26 ms·

Quitting the rat race

• d23 4y ago
  The mountain stuff and diving into ice water doesn’t resonate with me at all, but the burnout at the industry generally does. I’m glad you’ve found something to make you happy.
• mooneater 4y ago
  How much of this would be fixed if you lived in the woods and did the same job remotely (which is my situation with similar work).
• tysam_and 4y ago
  This is a good article. I will be honest, the Twitter link felt like a very ironic finish to the article, so much so that I chuckled. Some rat races may indeed continue, though maybe it is not all or nothing. We wish the author well in his endeavors.
  • lumost 4y ago
    We may see an interesting few years for tech going forward. The path for software engineers the last 10 years was to move into the biggest company you could… and then stay there. A college grad who joined FB in 2012 would have made more money at FB than any other likely alternative including founding their own firm. The same was true for at least a dozen large firms. These big firms came with the added benefit that one didn’t have to worry that your 12 hour days of toil would lead to a layoff at the end.
  • henshao 4y ago
    I had the same thought about the twitter link. I also find that many people decide to disconnect from the "rat race" and explore the mountains and be one with the earth...often after you're already set up from your racing days that you can afford to adventure off like that. But yes, good for him. I also like the mountains.
• jaimex2 4y ago
  Just work from home dude, you'll find you can't just quit. Society won't let you unless you go full drifter and only certain people have a personality for it.
• greggman3 4y ago
  Hey, if being in nature makes you happy good for you but your outlook on the rest is kind of crap. Me, best time in my life, commuting in Tokyo to my jobs working on a project I loved with people I loved. All the ads on the trains were eye candy to me. I didn't buy anything that I remember but I did find out about museums, concerts, and other events around town as well as various obscure services which I never used but was amused to read about. Drinking with my buddies, including work buddies about once a week was great. Clubbing, going to restaurants, and going to events of the kind that generally only happen in giant cities was lovely. I like the occasional trip to nature but as for me I'll pick the city and the public transportation. I love it!
  • throwaway_au_1 4y ago
    Different strokes for different folks. At least the author of the OP had the humility not to call anyone else's perspective 'crap'.
    • greggman3 4y ago
      He did call it crap or did you miss it? In so many words he said cities suck, nature rocks. Vs me, who said both nature and cities rock, and that the attitude that one sucks is a poor attitude
    • borski 4y ago
      I mean, he did call them rats, which isn’t that far off.
      • throwaway_au_1 4y ago
        I'm not so sure that the meaning behind The Rat Race is that a human being participating in a rat race is a rat.
        • borski 4y ago
          > Around the 30 second mark is a scene where the protaganist rat is waiting for a train to arrive at a packed platform. I recently had a sobering realisation while standing waiting at the platform for the Waterloo & City Line: this had become my life. He calls himself, and by implication those around him, rats in the rat race. Whether you agree with him or not, the clear implication is a negative one.
• halfmatthalfcat 4y ago
  After getting up to FANNG-esque levels and seeing the “mountain top”, I’m done too. I’m not sure when or why decide to climb the latter but upon reflection, it just seems so empty. I’m planning on a career change within the next 5 years. Unshackling from the golden handcuffs takes time, especially with a family.
• BizarreByte 4y ago
  It’s a short piece, but it resonates with me, specifically this part: > I’m earning the most money I’ve ever made and yet I’m the least fulfilled I’ve ever been. I’m making the most I’ve ever made and I’ve never been less happy and more depressed. I despise being a cog in a huge corporate machine, it’s like the job was designed to be as unappealing as possible. At the same time I can’t get over the fact that I have it better than the vast majority of humanity. I feel guilty hating my job, I won’t complain to people IRL because how could I? I have it made by all accounts. This guilt completely consumes me and adds a special level of self hatred, if I’m not happy with this, maybe I never will be? Unlike the author though I can’t just quit, so endure it I must.
  • nine_k 4y ago
    My approach to that problem is to oscillate between large companies where the pay is extra good and you get to see huge things but the work as a cog is not very appealing, and smaller companies / startups where work is fun and personal growth is noticeable even though it pays less. I think it also accelerates professional growth.
    • dylan604 4y ago
      i've done something similar but different. when i get to the absolute breaking point of cannot stand to look at code any longer, i switch industries altogether and go back to a lower paying but much more creative field. once i get tired of essentially being a broke artist, i find a tech job again to start the process over. i also try to stave off the hatred of tech by having creative hobbies, and when i'm being a broke artist i keep up with coding trends to the best of my interest. the staving off of the hatred of tech is getting harder though. the pervasiveness of ad tech and privacy invading tech is just got me just under red lined.
      • daveidol 4y ago
        What kind of art/creative projects do you work on?
• mmaunder 4y ago
  Funny, I was this guy 23 years ago working in London for Credit Suisse. It’s clear in investment banks that you can just keep doing that forever and get paid what most would consider a lot for doing routine stuff. What bugged me is that I’d stopped growing and wasn’t challenged. I quit and joined a fast growing dot com in 2000, met my wife, moved to the states and we’ve had one hell of an adventure since then. Sometimes you just need to pick a different path outside the current comfort zone, and that comes with risk, but the rewards can be amazing.
  • antihero 4y ago
    I was in that office today, weird eh
    • mmaunder 4y ago
      Haha. I was at 1 to 5 Cabot Square. The Friday pub gatherings were pretty epic. One Friday I got seriously drunk and swam across the dock, banged on one of the old barges parked on the other side and swam back. Canary Wharf security was waiting for me. A colleague pretended he was an off duty cop from Manchester (he had the accent) and talked them out of detaining me. And that was pretty early on in the evening. Haven’t been back there in a very long time.
      • antihero 4y ago
        Ha! Off there again in a minute. I’m a contractor who’s onboarding, so I walk in, talk to literally nobody and sit on floor 8 doing your thing for a while then leave, is kind of surreal.
• nine_k 4y ago
  If you're well-off, have no dependents, and can also work remotely, why not enjoy the mountains, the nature, the beauty of the great outside? Do yourself a favour.
  • jkelleyrtp 4y ago
    I did this during covid. I really enjoyed it. But it does get lonely, not that many young people, and the city I lived near was just not that bustling. You quickly eat your way through all the restaurants in town and there's just not that much culture. It was a great covid experience, but it's not quite something I want to repeat soon.
• dvt 4y ago
  I might be a bit harsh, but this is a typical western le bon sauvage misunderstanding about what goes on in the wilderness. I also grew up in the mountains (of Eastern Europe), and I equally despise the eye-rolling fakery and the hustle and bustle of modern day Los Angeles. I love camping, and I surf, and kayak, scuba dive, offroad, and explore. But I don't make the category mistake of thinking the former is somehow better than the latter. I love the outdoors, but more importantly: I respect it. In LA, I have the luxury of clean water, sewage, medicine, a decent cocktail, and, like OP, make a decent living. It's easy to decry modern society because you're not "happy" but, imo, that says more about you than it does about what you do. Don't think the mountains, or the oceans, or the deserts are an idyllic virginal untouched Eden. You're going to end up getting yourself killed like the Into the Wild guy.
  • itisit 4y ago
    I think you're overanalyzing what is too brief of a blog post to draw any sound conclusions about the author's meaning or their character.
    • fsckboy 4y ago
      > too brief of a blog post the author kept it brief by relying on cliche after cliche, telling us to make sure we watched a completely cliche video. Why do people who have a critique of society think that they're the only ones who ever thought of this stuff? can't get enough of it? here, enjoy https://youtu.be/n-sQSp5jbSQ?t=28 https://youtu.be/n-sQSp5jbSQ?t=28
      • itisit 4y ago
        > Why do people who have a critique of society think that they're the only ones who ever thought of this stuff? Where did you get that from?
        • fsckboy 4y ago
          did you need to watch the video to grasp the idea of what a rat-race is? The author thought you did, OP thought you needed "dropping out of the rat race" explained to you, meaning thta OP thought you never thought of it before.
• dinobones 4y ago
  I am in my mid 20s. I have about $200k saved and I think about quitting everyday, even though it would probably be disastrous for my career. I look up and I see colleagues in their 40s-50s. 20-30 years of experience in the industry, with the performance of their RSUs they probably easily have $2m+ net worth. I really don't understand why they don't quit. Just a naive example: Buy a cheap house ($250k) and live off of $40k/year for the next 40 years ($1.6m). You can always freelance or do extra work on the side if you want to splurge on a vacation or major purchase. And I "enjoy" my job. It is comfy and interesting most days. But it is just such a massive time sink, after accounting for the chores of life and the "ramp up" and "ramp down" time before work, it honestly feels like I have maybe 2-3 hours a day on the weekdays of time that I can honestly say is my own. I can't imagine doing this tradeoff for another 15 years, but we'll see. Props to the OP for having the courage to do this. I hope I can muster up some of the same courage soon.
  • LoveMortuus 4y ago
    I'm about 30 and have only ~4.5k€... Not because I didn't save more, but because I wasn't able to save more. I do look brightly towards the future and hope I'll turn for the better.
  • notch656c 4y ago
    If you have kids and quit while your family is used to the standard of living there is a good chance a divorce is in the cards. You will then owe 20% (pretax, 30% post tax) of your "imputed" salary for the kid, as well as possible alimony. If you don't come up with 20% of your generous salary you git tossed in a cage, even if the kid only needs a tiny fraction of that for a decent life. For many it's impossible to step down their career without being tossed into prison, as the judge uses "imputed income" to calculate what you owe based on what you can potentially earn. That is if say you go from engineer to carpenter, you may now owe over 100% of your salary for support.
    • hi41 4y ago
      I don’t understand the logic behind this. A man can lose his job then how can he make court ordered payments for kids and wife? And then putting the man behind bars is detrimental to society because a divorced man would be experience depression and likely lose his job. Punishing such a man is not good for society.
• shinycode 4y ago
  Feels like you just need some long holidays
  • alecbz 4y ago
    IME long breaks do very little to help with burnout like this. All you're doing is giving yourself a brief reprieve from an environment that drains your energy. You'll build up a bit of the energy over the break, but as soon as you come back you'll start getting drained again, possibly even worse than before because of the contrast of having to be back in that environment. Breaks are important but if your environment is fundamentally draining you day after day, they're not going to move that needle.
    • shinycode 4y ago
      yes you’re right, in case of burnout nothing replaces a deep change
• rubicon33 4y ago
  Posts like this frustrate me. "I'm quitting! But I'm not telling you anything about how I plan to pay for life." The message mostly resonates with me, right up until they leave out the most crucial part of the post. How do you escape the rat race, and still pay for things like health care, food, rent, etc. Even if you're making $100k+ a year, those costs aren't insignificant. No how do you handle them making $0k a year?
  • nine_k 4y ago
    Isn't it the classics of downshifting? Move to a cheap place, do some remote work, maybe time to time. Plan not to need much health care %)
    • rubicon33 4y ago
      Maybe, but they never say! It's strange to me how often I'll read a post like this that conveniently leaves out the crucial detail. Leaves a suspicious feeling in me that they have some nest egg or something they're not telling us about.
    • metadat 4y ago
      How do you plan to not need healthcare. "Just don't get sick?" ???
      • nine_k 4y ago
        Do not embark on such a project if you have some chronic conditions. Start in a good shape. Generally keep a healthy lifestyle: no heavy drinking, no junk food dinners, enough motion, etc. Stay away from high-risk pastimes like snowboarding, motorcycle racing, etc. Wash your hands and do other trivial things to keep infections reasonably away, especially when far from thickets of civilization. Things like that. Do what you can not to get badly sick or injured, because medical bills can quickly burn through your savings.
        • metadat 4y ago
• piecerough 4y ago
  "The truth is: nothing I’ve done or experienced in this place has given me any experience comparable to walking along the ridge between two mountains. Nothing has made me feel alive like getting in to freezing cold water despite my body screaming at me not to. Nothing has made me feel anything like that feeling when you summit a mountain after 2 hours of solid climbing in the rain, and the clouds part to reveal the most spectacular and breathtaking view you’ve ever seen." This is the tricky part. If you're in the rat race, the feelings you get in the mountains are way more intense. If mountains become your life, it won't be long until they become the norm, making you flee back to some urban jungle. It's the contrast in your life that matter.
  • ip26 4y ago
    Some outdoors professionals might summit the same mountain 100+ times a year. Their breath is not taken each time. Watching them, it's more like the mountain is their office. An office with plenty of nature & exercise, but the magic is largely gone.
  • qkls 4y ago
    Living in a rural area and visiting cities beats living in a city and viting the mountains for me. Visiting cities is super simple, and time of the year or weather basically doesn't matter. But for the mountains you need to be there to be ready for the best weather and conditions.
  • ghshephard 4y ago
    This article suggests it is not the contrast, but the inherent positive impacts of being outdoors. Even people who do it as their day job are happier. https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2023/01/06/happiest-jobs-on-earth/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2023/01/06/happiest-...
    • resonious 4y ago
      Unfortunately I don't have any links right now but I also remember reading that primitive tribes are far more "happy" than the average modern city dweller. I'm pretty sure "happiness" was measured by average amount of time smiling each day - take from that what you will.
• gonadsi 4y ago
  [flagged]
• Panini_Jones 4y ago
  I see software engineers lament about a lack of fulfillment in their career (heck, I'm one of them). The author doesn't have fulfillment and decides that they should quit their job and move closer to nature to be fulfilled. I don't really understand the problem or the solution. Is this sustainable? Will the begin to feel unfulfilled in the mountains? What is fulfillment? Could a steady cadence of vacations to the mountains have bridged the gap? Does it require such an 'all or nothing' solution?
  • ablatt89 4y ago
    He's also dissing engineering as a rat race, as if we're all idiots and morons for adhering to some 9-5 job, and he, a software engineer at a "top bank" can see the light while all of us are just plebs. Yea, you're not Tyler Durden...
• KronisLV 4y ago
  What I feel is perhaps missing here is some sort of a plan, so the author can either generate enough income or control the spending well enough not to become homeless. It's nice to (hopefully) have savings for these sorts of situations, but for many out there the end result of something like that would be eventual financial peril. I recently also submitted my own resignation, except I've figured out that my current savings could last me around 3-5 years, so my plan so far is to take one year off work for personal projects, books and other ways of upskilling myself, as well as handling various larger events, such as moving to the city from the countryside (healthcare or even getting to the store is problematic otherwise), as well as just hang out with friends occasionally and visit some museums. Though maybe my plans are too much work and too little play.
  • seanbarry 4y ago
    Author here. Please see this comment I wrote: https://news.ycombinator.com/reply?id=34426360&goto=item%3Fid%3D34406760%26p%3D2%2334426360 https://news.ycombinator.com/reply?id=34426360&goto=item%3Fi...
    • KronisLV 4y ago
      Thanks for the clarification, this is probably an interesting point to make: > I don't have FU money, I still want to work as a software engineer and will have to very soon. The difference is that I will not trade quality of life for money, and I will try to find or create work on the terms that maximise happiness for me. These terms are different for everybody, so my solution is unique to me. I'm inclined to agree, though of course having adequate savings and planning ahead both feel like pre-requisites to me. Best of luck!
• ablatt89 4y ago
  It's a rat race if you never enjoyed software engineering and computer science from the start, and joined due to the growing SWE hype in the 2010s. Most people in the world have to work 40+ hours a week, and on weekends. It's kinda crazy to not take your career choice in perspective, which is relatively cushy, good perks, good pay, often wfh or decent offices, and call it a rat race because... you think you deserve to earn even more money and get more recognition? Okay, don't we all...
  • deleted 4y ago
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  • alecbz 4y ago
    I still love programming but often feel burnt out at my SWE job. Things like: - coworkers - working culture - autonomy - sense of ownership - sense of impact - how much you actually get to code - whether the coding you're doing is interesting can make you hate your job even if you still like programming itself.
    • ablatt89 4y ago
      I think the things you listed are reasonable expectations to make someone happy for any job, but it's not what the original article seems to get at. At least from my perspective, he's dismissing software engineering as a fruitful career, humble bragging he's working at a "top investment bank" (?), and implying he's just somehow "better" than others for escaping the "matrix" despite being more "accomplished" (lol) than others.
  • TranquilMarmot 4y ago
    I love writing code and solving problems with it. Even if this job didn't pay well and didn't come with all the amazing benefits, I would still do it. I think a lot of software engineers need to hang out with more people who are less well off than them. Befriend the grocery store clerk, talk to the mechanic fixing your car. If you're in a bubble of wealthy people, it gets really hard to appreciate the benefits that you have simply because you stop seeing them as benefits and see them instead as the status quo.
• travisgriggs 4y ago
  So which peak is pictured here? I’m visiting the UK this summer. Might want to check that out…
  • seanbarry 4y ago
    Hey, author here. Sorry to disappoint but it's not in the UK. It's Innerdalen, Norway (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Innerdalen https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Innerdalen). It's one of the most beautiful places I've seen. If you have the opportunity to visit, I recommend it highly.
• garganzol 4y ago
  I currently live in a less densely populated area than before. And it feels terrible - I want to bring my rat race back!
• Yhippa 4y ago
  I'm old enough where I've been through these pits of despair. Unlike this chap, in didn't have the FU money to just walk away. At some point I realized that without this massive dehumanizing system to fire me regular income, the alternative is that we are out in the wild fighting for survival every minute, not knowing where my next meal is coming from. What our system gives us seems decidedly better but man, it can be mentally tough to keep trucking along.
• fsckboy 4y ago
  You being unhappy in your life does not mean that there is anything wrong with the world. Looking to pin the blame on society at large and other people's choices is a convenient escape from looking at yourself and your own fears, disappointments, choices made, etc. I grew up in a rural place, no mountains but we substituted beaches, marshes, and ocean. When I go back to visit I can't believe how beautiful it is. But, I prefer to live in the city where I can walk to coffee, pizza, chinese, mexican, etc. I never visit city parks, the grass and trees don't speak to me at all of nature and as an engineer I see beauty in architecture and construction and (after studying economics) the dynamism of human striving. It's fine to decide to drop out of the hurly-burly, but don't call your fellow city dwellers rats, they're people making a go of it. The carbon footprint of the average New Yorker is among the smallest in the world, that's what population density gets you, and rural areas? they're filled with human suffering, don't kid yourself.
  • Barrin92 4y ago
    >Looking to pin the blame on society at large and other people's choices is a convenient escape In reality it's the opposite. Coming to terms with the fact that the world is screwed up rather than you is a much scarier prospect given the implications. If you blame yourself you can hit the gym, lawyer up, buy some meditation apps, everyone will applaud you on your great self-help journey etc. Of course a student of economics would love this story, it's very profitable!
    • throwaway1851 4y ago
      The world doesn’t need to be unfucked for you to be happy, I believe is the point. And that’s a good thing, because the world always has had and always will have its problems.
  • Loocid 4y ago
    >The carbon footprint of the average New Yorker is among the smallest in the world Where does that come from? I struggle to see how any person living in the first world could be amongst those with the smallest carbon footprint.
• lettergram 4y ago
  I grew up in the suburbs, in a lower-middle class neighborhood. We were always out in the woods near our house. The children of the neighborhood would work on the horse ranch next to us. Every weekend was all day rugby games in a massive field we had near us. It was great. We weren’t wealthy, but had an amazing childhood. Having lived in multiple major cities — they aren’t ideal. Particularly, for children. With the advent of starlink and wireless networks I think increasingly (I hope) children will be brought up with space. I know with remote work I moved and built a homestead, we are nearly breaking even while supplying all our food. I know me and my family are happier with the space, being outside, etc. Less pollution, less noise, better air, better food, and generally safer.
• deleted 4y ago
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• viktorcode 4y ago
  Remote work would help the author tremendously. He could have enjoyed his favourite countryside without ever needing to go to the office.
• huitzitziltzin 4y ago
  Try seeing how fulfilled you are making the least money you’ve ever made! Maybe very fulfilled, maybe not at all. If you don’t like what you are doing, do something else. I don’t know if it’s worth trying to project your personal dissatisfaction into some broad diagnosis of social ills. Many of the alternatives to the rat race are pretty dismal.
• Minor49er 4y ago
  I wonder if the author is the type of person to use up all of his vacation time or let it build up
  • kaashif 4y ago
    Interesting question. At my old job a lot of people would let vacation days accumulate and since only a few days would carry over to the next year, lots of people "had" to "think of" a vacation towards the end of the year. This was always insane to me, I always had my vacations and visits to family planned out well in advance, I never had anything left over. Maybe it means something, maybe not.
• mrmincent 4y ago
  Watching the linked video made me realise how out of step I feel with the rat race now that I work from home 100%. No more stressful commutes, no more suit and ties. I might step into a giant shopping centre once every 3 months, if that. I don’t see adverts anywhere except on my phone when I’m scrolling. I think I’m lucky because I get to live in a very walkable suburb in Melbourne AU. Feels less like a race, and more like a stroll. Instead of quitting and moving to the mountains, maybe just move to a place that’s a bit more liveable and work a job that’s a bit more flexible.
  • horns4lyfe 4y ago
    I’m with you. I don’t even live in a super walkable urban core or anything, just a suburb. I realized I don’t hate the rat race, I just hate being in an office.
• mr_tristan 4y ago
  So, it's great the author has recognized they are unhappy, but "heading to the mountains because I had good experiences there" seems like terrible decision making. The "happiness trifecta" still seems to be a sense of purpose, autonomy, and expertise. Money just helps remove stressors. I'd like to see more stories of people working to open a path in a system where it didn't exist before. Like, "how I carved out a new position at this huge company that gave be a better sense of why I do what I do". Everyone tends to think they need to go to a small place to have a big impact, but I think you can bend the world wherever you are a bit if you know how to define the targets, and get there slowly, one day at a time. Big career changes are sometimes worth it, though I wouldn't follow this guy's lead. I found this experience from a woodworker who left architecture much more interesting: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQoqGPnRLbU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQoqGPnRLbU
• xnx 4y ago
  Everyone making $200k+ should definitely immediately quit and follow this path so I can swoop in for some of that cash.
  • temende 4y ago
    There are plenty of $200k SWE jobs available (largely but not exclusively at FAANG), I don't think you need to wait for other people to leave.
• namuol 4y ago
  I’m pretty sure the romanticizing of the idea of “quitting the rat race” is one of the largest motivators to play the game. If you want to quit the rat race you’re going to have to sacrifice a lot, unless you checks notes “[work] at a top tier investment bank as a software engineer”.
  • mancerayder 4y ago
    This is a thoughtful comment compared to the debates raging above. It makes you think we've fallen (yet again) into the trap of the utopia, the paradise ideal, namely freedom not to do this (where this is software engineering instead of something else, or living in an urban setting instead of a rural one; both sets of ideals described above).
  • strken 4y ago
    Sometimes the perfect is the enemy of the good, yeah. If you can manage to work four days a week, or live halfway up a mountain in a weird semi-commune sharehouse and work from home, that's not perfect, but maybe it's a lot better than working 60 hour weeks for 20 years then retiring.
  • Existenceblinks 4y ago
    I'm like please put me in the race track and give me $100k reward because my slow life makes me and family hungry .. yet still forced to race in a terrible track.
  • lm28469 4y ago
    Or work part time at a chill company, 3 days a week and still make 2-3 times the min wage of your country (easily doable in tech). You're still in the race, but instead of burning everything to get in front and "win" (win what ?) you're just taking a stroll at the back, enjoying the view while chatting with your friends
    • disqard 4y ago
      Staying at the back leaves the door open to amazing outcomes: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Bradbury https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Bradbury (burning out and quitting definitely removes that possibility)
• dqpb 4y ago
  Not bad, except it doesn't show all the amazing things the rats are building.
• outside1234 4y ago
  > When I cycle I need to cycle through kilometre after kilometre of urban jungle before I see anything resembling a field. This is the exact realization I had that lead me to quit London as well.
• jehb 4y ago
  Having "quit the rat race" last year, spending much time in the mountains just like the author, and now finding myself back in the corporate world again, I do have one piece of advice. Do not let your job become a part of your identity. I work just as hard at my new job as I did at my last one, but in my mind, they're just a client I'm choosing to offer services to at this time. I've made many good friends through work over the years, but now my loyalty to my friends is independent of my loyalty to the companies for which we work. I used to use the demonym of my place of work to tell people about myself; now I describe myself by my hobbies, my beliefs, and my aspirations. Did that solve everything? Of course not. Late-stage capitalism is still riddled with bullshit. But I do sleep better at night.
  • rafaelero 4y ago
    > Do not let your job become a part of your identity. I disagree. People should strive for a fulfilling job that allows them to express their identity. Just try not to be so picky that you end up with so few options.
• thenerdhead 4y ago
  This seems to be a common phenomena. One thing that recently stood out as to why is the flow state famous by Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi. In short, you might experience flow outside of your day-to-day life (i.e. work). It becomes such an addicting feeling that you try to revolve your entire life around that new sensation. It's funny, because much of the time it happens when people do something a bit difficult and outside of their current skillset. For software types it tends to always be something with nature or woodworking.
• wnolens 4y ago
  Ah yes.. the trope of overpaid (with respect to history) millennial writing about their transcendence from this absurd thing called 'work'. Not judging harshly because I did nearly the same as the author years ago! Only I found a pot of emptiness at the end of the rainbow. I hope he really REALLY likes mountains ;)
  • deleted 4y ago
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  • temende 4y ago
    So you tried doing what the OP did and ended up going back to your job? Would love to hear more if you don't mind expanding.
    • wnolens 4y ago
      Have a lot to say, it was an emotional journey with highest highs and lowest lows of my life. But can't type it all out. Happy to answer any particular question. In short: I saved up enough not to quit rat race forever, but to see what life was like without the obligation to work for an open ended amount of time. I did whatever the hell I wanted at any moment. Which was euphoric, but it's really really hard to accomplish larger efforts or really meaningful things with that attitude, because those things necessarily come with struggle. With no obligation, you don't need a tolerance to pain. You just quit building your side project when it gets frustrating. I only had staying power doing the things I enjoyed the process of. After 2.5y (the last 1.5y spent doing 20h/wk contract work, and trying to build a startup) I crashed and burned hard psychologically. Freedom means nothing to me intrinsically, I need a reason to appreciate the freedom or make productive use of it. The appreciation wore off, mountains wore off, I don't actually want to code on my own time. Everyone else in life is busy doing meaningful things to them. I broke down and got a job again, but with a much different relationship with work.
      • temende 4y ago
        Wow, we actually have very similar trajectories. Except I'm still at the point of doing part-time work + coding side-projects/startups on the side. I agree that the too much freedom can be disorienting. If you don't mind me asking, how did you end up deciding that getting a job again was the right move? How did that compare to keeping doing 20hr/wk contract work and then spending the rest of your time doing non-coding/non-startup stuff if that's what was burning you out?
• SeattleAltruist 4y ago
  Kudos! May I suggest ikiagi, the overlap between what you are good at (vocation), what you love (passion), what makes adequate money (profession), and what the world needs (mission). See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ikigai https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ikigai. The Japanese call it "the reason for getting out of bed in the morning." Best of luck with your continued search for balance in life.
  • mupuff1234 4y ago
    Ikigai as how some western authors try to portray and promote it isn't really a thing in Japanese culture according to the economist. https://www.economist.com/asia/2022/10/27/what-japan-makes-of-ikigai https://www.economist.com/asia/2022/10/27/what-japan-makes-o...
    • unforeseen9991 4y ago
      Thanks for this. It's funny how stemmed from some british dude who essentially made it up and people bought into it. I was also surprised by all the other terms I seen floating around that are a similar thing
• jonstewart 4y ago
  I grew up in a rural area in the US. I love nature and the outdoors. I also love programming. But, rural living is vastly less sustainable on a per capita basis than city living. The elegiac tone of a rural paradise lost is a familiar one throughout the past few centuries. It’s an aspect of “blood-and-soil” nationalism (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_and_soil https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_and_soil) and Boomer-era environmentalism and of Tolkien (so, I guess that’s in order of most to least problematic). It is easy to feel the longing, but it’s also worth some critical thinking. I’ve got a place in the country that I go when I need to get away from the city (and, yes, putting a lot of time and effort into making it sustainable…). I find myself doing a lot of programming there. And then I go back to the city to talk to people about the code, and find out what they’ve been coding.
  • deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
• juve1996 4y ago
  This post really ruffled some feathers on here, talking about how he can't find happiness out there, you can't find happiness externally, it's all internal, he can only do this because he makes money, etc. It's amazing how many people simply want to tear others down, I think, deep down, many wish they could do the same as this man.
  • throwaway_au_1 4y ago
    100%. The guy is leaving something behind that doesn't fulfil him in pursuit of something that does, and what do the best minds of HN have to offer? "Well actually"
  • bradly 4y ago
    When I told my family and friends my plan to leave my great FAANG job to retire early very few of the responses were positive. It was really disheartening after working so hard for so many years towards that goal.
    • csomar 4y ago
      You are the status quo. By leaving, you are breaking their new (since FAANGs are a recent thing) social structure. They’d definitively not support you.
      • unforeseen9991 4y ago
        Jealousy and resentment as well
      • strken 4y ago
        I think it's more likely that he's a success story, and it's disheartening to see your example of success quit and "stop doing anything." This is of course unfair to him and he shouldn't be beholden to other people using him as an exemplar, nor is it likely that he's done nothing since retiring, but it's an understandable reaction.
    • qwerpy 4y ago
• syndacks 4y ago
  Me me me me. Virtue signal, virtue signal, virtue signal. I don't understand these pieces ... like, quit your job. I don't give a shit that you make a lot of money at a bank and you aren't fulfilled, what did you think was going to happen?
  • weakfortress 4y ago
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• deleted 4y ago
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• tinktank 4y ago
  Good luck Sean. Hope it all works out for you. I would derive pleasure by transitive closure if you make it out of this hell hole we call work.
• paulpauper 4y ago
  The rat race and BS jobs' are not that bad. You get paid good money to not have to expend much effort .many people would love such a privilege. Look how many applicants white collar companies get. Low paid jobs are just as tedious or worse, but obviously lower pay...having to death with 'Karen' customers and such. There are many stories of people on reddit (such as investing and 'FIRE' subs) and here doing their '4 & 10' and having a large nest egg to show for it,
• raincom 4y ago
  Everyone access happiness through the world (work, money, people, events, trips, etc). What happens to everyone is this: whatever things that give access to your happiness, cease to be be that conduit to happiness after sometime; so, you end up chasing new things in the world, these new things provide that new conduit to happiness. Rinse and repeat.
• yawnxyz 4y ago
  > Around the 30 second mark is a scene where the protaganist rat is waiting for a train to arrive at a packed platform I was visiting London and took the train in the morning to the airport (this is a really bad idea), and saw that exact thing play out. Some girl was smushed into the crowd in train by someone outside so she could make the train, like a cartoon character. Definitely convinced me I couldn't do a 9-5 after that
• riemannzeta 4y ago
  I believe Mr. Barry is simply doing what very few of us are brave enough to do: To think for himself! We are social animals, and many of our goals are the defaults set for us by our social cohort. Very seldom do we take the time to think deeply about what we really enjoy, much less have the courage to act on what we might think in a way that would mark us as different. After all, any rejection of the defaults is a subversive threat to undermine the entire system! Good for you, Mr. Barry. I for one am very excited to hear more from you in the future!
• Nevermark 4y ago
  I quit what was my dream job for a great many years, but eventually became a terribly frustrating pinching slog. I sacrificed a lot of value and security. I have many more worries today, some more serious than any problem I had at that job. But I feel enormous relief, I sleep better, and between the most extreme hurdles that come by, I am far far happier. I don’t think there is any simple rule for when to change one’s outlook or change one’s scenery. Both are important tools!
• bacon_waffle 4y ago
  > If this resonated with you - reach out to me on Twitter It resonated with me, right up until the "on Twitter" part. A few weeks shy of 20 years ago, I was a fed-up high school student and made probably the best decision of my life so far. I loaded my stuff in to the back of a beat-up Nissan 720, drove it over to the high school to return their books and sign a few papers to drop out, continued driving a few hours down the road to Georgia where I unloaded stuff in to storage the next day, then started walking the Appalachian Trail... Just a few minutes ago, I got off the phone with a friend from 500-odd miles in to that walk; he recited a line from Thoreau about most men leading a life of quiet desperation. My friend had to cut our call short, as a childhood friend of his was on another line, presumably with news about their recent stage-4 cancer diagnosis. We're talking about a canoe trip, and I very much hope we actually make it happen. But, in the meantime, I have an infinite list of bugs to work on.
  • seanbarry 4y ago
    Author here. You'll notice I didn't ask the reader to "follow me on twitter". I had ~30 people reach out to me in DMs on twitter. Some were people who feel in a similar position but don't know what to do. Others were people who have been where I am and offered advice. Twitter is just a tool to connect with people outside of the immediate circle I have around me, I don't think there's any problem with using it as such.
    • bacon_waffle 4y ago
      Forgive me, but I don't understand the relevance of "follow" vs "reach out to". In the post, you wrote a paragraph starting with `Almost everything around me is designed to addict me.`, which seems incongruous with communicating through Twitter. I'm glad it has worked out well for you and those ~30 other folks anyway. Mainly I intended to say that I have exited and successfully re-entered the rat race (actually, a few times), and fully support others in doing so. Do it while you can! Many commenters clearly don't get it, and probably never will. But, I do, and I don't have a Twitter account.
• BirAdam 4y ago
  First, this comes off to me as a very privileged take. Second, I do feel the pain of corporate life, and I switched to working for a non-profit because of it. Leaving the city… nah. Just moved to the perimeter and now I can drive 10 minutes to downtown or 20 to the mountains. Why get a septic tank, a well, my own water treatment, and all this other stuff if I need not do so?
• ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
  I've mentioned before, how I had to have done [to|for] me, that which I could not do for myself. I was told "Go away, old man. No one wants you.", in, pretty much, those words. Hurt like hell, but after I got over my sniffles, I learned to "lean into" my exile. I just released a new kernel for the app I'm working on. I budgeted two months for it, but got it done -at much higher functionality than planned- in five weeks. The difference in my development velocity and product Quality is nothing short of astounding.
• boh 4y ago
  These self-indulgent "I'm not happy with my high paying job" posts are getting pretty repetative and tedious. Most people don't actually work to get "fulfilled". I guess this must resonate as freedom-porn.
  • disqard 4y ago
    You're not wrong, though here's one underlying reason why it's playing out this way: https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/02/religion-workism-making-americans-miserable/583441/ https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/02/religion-w... Excerpt: "In the past century, the American conception of work has shifted from jobs to careers to callings—from necessity to status to meaning. In an agrarian or early-manufacturing economy, where tens of millions of people perform similar routinized tasks, there are no delusions about the higher purpose of, say, planting corn or screwing bolts: It’s just a job."
• siftrics 4y ago
  Steve Cutts' other piece is very good, as well. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=A-rEb0KuopI https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=A-rEb0KuopI
• steele 4y ago
  16 days into the new year
• motohagiography 4y ago
  Happiness, it's what you don't have - that's the oldest hustle in the world. I was just cursing a pile of sticks that were too damp to light and I was being deprived of the bonfire I had assembled and was preparing to light, and I was laughing because in the words of Buckaroo Banzai, "wherever you go, there you are." I've achieved a kind of temporary exit for as long as my means permit, and I can say that the real that the rat race conceals is not for everyone. My trip up the hedonic treadmill was such that I even wrote professionally about the sort of things one might buy in the hopes of finding a there there, pitching stories about exotic experiences one could have for the price of a vacation. There isn't a there there. There is no yacht long enough, club exclusive enough, view stunning enough, or achievement great enough that it makes you any different from the person standing on the subway platform. You will be the same person. I guarantee that if you flame out of your job, cash in your savings and manage to summit Everest, the first thing you will do when you get to the top is check your phone. The things that seemed so important were only symbolic. Pursuit of symbols specificially disqualifies us from attaining the meaning they represent. Maybe the humility is worth it, as yeah, the things I achieved were symbols that don't mean the same things now that I have them, but that's the treadmill, the pursuit of symbols and representations - affect. I can say with some confidence that you only actually have what is yours to share, not all of it is good, and meaning only exists in the moment of sharing it. I can also say that unhappy people are not lonely, as their misery and self involvement keeps them from noticing it. I think to really understand what it means to be lonely, you need to find some happiness first, then when you move to share it with someone who isn't there, that's the feeling. That absence of no one in particular, but with the sense of having lost someone close. It is truly a rarefied experience I am glad to have been able to appreciate, but it's not a solution to anything. If you want to exit the rat race, try camping first, maybe a longish canoe trip, or read some good literary fiction. Ultimately, it's just you. This is all to say, we invent the conditions we impose on our choosing happiness. They are symbolic and representations, they are not the real, and the real is not far or exotic. It's perhaps easier to believe we are unfufilled by our successes, and that there is another life out there if we just leave all this behind, as it puts off recognizing that we're probably just idiots in profoundly difficult ways.
• fdsfawfds 4y ago
  [dead]
• audiodude 4y ago
  God I hate nature
  • amalgamated_inc 4y ago
    Only thing worse than nature is people talking about how much they love nature. Especially hiking. Gosh!
• footlose_3815 4y ago
  >I’m excruciatingly lucky to have been in the right place at the right time This article is just another reminder that techbros making bank can afford the luxury to save-up a few years, and spend years contemplating their self-realization. I'm glad the author was able to finance their perspective-changing journey, but reading this is less of a lesson, and more of reading that someone won the lottery. You can only leave the rat race if you can afford to... The rest of the earth can't do this and the author is writing from a place of great (earned) privilege. Must be nice.
  • blahblah1234567 4y ago
    "techbro" always sounds like passive-aggresive envy to me. As though the person saying it wish they were a technologist, so they could earn more.
• ggm 4y ago
  The thing is, there is a selection bias at play here. The ones who really succeed in "quitting the rat race" don't show up because they have next to no interest in discussing this with you, or anyone else online. I don't mean the silence from HNW individuals, I mean the real quitters, who are sitting round a version of Thoreau's Walden pond NOT WRITING ABOUT IT The "FIRE" community are the front edge. Once they get there, they stop obsessively telling people how they did it. The best choice I made was closing out my socials. I do wonder why I keep HN open (as I am sure, do many people who choose to read what I write here) and I suspect it's also going away, when I turn off, tune out, and drop off. My superannuation (pension in UK speak) is vesting out inside 6 months. It's not HNW. I won't be in lambos. It is more than enough for me and my partner, to be quiet, and sufficiently comfortable in our declining years. If I misjudged the market I'll either go back to work, or not. "it depends". It might be in this field, it might be in another. A surprising number of older (and not so old) retirees work because they want to (I know many work because they have no choice)
• _8j50 4y ago
  Been there, done that. "The rat race" is a very reductionist and naive take. What I found out is, wherever you go, there you are. You must really be at peace with yourself for a change in environment to bring you lasting peace. Mountains, beaches, deserts, forests are all amazing. But you do get used to them and then miss the cool city life and convenience. But wherever you go, you bring your problems with you. The drugs, alcohol,etc... in that video are solutions for the rat's unhappiness. It isn't the race that is the problem, it is the person. There is wisdom in balance. Make a lot of money with the least amount of work-time and spend that money by traveling or living somewhere nice. Doing fun things. But none of that will solve the sickness of the human soul.
  • JSavageOne 4y ago
    There's some truth to this, but environment does make a difference. The problem with this advice is that it seems to imply that moving doesn't make a difference - when the reality is that some people are just better suited to different environments. A nature lover is just going to be happier living somewhere blessed with beautiful nature than in NYC. The challenge of course is distinguishing which problems are external vs internal, and sometimes you need to make the external change to discern the difference.
    • _8j50 4y ago
      I think I have acknowledged that. Sure, move where you are better suited but don't expect that to solve your problems. It's the same thing as with finding a spouse or a job of your dreams that also pays well. That's less problems for you but believe me when I say the disappointment is is truly crushing when you work hard to make these changes happen hoping it will solve problems that can only be solved by working on yourself but things get even worse! Imagine moving to a rural place and you enjoy nature but now ontop of it all you are very lonely, isolated and stressed for time and money for example.
• SnowHill9902 4y ago
  First step to quitting the rat race is to quit being a rat.
• friend_and_foe 4y ago
  Shit, that's what I did. I highly recommend it to anyone who'll listen.
• bix6 4y ago
  Sean, you should consider reading Be Here Now by Ram Dass
• generated 4y ago
  "The ultimate capitalist luxury - the illusion that I was not participating in capitalism." -Kirsten Hacker
• deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
• JSavageOne 4y ago
  I resonate with this as I type this from NYC, a city significantly more nature-starved than London. I was pretty impressed with the parks and greenery in London. My friend there bought a unit in the first floor of a townhouse with a backyard in a peaceful but convenient neighborhood. Such an apartment would cost at least double in NYC and those sort of places are rare. I'm definitely not a rural person, but I do think that living in nature has a strong correlation to happiness. I don't think the average person in a concrete jungle like NYC is happier than in a random village in the Amazon jungle or the Swiss alps. I don't regret my time I lived in NYC though other than that I stayed too long. It's fun for a time in one's life while one is young, but it's not a forever place for most people. Most jobs suck. "Find your passion" is bullshit career advice because a job by definition means selling your freedom (if the job was so much fun they wouldn't need to pay you because people would do it for free). Unfortunately the reality is that we must make money to afford a modern lifestyle, and thus if you want financial freedom you will probably need to get a job (yes you can create your own business, but until that takes off you need to pay the bills somehow). I quit the rat race and left NYC to travel the world. After 1.5 years of traveling I started to run amount of money and I reluctantly decided to start working again - this time remotely. But to my surprise I found that I actually enjoyed the new job and had missed having that sense of responsibility (or maybe I liked finally seeing my bank account balance go up and was trying to rationalize it, who knows). But eventually the job started to suck as I realized it was a deadend job and felt like I wasn't respected. I was miserable and performing the job was a chore, but I stayed because I didn't have the courage to quit a job that paid so well for so little work - the same position I was in in NYC before my world travel. Finally that contract ended, and I was again free from work obligations. This time I set my goal to create my own tech projects with the hope of eventually monetizing them and living off of that. Finally I enjoyed programming again because I was building whatever I wanted. A job fell in my lap with another startup, and I initially didn't want to take it because my focus was on my own work. But in the end I decided to give it a chance as I figured it could be a valuable experience, and I can always quit if I don't like it. The job turned out to be awesome. Awesome people, interesting problems, and I get a front row seat at an early stage startup. The downside of course is that I have not been able to put as much time on my personal projects as I'd like, but I am still working on it on the side, and we'll see if I can manage them both. Leaving the rat race to travel the world led to some amazing experiences with high highs and low lows. I went from being sick of software engineering to wanting to build my own tech startups - which is my main work goal now. It took me traveling so much I got bored of it until I got inspired to want to build tech things again to solve my own problems. But maybe you'll leave forever and prefer being a park ranger in the words - who knows. We're all different. In any case I think people should do whatever the hell they want, as no money is worth wasting one's life in misery. Worst case scenario you don't like living in the nature and can return to London to work at another bank with a renewed sense of gratefulness. Of course most likely you probably won't ever return to the same exact old life. Maybe you'll work remotely for a startup from the woods, or become a writer, or go completely offline and just live a simpler life. Who knows. It doesn't matter as long as you're doing you. Either way best of luck on your journey, from one rat rat escapee to the next.
• angarg12 4y ago
  What I don't like about the discourse on the "rat race" online is that people only discuss two extremes: either you work a high paid, highly stressing job that you hate, or you retire. I feel dumb saying this, but there are many combinations of salary, stress and meaning (to choose three axis) as companies out there. If instead of "rat race vs not" we frame it as a tradeoff between possibly conflicting attributes, which may vary person to person and at different points in life, I think we'd have a more fruitful conversation.
• 5350-uiop-1130 4y ago
  is this one of those thing's with OPs parents owning 4 properties or something... i'm glad you were able to quit. i did see that video recently and found it a bit cliche but well made.
• lazyeye 4y ago
  For a great example of an utterly different way of life, I recommend checking out the TV reality series "Port Protection" where they document the lives of people living a modern-day subsistence lifestyle in a small community on an island in Alaska. The only access is by boat or float-plane. By any definition these people are not rich but they are definitely happier than most city-dwellers IMO. I think there are 6 series now. https://www.imdb.com/title/tt4838586/ https://www.imdb.com/title/tt4838586/
• kovac 4y ago
  All the best in your endeavours. Hope you will find what you're looking for.
• 8bitsrule 4y ago
  John Perry Barlow, "The Pursuit of Emptiness" https://www.forbes.com/asap/2001/1203/096_print.html https://www.forbes.com/asap/2001/1203/096_print.html
  • nickd2001 4y ago
    Very wise words :)
• test6554 4y ago
  I'm terrified of retirement because then I would be "free to do all the stuff nobody else wants to do" around the house. From the rat race to the rat trap.
• seanbarry 4y ago
  Author here. I posted this late last night (BST) and I’m shocked to wake and see it was so heavily read and discussed. Thank you everyone! The post received some justifiable criticism for making it sound like I’m about to disappear in to the mountains to live like a hermit in a poorly thought out, idealistic middle finger to society. In reality the change I’m making is to move to a much smaller place where I still have people and the urban environment around me, but with a much healthier balance of the things I value: family, nature, and quiet. Importantly, I’ll be a 15 minute walk from the seaside and a short drive away from the mountains - so I’ll be able to escape to them as often as I want. I also want to find or create more meaningful work, even though this means my income may be lower. I don’t have FU money from working at a FAANG company, so my personal runway is ~6 months. I won’t be taking significant time off. The most ironic thing is that change isn’t immediate. It’s going to be six weeks before my obligations here expire and until then, life continues as it has done previously. As I write this comment I’m standing in a packed train on the way in to the city, but today with a little smile on my face.
  • mclightning 4y ago
    Commuting in London is a headache by itself. I live/work in London but remotely. I earn less than what I used to, but I think I am happier.
  • nunez 4y ago
    Thank you for linking to that video. I've never heard of it prior to reading your post. Really enjoyed it.
  • simonebrunozzi 4y ago
    Enjoy your time off. Keep us posted. I hope you'll find something more fulfilling when you will feel the urge to get back at earning money. My only humble suggestion is to write a journal of your experience being "off the rat race". And maybe share some of it. Good luck.
• ideamotor 4y ago
  His job sounded like a hamster wheel but otherwise, well, it’s amazing how different I am from the author. I view everything about the inner city completely opposite. That’s where the people are, things to do, engagement, social life, the action. He even got to ride a subway. I’m very jealous of what he tossed aside. Meanwhile, it’s not that I don’t like nature but I go crazy stuck without people.
• pointlessone 4y ago
  > The truth is: nothing I’ve done or experienced in this place has given me any experience comparable to walking along the ridge between two mountains. Nothing has made me feel alive like getting in to freezing cold water despite my body screaming at me not to. Nothing has made me feel anything like that feeling when you summit a mountain after 2 hours of solid climbing in the rain, and the clouds part to reveal the most spectacular and breathtaking view you’ve ever seen. It's true by definition. One experience is not like the other. The tone hints at what OP prefers but it's rather easy to come up with a statement pointing in the other direction. "Nothing has made me feel anything like that feeling when you get out of a nice warm bath, dress up nicely, walk to your favourite local restaurant with your mates and get a your favourite meal with a nice glass of wine." Or whatever tickles your fancy. > The best part about those things is that there is no booking system. There is no door security choosing who gets in because there is no door. It’s all there, ready to be experienced, and free. There are many other free things out there. Starving in the African heat. Freezing under shelling somewhere in Ukraine. Dying of incurable disease. At the same time, there are many things ready to be experienced that are not free but, I'm sure, OP can easily afford. A nice meal in a good restaurant, a movie, a coffee with a friend, a book, comfort of his home, a trip to wherever his childhood was. I suspect, even his quitting is not entirely free. It probably comes from his privilege to be able to not work for a while and be able to afford all the gear he needs for mountaineering. It's not a critique of his choice. I'm glad he has the option to choose and doubly so that he's happy with the choice he made. I'm critical though of OP implying that that option is the best. That it's obviously betters, and free on top of everything, but somehow overlooked buy everyone. I understand how big city can be overwhelming. Referring to it as "Rat Race" is a little dramatic, I'd say. The toon paints a bleak picture that reflect only one side of the modern city life. Retreating to mountains is only one way to deal with it, too. And it's on the more severe side of possible solutions spectrum.
• netfortius 4y ago
  Thank you for this!! I finally have one link to send to all those who asked me "why", instead of getting lost in incomprehensible [to them] explanations ...
• alexpotato 4y ago
  > and the water I drink has been recycled many times. Who's going to tell him that ALL the water on Earth has been recycled many, many times. As a professor once said: "All the air you're breathing and all the water you're drinking was the same stuff the dinosaurs consumed and shit into."
  • Pigalowda 4y ago
    I’m not sure what recycled water was meant in the article? Does he mean grey water? Apparently that is used only a little bit in London and in specific places, not in households unless a system has been installed. I guess if he wanted to avoid recycled water he could collect and purify water from animal aerobic respiration or hydrocarbon combustion. Even then the oxygen and hydrogen could have been used before.
• jacknews 4y ago
  Can I have your old job please? 'The mountains' are wonderful while you still have a pile of cash to pay 'friendly locals' to help support your dream, but eventually you will get older, and it will run out...
  • throwaway4aday 4y ago
    It all runs out eventually, best to make use of it now while you can still climb mountains.
• SyzygistSix 4y ago
  "If this resonated with you, message me on Twitter" That makes the post ring rather hollow to me. It sounds like they want to monetize their experience of quitting and rejoining nature. Which basically reads like another version of selling the secrets to a 5 hour work week kind of deal.
  • seanbarry 4y ago
    Author here. This was not my intention. Please see my explanation here: https://news.ycombinator.com/reply?id=34426290&goto=item%3Fid%3D34406760%26p%3D2%2334426290 https://news.ycombinator.com/reply?id=34426290&goto=item%3Fi...