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Those journalists weren't reporting specific locations of his jet...they were reporting on a legit news story about it. Musk didn't like it so the journalists a
by GoofballJones 4y ago
Those journalists weren't reporting specific locations of his jet...they were reporting on a legit news story about it. Musk didn't like it so the journalists are now banned.
The dude is truly off his rocker now. The "rules" are whatever he makes up on the spot. He's self-destructing before our eyes...no longer the richest man in the world. Telsa stock tanking all because he can't STFU and acts like a spoiled 12 year old.
- fourstar 4y ago
- dang 4y agoWe've banned this account for breaking the site guidelines - https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html. I really hate to ban a 14 year old account, but you've been posting abusively so consistently lately—in fact it seems that's all you've been doing—that I don't see what choice we have. If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future. They're here: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html.
- NaturalPhallacy 4y ago>Those journalists weren't reporting specific locations of his jet...they were reporting on a legit news story about it. Come on now. They were linking directly to the tracker that Sweeney was banned for, not just reporting on the story about it. It was a childish petulant doxxing on purpose and they got treated the same as Sweeney.
- TulliusCicero 4y agoHow is it "doxxing" to use public flight data? Am I missing something here?
- notinfuriated 4y agoI think of it as about the same as the recent complaints that Elon Musk posting 'prosecute Fauci' means he is responsible for Dr. Fauci receiving death threats, or whatever the actual consequence was of that. That is, the idea or information already exists and is publicly available to anyone, but it has been 'amplified' here and this makes it much more serious. (I disagree with the logic in both cases.)
- rosnd 4y agoWhat adsbexchange, flightradar & co. are doing is almost certainly illegal in Europe under the GDPR. This isn't exactly "public flight data", in many cases it's illegally collected and published flight data. E: I can't reply to "imnotjames" below thanks to HN ratelimits, but here you go: It's an obvious GDPR violation, just like it'd be an obvious GDPR violation to publish a similar database but with phone IMEIs and associated locations instead of aircraft.
- imnotjames 4y agoHow is it illegal?
- Nas808 4y agoThe FAA has a program called LADD (Limiting Aircraft Data Displayed) and high-profile individuals, etc can sign up to it. The major players in the flight tracking business like FlightRadar24 or FlightAware follow that. But sites like ADS-B Exchange do not adhere to that, so you can see a lot more flights that are blocked on the others. Also anyone with a Raspberry Pi and a cheap antenna can build their own ADS-B receiver and get that unfiltered data.
- TulliusCicero 4y agoMusk lives in the US, I imagine most of his flights are within the US. Not sure why you're bringing up GDPR.
- seanhunter 4y agoNot sure how GDPR is relevant since Elon Musk isn’t the EU data commissioner so it’s not up to him to enforce GDPR, and neither Musk, nor Twitter itself, nor the journalists, nor the sites concerned nor the information in question is in any way European[1]. Here’s the definition of personal data under GDPR[2] for anyone who’s curious. If this information hypothetically were to be published by a company with a European or UK connection about an EU or UK data subject and that person were to complain to their national data protection authority we might be in GDPR enforcement territory. [1] or UK because UK GDPR is a thing even though the UK is no longer in the EU [2] https://www.gdpreu.org/the-regulation/key-concepts/personal-data/ https://www.gdpreu.org/the-regulation/key-concepts/personal-...
- revetkn 4y agoMaybe, but the last straw for me on that platform was preventing tweets from linking to arbitrary, non-doxxing Mastodon profiles (try it and see). I tested it to confirm and deactivated my account afterwards. Who would want to be on a social network like that?
- notinfuriated 4y agoWhy didn't you leave when they blocked tweets that linked to the Hunter Biden laptop story?
- RavingGoat 4y ago
- Pxtl 4y ago
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- godelski 4y agoYou're allowed to be upset about more than one thing.
- notinfuriated 4y agoYes, you absolutely are. Nothing in my comment suggested you are not. The comment I responded to specifically was upset about censorship targeted at tweeting Mastodon links and not another version of censorship which came in the exact same form but targeted X links. I just gave X a name. I find it somewhat absurd that a person would become indignant when the link is Y instead of X.
- revetkn 4y ago
- RavingGoat 4y agoOne simply called out his lie about the attack on the car. He didn't even file a police report.
- hgdfhgdfhgdfbgf 4y ago
- richbell 4y agoIf you were attacked by someone and got a clear picture of their license plate, would you: a) report it to the police, who have direct access to vehicle registrations and can easily find the perpetrator or b) post on Twitter asking random people if they recognize a person's face or license plate? https://nitter.it/@ZacksJerryRig/status/1603286484785586178 https://nitter.it/@ZacksJerryRig/status/1603286484785586178 https://nitter.it/pic/orig/enc/bWVkaWEvRmtBR0FsUGFjQUE4MjQzLmpwZw== https://nitter.it/pic/orig/enc/bWVkaWEvRmtBR0FsUGFjQUE4MjQzL...
- BoorishBears 4y agoDid you really make an account just to spam low-effort comments in Elon's favor in the comments of this article? Has his recent behavior been that defensible?
- nickthegreek 4y agoWell it would add some credibility to a man who has burnt up his benefit of the doubt quota.
- MallocVoidstar 4y agoHis jet's location isn't doxxing and the public has a legitimate interest in it.
- wfme 4y agoWhat exactly is this "legitimate" interest?
- kasey_junk 4y agoThe general premise about why flight data is public is because the planes are using a public good. The airspace of a place is a commons, what happens in the commons is everyone’s to know.
- wfme 4y agoSince military planes use this same public good, is their flight data also published?
- kasey_junk 4y agoNo but the most accepted premise is we give up public goods for national security not because rich guys don’t like it.
- _kbh_ 4y agoYou can actually track a large number of military flights on websites such as https://www.adsbexchange.com/ https://www.adsbexchange.com/ a large amount of the time they fly with there transponder on because they don’t want to hit other aircraft.
- matkoniecz 4y agoIn general yes, for example https://www.flightradar24.com/ https://www.flightradar24.com/ shows right now FORTE10 plane (Northrop Grumman RQ-4B Global Hawk) which is UAV heading toward Black Sea where it will be spying over Russian invasion of Ukraine and launches of Russian missiles from Black Sea in their bombing of Ukrainian cities. Flights supplying Ukraine were routinely top viewed flights on that website (they were flying to Rzeszów in Poland, so there was no real risk of Russian shooting them down). AWACS planes and tanker flying in holding patterns over Poland, Romania and Baltic Sea used to be top observed planes on flightradar24 but I should be now working not looking through flightradar24 planes over Poland ( so I will link https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-europe-60612255 https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-europe-60612255 that has video of inside one of them ). Obviously planes flying combat missions are not publishing data there. Presumably ones training in restricted airspace are not either for also obvious reasons.
- sillysaurusx 4y agoNot quite. Some of the journalists linked to a Facebook page about the topic, which is a small but crucial distinction. Banning for linking to peripheral news stories is pretty bad.
- NaturalPhallacy 4y agoThe Facebook page is where Sweeney said you could find the tracker...
- jhugo 4y agoWhen did a Facebook page become a "peripheral news story"?
- yurodivuie 4y agoThey were banned for including a link to where Sweeney moved. I wonder if everyone who posts a link to these journalists will get banned too. If it were an algorithm, everyone in Twitter would be banned by tomorrow. I hope it works.
- EGreg 4y agoPerhaps now we can see how Freedom Ain't Free. You can't claim to be a free speech absolutist, or a supporter of the second amendment, but then go ban stuff you don't like as soon as it concerns YOU. Doxxing isn't illegal. I thought Elon claimed that ONLY violation of national laws could be the basis for deplatforming. As if his understaffed team can make legal decisions on the spot, and output true/false about millions of tweets that fall into gray areas. They don't even KNOW the whole body of law, and they aren't the judge or jury either. I had two discussions with Noam Chomsky about how capitalism has co-opted Freedom of Speech, just like it has done with Women's Lib and many other things In 2020: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HovxY1qBfek https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HovxY1qBfek A year later: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gv5mI6ClPGc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gv5mI6ClPGc
- hgdfhgdfhgdfbgf 4y agoHow is the second amendment relevant here? Zuckerberg's jet account and others like it were also banned.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- nephanth 4y agoI mean the location of his jet is public information (all flight plans are public records). Plus he's a public personality, so not really concerned by most of that "anti-doxxing" rule
- lovich 4y agoOn that note, for anyone who would argue he didn’t consent to giving up his right to privacy on where he travels, he explicitly used his presence as a tool to endorse companies, people, and activities. You can’t actively imply people should give you and your business partners money because you physically showed up to a location and then be upset that people care where you are physically located
- lovich 4y agoOn that note, for anyone who would argue he didn’t consent to giving up his right to privacy on where he travels, he explicitly used his presence as a tool to endorse companies, people, and activities. You can’t actively imply people give you and your business partners money because you physically showed up to a location and then be upset that people care where you are physically located
- zoklet-enjoyer 4y agoThat's a ridiculous argument. Just because he does some public relations stuff doesn't mean it's ok to blast out his location to the world. Yes, it's public information, but so what? Would you want a Twitter account dedicated to broadcasting your movements to the world?
- tluyben2 4y agoIf I owned a private jet, I would assume it is broadcasted, because it has to be, legally. Nothing you can do. Anyone can find it, so what’s the difference if a Twitter account links it? Obviously it’s a different story if someone would indeed make his (and his family) real-time moves outside his jet known. But I haven’t seen that unless he announced it himself.
- checkyoursudo 4y agoHow many degrees of separation from actually PII is allowed? Would posting a link to an account that posts a link to the tracker be an offense? Banning people for posting a link to someone else possibly violating the rules seems like a step way too far.
- kcplate 4y ago> The "rules" are whatever he makes up on the spot. He paid for that privilege.
- ceejayoz 4y agoSure, and he has that privilege. He's making rules he promised not to, and we don't have to pay for the privilege to criticize that hypocrisy.
- andrewinardeer 4y agoIt is disingenuous to argue that "free speech" includes all speech. People making bomb or mass shooting threats get arrested all the time. You shouldn't have people fear for their lives.
- ceejayoz 4y ago> It is disingenuous to argue that "free speech" includes all speech. Elon Musk himself argued this exact specific thing is included. Nov 6, 2022, https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1589414958508691456 https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1589414958508691456: "My commitment to free speech extends even to not banning the account following my plane, even though that is a direct personal safety risk"
- kevinmchugh 4y agoI missed it if the jet tracking accounts made threats
- lovich 4y agoWhat does the phrase “free speech absolutist” mean to you? He’s described himself as one, and I can’t see a way to square the idea that he says he is a free speech absolutist with the excuse that free speech is hard to regulate in the real world. He’s either a moron or was incapable of understanding even first level consequences of his actions or he’s an actual moron
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- egberts1 4y ago
- Taniwha 4y agoNo they weren't they were tweeting the new location of the @elronjet account - all this has been through the courts a bunch of times now: posting a link is not the same as posting the content it points to
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- darawk 4y ago> Those journalists weren't reporting specific locations of his jet...they were reporting on a legit news story about it. Do you have evidence of that? He claims they were reporting the location.
- ncallaway 4y agoIf they reported the specific locations of the jet, could you… point to where they reported on that?
- hackerlight 4y agoAaron Rupar says he linked to the Facebook page which displays the location, which he assumes is what got him banned.
- mikeryan 4y agoThis is ridiculous. 1. The jet’s location is publicly available by law. 2. No one knows who’s in “Elons jet”. If Elon wants to travel private without anyone knowing he is he can simply charter a jet. This is what most celebrities do.
- darawk 4y agoI'm not defending his choice to ban it. The person I was responding to made the claim that the journalists were banned without even having posted the banned information. If that's true, that's bad in a different way than the choice to ban the information in the first place. My position is that I don't like his decision to ban this information, but I understand it. If, however, he is using this as an excuse to capriciously ban his enemies, that is something I don't like a lot more.
- memish 4y ago
- dylan604 4y ago
- memish 4y agoHe's handing it over to the people. Vox Populi Vox Dei. They will be unbanned shortly, as they should. https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1603609466301059073 https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1603609466301059073 > Telsa stock tanking all because he can't STFU and acts like a spoiled 12 year old. Uh, the whole stock market is down. Amazon is down almost as much as Tesla. 48% vs 50%.
- rrmm 4y agoMusk actually ran a poll already, but the people got the wrong answer (unban now). So he's running another poll. https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1603600001057185792 https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1603600001057185792
- dmix 4y agothe excuse: https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1603609278664712192 https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1603609278664712192 > Sorry, too many options. Will redo poll. The previous poll was bad because 3x of them were basically "No" and 1x was "Yes" New poll is heavily leaning yes regardless
- rrmm 4y agoThe new poll also has a 24 hour timer, so 'now' is effectively a 1 day ban. I kind of suspect the length of time has other motivations (but that's really just me being cynical).
- dmix 4y agoNo that's a fair criticism since it says "Now" This is 2022 Twitter-brained audience, now doesn't mean 24hrs these days.
- hackerlight 4y agoIn his new poll the majority are saying to unban the accounts now: https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1603609466301059073 https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1603609466301059073
- ilyt 4y agoIt almost look like the clown ran into the ops room and yelled. "Ban everyone mentioning @elonjet, EVERYONE" and someone just ran SQL query with LIKE %@elonjet% AND user != musky_boy ...
- commandlinefan 4y ago> The "rules" are whatever he makes up on the spot But two years ago, the rules were whatever Vijaya Gadde made up on the spot. Why is this suddenly a cause for outrage? Twitter has always been like this.
- cwkoss 4y agoBoth are bad. The idea that one person doing wrong makes it right when someone ideologically opposed does the same thing is bad logic, and I've been seeing it way too often recently. I worry the American education system is failing us.