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Sidestepping the geopolitical issues with this for a moment ... What advantage is there to using a high altitude balloon for surveillance? I have to imagine th

Sidestepping the geopolitical issues with this for a moment ... What advantage is there to using a high altitude balloon for surveillance? I have to imagine there are some - like longer loiter time over a specific point, maybe better optics because you are still in atmosphere, it's obviously cheaper than launching a satellite - but I don't really know enough about this kind of hardware to say. Or maybe the point wasn't to actually look at anything, but instead see how the US would respond?

fbdab103 4y ago
Significantly closer to the ground, so can capture better resolution pictures. If browsing Google Earth, the high-resolution data around cities originates from airplanes, not satellites.
- rkagerer 4y ago
  Hey does that mean we can soon buy high-res, balloon-altitude imagery at low-priced China-rates?
  - cuteboy19 4y ago
    We can already do it better with drones, but those don't fly high enough to be used this way
sandworm101 4y ago
Turnaround/prototyping. Getting a sensor onto a spy sat is a multi-year process of testing and validating. But a new balloon can probably be built and flown in a matter of weeks. So any country trying to learn how to spy from above might want to build up the relevant corporate knowledge using balloons.
- SpicyP 4y ago
  Why did they need to test it over the United States though? If the purpose was prototyping you’d think they could have done that locally
  - prox 4y ago
    Who is to say they already have? And they felt it was time to put the thing to use.
  - psychphysic 4y ago
    Testing acceptability? Probably also why such a dramatic response from the US. Before satillites flew over enemies no one was too sure if they'd be attacked immediately (they weren't).
- vineyardmike 4y ago
  Chinese doesn't need to learn how to spy or build up knowledge, and they surely have plenty of satellites at this point.
bpodgursky 4y ago
It's 11 miles vs 350+ miles. Certainly you have the ability to get dramatically better imaging than from a satellite.
ttul 4y ago
One of the most technically challenging things about reconnaissance satellites is dealing with the high speed at which the satellite moves over the target. A balloon flies much lower and vastly more slowly. It can loiter over an area, sucking in electronic signals and taking photographs with extremely high fidelity. I don’t think the Chinese meant for this balloon to cross the United States. I believe they were testing it for use over other countries or perhaps for use during wartime. Their apology was way too quick for this to have been anything other than a genuine accident.
- remarkEon 4y ago
  Did they actually apologize? I thought all they said is that it was a weather balloon. Regardless, I'm very interested in what hardware was actually on this thing. Hopefully the public gets a summary of what USN pulls up during recovery.
  - ttul 4y ago
    “… the uncharacteristic speed and contrition of China’s statement as indications that it was probably a genuine error…” https://www.economist.com/china/2023/02/03/how-a-balloon-burst-sino-american-talks https://www.economist.com/china/2023/02/03/how-a-balloon-bur...
    - khuey 4y ago
      They put out a statement a few hours ago whining that it was shot down so I wouldn't take that "apology" for much.
      - Choco31415 4y ago
        Can you share a link to the statement?
        T-A 4y ago
        https://www.fmprc.gov.cn/mfa_eng/zxxx_662805/202302/t20230205_11019871.html https://www.fmprc.gov.cn/mfa_eng/zxxx_662805/202302/t2023020...
citboin 4y ago
LiDAR, plus it could be a dry run for more advanced balloons with offensive capabilities.
- idlewords 4y ago
  The precursor to a strategic balloon arms race that it chills the blood to contemplate. All it takes is one push of the button and, 14 days later, death comes drifting in from above.
  - sitkack 4y ago
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4UFQWKjy_I https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4UFQWKjy_I
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
defrost 4y ago
Radiometrics - being closer than orbit and having a much longer linger time drastically increases the signal count to any gamma spectrum gear that might be on board. Whether or not that reveals any non usual background signal of interest is an interesting ponder.
noodleman 4y ago
It can pick up other strategically useful info than just photographs such as radio comms and relay it back to home via satelite.
mlindner 4y ago
The one advantage it really has over satellites is how long it can stay on station and still be relatively near to the target. I'd personally guess it's a signals intelligence platform rather than anything telescopic.

fbdab103 4y ago

Significantly closer to the ground, so can capture better resolution pictures. If browsing Google Earth, the high-resolution data around cities originates from airplanes, not satellites.

rkagerer 4y ago
Hey does that mean we can soon buy high-res, balloon-altitude imagery at low-priced China-rates?
- cuteboy19 4y ago
  We can already do it better with drones, but those don't fly high enough to be used this way

sandworm101 4y ago

Turnaround/prototyping. Getting a sensor onto a spy sat is a multi-year process of testing and validating. But a new balloon can probably be built and flown in a matter of weeks. So any country trying to learn how to spy from above might want to build up the relevant corporate knowledge using balloons.

SpicyP 4y ago
Why did they need to test it over the United States though? If the purpose was prototyping you’d think they could have done that locally
- prox 4y ago
  Who is to say they already have? And they felt it was time to put the thing to use.
- psychphysic 4y ago
  Testing acceptability? Probably also why such a dramatic response from the US. Before satillites flew over enemies no one was too sure if they'd be attacked immediately (they weren't).
vineyardmike 4y ago
Chinese doesn't need to learn how to spy or build up knowledge, and they surely have plenty of satellites at this point.

bpodgursky 4y ago

It's 11 miles vs 350+ miles. Certainly you have the ability to get dramatically better imaging than from a satellite.

ttul 4y ago

One of the most technically challenging things about reconnaissance satellites is dealing with the high speed at which the satellite moves over the target. A balloon flies much lower and vastly more slowly. It can loiter over an area, sucking in electronic signals and taking photographs with extremely high fidelity. I don’t think the Chinese meant for this balloon to cross the United States. I believe they were testing it for use over other countries or perhaps for use during wartime. Their apology was way too quick for this to have been anything other than a genuine accident.

remarkEon 4y ago
Did they actually apologize? I thought all they said is that it was a weather balloon. Regardless, I'm very interested in what hardware was actually on this thing. Hopefully the public gets a summary of what USN pulls up during recovery.
- ttul 4y ago
  “… the uncharacteristic speed and contrition of China’s statement as indications that it was probably a genuine error…” https://www.economist.com/china/2023/02/03/how-a-balloon-burst-sino-american-talks https://www.economist.com/china/2023/02/03/how-a-balloon-bur...
  - khuey 4y ago
    They put out a statement a few hours ago whining that it was shot down so I wouldn't take that "apology" for much.
    - Choco31415 4y ago
      Can you share a link to the statement?
      - T-A 4y ago
        https://www.fmprc.gov.cn/mfa_eng/zxxx_662805/202302/t20230205_11019871.html https://www.fmprc.gov.cn/mfa_eng/zxxx_662805/202302/t2023020...

citboin 4y ago

LiDAR, plus it could be a dry run for more advanced balloons with offensive capabilities.

idlewords 4y ago
The precursor to a strategic balloon arms race that it chills the blood to contemplate. All it takes is one push of the button and, 14 days later, death comes drifting in from above.
- sitkack 4y ago
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4UFQWKjy_I https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4UFQWKjy_I
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]

defrost 4y ago

Radiometrics - being closer than orbit and having a much longer linger time drastically increases the signal count to any gamma spectrum gear that might be on board. Whether or not that reveals any non usual background signal of interest is an interesting ponder.

noodleman 4y ago

It can pick up other strategically useful info than just photographs such as radio comms and relay it back to home via satelite.

mlindner 4y ago

The one advantage it really has over satellites is how long it can stay on station and still be relatively near to the target. I'd personally guess it's a signals intelligence platform rather than anything telescopic.