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Microsoft now thirstily injects a poll when you download Google Chrome
- bogwog 3y agoRegardless of who wins this battle, we all lose in the end anyways.
- JadeNB 3y agoHijacking my browsing experience to try to direct me away from my goal definitely shows me the added value of "the trust of Microsoft." (Also, I think that I understand its meaning, but 'thirstily' seems like a weird adverb here … and, while I'm on language, does Microsoft really misspell "its" in "Make Microsoft Edge work it's best"?)
- queuebert 3y agoI'm visualizing Microsoft busting into my browsing experience like the Kool-Aid Man through a wall.
- irrational 3y agoI don't have a Windows machine to test with, but does it do the same thing if you try to download Firefox?
- onion2k 3y agoIt didn't for me when I tried from my reasonably-locked-down-Windows-dev laptop. I still wouldn't rule it out for consumers though.
- darklycan51 3y agoI'll be honest, I don't have a problem with this while Google is and was allowed to insert their own on pages such as Google.com Everyone and their mothers thinks Google is the default internet, no different than people "forced" to use windows cause they don't know what Linux is. If so then I have no problem with Edge taking market share away from Chrome. If you want to criticize this then ban ALL advertisement for web browsers anywhere else it is in the real world, not fair and will just maintain Google's monopoly. And based on the recent years and trends of Google completely destroying the open web, is anyone really pro Chrome domination anymore? Firefox and other competing smaller player who depend on Google money aren't looking to compete either, it is beyond obvious, so.
- JadeNB 3y ago> I'll be honest, I don't have a problem with this while Google is and was allowed to insert their own on pages such as Google.com I think that there's a big difference between a company putting ads on a page they own, and a company hijacking an app that they own. For better or worse, the expectation on the web is that wherever you browse to might try to pull all kinds of shady tricks on you, and we more or less learn to tune it out (and hopefully also to run some sort of appropriate protection). I think that the expectation, especially from a reputable software maker, is that the browser itself will not get in your way. Maybe things are moving in the direction that that's not the expectation, either, but, if so, then I think it's good to make that process as high-friction as possible. Also, even if there's not a difference, "I'm OK with Microsoft pulling user-hostile tricks because Google does" may be a decent rebuttal of "Microsoft is worse than Google", which is not a claim I saw here, but it is not much of a rebuttal of "Microsoft is doing some shady tricks."
- ToucanLoucan 3y ago> I'll be honest, I don't have a problem with this while Google is and was allowed to insert their own on pages such as Google.com You're going to get DV'd to hell but you're absolutely right. At the end of the day, Microsoft injecting ads for Edge when it detects you're downloading another popular browser is literally no different than Google advertising Chrome on damn near every website they run. Google has somehow managed to maintain this image as this scrappy underdog entity and it's absolutely ridiculous the mental gymnastics some people will engage in to excuse all their anti-competitive behaviors. Edit: I suppose it's technically different because they are injecting content into a website that wouldn't otherwise be there, and one can make the argument that a web browser should only render what is served. But also I have literally a dozen extensions that all alter content in the browser (many of which are for Google owned websites!) not the least of which is an adblocker. I have a hard time saying Microsoft adding a blurb about Edge being good to search results for Chrome or Firefox is the end of the free internet.
- JadeNB 3y ago> Google has somehow managed to maintain this image as this scrappy underdog entity and it's absolutely ridiculous the mental gymnastics some people will engage in to excuse all their anti-competitive behaviors. But nothing about this story is about Google, except that the nastiness that Microsoft is doing involves a Google product. What Microsoft is doing is wrong because it's wrong, not because they're doing it to a Google product, and my moral position on Google (also untrustworthy and shady) doesn't come into it.
- SpaceManNabs 3y agoEvery day I am happy that I switched to Ubuntu and Firefox 24/7, except for work computer...
- amlib 3y agoI'm glad my employer lets me install any system I want on my work machine. I really can't stand dealing with windows outside of a VM.
- queuebert 3y agoFind a new job? Only slightly kidding. I do most of my work on a System76 laptop, and I loathe every minute I'm forced by my employer to check my email through Outlook. The day they shut down my Alpine connection to my work email was the beginning of a long slide downward for the quality of this place.
- LtWorf 3y agokmail and thunderbird work with outlook's web popup authentication thing.
- SpaceManNabs 3y agoI dont mind Mac and chrome.
- chaps 3y agoWhen an old employer required us to use windows, I just built a Linux VM that was always set to fullsceen. Surprisingly they were okay with it, so maybe you'll have the same luck?
- kadoban 3y agoIf nothing else, WSL is part of windows now, so it's trivial to get that set up and hard to argue against most places. You still get stuck with your UI being largely windows, but the guts all being over on linux is enough for me personally.
- albert_e 3y agoone of the options in that poll should be ... "THIS!"
- brucethemoose2 3y agoIn other words, Microsoft nags you use their user tracking adware instead of Google's user tracking adware... I am indifferent to this. For what its worth, it doesn't seem to recognize Chromium derivatives like Cromite or Firefox derivatives like Mercury.
- JadeNB 3y ago> I am indifferent to this. Why? "The browser inserts itself into the browsing experience in a user-hostile way" is a bad slope to start down, even if the browser starts by inserting itself between one untrustworthy product and another.
- freyes 3y agoThis is two gang bands fighting on the street, there is no good guy here. Google is so annoying trying constantly to push you to use Chrome when you visit their websites
- Bud 3y ago[dead]
- CobrastanJorji 3y ago"Their" is an important word here. Google's website nags you when you visit Google's website. Microsoft's browser nags you when you visit Google's website.
- brucethemoose2 3y agoUsing Microsoft's operating system.
- CamperBob2 3y agoOn my computer.
- glimshe 3y agoTry deleting Google cookies on every session, like I do, and you'll see how often Google nags you.
- RobotToaster 3y ago"Thirstily"?
- whoisthemachine 3y agoA weird synonym for "Desperately".
- 3seashells 3y agoBulging browsers, throbbing with Spyware, thirsty for your data. Hot single browsers near you?
- zengid 3y agoThe Verge has a long running joke that Bing is very horny.
- hotnfresh 3y agoIt’s gen z for horny.
- JohnFen 3y agoThat meaning of it predates gen Z by a long way.
- hotnfresh 3y agoI’d never in my life seen or heard it used in that sense until like 5 years ago.
- mixmastamyk 3y agoFirst encounter here, if true.
- JohnFen 3y agoInteresting. It was part of the slang vocabulary at my high school, roughly 40 years ago.
- Spivak 3y agoYou can really feel the frustration of the Edge devs refusing to admit that Google got a culture victory when they spec'd into the science tree. Edge being a better browser isn't going to sway anyone anymore. Every browser is good enough and so you need not just differentiating features but a differentiating ethos and Google/MS are the same now. Firefox gets users because they're inde, foss, and built up a lot of community goodwill via their other community projects.
- jsnell 3y agoDupe: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38008100 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38008100
- daft_pink 3y agoThe real reason, your browser seems like spyware and is full of ads, is not listed.
- zengid 3y agoOff topic but I love how the Verge sticks to their bit that Bing is super horny.
- spullara 3y agoGoogle constantly nags you to install Chrome whenever you first visit their properties. All of it is super annoying but I see Google doing it more than Microsoft.
- Liquix 3y agoYeah, but google owns that domain and you chose to navigate to it, so they have every right to do so. Imagine if navigating to apple.com in Chrome displayed a hardcoded survey asking why you're not buying an Android phone. Over the line
- donmcronald 3y ago> Imagine if navigating to apple.com in Chrome displayed a hardcoded survey asking why you're not buying an Android phone. Plus, where's the limit in Windows? If they get away with this for Edge and it works, why not do the same for Dropbox vs OneDrive? Or how about getting Edge to nag you about Office when you go to Google Docs? Google could do the same with Chrome when you visit office.com. There must be a point where having these massive companies delivering features that are objectively bad for users that are trapped in the ecosystem needs to be recognized as something that requires antitrust enforcement. All 3 major platform owners should be broken up into dozens of smaller companies; Microsoft, Google, Apple.
- darthrupert 3y ago"Why didn't you switch to the obviously superior Firefox?"
- api 3y agoThe year of the Linux desktop could come not through the Linux desktop getting better but just by waiting for MS to get bad enough that it starts repelling people. Of course you also probably hear some chuckling coming from Cupertino...
- hiramfromthechi 3y agoIf I was Microsoft, I'd wanna know too. After all, it's a race for every single one of our data points, and then some. Either way, you gotta admit it's ironically funny that Microsoft wants to keep/poach Chrome users into their own... wait for it... Chromium-based browser.
- ExoticPearTree 3y agoI mean, the fact that they had to use Chromium as the underlying framework for a browser, considering how much resources MS has... feels like a monumental failure at being able to make a decent browser.
- donmcronald 3y agoI'm sure they don't see any value in maintaining a browser. The attitude nowadays seems to be that good software is simply a means to deliver ads and paid up-sells while sucking up as much personal information as possible. Why bother building something when you can just slap some lipstick on an existing pig and get to the same level of user exploitation with far less effort?
- ChrisArchitect 3y ago[Dupe] Lots of discussion yesterday: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38008100 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38008100
- marricks 3y agoWith how much Chrome "Oops"ed Firefox[1] I am fully in the "kick back and eat popcorn" mindset of this fight. If only Chrome could do the same thing to Edge than people might be clamoring back for Firefox. That said, Firefox would have the least ability to stop this... if it gets to all out mudslinging the only option that would be "safe" is Safari on MacOS using duckduckgo or something. As any other config someone can and would inject "nudges" to the other. [1] https://www.zdnet.com/article/former-mozilla-exec-google-has-sabotaged-firefox-for-years/ https://www.zdnet.com/article/former-mozilla-exec-google-has...
- MSFT_Edging 3y agoIts honestly amazing how much worse google maps runs on Firefox as opposed to Chrome. It wasn't always like that and I feel like across my devices between windows and Linux, google maps is barely usable in Firefox anymore. If I need to do any real map searching, I need to break out chrome if I have any respect for my time. I'd be interested in reading a writeup by someone knowledgeable in web tech that would explain what on earth is happening between these two browsers when both are serving maps.google.com.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- marricks 3y agoI'd be interested to hear what it was like on the dev team. I'm sure they don't super care about throwing elbows at Firefox now that that fight is won, so maybe the issues are just holdover from past decisions. But 10 years ago... was it just "don't test on firefox"? Or "heeey, we just made a brand new feature [that no one else uses] go ahead and use it in mail and maps!" Or more openly nefarious?
- MSFT_Edging 3y ago10 years ago, maps worked great on Firefox, I'd be genuinely surprised if they didn't test it there. I genuinely think they're doing anti-optimization for firefox users at this point. Edit: Did some google employee see this and turn a "maps on firefox load speed" knob? I decided to test again on a private window vs my typical plugin laden setup and it seems to be performing far faster than it has in years. wtf.
- redbell 3y agoApparently, MS didn't learn from its IE antitrust experience in the 90s. The FTC should take action now.. I have Chrome installed on my Windows machine but haven't launched it in months. I also have Edge installed and set as the default browser, but guess what? The other day, I needed to test some work related to web-sev on Chrome, and the moment I clicked its icon in the taskbar, windows showed up a pop-up notification that read something like: "use Edge instead, a fast, secure.. bla bla browser". Edit: I definitely agree that Google is behaving the same, in a way or another but what pains me in the Microsoft’s case is that I already paid for my Windows license, so I expect some level of freedom unlike using Google for free.
- omginternets 3y agoIs there a way to file a complaint online?
- whalesalad 3y agoI’m surprised by their candor with all of this too. It’s ingrained in their culture.
- darknavi 3y agoI work in games at Microsoft and FWIW it really isn't, at least not any where near our team.
- thomastjeffery 3y agoWell, your team isn't anywhere near the Windows or Edge team, is it?
- folbec 3y agohere it's more like the Bing team. It's all about targeted ads.
- toddmorey 3y agoIt’s not a switch campaign but Google just begged me to login before showing me my search results. Both of you, stop. It’s a desperate look. I live in constant fear that the Arc team (my beloved browser) will start chasing revenue with these privacy invasive services. Can I please have the option to just pay for the software? I’m so tired of being the product.
- bigbacaloa 3y ago[dead]
- 66yatman 3y agoThis is supposed to be the reaction from the beginning. So bad it's won't much appealing in the moment.
- secondcoming 3y agoSpeaking of injecting things... every time I, when using Chrome to read GMail emails, switch email accounts, iPadOS prompts me to use Apple's Mail app. I can't turn it off. I will never use their app. How does it know I'm switching email accounts?
- tsycho 3y agoIt's unfortunate how any discussion around Google/Apple/Meta in particular just devolves to the same repeated talking points :( For the "Google does it too on google.com" commenters, imagine if Microsoft did this when you are downloading Firefox. Would you still find that okay?
- mordae 3y agoNo, but I laugh at closed source browser vendors waging a war against each other.
- chankstein38 3y agoAll trying to get you to use the same damned browser. Edge says it itself, "Edge is Chromium!" then why should I use yours instead of the one I'm familiar with?
- diggan 3y agoEdge is Chromium, with the added trust of Microsoft, is what Microsoft is saying. At least according to the article. Not sure which devil I trust the most, probably have the same level of trust in both of them, almost zero.
- ExoticPearTree 3y ago“Microsoft Edge runs on the same technology as Chrome, with the added trust of Microsoft.” - this begs the question: who actually trusts MS? and for what.
- yjftsjthsd-h 3y agoA person could coherently argue that if you're trusting Microsoft with the operating system you might as well trust them with the browser and not add another party to trust in the form of Google. (I'm not saying I hold that view, but I can see how a person could argue that.)
- Mr_Modulo 3y agoBelieve it or not this article does not cover everything. When you try to set Chrome (or any alternate browser) as default on Windows 10/11 a pop up appears suggesting you use Edge[1]. [1]: https://www.techrepublic.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/Figure-c-Change-default-browser-windows11.jpg?x59054 https://www.techrepublic.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/Figu...
- CSMastermind 3y agoIf Microsoft wants to handicap Google they should give you the option to block ads at the OS level.
- manuelabeledo 3y agoWho would want to shoot someone in the head, while being right next to him? Microsoft has riddled Windows with ads.
- chankstein38 3y ago"My reason isn't listed" Because I'd rather use a different browser and that should be sufficient information. I don't care about their numbers or their desire to have people use their browser, I want to use the browser I want to use on the thing I paid a bunch of money for.
- sleepybrett 3y agoThat's just sad. That said no one should be using chrome.
- TheRealDunkirk 3y agoI use Windows (personally) only to play one game, which I hear runs under Proton. One day soon, I'm going to try setting it up. When I was in 4th grade, I didn't understand the line in Star Wars, "The more you tighten your grasp, the more systems will slip through your fingers." Now I do.
- alephxyz 3y agoThey also added a search box to my task bar after the last Windows update (albeit with a "do you want to keep it?" prompt). Guess what browser the search results open in? Hint: it's not my default browser
- matthewfelgate 3y agoMicrosoft abusing it's monopoly. Will get a lot less publicity here than the anti-Google haters.