58 ms·

Why are glasses so expensive? The industry prefers to keep that blurry (2019)

375 points by joelkesler 4y ago

quantified 4y ago
It's wonderful for them. Everyone who has eyesight really wants to see clearly. After air, food, water, eyesight is kinda crucial. Maybe we should tithe them in thanks for not making it way more expensive.
- nullish_signal 4y ago
  Should we tithe Industrial Zones for not dumping more chem waste? Tip our wait staff for not spitting in our food?
  - yarg 4y ago
    Clearly not (and you're replying to a sarcastic comment).
    - stjohnswarts 4y ago
      It was practically dripping wasn't it? :)
      - yarg 4y ago
        Yeah, but HN isn't exactly the least autistic forum on the internet.
  - mhuffman 4y ago
    >Tip our wait staff for not spitting in our food? I know people that worked in the industry and mention up-front they are good tippers to the servers ... just in case!
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
dboreham 4y ago
Get your eyes tested and buy glasses at Costco. Also if your prescription is a simple one, Costco sells off the shelf reading glasses for around $20 for three pairs.
mitchbob 4y ago
Archived: https://archive.ph/jhgdR https://archive.ph/jhgdR
rahimnathwani 4y ago
"Warby Parker recognized this as a business opportunity. I’m surprised others haven’t jumped in as well with reasonably priced eyewear." This author is uninformed. Others have jumped in. And Warby Parker wasn't even the first. 15 years ago I would buy my single-vision prescription glasses from optical4less.com. The cost was $58 for 2 pairs, including worldwide shipping. Today I buy my glasses from Zenni. Last month, I paid $176.75 total for two pairs of glasses, each with single-vision photochromic lenses (and one pair with additional blue light blocking).
- MichaelZuo 4y ago
  I've heard a lot of the cheaper places cutback on the fancy multi-layer coatings, so that the quality of lens is not equivalent. I know a lot of them advertise identical quality but did you ever confirm that to be the case?
  - rahimnathwani 4y ago
    I've heard ... Heard from whom? I know a lot of them advertise identical quality but did you ever confirm that to be the case? You can choose what types of lenses you want. Zenni, for example, offers multiple lens options, some of which are from specific brands. https://www.zennioptical.com/glasses-lenses https://www.zennioptical.com/glasses-lenses When you buy glasses from a bricks and mortar optician, you're getting whatever bog-standard lenses they sell, unless they specifically mention they're high index, or have some specific feature/coating, or are from some specific manufacturer. Just like when you buy glasses online. There are definitely differences in lens quality, but the available range is just as wide in retail stores as it is online.
    - MichaelZuo 4y ago
      The high end luxury brands such as Silhouette offer very advanced lens coatings and materials that aren't found in any of the discount stores online or brick-and-mortar, so there's definitely a difference there. It's only their full priced partner shops that carry them. They also claim to use custom technology that allows their 10+ layers of coatings to stick together much better and not flake off. The mid range to entry luxury brands, many owned by Luxottica, use broadly available lenses and coatings, or so the discount online stores claim. I've never been to a discount brick-and-mortar store selling the full range of Luxottica products, usually only a few styles here and there. So I can't comment there. What I'm asking is if the claims of discount stores, like that they have access to the same lenses as full priced Luxottica stores, are actually true. And whether they are honest with their shipped product. e.g. How would anyone know if they in fact got a X layer coated lens (where X could be from 3 to 8) from a discount shop? It seems trivial to ship a X-1 layer coated lens instead, with a very low possibility of getting caught.
mindslight 4y ago
Uh, they aren't. You go to Zenni Optical and it's a solved problem. You basically choose what you want to pay. Their $7 glasses work great. My every days were $25, until I decided to try out their UV blocking lenses, which bumped them to $50. My prescription sunglasses and prescription safety goggles were each $80. If you've got a stronger prescription or need more than single vision lenses you'll pay a bit more. But nothing compared to the many hundreds by the time you walk out of an optician. Reasonable pricing completely changes the dynamic from bundling every what-if into a single pair, to one of why-not try something new - the way markets are supposed to work. Maybe next time I'll even try auto-darkening lenses, despite having had a lackluster experience with them decades ago. Ctrl-F Zenni in the article show no results though. I know there are even some competitors by now, but the ones I've seen are still trying to gouge a bit.
- KatieLN 4y ago
  Try Payneglasses.com. They're cheaper than zenni. Also, they're way easier to deal with if you need to exchange/return.
turtlebits 4y ago
Zenni glasses are 7$ and perfectly fine (I ordered a test set, which I now use as a spare) My current set from them is a high index lens and anti glare, which were only $30 shipped. They’re going on 3 years now and still look new.
bityard 4y ago
Same reason medical care is so expensive in the US: Insurance and the art of the upsell. The provider gets to charge high prices because the bulk of the cost is covered by insurance and thus "hidden" from consumers. The insurance company gets a non-trivial cut of the pie, which pads the bill further. And in my experience, when you go in with something wrong with you, most doctors will recommend (or perform without asking) tests that aren't covered by insurance and you don't find that out until the bill arrives in the mail. I have a pretty standard vision insurance plan and need glasses roughly every two years. (Two pairs: one for indoors, and sunglasses for outdoors and driving.) I go into an optometrist office and get my vision checked. $10 copay or whatever for the exam. Then the pain starts. The frame selection is terrible and it turns out that the only decent-looking frames and lenses cost 3-4x what insurance will cover. And insurance doesn't cover more-or-less "required" add-ons to lenses like anti-glare coatings. And the person selling you the glasses is _very_ good at convincing you that you need all the extras. I did the math one time and I paid $200 per year for vision insurance to save $190 (including the cost of the exam) on one pair of glasses. The last time I bought glasses, I took my (recent) prescription to an online eyelasses e-tailer website and purchased a pair that included all the fancy extras for $60 out the door. I don't _love_ them, but I can certainly live with them for the price.
- olliej 4y ago
  I would suggest checking out other optometrists, most have a much better insurance wall than they had a couple of decades ago. Or go online (to order, not suggesting an eye exam over webcam :D ). That said, I'm currently getting cataracts removed and IOL implants and insurance is like "correcting your astigmatism isn't needed so we won't cover the IOL that does that, just your distance vision". If correcting my vision isn't necessary then why cover any IOL at all??? :-/
  - epmaybe 4y ago
    This gets into the weeds a little but the reason boils down to money and tradition, and “what is needed” is a shifting goalpost for society. Just thirty years ago you may have never even gotten an IOL due to tradition or cost. After adoption in the developed world there was a huge push to prevent lower income countries from accessing the technology because they “didn’t need” that technology and could benefit from lower cost interventions such as glasses. So as companies started to innovate and lower cost, single vision non toric IOLs became cheap enough for insurance to cover. Then to make some money on premium lenses companies (and ophthalmologists, sadly) really started to push torics and multifocal lenses. The fact of the matter is that few patients benefit all that much from toric lenses that fix astigmatism. Most people have less than 1 diopter of astigmatic error, which they don’t even manufacture a toric lens for at any usable tolerance (the FDA allows a +/-0.50D tolerance to all lenses including torics), and surgical modifications can nullify that to some extent. Veterans get it free at most VA hospitals though, so they probably get more implanted than the average population. In the next fifteen years though I bet Medicare will begin to cover toric lenses, and the rest of the insurance industry will follow. The surgery doesn’t change much between toric and non toric. The Multifocal IOLs will remain “premium” for a while to come I expect.
yarg 4y ago
Boycott Luxottica. Anyway, reminds me of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpKWHSsBpnE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpKWHSsBpnE; glasses with user adjustable lenses. Removes the need to customise the product to the individual, and the need to see an optometrist - it reduces the cost of the product and makes 'prescription' glasses a viable option even in nations without adequate medical services.
- Saigonauticon 4y ago
  Interestingly, a pair of glasses here in Vietnam -- including eye exam, fancy lenses (high refractive index, anti-glare etc.), and frame -- usually runs in the 20-40$ range. As with most things here, you can find cheaper if you need (e.g. secondhand). I'm not certain, but it sure feels like the inflated cost in North America makes it seem like eyeglasses are less affordable here than they actually are, at least in the cities. The kicker is when I fly to North America and I see the same frames being sold there! Edit: Eyeglasses are one of the things I recommend colleagues buy here while visiting. It's conceivable some (from nearby countries) save more than the cost of their trip!
  - int_19h 4y ago
    You can get eyeglasses for $40 in US, from online stores like Zenni.
- bagels 4y ago
  I tried Warby Parker. The lenses delaminated in a few weeks both times (my experiment confirmed that the first one was not a fluke). I'd love to eliminate the cost and hassle of visiting an optometrist when the current prescription is working just fine.
- dzhiurgis 4y ago
  Boycott zenni as they ignore Taiwan
  - bluGill 4y ago
    Got a better suggestion?
olliej 4y ago
I thought it was fairly well established that optometrists make most of their income from the sale of the frames as they have little to no control over how much they get for the examination, and the lens price determined by the lens manufacturer. The frames are the only thing that the optometrists get any significant margin on. The moment you aren't buying the frame from the optometrist office the price craters, and has been that way for at least a couple of decades at this point.
- mixmastamyk 4y ago
  Don't forget the lens and underbody coatings.
  - olliej 4y ago
    I literally stated that they don’t have significant control over the lens prices. Every optometrist is getting their lens from a relatively minor set of manufacturers, and the manufacturers price to maximize their revenue, not the optometrist. Now I’m sure that they make a bit more money in an absolute sense from coatings, but nothing like the full $8 or whatever it costs these days. The biggest markup items they have are the frames, as there are many different manufacturers the frame manufacturers do have to offer margins to the places that sell them.
    - mixmastamyk 4y ago
      Sorry coatings are much more expensive, lotsa markup, bucko.
stjohnswarts 4y ago
don't buy your glasses from your optometrist, buy it from online sources. Most states require them to provide you with your prescription after an eye examination. I get mine for roughly 1/4-1/3 (I could probably get them cheaper if I wasn't sticking with a vendor that has been great for me) the price online and they're fine.
dang 4y ago
Discussed at the time: Why are glasses so expensive? The eyewear industry prefers to keep that blurry - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18980191 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18980191 - Jan 2019 (588 comments) Related: Ask HN: Recommend sunglasses made in the west and independent of Luxotica - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28029206 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28029206 - Aug 2021 (35 comments) Making My Own Glasses - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21156637 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21156637 - Oct 2019 (187 comments) How badly are we being ripped off on eyewear? Former industry execs tell all - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19312499 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19312499 - March 2019 (301 comments) The spectacular power of Big Lens - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17061380 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17061380 - May 2018 (43 comments) The One Product You Should Buy Online: Eyeglasses - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16040924 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16040924 - Dec 2017 (97 comments) Vision Insurance Is Making Glasses More Expensive - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15736573 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15736573 - Nov 2017 (86 comments) A Closer Look at the $13B Premium Eyewear Market - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15429826 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15429826 - Oct 2017 (135 comments) One Dollar Glasses – Help for 150M people - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13091936 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13091936 - Dec 2016 (114 comments) Why are glasses so expensive? (2012) - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9183464 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9183464 - March 2015 (113 comments) Sticker shock: Why are glasses so expensive? [video] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6718224 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6718224 - Nov 2013 (48 comments)
petilon 4y ago
Glasses are expensive because there is no competition. One company - Luxottica - owns pretty much everything. You go to LensCrafters and prices seem super expensive, so you go to Pearle Vision and that's expensive too, so you go to Target Optical and prices are still high and then you think maybe glasses are expensive, since you went to multiple stores and they all have similar prices. What you don't realize is that all those retail brands are owned by the same company - Luxottica [1]. They operate under several names, so there is an appearance of competition but there isn't. But wait, it isn't just stores, they also own eyewear brands such as Ray-Ban, Chanel, Coach, Oakley, Prada, Tiffany, and so on. Yes, all of those brands are owned by Luxottica [2]. Wait, not done yet. They also own insurance. Luxottica owns the vision insurance company EyeMed. [3] Still not done. Luxottica has merged with Essilor and now own multiple lens brands [4]. See 60 Minutes story on Luxottica if you're not outraged yet [5]. Where are the anti-trust enforcers in this country and other countries, and why are they not doing anything? [1] https://www.luxottica.com/en/retail-brands https://www.luxottica.com/en/retail-brands [2] https://www.luxottica.com/en/eyewear-brands https://www.luxottica.com/en/eyewear-brands [3] https://eyemed.com/en-us/about-us https://eyemed.com/en-us/about-us [4] https://www.essilorluxottica.com/brands https://www.essilorluxottica.com/brands [5] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDdq2rIqAlM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDdq2rIqAlM
- nnoitra 4y ago
  This comment slowly escalated to the point where I thought the next line would be: "They also own your eyes".
- Eddy_Viscosity2 4y ago
  It's almost as if monopolies are bad. I also thought they were illegal. Why hasn't Luxottica been broken up by antitrust laws?
- planetsprite 4y ago
  Why can't a new company simply undercut the competition? I don't imagine the barriers to entry are too high for manufacturing glasses, are they?
ekianjo 4y ago
In Japan you can get glasses for dirty cheap, including the eye check and case that goes with it. That's what happens when you liberate the market. NOTE: it's not reimbursed but nobody cares because it's cheap.
- bschwindHN 4y ago
  Yep - got my current pair of glasses from Zoff for around $30 all said and done.
- rippercushions 4y ago
  Japanese brands are slowly starting to make inroads overseas too. Owndays (cheap) and 999.9 (expensive but great service and very high quality) are now available in Australia and many Asian countries, Zoff has made its way to Singapore and Hong Kong.
warbler73 4y ago
After decades with private practices, since I switched to WalMart my prescriptions are more accurate and glasses cost almost nothing.
- ourmandave 4y ago
  Are Walmart glasses cheaper? My last pair was about the going rate, although it's been 4 years ago. I still use Walmart for exams but buy all my glasses from Zenni.com. They're so cheap, glasses have gone from sacred to disposable.
  - mrguyorama 4y ago
    When I used them regularly (as a kid) in the 2000s, they were just as expensive and gave me untold problems involving insurance and repairs. Specifically, they would turn over frame styling so often that if you broke your frame in just a few months, they would be unable to repair or replace them. I'm not convinced this isn't an issue that most places have.
flashgordon 4y ago
Dumb question. Frames can be 3d printed right? Is it possible to so the same with lenses? Sounds like a "neighborhood/artisan" lens and glass maker could so this easily for a reasonable size neighborhood lucratively?
- theklr 4y ago
  Guessing it’s still a scalable issue for it to take off. King Children is still the only company I know that’s in this space, but they haven’t taken off like I’ve hoped for them to expand
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
dis-sys 4y ago
I used to pay $800-1,000 a pair, then I heard that the exact same glasses from the exact same factory just without that fancy logo costs you about $100 a pair. Bought a few of them, never looked back. People need to accept that you get ripped off all the time, it just a normal part of everyday life. when you think a $5 walmart tshirt is cheap, well, the factory gets probably 50c.
- int_19h 4y ago
  Perhaps life would be better if we stopped treating 10x markup as "normal part of everyday life"?
artificialLimbs 4y ago
I've been paying $350-400 for my high strength prescription glasses for most of my life. Last time around I heard you could order from England and get them for a fraction. Found selectspecs.com and got my -10's for ~100 shipped to my door. Not affiliated at all, just glad I don't have to pay the gouge in the US anymore.
- rahimnathwani 4y ago
  In the UK, there are several popular online glasses retailers: goggles4u speckyfoureyes GlassesDirect Currently, Glasses Direct is offering two pairs of single-vision prescription glasses for 14GBP (16USD) including shipping anywhere in the UK: https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/deals/cheap-glasses-discounts/ https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/deals/cheap-glasses-discou... Varifocals are also cheap (49GBP, or 57USD, for one pair).
- jtchang 4y ago
  That's a great deal. Were they 1.74 index?
  - artificialLimbs 4y ago
    Single Vision UltraX Super Thin 1.74, Clear UV Coating, AR, Scratch Resistance
nostromo 4y ago
Because of insurance, which distorts markets. Lots of people get benefits that pay for their glasses, so they're not incentivized to be economical.
ck2 4y ago
https://google.com/search?q=reddit+"Zenni"+"Payne"+"Eyebuydirect"+"Goggles4u" https://google.com/search?q=reddit+"Zenni"+"Payne"+"Eyebuydi...
davidmurdoch 4y ago
Buy from Zenni Optical. They are inexpensive and customer service is pretty great. My daughter broke an arm of one of her frames while playing at school. I emailed Zenni asking for tips on how to repair it. They sent me replacement frames for free.
EMM_386 4y ago
I own exactly one pair of "expensive" glasses that I got from a retail chain and use as my primary pair. I will admit, they are of much higher quality than the glasses that I order online as a back-up. But outside of that pair, I get a print out of my prescription and go to places like www.eyebuydirect.com to get any other pairs. The quality isn't there but we are talking about hundreds of dollars cheaper. And if anything was to happen to my main pair, I can quickly grab the $80 and I doubt anyone would even notice. Plus, it makes wearing different styles from time to time a much more attractive offer.
- walterbell 4y ago
  What have you observed as a quality difference in the EBD pair? Frame construction? Any difference in optical clarity or face fit?
  - EMM_386 4y ago
    Frame construction is generally much poorer quality. I've had them break from just taking them off my face too fast. Face fit is tricky, they allow you to select things like your "size" but this is broken down into "small/medium/large" when in reality it needs to take into account things like temple (arm) length, bridge width, etc. My main pair is perfect because I spent the big bucks on them and had a professional constantly tweaking them, putting them back on my face, tweaking them some more. And that comes with the ability to return to the store and have them do it again for free if I feel like I need to. Online you won't get any of that, so the fit isn't perfect. Optical clarity, no complaints. The lenses are good. But we're talking $500+ vs. $80.
eyelidlessness 4y ago
I’ll add another pro-Zenni comment. Not just because the glasses themselves are inexpensive (they are though, when I broke my favorite frames it cost $36 to get two replacements), but because it’s a godsend to get glasses you need if your prescription has “expired”. I’m sure there’s good reason for regulating routine vision checkups, but refusing to sell glasses to anyone who can’t get to the appointment isn’t serving anyone.
- Markoff 4y ago
  Yeah, I have never understood whole "prescription" thing in US, here in many (all?) European countries, you just go to eyeglasses shop, they measure your eyes and you get what you want, no prescriptions, nothing. Measuring is usually free if you buy frames from them, if not it cost like 20USD, though you could still go to ophthalmologist to have them measured professionally and it would be free, but you would need to get appointment and there is quite long waiting time and still not sure if they would provide you results for free. By US logic it's better if people don't have any glasses than bad glasses, strange logic to me.
TheWoodsy 4y ago
Sunglass frames are in every petrol station. Would it be possible to 3d-print a resin with known index of refraction, then go to town on the buffing wheel for an hour? Would love to hear more about DIY corrective lenses.
- Johnny555 4y ago
  then go to town on the buffing wheel for an hour You can get glasses from Zenni for under $10 (their website says they start at $6.95), you'd have a hard time beating their price with DIY, gas station sun glasses cost more than that around here. Of course, at that price you're not getting the lightest lenses, or coatings, but you're probably not getting that with DIY either.
Keyframe 4y ago
Ah, eyewear! I see Luxottica is mentioned. Kind of similar story behind optical glass (lenses, namely) and Schott (Zeiss) behind all of it.
bpanon 4y ago
Because large corporations work together to ensure their mutual longevity by monopolizing the market and ensuring cheaper alternatives never make it to the market. Nothing new under the sun. If there was a tire that never wore our, would it be manufactured? If there was a simple, cheap cancer treatment, would all associated businesses that profit from the treatment of cancer shut down? If internet could be offered at 10x for the speed, for 1/10th the cost, would it be? Only if the incentives line up for the dominant player(s).
newman314 4y ago
I started looking at getting new glasses recently and due to my extremely poor vision, need all these extra addons for lenses (high-index, progressive etc.) and they get EXPENSIVE very quickly.
whydat_whodat 4y ago
I'm a customer of Zenni Optical. They have glasses from $10 - $100+. I usually get the same set, for $100-- frameless. And that price includes blue-blocks (to reduce blue light from screens). They last long and are easily replaceable. [1] https://www.zennioptical.com/ https://www.zennioptical.com/
deleted 4y ago
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cozos 4y ago
I buy glasses (in the US) from this place called Jins. They are cheaper out-of-pocket than glasses being sold by my optometrist, even after insurance (I pay for Jins out of pocket). Not sure why and my optometrist can't explain how his glasses are betters either. I assume its some kind of price gouging.
scottmcdot 4y ago
FACE À FACE are high-quality glasses and I'm happy to pay the premium. They are not owned by Luxottica.
bradwood 4y ago
I now have to use reading glasses. First few prescriptions were eye-wateringly expensive. Now I just order a 4-pack off Amazon for about a tenner - never been happier. I have a pair at home, at work, in the car, in my bag and if they break I just toss 'em away without a second thought. I'm sure it must be a lot more tricky for those with unique prescriptions but for stock readers this is definitely the way to go.
lrvick 4y ago
I have purchased < $20 glasses from zennioptical without a perscription online many times that were every bit as good as $500 ones I bought at lenscrafters, with near identical styles. I started buying in bulk and worrying less about losing or babying them.
KoftaBob 4y ago
https://zennioptical.com https://zennioptical.com
goguy 4y ago
Just like anything you can shop around and get a good deal. In the UK I use glasses direct, you can pick up a pair with a prescription for £50. They regularly have discount codes so most of the time that would be £35/40. Sure they aren't designer but they look ok for the price if you don't want to spend a lot, if you use them just got driving you can probably get an even cheaper pair that don't look as good.
- williamvds 4y ago
  I've worn glasses since I was a kid, when you're entitled to a free frame from the cheaper range at Boots (a local retailer) (also, thanks, NHS). I remember struggling to find a design that I liked decent around that price range. As soon as you went out into the price ranges that weren't covered, you got a lot more nicer looking ones. At the time I was buying new frames and lenses every few years so I went with the cheap ones. My current pair were about £30 from Aliexpress, a gorgeous rimless set with anti-glare lenses included. Needless to say I won't be buying from local retailers anymore. I'm sure here in the UK we're also affected by the Luxottica monopoly in the US, especially when it comes to designer brands.
citizenpaul 4y ago
Reminds me of the time I found out that golf balls and eink screens are also a "secret monopoly" kept by highly litigatious patents.
- braunboffel 4y ago
  > eink screens are also a "secret monopoly" kept by highly litigatious patents. Please share the evidence for this.
  - citizenpaul 4y ago
    Search engines don't seem to work anymore to find controversial information so I could not dig up the info again. It was from several years back it might be starting to change now. The golf balls are more interesting. Walmart/sams club actually had to give up on their own brand of golf balls due to the nonstop litigation from top flight, making it unprofitable to produce them.
    - braunboffel 4y ago
      > Search engines don't seem to work anymore to find controversial information so I could not dig up the info again. It was from several years back it might be starting to change now. Hmmm.... not really a satisfying answer for me. I wouldn't make such claims unless I was confident about it. > The golf balls are more interesting I'm not interested in the golf balls part.
piaste 4y ago
For many people, there is an option that side-steps the racket entirely, massively improves their QoL, and can even save money in the long term - laser eye surgery. (disclaimer: prices are likely to be different in other countries) Prices and quality of LES seems to have dropped significantly even as glasses have become more expensive. I had some annoying myopy / astigmastism combo so I used to pay up to 200-300€ for glasses, and prescription sunglasses were also expensive. Femto-LASIK surgery cost me a whopping 1500€ a couple of years ago, whereas an older acquaintance told me that he had paid 10x as much in the mid-aughts. A couple of decades of glasses would not have cost me much less, and the difference it makes in quality of life cannot be overstated. Easily in the running for the best money I ever spent. Of course, not everybody can get lasered - children and teenagers, first and foremost - but a lot more people do than realize it.
- bluGill 4y ago
  That doesn't last as long as you think before you will need readers anyway. I'm not saying it is a bad option, just that it isn't as great as it sounds when you are young.
atemerev 4y ago
Glasses are expensive because they are not just a medical device, but also a fashion accessory, and this market is a fashion market. I have to try about 20-30 frames or so, until I find something that looks OK on me. But! It is still possible to buy cheap enough frames that look fine. Why the _lenses_ are so expensive, that’s a different question. I routinely pay $700 or so for the lenses. Many professional multi-component _camera_ lenses cost much less than that. And it has nothing to do with Luxottica.
dustfinger 4y ago
Ha! One might ask the same about braces.
gnarula 4y ago
There's plenty of margin in the industry - as an anecdote, I've paid around £40 for a pair in the UK through an online retailer (Glasses Direct), around ~₹1500-2000 in India through an online retailer (Lenskart) and ~₹800 by visiting a local store in a Tier 2 city in India
regular 4y ago
Well, don't try GlassesUSA. They are a scam operation operating under various names, working hard to test your resolve to prosecute them.
bluecalm 4y ago
Great suggestions for cheaper alternatives in this thread! Does anyone knows if it's possible to get cycling sunglasses of similar quality as Oakley/100%? By cycling sunglasses I mean: -shape (those need to be big and go over forehead so you see clearly from hunched position) -lenses (tint, increased color contrast, preferably not polarized), anti fog -safe in case of a crash I tried shopping around but couldn't find anything that fits as well as 165$ pair of Speedcrafts (the lenses are amazing as well). The glasses are just 4 pieces of plastic (frame, lenses, nose bridge, nose pad) but somehow it's not easy to find a decent cheaper alternative.
- KatieLN 4y ago
  try payneglasses.com. I got some sports sunglasses from there. They're wraparound and have polarized lenses. They were around $25.
Markoff 4y ago
Are they? I ordered for wife glasses including frames from Zenni and it cost me 7 USD for cheap ones, 20 USD for more "expensive" ones (frame was cheap but chose some fancy lenses addons) plus 9 USD for shipping, so paid total 36 USD for two frames. But she had to have measured eyes which cost us like 20USD, it would be probably free in hospital, but too much hassle in hospital with appointments. https://www.zennioptical.com/ https://www.zennioptical.com/
cryptos 4y ago
Why isn't there more competition? Or, as Jeff Bezos would say: "Your margin is my opportunity."
rroot 4y ago
Seems like the glasses market is ripe for a disruptive startup company?
shinycode 4y ago
There is a French startup that tries to beat them to it. https://lunettespourtous.com https://lunettespourtous.com There is some podcasts about the founder, how he managed to do it. 10€ a pair of glass from the same quality within 10mn in store. https://lunettespourtous.com/pages/notre-mission https://lunettespourtous.com/pages/notre-mission
azubinski 4y ago
Usually, people buy glasses for a long time. Carrera with chameleon glasses served me for almost 15 years. They were expensive, yes. But they lasted 15 years. And this means that during these 15 years I did not buy new glasses. And so do a lot of people. And that means that if you start a company that makes cheap good glasses, you will be in trouble in a couple of years. Because good glasses last a long time, people love them and don't want to change them. So you raise your prices. I have vintage Ray Ban from the 1970s, still with real glass, not plastic, I love and wear them, and I'm not going to buy new "aviators" because I already have them. It's just such a specific product, it's not impersonal plastic boxes of electronics, this is a thing that is always with you and becomes a part of you. And there are many unknown manufacturers of cheap glasses, in any supermarket in the EU you will find racks with these glasses.
EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 4y ago
Looks prime for SV disruption, no?
herbst 4y ago
Glasses actually aren't expensive. I pay like $20-40 per prescription glasses from China. Firmoo, Zenni, ... No quality issues so far and a far more realistic price. No 'classic' glasses dealer makes their glasses in-house anyway. They all produce in cheap countries.
ggm 4y ago
Having moved to specific focal point, variable focus on high refractive index plastic (because I have some untenably bad differential between eyes and glass was causing my specs to slide off diagonally) I now find that I don't seem to get "told" the magic formulae for making my specs, to my needs. The basics are fine. I could use a $20 test and get fixed focus lenses cheap. Getting them to re-produce what I wear appears hard. I can't find anyone to explain the small piece of paper the machine spits out with a grid of numbers. (the very experienced ocular professor who assessed some structural eye issues for me used a 20second test machine and laughed at the professionals who still use the eye chart and a face sheet of lenses. He's confident they will ultimately stop using that stuff routinely, the box does it very well) Probably there is a canonical formula to reproduce it, I broke a pair in flight once and took the bust lenses to an optician in Paris who made me a pair from the lenses in 2 days. Some things demand fit. where the eye sweet spot is for variable focus depends how the lenses sit on your face. Maybe breaking the monopoly on price starts with fixed focus or bi or tri focals first, not continuous variable focus.
- LorenPechtel 4y ago
  I think the eye chart still has use. The machine spits out a field of numbers but my eye doc uses that as a starting point to refine from. Since I have some astigmatism there is no perfect answer, it's a matter of finding what deviation from perfect is the best and I get the strong impression that that's a matter of the individual, not something the machine can measure.
tcgv 4y ago
In my last summer vacation I travelled abroad and forgot to bring my sunglasses. Looking for a new one in the stores I found that prices for regular Ray-Ban (owned by Luxotica) were too expensive for my taste (~120 USD). So I decided to get a Polaroid sunglasses instead, for a third of the price (~40 USD). My only concern was wether the lenses polarization would be up to standards. So I Googled it and found out that Polaroid was in fact the company that invented polarized lenses :)
dghughes 4y ago
I had the same pair of glasses for 20 years just getting new lenses as needed. A year ago I had a slight change in prescription but also had to make the plunge into bifocals. Cost to me even after insurance? $800. And they're terrible.
- timbit42 4y ago
  I got my bifocals at ZenniOptical for around $130 before insurance, and they're fine.
whywhywhydude 4y ago
I wonder why the Euro bureaucrats are not doing anything about one of the biggest monopolies in the Europe. Guess they are just too busy figuring out another way to milk Google.
- rcMgD2BwE72F 4y ago
  What are Google market shares in Web searches in Europe?
Aulig 4y ago
Lots of recommendations for Zenni here, which is excellent. I'll go ahead and recommend AliExpress if you want the absolute cheapest. You can get everything from very basic (usually ~$5 for same strength on both eyes, ~$15 for different strengths) to any custom combination of glasses & frames ($30+) there. I've bought around a dozen and have only had good experiences. In case of bad experiences (one arrived a bit bent) you can get a refund. I'd recommend going for a metal frame though, since they're more durable.
rodolphoarruda 4y ago
I live in Sao Paulo, Brazil. There is a glasses retail chain here called Gassi which sells 2 pairs of glasses (frames + lenses) for around 40 USD.
exabrial 4y ago
It's expensive because Luxottica keeps quiet. It's a monopoly and needs to be broken up.
- missedthecue 4y ago
  Reading through this thread though, it seems like they have a lot of competition at a wide range of price points, from ten bucks to a couple hundred.
jarek83 4y ago
In Poland you can still get very decent glasses (that could be even with a premium brand frames) with top service included for about $300. I believe it's just a market that makes it expensive or cheap. Oh, and you don't need a prescription.
beaylott1986 4y ago
This must be a US thing. In UK you pay £25 for an eye test (which employer is required to cover if you have to wear glasses at work) and then you can order online with prescription you get from test for £40 and usually there are 2 for 1 or 50% offers even on that. It is baffling that you would have no competition if this was costing $800 ... is there IP or regulations stopping this or something?
KatieLN 4y ago
My go-to is Payneglasses.com. They're easy to work with and have incredible deals. Most of the frames I buy are $5.95 and then I add on the blue blocking protection and antiglare.
deleted 4y ago
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- deleted 4y ago
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375 points by joelkesler 4y ago

It's wonderful for them. Everyone who has eyesight really wants to see clearly. After air, food, water, eyesight is kinda crucial. Maybe we should tithe them in thanks for not making it way more expensive.

nullish_signal 4y ago
Should we tithe Industrial Zones for not dumping more chem waste? Tip our wait staff for not spitting in our food?
- yarg 4y ago
  Clearly not (and you're replying to a sarcastic comment).
  - stjohnswarts 4y ago
    It was practically dripping wasn't it? :)
    - yarg 4y ago
      Yeah, but HN isn't exactly the least autistic forum on the internet.
- mhuffman 4y ago
  >Tip our wait staff for not spitting in our food? I know people that worked in the industry and mention up-front they are good tippers to the servers ... just in case!
deleted 4y ago
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dboreham 4y ago

Get your eyes tested and buy glasses at Costco. Also if your prescription is a simple one, Costco sells off the shelf reading glasses for around $20 for three pairs.

mitchbob 4y ago

Archived: https://archive.ph/jhgdR https://archive.ph/jhgdR

rahimnathwani 4y ago

"Warby Parker recognized this as a business opportunity. I’m surprised others haven’t jumped in as well with reasonably priced eyewear." This author is uninformed. Others have jumped in. And Warby Parker wasn't even the first. 15 years ago I would buy my single-vision prescription glasses from optical4less.com. The cost was $58 for 2 pairs, including worldwide shipping. Today I buy my glasses from Zenni. Last month, I paid $176.75 total for two pairs of glasses, each with single-vision photochromic lenses (and one pair with additional blue light blocking).

MichaelZuo 4y ago
I've heard a lot of the cheaper places cutback on the fancy multi-layer coatings, so that the quality of lens is not equivalent. I know a lot of them advertise identical quality but did you ever confirm that to be the case?
- rahimnathwani 4y ago
  I've heard ... Heard from whom? I know a lot of them advertise identical quality but did you ever confirm that to be the case? You can choose what types of lenses you want. Zenni, for example, offers multiple lens options, some of which are from specific brands. https://www.zennioptical.com/glasses-lenses https://www.zennioptical.com/glasses-lenses When you buy glasses from a bricks and mortar optician, you're getting whatever bog-standard lenses they sell, unless they specifically mention they're high index, or have some specific feature/coating, or are from some specific manufacturer. Just like when you buy glasses online. There are definitely differences in lens quality, but the available range is just as wide in retail stores as it is online.
  - MichaelZuo 4y ago
    The high end luxury brands such as Silhouette offer very advanced lens coatings and materials that aren't found in any of the discount stores online or brick-and-mortar, so there's definitely a difference there. It's only their full priced partner shops that carry them. They also claim to use custom technology that allows their 10+ layers of coatings to stick together much better and not flake off. The mid range to entry luxury brands, many owned by Luxottica, use broadly available lenses and coatings, or so the discount online stores claim. I've never been to a discount brick-and-mortar store selling the full range of Luxottica products, usually only a few styles here and there. So I can't comment there. What I'm asking is if the claims of discount stores, like that they have access to the same lenses as full priced Luxottica stores, are actually true. And whether they are honest with their shipped product. e.g. How would anyone know if they in fact got a X layer coated lens (where X could be from 3 to 8) from a discount shop? It seems trivial to ship a X-1 layer coated lens instead, with a very low possibility of getting caught.

mindslight 4y ago

Uh, they aren't. You go to Zenni Optical and it's a solved problem. You basically choose what you want to pay. Their $7 glasses work great. My every days were $25, until I decided to try out their UV blocking lenses, which bumped them to $50. My prescription sunglasses and prescription safety goggles were each $80. If you've got a stronger prescription or need more than single vision lenses you'll pay a bit more. But nothing compared to the many hundreds by the time you walk out of an optician. Reasonable pricing completely changes the dynamic from bundling every what-if into a single pair, to one of why-not try something new - the way markets are supposed to work. Maybe next time I'll even try auto-darkening lenses, despite having had a lackluster experience with them decades ago. Ctrl-F Zenni in the article show no results though. I know there are even some competitors by now, but the ones I've seen are still trying to gouge a bit.

KatieLN 4y ago
Try Payneglasses.com. They're cheaper than zenni. Also, they're way easier to deal with if you need to exchange/return.

turtlebits 4y ago

Zenni glasses are 7$ and perfectly fine (I ordered a test set, which I now use as a spare) My current set from them is a high index lens and anti glare, which were only $30 shipped. They’re going on 3 years now and still look new.

bityard 4y ago

Same reason medical care is so expensive in the US: Insurance and the art of the upsell. The provider gets to charge high prices because the bulk of the cost is covered by insurance and thus "hidden" from consumers. The insurance company gets a non-trivial cut of the pie, which pads the bill further. And in my experience, when you go in with something wrong with you, most doctors will recommend (or perform without asking) tests that aren't covered by insurance and you don't find that out until the bill arrives in the mail. I have a pretty standard vision insurance plan and need glasses roughly every two years. (Two pairs: one for indoors, and sunglasses for outdoors and driving.) I go into an optometrist office and get my vision checked. $10 copay or whatever for the exam. Then the pain starts. The frame selection is terrible and it turns out that the only decent-looking frames and lenses cost 3-4x what insurance will cover. And insurance doesn't cover more-or-less "required" add-ons to lenses like anti-glare coatings. And the person selling you the glasses is _very_ good at convincing you that you need all the extras. I did the math one time and I paid $200 per year for vision insurance to save $190 (including the cost of the exam) on one pair of glasses. The last time I bought glasses, I took my (recent) prescription to an online eyelasses e-tailer website and purchased a pair that included all the fancy extras for $60 out the door. I don't _love_ them, but I can certainly live with them for the price.

olliej 4y ago
I would suggest checking out other optometrists, most have a much better insurance wall than they had a couple of decades ago. Or go online (to order, not suggesting an eye exam over webcam :D ). That said, I'm currently getting cataracts removed and IOL implants and insurance is like "correcting your astigmatism isn't needed so we won't cover the IOL that does that, just your distance vision". If correcting my vision isn't necessary then why cover any IOL at all??? :-/
- epmaybe 4y ago
  This gets into the weeds a little but the reason boils down to money and tradition, and “what is needed” is a shifting goalpost for society. Just thirty years ago you may have never even gotten an IOL due to tradition or cost. After adoption in the developed world there was a huge push to prevent lower income countries from accessing the technology because they “didn’t need” that technology and could benefit from lower cost interventions such as glasses. So as companies started to innovate and lower cost, single vision non toric IOLs became cheap enough for insurance to cover. Then to make some money on premium lenses companies (and ophthalmologists, sadly) really started to push torics and multifocal lenses. The fact of the matter is that few patients benefit all that much from toric lenses that fix astigmatism. Most people have less than 1 diopter of astigmatic error, which they don’t even manufacture a toric lens for at any usable tolerance (the FDA allows a +/-0.50D tolerance to all lenses including torics), and surgical modifications can nullify that to some extent. Veterans get it free at most VA hospitals though, so they probably get more implanted than the average population. In the next fifteen years though I bet Medicare will begin to cover toric lenses, and the rest of the insurance industry will follow. The surgery doesn’t change much between toric and non toric. The Multifocal IOLs will remain “premium” for a while to come I expect.

yarg 4y ago

Boycott Luxottica. Anyway, reminds me of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpKWHSsBpnE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpKWHSsBpnE; glasses with user adjustable lenses. Removes the need to customise the product to the individual, and the need to see an optometrist - it reduces the cost of the product and makes 'prescription' glasses a viable option even in nations without adequate medical services.

Saigonauticon 4y ago
Interestingly, a pair of glasses here in Vietnam -- including eye exam, fancy lenses (high refractive index, anti-glare etc.), and frame -- usually runs in the 20-40$ range. As with most things here, you can find cheaper if you need (e.g. secondhand). I'm not certain, but it sure feels like the inflated cost in North America makes it seem like eyeglasses are less affordable here than they actually are, at least in the cities. The kicker is when I fly to North America and I see the same frames being sold there! Edit: Eyeglasses are one of the things I recommend colleagues buy here while visiting. It's conceivable some (from nearby countries) save more than the cost of their trip!
- int_19h 4y ago
  You can get eyeglasses for $40 in US, from online stores like Zenni.
bagels 4y ago
I tried Warby Parker. The lenses delaminated in a few weeks both times (my experiment confirmed that the first one was not a fluke). I'd love to eliminate the cost and hassle of visiting an optometrist when the current prescription is working just fine.
dzhiurgis 4y ago
Boycott zenni as they ignore Taiwan
- bluGill 4y ago
  Got a better suggestion?

olliej 4y ago

I thought it was fairly well established that optometrists make most of their income from the sale of the frames as they have little to no control over how much they get for the examination, and the lens price determined by the lens manufacturer. The frames are the only thing that the optometrists get any significant margin on. The moment you aren't buying the frame from the optometrist office the price craters, and has been that way for at least a couple of decades at this point.

mixmastamyk 4y ago
Don't forget the lens and underbody coatings.
- olliej 4y ago
  I literally stated that they don’t have significant control over the lens prices. Every optometrist is getting their lens from a relatively minor set of manufacturers, and the manufacturers price to maximize their revenue, not the optometrist. Now I’m sure that they make a bit more money in an absolute sense from coatings, but nothing like the full $8 or whatever it costs these days. The biggest markup items they have are the frames, as there are many different manufacturers the frame manufacturers do have to offer margins to the places that sell them.
  - mixmastamyk 4y ago
    Sorry coatings are much more expensive, lotsa markup, bucko.

stjohnswarts 4y ago

don't buy your glasses from your optometrist, buy it from online sources. Most states require them to provide you with your prescription after an eye examination. I get mine for roughly 1/4-1/3 (I could probably get them cheaper if I wasn't sticking with a vendor that has been great for me) the price online and they're fine.

dang 4y ago

Discussed at the time: Why are glasses so expensive? The eyewear industry prefers to keep that blurry - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18980191 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18980191 - Jan 2019 (588 comments) Related: Ask HN: Recommend sunglasses made in the west and independent of Luxotica - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28029206 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28029206 - Aug 2021 (35 comments) Making My Own Glasses - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21156637 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21156637 - Oct 2019 (187 comments) How badly are we being ripped off on eyewear? Former industry execs tell all - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19312499 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19312499 - March 2019 (301 comments) The spectacular power of Big Lens - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17061380 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17061380 - May 2018 (43 comments) The One Product You Should Buy Online: Eyeglasses - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16040924 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16040924 - Dec 2017 (97 comments) Vision Insurance Is Making Glasses More Expensive - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15736573 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15736573 - Nov 2017 (86 comments) A Closer Look at the $13B Premium Eyewear Market - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15429826 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15429826 - Oct 2017 (135 comments) One Dollar Glasses – Help for 150M people - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13091936 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13091936 - Dec 2016 (114 comments) Why are glasses so expensive? (2012) - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9183464 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9183464 - March 2015 (113 comments) Sticker shock: Why are glasses so expensive? [video] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6718224 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6718224 - Nov 2013 (48 comments)

petilon 4y ago

Glasses are expensive because there is no competition. One company - Luxottica - owns pretty much everything. You go to LensCrafters and prices seem super expensive, so you go to Pearle Vision and that's expensive too, so you go to Target Optical and prices are still high and then you think maybe glasses are expensive, since you went to multiple stores and they all have similar prices. What you don't realize is that all those retail brands are owned by the same company - Luxottica [1]. They operate under several names, so there is an appearance of competition but there isn't. But wait, it isn't just stores, they also own eyewear brands such as Ray-Ban, Chanel, Coach, Oakley, Prada, Tiffany, and so on. Yes, all of those brands are owned by Luxottica [2]. Wait, not done yet. They also own insurance. Luxottica owns the vision insurance company EyeMed. [3] Still not done. Luxottica has merged with Essilor and now own multiple lens brands [4]. See 60 Minutes story on Luxottica if you're not outraged yet [5]. Where are the anti-trust enforcers in this country and other countries, and why are they not doing anything? [1] https://www.luxottica.com/en/retail-brands https://www.luxottica.com/en/retail-brands [2] https://www.luxottica.com/en/eyewear-brands https://www.luxottica.com/en/eyewear-brands [3] https://eyemed.com/en-us/about-us https://eyemed.com/en-us/about-us [4] https://www.essilorluxottica.com/brands https://www.essilorluxottica.com/brands [5] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDdq2rIqAlM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDdq2rIqAlM

nnoitra 4y ago
This comment slowly escalated to the point where I thought the next line would be: "They also own your eyes".
Eddy_Viscosity2 4y ago
It's almost as if monopolies are bad. I also thought they were illegal. Why hasn't Luxottica been broken up by antitrust laws?
planetsprite 4y ago
Why can't a new company simply undercut the competition? I don't imagine the barriers to entry are too high for manufacturing glasses, are they?

ekianjo 4y ago

In Japan you can get glasses for dirty cheap, including the eye check and case that goes with it. That's what happens when you liberate the market. NOTE: it's not reimbursed but nobody cares because it's cheap.

bschwindHN 4y ago
Yep - got my current pair of glasses from Zoff for around $30 all said and done.
rippercushions 4y ago
Japanese brands are slowly starting to make inroads overseas too. Owndays (cheap) and 999.9 (expensive but great service and very high quality) are now available in Australia and many Asian countries, Zoff has made its way to Singapore and Hong Kong.

warbler73 4y ago

After decades with private practices, since I switched to WalMart my prescriptions are more accurate and glasses cost almost nothing.

ourmandave 4y ago
Are Walmart glasses cheaper? My last pair was about the going rate, although it's been 4 years ago. I still use Walmart for exams but buy all my glasses from Zenni.com. They're so cheap, glasses have gone from sacred to disposable.
- mrguyorama 4y ago
  When I used them regularly (as a kid) in the 2000s, they were just as expensive and gave me untold problems involving insurance and repairs. Specifically, they would turn over frame styling so often that if you broke your frame in just a few months, they would be unable to repair or replace them. I'm not convinced this isn't an issue that most places have.

flashgordon 4y ago

Dumb question. Frames can be 3d printed right? Is it possible to so the same with lenses? Sounds like a "neighborhood/artisan" lens and glass maker could so this easily for a reasonable size neighborhood lucratively?

theklr 4y ago
Guessing it’s still a scalable issue for it to take off. King Children is still the only company I know that’s in this space, but they haven’t taken off like I’ve hoped for them to expand

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

dis-sys 4y ago

I used to pay $800-1,000 a pair, then I heard that the exact same glasses from the exact same factory just without that fancy logo costs you about $100 a pair. Bought a few of them, never looked back. People need to accept that you get ripped off all the time, it just a normal part of everyday life. when you think a $5 walmart tshirt is cheap, well, the factory gets probably 50c.

int_19h 4y ago
Perhaps life would be better if we stopped treating 10x markup as "normal part of everyday life"?

artificialLimbs 4y ago

I've been paying $350-400 for my high strength prescription glasses for most of my life. Last time around I heard you could order from England and get them for a fraction. Found selectspecs.com and got my -10's for ~100 shipped to my door. Not affiliated at all, just glad I don't have to pay the gouge in the US anymore.

rahimnathwani 4y ago
In the UK, there are several popular online glasses retailers: goggles4u speckyfoureyes GlassesDirect Currently, Glasses Direct is offering two pairs of single-vision prescription glasses for 14GBP (16USD) including shipping anywhere in the UK: https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/deals/cheap-glasses-discounts/ https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/deals/cheap-glasses-discou... Varifocals are also cheap (49GBP, or 57USD, for one pair).
jtchang 4y ago
That's a great deal. Were they 1.74 index?
- artificialLimbs 4y ago
  Single Vision UltraX Super Thin 1.74, Clear UV Coating, AR, Scratch Resistance

nostromo 4y ago

Because of insurance, which distorts markets. Lots of people get benefits that pay for their glasses, so they're not incentivized to be economical.

ck2 4y ago

https://google.com/search?q=reddit+"Zenni"+"Payne"+"Eyebuydirect"+"Goggles4u" https://google.com/search?q=reddit+"Zenni"+"Payne"+"Eyebuydi...

davidmurdoch 4y ago

Buy from Zenni Optical. They are inexpensive and customer service is pretty great. My daughter broke an arm of one of her frames while playing at school. I emailed Zenni asking for tips on how to repair it. They sent me replacement frames for free.

EMM_386 4y ago

I own exactly one pair of "expensive" glasses that I got from a retail chain and use as my primary pair. I will admit, they are of much higher quality than the glasses that I order online as a back-up. But outside of that pair, I get a print out of my prescription and go to places like www.eyebuydirect.com to get any other pairs. The quality isn't there but we are talking about hundreds of dollars cheaper. And if anything was to happen to my main pair, I can quickly grab the $80 and I doubt anyone would even notice. Plus, it makes wearing different styles from time to time a much more attractive offer.

walterbell 4y ago
What have you observed as a quality difference in the EBD pair? Frame construction? Any difference in optical clarity or face fit?
- EMM_386 4y ago
  Frame construction is generally much poorer quality. I've had them break from just taking them off my face too fast. Face fit is tricky, they allow you to select things like your "size" but this is broken down into "small/medium/large" when in reality it needs to take into account things like temple (arm) length, bridge width, etc. My main pair is perfect because I spent the big bucks on them and had a professional constantly tweaking them, putting them back on my face, tweaking them some more. And that comes with the ability to return to the store and have them do it again for free if I feel like I need to. Online you won't get any of that, so the fit isn't perfect. Optical clarity, no complaints. The lenses are good. But we're talking $500+ vs. $80.

eyelidlessness 4y ago

I’ll add another pro-Zenni comment. Not just because the glasses themselves are inexpensive (they are though, when I broke my favorite frames it cost $36 to get two replacements), but because it’s a godsend to get glasses you need if your prescription has “expired”. I’m sure there’s good reason for regulating routine vision checkups, but refusing to sell glasses to anyone who can’t get to the appointment isn’t serving anyone.

Markoff 4y ago
Yeah, I have never understood whole "prescription" thing in US, here in many (all?) European countries, you just go to eyeglasses shop, they measure your eyes and you get what you want, no prescriptions, nothing. Measuring is usually free if you buy frames from them, if not it cost like 20USD, though you could still go to ophthalmologist to have them measured professionally and it would be free, but you would need to get appointment and there is quite long waiting time and still not sure if they would provide you results for free. By US logic it's better if people don't have any glasses than bad glasses, strange logic to me.

TheWoodsy 4y ago

Sunglass frames are in every petrol station. Would it be possible to 3d-print a resin with known index of refraction, then go to town on the buffing wheel for an hour? Would love to hear more about DIY corrective lenses.

Johnny555 4y ago
then go to town on the buffing wheel for an hour You can get glasses from Zenni for under $10 (their website says they start at $6.95), you'd have a hard time beating their price with DIY, gas station sun glasses cost more than that around here. Of course, at that price you're not getting the lightest lenses, or coatings, but you're probably not getting that with DIY either.

Keyframe 4y ago

Ah, eyewear! I see Luxottica is mentioned. Kind of similar story behind optical glass (lenses, namely) and Schott (Zeiss) behind all of it.

bpanon 4y ago

Because large corporations work together to ensure their mutual longevity by monopolizing the market and ensuring cheaper alternatives never make it to the market. Nothing new under the sun. If there was a tire that never wore our, would it be manufactured? If there was a simple, cheap cancer treatment, would all associated businesses that profit from the treatment of cancer shut down? If internet could be offered at 10x for the speed, for 1/10th the cost, would it be? Only if the incentives line up for the dominant player(s).

newman314 4y ago

I started looking at getting new glasses recently and due to my extremely poor vision, need all these extra addons for lenses (high-index, progressive etc.) and they get EXPENSIVE very quickly.

whydat_whodat 4y ago

I'm a customer of Zenni Optical. They have glasses from $10 - $100+. I usually get the same set, for $100-- frameless. And that price includes blue-blocks (to reduce blue light from screens). They last long and are easily replaceable. [1] https://www.zennioptical.com/ https://www.zennioptical.com/

deleted 4y ago

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cozos 4y ago

I buy glasses (in the US) from this place called Jins. They are cheaper out-of-pocket than glasses being sold by my optometrist, even after insurance (I pay for Jins out of pocket). Not sure why and my optometrist can't explain how his glasses are betters either. I assume its some kind of price gouging.

scottmcdot 4y ago

FACE À FACE are high-quality glasses and I'm happy to pay the premium. They are not owned by Luxottica.

bradwood 4y ago

I now have to use reading glasses. First few prescriptions were eye-wateringly expensive. Now I just order a 4-pack off Amazon for about a tenner - never been happier. I have a pair at home, at work, in the car, in my bag and if they break I just toss 'em away without a second thought. I'm sure it must be a lot more tricky for those with unique prescriptions but for stock readers this is definitely the way to go.

lrvick 4y ago

I have purchased < $20 glasses from zennioptical without a perscription online many times that were every bit as good as $500 ones I bought at lenscrafters, with near identical styles. I started buying in bulk and worrying less about losing or babying them.

KoftaBob 4y ago

https://zennioptical.com https://zennioptical.com

goguy 4y ago

Just like anything you can shop around and get a good deal. In the UK I use glasses direct, you can pick up a pair with a prescription for £50. They regularly have discount codes so most of the time that would be £35/40. Sure they aren't designer but they look ok for the price if you don't want to spend a lot, if you use them just got driving you can probably get an even cheaper pair that don't look as good.

williamvds 4y ago
I've worn glasses since I was a kid, when you're entitled to a free frame from the cheaper range at Boots (a local retailer) (also, thanks, NHS). I remember struggling to find a design that I liked decent around that price range. As soon as you went out into the price ranges that weren't covered, you got a lot more nicer looking ones. At the time I was buying new frames and lenses every few years so I went with the cheap ones. My current pair were about £30 from Aliexpress, a gorgeous rimless set with anti-glare lenses included. Needless to say I won't be buying from local retailers anymore. I'm sure here in the UK we're also affected by the Luxottica monopoly in the US, especially when it comes to designer brands.

citizenpaul 4y ago

Reminds me of the time I found out that golf balls and eink screens are also a "secret monopoly" kept by highly litigatious patents.

braunboffel 4y ago
> eink screens are also a "secret monopoly" kept by highly litigatious patents. Please share the evidence for this.
- citizenpaul 4y ago
  Search engines don't seem to work anymore to find controversial information so I could not dig up the info again. It was from several years back it might be starting to change now. The golf balls are more interesting. Walmart/sams club actually had to give up on their own brand of golf balls due to the nonstop litigation from top flight, making it unprofitable to produce them.
  - braunboffel 4y ago
    > Search engines don't seem to work anymore to find controversial information so I could not dig up the info again. It was from several years back it might be starting to change now. Hmmm.... not really a satisfying answer for me. I wouldn't make such claims unless I was confident about it. > The golf balls are more interesting I'm not interested in the golf balls part.

piaste 4y ago

For many people, there is an option that side-steps the racket entirely, massively improves their QoL, and can even save money in the long term - laser eye surgery. (disclaimer: prices are likely to be different in other countries) Prices and quality of LES seems to have dropped significantly even as glasses have become more expensive. I had some annoying myopy / astigmastism combo so I used to pay up to 200-300€ for glasses, and prescription sunglasses were also expensive. Femto-LASIK surgery cost me a whopping 1500€ a couple of years ago, whereas an older acquaintance told me that he had paid 10x as much in the mid-aughts. A couple of decades of glasses would not have cost me much less, and the difference it makes in quality of life cannot be overstated. Easily in the running for the best money I ever spent. Of course, not everybody can get lasered - children and teenagers, first and foremost - but a lot more people do than realize it.

bluGill 4y ago
That doesn't last as long as you think before you will need readers anyway. I'm not saying it is a bad option, just that it isn't as great as it sounds when you are young.

atemerev 4y ago

Glasses are expensive because they are not just a medical device, but also a fashion accessory, and this market is a fashion market. I have to try about 20-30 frames or so, until I find something that looks OK on me. But! It is still possible to buy cheap enough frames that look fine. Why the _lenses_ are so expensive, that’s a different question. I routinely pay $700 or so for the lenses. Many professional multi-component _camera_ lenses cost much less than that. And it has nothing to do with Luxottica.

dustfinger 4y ago

Ha! One might ask the same about braces.

gnarula 4y ago

There's plenty of margin in the industry - as an anecdote, I've paid around £40 for a pair in the UK through an online retailer (Glasses Direct), around ~₹1500-2000 in India through an online retailer (Lenskart) and ~₹800 by visiting a local store in a Tier 2 city in India

regular 4y ago

Well, don't try GlassesUSA. They are a scam operation operating under various names, working hard to test your resolve to prosecute them.

bluecalm 4y ago

Great suggestions for cheaper alternatives in this thread! Does anyone knows if it's possible to get cycling sunglasses of similar quality as Oakley/100%? By cycling sunglasses I mean: -shape (those need to be big and go over forehead so you see clearly from hunched position) -lenses (tint, increased color contrast, preferably not polarized), anti fog -safe in case of a crash I tried shopping around but couldn't find anything that fits as well as 165$ pair of Speedcrafts (the lenses are amazing as well). The glasses are just 4 pieces of plastic (frame, lenses, nose bridge, nose pad) but somehow it's not easy to find a decent cheaper alternative.

KatieLN 4y ago
try payneglasses.com. I got some sports sunglasses from there. They're wraparound and have polarized lenses. They were around $25.

Markoff 4y ago

Are they? I ordered for wife glasses including frames from Zenni and it cost me 7 USD for cheap ones, 20 USD for more "expensive" ones (frame was cheap but chose some fancy lenses addons) plus 9 USD for shipping, so paid total 36 USD for two frames. But she had to have measured eyes which cost us like 20USD, it would be probably free in hospital, but too much hassle in hospital with appointments. https://www.zennioptical.com/ https://www.zennioptical.com/

cryptos 4y ago

Why isn't there more competition? Or, as Jeff Bezos would say: "Your margin is my opportunity."

rroot 4y ago

Seems like the glasses market is ripe for a disruptive startup company?

shinycode 4y ago

There is a French startup that tries to beat them to it. https://lunettespourtous.com https://lunettespourtous.com There is some podcasts about the founder, how he managed to do it. 10€ a pair of glass from the same quality within 10mn in store. https://lunettespourtous.com/pages/notre-mission https://lunettespourtous.com/pages/notre-mission

azubinski 4y ago

Usually, people buy glasses for a long time. Carrera with chameleon glasses served me for almost 15 years. They were expensive, yes. But they lasted 15 years. And this means that during these 15 years I did not buy new glasses. And so do a lot of people. And that means that if you start a company that makes cheap good glasses, you will be in trouble in a couple of years. Because good glasses last a long time, people love them and don't want to change them. So you raise your prices. I have vintage Ray Ban from the 1970s, still with real glass, not plastic, I love and wear them, and I'm not going to buy new "aviators" because I already have them. It's just such a specific product, it's not impersonal plastic boxes of electronics, this is a thing that is always with you and becomes a part of you. And there are many unknown manufacturers of cheap glasses, in any supermarket in the EU you will find racks with these glasses.

EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 4y ago

Looks prime for SV disruption, no?

herbst 4y ago

Glasses actually aren't expensive. I pay like $20-40 per prescription glasses from China. Firmoo, Zenni, ... No quality issues so far and a far more realistic price. No 'classic' glasses dealer makes their glasses in-house anyway. They all produce in cheap countries.

ggm 4y ago

Having moved to specific focal point, variable focus on high refractive index plastic (because I have some untenably bad differential between eyes and glass was causing my specs to slide off diagonally) I now find that I don't seem to get "told" the magic formulae for making my specs, to my needs. The basics are fine. I could use a $20 test and get fixed focus lenses cheap. Getting them to re-produce what I wear appears hard. I can't find anyone to explain the small piece of paper the machine spits out with a grid of numbers. (the very experienced ocular professor who assessed some structural eye issues for me used a 20second test machine and laughed at the professionals who still use the eye chart and a face sheet of lenses. He's confident they will ultimately stop using that stuff routinely, the box does it very well) Probably there is a canonical formula to reproduce it, I broke a pair in flight once and took the bust lenses to an optician in Paris who made me a pair from the lenses in 2 days. Some things demand fit. where the eye sweet spot is for variable focus depends how the lenses sit on your face. Maybe breaking the monopoly on price starts with fixed focus or bi or tri focals first, not continuous variable focus.

LorenPechtel 4y ago
I think the eye chart still has use. The machine spits out a field of numbers but my eye doc uses that as a starting point to refine from. Since I have some astigmatism there is no perfect answer, it's a matter of finding what deviation from perfect is the best and I get the strong impression that that's a matter of the individual, not something the machine can measure.

tcgv 4y ago

In my last summer vacation I travelled abroad and forgot to bring my sunglasses. Looking for a new one in the stores I found that prices for regular Ray-Ban (owned by Luxotica) were too expensive for my taste (~120 USD). So I decided to get a Polaroid sunglasses instead, for a third of the price (~40 USD). My only concern was wether the lenses polarization would be up to standards. So I Googled it and found out that Polaroid was in fact the company that invented polarized lenses :)

dghughes 4y ago

I had the same pair of glasses for 20 years just getting new lenses as needed. A year ago I had a slight change in prescription but also had to make the plunge into bifocals. Cost to me even after insurance? $800. And they're terrible.

timbit42 4y ago
I got my bifocals at ZenniOptical for around $130 before insurance, and they're fine.

whywhywhydude 4y ago

I wonder why the Euro bureaucrats are not doing anything about one of the biggest monopolies in the Europe. Guess they are just too busy figuring out another way to milk Google.

rcMgD2BwE72F 4y ago
What are Google market shares in Web searches in Europe?

Aulig 4y ago

Lots of recommendations for Zenni here, which is excellent. I'll go ahead and recommend AliExpress if you want the absolute cheapest. You can get everything from very basic (usually ~$5 for same strength on both eyes, ~$15 for different strengths) to any custom combination of glasses & frames ($30+) there. I've bought around a dozen and have only had good experiences. In case of bad experiences (one arrived a bit bent) you can get a refund. I'd recommend going for a metal frame though, since they're more durable.

rodolphoarruda 4y ago

I live in Sao Paulo, Brazil. There is a glasses retail chain here called Gassi which sells 2 pairs of glasses (frames + lenses) for around 40 USD.

exabrial 4y ago

It's expensive because Luxottica keeps quiet. It's a monopoly and needs to be broken up.

missedthecue 4y ago
Reading through this thread though, it seems like they have a lot of competition at a wide range of price points, from ten bucks to a couple hundred.

jarek83 4y ago

In Poland you can still get very decent glasses (that could be even with a premium brand frames) with top service included for about $300. I believe it's just a market that makes it expensive or cheap. Oh, and you don't need a prescription.

beaylott1986 4y ago

This must be a US thing. In UK you pay £25 for an eye test (which employer is required to cover if you have to wear glasses at work) and then you can order online with prescription you get from test for £40 and usually there are 2 for 1 or 50% offers even on that. It is baffling that you would have no competition if this was costing $800 ... is there IP or regulations stopping this or something?

KatieLN 4y ago

My go-to is Payneglasses.com. They're easy to work with and have incredible deals. Most of the frames I buy are $5.95 and then I add on the blue blocking protection and antiglare.

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