24 ms·

On the cheap, like a local, and without a lot of luggage

• rippercushions 4y ago
  Some of this advice is good, some of it is bizarre: > I prefer to travel to a city the time of year its most uncomfortable. So like Montreal in the winter, or New Delhi in the summer. I want to see a place when it’s at the apogee of its essence, not when it’s the most comfortable. A kinda, if you are going to do X really do X thing. It’s also when it’s a lot cheaper. No, sorry, if you visit New Delhi in May, Tokyo in August or Montreal in February, you're going to have a pretty miserable time.
  • rtanks 4y ago
    Agreed
  • Chris_arnade 4y ago
    Had a great time in Montreal in February. Great time in Hanoi in July!
    • cptn_badass 4y ago
      The thing is even locals will have a greater time during the nicer times. Using Montreal, where I was living until a few years ago, is a much nicer place to wander around when there's no snow. It's a colourful city, lively and full of small and big activity to do, so you can get by with the sort of tourism you described in high season (summer), but also end of spring and early fall. In the winter, it's a cold, wet and relatively low interaction time of the year. I assume some place have a high, low and dead season for tourism, and I personally aim for low, but to each their own. Quebec in general is a great place for winter vacation, just have to go outside Montreal island.
  • MerelyMortal 4y ago
    Maybe for someone who is always used to A/C or central heating. For someone who has experience with such weather and has adapted to it, it's not a big deal. I wouldn't presume to tell other people how they should feel, but giving them a head's up that it may be miserable if they're not ready for it is wise.
    • hinoki 4y ago
      Tokyo had a few days this last august with lethal wet bulb temperatures. I assume Delhi would be similar. Winter in Montreal just needs the right clothing, but then you’re not packing light. A proper winter coat, gloves, boots, etc. will need way more space than exists in that tiny backpack.
      • saint_fiasco 4y ago
        You can buy the right clothing in Montreal. Since the stores in Montreal sell to people in Montreal, the right clothing will be cheap and easy to find.
        • Swizec 4y ago
          > the right clothing will be cheap and easy to find Tell me you’ve never lived in a place with actual winter without telling me. The clothes aimed at locals are designed to be a 5 to 10 year investment. Not a jacket you buy to throw away in spring. That said, you are right that unless you’re in a place like that, the correct gear isn’t even available for you to buy.
          • hinoki 4y ago
            You could probably get something used, but it would be a bit of a hassle. Or another way to experience the city like a local. But while you’re shopping, and the trip in from the airport would be pretty miserable.
            • shagie 4y ago
              I'd tend to avoid buying used long underwear or wool socks. The "cheap, serviceable, but used" is... fairly picked over by the locals (and especially the homeless). Consider San Francisco for a moment and the daily occasion of tourists who suddenly find that the fog rolling in the evening is cold and then buy the "cheap" (but horribly marked up) jackets that aren't the right size in which they stand out like sore thumbs. Or they could go to the Salvation Army store and buy a winter jacket - consider the availability of them there. Or they could go to REI or Farm and Fleet (I know there aren't any F&F in SF) and buy a new winter jacket there. After childhood, locals have winter clothes that often last 5-10 years or more (and they pay for durability). My winter jackets are from '10 (I've got a medium weight photographer's jacket that I got in Keeble & Shuchat in '01 that I still wear... wish I could find something like it again). My father's winter jackets are in the 10-20 year range. I'm also going to note the plural. Locals will often have two or three "winter" jackets depending on the weather. The only time you get a jacket for a season that is cheap is for a child who is going to outgrow it by the next winter.
  • blamazon 4y ago
    I was in Japan during the hottest part of the year pre-pandemic and it was delightful. The cicadas from anime are a real thing, not sure why that surprised me exactly but I loved the vibe. I experienced how an onsen visit can completely refresh me in any weather - so interesting how steeping in super hot water makes me feel better in super hot weather. I bought a neck towel with a fun waving cat print and shopkeepers watering plants always offered to water my neck towel. Always ice cold water. My hikes were made all the more satisfying under the intense heat. In the moment you're hot and sweaty, but afterwards you are washed and air conditioned and drinking ice cold beer and life is so much sweeter.
    • Cthulhu_ 4y ago
      I'd probably be okay with that, but I don't like being uncomfortable. My girlfriend gets heat stroke when temperatures go over 25 degrees celsius, so that's a definite nope. Still want to visit Japan at some point though.
      • willbw 4y ago
        Heat stroke at 25c! Is this in 100% humidity?
      • prottog 4y ago
        Where is your girlfriend from, Antarctica? I'd be hard-pressed to find many people who would find 25ºC unpleasant, even with high humidity.
        • pxx 4y ago
          I find 25C fairly unpleasant and definitely "warm." OSHA recommends offices to be cooled below that point, with 24C/76F being the upper end of acceptable. Some of this observation is also dependent on metabolic rate, which makes opinions on this somewhat gender-skewed.
  • joncp 4y ago
    I’d tweak the advice: go in the shoulder seasons.
    • brandall10 4y ago
      Exactly, that’s generally my tact on my digital nomad adventures… try to avoid peak season, but don’t go in the middle of winter/summer in a seasonal area
    • ghaff 4y ago
      And in the US and much of Europe, school and general vacation schedules play a role as well. September and October tend to be really good times to visit a lot of places that are packed in July and August--and the weather is often even better. Get into the winter and it's at least a different experience out of doors and may not even be really doable for the casual visitor (though of course cities are always visitable to some degree).
  • dominotw 4y ago
    Maybe around the edges of peak season is better option? Skiing in colorado is best end of March into April. Crowds are completely gone and snow is the best.
  • ehnto 4y ago
    I guess it depends on your sensibilities. Tokyo in the summer matches where I live in the summer, so it's no real change. Also I'd say weather is all part of the experience. Places like Sapporo or Sendai are great to visit in the winter, because you get a real winter experience. Something we don't get in my country. Most countries have more than 4 season in practical terms though, and going during the "seasons inbetween" is my recommendation. In Australia, the indigenous have up to 6 different seasons they identified depending on the location/tribe, and they have more nuanced events expected for each season. Most countries are like that in real terms, so intimate knowledge can get you a great budget off-season holiday experience. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigenous_Australian_seasons https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigenous_Australian_seasons
  • wirthjason 4y ago
    If you visit Chicago in the winter, the absolute worst part of the year, you’ll miss what makes Chicago great. The beautiful summers are so great it makes the winters tolerable. For example I always take visitors on a river/lake boat tour. Even though I grew up here it always blows my mind mind. The problems is those are completely shut down in the winter. If someone wanted to visit me in the winter and “act like a local” I don’t know what I would suggest, maybe stay indoors where it’s warm.
    • bombcar 4y ago
      I think there's "off season" and there's "midwest in January" - you can aim to visit Chicago in the very early spring or late fall just as the boat tours begin or end. As in all cases, careful research can reveal opportune times that you can balance with your other goals. If you want to see the cherry blossoms in Japan, you're stuck to a very particular time, for example; but I don't think they put away Mt Fiji until very late in winter.
      • rippercushions 4y ago
        Mt Fuji is best seen in winter, when the air is clear and it can be seen from far away. If you actually want to climb it, you're limited to a brief season of a couple of months in midsummer.
      • kritiko 4y ago
        I was in Chicago in mid-May a few years ago and took a boat tour. The weather was still very cold and windy and it ended up being pretty miserable! I'd still recommend it. But it taught me to pack based on the weather forecast and historical weather. I make sure to bring a warm and dry enough outer layers that I can sit outside for an extended period.
        • bombcar 4y ago
          And one of the best things you can do "as a local" is ... buying weather-appropriate clothes you forgot! Almost all cities have thrift stores or equivalent, too, which can be even more fun.
  • mvexel 4y ago
    I think it actually makes sense, but perhaps more so for “traditional” tourism. I lived in Amsterdam for 20 or so years. I found winter to be positively miserable: cold, rainy and dark. But it is the best time of year to see tourist highlights like the Anne Frank House, Rijksmuseum etc. Not as much waiting and crowding. The old town in general felt less like an open air museum. Not sure if this still holds true, it’s been over a decade since I moved away.
• draw_down 4y ago
  Rick Steves said something like this once, about trying to get the essence of a place. I think maybe there’s no use avoiding that wherever you go there you are. I remember his adamance that he would never drink a beer in some Italian place, because people there drink red wine. Meanwhile I’m pretty sure you can find plenty of people around Italy who enjoy a beer, or slivovitz or whatever. Not only that but you’re not a local- and so what? Travel, that is to say seeing other parts of the world than one’s own, need not involve an attempt at escaping into some other life.
• PopAlongKid 4y ago
  >Next time you travel, when you get home, unpack and see what you didn’t use. You’ll be surprised how much you’ve overpacked. >I also bring lots of cash Best travel advice I ever received, pre-Internet era (but still relevant): Bring twice as much money, and half as many clothes, as you think you are going to need.
• Lio 4y ago
  Whenever I see "travel light" advice now I just think of Vagrant Holiday[1]. Of course, once you've seen how The Vagrant travels it makes the rest of us look like pretentious bourgeois pretenders no matter how regimented our carry on bags are. :P 1. https://www.youtube.com/c/VagrantHoliday https://www.youtube.com/c/VagrantHoliday
  • mastax 4y ago
    Similarly I recently ran into the YouTube trainhopping community. Was surprisingly interesting. e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8OYWjIvycY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8OYWjIvycY
    • Lio 4y ago
      Yeah I love the idea of trainhopping but seeing The Vagrant's trainhopping video pretty much robbed any residual romance from it for me. It's a dirty, dangerous and cold way to travel. A bit like the guy that packed himself up in a crate to get back home; not something I'd ever really want to experience myself.
      • lazyasciiart 4y ago
        I saw a talk once by a guy on how he spent his late teens/early twenties train-hopping around North America. The main point he wanted the audience to take away was Don't Do It - it's dangerous (stories of a few dead or disabled friends), uncomfortable, can have serious legal consequences, and (most importantly to him) the more rich tourists do it, the harder it gets for the desperate teenage runaways like himself, and others with zero resources, who are using it to survive.
  • 2Gkashmiri 4y ago
    holy shit that guy swears a lot. am definiely not used to that.... other than that, he doesnt explain where he showers, does mcdonalds offer shower+washing at their restrooms across europe?
    • 4y ago
• soared 4y ago
  One sentence in and the article is already waving its cringe flag proudly. > I don’t travel like most people do The author follows that up by saying they’d rather travel to a place like Indianapolis than NYC. In your words author, enjoy spending 4 weeks in Indianapolis living out of your book bag, not doing trips to other cities, sampling the local restaurants of Applebees and chilis, all while using the glorious public transit they have to offer.
  • prottog 4y ago
    The author in fact did spend some time in Indianapolis[0]. I'm not really sure what your point is, besides that Indianapolis is a hinterland town with no public transit (the author was mainly on foot, anyway) and its height of cuisine being chain restaurants? Have you been to Indianapolis? [0]: https://walkingtheworld.substack.com/p/walking-america-part-3-indianapolis https://walkingtheworld.substack.com/p/walking-america-part-...
    • ghaff 4y ago
      Well, one of the points of that link seemed to be that there are nice little ethnic restaurants even in strip malls in Indianapolis. I know that many smaller cities are perfectly nice places to live in--especially for those who don't want either a bustling metropolis or a rural location. But it doesn't mean I'll visit there for no particular reason especially without a car to get around easily.
      • prottog 4y ago
        You might find yourself surprised at how many of these smaller cities are good to visit for no particular reason! Indianapolis does have more than just little ethnic restaurants in strip malls. Of course, you may run out of things to see and do there sooner than you would in NYC, but who really has time to travel that much, anyway? ;-) You have a point about needing a car in any number of such smaller cities in America, but even in those places there is a central core that remains relatively walkable.
• pxx 4y ago
  > "You can almost always change cash with no commission and at a better exchange rate than credit cards charge" Can you? This doesn't seem to be the case except in countries where the real exchange rate has drifted from a government-imposed one. The spread on my credit card and ATM card are low enough (very negative, in fact, on the credit card when we consider cashback) where if this were the case I would be able to arbitrage against said jewelry stores.
  • Mikeb85 4y ago
    Definitely not lol. Cash changing places are always colossal rip-offs that give you an exchange rate that's off by like 30%...
    • presentation 4y ago
      Yeah I’ve checked my credit card and ATM transactions against google’s exchange rates and they almost always are extremely close matches. Local banks seem to basically just provide the same rates with the extra annoyance that you have to carry around a ton of cash.
    • Chris_arnade 4y ago
      No! Some are indeed. Especially in Airport. But almost every country has, if you look for them, places with zero commission. Also, a lot of places around the world (where I go, especially street food type places) don't accept cards. Taking local money out of bank machines is a huge rip off. Huge fees and bad exchange rates
      • pxx 4y ago
        But that's literally not the case. There are ATM cards that reimburse you for fees and also give you great exchange rates. Again, this is assuming that there isn't some sort of black market for exchange that's causing published rates to diverge from real rates, but that's only the case in relatively few countries.
        • deleted 4y ago
• elif 4y ago
  All this to say "I'm a contrarian" I don't think most people legitimately enjoy "empty military museums" "walking across town aimlessly twice" "visiting in bad weather" "watching bad soccer matches" "eating at the same place three quarters of meals for 8 weeks" I do 4-8 month backpacking trips semi-regularly and try to visit new countries whenever possible... But even I can't find a single piece of appreciable advice from this whole read.
  • e1g 4y ago
    I imagine someone visiting my "home" cities using that strategy, and it's hilarious how wildly incorrect and poor their experience of these places would be. Like a local? Ok, just not like any local I've ever met living here.
    • bombcar 4y ago
      Anyone who has ever been a local knows that locals spend time living their life; they rarely go to museums, etc in their own town; and if they do they probably go to specific ones multiple times (the ones that go with their hobbies, say). There is something to "not being a stereotypical tourist" but that's easy enough to do by being polite, and paying attention to what is going on, and wandering off the beaten path now and then. Visiting off-season can be a great deal, especially if you're not concerned with weather (for example, if you're going to be visiting museums in Rome, they will be open during the rain as well as the shine).
      • hooverd 4y ago
        I'm very aware of the nature of my relationship as a tourist, but I do want to be an active participant and not a passive observer.
    • Cthulhu_ 4y ago
      I mean looking around where I live (a quiet, fairly middle class suburb), I'm sure they would get bored pretty quickly. There's no stores or landmarks here, just some playgrounds and bits of greenery. People live here, they do business and entertainment elsewhere.
• throw_lfnsooemd 4y ago
  IMO this misses out on how to create deep connections with people. What I often do is meet people through Grindr and try to get a short term romance. The relationships that ensure are quite profound and it creates a very special connection with the place. Maybe through the eyes of the person that you've met.
• state_less 4y ago
  Another benefit of packing light is that you can rent a motorcycle and carry your kit cross-country without much trouble. I like covering a lot of ground and coming and going whenever it suits me.
• ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
  I worked with a Japanese chap, who was a 3rd Degree blackbelt travel ninja. He had one Zero Halliburton carry-on case. Had about three changes of clothes, and all his tech gear in there. He would travel for months at a time, but always used just that case. In many cases, he slept on the plane, and never even got a hotel room. Once he became a VP, he had to pack a suit, so he had to add a suit bag.
  • user3939382 4y ago
    > In many cases, he slept on the plane, and never even got a hotel room. How did he shower/bathe?
    • ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
      I didn't ask, but he had a lot of travel percs, so he probably used the airport lounge facilities. They can have the full Monty, in some of these lounges.
    • klausa 4y ago
      Airport lounges, I assume.
  • laundermaf 4y ago
    > In many cases, he slept on the plane, and never even got a hotel room. Doesn't sound like such a great life. Anything short of a bed is pretty awful to sleep, let alone planes; even less once-a-day long-haul flights that would allow any acceptable amount of sleep. I'd guess "never even got a hotel room" is an exaggeration.
    • ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
      > I'd guess "never even got a hotel room" is an exaggeration. No, it isn't. It wasn't that frequent, but he (and others) did, from time to time. I traveled with him, many times, and can attest to a lot of it (I'm a wuss. I'll always get a hotel room, and insist on a night of rest). It was the life he chose. I suspect that he leveraged the extreme. It did get him a Corporate VP seat, after all (and the fact that he's one of the smartest bastards I'd ever met). I don't know if the office would have been much less stress. Japanese work culture is pretty intense.
• ochoseis 4y ago
  There’s a really good subreddit for this called r/onebag. You can get by with surprisingly little clothing by utilizing wool t-shirts, socks and underwear, plus semi-stylish nylon shorts and pants (I’ve personally had good luck with Unbound merino, Western Rise, and Outlier). Pure wool is more fragile than cotton, but pretty comfortable these days, resists odor, dries quickly, and is easy to sink-wash. Shoes are the one thing I have yet to crack — hard to find ones that dress up and down well.
  • adwi 4y ago
    They’re not for serious hiking but I’m a fan of Clark’s Desert Boots re: up and down. Look great with jeans (even shorts, IMO) and work with a suit. I recommend you getting the Bushacre version, as the effectively turn any moisture on the ground into ice. Cheaper, too.
  • tbran 4y ago
    For the more adventurous, there is also r/zerobag! Lots of interesting little posts and articles, but few enough to read them in an afternoon. https://old.reddit.com/r/Zerobag/ https://old.reddit.com/r/Zerobag/
    • TremendousJudge 4y ago
      It's amazing that some people do this, but it just seems very inconvenient
  • kritiko 4y ago
    Allbirds are pretty good - and some of them are made of wool. I became a devoted fan because of their odor resistance.
  • coyotespike 4y ago
    I will check out that reddit! Shoes are hard. Personally, I tend to use one of: - Astral Loyaks, which are minimalist boating shoes. Fine for casual style, and can work out in them - Chuck Taylor's, again casual but super flexible style. Again, you can work out in them - Good leather town boots. Can walk anywhere in them and they dress up excellently. For the rest of my clothing, I tend to wear things Lululemon's collared shirts and long pants, which are technical fabric but look downright dressy.
• varispeed 4y ago
  These guides to travel "like a local" always sound patronising and demeaning. It's almost short of saying travel "like a poor" and reminds me of rich middle class coming to deprived parts of town to have pint with the locals to hear how they struggle and at the same time feel better about themselves.
  • biftek 4y ago
    That's the real issue I have with this article. I think it's possible to have a considered approach to an off the beaten path style of travel, but writing a "holier than thou" article about it doesn't seem like it tho.
  • dahauns 4y ago
    Yeah, I couldn't help but hear Pulp's Common People in my head when reading the article... (Well, the Shatner version, to be exact ;) )
• cowuser666 4y ago
  Seems like people are criticizing this partially because it's pitched as an alternative to normal tourism. Just wanted to point out that Chris Arnade has done quite compelling photo journalism based on his way of engaging with communities, so what might seem like non sequitors or edge lord stuff might be in service of an implicit goal of his that most travelers don't share. Not that he does himself any favors with some of the framing. Highly recommend his book Dignity. https://www.amazon.com/Dignity-Seeking-Respect-Back-America/dp/0525534733 https://www.amazon.com/Dignity-Seeking-Respect-Back-America/... Some of his work in the Guardian: https://www.theguardian.com/profile/chris-arnade https://www.theguardian.com/profile/chris-arnade
  • runjake 4y ago
    In fact, he's apparently on HN, also. https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=Chris_arnade https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=Chris_arnade
  • ericholscher 4y ago
    This is useful context, thanks for sharing it.
  • neilknowsbest 4y ago
    Is this the guy who covered Hunts Point in the Bronx? I remember seeing his pictures, feels like a long time ago now. I found a Flickr album here [0]. I also vaguely recall a long form article, talking about a few different people's lives, but I can't seem to find that one. [0] - https://www.flickr.com/photos/arnade/albums/72157626468016870/ https://www.flickr.com/photos/arnade/albums/7215762646801687...
• post_break 4y ago
  Reminds me of the guy who travels after a terrorist attack because it’s so much cheaper: https://www.reddit.com/r/funny/comments/l9y45v/travel_hacks/ https://www.reddit.com/r/funny/comments/l9y45v/travel_hacks/
• smoovb 4y ago
  A Buddhist monk might call this kind of travel extravagant.
• kritiko 4y ago
  Lots of commentary on Arnade’s recommendations already, so I’ll ask a question instead —- Does anybody here have a regular job and family and take multiple multiple-week trips per year? If so, how do you do it?
  • tayo42 4y ago
    No family, but it's not hard with tech companies and unlimited pto. In the post covid world and wfh my gf and I work on trips I wouldn't have been able to do before too
    • kritiko 4y ago
      So the how is roughly: -Work remotely -Take unlimited PTO (how many days is that for you?) Do you find that working on trips impacts your itinerary or choice of accommodations?
      • tayo42 4y ago
        im not working currently but at my last job of 5 years I took between 6-8 weeks of pto a year. 2-3 week trips internationally. my gf works a little more then i do on trips her unlimited pto isnt as flexible. > choice of accommodations? I have to make sure there is working space for 2 and good wifi and internet so I had to pay a little more on those trips and carefully read reviews and look at all the pictures. I'm not a work from a coffee shop person. I need quiet. > impacts your itinerary Not so much, though we don't really plan that much. While working you can stay a little longer. So it becomes do one thing in the afternoon, or in the morning. I like trying lots of new food and exploring cuisine so filling the day with work then eating is fine with me. I did the work-cation thing more on surf trips where I was surfing a lot, less tourist focused stuff. Did this in bali, kauai, puerto rico and europe
• jobs_throwaway 4y ago
  Nice read, but for all the "I want to travel like a local", I find it funny that he refers to the large city in the south of Vietnam as "Ho Chi Minh City" when virtually all locals call it its traditional name "Saigon".
• iLoveOncall 4y ago
  I genuinely never understood the people that travel to live like locals, avoiding tourist spots, popular attractions, etc. Popular things are popular for a reason, I just can't fathom missing out on them on purpose, with the sole reason being that they are popular. If I pay thousands for flights and hotels, it's definitely to see what's unique about the place, and after having lived in 4 very different countries (and my girlfriend in 10+), I can tell you that the locals' way of life is definitely not unique anywhere in the world.
  • Consultant32452 4y ago
    I do the tourist attractions but try to find local mom and pop restaurants over the recommended tourist places.
  • yunwal 4y ago
    Locals way of life is no different in South India vs. the US? I get your point I guess, but there are huge differences in way of life that are genuinely interesting to me at least.
    • iLoveOncall 4y ago
      No, it really isn't that different. I think you can see differences in standard of living, not way of life or day to day life. Wake up, go to work, go for a drink with colleagues or friends and go back home (and everything in between) is the day to day routine of the vast majority of people, no matter which country they are in and which standard of living they have. It's not because some do it in a megalopolis with skyscrapers and some in a wooden shack in the middle of the mountains that the way of life is different.
      • laundermaf 4y ago
        Your view on "the way of life" is so superficial. Yes, we all breathe, eat and die. Day to day things are different. Interactions are different. Food is different. The time you spend between work and sleep is different. Saying that "the way of life" is the same between South of India and the US is completely laughable.
• Chris_arnade 4y ago
  I wrote the article. So you can yell at me here. Thanks again for all the interesting comments. Hacker news is the best. One of the few places I read the comments and learn.
  • mhitza 4y ago
    Please get rid of that subscription popup. OR make it only show on consecutive visits (not the first one), and make the "let me read this first" option a bit more obvious. I've been looking aimlessly for an obvious X or No and missed the option the first time around.
    • Chris_arnade 4y ago
      That's a substack thing that I'm completely unaware of and I think powerless to do anything about.
    • jason-phillips 4y ago
      You can block the HTML element yourself with uBlock Origin's dropper tool.
  • jdpedrie 4y ago
    Hey Chris, just wanted to say I love Dignity, and enjoy listening to you on various podcasts. The Econtalk episode and the recent Lamp Magazine ones were great!
    • Chris_arnade 4y ago
      Thanks so much. Really appreciate that.
  • Vrondi 4y ago
    How do you get PB&J through airport security? Also, can you somehow turn off your subscription popup on your website just on the "About" page (where I'm not reading any of your content yet)? You seem to have some nice candid photography.
• throw7 4y ago
  Walking around is great, but I think it's a good idea to generally be aware of "unsafe" parts of town. If you think about your own local city, you would know areas to avoid, but, hey, if that's your thing, then go for it.
• invalidusernam3 4y ago
  The part about visas is purely from an American perspective. I always find it weird when people write assuming everyone reading will be American. It's extra surprising when the person is a supposed travel guru.
  • Bakary 4y ago
    It's not that strange. They are writing a paid newsletter oriented towards Americans, which is why it has that "Live, laugh, love" tinge to it. Besides, you could say an endless number of troubled audiences might read the article. Handicapped folks, parents with needy and noisy children, depressed/repressed engineers who don't leave their house, and thousands of other profiles for whom travel is but a distant dream. You just have to write and not worry about all that. Heck, the people who can't travel might enjoy the escapism.
• ricardobayes 4y ago
  Travelling is like real estate, location matters. Certain places are popular for a reason usually. Off-the beaten path travelling is like advocating people to move to an off-grid farm with no running water. It might work out fine for you, but most people are not into that thing.
• mvexel 4y ago
  If you need a travel guide for this type of tourism, you may find the “tourists vs locals” maps interesting and useful. Made by analyzing Flickr photos grouping them in ones likely taken by locals (blue) vs ones likely taken by tourists (red).
  • ghaff 4y ago
    Those were fascinating when geotagging was just becoming a thing. All they show though is that a lot of tourist locations aren't where people live and work. (If you look at the SF example, relatively few locals are regularly taking pics on Alcatraz.) It's not that visitors should avoid locales like the Mission (personally a lot of it is probably more interesting than Fisherman's Wharf) but it's not surprising that overall areas with a lot of housing or downtown businesses don't necessarily overlap with tourist attractions (though they probably do in SF more than some other places. Seattle may be a more obvious example although there are many that make a lot of sense. https://www.flickr.com/photos/walkingsf/albums/72157624209158632/ https://www.flickr.com/photos/walkingsf/albums/7215762420915...
• throwaway123120 4y ago
  > * When I decided to go to Vietnam, everything and everyone told me to go to Ho Chi Minh City. It had better food. More art. More high culture. Less government. So I went to Hanoi. The US equivalent is to go to Indianapolis instead of NYC or Houston instead of LA.* Uh huh. Indianapolis is a great idea for an international traveler. And while you are at it, go visit Indiana's state parks instead of Yosemite or Zion /s
  • laundermaf 4y ago
    The US equivalent is to go to LA instead of NY. Hanoi is the capital, the second largest city and very touristy. Picking Hanoi over HCM isn't off the beaten path at all. Try Đà Lạt if you want to travel like a local.
• wdutch 4y ago
  > When I decided to go to Vietnam, everything and everyone told me to go to Ho Chi Minh City. It had better food. More art. More high culture. Less government. So I went to Hanoi. I'm not sure why the author acts like those are the only 2 options. I spent a year living in Ho Chi Minh city and the vast majority of the city of is not aimed at international people but at the 9 million Vietnamese speakers living there (districts 1, 2 and 7 being the exceptions). That being said, both HCM and Hanoi are subcultures of their own and don't give any impression of a 'typical' Vietnamese person's experience. If I were to look for a completely ordinary city, I'd pick a random city with a population of around 500,000 and nothing notable on Wikipedia.
  • notahacker 4y ago
    Not to mention that most backpackers probably visit both cities, and Hanoi is arguably the more touristy of the two...
  • refurb 4y ago
    Indeed. HCMC and Hanoi are huge metropolis. There is a huge migrant worker population because that's where the jobs are. If you want an "non-touristy" experience, go to mid-sized cities like Can Tho or Ben Tre in the Mekong Delta. They have lots of tourists, but they tend to be local. Everyone else there is just living their life. Or go to some small rural town. Not much to do, but you'll get a glimpse of how a large part of the population lives.
• yosito 4y ago
  I've been traveling out of carryon luggage for almost 15 years, and I really disagree with a lot of the stuff in this post. I find many of the people who say "I'm traveling like a local not a tourist" to be at least slightly self-deceiving. You're a goddamned tourist, whether you go to restaurants with good reviews or not. The packing tips here are utter nonsense, as well as the suggestion that you get better exchange rates with cash than with credit cards.
  • lg 4y ago
    > The packing tips here are utter nonsense, as well as the suggestion that you get better exchange rates with cash than with credit cards. I was surprised on a recent trip to Europe that my (fee-free) credit card got me almost exactly the exchange rate I see on Google. Much better than ATM withdrawal with fees or any posted rate I saw in towns. Also all the internet advice about needing cash left me with lots of unspent euros and zlotys, I used apple pay almost everywhere (in fact my cash was refused in some places!) Maybe a covid-times switch away from cash, not sure.
    • ghaff 4y ago
      >Also all the internet advice about needing cash I always want to have some cash but it really depends on the country and location how much. I just got back from London and Dublin. I took my ziplocks of pounds and euros over and, aside from tossing some coins in the donation bucket at a London museum (and I think you could donate digitally) and using my Oyster card, I didn't spend a single coin or note. On the other hand, if I were doing an extended walk in the English countryside, I would absolutely want to have a couple hundred pounds with me. I have a feeling my widespread traveling pre-COVID during which I pretty much figured I'd always have a use for most of my baggies of foreign currency is going to leave me with a fair bit of unused cash going forward.
  • hooverd 4y ago
    Credit cards worth their salt don't have any foreign transaction fees and convert transparently.
• bodge5000 4y ago
  I've never travelled before (other than the usual British holidays to france and spain, in which you make an immediate detour to the first red lion you see and kind of just sit around that for a week), but have recently been feeling like I should at least try it. The problem is, I have no idea where to start, where to go or what to do. I don't really have any opinions on where I'd want to go because its never been something I've considered doing. Ideally, it'd be really nice to find a group of people who also want to go travelling and who are also more into it that I can join along with. Not like a tour guide, I'm not a huge fan of strict activites and basically just want to go foreign pubs, but a few people who I can socialise with and who know what they're doing, that'd be great, but so far Google hasn't turned up a lot. Anyone have any advice for somone like me? For some reason I know the more granular advice like "travel light", but don't really have a clue about the much broader stuff like "go to x"
  • edent 4y ago
    The trick, I find, is to start small and see what you like doing. My advice would be - go to Rotterdam. Take the Eurostar there, pick literally any hotel. Open up Google maps, find some bars. Pick a couple of museums or parks. Built a rough itinerary for, say, a long weekend. If there's a Pride event on, that's fun. If not, just go wandering. Everyone there speaks decent English. Food and beer is great. Good culture. Adequate weather. If you're gregarious, chat to people in bars, clubs, concerts. If not, look at Greeters - https://internationalgreeter.org/ https://internationalgreeter.org/ They're locals who will show you around the city. Have fun!
    • bodge5000 4y ago
      Never heard of Greeters before, that sounds fantastic! Also nice to finally have an idea of somewhere to go, that helps tremendously Cheers for the help!
  • virgildotcodes 4y ago
    If you're looking to meet a group of people to go to foreign pubs with, especially (but not strictly) if you happen to be in your 20s and 30s, just stay in social hostels. You can occasionally find sites that highlight the most social "party" hostels in each town, or you can get a feel for it based on if their pictures feature extensive communal areas, an on-premises bar, pool tables, etc. Basically go to any destination that seems appealing, stay at one of those hostels in the dorms, and you'll make friends quickly. It's not all about just getting trashed together, oftentimes the people around you will tip you off to what's worth seeing and doing in the area, and will even want to join you or have you join their group and go do these things together. It can be a lot of fun, not to mention typically the cheapest option for housing while traveling. Edit: More to the point of "go to x" - I'd highly recommend Southeast Asia as a great entry point to travel. It's beautiful, very different from Europe/North America so it really feels like you're traveling, it's got the gorgeous tropical beaches, rainforests, beautiful architecture, unique street food scene, etc that all feel very foreign to anyone who's lived in the West for most of their lives, it's overwhelmingly safe, probably the cheapest place in the world to travel ($3-$10/night for a hostel, $1-2 for a meal from a street vendor), and it's a very popular destination with plenty of hostels and fellow travelers to meet at those hostels and befriend. In terms of a couple specific destinations to start out with, take a look at Thailand, especially Koh Phangan and Koh Phi Phi, and Bali (Canggu and Ubud areas).
• gniv 4y ago
  I had discovered the author through his series on Istanbul, which I thought was interesting and insightful: https://walkingtheworld.substack.com/p/walking-istanbul-part-1 https://walkingtheworld.substack.com/p/walking-istanbul-part...
• deleted 4y ago
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• penner_im_auto 4y ago
  2 years Vanlifer here. I am surprised he didn't mention once asking the locals. That is my key to knowing how people live in different countries. Also you get tons of inside information and it is an easy step to connect to people. Often times you get 'adopted'. You find yourself as a special guest on a private family garden party. Or on parties in locations that only the 'cool people' know it is open because Corona regulations mixed things up. I am currently recording hundreds of videos to share all knowledge on YT.
  • usrusr 4y ago
    > I am currently recording hundreds of videos to share all knowledge on YT An interesting way to say thank you to all the people who helped you: send in the copycats!
• Markoff 4y ago
  How to travel on the cheap Author uses Airbnb. /facepalm I have one advice for you - don't use Airbnb, small guesthouses are way cheaper than any Airbnb in SEA and busy areas have often lot of competition pushing prices much lower than done deserted areas, you have no clue about cheap travel. And if you want really local experience then stay at CS hosts or find whatever you can like when I argued about price in one Thai island with owner and they suggested for price I propose I can sleep somewhere in floor, which I said it's fine with me, couple from bus station heard us and I ended up sleeping on mattress in their bus station office. Also Hanoi is less touristy and more local than HCMC? You what? Who is this noob? I enjoyed motorbiking around Ninh Binh a lot, Hanoi is like top 1 or 2 most touristy place in Vietnam, heck even Hue or Danang are less touristy than Hanoi.
  • sixothree 4y ago
    Many people here blame airbnb for rising house prices in my city. Every block seemed to have multiple houses dedicated to airbnb. And the visitors certainly are problematic at best.
• DustinBrett 4y ago
  I did this in my mid-20's and it was indeed a great way to travel. Ended up going to 50 countries before I turned 30. Lots of CouchSurfing along the way, although that community/site has degraded. Had an Osprey Escapist 20L backpack which was more than enough to fit a weeks worth of living into, I'd do laundry and buy new t-shirts/underwear along the way. After years of traveling I think I ended up being every type of cliché traveler eventually. Doing the math it was about $15,000 CAD / year. It was actually a very interesting way to live and it gave me a lot of confidence to be able to survive in most places on very little. Even the most expensive cities in the world you can usually find a way to live cheap, if you are willing to compromise and find a way to be ok with being uncomfortable.
  • Bakary 4y ago
    Did you use your savings or had a way to generate income on the journey?
    • DustinBrett 4y ago
      Before I left I sold my car for $9k and all my stuff for maybe $6k. And I think I had $9k in savings before, so I started with about $24k which lasted me almost 2 years. But I did work odd job Craigslist stuff along the way occasionally. And near the end I got in debt a bit. But it was worth it I think. Now with the way remote work is I could travel indefinitely, but at that time I had less skills in programming and I really didn't wanna work in general.
• Hakeemmidan 4y ago
  > And like good fiction, travel changes you. For the better. Mostly. Fiction changes you? For the better?! Mostly?!?!?!? I need some expansion on this. I have been living in the non-fiction darkness.
  • guggalugalug 4y ago
    Great literature -- not airport bestsellers, of course. How could a deep, intimate window into another part of our shared human condition _not_ change you? Mostly for the better.
• seydor 4y ago
  Travel is easy now. You don't need to ask locals, you can't get lost, and only a few remote places have anthropologic interest. The author travels for entertainment, it is certainly a time-consuming kind with slow reward's but as time goes by i wonder if travel will simply go out of fashion, as every place looks alike. We have google earth to explore even remote dangerous favelas, (accompanied by police). Tech is making travel a pure exercise in movement, without need or purpose
  • ilikecakeandpie 4y ago
    You can absolutely get lost if you are super reliant on your phone and it is inaccessible or you go somewhere with limited service and you didn't download offline maps.
    • em-bee 4y ago
      not if they have public transport
  • virgildotcodes 4y ago
    I mean, I think there is a difference between being somewhere and looking at pictures of it on google earth, akin to having sex versus watching porn, being in love versus reading about love, eating spicy food versus watching people do it on Hot Ones etc.
    • seydor 4y ago
      That was not my point, and there are gradations in those analogies. Cookie-cutter tourist vacations are not much different than watching the corresponding youtube travelogues, except for the smells, because they are so stereotypical. There is something interesting to traveling but i wonder how much value there is in it anymore. The author himself said that traveling is like fiction to him.
• mrb 4y ago
  «I try to find non-traditional tourist destinations. Cities that are viewed as ugly, or without a lot to see. Cities where the residents are more focused on living their life, for themselves, not for a global audience.» This resonates so much with an experience I have had once. My wife and I visited Japan for a couple weeks and we went to 4 cities: 3 big classic ones (Tokyo, Kyoto, Hiroshima), and a small city that a relative used to live in: Beppu, which is not at all a tourist destination. In fact Beppu is so off the radar that one of the only guided tours available there to see local gardens and one monastery was by a guide who didn't even speak English. I didn't see a single restaurant menu in English. There was not much to do except randomly exploring neighborhoods and trying random shops, walking along canals, people-watching, bathing in the local hot springs (which were completely empty), etc. We were immersed in a tiny city with just people living their normal lives. And yet, Beppu was my most favorite experience in Japan. It felt like the real Japan.
  • sosborn 4y ago
    Beppu is one of those places that lives off of domestic tourism. I wouldn't say it's the "real" Japan, but it is certainly in the realm of "traditional" japan.
    • ambrose2 4y ago
      The main historical attraction was for the hot springs.
    • idontpost 4y ago
  • bnralt 4y ago
    The thing is, most people in most cities are living for themselves, not a global audience. Even a place like New York isn't all Broadway and haute couture, and there are a number of interesting neighborhoods that are generally overlooked by tourists. I saw this recently with the issue of migrants in Martha's Vineyard, where people thought the entire island was populated by millionaires. There's a lot of wealthy people who go to these places for the summer, but the year-round population is much more complex. About 1/5 of the population are actually recent immigrants from Brazil[1], and if you look at the local school notices you'll see they're printed in English and Portuguese. In an effort to get an "authentic" experience, it's possible to overlook the authentic experiences that are right in front of us. [1] https://web.archive.org/web/20220920163318/https://www.businessinsider.com/marthas-vineyard-is-more-than-just-a-posh-vacationland-2022-9 https://web.archive.org/web/20220920163318/https://www.busin...
• tayo42 4y ago
  This idea that nyc isn't real America and some fly over country city bugs me a lot. Its marketing that says NYC isn't authentic. if you say something like > They’ve got such a strong self-image, a strong desire to be seen as special, that many residents have become actors playing NYC, or LA. Then claim your traveling like a real local, i cant help but feel your kind of full of it. If this is your take away, you didn't travel like a local, you didn't meet enough new yorkers. Probably met an extroverted transplant and judged from there. A small part of what makes up a place like NYC. Its like someone is looking to feed their bias about what a place should be like. >Cities where the residents are more focused on living their life, for themselves, not for a global audience. This is what NYC is. 10 million people, and you think they're putting on a show for a global audience? Be a local always bugged me. Its seem to always be followed up by, hang out in dive bars and crappy restaurants and do poverty things. I'm local, my friends are local. We don't hang out in dive bars, or eat at crappy restaurants. Why would i think that is the thing to do in another country? After traveling a bit, if you cant speak the local language you'll never understand what its like to be local or understand their life. I can rant more i guess but w/e
  • pcglue 4y ago
    I get what he's doing and why and even agree with some/most of it. But a subtle pervasive holier-than-thou attitude in the writing just turns me off.
  • codalan 4y ago
    NYC, LA, and Chicago are bubbles. They are not reflective of the rest of the US in my experience. They are much more cosmopolitan and are the top destinations for tourists, migrants, and other people looking for opportunities. You can find a little bit of the rest of the world within 30 sq. miles in those cities. I can't really say the same for the rest of the major American metropolises. Boston, DC, SF, Seattle come pretty close, though. Where I do diverge in opinion w/ the article (and agree with you on) is the whole idea of traveling "like a local", as a lot of traveloguers like to call it. I think the best most travelers can expect is maybe some curiosity from the community they're visiting, but they'll never have the full local experience. Only locals get that experience. You could live in a foreign city for years and even learn the language, but you will always be an outsider to the people in that community. You will never gain the years of culture and context that comes with having grown up in the area you are visiting. The best you could ever do in that situation is accept it and be gracious and courteous to the people in those communities.
• grammers 4y ago
  Traveling the world is awesome. At the same time I'm always surprised at how many things you can do right at your doorstep. At least for myself I can say I need to do a vacation at home because if you're always on the go, you never get a chance to see the beautiful spots right next to you.
• glonq 4y ago
  My sister and her husband have been travelling throughout asia and south america this way for years. It's a great way to stretch the budget; they can get 4 months of travel out of what a typical tourist might spend in 1 or 2 months. It wouldn't work for me, but I really respect that they're able to do it.
• aeturnum 4y ago
  This is such a strange article. I too, in general, avoid starting with "pre-packaged" experiences when traveling. My most memorable experiences were only possible because, like the author, I travel light and don't plan too far ahead and mostly avoid being spendy. There's a kind of looseness and spontaneity that is possible if one plans generally and keeps funds available to take advantage of opportunities that only crystalize once you get to where you are going. But the high-handed tone in this article, denigrating the popular attractions countries are known of, feels entirely at odds with that philosophy. > I stay away from the coolest neighborhoods in the world, which all end up being variations of the same thing. If you have spent any time traveling, you know this is a silly thing to say. Even the most tourist-y places like Bali, though you see similarities, retain a national character. They are also generally very different from the rest of their host country - bubbles with their own rules and features. This is a feature! I have never regretted spending some time in heavily tourist'ed areas. Being catered to and seeing how culture shifts is interesting and fun. Taking a break from forging your own path and doing some pre-constructed-fun is nice. The reasons those areas are popular is because they are interesting and fun! To me, a lot of this comes down to balancing the time you invest in figuring out how to spend your time and money v.s. the time you want to take "doing the thing." If you have a low budget, then just kind of scrap around (you don't have a choice so there's no need to pretend this is some crazy tip). If you have a higher budget you have options! You can jump right into a pre-planned experience for a little bit or you can scrap it a bit and see what turns out. Ultimately, for most of us, even if you travel on "the cheap" you are still actually planning around a budget of how long you can skip work. I 1000% think that, if people have never taken just a carry on to a less touristy city in a foreign city, you should consider it. But the experience is a close cousin to the one you have when you are in tourist land and the two approaches support each other.
  • com2kid 4y ago
    > If you have spent any time traveling, you know this is a silly thing to say. I know from my own home city, Seattle, that this is bad advice. If someone comes here and doesn't do any of the tourist things, hike up one of our many many mountains, go to the rain forest, spend a day out on Lake Washington, or stop by one of the many Sea Fair events, then they aren't actually doing the things that locals also do. Because, surprise surprise, locals around here also go hiking and camping and go watch naked bicyclists. Go to the "touristy" parts of Japan, and they are filled with Japanese residents doing fun things! Feeding the deer in Nara is something everyone loves to do, so don't be elitist, go do it! The fashion districts in Tokyo are amazing, go buy an outrageous new outfit! Anyone who spends half a second looking around will see that plenty of people who live there have done the same thing. Likewise, the large museums in different countries are all worth visiting. The museum in the Forbidden City has dioramas made out of gem stones, they are one of the most memorable things I have ever seen! I agree, staying at an Air BnB in a "safe but not cool" part of a city that is still on a transit line is a good idea. Eating at local restaurants is a good idea, but wow, the author is so self assured that his way of doing things is superior. I agree that if someone goes to an all inclusive resort in Mexico, then they haven't visited Mexico. I encourage everyone I meet to go spend a week in Mexico City (CDMX is one of my favorite cities!!!), it completely destroyed any lingering bullshit stereotypes I had about Mexico. (Fun fact: Mexico City has the second largest metropolitan GDP of any city in North America) But, again, also, GO DO FUN STUFF.
• tomxor 4y ago
  Depending on the country this can ring very true when it comes to food in my experience. i.e where popular = worse. The most extreme experience I had was for a brief stay in Thailand, where the main tourist streets are filled with ridiculously glamorous looking and very busy restaurants serving the blandest meals (by anyone's opinion) with the most watered down and expensive drinks I've ever had. I don't think anyone could ever eat at one more than once. But within only a couple streets distance you can find amazing street food for a fraction of the price and eat like a king, which is exactly what all the locals were eating. Some westerners might be a little worried about hygiene but they cook it right in front of you and honestly I think the tourist restaurants were a complete facade and are probably have far less hygienic kitchens hidden away... Since then, in foreign lands, I'm more wary of places filled with tourists and few locals.
• ilamont 4y ago
  There's a correspondent named Paul Salopek walking around the world and writing/shooting it for National Geographic. He started in Africa and he is currently in Asia, headed northeast. His final destination is Tierra del Fuego. I follow him on Twitter and it's very interesting seeing the pictures (mostly in rural areas) and understanding how he does it (he has locals walking with him on each leg). He's gone through many sets of hiking boots. https://twitter.com/PaulSalopek https://twitter.com/PaulSalopek https://www.nationalgeographic.org/projects/out-of-eden-walk/ https://www.nationalgeographic.org/projects/out-of-eden-walk...
• pengaru 4y ago
  pro-tip: Traveling light/backpacking is far simpler in a fasted state. Now whenever I go on a multi-day trip I'll deliberately pack on a few extra pounds before departing while in keto mode. From there it's a painless transition to simply not eating, and after 48hrs it feels like a potentially infinite modus operandi. No need for pooping in random foreign places and less demand for bathing daily, no need to carry bulky/heavy food... These problems are effectively reduced to just drinking water and finding places to pee.
  • samatman 4y ago
    Eating is a top five reason for me to travel, maybe top three. I know, not everyone's like me, that's fine. "Just don't eat, it'll make your vacation easier" is nonetheless one of the stranger life hacks I've seen proposed. I think you're saying this with a straight face?
    • pengaru 4y ago
      > I think you're saying this with a straight face? I'm definitely saying it with a straight face, but I also ceased abusing food as entertainment and a primary source of short-term happiness over a decade ago. Except what I'm referring to is traveling, as in, actually in-transit. If you're boarding a plane to spend just one night somewhere, then yes I suppose I'm suggesting just fast the entire trip. That's not a form of travel I engage in. Obviously while visiting a foreign place for months I'm not suggesting you abstain from eating the entire time - it's impractical and missing the cultural experience. What I am saying is when you're hoofing it days with a backpack, or boarding a 52-hr train ride, or bikepacking a couple days, it's substantially more pleasant in a fasted state. No bulky food to carry and you won't have a dirty bum/as much want for a bath. For example I'll be riding the Zephyr from IL to CA (~2.3 days) at the end of the month, followed by a 60-mile bike ride from the Sacramento Valley train station, east up into the Sierra Nevada. I'll eat a few whole chickens in the days leading up to the train ride, and won't eat again until arriving at my destination in the Sierra Nevada. The train ride won't require #2 bathroom breaks fasted, and the bike ride will be 100% adipose-fueled, light, and way more fun in that state. Of course I'll be eating meals with friends in CA over the following months though.
• xivzgrev 4y ago
  If most tourists go to popular areas, the author is the extreme opposite. I like somewhere in the middle. I seek out highly-rated restaurants among LOCALS as a starting point. The fewer other tourists I see and the less English the staff speaks, the better. I also mix in places I see on the street that look good - they may not even be on rating apps; sometimes I get lucky that way too.
• duxup 4y ago
  Some of my best experiences were off the beaten path. Having said that I kinda question this idea how local or representative of local life those experiences were. I also would not what to have missed out on the big attractions either... I can't imagine skipping the Louvre, not seeing David... For an article by someone who travels a lot there's a tone here like that friend who comes back from some trip to tell you how much more amazing X place is and all the wonderful things they do better. Things that are different often make big impressions. I'm always skeptical of these ideas, how many people you meet, what that really represents and so on. Otherwise I probably agree with most things in the article, granted somewhat aspirationally (I wish I could pack that light) ;)
• jonfromsf 4y ago
  My parents used to have a simple approach to traveling on the Greek Islands. They would buy a Lonely Planet Greece guidebook, then go to the dock in Athens and look at the signs for the ferries. They would only go to an island that wasn't listed in the book. Worked like a charm for years and years.
• nkingsy 4y ago
  I'll add my three rules for exciting travel: 1. Travel alone. 2. Always politely brush off people that approach you. 3. Approach people that look like they're having fun. Alternatively, go places where you have a good friend who will let you stay with them.
  • em-bee 4y ago
    or use couchsurfing or an equivalent
• WirelessGigabit 4y ago
  Am I the only one that gets bored on vacation? Like I go hiking. Wake up, go hiking, spend 8 hours away, go home, and then ... what do I do after that? I cannot sit still. So I end up being on my laptop.
  • em-bee 4y ago
    maybe 8 hours away is not enough. the question is what is the purpose of the vacation. if it is to take a break from work, then maybe you want to find activities that help you take your mind of work but aren't boring. you enjoy hiking. i do too. but when i get home i am either exhausted, or i write a diary. if i was alone all day i might seek out a place with other people.
• steele 4y ago
  • fritztastic 4y ago
    • alchemist1e9 4y ago
• woevdbz 4y ago
  Next level: do this but as a woman and try not to get harassed
  • FrecklySunbeam 4y ago
    this was the only thing I could think while reading the article, if you're not /a white guy/ a lot of this advice is not useful at best or dangerous at worst
    • googlryas 4y ago
      Huh? Being white puts a target on your back in a lot of areas of the world, because you'll be assumed to be a naive tourist with money, and possibly drunk. I'm positive a Filipino person can move around Hanoi more easily than a white person from the perspective of random harassment. Yes, sometimes being white is a boon, and people will treat you nicer or more respectfully than they would a brown person. I'm not trying to say being white is a negative, I'm saying it is really dependent on where you are traveling to.
• dabedee 4y ago
  The author's behavior is, to some extent, an attempt at anti-conformity by traveling in a way that he believes most people don't do (i.e. by staying close to locals, staying longer than a few days, avoiding popular places to experience authenticity). I think most people would in theory like to travel that way. Places that feel authentic draw people and become popular, which eventually makes those places feel less "authentic". That's the paradox. If everyone traveled and behaved like the author, then, in time, there would be less "authentic" places to discover.
  • porknubbins 4y ago
    This is kind of like the Heisenberg principle for travel. You can’t visit the place without having some effect on it. Though I think authenticity is a bit fetishized anyway. Some of the world’s most interesting places are fusions of multiple cultures. Like wishing for the “authentic” Mexico City before the Spanish.
• renewiltord 4y ago
  His photos are great. The article does come across a little full of itself, but I think it's overall a solid idea. Personally, I allocate very little time to traveling these days so I'm forced to squeeze in the big wins: i.e. if I go to Tanzania I'm going to go see the wildebeest on the Serengeti. That's just how it is. But I have to say, looking back, the most fun moments were less curated. And one example that I remember is walking through Gent with a friend of mine, feeling hungry, and stopping at one of those kebab stores. My friend and I had traveled to Turkey at some earlier time so when we asked the guy running the store (who was quite obviously Turkish) if he knew where I could get some fistikli kadayif (the wrong i but my keyboard is US) we ended up having a really fun conversation with someone who hadn't been to the country of his birth in a decade and really just enjoyed talking about it. Personally, I'm a huge fan of these human connections. I really wish I could mind-meld with people and just absorb and share everything I've seen and they've seen and experienced. We can't, so this is what we get. But besides that, when I as young I wrote copy for a bunch of these sites/magazines freelance and the 'research' was incredibly shallow. So what you're going to get is some teenager's online echo of some other teenager's online echo. Then everyone is convinced that only Giovanni's Shrimp Truck is the place to go. So if you just go next door to the other shrimp truck without the line, you'll get 99% experience with 1% trouble. Following the herd has its value in that shared experiences themselves are of value but there's fun to be had in not that, too.
• justnotworthit 4y ago
  Are you collecting "local" trophies? The quaint lives of indigenous grandmas and blue collar workers? Are they the "real" ones whose wisdom you absorb? Do they stop being real when they enter a chain restuarant? Some locals (as if they're museum artifacts!) don't live cheaply; or have learned your language; or are overeducated; or buy in bulk; or like to travel too (can a local travel?); Are they not authentic? Not able to teach you something? You've heard from them already, I guess.
• blacklion 4y ago
  Hanoi as off-beaten path in Vietnam? Ok, I see what you did here.
• fritztastic 4y ago
  Something about this just seems very odd to me. As someone who grew up in the global South, this reads to me like a person from a privileged background trying to relate to the everyday people in other places and the marginalized- but it comes off sounding like a lot of projectionand assumptions- it would read much better if the conclusions were accompanied with dialogue from people, maybe explanations of where those statements are coming from. >I don’t travel like most people do I would think most travel is done by a wealthy few, but most travelers aren't wealthy- if that makes sense? It sounds like the "travel" being referred to here is "flying somewhere and being a tourist" but in fact to many people "travel" means taking the train/bus to another city, staying in a hostel, wandering around. Most people who go to see a wonder of the world do it because this might be the one time in their life they can afford to visit NYC, a place many people dream of seeing, and so they want to experience those things that are iconic there. I guess it really stands out to me, this writing sounds like "I'm not like those other stereotypical tourists" and the stereotypes are those behaviors associated with privileged westerners- which isn't really an accurate representation of most travelers. From the Istanbul post: >Most Turks are not secular though, and neither are they religious nuts like them Arabs He considers education by traveling as sufficient, which I believe is not the best approach. Might be a good idea to read up a little about the history and cultures of a region before going. There is a lot going on with his writing that comes off ethnocentric, uninformed, insensitive. I'm not going to dissect it, but I'll just say I recommend familiarization with cultural geography, anthropology, and ethnography if the topic of understanding people in different places interests you- because this blog is rife with problematic bias and some really broad generalizations that are prejudice at best, racism at worst.
  • kodah 4y ago
    Actually, your synopsis isn't far off: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Arnade https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Arnade Before he did it to the rest of the world, he did it to others in the United States. FWIW, it looks like he's watching: https://twitter.com/Chris_arnade/status/1580993239670136832 https://twitter.com/Chris_arnade/status/1580993239670136832 So maybe he'll take your criticism.
    • 4y ago
• kylehotchkiss 4y ago
  This blog post is a nice guide! Some additions: * Pack immodium for food sickness, this style of travel guarantees it. Add some ORS packets to your bag too (don't just trust gatorade or whatever) * The new iPhone SE blends in remarkably well everywhere, it looks like a 7 year old phone. * I feel much better in foreign hotels than AirBNBs. They generally adhere to some form of security backed by a legal standard, as far as door locks, and having guards on the property goes. AirBnB is great in trust-based societies, which travelers on the beaten path are not visiting. * As cheap as possible for flights isn't the wisest choice, especially after covid where a lot of low cost carriers have cut corners on maintenance (see google news for spicejet over the past few months for more)
• reedf1 4y ago
  I have a song for you, Common People...
• parthianshotgun 4y ago
  Relevant David Foster Wallace > As I see it, it probably really is good for the soul to be a tourist, even if it’s only once in a while. Not good for the soul in a refreshing or enlivening way, though, but rather in a grim, steely-eyed, let’s-look-honestly-at-the-facts-and-find-some-way-to-deal-with-them way. > > My personal experience has not been that traveling around the country is broadening or relaxing, or that radical changes in place and context have a salutary effect, but rather that intranational tourism is radically constricting, and humbling in the hardest wayhostile to my fantasy of being a real individual, of living somehow outside and above it all. > To be a mass tourist, for me, is to become a pure late-date American: alien, ignorant, greedy for something you cannot ever have, disappointed in a way you can never admit. It is to spoil, by way of sheer ontology, the very unspoiledness you are there to experience. It is to impose yourself on places that in all noneconomic ways would be better, realer, without you. It is, in lines and gridlock and transaction after transaction, to confront a dimension of yourself that is as inescapable as it is painful: > > As a tourist, you become economically significant but existentially loathsome, an insect on a dead thing.
  • draw_down 4y ago
    Gee, can you believe this guy killed himself?!
  • seirim 4y ago
    Thank you for the DFW quotes. He's always amazing. A great, incredibly captivating piece of his on tourism for anyone interested is "A Supposedly Fun Thing I'll Never Do Again" about a week he spent on a fancy cruise ship.
  • zeroonetwothree 4y ago
    Meh, it seems like his negative worldview was colored by his own mental state. Personally I think tourism is fine, it’s a fun break from normal life, and it can broaden your views sometimes. It’s neither “existentially loathsome” nor does it make you somehow superior to the people that can’t afford it.
• insane_dreamer 4y ago
  For some reason I didn't expect an article about traveling the world (something I've done a lot of and love) would get 250+ comments on HN.
• hayst4ck 4y ago
  I spent over a year traveling like this person. I agree with most of what he said. My most treasured experiences were from being a regular somewhere. I think that is the most important lesson of the post. Friendship is proximity + time, so without spending a lot of time in one location you won't make friends. Random aimless walking through non tourist areas is also an enriching activity. I also found that traveling to places local people would visit to be far more interesting than the major tourist destinations. If I had one uncommon piece of advice, it would be to invest in an extremely comfortable pair of shoes. After your phone, your shoes are by far your most important investment. I personally prefer to travel with more stuff, although the author is absolutely right that you almost always travel with a lot more than you need. I like large cities more than the author, mostly because larger cities have more English speaking people so they are significantly less isolating. In larger cities it's nicer to have more clothing (and shoe) choices. I travel with a 55L osprey bag. I put all my electronics and papers in the day bag, and in the main bag I have clothes shoes and toiletries. If you know you are going to a single climate, you can pack less, but if you are going to both hot and cold places, you will want to pack more. The size of your pack mainly determines the rate of your laundromat trips and number of times you have to wait at baggage claim. If you are an American tech worker, your credit card is almost certainly better than cash anywhere you can use it. I could also withdrawal cash from ATMs at the official forex exchange rate with my bank card. You do have to be very careful because all forms of payment will ask if you want to pay in local currency or your own currency. If you choose to pay in your own currency, you will be charged a predatory exchange rate, so you must always pay (or atm withdrawal) in the local currency. I left the US with $400USD and came back with $300USD after a full year of travel abroad, I gained a lot of peace of mind from traveling with cash I wouldn't be heartbroken to lose and electronics (chromebook) that I didn't particular care if they were stolen or destroyed. After traveling without valuable items, I did feel mildly deprived. I would put a grand or two aside as "just the cost of traveling" money and use that as my "bad things happen sometimes" budget to get peace of mind about having valuable stuff in poor areas. If nothing bad happens, call it karma and donate it to a good cause. The author talked about visas. The hardest problem for me was that countries wanted round trip tickets. They wanted a ticket showing you were going to leave the country. This can often be circumvented by buying a $10 bus ticket out of the country. That's the only way I found to reliably purchase one way tickets to various countries ad hoc. > When I decided to go to Vietnam, everything and everyone told me to go to Ho Chi Minh City. It had better food. More art. More high culture. Less government. So I went to Hanoi. I experienced this when I visited Vietnam as well. I thought Ho Chi Mihn felt kind of empty and not too different from other major cities. Hanoi was a wonderful city and felt much more lively. I liked Da Nang a fair amount as well. A lot of the authors post can be summarized fairly succinctly: If you want to grow as a person, you need to be uncomfortable. So don't optimize for comfort. You can choose big comfortable cities with comfortable sights, comfortable food choices, and comfortable companions, but that won't lead to personal growth.
• a-user-you-like 4y ago
  We’ll this is one way to tell the poor people who gad their money inflated away by the fed printer, “get used to a lower standard of life”!
• andirk 4y ago
  I do a combo of these, with more time being a local if I have a lot of time, and little localing if I don't. There is often a new world in the common activities like going to the laundromat, getting groceries, plugging in your electric Alfa Romeo in the nearby favela.
• magic_hamster 4y ago
  While I understand the mixed responses to this post, and I started writing a lengthy comment with my own point of view, I realized that all said and done, this is just what the author wants. It is commendable that the author is going to these lengths to experience what they are after. I'm not sure it has to be quite this extreme: for instance, you don't have to deliberately visit in the worst possible weather to experience the place authentically, especially since you're already going off the beaten path to places where most tourists aren't going to visit anyway. The only problem with this sort of travel is that you're not really getting to live as a local, no matter what sort of condition your subject yourself to. Real life has bureaucracy, waiting in line for boring stuff, sometimes concerning stuff. It has limitations that stem from what you make, while visiting significantly smaller economies you are disproportionately wealthy and you don't really share the locals' means for survival. No matter what you do, you are still a spectator, and while you're learning about different cultures and lifestyles, it's okay to have some fun.
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• karaterobot 4y ago
  I always thought that the only real way to live like a local would be to get a job that takes up most of your time, rent the cheapest apartment you can find, and go to the same places every day. On weekends, catch up on errands. Everything else is just some flavor of tourism. To be honest, I prefer tourism!
  • seirim 4y ago
    Ha, this is what I've done, it's called "moving there". Lived in many countries around the world - you want to learn what it's like to be local, you gotta live there, and for a long while. Even then you're still an outsider. The truth is, we're all always outsiders in the lives of people we don't know, no matter where we are or live.
• plaguepilled 4y ago
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• JadeNB 4y ago
  I understand de-clickbaiting titles, but removing the actual title "How to travel" before the subtitle "On the cheap, like a local, and without a lot of luggage" makes this title incomprehensible to me. If the whole is too unwieldy, then why not drop the subtitle and keep the actual title?
• throwaway83738 4y ago
• ElDji 4y ago
  Traveling around the world is cool as fuck, but com'on guys didn't you heard about global change due to CO2 emission ? Do you realize that you rich life style is impacting more poor people from south who will never take a plane ?
• technoooooost 4y ago
  Since when hallucinogens kill you?