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Doctors on TikTok
- JimtheCoder 3y agoIt's always the plastic surgeons doing stuff like this... Proctologists...not so much.
- itake 3y agoproctologist's work has a smaller audience...
- NoZebra120vClip 3y agoThey're falling behind. They're bringing up the rear in the rush to social media. They wouldn't want to be the butt of jokes. They can't manually type in URLs, because they're always getting distracted by the colon.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- passwordoops 3y agoThe Long Tail in action
- AraceliHarker 3y agoDo experts who are active on social media often comment on things outside of their field of expertise?
- ohdannyboy 3y agoFWIW one of the internet's first viral shock images was proctological and it was very, uh, wide spread... So there is an audience, they're just not advertiser friendly.
- throwaway_goats 3y agoNop! That was just a guy who likes putting big things in his ass. He’s called Kirk and he’s active on forums about the subject.
- tibbydudeza 3y agoI have seen some foot doctors as well (they do ask permission) - more of a warning to take care of your foot injuries if you are a diabetic like me.
- thenerdhead 3y agoIt’s all of them. Dentists, foot doctors, cardiologists, surgeons, etc. And yes, even proctologists. Sure as hell beats traditional advertising means in this digital age.
- userbinator 3y agocontained details that would likely make patients identifiable to themselves. IMHO the real question of privacy is whether they would be identifiable to others, not to themselves.
- batch12 3y ago> IMHO the real question of privacy is whether they would be identifiable to others, not to themselves I disagree. Just because my headless naked body can't easily be traced to me doesn't mean my privacy isn't violated if pictures are shared without my explicit concent.
- Bukhmanizer 3y ago> can't *easily* be traced to me Yeah, it would be identifiable to others, so that’s a violation of your privacy. A more accurate analogy is if someone shared a picture of the back of your own hand or something that would be basically impossible for anyone but you to recognize. I’m not saying it is or is not a violation of your privacy, but your example is flawed.
- waffleiron 3y agoIf I was in a situation where I have not given consent to take that picture, and I see that shared, it would make me wonder if any other pictures I didn’t agree to were also taken. See Ryan Calo’s work: https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1641487 https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1641487
- lobochrome 3y agoHow so? Because of the "easily" qualification? Is this ironic? If it can't be traced to you it is by definition perfect privacy.
- JamisonM 3y agoIf there is a publicly available picture of you that you did not consent to be published and literally nobody can currently identify it as you that is still a privacy violation. It is a violation because of the lack of consent, but it is also a violation because now you have to live with the fact that maybe some other information can link you to that picture in the future. There is no such thing as perfect privacy if any link can be created in the future, and the fear of the creation of that link going forward is itself a problem for the subject.
- foreverobama 3y ago[dead]
- tonymet 3y agoThe more we can see their true nature the better
- cosmojg 3y agoAt least in my feed, I'd argue what's worse is the surprising frequency with which medical doctors engage in credential-backed sensationalism, sometimes even manufacturing outright misinformation, all for the sake of views. TikTok and platforms like it have birthed a disturbing little army of Dr. Oz wannabes.
- thenerdhead 3y agoHow else do you get views? Be the first to say something confidently even if it is incorrect in the long term. This is exactly what happened with the pandemic and many of these medical personalities are backpedaling their original claims/takes.
- Bukhmanizer 3y agoI liked this article but mining social media comment sections to show “impact” like > “TikTok singlehandedly made me not seek medical care recently,” wrote one user is pretty cringey. You could probably find comments in favor or against literally any story that you want to tell.
- 112233 3y agoOnce you have gone that far, what stops you from writing those comments yourself? It is not like there is any attribution on tiktok. (edit: "you" in a "them"sense)
- prepend 3y agoWhat’s funny is I have some journalist friends and they used to tell stories of colleagues who would literally call someone and tell them “please say ‘X’” and then would run a story of “a person on the street says ‘X’.” And would get emails like “anyone willing to give a background flavor quote on…” Whenever I see a news story and the random example is some rich New York person I assume they are friends with the producer or whatnot. So I think journalists have always done this, just now it’s so much easier.
- soco 3y agoWhich uncovers an even bigger problem: people making medical decisions on whatever some "influencer" on Tiktok says. In this case actually the quotes are unwarranted - the influencer DID influence a person. And not in a good way. Edit: just wait until AI starts giving medical advice and people start listening to it.
- sneak 3y agoKarens already give medical advice and people already listen to it and now whooping cough is back. We don't need to wait for AI. Please stop trotting out this bogeyman as if LLMs are currently transformative - they are not. TBH LLMs probably give better medical advice on average than the median layperson (if deprived of Google).
- acyou 3y agoThis is a hit piece with a divisive agenda. Patients vs. the health establishment. Us vs. them. I had to stop reading. I am not convinced this is widespread behavior. Yes, if I saw myself on social media without consent, I would go straight to the college or professional association with a privacy violation complaint. But this article is just trying to fuel hatred.
- jbigelow76 3y agoI am not convinced this is widespread behavior. How many does it take to be widespread (or more crucially, addressable) behavior, is it N+you? Yes, if I saw myself on social media without consent, I would go straight to the college or professional association with a privacy violation complaint. But this article is just trying to fuel hatred. Are there any release documents for doctors that you can cite that include a patient appearing, either knowingly or unknowingly, in social media? I know this sounds sarcastic because it's so ludicrous but if they exist I would like to know.
- ohdannyboy 3y agoThis template would suggest such a release is trivial https://eforms.com/release/medical-hipaa/ https://eforms.com/release/medical-hipaa/ In fact I could see an unscrupulous doctor being able to write one vague enough to do it without the person knowing it's going to be in social media. No idea where that would go with ethics boards and such, though.
- leoedin 3y agoTraditional broadcasters have been making medical documentaries, which often show patients, for years. Presumably they've figured out bulletproof release documents. It's clearly not particularly hard to find people who will agree to be on TV for no obvious benefit to them.
- soco 3y agoAround here I often see pixelated people in those documentaries, so where there's a will there's a way.
- AraceliHarker 3y agoMoney can buy anything, even morality.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- balls187 3y agoPre and Post Op Surgical photos are considered part of patient's medical record. I don't know about laws in the Canada, but in the US HIPAA provides how medical information must be treated. Specifically the HIPAA Privacy Rule sets the standard of how Personal Health Information must be protected. Even if the images are altered to make them impossible to identify the individual, the patient still "owns" their medical record and if that patients medical information is not being used in the course of treating that patient, then informed consent must be given before it can be used for other purposes. Edit to add: It's going to be very difficult to explain why a doctor posting their patients pre/post op photos on TikTok without consent is not a violation of HIPAA Privacy Rule.
- haldujai 3y agoDeidentified data isn’t Protected Health Information. There are valid reasons other than the provision of care to access PHI for deidentification, it can also be automated at the time of collection. Healthcare operations being a nice vague one, or a limited dataset. These don’t require consent. Deidentification is technically possible but much harder to do and reidentification risks are higher (e.g. distinctive mark) so it’s strongly advised to obtain consent. I expect most TikTok doctors are getting consent, I’ve heard happy aesthetics patients tend to give consent.
- throwaway290 3y agoIf it is an image of a part of my body I don't see how it is deidentifiable. Unless you literally redraw it. Also the article is about the problem of TT doctors who are NOT getting consent.
- haldujai 3y ago> If it is an image of a part of my body I don't see how it is deidentifiable Depends how unique the part of your body looks, I agree it’s very hard (potentially impossible) so it shouldn’t be done. My point is mostly about the comment I was replying to which posited this as a hypothetical and incorrectly stated it couldn’t be used, I’m clarifying that’s not how HIPAA works.
- throwaway4good 3y agoWhy is this article focusing on TikTok when it is obvious that Instagram is the worst when it comes to vanity, celebrity worship, teenage angst, eating disorder, fad health influencing etc.?
- blackoil 3y ago"China bad" sells.
- aa1234556 3y ago[dead]
- throwaway290 3y agoIG has definitely gone downhill after it started trying to copy TT features. It's nearly dead for me at this point. Good job FB.
- Kiro 3y agoWhy is that obvious?
- llm_nerd 3y agoTikTok is mentioned five times within the article. Instagram is mentioned five times within the article. "Tiktok" is mentioned as a placeholder for social media, and the article is not particularly focused on it.
- rejectfinite 3y agoDoctors and Nurses are some of the worst to have as clients in IT. This does not surprise me.
- palijer 3y agoIt's understandable why they'd be the worst clients though. Imagine training rigorously for a decade without any real pay, and after that you are trying to save lives and suddenly the way you order tests doesn't work anymore for no reason. I wouldn't have much patience to deal with that. I got 12 complex patients that need shit done for them, and my login don't work because I missed some email, or something updated, or some network thing is down etc etc. Sounds like someone has not done their job well enough and that interrupting my patient care that I dedicated my life to. I work in IT, hang out with a ton of physicians though, and I absolutely get why they'd be bad clients. They don't got any time to deal with issues.
- rejectfinite 3y ago>Sounds like someone has not done their job well enough and that interrupting my patient care that I dedicated my life to. off topic but Nope that's just shit that happens. Like saying "I want 100% guarantee that my car won't crash ever never ever!!" Dedicate your life all you want
- Eumenes 3y agoDoctors are not just jerks to IT, they're often jerks to everyone around them in healthcare setting. Going to school for a decade isn't an excuse to act like that. You don't hear stereotypes of guys working 12 hr days in 100 degree weather being pricks, but you hear it about highly educated doctors all the time.
- tamimio 3y agoMy rule is that anyone call himself/herself an “influencer” or work towards that is a just a phony joker.
- localplume 3y agoinfluencers are either spreading propaganda or trying to sell a product. its literally in the name: they influence. pretty disgusting how normalized it is
- dewey 3y agoThat's a very simplistic view. There's influencers for all kinds of niches and agendas.
- kredd 3y agoI think OP’s point is, even “influencers for all kinds of niches” are still… trying to either sell you something or pushing some version of propaganda. It’s the same across all industries and social medias. Opening Twitter and accidentally scrolling through “For You” feed kinda shows how awful tech influencers are as well.
- dewey 3y agoBut how is it different than someone writing a blog post, a book or giving a talk? If someone is just sharing their opinions it doesn't mean they are trying to sell you something or spread propaganda.
- kredd 3y agoIt is not, they are still under the general term of “influencer”. It also depends on the person who is writing a blog or a book. “Do they have any sort of financial interest at sharing this opinion?” usually covers most of the cases.
- ahstilde 3y agoWe've done a ton of education on Tiktok as doctors without any patients: https://www.tiktok.com/@wyndlyteam https://www.tiktok.com/@wyndlyteam company: https://www.wyndly.com/ https://www.wyndly.com/
- aaron695 3y ago[dead]
- NoZebra120vClip 3y agoIf Jessica Frech were still around, she could do another montage video, and sing like she did when cataloging the People of Wal*Mart.
- parentheses 3y agoIt seems really ridiculous that doctors would violate HIPAA and risk their career willy nilly, for the next ad-bump. Like the other poster, I also couldn't read on - felt like fear-oriented news designed to prey on readers.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- tibbydudeza 3y agoI can see a point where divorce lawyers start doing tiktoks over the weirdest things said during settlements. Seems professionalism goes out of the window - esp those who practice crap like boob, tummy and butt lift cosmetic surgery - yes woman who had a mastectomy have a need for it.
- unsupp0rted 3y agoThat would be fascinating and probably socially valuable, as long as the stories were anonymized. People go into marriages completely oblivious to the ~40% chance that the person they're marrying will turn out in n years to be their life's greatest nemesis, in multiple comically extreme and callous ways.
- tibbydudeza 3y agoFunny enough I heard a stat that 60% of divorced people get married again - so go figure that one out. But I am 25 years in my own marriage (2 kids) and if I knew what I know now I would probably would not have done it - it has a cost. You might enjoy this video - a interview with a divorce lawyer on love and marriage - it is pretty good. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5z8-9Op2nM&t=779s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5z8-9Op2nM&t=779s
- unsupp0rted 3y agoExcellent video recommendation. That “one day the granola ran out” story is fascinating. It’s the little things that make or break a marriage.
- AlexandrB 3y agoNot every divorce is a nasty, dragged out, fight.
- unsupp0rted 3y agoNo comment suggested otherwise. But if the divorce rate is in the 40% ~ 70% range then the callous nemesis rate is in the 40% ~ 70% range too, even if the latter is a slightly lower number than the former.
- rejectfinite 3y agoHighly illegal. In the USA I guess you can sue. In EU these would be fucked by GDPR.
- 0dayz 3y agoIt's why in general I am always skeptical of content creators who are mainly known for their profession, since it's so easy for them to break their code of conduct of always remain professional. Due to a variety of reasons, like wealth, ego or political/religious agenda. For example transgender, both for and against, there are medical professionals pushing nonsense for political gain/clout. Or say police officers giving advice about traffic stops that isn't based on any procedure but instead "common sense".
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- Aleksdev 3y agoI would not go to any doctor that has a TikTok account.
- thenerdhead 3y agoThe big question is whether one even needs medical care to begin with. Go look at popular books like “Being Mortal” in which one of the core arguments is whether intervention harms more than it helps one live with a specific goal (I.e. quality of life/health span). Social media doctors are clearly driven by the same idea this article calls out. Most of them want out so they can “practice” on social media instead of in the system. Many will do whatever it takes to make it. This can be seen by the absurdity of posts and privacy violations being made. The sad part of all this is that you can get more helpful information from a 15s TikTok than you may get from a 15 minute doctor visit you waited months for. While most TikTok doctors today are the early adopters, you’ll start to see the laggards who have actual valuable information adopt it with time like we’ve seen on YouTube.
- crossroadsguy 3y ago> The big question is whether one even needs medical care to begin with. Well, then while we are at it we might as well evaluate whether we need to be on this planet at all? I mean what's even the point in being mortal if in the end we are anyway going to the mortuary? We might as well fast track it. I mean, right? So my question is - did you write this statement in all seriousness or there were traces of sarcasm that my radar totally failed to detect.
- thenerdhead 3y agoThe comment is about the need for medical intervention. TikTok and other social media platforms can convince you that you have all sorts of medical issues when you do not. And even if you did, the question still remains as to if intervention harms your overall quality of life. This is not a generalization saying to not get checked for cancer or other serious diseases early, but to take any self-promotional “medical advice” with a grain of salt like whether you need to fix your nose, buy expensive probiotics, or try to get prescribed a certain drug based on a list of symptoms. And no, we should not fast track death. Life is already too short.
- Quinzel 3y agoI think you’d find people who get knee and hip replacements have their quality of life restored considerably. They have also found breast reductions to also enhance quality of life for those patients that need them (which isnt exclusive to women - some men grow breast tissue too albeit it’s rarer and often not as big as women). There’s a wide variety of procedures that do indeed improve quality of life. I myself had a reconstructive surgery and my quality of life improved significantly. I’m fortunate to have had it. So the question as to whether people need medical care to begin with is a bit of a waste of time in my humble opinion.
- idiot900 3y agoI'm an anesthesiologist and I cannot imagine taking a picture of a patient, let alone posting it to social media. Even if anonymized. There is an element of coercion when you ask the patient who is about to place their life in your hands, for consent to do this sort of thing.
- willcipriano 3y agoIf anything happened while I was under I'd forever blame the guy who wanted to fool around on social media during a serious event like that.
- bobowzki 3y agoWe are quite a few anesthesiologists on HN it seems.
- haldujai 3y agoIs HN the new sudoku? Haha.
- bobowzki 3y agoHaha. Took me a second since anesthesiologists in the Nordics generelly do not stay in the room, but keep 2-3 rooms going and have specialist nurses for monitoring.
- haldujai 3y agoOh interesting, so you’re only in the room for induction and reversal/extubation? I trained in Canada where the anesthesiologist stays in the room for the whole case, I joke around with my anesthesia friends that 95% of their day job is playing sudoku or trading stocks haha. Not sure if the Canadian system is evidence-based or political given what’s happened in the US. My understanding is the Nordic systems are public? Curious your thoughts as to whether keeping an anesthesiologist in the room for the entire case is inefficient / wasted resources or there is a real safety benefit.
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- legitster 3y agoThe end result of most social media is to make all relationships exploitative.