm not sure I'd be a personally confident individual without those early moments of humility between me and my parents.
Apreche 3y ago
This is because software engineers never actually use devices that have parental controls enabled. Most parents either don’t enable the controls, or never use devices while those controls are active. It’s a user experience that is not tested in real world conditions very much. And the people that do experience it, children, obviously don’t want it enabled whether it works or not. They’re not going to go reporting bugs, lol! What parents consider bugs are actually features for the children. Only the kind of adult that wrote this blog post actually uses devices that have parental controls enabled, and sees how they actually work. The author suggests that companies should make their parental controls work to stave off government regulation. I think there’s actually a midway solution. I don’t want to see a government put its hand on the wheel and do the controls themselves. Instead, the government should regulate the companies and use the force of law to get them to make their parental controls work. Create a standard for parental control features that must be offered, tested, and working. If a platform doesn’t have the controls available that actually work, then you can’t sell it. If a government tells Apple it can’t sell iPhones until it fixes these problems with screen time, or that Nintendo can’t sell switches until it fixes their issues, then you can be damn sure they’ll be fixed within the week.
- tradertef 3y ago
  >>Only the kind of adult that wrote this blog post actually uses devices that have parental controls enabled, and sees how they actually work. It seems he is 21 years old :)
- hotnfresh 3y ago
  > This is because software engineers never actually use devices that have parental controls enabled. Yeah, it’s super-obvious. In many cases they’ve put work into implementing crap that’s useless without a lot more work to add more features… or they could have done something much simpler and it’d at least be a lot better than what they’ve actually done.
  - VincentEvans 3y ago
    After apple moved iphone power button from the top to the side of the device - most times i try to turn off my phone one-handed - i take a screenshot instead. My camera roll is full of screenshots of my lock screen and occasional random website. I was going to say - do they use their own devices? But if they don’t - what do they use? I mean it’s an iphone…
treyd 3y ago
A lot of the first set of points seem to be a result of Microsoft's self-sabotaging. I'm not going to pretend any Linux-based OS has any support for parental controls, but especially the points about the news feed and search didn't used to be an issue back in the days of like XP.
- I_am_uncreative 3y ago
  Back in those days, most families just had one computer, too, so it made it easier to monitor use.
- fifteen1506 3y ago
  Gnome has but I assume they're very basic. Currently using Qustodio and Linux boots to Waydroid (Android).
tempestn 3y ago
Yes parental controls are horribly complex and buggy. In my ideal world we'd just do away with them entirely, and not replace them with overly restrictive laws instead. As a parent I would rather spend my time actually talking with my kids about computer and internet use rather than fighting to work around these restrictive systems. Fortunately there isn't (yet!) a need to actually prove age when creating accounts in most cases. Edit: to be fair, I can imagine how they would be useful in some cases if they didn't suck so much, so I'm sympathetic to the OP. But I'd far and away take "nothing" over what we have now.
jonhohle 3y ago
I was just thinking this week about a business that offered MDM-like functionality for parents. My wife and I are strict with screen time limits and content filtering and have a teenager who likes to see what he can get away with. I have to manage Screen Time, OpenWRT firewall/DNS rules, Xbox limits, Blizzard limits, PlayStation limits. What I hate most about Screen Time is web content management. It’s so cumbersome and any change causes Safari to shut down on the client to load new settings. There’s also no way to “Always Allow” a website (say things necessary for school), so if you want to have strict limits on time, I have to be ready at a moment’s notice to approve time during whatever random school period requires it. That being said, we’ve found a solution that mostly works for us in a school setting. It’s better than what schools offered with Chromebooks, which were effectively wide open and didn’t allow any parent restrictions for time or content.
- ec109685 3y ago
  Apple’s App Store rules prevents MDM for parental control apps.
fungiblecog 3y ago
Parental controls are just a feature for advertising purposes
qweqwe14 3y ago
> What IP address is that kid’s laptop again? Technically per-device based filtering is done using MAC addresses, since local IPs can change sometimes. But even then it's trivial to change your MAC address even on an iPhone.
- joezydeco 3y ago
  The router-based controls just don't work when the kid's phone has cellular access, combined with unlimited data plans. So then you're back to the device controls which don't work. Some carriers offer primitive time-based access control but, again, they are broken too.
password4321 3y ago
Amazon Kids+ seems to work well, almost entirely allow list driven.
autoexec 3y ago
No software will ever replace parenting. If you have an 8 year who needs to do homework you sit them at the kitchen table with a laptop and peek over their shoulder every 15-20 minutes. If your 8 year old is browsing porn instead of doing math you're going to notice. Better yet, sit down right next to your kid and help them. If I worried about this, my solution would probably be more like this: Small children (say under 8-10) get computers with zero internet access. Not even an ethernet adapter. Zero unsupervised access to the internet on other devices. Older children (10-14) get devices with access to the internet, but first get education on what is/isn't appropriate to do/share online. I'll still check over their shoulders from time to time and everything is logged at the router. Ad blockers everywhere. Everything kept fully transparent so they know monitoring is happening and if I see requests made to questionable websites we can have a conversation about it. By now it'll be drilled into their heads that everything they do online is monitored by us, by the state, and by other companies who will sell that information to data brokers where it will end up collected into dossiers that will follow them for the rest of their lives. Young adults (14-18) don't need parental controls and are hopefully tech savvy enough by now to get around any if I tried using them anyway.
- eesmith 3y ago
  You never woke up after your parents went to bed to watch TV? With cable you could sometimes get a clear spot in the scrambled channels. And I assume you were not a latchkey kid, alone for hours before an adult came home? Never left unattended for hours when a 7 year old? (When sick, and both parents need to work; or on Saturday if one parent is running errands and the other handling lawn care; or any of many situations I can think of.) And from a rich enough family that could afford a personal device for each kid? (And no one shared or "borrowed" devices?) Where do you even get a computer these days with zero internet access? What software will the kid use? Your router log only handles questionable domains. Logging doesn't handle most of the issues mentioned in the article, like not wanting your 6 year old to see the "headlines of the day about how the world is on fire", or not wanting your kids to download something from the Microsoft Store.
  - fifteen1506 3y ago
somethoughts 3y ago
Surprisingly Google's FamilyLink when paired with Chromebook/Android Tablets work quite well. You can control/add devices pretty easily and block all web access and apps by default. You can add specific sites and apps manually (without manually approving random IP addresses).
csnover 3y ago
When the APA released their guidance on the use of social media by adolescents[0] earlier this year, they cited a study[1] that described the impacts of instructive[2] (a.k.a. active) versus restrictive[3] parental mediation in preventing cyber-bullying. This study found that the use of active mediation was associated with a decrease in victimisation, whereas restrictive parental mediation was not only unhelpful, it actually increased the risk of victimisation. In the discussion section, the authors reference several other studies that also suggest restrictive parental mediation is worse than doing nothing when it comes to stopping online victimisation. The APA appear to go out of their way in the guidance to explain that what they mean by “adult monitoring” is open coaching and discussion, not spying and blocking, but this sort of distinction seems to be missed or deliberately ignored in many discussions about online safety. As such, the source of the problem here doesn’t appear to be that the tools are inadequate at their jobs, but rather that they’re all fundamentally the wrong tools. In this case, no amount of engineering can solve it. Given this, perhaps the question should not be “What parental controls?”, but rather, “Should these kinds of restrictive parental controls even exist?” [0] https://www.apa.org/topics/social-media-internet/health-advisory-adolescent-social-media-use https://www.apa.org/topics/social-media-internet/health-advi... [1] https://doi.org/10.1016/j.compedu.2020.104026 https://doi.org/10.1016/j.compedu.2020.104026 [2] Definition from the study: “Instructive mediation […] explicitly involves children in the process of online monitoring. For instance, a parent adopting an instructive approach might appraise their children of the potential harms of certain online material, the appropriateness of sharing personal information online, and the latent danger of interacting with strangers on social media platforms.” [3] Also from the study: “Restrictive mediation does not directly include children in the intervention process. Rather, it involves the curtailing of cyber-routines through blocking software or parental monitoring of children's online habits and associations. Shielding children from the dangers of the Internet is given primacy over educating them about such hazards[.]”
- eesmith 3y ago
  Right, but adolescents in the study are in the age range 12 to 18, and the study specifically concerns cyberhate victimization, while the issues raised mostly concern younger kids, and include things like blocking access to online stores. (The "Kids Online Safety Act" is nominally about "kids", defined as "under the age of 13", but the bill's text mostly concerns minors, defined as "under the age of 17".) We just installed MS Windows 11 and it's clearly trying to get your attention with its tabloid-like feed meant to draw you to their web site. It takes time to learn media literacy, and companies should not be allowed to use the excuse that parents simply need to monitor more, while they do everything they can to get people to use their services and to buy from them, without distinguishing between 6 year olds and 60 year olds. What is a single parent to do to provide adult monitoring for their 8 year old latchkey kid?
ec109685 3y ago
Other issues with parental controls: - certain games require admin privileges on windows and there’s no easy way to say, “always launch this game without requiring a parent” - children accounts have irrevocable restrictions. E.g. YouTube prevents upload of videos, regardless of whether a parent allows it. So kids just spin up another account. - Microsoft makes it almost impossible to do simple things like allow child to buy a Minecraft realm. 10’s of clicks, errors and weird flows - parental controls don’t cross ecosystem, and no federation, so you have to setup each service independently - there’s no way for the device parental controls to influence web based services - there’s no way on Apple devices to allow a particular show, but in general restrict mature content. E.g. if a parent has different standards for violence, language or sexuality. The right solution is to put full control in parent’s hands (no saying 12 year olds can’t do X), support making device restrictions that are inherited by any application or site on it. And as others have said, incentive companies to remove bugs and make the solutions workable and not easily exploitable. The Consumer Protection Agency wouldn’t allow a toy that hurt children to exist, but don’t care if parental controls are actively harmful.
Nasrudith 3y ago
Such arrogance in thinking that it justifies congressional involvement. They're the ones who fucked the children into existence yet won't take your own goddamned responsibility and instead support the "think of the children" bull-crap. Seriously what the hell is wrong with people that they think the best thing for children is to create a goddamned dystopia for them in the name of "safety"?
restrainingbolt 3y ago
Well if anyone is interested, we're working on solving many of the problems outlined in this post. In particular our system sits in between the child and their internet, so we can do things like filter out links and social media posts before it even gets to the child's computer. Hopefully we'll be launched in 1-2 weeks, sign up for our email list if you want! https://parentcontrols.win/ https://parentcontrols.win/
- loehnsberg 3y ago
  I think this is a great idea! My kids use iPads and managing their screen time works well with what iOS has on board, but I cannot control social media, as this would nearly always intrude the privacy of the kid.
friend_and_foe 3y ago
Make no mistake, they're not trying to pass these laws because parental controls suck. They're trying to pass these laws so they can control what we say and read on the internet.
- nine_k 3y ago
  Levying fines is also fun!
- ashleyn 3y ago
  The Heritage Foundation openly telegraphed their intent to use KOSA, should it pass, to push for classification of all transgender resources as adult content. [1] [1]: https://www.techdirt.com/2023/05/24/heritage-foundation-says-that-of-course-gop-will-use-kosa-to-censor-lgbtq-content/ https://www.techdirt.com/2023/05/24/heritage-foundation-says...
deepthaw 3y ago
I have a special needs son. Parental controls are useless. Huge swathes of legitimate content gets blocked while he can still get to horrible material I don’t want him watching. His inability to obey any rules has resulted in him losing his pc because we simply couldn’t keep plugging all the holes he was finding to sneak into YouTube. And don’t get me started on streaming services where if you let your kid watch Star Wars, they can also watch The Simpsons Treehouse of Horror episodes.
ryandrake 3y ago
I'm obviously a terrible parent. My 10 year old gets unfiltered access to the Internet, with no technical restrictions, and she is responsible for moderating her time spent playing and browsing. She knows what is and isn't allowed and knows I have sorcerer-like powers to verify (viewing logs). We treat her like a human being with agency, we provide boundaries and guidance, and and don't rely on technical crutches and tools. She knows there are zero strikes. She 100% knows if she abuses this trust and responsibility, she'll be in a world of shit. She also knows that she needs to consciously strike a balance between fun time and school because we expect perfection at school. She gets anything besides straight A's in school, and the hammer comes down. Hasn't had to happen yet.
- Muromec 3y ago
  Brace yourself for impact, coz you will have a loota fun in about three years.
  - DangitBobby 3y ago
    There's not always an impact coming. Some kids just behave.
- deng 3y ago
  You know, there's different kind of kids. Consider yourself lucky that this works for you, but please also accept that this approach may not work for others.
  - ryandrake 3y ago
    Who knows if it will even work for us? Parenting is the terrifying experiment where you have a very small sample size and no control group.
- lrhegeba 3y ago
  if your measure of successful parenting is the 100% compliance with your rules: how can your child learn if every mistake is met with harsh disciplinary measures? how can it learn when every try/misstep isnt met with guidance but a penalty? judging from your text your educational style resembles more of a bootcamp. no judgement here, but please rethink this.
deng 3y ago
Couldn't agree more with this article. Parental controls are often times incredibly useless on many platforms. However, if you are a nerd, there are some good alternatives: - For desktop computing and gaming, use Linux. Yes, Linux is a viable gaming platform now, thanks to Valve/Steam. Use Timekpr-nExT (https://mjasnik.gitlab.io/timekpr-next/ https://mjasnik.gitlab.io/timekpr-next/) for managing screen time, which actually supports different screen time for "normal" computer use and gaming (you can define which processes count as "gaming", which in my case is 'steam' plus 'java' for Minecraft). Steam makes it easy to control which games are accessible, but in itself does not support any screen time. - There are some games which won't work on Linux, like Fortnite. I consider this a feature, but if your kid is absolutely adamant about needing to play it, cloud gaming can be a solution. - For content filtering, I use NextDNS as a DNS-based content filter, plus a local pi.hole. - For mobile, I use LineageOS plus TimeLimit (https://timelimit.io https://timelimit.io). TimeLimit has a very confusing UI/UX, but once you get used to it, it works pretty well. Also, at least in Germany, the full version can be bought old-school without the need for PlayStore/Google account, and it's cheap. Again, NextDNS is used for content filtering. - In school, iPads are used, which are actually the hardest to control. As said in the article, Apple's Screentime is horrible, but at least the app install stuff can be controlled, and there's the NextDNS app for iOS which works fine and can be PIN-protected. - For music, I first had Spotify, until I realized that it also has "video podcasts" with all kinds of horrible crap, as well as pornographic stuff disguised as "ASMR podcasts" and whatnot. Spotify obviously has no QC whatsoever and simply does not care. I switched to Deezer, which is also far from perfect, but at least it does not have video. - The biggest problem really is Youtube. There's Youtube Kids, which still contains tons of garbage, but it really is only for smaller kids. The "restricted" mode, which is aimed at 12+, is an absolute joke, as it still contains lots of terrible stuff and there's almost no difference to normal Youtube. So really, IMHO, there's no solution for it except active supervision what your kid is watching there.
lencastre 3y ago
I’m always curious about advancements in parenting controls for electronics, and it always boils down to a serious and frank convo with the child.
lencastre 3y ago
Also, why not just install shutup10 in Windows11 and further lock down all bloatware and undesired features?
wkjagt 3y ago
The simplest thing missing in iOS is multiple downtimes per day. My old router is able to do it, but Apple still hasn't done it. I don't want my kids on their phones during bed time and during a large part of the day (school!). But downtime lets you define just one period per day. I have to remember switching between them manually. I am sure I am doing something wrong. Something else that makes it hard to restrict things is that as a parent, you have to know all the features every app has. I think up to a point this is actually a good thing, so let me give an example when I think it's unrealistic. For example I don't want my daughter watching videos all the time, so most apps are blocked much of the time. She loves to draw on her iPad and listen to music though - two things I encourage - so I put Procreate (drawing app) and Spotify in her Always Allowed list. She's very artistic and makes beautiful drawings. But apparently you can import videos into Procreate, and Spotify now has music videos for many songs, so these apps quickly became her go to video watching apps during downtime. Ideally I think restrictions on platforms like these aren't app based, but "what do you do with them"-based. I'd like an option as a parent that lets me configure "no watching videos after 9pm". Some bonus gripes: - if I want to use parental controls for my kids' iOS devices, I need to have an Apple device as well. I can't, say, be on Android and Linux (I have a MacBook and an iPhone, so this doesn't apply to me personally). - Why does everything have to be an app these days. I remember having a router that my ISP provided. When we first got it, it had a very convenient web interface for parental controls. But then they decided to deprecate that and make it into a mobile app. I have a tiny phone (first gen iPhone SE, which I love) but it's not ideal for admin tasks like these.
svilen_dobrev 3y ago
i use nextdns.io. ~~$20 per year. Set up home router's dns to above. And devices' dns-es too. set up some ad-blocking list. Turn off tik-tok, youtube, etc (quite a few of those, with all their side domains) And if home router has time-bracket filtering, use it. The UI is probably wooden and terrible. But it's done once. Mine stops i'net to all unlisted devices from 23:00 till 6:00. All else is too much hassle. Or worse, that AND wrong results.
DangitBobby 3y ago
I have no control whatsoever over what kind of parental controls companies offer, but even if I did, I wouldn't accept the "punishment" of Congress revoking our freedoms. I don't even accept the premise that Congress is doing it to protect children. If they were, they'd be legislating parental controls. In other words, you took the bait (think of the children!).
- gjsman-1000 3y ago
  I don’t think that’s a correct interpretation of the article. It’s more that the systemic failure of parental controls create a more fertile environment for Congress to act; compared to a hypothetical situation where the parental controls actually worked and were used.
  - DangitBobby 3y ago
    The fundamental premise is that Congress is actually trying to protect the children, because that's the only way parental controls would have helped. It doesn't actually matter what the facts on the ground were, Congress would have found some excuse to try to pass this legislation.
  - smoldesu 3y ago
    For what it's worth, having pay-pornography channels next to Local 4 news has inspired a lot of letters to Congress in the past. I don't think that fostered any more of a "fertile environment for Congress to act" than the Christian Moms Against Seedless Watermelons movement.

131 points by gjsman-1000 3y ago

They really are awful. You definitely get the sense that these things were developed by software developers who didn’t eat their own dogfood. YouTube options for parents are the worst.

prox 3y ago

But at least the ads work! :) Good article. I really wonder if the management of these companies use their own products (or have kids?) Maybe there is a weird Venn diagram here?

iamthepieman 3y ago

Been so frustrated by the plethora of controls, their various inability to do what I want and the constant need to check the settings to make sure they didn't fail open or that I just forgot to lock something back down because my children needed access to do school and I was in a hurry and just disabled everything because it was simpler. Adding multiple devices of different types just exacerbates the problem and made me set everything to max lockdown and only unlock on demand. We have a switch. You can't lock it. You can set a minimum playtime of 15 minutes but then the kids sneak up to the attic and get their "free" 15 minutes of playtime in the middle of a school day. You can't set playtimes individually per kids account either. We have a family imac and our teens have android phones so now I've got three separate family account managers to use, family link (Google), screen time (apple) and Nintendo. No, make that 4, because I also have ubiquiti networking and have a separate WiFi network for kids devices so I can block the school provided chromebooks which I otherwise have no control over. You know what we've resorted to? Keeping devices in our bedroom and physically controlling them. Super simple, no passwords or random fail states.

jraby3 3y ago
On the switch parental controls if you choose to set limits by day then you can choose zero minutes. Our issue is that there is no cross platform parent control. Laptop, iPhone, switch, and let’s not forget about the TV. If I want to set a limit of screen time there is no way to just limit all time to 2 hours a day.
Joeri 3y ago
Enforcing screen time in any way other than physical device security is an exercise in frustration. With apple screen time is sometimes not counted, and sometimes counted when the screen is off. On mac especially it is basically useless. And in a multi-device scenario you cannot have the times add up across platforms, so unless you’re micromanaging they can have their full screen time allotment per platform. If you do go in for micromanaging you find that the syncing is unreliable, so the kids keep nagging to enable something that’s already enabled. There needs to be an interoperable standard for screen time and parental controls, with pluggable management apps that allow flexibility in the rule sets, and unified views across devices, accounts and platforms. This is on the tech companies to make it happen, because these platforms are so locked down that nobody else can do it.

magicseth 3y ago

We are tackling this at hellowonder.ai . I took what I learned building ai tools at Google and built a system that does more than just block bad content for kids. It helps kids find exciting content that is aligned with their parents, effectively allowing them much more freedom. It’s amazing how this system actually brings kids and parents closer together in practice. Email seth@ that domain if you have kids and would like to skip the waitlist.

iamthepieman 3y ago
Sounds like a really interesting system but the devil's in the details. I really don't see how you solve this without some combination of layer 3 filtering and individual kernel level apps for all supported devices.
freedomben 3y ago
Does this work for Android? I'd be interested but we have only Android and desktop Linux devices

wmf 3y ago

I heard MacOS screen time can't control Java apps like Minecraft.

hotnfresh 3y ago
It can. The trouble with Minecraft is that it phones home to a dozen IPV6 addresses every time it launches, and it practically never contacts the same one twice. Makes it impractical to apply allow-only address access to the Internet and still allow Minecraft. I’ve not manage to find any kind of list from MS of addresses to allow to stop the insanity. I hate whoever made this happen.

obviouslynotme 3y ago

Here's the actual problem. Kids are cute and annoying. You love them but they will drive you nuts if you don't drain their energy and attention. The previous solution to this was that parents booted their kids out of the house and made them play outside. This has somehow gone from normal parenting to abusive behavior that could get you arrested in some places with a possibility of losing the child. So instead, we throw tvs, ipads, and phones at them just so we can get a modicum of quiet. Not surprisingly, each one of those is bad for the kid. The developmental problem is screen time but the scary one is strangers on the Internet. Elsa Gate upset a lot of people, and that's not the worst thing that happens. Policing the Internet is a bad decision. Any Internet Safety Committee will eventually be staffed by the people you would least like to be there. That's especially problematic because one person's bad guy is another person's hero a lot of the time. Although this is the inevitable future due to increasing clamor by Internet companies for regulatory capture, it won't even be effective. Parental controls never work. Your kid has way more time and motivation to figure out workarounds, even if the parents and the company set everything correctly. Everyone also knows that there will be at least one friend whose parents don't care. This is true whether the parental controls are local or done by a central committee. The only solution to this mess is: * Remove the insane laws and policies that prevent parents from letting their children play outside, especially unaccompanied. * Educate parents on the importance of moderating and monitoring electronics use. * Educate parents on how to educate their children about the dangers of the Internet, especially social media, pornography, and pedophiles. * Accept that some parents don't care and will neglect their children no matter what you do. Instead, empower the parents that do care to easily and safely raise their children.

Libcat99 3y ago
The media has been pushing for years that playing outside is dangerous and to be punished. It's not just laws that need to change, it's public opinion.
- w-ll 3y ago
  Look, i dont have kids, so take this with a grain of salt, but even crossing the street at an interstion with clear rules, in a walkable city, is dangerous these days. Everyone is on their phones, not paying attention. I dont know who to blame, but collectively we are kinda F'd. Just the other day someone almost hit, while i was walking in a desiginated walking area and they just said "sorry, didnt see you." I replied in kind "duck you get off your phone" it sucks kids cant run around and play, i did, but also we've gotten ourselves in a bad spot with screens and phone. im not advocating anything, just saying, it sucks everwhere

ipython 3y ago

I'm so glad someone has called this out. I bought my kids Nintendo Switches and was appalled at the sad state of the Switch parental controls. No PIN locking, so my little ones can just swipe my teenager's Switch (which I don't bother with parental controls with). You can't specify "no time today" - your minimum time choice is 15 minutes. It's just plain awful. Apple TV is just as bad- I have Apple TVs throughout the house... but there's no way to lock them down either! Want to enforce no TV until a certain hour of the morning on Saturday? Too bad! I've just resorted to physically moving the errant devices into what we call "Switch jail" - aka my lockable network rack in the basement. Trouble is... I bought my teenage daughter a lockpicking set for Christmas... guess what happened next... I guess I should be proud of the effort!

hotnfresh 3y ago
One thing I can’t believe about Apple TV is that you can’t require a PIN for all apps but an allow-list—just for all apps. This, coupled with the fact that nothing other than first-party Apple apps respect the age rating settings makes the parental controls basically useless for anything but “lock everything”.
Zak 3y ago
I suggest progressively more challenging locks to hone her skills.
- askiiart 3y ago
  "This is the Lock Picking Daughter, and what I have for you today is a network cabinet with my Nintendo Switch locked inside."
  - ipython 3y ago
    Ha! I love it.
arp242 3y ago
> I bought my teenage daughter a lockpicking set for Christmas... guess what happened next I'm surprised you didn't see that one coming. There's an old saying: "give a small boy a hammer and he will discover everything needs pounding". Lockpicks are the same: "give a teen a lockpick, and they will discover every lock needs picking".

Spivak 3y ago

Posts like these make me appreciate my parents for not bothering to do any of this nonsense. Absolutely zero care in the slightest for movie/game/music ratings, completely unfiltered internet. The only standard I was held to as a kid was "will she have nightmares if we let her watch it." Honestly there's something to the theory that if you don't make it a thing it stops being a thing. At any point I could have put on an R rated movie, took one of my mom's cigarettes, or drank one of my dad's beers if I wanted but I didn't. For I'm sure their own amusement they even offered them to me just to watch me go bleh. And why would I -- ewwww those were boring dad movies. Hell I could have found porn but what stopped me wasn't parental controls, it was being 9 and not knowing such a thing existed. I'm still embarrassed that I never realized that that's what was behind the swinging doors at hollywood video until I was at college. And I still remember the moment that was tossed aside too; I was like 8-9 years old, couldn't sleep and came down stairs because my dad was still up watching a movie. He must been in the bathroom or getting something from the fridge but regardless he wasn't there so I got into his chair, put on his headphones and hit play. Didn't know at the time what I was watching but it was Kill Bill and I thought it was so cool these two badass women were fighting each other. When my dad came back and caught me I was mortified so sure I was gonna get in trouble. But no, he was like, "you think this is cool?" and got our another pair of headphones so we could watch together. Big don't tell your mom I'm letting you stay up late energy. After that my dad was like I know what she's goona like and we watched the entire Alien series together and Alien 2 is still my favorite movie to this day.

smoldesu 3y ago
Yeah, I posted this in one of these threads last time and got beaten down with sticks and swords. Oh well, I'm on a hot streak and have karma to burn, so I'll agree with you. Parents, if you don't want your children to have internet access, then don't give it to them. If you have reached a point where that is no longer possible (eg. grade school) then it's time to figure things out. Your kids will be perambulating around recess and interacting with all the lovely publicly schooled children. You know, the nose-pickers that stole their brother's smut magazine and brag about it being in their backpack. It's horrifying! But also real-life. I sympathize with my parents for trying to make the best environment for me growing up. I'm even happier (for my sake and theirs) that they didn't overreact when I was playing violent video games or walking in on them watching Shaun of the Dead. I'm not sure I'd be a personally confident individual without those early moments of humility between me and my parents.

Apreche 3y ago

This is because software engineers never actually use devices that have parental controls enabled. Most parents either don’t enable the controls, or never use devices while those controls are active. It’s a user experience that is not tested in real world conditions very much. And the people that do experience it, children, obviously don’t want it enabled whether it works or not. They’re not going to go reporting bugs, lol! What parents consider bugs are actually features for the children. Only the kind of adult that wrote this blog post actually uses devices that have parental controls enabled, and sees how they actually work. The author suggests that companies should make their parental controls work to stave off government regulation. I think there’s actually a midway solution. I don’t want to see a government put its hand on the wheel and do the controls themselves. Instead, the government should regulate the companies and use the force of law to get them to make their parental controls work. Create a standard for parental control features that must be offered, tested, and working. If a platform doesn’t have the controls available that actually work, then you can’t sell it. If a government tells Apple it can’t sell iPhones until it fixes these problems with screen time, or that Nintendo can’t sell switches until it fixes their issues, then you can be damn sure they’ll be fixed within the week.

tradertef 3y ago
>>Only the kind of adult that wrote this blog post actually uses devices that have parental controls enabled, and sees how they actually work. It seems he is 21 years old :)
hotnfresh 3y ago
> This is because software engineers never actually use devices that have parental controls enabled. Yeah, it’s super-obvious. In many cases they’ve put work into implementing crap that’s useless without a lot more work to add more features… or they could have done something much simpler and it’d at least be a lot better than what they’ve actually done.
- VincentEvans 3y ago
  After apple moved iphone power button from the top to the side of the device - most times i try to turn off my phone one-handed - i take a screenshot instead. My camera roll is full of screenshots of my lock screen and occasional random website. I was going to say - do they use their own devices? But if they don’t - what do they use? I mean it’s an iphone…

treyd 3y ago

A lot of the first set of points seem to be a result of Microsoft's self-sabotaging. I'm not going to pretend any Linux-based OS has any support for parental controls, but especially the points about the news feed and search didn't used to be an issue back in the days of like XP.

I_am_uncreative 3y ago
Back in those days, most families just had one computer, too, so it made it easier to monitor use.
fifteen1506 3y ago
Gnome has but I assume they're very basic. Currently using Qustodio and Linux boots to Waydroid (Android).

tempestn 3y ago

Yes parental controls are horribly complex and buggy. In my ideal world we'd just do away with them entirely, and not replace them with overly restrictive laws instead. As a parent I would rather spend my time actually talking with my kids about computer and internet use rather than fighting to work around these restrictive systems. Fortunately there isn't (yet!) a need to actually prove age when creating accounts in most cases. Edit: to be fair, I can imagine how they would be useful in some cases if they didn't suck so much, so I'm sympathetic to the OP. But I'd far and away take "nothing" over what we have now.

jonhohle 3y ago

I was just thinking this week about a business that offered MDM-like functionality for parents. My wife and I are strict with screen time limits and content filtering and have a teenager who likes to see what he can get away with. I have to manage Screen Time, OpenWRT firewall/DNS rules, Xbox limits, Blizzard limits, PlayStation limits. What I hate most about Screen Time is web content management. It’s so cumbersome and any change causes Safari to shut down on the client to load new settings. There’s also no way to “Always Allow” a website (say things necessary for school), so if you want to have strict limits on time, I have to be ready at a moment’s notice to approve time during whatever random school period requires it. That being said, we’ve found a solution that mostly works for us in a school setting. It’s better than what schools offered with Chromebooks, which were effectively wide open and didn’t allow any parent restrictions for time or content.

ec109685 3y ago
Apple’s App Store rules prevents MDM for parental control apps.

fungiblecog 3y ago

Parental controls are just a feature for advertising purposes

qweqwe14 3y ago

> What IP address is that kid’s laptop again? Technically per-device based filtering is done using MAC addresses, since local IPs can change sometimes. But even then it's trivial to change your MAC address even on an iPhone.

joezydeco 3y ago
The router-based controls just don't work when the kid's phone has cellular access, combined with unlimited data plans. So then you're back to the device controls which don't work. Some carriers offer primitive time-based access control but, again, they are broken too.

password4321 3y ago

Amazon Kids+ seems to work well, almost entirely allow list driven.

autoexec 3y ago

No software will ever replace parenting. If you have an 8 year who needs to do homework you sit them at the kitchen table with a laptop and peek over their shoulder every 15-20 minutes. If your 8 year old is browsing porn instead of doing math you're going to notice. Better yet, sit down right next to your kid and help them. If I worried about this, my solution would probably be more like this: Small children (say under 8-10) get computers with zero internet access. Not even an ethernet adapter. Zero unsupervised access to the internet on other devices. Older children (10-14) get devices with access to the internet, but first get education on what is/isn't appropriate to do/share online. I'll still check over their shoulders from time to time and everything is logged at the router. Ad blockers everywhere. Everything kept fully transparent so they know monitoring is happening and if I see requests made to questionable websites we can have a conversation about it. By now it'll be drilled into their heads that everything they do online is monitored by us, by the state, and by other companies who will sell that information to data brokers where it will end up collected into dossiers that will follow them for the rest of their lives. Young adults (14-18) don't need parental controls and are hopefully tech savvy enough by now to get around any if I tried using them anyway.

eesmith 3y ago
You never woke up after your parents went to bed to watch TV? With cable you could sometimes get a clear spot in the scrambled channels. And I assume you were not a latchkey kid, alone for hours before an adult came home? Never left unattended for hours when a 7 year old? (When sick, and both parents need to work; or on Saturday if one parent is running errands and the other handling lawn care; or any of many situations I can think of.) And from a rich enough family that could afford a personal device for each kid? (And no one shared or "borrowed" devices?) Where do you even get a computer these days with zero internet access? What software will the kid use? Your router log only handles questionable domains. Logging doesn't handle most of the issues mentioned in the article, like not wanting your 6 year old to see the "headlines of the day about how the world is on fire", or not wanting your kids to download something from the Microsoft Store.
- fifteen1506 3y ago

somethoughts 3y ago

Surprisingly Google's FamilyLink when paired with Chromebook/Android Tablets work quite well. You can control/add devices pretty easily and block all web access and apps by default. You can add specific sites and apps manually (without manually approving random IP addresses).

csnover 3y ago

When the APA released their guidance on the use of social media by adolescents[0] earlier this year, they cited a study[1] that described the impacts of instructive[2] (a.k.a. active) versus restrictive[3] parental mediation in preventing cyber-bullying. This study found that the use of active mediation was associated with a decrease in victimisation, whereas restrictive parental mediation was not only unhelpful, it actually increased the risk of victimisation. In the discussion section, the authors reference several other studies that also suggest restrictive parental mediation is worse than doing nothing when it comes to stopping online victimisation. The APA appear to go out of their way in the guidance to explain that what they mean by “adult monitoring” is open coaching and discussion, not spying and blocking, but this sort of distinction seems to be missed or deliberately ignored in many discussions about online safety. As such, the source of the problem here doesn’t appear to be that the tools are inadequate at their jobs, but rather that they’re all fundamentally the wrong tools. In this case, no amount of engineering can solve it. Given this, perhaps the question should not be “What parental controls?”, but rather, “Should these kinds of restrictive parental controls even exist?” [0] https://www.apa.org/topics/social-media-internet/health-advisory-adolescent-social-media-use https://www.apa.org/topics/social-media-internet/health-advi... [1] https://doi.org/10.1016/j.compedu.2020.104026 https://doi.org/10.1016/j.compedu.2020.104026 [2] Definition from the study: “Instructive mediation […] explicitly involves children in the process of online monitoring. For instance, a parent adopting an instructive approach might appraise their children of the potential harms of certain online material, the appropriateness of sharing personal information online, and the latent danger of interacting with strangers on social media platforms.” [3] Also from the study: “Restrictive mediation does not directly include children in the intervention process. Rather, it involves the curtailing of cyber-routines through blocking software or parental monitoring of children's online habits and associations. Shielding children from the dangers of the Internet is given primacy over educating them about such hazards[.]”

eesmith 3y ago
Right, but adolescents in the study are in the age range 12 to 18, and the study specifically concerns cyberhate victimization, while the issues raised mostly concern younger kids, and include things like blocking access to online stores. (The "Kids Online Safety Act" is nominally about "kids", defined as "under the age of 13", but the bill's text mostly concerns minors, defined as "under the age of 17".) We just installed MS Windows 11 and it's clearly trying to get your attention with its tabloid-like feed meant to draw you to their web site. It takes time to learn media literacy, and companies should not be allowed to use the excuse that parents simply need to monitor more, while they do everything they can to get people to use their services and to buy from them, without distinguishing between 6 year olds and 60 year olds. What is a single parent to do to provide adult monitoring for their 8 year old latchkey kid?

ec109685 3y ago

Other issues with parental controls: - certain games require admin privileges on windows and there’s no easy way to say, “always launch this game without requiring a parent” - children accounts have irrevocable restrictions. E.g. YouTube prevents upload of videos, regardless of whether a parent allows it. So kids just spin up another account. - Microsoft makes it almost impossible to do simple things like allow child to buy a Minecraft realm. 10’s of clicks, errors and weird flows - parental controls don’t cross ecosystem, and no federation, so you have to setup each service independently - there’s no way for the device parental controls to influence web based services - there’s no way on Apple devices to allow a particular show, but in general restrict mature content. E.g. if a parent has different standards for violence, language or sexuality. The right solution is to put full control in parent’s hands (no saying 12 year olds can’t do X), support making device restrictions that are inherited by any application or site on it. And as others have said, incentive companies to remove bugs and make the solutions workable and not easily exploitable. The Consumer Protection Agency wouldn’t allow a toy that hurt children to exist, but don’t care if parental controls are actively harmful.

Nasrudith 3y ago

Such arrogance in thinking that it justifies congressional involvement. They're the ones who fucked the children into existence yet won't take your own goddamned responsibility and instead support the "think of the children" bull-crap. Seriously what the hell is wrong with people that they think the best thing for children is to create a goddamned dystopia for them in the name of "safety"?

restrainingbolt 3y ago

Well if anyone is interested, we're working on solving many of the problems outlined in this post. In particular our system sits in between the child and their internet, so we can do things like filter out links and social media posts before it even gets to the child's computer. Hopefully we'll be launched in 1-2 weeks, sign up for our email list if you want! https://parentcontrols.win/ https://parentcontrols.win/

loehnsberg 3y ago
I think this is a great idea! My kids use iPads and managing their screen time works well with what iOS has on board, but I cannot control social media, as this would nearly always intrude the privacy of the kid.

friend_and_foe 3y ago

Make no mistake, they're not trying to pass these laws because parental controls suck. They're trying to pass these laws so they can control what we say and read on the internet.

nine_k 3y ago
Levying fines is also fun!
ashleyn 3y ago
The Heritage Foundation openly telegraphed their intent to use KOSA, should it pass, to push for classification of all transgender resources as adult content. [1] [1]: https://www.techdirt.com/2023/05/24/heritage-foundation-says-that-of-course-gop-will-use-kosa-to-censor-lgbtq-content/ https://www.techdirt.com/2023/05/24/heritage-foundation-says...

deepthaw 3y ago

I have a special needs son. Parental controls are useless. Huge swathes of legitimate content gets blocked while he can still get to horrible material I don’t want him watching. His inability to obey any rules has resulted in him losing his pc because we simply couldn’t keep plugging all the holes he was finding to sneak into YouTube. And don’t get me started on streaming services where if you let your kid watch Star Wars, they can also watch The Simpsons Treehouse of Horror episodes.

ryandrake 3y ago

I'm obviously a terrible parent. My 10 year old gets unfiltered access to the Internet, with no technical restrictions, and she is responsible for moderating her time spent playing and browsing. She knows what is and isn't allowed and knows I have sorcerer-like powers to verify (viewing logs). We treat her like a human being with agency, we provide boundaries and guidance, and and don't rely on technical crutches and tools. She knows there are zero strikes. She 100% knows if she abuses this trust and responsibility, she'll be in a world of shit. She also knows that she needs to consciously strike a balance between fun time and school because we expect perfection at school. She gets anything besides straight A's in school, and the hammer comes down. Hasn't had to happen yet.

Muromec 3y ago
Brace yourself for impact, coz you will have a loota fun in about three years.
- DangitBobby 3y ago
  There's not always an impact coming. Some kids just behave.
deng 3y ago
You know, there's different kind of kids. Consider yourself lucky that this works for you, but please also accept that this approach may not work for others.
- ryandrake 3y ago
  Who knows if it will even work for us? Parenting is the terrifying experiment where you have a very small sample size and no control group.
lrhegeba 3y ago
if your measure of successful parenting is the 100% compliance with your rules: how can your child learn if every mistake is met with harsh disciplinary measures? how can it learn when every try/misstep isnt met with guidance but a penalty? judging from your text your educational style resembles more of a bootcamp. no judgement here, but please rethink this.

deng 3y ago

Couldn't agree more with this article. Parental controls are often times incredibly useless on many platforms. However, if you are a nerd, there are some good alternatives: - For desktop computing and gaming, use Linux. Yes, Linux is a viable gaming platform now, thanks to Valve/Steam. Use Timekpr-nExT (https://mjasnik.gitlab.io/timekpr-next/ https://mjasnik.gitlab.io/timekpr-next/) for managing screen time, which actually supports different screen time for "normal" computer use and gaming (you can define which processes count as "gaming", which in my case is 'steam' plus 'java' for Minecraft). Steam makes it easy to control which games are accessible, but in itself does not support any screen time. - There are some games which won't work on Linux, like Fortnite. I consider this a feature, but if your kid is absolutely adamant about needing to play it, cloud gaming can be a solution. - For content filtering, I use NextDNS as a DNS-based content filter, plus a local pi.hole. - For mobile, I use LineageOS plus TimeLimit (https://timelimit.io https://timelimit.io). TimeLimit has a very confusing UI/UX, but once you get used to it, it works pretty well. Also, at least in Germany, the full version can be bought old-school without the need for PlayStore/Google account, and it's cheap. Again, NextDNS is used for content filtering. - In school, iPads are used, which are actually the hardest to control. As said in the article, Apple's Screentime is horrible, but at least the app install stuff can be controlled, and there's the NextDNS app for iOS which works fine and can be PIN-protected. - For music, I first had Spotify, until I realized that it also has "video podcasts" with all kinds of horrible crap, as well as pornographic stuff disguised as "ASMR podcasts" and whatnot. Spotify obviously has no QC whatsoever and simply does not care. I switched to Deezer, which is also far from perfect, but at least it does not have video. - The biggest problem really is Youtube. There's Youtube Kids, which still contains tons of garbage, but it really is only for smaller kids. The "restricted" mode, which is aimed at 12+, is an absolute joke, as it still contains lots of terrible stuff and there's almost no difference to normal Youtube. So really, IMHO, there's no solution for it except active supervision what your kid is watching there.

lencastre 3y ago

I’m always curious about advancements in parenting controls for electronics, and it always boils down to a serious and frank convo with the child.

lencastre 3y ago

Also, why not just install shutup10 in Windows11 and further lock down all bloatware and undesired features?

wkjagt 3y ago

The simplest thing missing in iOS is multiple downtimes per day. My old router is able to do it, but Apple still hasn't done it. I don't want my kids on their phones during bed time and during a large part of the day (school!). But downtime lets you define just one period per day. I have to remember switching between them manually. I am sure I am doing something wrong. Something else that makes it hard to restrict things is that as a parent, you have to know all the features every app has. I think up to a point this is actually a good thing, so let me give an example when I think it's unrealistic. For example I don't want my daughter watching videos all the time, so most apps are blocked much of the time. She loves to draw on her iPad and listen to music though - two things I encourage - so I put Procreate (drawing app) and Spotify in her Always Allowed list. She's very artistic and makes beautiful drawings. But apparently you can import videos into Procreate, and Spotify now has music videos for many songs, so these apps quickly became her go to video watching apps during downtime. Ideally I think restrictions on platforms like these aren't app based, but "what do you do with them"-based. I'd like an option as a parent that lets me configure "no watching videos after 9pm". Some bonus gripes: - if I want to use parental controls for my kids' iOS devices, I need to have an Apple device as well. I can't, say, be on Android and Linux (I have a MacBook and an iPhone, so this doesn't apply to me personally). - Why does everything have to be an app these days. I remember having a router that my ISP provided. When we first got it, it had a very convenient web interface for parental controls. But then they decided to deprecate that and make it into a mobile app. I have a tiny phone (first gen iPhone SE, which I love) but it's not ideal for admin tasks like these.

svilen_dobrev 3y ago

i use nextdns.io. ~~$20 per year. Set up home router's dns to above. And devices' dns-es too. set up some ad-blocking list. Turn off tik-tok, youtube, etc (quite a few of those, with all their side domains) And if home router has time-bracket filtering, use it. The UI is probably wooden and terrible. But it's done once. Mine stops i'net to all unlisted devices from 23:00 till 6:00. All else is too much hassle. Or worse, that AND wrong results.

DangitBobby 3y ago

I have no control whatsoever over what kind of parental controls companies offer, but even if I did, I wouldn't accept the "punishment" of Congress revoking our freedoms. I don't even accept the premise that Congress is doing it to protect children. If they were, they'd be legislating parental controls. In other words, you took the bait (think of the children!).

gjsman-1000 3y ago
I don’t think that’s a correct interpretation of the article. It’s more that the systemic failure of parental controls create a more fertile environment for Congress to act; compared to a hypothetical situation where the parental controls actually worked and were used.
- DangitBobby 3y ago
  The fundamental premise is that Congress is actually trying to protect the children, because that's the only way parental controls would have helped. It doesn't actually matter what the facts on the ground were, Congress would have found some excuse to try to pass this legislation.
- smoldesu 3y ago
  For what it's worth, having pay-pornography channels next to Local 4 news has inspired a lot of letters to Congress in the past. I don't think that fostered any more of a "fertile environment for Congress to act" than the Christian Moms Against Seedless Watermelons movement.