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> go on fancier vacations, upgrade your Honda to a Porsche, hire landscaper/housekeeper/dog walker, buy a bigger house, etc. I work at a FAANG and I will never
by 4qz 4y ago
> go on fancier vacations, upgrade your Honda to a Porsche, hire landscaper/housekeeper/dog walker, buy a bigger house, etc.
I work at a FAANG and I will never afford a home. Who is this list for? My senior engineer coworkers live in condos unless they move 2 hours away or have a very high earning spouse
- eddsh1994 4y agoPeople who work for good companies in lower cost of living environments? I live in Palo Alto and appreciate I’ll never buy here but my colleagues on similar salaries have huge houses with boats and nice cars in other parts of the US. This is the $150/200 mark btw, not FAANG.
- tnel77 4y ago“But I can’t live in the midwest” -Them, probably
- eddsh1994 4y agoPeople can't complain about high salaries not working for you in high COL places. In Atherton a 0.8 acre lot (no house) is on the market for $5.2m lol. If you stop looking for the prestige and high numbers of FAANG you can have a far better salary:COL and get that nice house/cool car.
- highwaylights 4y ago> This is the $150/200 mark btw, not FAANG. This is still wild to me. I’m well into my career (coming close to 25 years): — I do well when looking for work in that I interview well and get most gigs I go for. - I trade stability for higher rates working shorter gigs without any of the usual safety net / benefits. - Comp is top end of the range offered in a relatively well off part of the world. And yet with all that said, $200k is still an utter pipe dream. I’m not saying I’m necessarily jealous (I’m sure there’s the downsides I don’t see) but man-oh-man that’s a lot of money. I’m almost reluctant to ask but what is FAANG comp typically?
- thatfunkymunki 4y agohttps://levels.fyi https://levels.fyi
- tomduncalf 4y agoThe thing to note is that the base salary isn’t often too far off from non-FAANG jobs, but the stock grant which usually “vests” over 4 years is what makes the compensation so much higher. The amount of stock is locked in based on how many shares the dollar amount you’re offered would buy when you start, so if the share price goes up over time then that’s going to be worth more when it vests (which I guess mostly happened in the last decade), but if it drops from when you started it’s worth less (as happened in the last year, so if you started this time last year and the company stock is down 50%, that compensation is worth a lot less now). I definitely think it’s good to be aware of what compensation at these places looks like, I wasn’t really aware of how significant the stock thing is until recently (but I had a fun career up to now so not to worry!). I guess one of the downsides is that these are often huge companies there’s a reasonable chance you’ll end up maintaining some boring internal system or whatever, so it depends what motivates you.
- highwaylights 4y agoHonestly, as I'm non-US, I think I'm ruled out of those compensation packages (I don't think many offer remote work). It's disappointing, but it's the reality for a lot of people I'm sure.
- tomduncalf 4y agoNot sure where you’re based but some of the mid-sized companies definitely do hire outside of the US and offer equity (typically places where they have a company presence so they can employ you, and I guess they’ll probably try to have people in sensible time zones) and are remote-first. For example, I’m based in London and my last job was with MongoDB and that was fully remote in EMEA.
- 4y ago
- badpun 4y agoHow is the traffic and commute time in such cities? I ask as an European who can't fanthom an idea of a large city where most people live in detached houses (and not in apartments or even townhouses) - the city must take up enormous space. Do people commute 30 miles each way to work?
- bagels 4y agoWhich cities? Silicon Valley? Or people remote working in the Midwest? If you are making Faang money you can choose a shorter commute. 30 miles is 1-2 hours in silicon valley. My limit is 10 miles/40 mins
- badpun 4y agoAmerican cities in general. If in an average US city, most people live in a detached house, aren't they just a endless sprawl with nightmarish commute times?
- BirAdam 4y agoYes. American cities are endless sprawl. Yes. American cities have nightmarish commute times. During morning and evening rush, it can take 3 hours to cross the city I live in. The city I grew up in was better, but the same task could still take 30 minutes there, and it was a much smaller city.
- gnz11 4y agoYes
- bluedino 4y agoAccording to ACS 2010-14 data, the average commuter in the Chicago metropolitan region has a one-way commute of 30 minutes. This figure is slightly above the national average of 26 minutes, but on par with many other large U.S. regions FWIW a random survey on the internet lists Austin TX, Miami FL, and San Diego CA as the 'most stressful commutes'
- SturgeonsLaw 4y ago99.99% of the world's population don't live in San Francisco, so it's probably geared towards them
- trentgreene 4y agoI don’t think 99.9% of people have the choice between a Honda or a Porsche (… or either of the two), so this list is probably aimed at a much more narrow group.
- nickd2001 4y agoI reckon we could just about run to a Honda if we tried, but the Citroen works fine. So not really feeling the need for it ;)
- pbhjpbhj 4y agoMaths: It almost seems like it should be a higher percentage, but 900k/8Billion gives 99.9875% exactly.
- caskstrength 4y ago> 99.99% of the world's population don't live in San Francisco, so it's probably geared towards them Is the situation any better in other big IT-cities in the States (Seattle, NYC) or in Europe (London, Amsterdam, Zurich, Munich)? Some of these are slightly better than SF and some are even worse IMO.
- parkingrift 4y agoIt’s not as dire in NYC unless you’re exclusively considering Manhattan. And even in Manhattan it’s relatively “affordable” if you’re willing to live in the 160s+. Significantly less than people think, at least.
- caskstrength 4y agoOP wrote about owning a "home" as opposed to his coworkers who live in "condos" which makes me think he meant single-family house. Are you saying that SFH in Manhattan is relatively affordable for average FAANG developer?
- comte7092 4y agoSounds like FAANG is a trash deal then, tbh. You could afford a home in most other US cities even with a pay cut from the typical FAANG salary.
- dasil003 4y agoOr just rent for a couple years and save up enough to buy a house elsewhere in cash.
- dougmwne 4y agoFor real. My 24 year old cousin just bought his first home and he works a low paid blue collar job. The trick is to be in an affordable location.
- illirik 4y agoExactly! People read "affordable location" and think it means somewhere boring and depressing, like Youngstown or Peoria. There are numerous, wonderful US cities where you can buy a respectable place for under $200,000 - they're just not on the coasts or in the sun belt. Move to West Rogers Park in Chicago and walk to the best Indian food you've ever had, or Brewer's Hill in Milwaukee and walk to a vegan brewery where all beers are $5. If you like the small-town feel, try Holland, MI or Stevens Point, WI. If the winters get you down, you can fly to Maui in January from O'Hare for $400 round-trip, or you could just wait 20 years for CO2 to do its thing.
- Karrot_Kream 4y agoIMO this only changed in the US over the last 5-6 years and accelerated because of COVID and remote tech work. The stigma persists from before when the US had only a handful of fun, young, urban areas to live in. When I entered the workforce there were only a few choices. Now I could see myself living in a whole bunch of places were I starting out my career.
- lodovic 4y agoFun fact: where I live, many so-called blue collar jobs such as plumbing earn a higher wage than software engineering, due to extreme shortages.
- Rebelgecko 4y agoI bought my condo when I was making less money than FAANG interns do. As long as you avoid the Bay Area it doesn't really take "Senior SWE" money (even in places that are high COL relative to the non-Silicon Valley parts of the country)
- xboxnolifes 4y ago*in the middle of SF/NYC/etc. Anywhere else, a FAANG salary will get you home ownership in 1-2 years.
- DiggyJohnson 4y agoCan you explain your expectations around home ownership? I am rarely this flummoxed at a comment..
- SamuelAdams 4y agoThey mean they will never own a home in two of the wealthiest cities in the USA - San Francisco or New York. There’s a few other really expensive cities as well. It’s really easy for most properties to list for 1 MM min, even a 3 bed 1 bath house on a quarter acre lot. The solution is easy, don’t live in an expensive city. Or inherit property from relatives who lived there 50 years ago. Or have a rich spouse.
- gorbachev 4y agoThe most common way I've seen it done in New York suburbs is to buy a multi-family home and split it between family. Houses with three generations of family living in them are quite common.
- dougmwne 4y agoThis sounds like a you problem. Remote tech roles are falling off trees. Wherever you are that FAANG money can’t buy you a house, you definitely don’t need to be there. You are choosing to be in some incredibly unaffordable area. Lucky, if you are in a place like San Francisco, I expect with the exodus of on-site jobs and people, that the housing will be rapidly getting more affordable.
- tnel77 4y agoWhy do you live there then? So many great cities you can live in where you can actually afford a house.
- thewebcount 4y agoWhy do you think that? I know many people working at a FAANG both in SF and LA, and most of them own some sort of home. (Some are condos or townhomes because that’s the lifestyle they prefer - but many are single family homes.) They’re in decent places, too, not 100 miles away or “the bad part of town”. It took a few years of savings, and some of them are dual income, which helps, but between stock that’s been on a rocket ship for the last 20 years and a decently high salary, they do just fine. If you’re not vested yet, you might not have hit the point where things start to take off. It can be pretty dramatic what those RSUs add up to if you aren’t constantly watching their value.
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- dusted 4y agolol, I bought the current house we're living in for under $100k cash, maybe move somewhere reasonable instead of insisting on living in the most expensive place possible?
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- joshuamorton 4y agoI'm confused by this, you can totally find single family homes in SF for 1.5-2M, which while pricey should be affordable after a few years on a FAANG salary if you aren't already spending a lot on kids. They're just in Sunset or Diamond Heights or Portola or Glen Park, not Noe or Mission. And even in those areas, you can find two-unit condos in that range.
- newshorts 4y agoA cautionary tale for you: I was in a similar situation a few years ago, working at FAANG and living in SCV. Wanted a house more than anything. Eventually, got relocated to a lower COL area and finally accomplished my dream of owning a home. Inspector didn’t catch a few things, also bought at the peak of housing mania and now we are both underwater and have sunk a large chunk of our savings into making the house safe and livable for our kids. If we would have stayed in SCV and rented we’d be in a better financial position. However, overall we are happy with our choices given we don’t have to stress about things like keeping a 3yo quiet for the neighbors who live below us. Not saying a house won’t make you happy, just saying houses are not a complete measure of financial success.